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[Patrick]

I've heard of a lot of instances of bands forming where a guitarist will decide to switch to the bass (or, in the case of the New York Dolls, the exact opposite). What do you guys think of the idea of people instrument switching just to fill a slot?

[StaedlerMars]

why not?

Though, if you want to be original you'll make it work without fitting in slots.

[IronOxide]

Also, acoustic builds up callouses and finger strength in a way no electric will.

My experience is probably a little different, but I was taught how to play the Trombone when I was a wee lad. When I was in 7th grade, they needed a Euphonium for the marching band and I joined.  I now play Euph primarily and trombone secondarily. The move was not too hard, and if you have somebody to hold your hand for about a week, it's very easy to do.

[RyanT]

I would have to slightly disagree and say that the best instrument to start on is the piano.  With the piano, you get a very strong visual image of a keyboard in your head, which allows you a great tool for understanding music theory that I just don't think guitar does.  The thing that happens with guitar is that you just start memorizing the positions for chords and never really understand what notes are going into that chord, so you get stuck in a rut. 

I do agree, though, that electric is a lot easier to play after starting out on an acoustic.  Both for callouses and for building up finger strength (thicker strings and higher action) and a good understanding of the chords and fingerboard.

[Patrick]

I tend to disagree. I can find all my fifths in a matter of about 3 nanoseconds on a standard-tuned (well, drop D) guitar, but sit me behind a set of keys and the only thing I can play is "Hoppipolla" and "Closing Time".

[RyanT]

Well yeah, fifths is one thing.  But if I asked you to play some diminished chord or something, I'm sure you could show me the chord shape and play one, but would you know what notes go into it?  And more importantly, could you revoice it or anything?  For me, I can come up with new chords because i know what notes are in the chord and can place them on the fingerboard.  Of course, my opinion may be skewed because I've been playing piano for probably 16 years and guitar for 2, but I think piano is a great tool to start with.

Oh, and one more thing to back me up - all music universities that I know of have you take piano lessons, and none teach group guitar to everybody.  I'm not ragging on guitar - I love the instrument.  I just happen to think that piano will give you a better foundation for music, across the board, than guitar will.

[Orbert]

The best bassist I've ever played with was a guitarist first. But we had a guitarist and needed a bassist, so he played bass, but he played like a motherfucker. At various times melodic, heavy, light, straight thumping, walking... you name, he could do it. I would guess that it was because he was already all over the notes and stuff from playing guitar. But what do I know? I play keyboards and winds.

[McTaggart]

I really don't get the point of this thread. Maybe it's because I'm not a musician but isn't learning a new instrument to fill a slot entirely a good thing. You end up filling the slot so that you can make the music you want to, someone ends up learning a something new which can't be a bad thing. What's there to feel about it?

[timehat]

Oh, and one more thing to back me up - all music universities that I know of have you take piano lessons, and none teach group guitar to everybody.  I'm not ragging on guitar - I love the instrument.  I just happen to think that piano will give you a better foundation for music, across the board, than guitar will.

I think that the only thing that piano provides above guitar in the way of music theory is that you can actually stack chords in thirds all the time, whereas you can only do it some of the time on guitar. The thing though, is that it doesn't really matter, because you can teach chord theory to anyone easily enough using standard notation, and if they have an instrument that can play harmony (such as the guitar) they can figure it out themselves. I've been playing guitar for 10 years and piano for only 2, and I can certainly tell you what notes are in a chord that I play on guitar, because I know chord theory and I know the fretboard. Not only that, but I can find chords on the guitar much faster than I can on piano, and my voicings on piano are generally really limited.

[Thrillho]

That's how I joined my band. But then I do play both, and did before I joined.

[Jimmy the Squid]

When the original bass player left my band we got the lead guitarist from another band to fill in for him. That guy eventually became our rhythm guitarist when the original one quit and we just got a new bass player. I'm ok with it and I don't see a problem. I know most people don't like Fear Factory but they're a pretty good example of this as when Dino Cazares (lead guitar) quit the band they replaced him with Christian Olde Wolbers who was the bass player at the time. They still sound as good as they ever did.

[Gridgm]

I would have to slightly disagree and say that the best instrument to start on is the piano.  With the piano, you get a very strong visual image of a keyboard in your head, which allows you a great tool for understanding music theory that I just don't think guitar does.  The thing that happens with guitar is that you just start memorizing the positions for chords and never really understand what notes are going into that chord, so you get stuck in a rut. 

I do agree, though, that electric is a lot easier to play after starting out on an acoustic.  Both for callouses and for building up finger strength (thicker strings and higher action) and a good understanding of the chords and fingerboard.

i started out playing violin ages back for 5 years, learned trumpet for 2 years concurrently, taught myself how to play piano then taught myself how to play guitar...i still for the life of me can not play sheet music for guitar though

[negative creep]

i started playing violin 10 years ago. then i picked up the guitar. when a friend of mine needed a bass player last year i started playing bass in his band and i think i did a pretty good job. now i just play guitar. so, in conclusion: switching instruments is fun!

[Patrick]

Well yeah, fifths is one thing.  But if I asked you to play some diminished chord or something, I'm sure you could show me the chord shape and play one, but would you know what notes go into it?  And more importantly, could you revoice it or anything?

See, the thing about that is that I play exclusively by ear. I hardly know anything about which notes coincide with which frets. But revoicing would take about 20 seconds.

[Johnny C]

My band is a four-piece, and every member who isn't the drummer shares duties on keyboards, bass and guitar. Each person's approach is different, too. It's totally worth it.

[Johnny C]

Since the drummer is learning guitar this is in all likelihood possible.

Can I do it for the EP though? I have the design worked out for the first album already.

[gnarphlager]

You can never learn too many instruments!  Though, as godinpants  noted, it becomes quite tiring on the expense budget after a while.  Like many others, I started on guitar.  I've been entirely self taught, but in retrospect learning piano would have been the most useful to start on in the long run.  The key is listening...there are a lot of guitarists that play bass like a guitarist when they switch over.  It takes a while to develop actual bass technique, not just knowing where the notes are.  Of course, it's a matter of intent too.  For some people, the goal is to be the best player at their given instrument.  For others (I fit firmly into this one), the goal is to be able to play as much as you can, as well as you can.  These days keys and electronics are my main weapon of choice, but have learned (in approximately this order) guitar, bass, mandolin, dulcimer (both lap and hammered), harp, psaltry (though if you can play a harp, you can play a psaltry) and fiddle.  I can fool around with a few more (I know the basics of accordion, but can't play it well yet), but I'd say the toughest thing for me to learn has been voice.  You can figure out guitar if you fool around with it long enough, but it's easy to learn to sing incorrectly, giving you bad habits that eventually have to be beaten out of you if you want to really sing well. 

[Thrillho]

...there are a lot of guitarists that play bass like a guitarist when they switch over.  It takes a while to develop actual bass technique, not just knowing where the notes are. 

Don't get me started on people like that. People who are 'bassists' or think they can be a 'bassist' just because they're a guitarist.

[imapiratearg]

I can  play guitar, piano, a little bass, and drums.  But I'm not particularly stellar at any of them.  I very rarely get to play drums, so I just dabble with them.  I don't get to play piano much either, but I figured a song out by ear once, and I can learn by watching someone play.  I primarily play guitar.

I do, however, know the bass part of the beginning of "Waiting Room" by Fugazi.  I also figured out the bassline to "Float On" by Modest Mouse by ear.  So...yeah.  That's about the extent of my knowledge on bass, besides "Louie Louie" which I learned by watching my girlfriend play it.

Basically, I could fill the guitar slot of a band and that'd be about it.  I can't sing and play at the same time yet, and I haven't trained my voice at all, nor do I think it's fit yet to do vocals for a band.

[Patrick]

Don't get me started on people like that. People who are 'bassists' or think they can be a 'bassist' just because they're a guitarist.

Good point. But Idunno, man. Listen to Cream. Notice the similarity between Jack Bruce and Eric Clapton's styles? Jack Bruce doesn't play root note basslines. When you take a good listen, it sounds like he's just playing a solid lead guitar line, he's just doing it 2 octaves down and without doing any string-bending.

[Thrillho]

Don't get me started on people like that. People who are 'bassists' or think they can be a 'bassist' just because they're a guitarist.

Good point. But Idunno, man. Listen to Cream. Notice the similarity between Jack Bruce and Eric Clapton's styles? Jack Bruce doesn't play root note basslines. When you take a good listen, it sounds like he's just playing a solid lead guitar line, he's just doing it 2 octaves down and without doing any string-bending.

That's intuition. That's good playing.

Guitar-bassists are the people who think bass is easier because 'it's only one note' and think that they only play the root note, so they're too stupid to even play an F# for the D chord when descending from G to Eminor.

[Lines]

Yeah being a good bassist doesn't mean playing the root of a chord for every chord, you have to be creative. That's why bass is a lot harder to learn than most people think.

Switching instruments is very beneficial, I think. You learn more and you learn different styles and overall I think it gives a unique sound. Someone who plays piano will sound different on a guitar than someone who plays a violin (and guitar). Same with any other instrument. It changes how you phrase the music your playing and how you physically play as well. Also it helps you learn to read different forms of music. I can read treble and bass clef, but when it comes to reading tab, I got confused at first, as I learned how to read music about 7 years before I ever tried to read tab.

[thenosebleedkid]

Don't get me started on people like that. People who are 'bassists' or think they can be a 'bassist' just because they're a guitarist.

Good point. But Idunno, man. Listen to Cream. Notice the similarity between Jack Bruce and Eric Clapton's styles? Jack Bruce doesn't play root note basslines. When you take a good listen, it sounds like he's just playing a solid lead guitar line, he's just doing it 2 octaves down and without doing any string-bending.

That's intuition. That's good playing.

Guitar-bassists are the people who think bass is easier because 'it's only one note' and think that they only play the root note, so they're too stupid to even play an F# for the D chord when descending from G to Eminor.

Or they ONLY stick to box shape

OR they ONLY stick to root note arpeggios

ANGER!

[Johnny C]

yeah fuck peter hook what'd he ever do jeez

[a pack of wolves]

Guitar-bassists are the people who think bass is easier because 'it's only one note' and think that they only play the root note, so they're too stupid to even play an F# for the D chord when descending from G to Eminor.

I'm a bassist and I'm definitely stupid enough to do that. I don't even know what it means.

[Thrillho]

yeah fuck peter hook what'd he ever do jeez

Care to elaborate?

By the way just to clarify, I wasn't saying there isn't a time and a place for playing the root note. Plenty of music styles or specific songs work fine with the bassist just pumping the root, I do it myself in a few of my band's tracks. But there's a time and a place.