Fun Stuff > CHATTER
patriotism/nationalism
tommydski:
--- Quote from: Ian Mackaye ---Yes I know this is politically correct,
But it comes to you spiritually direct,
An attempt to thoughtfully affect,
Your way of thinking.
That is if you believe in race,
Or that you were born,
In the right time or place,
This is a thought:
About face your way of thinking...
--- End quote ---
Slick:
--- Quote from: Leinad on 10 Aug 2008, 14:21 ---First, a piece of advice: If you are European do not bring history into this. Just don't do it. You have the longest history of racism, bigotry, and waging war under false pretences. If you think that is American arrogance, you are probably right, but it is arrogance through only being a disphit for 200 years, rather than 1000.
--- End quote ---
I am going to stop ranting the shit out of this reply any minute now, but my ancestors who were not of noble stock are not to blame for meaningless wars under false pretenses. Poor fishermen might be worked up to think someone's the enemy, but in the end, they're working hard jobs for little money and the upper class keeps all of all the power. The entirety of the population of Europe is not to blame for the fucked up workings of monarchies and empires.
ruyi:
--- Quote from: waterloosunset on 10 Aug 2008, 13:44 ---
--- Quote from: Hat on 10 Aug 2008, 10:04 ---
The problem being that some people interpret the melting pot idea as meaning "leave your old culture at the door, you're an AMERICAN now",
--- End quote ---
Surely in America it was always that way? Italians, Irish, Germans etc in the late 19th/early 20th century came over and were encouraged to "Americanise", so second generations onwards lost the old ways of their ancestry and spoke english, drove big cars, ate apple pie, played baseball etc. Give the hispanics a couple of generations and it'll be the same with them, completly immersed in the mainstream. Of course there will always be a few who don't change, but on the whole they'll be considered American, not Latino
--- End quote ---
I thought that was because they were white? Also one of the problems with your argument is that Mexicans have been around for a pretty long time. And by pretty long time I mean they were living in states like California and Texas while those areas were still part of Mexico. Blacks/asians/arabs/latinos are still looked at as 'other', even if they've been here for many generations as well.
Vendetagainst:
--- Quote from: Patrick on 10 Aug 2008, 12:06 ---I have an assignment for you. Go anywhere in California between Salinas, Watsonville, and Santa Cruz during harvest time. While driving around, look out your window. There's lots of Mexicans all bent over in the fields, picking strawberries or what have you. Drive around the nice parts of town and you will not see any of these Mexicans. Drive around the shitty crumbly parts? Suddenly, Mexicans everywhere. Hate to break it to you, but illegal immigration is definitely a reality, and these people will never see the end of my sympathy as long as they have to hide out and do backbreaking labor just to make a goddamn dollar.
--- End quote ---
Well of course illegal immigration is a reality. And yeah, the people who come here have nothing to start with and have to do things that they absolutely should not have to do to get by, but it's not like there aren't Mexicans gaining legal citizenship to this country. I was on a plane from Tucson going to Chicago and by the end of the flight I was helping the woman next to me practice for her citizenship test, she came here for college (I don't remember her major) and she wasn't in some field picking fruit. Illegal immigration is just as much Mexico's fault as anybody's, if their country wasn't a shit place to live for a LOT of people then so many people wouldn't be trying to get out of it.
--- Quote from: Slick on 10 Aug 2008, 15:02 ---The entirety of the population of Europe is not to blame for the fucked up workings of monarchies and empires.
--- End quote ---
That could be said of any country though.
Slick:
I was born in Labrador (Canada), and I love my home. Maybe it's who I am or just the fact that I grew up there, but I just love the place. It makes me so goddamned happy to stand on top of a humbled old mountain and look across a barren winter wasteland. I love being in the place
Maybe I'd be just as happy somewhere else, but that's where I was born and this is who I am.
I think Canada is pretty neat, I like our reputation, and I like to think I live up to it most of the time. I like that, when traveling abroad, people can see a Canadian flag and just like me right away, and I like that traveling within Canada, I tell people I'm from Labrador and everyone just likes me right away, and newfies consider me old friends.
Now, my approach to understanding what this means to me is just that people seem to like the idea of Canada, and if they treat me nice I'm going to do my damndest to treat them right as well.
I wouldn't say I'm proud to be what I am, just that I consider myself lucky and would like to live up to expectations and make them better.
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