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Mass Effect 2
JD:
--- Quote from: Nodaisho on 15 Mar 2010, 03:15 ---
--- Quote from: Zombiedude on 14 Mar 2010, 18:03 ---I'm not willing to swap spit with Tali but I still wanna see her face.
--- End quote ---
I want it to be shown, and to be absolutely hideous.
--- End quote ---
By the way
Melodic:
that's actually really cute!
JD:
Alright Kasumi will be released on April 6th for 560 MS points on the Xbawks. No clue what that translates into dollars.
Johnny C:
--- Quote from: KvP on 15 Mar 2010, 04:50 ---How so? I haven't gone through Tali's but the rest seem to be Bioware's usual first-the-therapy-then-the-coitus plotlines. Jack's childhood, Thane's dead wife, Miranda's self-esteem issues, etc. etc.
--- End quote ---
except that you don't unlock any of them until after the loyalty mission, meaning that you have to go through actual character development first, and the character development in this game is largely very good. so like i said, it's personalities - as in, they have them, the game explores them, and then you choose if your shepard is attracted to one. besides that they're almost all well-written and i can think offhand of exactly one scene which felt clumsy.
KvP:
--- Quote from: Johnny C on 15 Mar 2010, 16:03 ---
--- Quote from: KvP on 15 Mar 2010, 04:50 ---How so? I haven't gone through Tali's but the rest seem to be Bioware's usual first-the-therapy-then-the-coitus plotlines. Jack's childhood, Thane's dead wife, Miranda's self-esteem issues, etc. etc.
--- End quote ---
except that you don't unlock any of them until after the loyalty mission, meaning that you have to go through actual character development first
--- End quote ---
They've never not had character development in romances. There are a couple of apparently unavoidable issues with game romances, most of which have to do with time. You have to get two characters from having just met to being lovers in the space of a 15-30 hour game, with only a small portion of that time relegated to intra-party conversations and downtime, and you have to make it seem natural. You could go down the Witcher route and just toss out that whole idea, and have the PC be able to sleep with literally every named female character after 1 or 2 dialogues, or you could try and simulate an actual relationship, which is much harder.
The only RPG "romance plots" I found halfway good were Baldur's Gate 2's, for a few reasons. One was because the game was so incredibly long, probably around 80 hours total with the expansion, and the romance plots were designed to stretch out over roughly that time frame. As such it didn't really feel like the sex was actually the point of the plot - in fact the romances were pretty well tied into the critical plot of both the game. In both ME1 and ME2 the romances are tangential to the critical plot and seem to end with the consummation (though I'd be surprised if that would be repeated in ME3) and in Dragon Age only Morrigan's and (probably) Alistair's are. Another reason was the irregularity of the romance plot advancements, because you didn't initiate them, and the game was not rigidly set up in incremental stages like every game Bioware's made since. Having the romance advance incrementally at the end of every mission turns the romance into its own sort of mission.
Having missions you undertake with a character to advance a romance plot is probably the best way to do so, in all actuality. Bioware has gotten a lot better at that, and they're pretty much the only ones doing it. But it's hard to overstate how frustrated I am with the Therapy Love template that just keeps getting used (all romances in BG2, all romances in Jade Empire, Juhani and Carth in KOTOR, Liara in ME, Alistair to some extent in DA, etc.). Characters are woobified because it makes short-term romances a little more sensible, which is fair even if it is tiring, but several of the characters who are supposed to be strong, independent types end up chickified (every female love interest except Aerie, Ashley and Morrigan) When your love interests are solely dependent on the protagonist to heal their psychic wounds and make them whole again, it makes you really long for a character that has his / her shit together. Ashley and Kaidan were actually pretty okay in this regard. Most of the ME2 romances were not. It's a dilemma because game designers at Bioware and elsewhere are always wanting the player to feel accomplished, so it makes sense to put them in the role of "personality healer" so they can good about themselves. It just happens to make a lot of the romances one-note, more or less. Bioware's also flirted with rape as drama in their plotlines on more than one occasion, but that's an entirely different bag of worms.
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