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To Boldly Go Where No One Has Gone Before
Thrillho:
--- Quote from: GarandMarine on 16 Nov 2014, 08:04 ---
--- Quote from: Gareth on 14 Nov 2014, 02:34 ---
--- Quote from: Akima on 14 Nov 2014, 00:31 ---
--- Quote from: mustang6172 on 13 Nov 2014, 21:29 ---Is Star Wars bad?
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Bad science-fiction, yes.
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Why? Is it not just soft science fiction?
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Nope. Entirely different construction and build. Star Wars could be called fantasy, but most accurately, despite it's fantastic setting, Star Wars is a Myth Cycle. Quite literally the oldest form of story ever told. Star Trek actually is what one could call Soft Sci-fi for the most part because a fair amount of it's tech is not entirely plausible and/or unexplained, which is one qualifier for "soft" science fiction. The other qualifier is a focus on the soft sciences, the humanities, be they political, anthropology or sociology. Fahrenheit 451 and Orwell's 1984 could both be classed as Soft Sci Fi for their focuses on politics. The film District 9, with it's use of the medium to explore a variety of modern social and political themes would also be "soft". Star Trek floats between hard and soft and is an incredible piece of sci fi for it, with it's sheer scale, it's explored hundreds of thousands of themes and concepts, some of them a bit too often, all with a bright eye towards the future.
It's important to remember that the goal and purpose of Science Fiction is not to tell a story. It is to look at ourselves and our current state through the lens of the fantastic, and occasionally, to turn that lens on the grey mists of the future and based as we are now, speculate as to what might come.
While still telling a damn good story.
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None of that gives me any indication why Star Wars is not sci-fi.
BenRG:
--- Quote from: Torlek on 16 Nov 2014, 23:32 ---On the other hand, the DCX was never going to be able to deliver SSTO with any meaningful payload. There's no engines that are up to that challenge. The concept as a first stage, however, is perfectly sound. Hence why we see SpaceX planning to perform a first stage RTLS on their next Dragon flight. The future will be here soon.
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I'd be very interested to find out the payload to LEO you could get with a reusable spacecraft like Delta Clipper boosted by a reusable first stage like that used on the Falcon-9 v.1.1. SSTO is beyond our engineering capabilities right now; reusable TSTO, on the other hand just requires someone to fund and develop it. I suspect that the only reason SpaceX isn't trying it now is because it isn't easily compatible with their commercial goal of carving out their own chunk of the commercial satellite business; that requires an expendable second stage for maximum launch efficiency.
Back on topic, whoever wrote the Enterprise opening credits got right that cheap, routine space launch is a key to human space expansion. However, the story of the ISS (formerly Space Station Freedom) shows that this must be accompanied by a fully-funded applications programme to be worthwhile. There is no point building a space infrastructure if you're not going to build a moonbase, orbital power satellites or the like.
--- Quote from: Gareth on 17 Nov 2014, 00:46 ---None of that gives me any indication why Star Wars is not sci-fi.
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It's simple. Star Wars does not address how science and technology affects social and other human development issues. That is a critical element of sci-fi.
Thrillho:
A quick Google suggests that the definition of sci-fi is murky as hell anyway. To be as crass as to use Wikipedia: 'Science fiction is a genre of fiction dealing with imaginative content such as futuristic settings, futuristic science and technology, space travel, time travel, faster than light travel, parallel universes, and extraterrestrial life.' It uses at least seven of those.
jwhouk:
That definition of Sci-Fi essentially is Star Trek.
BenRG:
--- Quote from: jwhouk on 17 Nov 2014, 05:37 ---That definition of Sci-Fi essentially is Star Trek.
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I think it's more of a case that, in its many decades of existence, Star Trek has managed to, at least once, match every possible definition of sci-fi. Coincidence or just the effect of despairing script-writers casting around desperately for some new story ideas? :lol:
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