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Get off my lawn!

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ruyi:

--- Quote from: Patrick on 25 Mar 2008, 12:01 ---@idiolect: You're not really answering the question that Jon's implying. Was the guy an asshole before he ever started lighting up regularly, or was it a new development?

--- End quote ---

I believe that was here:


--- Quote from: idiolect on 25 Mar 2008, 01:17 ---What I was suggesting, and honestly, what I really do believe to be true, is that he was *generally* more of a jerk after he started smoking up every day, and he was especially a jerk *about* pot.

--- End quote ---

We have no way of knowing if this is true or not, so there's no point arguing about idiolect's judgment in this situation.


--- Quote from: 0bsessions on 25 Mar 2008, 07:38 ---Simply speaking, you're wrong. I'm willing to bet either you didn't know the guy very well before he started smoking or you've never really thought about what he was like before/are so jaded towards pot that you refuse to believe he's not a cunt of his own volition. I am so confident in this statement that I am willing to guarantee you that you are 100% bullshit wrong on this without ever having even met the dude myself.

As far as the car crash, well, no one was arguing that then, but yeah, I think I would. All those stories you heard about as a kid about people smoking pot and thinking they were Superman? So much shit. Yes, pot impairs you. If the dude dozed off at the wheel and crashed, I'd believe it. Pot doesn't make you drive around like an idiot, being an idiot makes you drive around like an idiot. The latter part where he fled the scene only had to do with pot in the vague sense that he was aware he was going to get busted. If the dude got caught, he would have most definitely gotten some serious shit heaped on him. I'm pretty sure the dude would've gotten in the same accident with or without the pot since the guy sounds like an utter tit.

My diagnosis? You don't have the slightest real knowledge of pot. You seem to be utilizing decades worth of propaganda that school and G.I. Joe PSAs grind into you in order to rationalize the fact that you seem to just have piss poor judgment when it comes to who you associate with and would rather blame a plant than admit it. Stop hanging out with morons and twats and this problem will go away.

--- End quote ---

Jon, I like you. Please be nice!

ledhendrix:
Every time i come into this thread i try and think of something to say that might be worthwhile. Then i think, well fuck everything has been said already and people are just going to have to agree to disagree. Then i think thats a bit of a defeatists argument and would like to say something blunt like *woo fuck yeah weed*. Then i think thats just stupid because people will just be like *fucking idiot*. So hear i am now saying that i smoke weed, sometimes quite alot, sometimes not. I like the feeling it gives me better than alcohol, i can actually stay up and have a sensible conversation with someone rather than just being like *FUCK YEAH LETS TALK REALLY LOUDLY ABOUT CRAP AND HOW GOOD FRIENDS WE ARE*.

 I'm not saying there isn't a place for alcohol, i do like it, it's just that i would rather smoke Cannabis. I've seen people drinking alcohol that are normally excellent people, but when they have a lot to drink they will start fights with people. The same person smoking cannabis more resembles a teddy bear than anything else. I don't think anyones going to agree about this situation but oh well. If people don't drink to much it shouldn't be a problem but sadly some peoples idea of "fun" is going out and getting shit faced until they can't remember anything and are a danger to other people. Similarly, smoking to much weed at once is probably not a good idea if you are out and about in the town/needing to drive home, but staying at home and smoking a lot of weed will probably just make you fall asleep, whilst if people stay at home and drink alcohol, they can drink to much, get alcohol poisoning, get incredibly stupid ideas etc.
 My reasoning is a little weak towards the end but i'm sure you get the jist of it.

tldr: I like Cannabis. I think its better than alcohol, lets agree to disagree and everything is good in moderation.

idiolect:
Thanks ruyi, that's about what I would have said.

I am curious about one thing though -- are all you guys who spend a lot of time around pot saying that you've really never met someone who became more of a douchebag correlative to becoming more of a pothead?  I've seen that so frequently, discussed that so frequently with other people (who themselves regularly smoke pot), seen that in people that *I* smoked pot *with* way back when, that I find that hard to believe.  I'm totally willing to believe that might have as much or maybe even more to do with the cultural ramnifications of pot being illegal for so long (i.e. it going "underground") than it does with the actual chemical effects of pot, but the chemical effects of pot are not the only thing one has to worry about when thinking about whether or not becoming a regular pot smoker has a negative effect on your life.

Also, I still don't think people should drive while stoned.  I mean, even aside from my own opinions about it, it's at least safe to say that there is a debate about whether being stoned impairs your driving, and so why risk it?  If there's even the tiniest chance that you might be wrong, then you are risking people's lives, which is really not "worth it."  If it turns out that somehow the debate is settled and I'm certainly wrong, then it shouldn't have been any skin off of your back to not drive stoned, because really, how often are you in a situation where you just can't possibly get around driving stoned anyway?


One more thing: to respond briefly to some of the personal attacks -- First of all, my friends aren't morons.  My friends are actually pretty awesome.  If this is just so terribly unbelievable to you that you absolutely must know how it could possibly be true, I suppose I could begin to list ways in which my friends are awesome for you.  Secondly, my conclusions about the accident being because of the pot wasn't some abstracted thing where I heard about some accident and thought OH LORD JESUS IT MUST BE THEM DRUGS.  I mean, I was physically inside a car that crashed into another car and it was awful and I'm really glad none of us got hurt.  The driver of the car was acting in a way that he generally acted specifically when he was stoned, which I know because for a handful of years *I* smoked up with him.  The next morning, he himself said that he was never going to drive stoned again.  And just for the record, he never "thought he was Superman" when he was stoned, because like you said, that just doesn't make sense -- what he DID do was think that stupid things were hilarious, and he realized that he could in fact DO stupid things, thus increasing the hilarious.  I suppose you can not believe me if you want, but don't presume to know positively what happened otherwise.


--- Quote from: 0bsessions on 25 Mar 2008, 07:38 ---My diagnosis? You don't have the slightest real knowledge of pot. You seem to be utilizing decades worth of propaganda that school and G.I. Joe PSAs grind into you

--- End quote ---

Alternatively, isn't it funny how you can't even suggest to a pothead that pot may not be the best thing since sliced bread without them deciding that you must be brainwashed by the government?  Hmm.  I think that's kind of a jerk thing to do.  Were you that much of a jerk before you started smoking pot?

a pack of wolves:
I've known a few people who've acted like more of a dick as they increased the amount of weed they smoked. One of them was me. The thing is, it wasn't the weed itself exactly that was the problem. I didn't do anything as dumb as crash a car or as obnoxious as light up in a van without asking people first, but I did become intensely boring and selfish and I had some bad mood swings. But weed didn't make me boring and selfish, I was being a boring and selfish person and therefore smoking weed all the time instead of doing interesting things. The mood swings were a result of the weed but they just made me depressed, not a dick. I've known other people who at one point were very interesting and active and then just descended into getting stoned all the time and being dull and just sitting around whinging. But again I don't think it was the drug messing them up, I think it was them messing themselves up and getting stoned all the time was a symptom and facilitator of that, but not the cause.

And seriously, someone who thinks it's a great idea to drive around yelling at people and then crashes their car is a wanker regardless of the drugs that are in them. I just hope the accident shocked them into not being a wanker anymore.

onewheelwizzard:
In my experience people don't start actually being insufferable dicks until they get into cocaine.  I've known many a jovial, friendly, and intelligent weed smoker who started to enjoy nose candy a little too much and ended up turning into a total tool.

Come to think of it, cocaine is the only drug that I've ever seen actually turn people into legitimately worse people.  I mean, I've had some friends act like idiots while drunk, but I can't say I remember anyone whose actual motivations and loyalties changed due to the stuff (though I'm sure it's possible).  Cocaine on the other hand is perfectly capable of turning otherwise perfectly fine people into genuinely shameful parodies of themselves.

There is definitely a vicious circle that can arise from extended patterns of smoking weed combined with consistently thoughtless behavior (which can sometimes dip straight into total-dick-move territory).   That sort of thing is true about anything though ... sex, driving, having new friends, playing in a band, etc.  It's always the thoughtless behavior that contributes to and is contributed to by whatever factor plays a role in the specific situation, and ultimately causes the problems.  Anyone who keeps a healthy level of respect for themselves and the people around them is probably going to be fine no matter how much weed they smoke.

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