Comic Discussion > QUESTIONABLE CONTENT
Does Marten have goals?
Odin:
--- Quote from: tomart on 10 May 2011, 14:32 ---<removed by moderator> Maybe by now machines could be doing most of the work, and people could be, *OH GASP,THE HORROR* enjoying life??
Odin: "these things having been discussed in pretty excruciating detail with similar conclusions being reached by every society since the old Persian empire."
Oh, did I miss the memo? Please, tell me, 50 years too late, "What Should I Be Doing With My Life?" I'd like to know, really.
--- End quote ---
<removed by moderator>
Marten is not Charlie Sheen's character in Office Space. He is not happy, he mopes around about how much his life sucks pretty much every time he's given the opportunity to do so (or any time he gets drunk and doesn't do something so patently stupid he gets the shit kicked out of him) and he takes zero initiative with regard to improving his level of happiness in life. The way that Marten has been written up until this point, if the world around him doesn't make him happy, oh well there is nothing he can do about it (which is complete bullshit).
pwhodges:
Please avoid getting personal in this forum, and please keep it civil even when not being personal; I have removed from a couple of posts above the phrases or paragraphs that went too far.
Tergon:
Short Version:
I agree that Marten seems to have little motivation in his life, and no real goals for his future. But I don't think that's made him stagnant. I think he's shown tremendous growth.
Long Version:
I'd say that Marten's life seems like that of a person who once settled on good enough. He moved across the country for a girl who broke up with him, had no friends or contacts or even a place of his own, and when push came to shove he did the best he could. He got a job with a boss that he got along with okay, even if he didn't care for the job itself too much. He made friends with Steve. He got an apartment. That's not a great life, sure, but for a guy with zero contacts, zero prospects, and hardly any self-confidence, it was a start.
So, however long ago it was, when he was in a bad state, he settled for his Office Bitch job. He only had one friend that we know of, that being Steve, unless you also count Pintsize. His apartment was small but servicable for just himself. A shitty existence, but his only alternative at this point was running home to his parents, and he clearly didn't want to do that.
The important part here is that we don't know how long Marten remained in this state for. He met his previous girlfriend Vicki in his last semester of college, and then a couple of months later he made the cross-country shift to be with her. It could have been weeks or months after that when they finally broke up, and months or years between then and when QC started. We have no timeline to work with here. But the comic starts with Marten hating his job, only having one friend, and generally seeing his life as a never-ending crapstorm.
But then!
Look at what's happened to him over the course of the comic. His circle of friends has expanded to a pretty large group. He's started playing music again. He's got a job he seems to like a lot better than being an Office Bitch. He's more confident and assertive. He got a new girlfriend, and while he did have a dark patch when they broke up, he's bounced back pretty damn well from it.
Now, yes, he hasn't given us much of what he wants in life, but the simple fact is that a lot of people honestly don't know what they want out of life. Marten has vague dreams of being a musician, but that's about it. But, while I agree that's not positive for him, I still think he's done pretty damn well over the course of QC.
Think of what we know about him from before the comic started - a confused, sad kid from a broken home with a worthless degree, zero self-confidence, a job he hated, no prospects, nothing. Take that knowledge and really look at the character we met in Strip #1. And then, compare that person to the Marten we know now, nearly 2000 strips later.
Marten Reed is no Superman. He hasn't changed the world, nor is he going to. But the important thing is that he has changed, and still is changing. His character is still growing up in a lot of ways. And, given the way the last 200 or so strips have gone for him, I don't think it's too far-fetched to say that our favourite Manatee on Codeine is eventually going to find himself a backbone and do something with his life.
Odin:
<removed by moderator>
--- Quote from: Tergon on 11 May 2011, 05:06 ---The important part here is that we don't know how long Marten remained in this state for. He met his previous girlfriend Vicki in his last semester of college, and then a couple of months later he made the cross-country shift to be with her. It could have been weeks or months after that when they finally broke up, and months or years between then and when QC started.
--- End quote ---
Bit of context, but they broke up before he moved and he basically harassed her until she told him to fuck off (conveniently retold in the comic to paint her as the bad guy, but then, Marten is the one telling the story so of course he didn't actually do anything wrong in that situation).
--- Quote ---We have no timeline to work with here. But the comic starts with Marten hating his job, only having one friend, and generally seeing his life as a never-ending crapstorm.
But then!
Look at what's happened to him over the course of the comic. His circle of friends has expanded to a pretty large group.
--- End quote ---
Marten has 3 friends (Faye, Hannelore and Steve), everyone else is someone that Marten occasionally interacts with and who is another character in the comic, but he isn't friends with them.
--- Quote ---He's started playing music again.
--- End quote ---
Anyone have the last comic where Marten has actually acknowledged being in Deathmole or playing any sort of music himself? Hell, aside from a brief run of jokes about Hannelore being obsessed with drumming in the band, nobody in the comic has talked about it at all in a long while (since at least before shit really started to get miserable between Dora and Marten pre-breakup, which was also a toxic relationship to start with so that shouldn't be surprising).
--- Quote ---He's got a job he seems to like a lot better than being an Office Bitch. He's more confident and assertive. He got a new girlfriend, and while he did have a dark patch when they broke up, he's bounced back pretty damn well from it.
Now, yes, he hasn't given us much of what he wants in life, but the simple fact is that a lot of people honestly don't know what they want out of life. Marten has vague dreams of being a musician, but that's about it. But, while I agree that's not positive for him, I still think he's done pretty damn well over the course of QC.
Think of what we know about him from before the comic started - a confused, sad kid from a broken home with a worthless degree, zero self-confidence, a job he hated, no prospects, nothing. Take that knowledge and really look at the character we met in Strip #1. And then, compare that person to the Marten we know now, nearly 2000 strips later.
Marten Reed is no Superman. He hasn't changed the world, nor is he going to. But the important thing is that he has changed, and still is changing. His character is still growing up in a lot of ways. And, given the way the last 200 or so strips have gone for him, I don't think it's too far-fetched to say that our favourite Manatee on Codeine is eventually going to find himself a backbone and do something with his life.
--- End quote ---
The only way this prediction has a chance of coming true is if Jeph gets tired of making Marten the whipping post for the comic (read: never going to happen).
Every single other character in the comic but Marten has experienced character growth. Marten himself, however, has been a one-note character for the entire run of the comic (moved from one scenario or situation to the next).
rje:
--- Quote from: tomart on 10 May 2011, 14:07 ---
Sounds like someone laid that whole horrible trip on you at an impressionable age. I'm sorry.
--- End quote ---
Weeeell...besides my parents - neither of whom attended college or finished high school - encouraging me to go as far as I could in my schooling, so I could have an easier life than they did (and what parent doesn't want that?) nobody really told me I -had- to do anything besides myself. I actually failed my first semester at college and they both told me it was okay to stop and wait until I was ready if I wanted to, or even do something else, if I wanted to. But I did want to get a degree and a career in what I love to do. I wanted to achieve my goals because that feels good. It made me feel good about myself to succeed. I hate failing, too..but that's -me-, of course. I just think Marten achieving something outside of himself would be good for him emotionally. And I also think it'd make an interesting story arc! I kind of look at QC as more than a relationship comedy, and arcs that show the cast growing and evolving and maturing are really interesting to me.
I think we can all agree that achievement and success are empowering things? It doesn't have to be big. Look at Hannelore - she's had her own business, she's taken active steps to try to control her OCD and gain experiences in things she otherwise couldn't do (her pretend-date with Sven), she's done things to grow and mature herself as an adult (standing up to her mother) -- she's actually grown the most over the course of the comic, she's pretty inspiring when you think about it.
So's Faye, and Dora, and all the others in their own ways.
But I'm not saying I don't like Marten D: I like him a lot! I can totally empathize with him too and I so understand the mindset of 'eh, good enough' - I'm just saying that I think if he looked around and said 'Hm...maybe this isn't good enough' it'd be pretty neat to see what he does about it. I'm not demanding Jeph do this, and if he never does it's not like I'd stop reading the comic.
And heck, some of it's jealousy, sure - cos man I wish I had a stress-free pretty awesome laid-back job like that, that paid the bills enough and a wide circle of friends and a nice town to live in where you could walk everywhere and nobody hung fake testicles from the back of their pick-up trucks!
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