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Bioshock: Infinite

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LTK:
Well, I just finished it. Everything makes sense. Except, not.


--- Quote from: snalin on 29 Mar 2013, 06:50 ---Also replaying Bioshock 1, and the would you kindly thing is really obvious now. Even in the five seconds you are sitting in the plane at the beginning, you see a package in your lap, and a note on the package starting with "would you kindly". I'd like to see if that kind of core plot details are possible to spot early on in Infinite.

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It's not as glaringly obvious in hindsight as it was in Bioshock 1. Even if you notice the things that point towards what really happened, it's easy to find an alternative explanation. I went in knowing the big twist, and it didn't became conclusive until Comstock's last voxophone recording said what he meant by...

(click to show/hide)What happens to a man as he lies in the waters of baptism. Up until that point, he could have been lying about being present at Wounded Knee, just as he lied about being present in Peking. On the other hand, he did record a rage-filled voxophone where he talks about receiving mistrust from his fellow soldiers because he allegedly had native Americans in his family tree, so that indicates he's telling the truth. But aside from those, there is nothing to lead you to believe that Booker and Comstock are the same person.

At the end, I wonder if Booker realised that dying before he made the decision about being baptised would cause Elizabeth to have never have existed. Well, aside from in all the other universes, maybe.
Gonna read the rest of those spoilers now.


--- Quote from: ackblom12 on 29 Mar 2013, 07:53 --- (click to show/hide)I'm thinking specifically of when you've used the control panel to open the door to the lift to get to Elizabeth, and you turn around and shit yourself because one is totally just blaring his horns in your face.

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Totally saw that coming.


--- Quote from: snalin on 29 Mar 2013, 06:50 --- (click to show/hide)how man got the twist once you battered Comstock's head in and Brooker started bleeding from his nose? That went straight over my head, but I am fucking horrible at picking up clues.
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(click to show/hide)His nose didn't start to bleed because he killed Comstock, but because Comstock was starting to remind Booker of what happened in the other reality, regarding Elizabeth's missing finger. Nosebleeds happen every time when memories start to conflict.
Now, there's only one thing left that I really don't understand. How the hell does Comstock actually tell the future?

snalin:

--- Quote from: LTK on 30 Mar 2013, 18:41 ---Now, there's only one thing left that I really don't understand. How the hell does Comstock actually tell the future?

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(click to show/hide)Because he knows the twins? He knows/suspects that Booker will be coming because he stole his daughter from him. The AD marking the false shepherd... I cannot remember if that was there when B gave away his daughter, or if that's a later addition, I'll have to check that. Otherwise, C knowing the twin(s), who seems to have a pretty non-linear relation with space-time, can definitely help with his fortune telling.

From what I picked up from one of the voxphones, it was the male twin that insisted on bringing B into the mix. That is, it wasn't because of C ordered them to do it. Their relation with C is still unclear to me. What's also unclear is the timeline - it seems like B has his child, but loses his wife, gives up his child for gambling debt, and then goes to war, either becoming Comstock, or himself, depending on if he accepts or refuses the baptism. Or is that off?


--- Quote from: LTK on 30 Mar 2013, 18:41 --- (click to show/hide)His nose didn't start to bleed because he killed Comstock, but because Comstock was starting to remind Booker of what happened in the other reality, regarding Elizabeth's missing finger. Nosebleeds happen every time when memories start to conflict.
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(click to show/hide)I don't know, the nosebleeds has only happened up until then, as far as I can remember, when somebody is alive in one reality, but dead in another. Which is what happens.  I could be wrong, though.

ackblom12:
(click to show/hide)It's because they're minds are trying to reconcile their memories. One of the voxophones talks specifically about the effects of crossing rifts, which has hemorraging as a symptom until the brain adapts and creates new and non contradictory memories. Also, the prophecy bit is explained in another voxophone. Comstock was using the machine to look through various windows of time and space to get an idea of what was to come. The twins were annoyed by this because he took it as prophecy, when it was merely probablity. Also no, he didn't brand himself until after he gave away Anna/Elizabeth.

LTK:

--- Quote from: ackblom12 on 30 Mar 2013, 19:38 --- (click to show/hide)It's because they're minds are trying to reconcile their memories. One of the voxophones talks specifically about the effects of crossing rifts, which has hemorraging as a symptom until the brain adapts and creates new and non contradictory memories. Also, the prophecy bit is explained in another voxophone. Comstock was using the machine to look through various windows of time and space to get an idea of what was to come. The twins were annoyed by this because he took it as prophecy, when it was merely probablity. Also no, he didn't brand himself until after he gave away Anna/Elizabeth.

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Ahh, I get it now. I did listen to that voxophone where Lutece explains this, so I just forgot.

The timeline is thus:

(click to show/hide)Booker DeWitt participates in the battle of Wounded Knee and does/does not get baptised.

Does not: He proceeds to join the Pinkerton detective agency, meets his wife, conceives Anna, to whom his wife dies giving birth, racks up a massive debt with Robert Lutece (who is native to his reality), gives away Anna to Robert Lutece, and proceeds to drown himself in sorrow for the next 20 years. Meanwhile, Robert Lutece convinces his sister that Elizabeth should return to her own reality, and so they retrieve Booker from the other reality to make that happen.

Does: He is reborn as Zachary Hale Comstock, meets Rosaline Lutece, stands at the head of Columbia, realises he cannot conceive a child with his wife, asks Rosaline Lutece to solve this problem, who contacts her brother to retrieve Anna. At this point they probably didn't realise that she would become... difficult.

Method of Madness:
(click to show/hide)Don't you have the does/doesn't backwards? He becomes Comstock if he does get baptized, I thought that was the point. Our universe's Booker is Booker because he didn't get baptized. Also, just beat it. Wow. Although I wonder if it would've been even more effective if I'd played Bioshock 1/2.Great game, though. And after listening to that, I think I might have to acquire the soundtrack.

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