Comic Discussion > QUESTIONABLE CONTENT

WCDT 4176-4180 (13th - 17th, January 2020)

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Wingy:
Mag title: "Tity" instead of "Titty".  Is this creative license on the magazines' staff?

I still don't get May's fascination with this.  I mean, can't she just log in to BME?

BenRG:

--- Quote from: Wingy on 17 Jan 2020, 04:32 ---I still don't get May's fascination with this.  I mean, can't she just log in to BME?
--- End quote ---

Momo has addressed this before, I think. Most AIs find there to be a different quality of mental experience of the data/image if they absorb it through senses rather than download it directly into their memories.

Cornelius:

--- Quote from: jwhouk on 17 Jan 2020, 04:17 ---Boy, this is reminding me of the old days of the long WCDT's with multiple arguments...

Thing is, there's a couple of major things that Roko's up against here:

1. Bureaucracy, and
2. the basic question of AI rights.

The problem is that, to the latter, it took the US over a century to really address basic human rights (and they still haven't quite got it down). And, to the former, no one has ever figured out a way of getting around it, once it is in place - short of pitching the whole of government into the trash bin.

--- End quote ---

At which point it is replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable?

notsocool:

--- Quote from: Aenno on 17 Jan 2020, 04:25 ---
Because she is explicitly obliged to find a job, she is explicitly obliged to live in society, and she is explicitly forbidden to do any kind of digital job. It's necessary means she can't be disembodied and conform to parole requirements. Actually, "find a job, but you can't do any kind of digital job" is already a "no disembodiment" rule. Any job disembodiment AI can do is digital.
--- End quote ---

No. The "digital work" referred to is explicitly explained to be the renting out of processor power the way Pintsize does. May explains that she is not allowed to to this. In comic 4173 the government employee reveals bits of May's situation that wasn't clear before: in panel 4 he says that the vast majority of AI offenders are either not embodied or have bodies to return to on release. This is as clear as can be that there are AI offenders who are disembodied, and continue to be disembodied after release. May's parole conditions should be the same as theirs. This is the "ridiculous" part of my statement: if May is somehow being treated differently from other disembodied AI, that is ridiculous, and they should have her parole conditions revised. But we know for a fact that May's parole doesn't require her to have a body, because in panel 5 the same employee reveals something even more important: that May requested her body.


--- Quote ---First, as I said before, it's absolutely possible (on the level "it would be very curious if it hasn't") it was confiscated as a mean of crime.
Second, yeah, I can perfectly imagine a server that would cost more then humanoid body. Again, it's not fixed stats like "that's a server, it costs X; it's humanoid body, it costs Y". Again, it's like cars. Is it possible that a car cost more then a, let's say, house? I can buy a house in Russia (where I reside) for, about, 50K USD (3 millions roubles). Ferrari 488 Spider costs ten times from it (32 millions).
Point is, don't assume "disembodiment" means "free as a wind, completely no expenses, no need of platform". It's a question about "what platform government should allow for released convict" anyway.
--- End quote ---

Please do not compare a luxury car to a regular house. This is not a good faith argument. The government is not going to buy luxury solid gold servers for AI ex-offenders, and the more relevant thing is whether a cheaper option is available, and of course there is. There is no way that a regular server would cost more than the exact same computer PLUS arms, legs, and a face. More importantly, the reason this came up is because the only reason May loses so much of her pay is because she has to pay to fix her body - for that matter, there is no way that a computer would use up as much electricity as the same computer inside an AI body that ALSO has to power arms and legs!

This is the critical thing: an AI does not need a bed, does not need food, does not even need a home larger than a closet. She does not die of exposure, she does not starve to death, she has no chance of falling sick. In fact, this is so far from the human version of the same that we'd ask if the government's money would be better spent helping human parolees who might actually die if they don't receive the help. May's problem is in fact transient, because if she saves even a tiny amount of money she will eventually get out of her predicament by buying a new body, because she cannot die of old age! On a story level, May's situation is entirely contrived by the writer, because an AI has so much less limitations than a human it's crazy!


--- Quote ---Yes, because we're putting them in situation where it's HARDER for them to get all of this by themselves.
Look at this by another way. Should we give prisoners medicare, shelters and free clothes, if we don't give it to law-abiding people?
--- End quote ---

Not the same thing. A prisoner has NO way of getting any of those things, hence they are responsible for you. May is not a prisoner, she is a parolee, and the government is not responsible for her. Compare apples to apples and oranges to oranges, please. If this was set in some vague country we might have to guess at law, but the comic explicitly takes place in America, so we know what laws apply to humans. Human parolees do not get those things.

Cornelius:
An interesting question that, if I'm not mistaken, hasn't been dealt with in universe: is there such a thing as a natural death for AI? I.e. not through accident - as the Crushbot incident could have been, had Roko not had a reinforced core. If AI should be inextricably linked to their substrate, then that could wear out. On the other hand, we've seen Pintsize being backed up, and I seem to remember Momo being transferred by data cable?

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