Comic Discussion > ALICE GROVE

Alice Grove MCDT - December 2014

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Method of Madness:
Well...yeah, I know. That's why I didn't.

explicit:
I'm all for grit. And for a story with female MC who can kill people without being an over the top villain, 2-dimensional mercenary/assassin, psychotic or get really whiny after they kill someone. For online comics only flipside and grrlpower come to mind atm. Guys get to be badasses all the time.

Although egregious violence is sufficient - I guess.

ReindeerFlotilla:

--- Quote from: Method of Madness on 28 Dec 2014, 18:41 ---
--- Quote from: ReindeerFlotilla on 28 Dec 2014, 01:24 ---Murder assumes the existence of a justice system.
--- End quote ---
I really want to respond to this, but I can't think of a way that wouldn't start a capital punishment debate.

--- End quote ---

Meh. I wasn't making a value judgment vis a vis systems of law. That's a whole different moral debate. I was responding to "would be murder."

I mean "murder" has several meanings that (almost) all point to the same thing in different contexts. It just seems to me that all homicide is murder outside the legal context--except for accidents. That is to say, if A kills B during the act of attempting to harm B, most people wouldn't bat an eye if you said "A murdered B." So to look at Alice killing LEJ as murdering her, now, but not before now does imply the legal context of murder. For that, you have to have a justice system.

I'd really think my suggested that Alice might be the law would rather more lend itself to a capital punishment debates, but again, that wasn't my intent.

I suppose, the internet being what it is, one could construe my interest in the subject as a judgment that LEJ deserves to die. I don't think that at all. I once said that no one deserves anything. I meant it. "To die" is a thing. QED.

I simply hesitate to judge Alice's actions, or potential actions, because I'm putting myself in Alice's place. I can see a number of perspectives Alice could look on the matter from. I'm putting myself in Alice's place because what she has already done makes me uncomfortable. The Ender Wiggin theory of conflict resolution has a point, but I always thought Ender erred on the side of "you can never be too sure." which is why so few people survived his lessons. If your aim is to make sure your assailant knows not to make the mistake of attacking you again, you have to leave them alive. The dead know nothing. I never liked that side of Ender  (partly because he managed to be oblivious to the fact that he did kill people). I've never liked it in action heroes because they tend to be so off hand about it. I can't say I'm overly fond of it in Alice. (I also can't help but think the story has been structured to make me feel that way. Leaving aside "deserves," Alice being asked to stop, refusing, and then a shot of what she'd already done left with question of whether she will do more unresolved doesn't seem calibrated to make the reader sympathize with Alice.)

But we don't know what this really means. We really don't know anything about Alice as a person. The down side to a twice weekly update schedule. We know she's capable of great violence and continuous altruism. We don't know why for any of it.

BenRG:
For now, I'm sticking with my "Alice is an ex-con doing community service" theory. It is quite possible that she has experience with murder and may not be 100% mentally stable when in a fight-or-flight situation or when people and things she values are threatened.

I'm also sticking with my theory that Ardent's sister may not be aware of just what she did and why it would be considered criminal and even evil. It is quite possible that, thanks to nanotech, even most forms of death are curable (especially if the process begins immediately post-mortem). In such a society, it is possible that killing someone because you're annoyed is not considered too different from cussing them out or slapping them for an insult. She could be quite horrified if Alice tells her that there was the real likelihood that some of her targets would have remained dead. The nature of their society leaves people of their culture emotionally and mentally stunted, with all the impulse control of a toddler and a borderline-psychotic sense of selfishness (because there is no serious impact such a mindset could have on society and others - indeed their society is designed to fulfil every selfish whim instantly).

We could easily have a fascinating few dozen strips with Alice explaining to Ardent and his sister about society works without self-modification and other technologies that make any wish come true immediately and without consequence. Jeph could turn the normal narrative on its head by, instead of having the primitive wandering slacked-jawed through a technologically advanced society, instead have the children of a techologically-enabled utopia trying to understand a world where one has to sweat and work to gain anything and actions often have irrevocable consequences.

Oh, and a prediction - Ardent is going to become Alice's special friend: the Angel on her shoulder who helps her rein in her bloodthirsty impulses when the dark tide swallows her up.

ReindeerFlotilla:
It would seem Alice is the law.

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