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[Borondir]

I don't normally post much here, more of a lurker, but when I saw this article I knew I had to post it.  No less an authority than the New York Times is recognizing the amazing innovation happening in metal. Link

They actually do a really good job of describing the conflict between true and commercial metal since the 80s, and the dynamics between scenes, and how genre boundaries are finally being freely crossed.

Plus Sunn 0))) gets their picture in one of the biggest newspaper's in the world.

[kikanjuuneko]

I must admit, that was pretty well-written, even if the part about how My Chemical Romance and Coheed and Cambria were a mix of emo and metal was kind of off. While I like Isis, I'm usually kind of skeptical of some of the stuff that gets put out on Hydrahead (I call it Nintendo syndrome), but yeah, well-written nonetheless.

[KharBevNor]

Hmmn, I don't like this article. I don't like it for several pretty interconnected reasons. It obsesses almost entirely on the American metal scene, and then only the hip bits. There's the general attitude in there that metal has only just got intelligent, or arty, or whatever, and it has only done this because it's seen the light and embraced 'art-school' bs. My arse metal just got clever! Borknagar anyone? Cynic? Edge of Sanity? Yes, it's better written than a lot of articles of it's sort, but GAH! I just don't like this art-metal bollocks. I don't like it because people just like the crowd described there listen to it, and ZING they think they know metal, and they think they listen to better metal and have a better taste in metal than actual metalheads, when the application of the word 'metal' in these bands is a loose and devolved thing...it's just...insidious. Annoying. Plus it's not actually that good when you compare it to some of the cream of real goddamn metal.

gah, I don't like it. Go listen to Saxon and stop cutting your hair, you gits. Stop making me talk about stuff I can't iterate properly.

[Borondir]

The writer and the guy from Pelican don't talk about the art kids not knowing real metal in very positive light. The author also talks about bands laying the groundwork for 'cleverness' long ago.  Basically, he's just saying that only now is the mainstream noticing that metal has been smart all along. In a way the article is a bit condescending, but this is the mainstream media we're dealing with.

[Kai]

In other news, I just noticed you're from Kansas! what part? I live down in Overland Park, if that happens to mean anything.

[KharBevNor]

The writer and the guy from Pelican don't talk about the art kids not knowing real metal in very positive light. The author also talks about bands laying the groundwork for 'cleverness' long ago.  Basically, he's just saying that only now is the mainstream noticing that metal has been smart all along. In a way the article is a bit condescending, but this is the mainstream media we're dealing with.

I suppose.

Still, I don't like the whole trend. I suppose what I really resent is that my own favourite bands are totally 100% ignored by any sort of media whatosever, but the moment a few bands buy into the art-rock zeitgeist, suddenly they're all over the New York Times.

[Borondir]

In other news, I just noticed you're from Kansas! what part? I live down in Overland Park, if that happens to mean anything.

Uh yeah, I know where Overland Park is, up there by KC. When I'm in Kansas I live about an hour north of Wichita (Hutchinson) in the smack dab middle of the state. My location is slightly misleading because I'm actually at Valparaiso University in northwestern Indiana right now.

[sjbrot]

The author talks about how the "battle lines" have been dulled between the various camps for different sub-genres of metal. That really applies to alot of genres. Same thing with punk.

But how much of this leads to a bland, homogenous product? It's good to incorporate different influeces, but sometimes I feel like something the Taste of Chaos tour was a failure because you have at least a couple of bands (let's say MCR and Killswitch Engage) who shouldn't be on the same stage but are.

And the audience doesn't mind 'cause they just want their music "fuckin' LOUD."

[El Opium]

I do like some stuff that might fall into this here 'art-metal' category namely Skullflower and Sunn O)). Lately though I've been feeling that I should satisfy my cravings for heavyness by cutting the crap and buying Reign In Blood.

[Johnny C]

Albert Mudrian, editor of the year-old metal magazine Decibel and author of "Choosing Death: The Improbable History of Death Metal and Grindcore," asks: "Is art conscious or unconscious? Up until now, there was art in metal, but there wasn't for the most part a self-awareness about it. Now, these new artists have that, and they want to be painted as such."

I don't think the article's saying that heavy metal and art have not been friends before this; I think it's trying to get the point across that there are now a greater number of bands saying "hey, we're actually makin' something artistic and creative and stuff here, let's expand this as much as we can."

You're right, though, Khar; they left out a bunch of stuff. Heard of Earth, guys at the New York Times?

[SpacemanSpiff]

While I can actually understand Khar's point, I still think the article is good. The metal scene is insanely complex and big and of course the mainstream media will focus on the more popular bands then.
I find this article very useful though for two reasons: First of all, it tarnishes the myth that metal is "dumb music" and second of all, it might interest a few of the readers in these bands. And, as the guy from Pelican said: This might be their gateway. They might discover the more obscure bands that way.
This how I discovered most obscure bands - you find out about a band that actually gets a little bit of recognition in the media, then read about their influences and then listen to that and so on.

Also, I find it amazing that The Flying Luttenbachers were mentioned in there. Even though I wouldn't call them metal at all. But still.
The only thing that bugged me about that is the the article makes it sound as if they aren't around anymore. They are though, I've seen them live a few months ago.

[Kai]

Crotchduster is way more arty than Sunn O))) or Isis or anybody.

[KharBevNor]

I find this article very useful though for two reasons: First of all, it tarnishes the myth that metal is "dumb music" and second of all, it might interest a few of the readers in these bands. And, as the guy from Pelican said: This might be their gateway. They might discover the more obscure bands that way.

They don't though, and this is the point. The vast majority just listen to the narrow selection of 'art metal' that gets reviewed by major indie reviewers and then don't give a shit, or worse, feel that they have now experienced the cream of metal. On this forum, and at others, last.fm for example, I have several times seen voiced opinions that amount  'I see kids talking about the new Children of Bodom album, but when I mention 'Panopticon' to them they don't know what I'm talking about. I totally know my metal more.' When of course, this guy hasn't heard any more fucking metal than Isis, Pelican and Iron Maiden. He probably hasn't even heard a single Children of Bodom song all the way through. Only the barest majority ever try and get into real metal off this bat, and most of them only manage to scratch the surface. Jeph, for example, has made an effort: he acknowledges In Flames and Opeth, which is, I suppose, a start. The real problem is, there is something deeply anathemic about the two scenes. In a very real sense, I don't think something is really metal if you strip it from the long hair and the black clothes. 'Metal' is something far more visceral than a song structure or a tuning pattern. Metal is knowing when to throw the horns, metal is actually identifying with Hammerfall lyrics, it's a whole package. What am I even ranting about now? I dunno. Thing is, metal has never really been dumb, especially not when compared to other sorts of music. Aggh. I hate trying to iterate this stuff, especially without being rude or sounding stupid, both of which I'm sure I've already done somewhere.

Anyway, I have this theory that the metal community will be ostracising art metal in the next couple of years. These things take some time. They were pretty cool with hair metal and nu metal at first as well. Some things just can't co-exist with the essence of metal though, and I reckon this stuff is one of them.

Also, go listen to Borknagar.

[Borondir]

Borknagar IS art metal though. So they didn't get mentioned in the article, what's your point.  

Its not like the entire art metal scene is devoid of black shirts and long hair either. Look at Sunn 0))). Stephen O'Malley is more kvlt than half the Norwegian BM scene put together.  

I really do understand where your coming from on this Khar, I just have to respectfully disagree about whether this art-metal actually belongs or not. I think it does.  

On the discovering more thing, the vast majority of kids in general who listen to metal only listen to a couple of surface semi-popular bands and then pretend to grow up once they hit college. So indie kids finding out about a few metal bands from a different starting point isn't really different than how most  
"metalheads" listen to metal.

[Borondir]

BTW, I am going to go listen to Borknagar.

[KharBevNor]

Borknagar IS art metal though. So they didn't get mentioned in the article, what's your point.  

They're better than all the bands in the article, have been around for longer, and are far more obscure.

Basically.

On the discovering more thing, the vast majority of kids in general who listen to metal only listen to a couple of surface semi-popular bands and then pretend to grow up once they hit college. So indie kids finding out about a few metal bands from a different starting point isn't really different than how most"metalheads" listen to metal.

There is a tacit difference between a metalhead and someone who listens to metal. I call it 'The rushing feeling of euphoric wellbeing I get when I listen to 'All Guns Blazing' by Judas Priest'.

If you see what I mean.

[La Creme]

There has always been a smart side of metal. Generally, there tends to be a smart side of any popularized and generally ridiculous trend in art or music. It's just that the smart side is also usually the side you never hear about.


Also, Crotchduster are TOTALLY art. The art of making disgusting funnies.

[Borondir]

I'd like to think I understand what it means to really be a metalhead. Its that indescribable euphoric feeling, when you get that uncontrollable urge to headbang madly.

But fact is, the vast majority of people who listen to metal aren't metalheads.

Borknagar sort of came out of black metal scene, which whatever you want to say, doesn't give them points in artsy circles. I'm not saying that's good or bad, its just the way it is.

[Trollstormur]

fraz tab aloobie,

009D


that's all I have to say about art metal.