Is My Music Pretentious?

[Johnny C]

maybe and this is just a wild guess but maybe it is entirely possible to enjoy yourself and also know things

[Hat]

as is the implication that either you're a sober, straight-laced uptight asshole who has no idea how to unwind or you are the only person worth spending leisure time with???

I didn't say that you are making inferences dude are you ok I was about to just abuse the shit out of you for basically being an elitist asshole but basically this sounds like stress posting to me do you want a hug, maybe I can send you a soothing picture of baby ducks?

[Hat]

maybe and this is just a wild guess but maybe it is entirely possible to enjoy yourself and also know things

I do this all the time

why do you assume I don't know this

[Johnny C]

I didn't say that you are making inferences dude are you ok I was about to just abuse the shit out of you for basically being an elitist asshole but basically this sounds like stress posting to me do you want a hug, maybe I can send you a soothing picture of baby ducks?

you're right i have no clue where i could have got that ide

Johnny I am really sorry that your idea of unwinding from the stress and minutia of everyday life is to sit around a table sipping tea and discussing critical theory instead of doing whatever the fuck you feel like and enjoying yourself

[Hat]

Are you trying to say that you need to drink alcohol to have a good time dude because that is not cool

also note how practically everything in the world worth doing is hyponymous with "doing whatever the fuck you feel like" so don't feel restricted or anything by my judgement of you.

[Johnny C]

well "i'm sorry that your idea of unwinding from the stress and minutia of everyday life is to do whatever the fuck you feel like and enjoy yourself instead of doing whatever the fuck you feel like and enjoying yourself" isn't particularly coherent so you'll have to excuse me for failing to remix your sentence that way.

to address your concern from further up this page, i'm being sarcastic and glib because this whole conversation is super dumb and everyone, myself included, is creating these false dichotomies with like no room for any leeway and it's completely ridiculous. normally "please be polite" is my motto but mostly i just don't have the energy to do it in this thread. sorry!

also i had a super fun pair of weekends and now i'm mostly just unwinding and detoxing so actually life is quite pleasant but i appreciate the concern.

[Hat]

dude you are arguing with an idiot here I don't know what a false dichotomy is maybe use a dumbed down version when talking to me like "bullshit distinctions" or something

[MadassAlex]

ok now i'm confused. subjectivity is the only thing that's relevant in a debate of this nature. it's personal preference, more or less.

Music taste is personal preference. But the elements of music that make it what it is can be objectively defined and described.

But I suppose what I was really saying was "jeez khar i think you're kind of being an asshole by refusing to return the respect i've shown you by trying to post coherent arguments on a constant basis instead of restating your opinion".

I mean, music theory is a set of designations. That is A Fact. If all musical sound was shifted up or down a certain distance, the relationships between notes would not alter. This is also A Fact. Music theory does not have to be a limiting factor when it comes to composition and improvisation. Another Fact, since a musician is free to ignore theory if they choose to do so. If they are limited by theory, then they are probably not creative in the first place, as they allow themselves to be restricted by designations.

Basically what I am saying with my argument is "I think music theory is a good thing and here are some facts about music theory that support my claim".

[pwhodges]

a musician is free to ignore theory if they choose to do so. If they are limited by theory, then they are probably not creative in the first place

After all, they can produce a new theory to suit their inclinations if the old one no longer fits.  Oh yes, so they did! - both Schoenberg and Hindemith designed new theories to suit the music they wanted to write (and wrote books on them), as did Bartók (who didn't).  And probably lots of people I know less about.  As far as I can see, though, Stockhausen took Khar's view (but also went pretty much barking mad - this may be unrelated). 

Allowing yourself to be limited by nineteenth-century music theory (I used to have a copy of Ebenezer Prout's 12-volume work on it, which I now see goes for $50 a volume - bother!) is about as admirable as arguing about nineteenth-century grammarian's rules like the split infinitive or dangling preposition.

[Johnny C]

What a ridiculous argument. Why did we even have this argument?

[KharBevNor]

I think music theory is fantastic. What are we talking about?

All those little squiggles and things are so pretty.

[KharBevNor]

If the tails are hanging down you can draw little ears on them and imagine them being tiny musical cats.

[Sox]

if they're pointing up, draw ears on them anyway and say they're vampire cats.

[Scandanavian War Machine]

i have a new musical theory i'd like to run by you guys.

it's fairly simple and follows only three rules:

1) all notes must be followed by a lower note, never higher* **
2)*unless there is a blast beat in between. blast beats are the only way to reset back to a higher note.
3) all songs must be about either kittens or revolution, but never both. this is important.


it will revolutionize the music industry.



** an equivilant note would also be acceptable, i guess

[Zingoleb]

After you take the industry by storm and make this the new default, I will overthrow you by releasing my breakthrough album, "Revolutionary Kittens".

[Jeans]

So this is a very cool thing heavily related to the discussion the thread turned out to hold. If you've got some time to spare I suggest you watch it, it's very interesting stuff.

[Retrospectre]

I'll just say that I find music theory confusing and scary and that makes me dislike it.

[KharBevNor]

So Jens, you're saying people can generally easily correlate the idea of moving in one direction with making higher sounds and moving in the other direction with making lower sounds.

Fascinating.

[Jeans]

firstly, I'm not saying it, I'm pointing out that someone else does. Secondly, yeah, I think it's pretty cool that the note consensus is a fairly accurate musical scale in the twelve-tone system. I posted it in this thread because I thought it was relevant and kind of interesting and I thought others might share my opinion.

[Ptommydski]

Obligatory Sun City Girls link.

[KharBevNor]

Now, see, that rips Yngwie Malmsteens fucking legs off and pisses up the stumps.

[Jeans]

Yeah, Sun City Girls are awesome.

[a pack of wolves]

So Jens, you're saying people can generally easily correlate the idea of moving in one direction with making higher sounds and moving in the other direction with making lower sounds.

Fascinating.

I haven't actually watched what Jens linked but yes, that is a fascinating concept when you think about it. Why do we think of a low note as being lower in space? Or a high note as being up in the air? I would have presumed this was just cultural conditioning but if not that really is an interesting idea!

[Eris]

Also, I think what the guy is trying to show in that particular video is that in him moving in one direction everyone could have sung a note that was different (but higher), but even though he didn't specify the next note, the audience all sang the same one. And that no matter where he did it the audiences were able to do that.

[supersheep]

Maybe that is a function of group psychology? What happens when you do that test on individuals? What happens when you do that test in a group of, say, Chinese traditional musicians?
I mean I liked the clip and all (well, the Bobby McFerrin one, didn't watch the whole panel), but I dunno if it answers all those questions.

[Dliessmgg]

They used the pentatonic major scale (C - D - E - G - A, if this helps you), which is probably the most common scale in the world. AFAIK it exists in every kind of folk music (with small differences in the exact frequency of the notes for the local flavour) and it's the base of many other scales such as western major (add F and B) or blues major (add Eb and Bb).

[Yayniall]

There's only one rule you really need to know for music theory.
All songs can be improved by putting a banging donk on it.

[Black_Chamber]

Jazz-blues song I made

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6JgYWfiIqg0

[Black_Chamber]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9A1LrNQCMic

new trippy song I just made. This is probably going to be the last time I bump this thread

[ntny]

The Notes & Neurons video was awesome ... thank you for sharing that. It was right up there with The Music Instinct.

So the OP's music somewhat reminded me of Tim Hecker. If you haven't heard of Tim Hecker, I would say he is one of the most prominent and dare I say revolutionary composers of ambient music. However, Tim Hecker is leaps and bounds ahead of the OP's. What black_chamber has going for him is his production quality - (although there was a track I listened to which had some really harsh clipping going on).