Hannelore

[SuperSUGA]

I'm normally one to let out a long sigh at people who complain about creepy posts. In most cases they post a huge overreaction to something usually light-hearted that's bound to occur when you have a comic centered around female characters drawn in a somewhat sexualised way and with a lot of sexual content in the strips. However, with Hannelore it's really this...

She's legally and economically an adult, but emotionally still in adolescence.

...that I agree with. She might as well be a child, really.

[Zombiedude]

How is she still a child?

[jonarus_drakus]

How is she still a child?

I actually agree, she is more than inteligent enough to have a reasonable idea of what she is 'missing out on' due to her issues. Its just the fact that that knowledge is not enough to make her capable of overcoming those issues.
She does seem to be working on it though, its a process...

[nurgles_herald]

I dunno.  Hannelore has her issues, and her being in a relationship *at this point* would be kinda creepy, but I think it's unfair for her to be called a child.  She's much more mature than, say, Aerie from BG2, yet Aerie gets romancin'.  Then again, Bioware has a fetish for Elvish Priestesses.

That said, I might be able to accept a Hannelore romance after, say, 400 or so more strips, IF she happens to make progress of some kind.  As has been pointed out, OCD isn't something you can *cure*, but she might be able to get to a point where she could handle basic human contact, thanks to friends, etc.  I mean, hell, she was drinking from a communal keg at the drunken sledding party.

[Is it cold in here?]

How is she still a child?

I cling to "adolescent" myself, but the answer to your question is that she has big eyes, cries at the drop of a hat, is missing some skills like introducing herself that people usually learn in childhood, and doesn't know much about how the world works.

[Zombiedude]

Your argument is flawed.

[Delirium]

Where are the flaws in eir argument? That's pretty much what defines one's mental age.

[Zombiedude]

but the answer to your question is that she has big eyes

Big eyes define a mental age?

[Is it cold in here?]

Being drawn with big eyes means you're being portrayed as childlike. That's all I meant.

Mental age? Draw a distinction between the intellectual and the emotional sides of the mind. Hannelore has a cultivated and vigorous adult intellect but she can still be influenced by stories about how a Worry Hat works.

[Delirium]

I understand that mental age =/= intelligence

[JohnWWells]

She's funnier now than she'd be if the strip took her problems more seriously. I'd object to the whole OCD-as-joke thing, given the horrible consequences of OCD in the real-world... but, from a certain distanced perspective, OCD really is kinda funny.

This guy goes to a psychiatrist and says, 'Doc, my brother's crazy, he thinks he's a chicken.' And the doctor says, 'Well why don't you turn him in?' and the guy says, 'I would, but I need the eggs.'

[Zombiedude]

I understand that mental age =/= intelligence

That isn't always true.


see also: every kid genius ever

[SuperSUGA]

It It Cold In Here? and Delirium pretty much cover my reasons for seeing her as childlike.

[Is it cold in here?]

I agree with Dora in #801: it's possible to be sympathetic and laugh at the same time.

[Delirium]

I understand that mental age =/= intelligence

That isn't always true.


see also: every kid genius ever

Perhaps you misunderstood me. What I said was that mental age does not equal intelligence. that's what =/= means.

[Zombiedude]

Yeah I did, whoops. Don't post late at night kids, you'll look like an idiot.

[nichidani]

i have severe social phobias which tend to prevent me from being good at social situations (i can barely talk on the phone with most people, and i have trouble introducing myself), but i am responsible and i think i am more adult than child. hannelore is just sensitive and shy, which are qualities a child may have but she is still responsible enough to live on her own, have a social life, etc.

[SJCrew]

Well, who can you talk comfortably with? It might not be severe social phobia so much as it is a slightly higher level of discomfort around people you don't know. I've seen it happen with a lot of people and it doesn't hinder their lives in a severe way, it just makes them approach their social situations differently. They're definitely at a disadvantage in group outings, though.

[nichidani]

close friends. which is a group of about five to ten people. i would admit its probably more discomfort around social situations than phobia.

[SJCrew]

That sounds similar to a lot of people I know, including myself. I talk to people that somehow catch my interest or intrigue me. But if a disinteresting but decent person walks up to me and wants to chat, I wouldn't refuse them a pleasant conversation.

[Heavyoak]

Would it be creepy of me to offer myself up for the role of Hanners Boy Toy? I mean, i wish i could find a 'real world' version of her coz she is actually pretty close to being my dream girl (OCD and all).

Whatever, the only reason i made THAT sugestion is the fact that if Jeph doest end up creating a romantic interest for Hannelore, he is gonna be one messed up dude (aka: ME). Considering how 'strange' she is, having her hook up with a 'normie' aint really feasable.

OH NO YOU DON'T!!!

I SHOULD BE HANNERS Boy Friend. NOT YOU.

[jonarus_drakus]

Oh god... another one... That was my first post ever, and it was badly mis-worded (i may have had a hangover at the time).

Methinks the Mods may be bringing the bad stick out of retirement...

[acidpops]

Maybe this will also end up being a regretable first post for me...but has anyone ever considered a Hannelore/Marigold relationship? I know Marigold's all weird and unbathed right now, but that could change! Neither of them have definitively stated their sexual preferences. I just think it would be interesting. Any thoughts?

[plethora]

Maybe this will also end up being a regretable first post for me...

Any thoughts?

Quit while you're ahead.

[NotAFanOfFenders]

This subforum is creepy.

[Is it cold in here?]

The best way to learn something is to teach it. What if Hannelore, in the process of becoming BFFs with Marigold, improves her own social skills by drawing Marigold out?

[Heavyoak]

Maybe this will also end up being a regretable first post for me...but has anyone ever considered a Hannelore/Marigold relationship? I know Marigold's all weird and unbathed right now, but that could change! Neither of them have definitively stated their sexual preferences. I just think it would be interesting. Any thoughts?

why am I thinking that this is a good idea?

[Surgoshan]

As a WAG, are you really, really high right now?  Or perhaps you've had a bad fall recently.

[LeeC]

I think Hanners explicit like for firemen, EMTs, and vetanarians as well as Mr. CLean does kinda show that she's into dudes.  Need I remind everyone of the awesome incident of the "cute boy"  looking at her and she tries to smile back?  I think Hanners is into dudes.  Marigold is the first friend she has ever had to introduce to a group.  I think they will become the best of friends.

What I think would be cool right now is if a dude hits on Marigold at the bar.  Nothing may come of it but the thought of her blushing and wondering the next day if she should call him or go to a raid is quite funny.

[nichidani]

I think Hanners explicit like for firemen, EMTs, and vetanarians as well as Mr. CLean does kinda show that she's into dudes.  Need I remind everyone of the awesome incident of the "cute boy"  looking at her and she tries to smile back?  I think Hanners is into dudes.  Marigold is the first friend she has ever had to introduce to a group.  I think they will become the best of friends.

great point! whereas, if a person is into the same gender, or is into both, it is totally mentioned. i.e. dora's bisexualism, tai's lesbianism, marten's ex-boss.

[KeepACoolin]

Not to mention the fact that, even if estimates as high as 10% of the population being LGBT are correct, both Hanners and Marigold being lesbian or bisexual would totally skew the ratio: you would be left with Sven, Wil, Penelope, Marten, Faye, and Steve as purely heterosexual along with Dora, Tai, Raven, Marigold, Hannelore, Faye's sister, and Marten's former boss being gay/bisexual.  That would leave you with a cast more bi/homosexual than heterosexual, which would be highly unusual for a comic not explicitly about LGBT life.

[Delirium]

Dude, it's Massecheusets. (absolutely sure I spelled it wrong)

[Zombiedude]

Massachusetts

[KeepACoolin]

I live in Massachusetts.  There might be a higher percentage than elsewhere, but it's not more than 50%.  It's not more than 10%, if that.

[Delirium]

Keep in mind that they're a bunch of non- or barely-religious 20-somethings living near the Smif campus. Anyways, it's not out of the ordinary to draw a circle of friends with a significant number of LGBTs completely by chance. See: my high school life.

Anyways, Marten is NOT completely heterosexual. He expressed non-interest in homo-sex for practical reasons, not those of attraction.

[Mr_Rose]

Based on pure biology that "ten percent rule" is a load of hogwash anyway; various studies indicate that human sexuality is no different that that of any other primate species, in that it tends to fit a bell curve centred around bisexuality; the ten percent of the rule are those people so far to the homosexual end of the curve that they would be really unhappy about heterosexual sex and therefore self-identify as gay. The rest tend to identify as heterosexual on account of various societies' prejudices against homo- and bi-sexuality. I wold not be at all surprised if the recorded incidence rat of "gays" continued to rise as the legal and societal taboos fade.

[Is it cold in here?]

Marten has preempted emotional contact with Steve, unless he was joking: "You can have my shoulder to cry on, but I'm takin' it back the minute you progress to the homoerotic "I love you, man. I LOVE you!" stage". In 477, he was eager not to see Steve naked.

Now, to be a good citizen I should relate this back to Hannelore. Even as easily squicked as she is, she's comfortable with yaoi and gay people, and somehow avoided going catatonic even when Tai was hitting on her.

[nichidani]

and, as far as marigold x hanners goes, marigold posted yesterday via twitter @pintsize "i'm not into girl on girl"

[Gnomo]

She seems to be clearly into boy on boy.

[KeepACoolin]

Based on pure biology that "ten percent rule" is a load of hogwash anyway; various studies indicate that human sexuality is no different that that of any other primate species, in that it tends to fit a bell curve centred around bisexuality; the ten percent of the rule are those people so far to the homosexual end of the curve that they would be really unhappy about heterosexual sex and therefore self-identify as gay. The rest tend to identify as heterosexual on account of various societies' prejudices against homo- and bi-sexuality. I wold not be at all surprised if the recorded incidence rat of "gays" continued to rise as the legal and societal taboos fade.

I think you're more or less wrong.  Based on psychological profiling, the majority of people fit the "primarily heterosexual, only incidentally homosexual" mold.  100% pure heterosexuality is about as rare as 100% homosexuality, and a perfect or near-perfect bisexual is also rare.  Besides which, the mating drive would dictate a more common preference for the opposite sex.  

And human sexuality is rarely, if ever, a question of "pure biology."  Even if, as you suggest, the vast majority of people are bisexual or near it, the fact is that the comic is set in modern America, even if in a socially liberal area.  The odds of more than 50% of the town of Northampton's young adults being homo-or-bisexual in a random sampling are probably not so good.

And even given the all-female college, the odds would not necessarily skyrocket.  As we have already seen with Ellen, Natasha, and the girl who asked out Marten, they are not all lesbians or bisexual, which would honestly reflect more of a late night Skinemax vibe than I think Jeph wants.

[H0b0K!n9]

Hanners at least isn't Homosexual, given the various accounts of her showing interest in guys, i.e. asking Pintsize for pictures of men, the guy she saw in the bar, and the interest in yaoi, which involves 2 guys.

[vettechinohio]

Friends don't let friends drunk text.

Sure they do, that's what textsfromlastnight.com is for!

[Aegir]

Friends don't let friends drunk text.

Sure they do, that's what textsfromlastnight.com is for!

OH

[Geekdumb]

I sort of understand where you're coming from with the whole Hannelore Marigold thing but like Is it cold in here? and LeeC I think it's a relationship based more on friendship.  They're both socially awkward characters that have a lot they could learn from each.  I can easily see them filling certain aspects of a relationship for each and maybe that will help one or both of them move a step closer to an actual relationship. 

Plus, it takes the whole Odd Couple stereotype to a new extreme.

[LeeC]

and LeeC I think it's a relationship based more on friendship. 

Thats what I thought I was saying. 

[epoch]

Not to mention the fact that, even if estimates as high as 10% of the population being LGBT are correct, both Hanners and Marigold being lesbian or bisexual would totally skew the ratio: you would be left with Sven, Wil, Penelope, Marten, Faye, and Steve as purely heterosexual along with Dora, Tai, Raven, Marigold, Hannelore, Faye's sister, and Marten's former boss being gay/bisexual.  That would leave you with a cast more bi/homosexual than heterosexual, which would be highly unusual for a comic not explicitly about LGBT life.

You're forgetting that Marten's dad is gay too.

[KeepACoolin]

True, although he never appeared on-screen.

[LeeC]

True, although he never appeared on-screen.

hes a hypothedical character like James Bond or Micheal Jackson.

[workingrobbie]

Only skimmed through most of the replies in this post so bare (or bear?) with me...
Hanners IS getting a lot better as far as her OCD is concerned and is shown in a few strips to have accepted an arm-around-the-shoulder hug from at least Marten (I'm working from memory here) and has recently contributed that it's because of her friends that she is more tolerant.

She intellectually understands whats going on with her, knows the physics of relationships and sex, would LIKE to be able to have a boyfriend (I think she mentioned that once around the robo-boyfriend arc) but can't control her reactions towards her phobia of germs and viruses. She's not 'emotionally' childish at all and has thought a lot about what her friends mean to her (with her discussions with Marigold) and how she would like more, but she's readily accepted that she's no way at all prepared for one because of her OCD. This is unlike Faye who is emotionally unprepared for a relationship - although getting slowly better - but more of a mental unprepareness.

I'm not an expert in psycology or anything, but that's my 2 cents

[LeeC]

Awesome post workingrobbie. I agree with you 100%  I dont know what gets these "shippers" to get all crazy with the mari-hanners thing.  Dont see it happening.  I actually could see Hanners at least trying to get a dude but it would be on accident and she would be like a dog chasing cars.  Wouldnt know what to do when she got one.  She has changed a lot since she was first introduced.  And I agree whole heartedly that she is aware of her problem and she is not child.