Comic Discussion > QUESTIONABLE CONTENT
WCDT 8-13 December 2014 (Strips 2850-2854)
ReindeerFlotilla:
--- Quote from: BenRG on 10 Dec 2014, 08:22 ---
--- Quote from: ReindeerFlotilla on 10 Dec 2014, 08:15 ---Do boys tend to start building identity by modeling men? Pretty much. Is that a good thing? I'm gonna have to say no.
--- End quote ---
The point is that the process is instinctual. So, whether or not it is a 'good' thing is meaningless. It simply imposes upon us the responsibility to be good role models. Unfortunately, it doesn't always happen.
--- End quote ---
My point is that there's literally (not figuratively) no evidence of any such instinctive process. We simply do not know if the effect is nature or nurture. Male and female are facts of the species. Man and woman are constructs. You can't assemble the thought "Boys unconsciously look to men as role models" without first understanding the construct exists. It's equally likely that boys look to men, not as "role models" so much as "clues as to how the construct works."
Its not the same thing. If instinct is involved in the latter, its no different than the instinct to bang on pots. There is a thing. What happens when I poke the thing?
Clinton has issues but there's no reason, yet, to trace those issues to abandonment. Certainly no reason to trace them to lack of a penis weilding authority figure. They might derive from Clinton being kind of a jerk. Or maybe they come of Clinton being short, scrawny, bookish, and younger sibling to a "non-standard" person. Kids are cruel to that which is different, and Clinton is pretty much different in all aspects. Also: ginger.
Whatever your theory of mind, children want approval from their elders. Claire's behavior would suggest that Clinton is constantly on the cusp of that from her. She disapproves, vociferously, but then adds a sideways compliment. That doesn't explain anything other than their relationship. One, standard, sibling rivalry.
Beyond that, Clinton has shown a "Lack of boundaries" and a "Tendency to try to share his excitement in inappropriate ways." In short, he's a fairly typical man (Even in the QCverse. Martin is atypical of male characters...shit, he's atypical of characters. Pretty much the only other character to show his level of reserve is Henry. The apple didn't fall far, if it fell at all). As a human male with no interest in sportsball, I can tell you that other human males--and more than a few females--don't grasp that it's not an appropriate topic with me. For sometime I managed to run in groups of like minded humans, but there was always someone who had to geek out about the Worldbowl or Super Series. Clinton happens to geek out about something that the majority doesn't care about. He's a sports fan in a town full of rabid ballet enthusiasts.
He's still got issues, but he's never actually done anything worse than things Sven, Angus, Steve, and Dale have done. He just catches more shit than most of the cast.
Undrneath:
Whether it is instinctual or cultural typically boys imprint what they see as "being a man" from what they see around them and then accordingly will then become that impression. So either way the end result is the same Clinton possibly not having positive male role models to imprint on may have negatively affected his personality. Moreover Marten's seemingly chill attitude may have a positive effect on Clinton.
ReindeerFlotilla:
--- Quote from: Undrneath on 10 Dec 2014, 15:55 ---Whether it is instinctual or cultural typically boys imprint what they see as "being a man" from what they see around them and then accordingly will then become that impression. So either way the end result is the same Clinton possibly not having positive male role models to imprint on may have negatively affected his personality. Moreover Marten's seemingly chill attitude may have a positive effect on Clinton.
--- End quote ---
This presupposes that Mrs Agustus was incapable of raising here son without a strong man to do the heavy lifting.
That's the patriarchy talking. That's why valkygrrl was right in the first place. Nature is an appeal to facts not in evidence. Clinton's issues as the result of a broken home is an appeal to facts not in evidence. EVERYONE is like Clinton. It's just that most people's boundary breaking and excessive enthusiasm is socially accepted. Marten will drop into a digression on bands you've never heard of in a heartbeat. Faye will straight up assault and batter you.
Clinton can be a dick, but he's no worse in that category than Sven. It's easy to think of him as a villian because he was a threat to Hanners for a moment. But, I submit that his reaction was fairly normal. First, he'd basically just met his own personal Jesus. Second, the creepy he was about to pull reduces to the same kind of shit people pull on celebrities all the time. All things considered, Hanners is a celebrity. The only reason TMZ isn't camped out in front of the building is likely that Beatrice A) paid off all the editors, B) had every editor who looked at the story sideways killed, and their families, and their dogs too, C) owns TMZ. (Station is probably also involved.)
When confronted with the fact that Hannelore Ellicott-Chatham is a person with friends and a life, he not only backed down, he kept the secret (evidenced by the fact that May was shocked to find Hanners. Given the AI's who have met Hanners and not realized who she was, it's likely that the media doesn't even have a good idea what she looks like. Clinton knows but hasn't told anyone).
Clinton is overly passionate and a little self absorbed. Compare to Claire who has displayed the same tendencies (First appearance, ear rings--several times). No one's making the argument that Mrs. Augustus was poor role model to Claire.
Natswash:
--- Quote from: ReindeerFlotilla on 10 Dec 2014, 13:39 ---Also: ginger.
--- End quote ---
Ginger men catch way too much flak for their hair color. Most get teased the hell out of for it, and not just in the UK, even out here in southern California. I had one scout in my troop dye his hair for months before he finally committed suicide because of the teasing and unkindness, at school and at scouts.
While women catch some of it too and catch some different flak (fetishism and stereotypes based on the Fiery redhead trope), it is usually seen as an addition to charm/beauty/power.
This could be a part of Clinton's character, who knows how much he got teased for it himself as a youth? For that and for his loss of a hand. Projecting a tough attitude as a way of dealing with outside pressures isn't uncommon at all. He also probably felt the need to protect Claire while she was figuring out her gender, and was almost certainly getting teased by both boys and girls
Loki:
wtf@ginger
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