Comic Discussion > QUESTIONABLE CONTENT
What did my parents tell me......
slandurgurl:
--- Quote from: Usopp on 16 Dec 2008, 17:50 ---
--- Quote ---Speaking from experience, teaching religion to children is very akin to brainwashing. What child, when told that if they don't believe in God they will burn in hell for all eternity, will choose not to believe?
--- End quote ---
By that token, teaching a kid pretty much anything constitutes "brainwashing", because you're an authority figure and they'll generally listen to you, even if you have no grounding in fact. Telling a kid that the Earth revolves around the Sun takes a fair amount of faith on their part, but that's not considered brainwashing. If you decided to teach your kid that the Holocaust was a hoax, is that brainwashing?
--- End quote ---
I disagree. When you teach a child that the earth revolves around the sun, you don't tell them that if they don't believe that they'll be flung off into the vacuum of space. You used the example of the Holocaust. When a child is raised by a Klu Klux Klan member, having racism and hate embedded into their heads, isn't that a form of brainwashing? When a child is taught to believe something because horrible things will happen to them if they don't, I consider that forcible indoctrination; i.e. brainwashing.
Jeff7:
--- Quote from: slandurgurl on 17 Dec 2008, 07:45 ---...
When a child is taught to believe something because horrible things will happen to them if they don't, I consider that forcible indoctrination; i.e. brainwashing.
--- End quote ---
Kid takes stuff from the cookie jar without permission, horrible things will happen. :P
The first humans take an apple from a tree without permission, all living humans are punished.
I'm glad our justice system doesn't work like that - punish not only the person responsible, but also the rest of their lineage, pretty much until time stops.
Kharthulu:
I never asked my parents about the afterlife. I didn't really care. When realized that the likelihood of either the atheists or the religious being correct was roughly the flip of a coin, and i had to accept the possibility that I would cease to exist after death, I confirmed my impulsive decision to not care.
As for what I am going to tell my kids, if i ever have them. I plan to tell them that nobody knows, and it may be impossible for us to figure it(what happens after death) out, but it is unlikely that any religion has it right since they keep changing their stories and failing to make good on their claims. I also plan to tell him that having a religion, or lack of religion is socially expected, but isn't absolutely essential.
I plan to inform my kids about what is socially expected or believed, but not really set in stone. And telling him that although he knows that some of societies customs and beliefs are arbitrary or BS, that doesn't exempt him from the consequences if he chooses to ignore them.
jtheory:
--- Quote from: Kharthulu on 21 Dec 2008, 05:10 ---When realized that the likelihood of either the atheists or the religious being correct was roughly the flip of a coin[...]
--- End quote ---
See, a lot of people think that, and I suspect that's Dora's projected viewpoint as well, but I come down with Penelope on this one.
We don't have an absolute answer -- because we don't have an absolute answer to *anything*, but probability absolutely does play a role in human knowledge.
This is why "statistically significant" results for a study are important, and understanding statistics and probability is so important to science.
If you flip a coin, would you say the chances that it comes back down again vs. the chances that it morphs into a unicorn and flies away equally likely? We have to acknowledge that they are both possible -- but they are not equally likely.
We don't know everything there is to know about how consciousness functions, but we know quite a lot, and there's utterly no reason to believe that consciousness could do anything other than dissolve as the systems supporting it fail.
It's not *impossible* that your consciousness will somehow escape your nervous system and magically fly to any of the magical places that are described in the various religions. But it's incredibly unlikely.
Sorry to seem like I'm ranting at you -- your coin-flip comment was just a starting point, I have no idea whether you'd generally agree with what I'm saying or not! But studying the evolution of human religion (and how supernatural beliefs have evolved from back when the gods were blowing up storms and throwing lightning bolts) it's sometimes amazing to me (and many other atheists, I'm sure) how people think their religious beliefs are just as likely as scientific explanations... ignoring the fact that one way of interpreting the world is vindicated time after time after time, and the others simply are not (and generally just ignore huge swaths of reality).
greatbritton:
--- Quote from: jtheory on 21 Dec 2008, 08:51 ---If you flip a coin, would you say the chances that it comes back down again vs. the chances that it morphs into a unicorn and flies away equally likely? We have to acknowledge that they are both possible -- but they are not equally likely.
--- End quote ---
Unicorns don't have wings!!
no, I kid. usually what I say is something about growing a third arm from the side of your head.
unfortunately for us all, there is simply no way to "logicify" this discussion. faith isn't logical, nor is religion, some science isn't seemingly logical. Please don't misunderstand, I'm not trying to kill this conversation. Ultimately, appealing to a religious person's logic is like...well, like appealing to a religious person's logic!
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