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patriotism/nationalism

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RedLion:

--- Quote from: KharBevNor on 24 Jul 2008, 18:35 ---Who invented/won what is a pretty fun game because generally Britain wins.

--- End quote ---

Another fun game to play is "Who's responsible for a lot of the world's current problems," because Britain generally wins there too, what with artificially carving out countries in the Middle East and Africa with no regard to tribe, religion, history, etc. Of course the French did their share of that too in Africa--Mauritania's border is composed of nothing but straight lines drawn randomly. (note: I'm [mostly] kidding.)

Anyway, nationalism is one of the most violent and damaging forces in the world, ranking up there with religious fanaticism and ideologies like Stalinism. All borders are artificial creations anyway. Why do people feel the need to define themselves as a chunk of random lank at odds with other chunks of random land? It's only natural that different tribes and peoples clash with one another, but why is so much sacrificed in support of of nationalism? In the past, it was empire-building. Part of that was guaranteeing access to resources and such, but it was largely built around nationalistic glory. Domestic problems in countries often lead to the leaders of those countries trying to re-direct attention to clashes with foreign entities, to rally the people around their nation and distract them from the issues that actually make a difference in their day-to-day lives. The idea of "my country over all other countries" just doesn't seem to have much logical basis, unless it's viewed as the equivalent of different dens of wolves or prides of lions competing amongst themselves. But even then, often times a lot of the people living in those countries aren't bound together by anything other than a vague national story, particularly in recently created nations in Africa and Asia. So what holds that system together?

I, personally, truly do love my country. But I think the most patriotic way to show that love is to question everything it does and demand nothing but the best from it. It has terrible faults, but it also has tremendous accomplishments and has more often than not in the past stood for "the right thing," although that in itself is subject to interpretation. That's why the occurrences of the past few years have been so infuriating to me. I see the current leaders of America betraying everything this country was founded on.  Iraq, Guantanamo Bay, Abu Graihb, renditions, torture, political curruption, religious extremism and intolerance on the rise... John Adams, Thomas Jefferson, Ben Franklin and George Washington would probably disavow this country of any relation to the nation they forged, were they alive. But what I love about my country is that it has the potential to reinvent itself endlessly, and it's been in similar situations in the past, and has always managed to return to its core principles, though never perfectly. I'm a staunch pacifist for the most part, so foreign military adventures are something that I can't support. But if this country were to be invaded or attacked, I would be one of the first people to stand in its defense. I'm not even sure why.

Luke C:
I used to think patriotism and nationalism were both ridiculous ideas since you dont decide were you are born, however when I thought about it you dont pick your family either but most people would say it is rational to love them.

So now I would consider myself a patriot, I take pride in my country and its many achievements but Im not a nationalist. I wont back it right or wrong and I dont have some crazy belief that British people are inherently better than anyone else or that only British people should be allowed to live in Britain.

RedLion:
But what exactly do you mean by "British people"? Is it everyone who is born in Britain? Everyone who fits in with the predominant British culture/society?

Vendetagainst:
Do British people say Brit or Briton? Do Canadians ever get pissed off after they find US pennies and nickels in their change? These are the questions that haunt me.

Jimmy the Squid:
I've never heard a British person say "Brit" nor seen them write "Briton". Also why would anyone be mad about finding change from other countries in amongst their native change? It's not like that change is coming over to your country, stealing your jobs and marrying your women.

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