- If Ma Vance gets word of the breakup, Dora might sell the shop to Hanners and move to Kathmandu. Now that I think back, I don't think Faye ever mentioned to Dora what Veronica threatened her with when they went to dinner...
- If Ma Vance gets word of the breakup, Dora might sell the shop to Hanners and move to Kathmandu. Now that I think back, I don't think Faye ever mentioned to Dora what Veronica threatened her with when they went to dinner...
She did. (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=467) Dora might not remember though; that was quote awhile ago now.
If she did forget, I'm sure she'll get a sound reminder when she wakes up hanging by rusty chains from a dungeon ceiling.
Steve, obviously.
... and WHERE is the PENNY option?? I haven't seen her in CoD for a long time.
I'm kinda looking forward to Penny's annoyed face
Pressing F5 over and over does not make Jeph draw faster.
However AS SOON AS I GO TO BED he will post. Happens every time.
Sadly, I fear that Penelope may have booked a bus tour of the local allosaurus preserve...
Sadly, I fear that Penelope may have booked a bus tour of the local allosaurus preserve...
A few thoughts as we open the week:Just for clarity's sake, do you mean "celibate" in a purely sexual sense, or for the sake of romantic relationships as well? I mean, I can't see either one working out unless Marten gets horrifically drunk and wakes up in some random lady's apartment, and even that would be massively, massively out-of-character for him. So I guess I agree with you either way? I just thought your comment kind of blurs the line there, and I wasn't quite sure which way you meant it.
- I still contend that Marten is going to be celibate for a while, for two good reasons: first, after the relationship roller coaster he's been on with Faye and Dora, I don't think he's going to want to be going back to Six Flags Dating Adventure anytime soon; second, it's better for Teh Funny in the strip.
...I don't mean taking sides, so much as, "Good! I'm glad you guys are broken up!" or something similar...
Aww, man! Marten looks rough. Poor bastard is haggard.
Has he even showered?
Has he even slept?
OHMYGOD THE STRIP TITLE IS I'LL BE BY YOUR SIDE IS JEPH SAYING THAT HANNERS AND MARTEN WILL GET TOGETHER AND HAVE BABBIES?!?!?!?!Perhaps it would be a good thing... I think they'd make a nice couple, if Hanners can overcome her OCD
*sigh* I don't understaaaand what the deal is with Hanners. I don't especially like or dislike her, but I find the lolcat-esque cuteness somewhat painful. Since when does OCD, and yeah, more than a little lack of life experience, make you act like a child?
Been watching all of this, for like months....
Seriously? None of you saw the Dora treating the Marten as getting stale? None of you saw the "mental troubles are the new indie rock" infecting this like it has everything else?
No one?
And really, on average, a weeks worth of comics equals maybe a day, so Dora and Marten had been dating what, 5-6 months? You buffoons are suggesting couples counseling? for a 5 (at best) month old relationship?
Gah! Seriously, can we get back to a storyline that doesn't stink of pussy Jeph?
Been watching all of this, for like months....Uh, actually, like two dozen people registered last week to scream the exact same thing at high volume. It started such a huge pissing war that the thread got locked. Rather than start another flamewar, I'll just say three things.
Seriously? None of you saw the Dora treating the Marten as getting stale? None of you saw the "mental troubles are the new indie rock" infecting this like it has everything else?
No one?
And really, on average, a weeks worth of comics equals maybe a day, so Dora and Marten had been dating what, 5-6 months? You buffoons are suggesting couples counseling? for a 5 (at best) month old relationship?
Gah! Seriously, can we get back to a storyline that doesn't stink of pussy Jeph?
*sigh* I don't understaaaand what the deal is with Hanners. I don't especially like or dislike her, but I find the lolcat-esque cuteness somewhat painful. Since when does OCD, and yeah, more than a little lack of life experience, make you act like a child?
I don't think Jeph is trying to make it sound like OCD means a person acts like a child. This is just another part of Hannelore's character, she acts like child not because of her OCD or lack of life experience, it's just how she is.
I thought today's comic was cute, I think this is what Marten needed just a little pick me up with no big discussion about how he feels and what happened, all that can come later. Hanners was the perfect person to see Marten right now I think.
Marten's smile seems someone guarded, he's not letting himself go.
He's holding something back.
Why do you folks keep insisting that all of a sudden Marten is going to morph into this violent, raging, screaming, everyone-get-away kind of beast and start tearing into people?Not only it would be interesting, i personally think Marten NEEDS to get angry.... It's healthy sometimes you know?
Have we ever, EVER seen him do anything remotely like that at all, in the history of the strip?
Yeah, he had a breakup. It was the end of a long relationship. But people do that all the time without raging, taking it out on their friends, or in general becoming an asswipe to be around.
Marten had his cry, in private. He's dealing with it in his own way.
Sheesh, people.
Why do you folks keep insisting that all of a sudden Marten is going to morph into this violent, raging, screaming, everyone-get-away kind of beast and start tearing into people?
Have we ever, EVER seen him do anything remotely like that at all, in the history of the strip?
Yeah, he had a breakup. It was the end of a long relationship. But people do that all the time without raging, taking it out on their friends, or in general becoming an asswipe to be around.
Marten had his cry, in private. He's dealing with it in his own way.
Sheesh, people.
Let's distinguish between "next" to react and critical reactors; I voted for Tai, her reaction(s) could be critical, as could Ms Vance's... but they might not be in the next panels.
I picture Marten drunken hijinks w Steve and/or Jimbo, leading to erudite analyses of women, perhaps in the vein of Sigmund Freud, "What the fuck do women WANT, already??"
Healthy or no, it's clear to see that Marten's feeling like hell right now, and if someone triggers him I do believe he's going to lose his temper.
People shipping Marten with the worry hat in 5... 4...
:psyduck:
Every now and then we all lose our temper. It's never pretty, and it never helps things in the long run, and psychological studies may show that it has bad effects if you do it too much... but as much as I accept all that, I also know how it feels to be under a gigantic pile of shit when your world turns on you. And I know that sometimes, just for a few shining moments, getting it all off your chest does make you feel a little bit better. Marten needs to let out his emotions, and if Hannelore can't manage to get him to do it by being adorable, then maybe a good old-fashioned yell session might at least help him a little.
Or more likely Tai will make some off the cuff statement or a clumsy pass at Dora in front of Marten
"What the fuck do women WANT, already??"
a 12 inch chocolate penis that ejaculates money.
MARTEN!HULK MUST RAEG!"What the fuck do women WANT, already??"
a 12 inch chocolate penis that ejaculates money.
Chocolate penis, if edible, is an unfortunately non-renewable resource.
Cashjaculate just sounds painful, if not unsanitary, causing UTIs all up in the lady's hoohah or whatever. Some gals do a ping pong ball trick; this little filly pays off like a slot machine!
D
MARTEN!HULK MUST RAEG!"What the fuck do women WANT, already??"
a 12 inch chocolate penis that ejaculates money.
Chocolate penis, if edible, is an unfortunately non-renewable resource.
Cashjaculate just sounds painful, if not unsanitary, causing UTIs all up in the lady's hoohah or whatever. Some gals do a ping pong ball trick; this little filly pays off like a slot machine!
D
How about a 12 inch cash penis that ejaculates chocolate???
to all those Tai/Dora shipper
I present to you exhibit 1778 (http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=1778)
to all those Tai/Dora shipper
I present to you exhibit 1778 (http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=1778)
Tai says that she wouldnt want to lick something Marten has jizzed in before (1778)
+
When Marten met Dora's parents, he told her father (through code) that he is using protection with Dora (1034)
+
The most common form of contraception is condoms (assuming, I didnt factcheck)
=
Technically, Marten hasn't jizzed in Dora.
=
possible Dora/Tai (but I'm not necessarily shipping it)
"yeah, but you're the one who actualized it!"
As part of the "Marten Will Snap" faction, I think I need to clarify that I don't think Marten will do anything particularly violent or destructive (although he may have already destroyed items that remind him of Dora.) I think it's most likely that Marten will just say something without thinking that will be unintentionally hurtful.
Healthy or no, it's clear to see that Marten's feeling like hell right now, and if someone triggers him I do believe he's going to lose his temper. I don't want to see that because I think it'll be psychologically healthy, or because I think it'd be funny, or because I want him to make Hannelore cry, or anything like that. I want to see it because I think Marten's a great character with one gap in his personality - the fact that he always has this mask up of being a calm, cheerful, easygoing guy. Right now that mask is more strained than it ever has been, and purely for the sake of the story, I want a look underneath it.
I think it was Freud who defined depression as "anger without enthusiasm".
The only time I can remember Marten being enthusiastic is when he bought a guitar.
It would be consistent with all we've seen before if he had a "friggin' women" vent with someone.
Oh he's going to snap.
He was like mid-snap when Dora walked out in strip #1797 and he squelched it.
That shit is going to have to release at some point.
The only question is who will be the target/victim.
MARTEN!HULK MUST RAEG!"What the fuck do women WANT, already??"
a 12 inch chocolate penis that ejaculates money.
Chocolate penis, if edible, is an unfortunately non-renewable resource.
Cashjaculate just sounds painful, if not unsanitary, causing UTIs all up in the lady's hoohah or whatever. Some gals do a ping pong ball trick; this little filly pays off like a slot machine!
D
How about a 12 inch cash penis that ejaculates chocolate???
I don't want to watch Marten roast someone because I wanna see the fallout. I don't want to see him get violent and screaming and throwing shit around the room. I don't want to see him have a fit.
She's the Tasha Yar of the QC Universe, she ain't comin' back.
3) A series of Memento style comics starting at the end where they try to piece together just what Marten did
If Marten does snap I have hopes of one of the following happening *snip* I want it to involve duct tape and a midgetThrow in Tai with the duct tape and the midget and I'm with you, man. Yes, I like her better after the Marigold thing, but not that much better. I could stand to see Marten put the naked fear of …something in her. Just because.
Reading today's strip, I had this strange flash of Patrick Stewart putting on the Worry Hat (http://www.entertonement.com/clips/jgkbnwjhyd--EngageStar-Trek-Patrick-Stewart-Captain-Picard-geek-)...Oh dear god. That is indeed a strange flash. And yet…I can see it. Not as Picard, though, but as Xavier.
I think it was Freud who defined depression as "anger without enthusiasm".
The only time I can remember Marten being enthusiastic is when he bought a guitar.
It would be consistent with all we've seen before if he had a "friggin' women" vent with someone.
Freud also talked about babies and little kids having larges amounts of sexual thoughts and tendencies. There's a reason most of his stuff was discredited.
Ummm....
No.
Just no.
Sara hasn't been in the comic in over 1500 strips, or six years of real life time. She hasn't been seen since CoD dropped the apron requirement for the barristas
I doubt Jeph would even know how to draw her in the current style, nor would we recognize her if he did. He may as well create a completely new character.
She's the Tasha Yar of the QC Universe, she ain't comin' back.
Ten million YouTube views, minimum
The Legend lives on from the Chippewa on down,Proof ?
Of the big lake they call Gitchee-Gumi.
The Lake it is said never gives up her dead
When the skies of November turn Gloomy!
Faye:QuoteTen million YouTube views, minimum
...and 60 pages on the WCDT!
Can anyone identify the cameo figures?He made some reference in the justin.tv livechat to looking something up on Facebook, so presumably they're friends of his.
Personally, I wouldn't mind seeing Marten's old girlfriend return (and with her, you can't use the excuse that Jeph doesn't know how to draw her in his current style, since he did for the book! Mwaha!).
This is a girl for whom Marten MOVED ACROSS THE COUNTRY. He wouldn't f'n move to a different apartment for Dora. This is a side of him we haven't seen, a part of his life we've hardly heard about. Much more potential than bringing back a random girl for Marten to hook up with.
Well, that's about it for me. It was a good 1600 strips, and about 600 or so really awesome strips, but there's nothing for me here now. I don't watch soap operas anyway, so it's about time. After preparing myself for a couple weeks I don't even feel so bad about kicking the habit. These aren't the characters I used to like anyway. They just have a passing resemblance.
Thanks for the meories. Thanks for the good times. Questionable Content, I'm breaking up with you. You changed, and we want different things.
Well, that's about it for me. It was a good 1600 strips, and about 600 or so really awesome strips, but there's nothing for me here now. I don't watch soap operas anyway, so it's about time. After preparing myself for a couple weeks I don't even feel so bad about kicking the habit. These aren't the characters I used to like anyway. They just have a passing resemblance.
Thanks for the meories. Thanks for the good times. Questionable Content, I'm breaking up with you. You changed, and we want different things.
Well, that's about it for me. It was a good 1600 strips, and about 600 or so really awesome strips, but there's nothing for me here now. I don't watch soap operas anyway, so it's about time. After preparing myself for a couple weeks I don't even feel so bad about kicking the habit. These aren't the characters I used to like anyway. They just have a passing resemblance.Whatever shall we do?
Thanks for the meories. Thanks for the good times. Questionable Content, I'm breaking up with you. You changed, and we want different things.
Anyway, I had a feeling that would be Angus' response to this dilemma - "but you don't have feelings for him, right?" It's really only natural that he'd say that; I probably would too. But I really hope Angus doesn't turn into Dora II; letting jealousy wreck something great. No matter how hilariously tragic the S.S. Fangus Paddlesteamer disaster would be, I don't want to see it!!
Please, let the door hit you on the way out.At what point did I inadvertently shit in your cereal? I don't expect anyone to give a damn about my personal choice, but this is just a tad more hostile than I'd expect.
Whatever shall we do?Keep on reading a comic that you still enjoy? I dunno, maybe I'm drawing a faulty conclusion.... I'm not enjoying it anymore, haven't really been for a while. I dare say I'll get by without it. Just posting here because... well, why not?
:cry:
Anyway, I had a feeling that would be Angus' response to this dilemma - "but you don't have feelings for him, right?" It's really only natural that he'd say that; I probably would too. But I really hope Angus doesn't turn into Dora II; letting jealousy wreck something great. No matter how hilariously tragic the S.S. Fangus Paddlesteamer disaster would be, I don't want to see it!!
I don't think Angus is really all that bothered by it.
He has just the right mixture of confidence and lack of self-awareness to be able to negotiate those kinds of treacherous waters.
HERP HERP I DON'T LIKE THE COMIC ANYMORE THE WHOLE WORLD HAS TO KNOW HERP DERPWhat I posted isn't comic discussion. Clearly.
Just stop reading if you don't like it anymore. :psyduck:
SCNR? :?Sorry, Could Not Resist.
See the background in panels 4 and 5? isn't a recurrent place jeph likes to use? i think i remember that's were marten's dad had propoused to his boyfriend, but i really can't find the comic....
Relationships with nautical metaphors! It's like he's trying to set up the eventual sex scene set to The Decemberists.
Faye should have said "Sven and I were a speedboat that caught fire and exploded." That's the correct grammar, right?I spoted that too, but isn't she refering to the boat? Is it wrong like that?
I was trying not to point out her grammatical error earlier but it's been driving me crazy. English major and all that. Sorry!
Course, this is Faye we're talking about. Those aggressive tendencies need to be channeled somewhere...Oh god, i won't we surprised if Angus gets a lot of broken bones after they get it on!
Or more likely Tai will make some off the cuff statement or a clumsy pass at Dora in front of Marten
I really don't think something like that will happen, although i'd certanly think like that if i haven't read this: http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=1792
She is fond to joke around, but she is really mature, more than she seems to be.
Relationships with nautical metaphors! It's like he's trying to set up the eventual sex scene set to The Decemberists.
Wait - Mariner's revenge? Good tune, and an accelerating beat, with a climactic whale attack, but those lyrics...
Find him,
bind him,
tie him to a pole
and smash his fingers
to splinters
drag him to a hole
until he wakes up,
screaming,
clawing at the ceiling of his grave!
That's serious hate-fuck music, right there.
Course, this is Faye we're talking about. Those aggressive tendencies need to be channeled somewhere...
I like that Jeph has systematically difused all the people who were freaking out, "FAYE IS GONNA DUMP ANGUS AND SLEEP WITH MARTEN" and "OMG HANNERS AND MARTEN 4EVA".
That grammer issue is bothering me though. Was a speedboat? Were a speedboat? Why don't I know which way is correct? I don't care if Jeph made an error or not so much as I want to know for my own personal edification how the sentence "should" be structured. Are there any english majors here that clarify?
*edited to correct my atrocious spelling of the word difused. Now I'm wondering if I spelled atrocious right. Damn it!
Considering that a lot of their music has to do with sea shanty type stuff, it doesn't have to be Mariner's Revenge. They've got others.
Or maybe the Rogue's Gallery compilation.
I'd like to add that the general abrasiveness of your previous posts really set the tone.Abrasiveness is what it's called when you don't agree with someone. As for why I announced my departure... well honestly I wanted to voice my displeasure with the direction of the comic. I've done so previously, and today's comic could be taken almost as an answer to all the questions I've posed. I don't imagine it was intended as such, since I am no egotist. I just recognise an authorial statement of intent when I see one.
For what it's worth, Soluzar: Sorry to hear that QC has lost a fan in you. If it's no longer to your taste, that's fine. As stories change, people lose interest. Speaking for myself, you're one of the folks who I enjoyed a bit of discussion with when we disagreed, and although we didn't see eye-to-eye on some topics, I do wish you well if you're leaving. In the words of Master Alchemist Lysander, "I'm sorry things didn't turn out as you had hoped. Go, and remember us fondly. You know, you bothered me far less than most." ;)I would expect such conduct from the proud wielder of the original dickbroom, sir. It was an honour to disagree with such as you, and I genuinely can't understand why others have such an odd response to me. I made my initial post in this thread not in the mistaken belief that my disinterest in future QC is a matter of importance to others, but simply becuase I wonder if anyone else shares my views, even to a limited extent. I assumed it would be obvious why the current comic prompted me to write what I did, and honestly I find it slighly shocking that I'm apparently the only one who still thinks that when the comic was at its best when it was about Marten and Faye.
That grammer issue is bothering me though. Was a speedboat? Were a speedboat?
my atrocious spelling of the word difused.
That grammer issue is bothering me though. Was a speedboat? Were a speedboat?
Was is correct; the antecedent is not each of Sven and Faye (which would require were ), but the (singular) combination of the two of them. Of course, the next bit should then be "You and me is " to match. On the whole I would argue that the variation between the two forms is acceptable as Fowler's "elegant variation", and the whole is idiomatically fine.Quotemy atrocious spelling of the word difused.
Defused (removed the fuse); diffuse (vague, fuzzy).
I'd like to add that the general abrasiveness of your previous posts really set the tone.Abrasiveness is what it's called when you don't agree with someone. As for why I announced my departure... well honestly I wanted to voice my displeasure with the direction of the comic. I've done so previously, and today's comic could be taken almost as an answer to all the questions I've posed. I don't imagine it was intended as such, since I am no egotist. I just recognise an authorial statement of intent when I see one.For what it's worth, Soluzar: Sorry to hear that QC has lost a fan in you. If it's no longer to your taste, that's fine. As stories change, people lose interest. Speaking for myself, you're one of the folks who I enjoyed a bit of discussion with when we disagreed, and although we didn't see eye-to-eye on some topics, I do wish you well if you're leaving. In the words of Master Alchemist Lysander, "I'm sorry things didn't turn out as you had hoped. Go, and remember us fondly. You know, you bothered me far less than most." ;)I would expect such conduct from the proud wielder of the original dickbroom, sir. It was an honour to disagree with such as you, and I genuinely can't understand why others have such an odd response to me. I made my initial post in this thread not in the mistaken belief that my disinterest in future QC is a matter of importance to others, but simply becuase I wonder if anyone else shares my views, even to a limited extent. I assumed it would be obvious why the current comic prompted me to write what I did, and honestly I find it slighly shocking that I'm apparently the only one who still thinks that when the comic was at its best when it was about Marten and Faye.
If Marigold manages to end up in a (preferably loving, but...) relationship with someone, that is pretty much the only foreseeable future development I could regret missing out on. I can take or leave the other plotlines which are either ongoing or in prospect. Hannelore is of course always adorable, but she reached her pinnacle of loveliness in the recent story arc and I'm leaving her personal story behind on a relative high.
For those who find posts undesirable, I give you my word that you will find them in no future topics, although I reserve the right to reply in this one as I please.
Considering that a lot of their music has to do with sea shanty type stuff, it doesn't have to be Mariner's Revenge. They've got others.
Or maybe the Rogue's Gallery compilation.
If your significant other ever puts on Mariner's Revenge as a prelude to being intimate, that is probably a Bad Sign.
I would hope Faye went for "Yankee Bayonet" just for the humor value. Angus'd appreciate it, I'm sure.
( :psyduck: now I've gone and done it. please, please, please no innuendo about 'Yankee bayonets hur hur' I still feel bad for being the originator of That )
That grammer issue is bothering me though. Was a speedboat? Were a speedboat?
Was is correct; the antecedent is not each of Sven and Faye (which would require were ), but the (singular) combination of the two of them. Of course, the next bit should then be "You and me is " to match. On the whole I would argue that the variation between the two forms is acceptable as Fowler's "elegant variation", and the whole is idiomatically fine.Quotemy atrocious spelling of the word difused.
Defused (removed the fuse); diffuse (vague, fuzzy).
Considering that a lot of their music has to do with sea shanty type stuff, it doesn't have to be Mariner's Revenge. They've got others.
Or maybe the Rogue's Gallery compilation.
If your significant other ever puts on Mariner's Revenge as a prelude to being intimate, that is probably a Bad Sign.
I would hope Faye went for "Yankee Bayonet" just for the humor value. Angus'd appreciate it, I'm sure.
( :psyduck: now I've gone and done it. please, please, please no innuendo about 'Yankee bayonets hur hur' I still feel bad for being the originator of That )
OK, I need to hear more of their stuff. The CD my daughter compiled for me is woefully lacking...
What was that line Penny said about her former college roommates?http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=1037
HERP HERP I DON'T LIKE THE COMIC ANYMORE THE WHOLE WORLD HAS TO KNOW HERP DERPWhat I posted isn't comic discussion. Clearly.
Just stop reading if you don't like it anymore. :psyduck:
ITT: People too thin-skinned to hear a negative view on their favourite webcomic.
Really? But that sounds terrible! I mean it doesn't sound like it's proper English
[The combination of] Sven and me was a speedboat...
You and I are [the constituent parts of] a paddle steamer...
Faye should have said "Sven and I were a speedboat that caught fire and exploded." That's the correct grammar, right?
I was trying not to point out her grammatical error earlier but it's been driving me crazy. English major and all that. Sorry!
As someone who was born and spent the first 14 years of my life in Georgia and then moved to the Godless North, (Ohio in my case) I can attest that Faye's grammatical structure in today's comic, while in no way, shape or for form grammatically correct, (at least to a prescriptivist) is completely natural given Faye's linguistic history.
As a matter of fact, until I read this:Faye should have said "Sven and I were a speedboat that caught fire and exploded." That's the correct grammar, right?
I was trying not to point out her grammatical error earlier but it's been driving me crazy. English major and all that. Sorry!
I didn't notice anything unusual or out of the ordinary about Faye's sentence, and I'm willing to bet even iduguphergrave knew exactly what she was talking about, but because of decades of prescriptivist brainwashing, has been obsessing about her so-called 'error' for hours.
The problem isn't "Why can't the English* teach their children how to speak?" It's "Why can't the English teachers* of the Wolrd let the children speak their own languange?"
*by which I mean the entire Anglophone world.
Also, try imagining the implied extra words:Quote[The combination of] Sven and me was a speedboat...
You and I are [the constituent parts of] a paddle steamer...
If you are to have "were" in the first, you need to have "I" as well; reading the "me" makes my mind parse it as I suggest, making the "was" correct.
As a matter of fact, until I read this:Faye should have said "Sven and I were a speedboat that caught fire and exploded." That's the correct grammar, right?
I was trying not to point out her grammatical error earlier but it's been driving me crazy. English major and all that. Sorry!
I didn't notice anything unusual or out of the ordinary about Faye's sentence, and I'm willing to bet even iduguphergrave knew exactly what she was talking about, but because of decades of prescriptivist brainwashing, has been obsessing about her so-called 'error' for hours.
not the Queen's English, fucking thank you
For comic #1807...
3. Makes me more than a little sad to hear Faye's metaphor-description of her and Marten's stillborn romance :-( , considering how much it has been a defining part, and seed-of-growth, for her character and development.
Makes me more than a little sad to hear Faye's metaphor-description of her and Marten's stillborn romance :-( , considering how much it has been a defining part, and seed-of-growth, for her character and development.That's as may be, but it's the cold truth. I don't think it was so much that Faye really wanted a romance with Marten as she wanted the option of having one. That is what's driven her growth—she realized she didn't have it. If you go back and read through, it becomes pretty clear that's what was really the problem. I truly wonder if Faye and Marten would have lasted as lovers for as long as Marten and Dora did if they'd started at, say, The Talk.
I just know an 1.5 hour class on it wouldn't be able to hold my 2nd-grade attention span.Then you would love my daughter's Tuesday class: " Pedagogical English Grammer", three hours of how to teach it.
You know, at some point, I think I started posting to the wrong thread. Anyway, hit it, Celine!
Near, far, wherever you are
I believe that the heart does go on
Once more you open the door
And you're here in my heart
And my heart will go on and on
not the Queen's English, fucking thank you
You're welcome :wink:
In the case under discussion, I see no difference anyway.
Of course I knew what Faye was talking about; she still got her point across just fine, but your only half-right about the brainwashing part. Another reason I was obsessing over it because I'm just a liiiiittle OCD about certain things and that set it off. Like I said, I wasn't even sure if it was or wasn't grammatically correct, it just didn't sound right to me. So really it's my own problem; if I see something like that, until I give voice to it, it'll really bug me. For another example, I also feel an incessant need to correct Dr. ROFLPWN's signature, because Hannelore's actual line is "My name is DJ Phalliz," not MC. But I know if I just came right out and did that, I'd look like a total dick, so I'd have to find a more subtle way of correcting him without looking like a nit-picky pedant.
:-D
Hey look, a sensible conversation between Faye and Angus about Marten and Dora's breakup that leads into silly relationship metaphors! If they are best represented by a paddle steamer near Niagara Falls, that fits with the awkwardness-defusing garb at the Horrible Revelation. (I don't know if we're ever going to see the cast in Victorian dress again, but I would dearly love to see the entire cast, including Dale, in a Merry Christmas from the Horrible Revelation poster.)
Also, doesn't Jeph hate the Decemberists? Or am I mixing them up with another band?
Great scott Carl-E! that thing you do with words and respect with humility and askdljasjedhladewaeskldm_ :psyduck:
I mean... it may sound really silly, but geez you really are a nice guy!!! How the hell can you acomplish being so nice!??! :psyduck:
EDIT:
*NOT sarcasm!!*
Considering that a lot of their music has to do with sea shanty type stuff, it doesn't have to be Mariner's Revenge. They've got others.
Or maybe the Rogue's Gallery compilation.
If your significant other ever puts on Mariner's Revenge as a prelude to being intimate, that is probably a Bad Sign.
I would hope Faye went for "Yankee Bayonet" just for the humor value. Angus'd appreciate it, I'm sure.
( :psyduck: now I've gone and done it. please, please, please no innuendo about 'Yankee bayonets hur hur' I still feel bad for being the originator of That )
OK, I need to hear more of their stuff. The CD my daughter compiled for me is woefully lacking...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vvGwY4tEJQM <-- "Yankee Bayonet (I Will Be Home Then)".
I can totally see Faye and Angus singing this, or it being the anthem of their FIRST NIGHT OMGOMGOMGBBQ, or whatever. It's also just a lovely Goddamn song in general. Ask your daughter to lend you "The Crane Wife". Good album.
As someone who was born and spent the first 14 years of my life in Georgia and then moved to the Godless North, (OHIO IN MY CASE)...
<snip>
Translation: He's not a nice guy*. He just plays one on teh forums.Great scott Carl-E! that thing you do with words and respect with humility and askdljasjedhladewaeskldm_ :psyduck:
I mean... it may sound really silly, but geez you really are a nice guy!!! How the hell can you acomplish being so nice!??! :psyduck:
EDIT:
*NOT sarcasm!!*
Well, thanks. However, I could introduce you to a few individuals who would disagree with you. Whole classrooms full, in fact.
Not to mention the ones I live with...
It's nice to be able to present a fresh face.
“The evil that men do lives after them; the good is oft interred with their bones.” --Marc Antony, in Shakespeare's Julius Caesar
...in a display of complete linguistic pedantry on my part, this also sparked me to wonder whether "Me and Sven was" would not also be Faye's general use of the form, due to her Southern origins and the fact that she does seem to have Southern American English dialect artifacts from time to time. Not as often as one'd think, but...
...of course then I remember that I am analyzing the linguistics of a comic character :mrgreen:
That grammer issue is bothering me though. Was a speedboat? Were a speedboat?
Was is correct; the antecedent is not each of Sven and Faye (which would require were ), but the (singular) combination of the two of them. Of course, the next bit should then be "You and me is " to match. On the whole I would argue that the variation between the two forms is acceptable as Fowler's "elegant variation", and the whole is idiomatically fine.
Was is correct; the antecedent is not each of Sven and Faye (which would require were ), but the (singular) combination of the two of them. Of course, the next bit should then be "You and me is " to match. On the whole I would argue that the variation between the two forms is acceptable as Fowler's "elegant variation", and the whole is idiomatically fine.
Would anyone really say "Jack and Jill was a cute couple", treating Jack and Jill as a singular combination?
Translation: He's not a nice guy*. He just plays one on teh forums.Great scott Carl-E! that thing you do with words and respect with humility and askdljasjedhladewaeskldm_ :psyduck:
I mean... it may sound really silly, but geez you really are a nice guy!!! How the hell can you acomplish being so nice!??! :psyduck:
EDIT:
*NOT sarcasm!!*
Well, thanks. However, I could introduce you to a few individuals who would disagree with you. Whole classrooms full, in fact.
Not to mention the ones I live with...
It's nice to be able to present a fresh face.
“The evil that men do lives after them; the good is oft interred with their bones.” --Marc Antony, in Shakespeare's Julius Caesar
*For crissakes, he teaches math! Never met a math teacher who wasn't a sadist that would make the Marquis himself hide under the bed.
As a kid I was taught that is was always "John and I" no matter what
Why is it different? :?
try imagining the implied extra words:Quote[The combination of] Sven and me was a speedboat...
You and I are [the constituent parts of] a paddle steamer...
If you are to have "were" in the first, you need to have "I" as well; reading the "me" makes my mind parse it as I suggest, making the "was" correct.
But "Sven and me" didn't even sound right to me either. In fact I've always been confused on when you say "John and I" or "John and Me" or "Me and John." As a kid I was taught that is was always "John and I" no matter what but I've heard different since then. Anyway wouldn't it be "Sven and I?" After all later in the same speech bubble she says "You and I." Why is it different? :?You use "I" or "me" the same as if the other person weren't in the sentence.
But "Sven and me" didn't even sound right to me either. In fact I've always been confused on when you say "John and I" or "John and Me" or "Me and John." As a kid I was taught that is was always "John and I" no matter what but I've heard different since then. Anyway wouldn't it be "Sven and I?" After all later in the same speech bubble she says "You and I." Why is it different? :?You use "I" or "me" the same as if the other person weren't in the sentence.
I'm claiming Hodgson's Law RIGHT NOW.
hehe I know, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to create a monster :angel: Luckily I doubt this can snowball into 30+ pages of arguing about grammar
Considering that a lot of their music has to do with sea shanty type stuff, it doesn't have to be Mariner's Revenge. They've got others.
Or maybe the Rogue's Gallery compilation.
If your significant other ever puts on Mariner's Revenge as a prelude to being intimate, that is probably a Bad Sign.
I would hope Faye went for "Yankee Bayonet" just for the humor value. Angus'd appreciate it, I'm sure.
( :psyduck: now I've gone and done it. please, please, please no innuendo about 'Yankee bayonets hur hur' I still feel bad for being the originator of That )
OK, I need to hear more of their stuff. The CD my daughter compiled for me is woefully lacking...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vvGwY4tEJQM <-- "Yankee Bayonet (I Will Be Home Then)".
I can totally see Faye and Angus singing this, or it being the anthem of their FIRST NIGHT OMGOMGOMGBBQ, or whatever. It's also just a lovely Goddamn song in general. Ask your daughter to lend you "The Crane Wife". Good album.
Damn, now you've got me going.
But I think We both go down together (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ExTsO_q19II&feature=related) may be more appropriate?
As for an "our song", I'm afraid they already have one (http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=1735).
Considering that a lot of their music has to do with sea shanty type stuff, it doesn't have to be Mariner's Revenge. They've got others.
Or maybe the Rogue's Gallery compilation.
If your significant other ever puts on Mariner's Revenge as a prelude to being intimate, that is probably a Bad Sign.
I would hope Faye went for "Yankee Bayonet" just for the humor value. Angus'd appreciate it, I'm sure.
( :psyduck: now I've gone and done it. please, please, please no innuendo about 'Yankee bayonets hur hur' I still feel bad for being the originator of That )
OK, I need to hear more of their stuff. The CD my daughter compiled for me is woefully lacking...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vvGwY4tEJQM <-- "Yankee Bayonet (I Will Be Home Then)".
I can totally see Faye and Angus singing this, or it being the anthem of their FIRST NIGHT OMGOMGOMGBBQ, or whatever. It's also just a lovely Goddamn song in general. Ask your daughter to lend you "The Crane Wife". Good album.
Damn, now you've got me going.
But I think We both go down together (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ExTsO_q19II&feature=related) may be more appropriate?
As for an "our song", I'm afraid they already have one (http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=1735).
No; you use either "I" or "me" based upon which you would use without the other person.But "Sven and me" didn't even sound right to me either. In fact I've always been confused on when you say "John and I" or "John and Me" or "Me and John." As a kid I was taught that is was always "John and I" no matter what but I've heard different since then. Anyway wouldn't it be "Sven and I?" After all later in the same speech bubble she says "You and I." Why is it different? :?You use "I" or "me" the same as if the other person weren't in the sentence.
So "I" and "me" are interchangeable?
EDIT: HEARTILY AGREEING WITH SHARP'S ASSESSMENT ABOVE
OMG, we're still arguing about Faye's Grammar!?!?!?! :-o :? :roll:
There are three 'rules' she's breaking in that sentence, I'll list them:
1: Always list "I" or "me" last in a pair or list. "Sven and me" rather than "Me and Sven"
2: Choose "I" or "Me" in a list or pair as if it were not in a list or pair. "I was a speedboat" rather than "Me was a speedboat;" therefore "Sven and I was a speedboat" rather than "Sven and me was a speedboat"
3: Conjugate the verb acting on a list or pair as if it were plural, i. e. substitute the collective pronoun and then conjugate. "We were a speedboat" rather than "We was a speedboat;" therefore "Sven and I were a speedboat" rather than "Sven and I was a speedboat"
**BUT**
You'll notice that above I put " 'rules' " in scare quotes. The reason I did this, and what prescriptivist teachers forget, is that they are not rules, but merely recommendations.
Grammar is not physics, nor is it mathematics.
There is no such thing as "correct" grammar.
There is standard grammar, formal grammar, or recommended grammar, but it is important to remember that these standards are entirely arbitrary.
The only thing that makes one form more correct than another is that someone somewhere wrote it down in a book that that was "the rule."
In Physics, E=mc2 because E=mc2. Einstein didn't decide that, he derived it, and it's the same whether you're in England, Wales, New England or New South Wales. That's not what happens with grammar. "The rule" in grammar is made up, and it may be different depending on where you live and what standard you use.
This is why we've been going 'round and 'round about this. There is no right answer, just different standards.
Likely, she uses a variant of Southern American English, where the rules are completely different and her wording is totally correct.I just spoke to my daughter the linguist about this, and here is the deal according to her:
Likely, she uses a variant of Southern American English, where the rules are completely different and her wording is totally correct.I just spoke to my daughter the linguist about this, and here is the deal according to her:
A compound subject ("Sven and me") would take a plural verb ("were"), but in some dialects (American Southern!) there is something called "was-leveling". You've all heard it, it's when all tenses of a verb become the same as the third-person singular. "Officer, we was just headin' down to the general store."
I am now done boring you all with grammar. Seriously, two pages worth? What next? Can we, shall we, might we, talk about modal auxiliaries? They use double modals in Kentucky. "You might should go to the doctor."
But would the wreck of the Faye Whittaker get a song written about it?
Likely, she uses a variant of Southern American English, where the rules are completely different and her wording is totally correct.I just spoke to my daughter the linguist about this, and here is the deal according to her:
A compound subject ("Sven and me") would take a plural verb ("were"), but in some dialects (American Southern!) there is something called "was-leveling". You've all heard it, it's when all tenses of a verb become the same as the third-person singular. "Officer, we was just headin' down to the general store."
I am now done boring you all with grammar. Seriously, two pages worth? What next? Can we, shall we, might we, talk about modal auxiliaries? They use double modals in Kentucky. "You might should go to the doctor."
EDIT: HEARTILY AGREEING WITH SHARP'S ASSESSMENT ABOVE
(http://i658.photobucket.com/albums/uu307/SharpArcher01/brograbs.jpg)
Nice that Faye could make the room darken, but the light from her eyes wasn't all that bright. Maybe Cosette could give her Death Stare lessons. (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=1547) :) But, there's potential there. :D
Likely, she uses a variant of Southern American English, where the rules are completely different and her wording is totally correct.I just spoke to my daughter the linguist about this, and here is the deal according to her:
A compound subject ("Sven and me") would take a plural verb ("were"), but in some dialects (American Southern!) there is something called "was-leveling". You've all heard it, it's when all tenses of a verb become the same as the third-person singular. "Officer, we was just headin' down to the general store."
I am now done boring you all with grammar. Seriously, two pages worth? What next? Can we, shall we, might we, talk about modal auxiliaries? They use double modals in Kentucky. "You might should go to the doctor."
As the holder of a linguistics degree m'self (only bachelor's though) I am completely totally all about modal auxiliaries, hell yyyyyeeeeesssssEDIT: HEARTILY AGREEING WITH SHARP'S ASSESSMENT ABOVE
(http://i658.photobucket.com/albums/uu307/SharpArcher01/brograbs.jpg)
Much bro grabs are returned sir and also fuck yeah Professor Brothers
If I was not on my iPhone like a tool I would post glorious Washington, destroyer of enemies
oh god, i just read through this entire thread, and it was interesting untill faye's grammar got brought up. IT'S JUST A DAMN COMIC THERE IS NO NEED FOR 20+ POSTS ARGUING OVER 1 SENTENCE A MADE UP CHARACTER SAID. that said i'm eagerly awaiting tonights comic
"Dora Bianchi!! Do not mistake me for some cheap conjuror of tricks! I'm trying not to hurt you, I'm trying to get you help."
LOTR: the fellowship of the ring"Dora Bianchi!! Do not mistake me for some cheap conjuror of tricks! I'm trying not to hurt you, I'm trying to get you help."
I'm gonna kick myself for not recognizing where that's from...
The only problem with this approach is if Dora arrives at therapist's office, then starts in with "I don't know why I'm here really…I don't need help…"
Reading over that, though, I gotta admit that anyone who's any good at all will very likely get his/her net out at that point. Nor will the purple hair help anything, since it doesn't exactly scream "Look! Good decision maker here! Plus, I look in the mirror every damn morning and assure myself that nothing's wrong, even though I clearly have purple hair."
Hell, Dora may get shipped straight to a, ah, holding facility.
Thank you, Dora. Thank you for calling. I'm pretty sure it's in everyone's best interest that I'M A FIRIN' MAH LAZERRR (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSVNbxjdvv8)
...I can't be the only one who thinks that whenever Faye's eyes go red.
...am I?
It would be funny if the therapist began blaming all of Dora's problems on her hair color..
"Insecure? well that's a common trait among those with purple hair, dear."
Faye should have said "Sven and I were a speedboat that caught fire and exploded." That's the correct grammar, right?I feel slightly better than I'm not the only one who noticed that.
I was trying not to point out her grammatical error earlier but it's been driving me crazy. English major and all that. Sorry!
I'm betting on a male who was trained at the Albert Ellis Institute and has five papers on Overcoming Self-Esteem.
The only problem with this approach is if Dora arrives at therapist's office, then starts in with "I don't know why I'm here really…I don't need help…"
That brings up an interesting side-point: What would Dora's middle name be?
Given the (approximate) time frame of the strip and of her parents' state of mind, I'd almost bet on "Summer", "Farrah" or (dread) "Amy".
The only problem with this approach is if Dora arrives at therapist's office, then starts in with "I don't know why I'm here really…I don't need help…"
She wouldn't be the first person to say that upon the start their first therapy session. Even when people schedule it themselves, if they've never done it before they might get nervous at the last second and try to prove to the shrink (and themselves) that they're fine. I'm sure therapists are trained to have appropriate responses to "I don't know why I'm here really" and "I don't need help."
It's either Lynn, Elizabeth or Marie.
I'm betting on Elizabeth.
Dora Safina Bianchi.but then my immediate thought was, "yeah, but it's probably just Marie."
In the spirit of complete speculative bullshit I wonder if her therapy will leave Dora thinking she can salvage the relationship and Marten rounding on her and spittin' venom? Not that I necessarily want to see that, but...'twas something that came to mind.
It's either Lynn, Elizabeth or Marie.
I'm betting on Elizabeth.
That's my point, really. Yes, New whatsis probably abounds with people who're perfectly capable of wearing strangely colored hair with aplomb, but if Dora ever was one of them, I'm willing to bet she isn't now.The only problem with this approach is if Dora arrives at therapist's office, then starts in with "I don't know why I'm here really…I don't need help…"
Reading over that, though, I gotta admit that anyone who's any good at all will very likely get his/her net out at that point. Nor will the purple hair help anything, since it doesn't exactly scream "Look! Good decision maker here! Plus, I look in the mirror every damn morning and assure myself that nothing's wrong, even though I clearly have purple hair."
Hell, Dora may get shipped straight to a, ah, holding facility.
Somehow I doubt that the therapists around Smif are going to see purple hair as an indicator of Dora's insanity. Maybe in a more conservative area...
It would be funny if the therapist began blaming all of Dora's problems on her hair color..
"Insecure? well that's a common trait among those with purple hair, dear."
*For crissakes, he teaches math!
Nah, that wasn't a number two look.maybe it is, maybe not.... maybe both?
Number ONE, however...
I'm sure therapists are trained to have appropriate responses to "I don't know why I'm here really" and "I don't need help."Yeah, that, and often the more a person demands that they don't need therapy, the more they really do.
"IGNORE ME AT YOUR PERIL, DORA BIANCHI."
I realize I might be offending some here, and if that's the case, you're more than free to educate me. But to me, therapy when triggered by something like a breakup or other "common" occurrences is an easy or lazy way out. It's saying, hey, none of us want to help you work through this, go talk about it with someone else.
But to me, therapy when triggered by something like a breakup or other "common" occurrences is an easy or lazy way out. It's saying, hey, none of us want to help you work through this, go talk about it with someone else.
Sure, Dora has "issues." I guess this is my own way of saying, I still don't really buy that line of reasoning, as I don't think we've seen a lot more than Dora's insecurities with Marten, and maybe we'll see more if we go in to therapy with her, and it might be a really good piece of character development on Jeph's part (or maybe she'll just bang her therapist).
I like how in the second-to-last panel Faye's teeth aren't bared, implying that that "rrrrRRR" sound is coming from deep in her throat, which is way scarier. I imagine that sound to be something like a wolverine, or a Tasmanian devil.
By the way, hi. Long-time reader, first-time poster. Sorry to start my Serious Pony career with such a wall of text.
I want to see the Dora backstory: this provides Jeph a way to work it into the comic without being too much like The Talk.
Hey look, a sensible conversation between Faye and Angus about Marten and Dora's breakup that leads into silly relationship metaphors! If they are best represented by a paddle steamer near Niagara Falls, that fits with the awkwardness-defusing garb at the Horrible Revelation. (I don't know if we're ever going to see the cast in Victorian dress again, but I would dearly love to see the entire cast, including Dale, in a Merry Christmas from the Horrible Revelation poster.)
Also, doesn't Jeph hate the Decemberists? Or am I mixing them up with another band?
I hope Jeph doesn't hate the Decemberists? I mean I know they're not the hella cool thing right now in the scene but I like my overly wordy 19th Century sea-shanty-based rockers
Am I wrong in being annoyed with "grammar" misspellings? Did it change since my 4th grade spelling bee?
The was I can forgive, but correcting grammar with spelling errors seems contradictory.
So what if Sven's Look Of Ultimate Seduction (http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=1078) hits her Death Stare?i don't think they would cancel out completley, but the resulting shockwave would probably cause damage on a massive scale to the surrounding area
TLDid read, but I'm not going to reproduce it. I agree though, that Dora has to talk to someone completely univolved if she'd going to have a prayer of digging her way out of this. I do hope she doesn't start suspecting therapists, though, since that really could end with her being put away (not in and of itself, but because of the possible snowball).
I want to see the Dora backstory: this provides Jeph a way to work it into the comic without being too much like The Talk.The thing with that is that I'm now wondering if we need to see two or three versions of it, or more, to get it. One from Dora, who's clearly an unreliable narrator; one from Sven, who's a liar; one from the 'rents, who either are or at least seem to be oblivious; and one from duh da DAAAA!
So you'll have us engineers to watch out for!
What if you grew up with someone who got his undergrad and physics and post-grad in engineering?Does this mean we have to start a grammar-related pun thread? To avoid pissing off everyone around us? Oh wait! Engineers don't care! :-D
Pfft, y'all would probably just try to kill each other with grammar-related puns.
Oh wait! Engineers don't care! :-D
The only times we've seen Sven openly lie were when he wanted to avoid Death By Ex-Girlfriend (http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=676#) at the horrible revelation; when he wanted to avoid temptation with his bendy blonde friend (http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=795) after lunch with Faye; and when he contemplated lying about sleeping with Gina Riversmith (http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=1338), but ultimately told the truth (http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=1341).Only. Heh. So because he only lies some of the time, Sven's not a liar? You don't think, if telling the tale of Dora and his childhood and including the role he played, he wouldn't shade the truth to favor himself or at least to let himself off easy?
That being said, he would give a very... slanted perspective on Dora's issues. And given that Dora's issues involve trouble in past relationships, she might feel extremely awkward opening up to her brother about it. A neutral ear is best, and the obvious choice for that is a therapist who can then offer professional advice on how she can overcome the issues, rather than just an awkward pat on the shoulder.
Only. Heh. So because he only lies some of the time, Sven's not a liar? You don't think, if telling the tale of Dora and his childhood and including the role he played, he wouldn't shade the truth to favor himself or at least to let himself off easy?
Because I think he would. Epiphany or not, Sven's not exactly hard on himself most of the time. That may change, may have changed, and hell, Sven may have all sorts of good reasons for acting the way he does. But so far, he's been a self-serving putz much more than he's been a paragon of truth.
Only. Heh. So because he only lies some of the time, Sven's not a liar? You don't think, if telling the tale of Dora and his childhood and including the role he played, he wouldn't shade the truth to favor himself or at least to let himself off easy?
Because I think he would. Epiphany or not, Sven's not exactly hard on himself most of the time. That may change, may have changed, and hell, Sven may have all sorts of good reasons for acting the way he does. But so far, he's been a self-serving putz much more than he's been a paragon of truth.
That has changed, as evidenced here (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=1747) and here. (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=1782) Nobody said he was a paragon of truth, but, especially recently, he's really realizing what a douche he's been. Not to mention if he really did trend towards trying to make himself not look like the bad guy, he wouldn't have been so apologetic in this strip (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=1481) (despite the fact that he didn't actually apologize, which I'm aware of). Sven's made mistakes, and he's quickly realizing that fact, and it's already changed him.
I think he's just oblivious to the fact that his actions growing up had a negative effect on Dora. It's not that he's in denial there; it probably hasn't even occurred to him. If Dora were to confront him about it at some point, I think he'd be surprised, and might deny it at first, but after thinking about it for a bit, realize she's got a point.
You should give Sven a little more credit; it takes awhile for someone to change for the better (see how long its taken Faye?), but he IS making progress.
Wait, he's clearly told Tai, and her reaction is...
"...poor emo Marten..."
Gah. Her stock just dropped by several points in my portfolio.
"But it was FREE..."
Now she gets her revenge for "happy batter."
Ahh, the perils of NOT banging the Coffee Shop owner. :-D
But seriously, Marten is going to have to face Dora again at some stage, I think it would be best if it happens sooner than later. The longer he leaves it, the more difficult and awkward is't going to be when it happens.
After all, they were friends before they were partners, and it's only going to make things more difficult since they both move in the same circles.
Don't think either of them is gonna be ready for that for a good long time I think. Sure exes can become friends again, but it usually takes awhile for any lingering bad feelings over the breakup to fade first, which usually means them not seeing each other for a time. Sucks that they aren't going to be able to just "hang out" for awhile, but that tends to be the nature of all but the friendliest breakups, and Marten and Dora's breakup may have been mutual (more on Dora's part than Marten's I suspect) but it was NOT friendly. Sure there have been uglier breakups, but there have been nicer ones too.
"But it was FREE..."No Grasshopper, the coffee and baked goods were not free. They were actually very expensive; you just did not pay for them with money. This is so of all the "best things in life" that the song mendaciously claims are free.
I loved Tai in this, even more than red-glowing-eyed Faye in yesterday's comic.
We didn't see her initial reaction to the breakup news (which disappoints me a little).
Heck, y'wanna see Marten being equally harsh to Tai on the subject of relationships? Try this (http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=727). Or this (http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=728). Or this (http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=765). Or hey, how about this (http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=815).
Heck, y'wanna see Marten being equally harsh to Tai on the subject of relationships? Try this (http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=727). Or this (http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=728). Or this (http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=765). Or hey, how about this (http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=815).
The awkward, it, well it doesn't exactly burn but it's definitely uncomfortable.Awkward could be used as a substantial adjective. I think it'd still be correct.
And I just used awkward as a noun!
:evil: Suck it, grammar Nazis! :evil:
The fact is, Dora is Faye's boss and friend. Marten is Faye's roommate and, right now, and honestly for quite a long time, closest friend. Marten and Dora can't keep apart forever, any more than they could back at comic 75-100.
As far as Marten being friends with Dora again goes, let's not forget his previous ex who he moved across the country to be with. When she showed up in the coffee shop, Marten didn't even want to talk to her. Far as I could tell from Marten's description, that breakup wasn't particularly nasty either, but Marten wanted nothing to do with the girl when he had the chance to talk to her.
I love this comic, I really do...but the vast majority of the dramatic resolution to these latest developments is happening off-panel, and we're not getting much in the way of actual details. The other characters have been informed, and we're just supposed to accept that and move on.
This is somewhat disappointing,as there was a lot of potential there...Dora/Sven, Marten//Dora, Dora/Faye, Hanners, Marten/Tai. Some of that might still happen, but it won't be the immedeate reaction, it'll be follow-up. Which is fine...but I just feel like a good opportunity for characterization has simply been ignored.
i wnat a degree in squirrel fighting! WHERE CAN I GET ONE?!!
I think there's a good chance that Martin and Dora will rekindle their friendship after they give each other some space to grow and move on.
There's a character who could mentor you in squirrel fighting.
There's a character who could mentor you in squirrel fighting.
(http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e280/Selexor/QC/SquirrelTai.png)
Coincidence? I think not.
He'll need new equipment if he's gonna take on the squirrels. The Worry Hat doesn't add to defense...
I had no idea that Squirrel Girl looked so...nice.Squirrel-girls you say? Grace here (http://www.egscomics.com/sketchbook/?date=2007-11-12) is part-squirrel. Apparently it's a thing now.
I've either just creeped myself out, or I need to get back into comics.
Anyone else irritated by Marten's attitude here?
Well, Marten's skinny as hell, so if it's any consolation I don't think he'd eat much.
Also now I cannot stop thinking about other superheroes the rest of QC would look like (Please nobody be lame enough to make a Pizza Girl joke). Like, Marten? He's totally Dick Grayson. If Raven had dyed the front of her hair white instead of hot pink she could be Rogue... and Dora could be Triplicate Girl with her black hair...
O NO HALP I AM CAUGHT IN ENDLESS NERD-LOOP
She drinks a whiskey drink, she drinks a lager drink... :angel:
That mean we can have Penny as the White Queen?If you can get Pene-lope into the costume, more power to ya.
Ms. Reed is the Baroness from G.I. Joe. I will not accept arguments on this.Yes. Absolutely. I will cut a fool who argues with that.
Ms. Reed is the Baroness from G.I. Joe. I will not accept arguments on this.You shall receive none from me!
Ms. Reed is the Baroness from G.I. Joe. I will not accept arguments on this.
Of course, we do recall that Faye was chucking leftover baked goods at hobos, don't we? If she had them left over anyway, I don't think the muffins Marten scarfed were cutting too much into Dora's bottom line. The lattes, I don't know about, having never had one in my life entire, much less paid for or made one.
As crass as Marten may seem, this is a normal thing to fixate on, and, I suspect, much easier than dealing directly with "I can't go hang out at CoD any more." and, worse, "I'm sleeping alone again tonight." At least it would be for me. Time enough to turn and face the (real) strain later.
Tai curves! Reminded me of this fanart: http://forums.questionablecontent.net/index.php/topic,4954.msg976066.html#msg976066
Ms. Reed is the Baroness from G.I. Joe. I will not accept arguments on this.You shall receive none from me!
But who does that make Destro?
And if Marten's dad is Magneto, that must mean Marten is Quicksilver; he just needs to bleach his hair to activate his powers and become the greatest rock guitarist since Eddie van Halen.
this strip reminds me of when my dog died. after awhile i wasn't thinking about it anymore, but then i dropped some egg salad on the floor and my first instinct was to whistle for him so i wouldn't have to clean it up. and then i remembered he was gone.
shit always comes back to hit you when you're not expecting it.
:cry:
Anyone else irritated by Marten's attitude here? Dude, the coffee/lattes/muffins weren't free, it just wasn't you who paid for them. Pretty sure your ex-girlfriend, the struggling small business owner, had to pay for all those "free" goods you were scarfing. And lunch EVERY DAY? I'd actually be super annoyed if I were in Dora's shoes. Coffee, whatever. Lattes... ennnnh depends how many he's having, those buggers are expensive in part because milk and espresso are expensive. Muffins? For lunch, every day of the week? How many would that be, anyway?When he says "free" he may have just meant that he didn't hand over cash in exchange for baked goods and lattes, but instead (for example) paid a bit more towards rent than did Dora. He could consider that part of his monthly expenses rather than paying for food.
Yeah, I'd have told him to stop mooching, I think.
</taking the comic too seriously>
If Raven is anything, she's Zatanna.I was gonna chew you out for the Steve/Hal Jordan thing, then I remembered the secret agent gig that is either real (and therefore makes him a pretty damn good Lantern candidate) or a hallucination he believed so hard he actually willed Tortura into existence (which makes him a fucking awesome Lantern candidate, since he doesn't even need the ring).
Tai strikes me as a cool Barbara Gordon.
Hanners as Kitty Pryde.
Marten seems like the closest superperson to him would be Spiderman.
If Dora gets better, Sue Storm, if she spirals into self doubt, Catwoman.
Steve seems Hal Jordan-esque.
Faye to me seems more like Tulip O'Hare but she isn't superpowered so what am I gonna doooooooo?
Don't you ever watch when Jeph broadcasts his drawing? Most of the music he listens to nowadays is techno/electronica, along with a healthy amount of death metal and some indie rock.where is this that he broadcasts? i've seen it mentioned but have no idea where it is
I personally think it's pretty awesome...
SQUUEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE :lol: :lol: :lol:
I have been wishing like CRAZY that Jeph would bring Veronica back into the strip!!! Now not only well we get to see her drawn in the newer, sexier style, we'll also get to see her make good on her word on what happens to people who fuck with her son. (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=459)
And just when I hit the reply button to say something like "I think Miss Reed is a bit too mature for that", Carl had to go and beat me to it.
;)
SQUUEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE :lol: :lol: :lol:
I have been wishing like CRAZY that Jeph would bring Veronica back into the strip!!! Now not only well we get to see her drawn in the newer, sexier style, we'll also get to see her make good on her word on what happens to people who fuck with her son. (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=459)
SQUUEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE :lol: :lol: :lol:
I have been wishing like CRAZY that Jeph would bring Veronica back into the strip!!! Now not only well we get to see her drawn in the newer, sexier style, we'll also get to see her make good on her word on what happens to people who fuck with her son. (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=459)
I don't think so - Dora hasn't "fucked with her son" so much as fucked herself out of their relationship. I doubt Ms Reed would get much enjoyment from kicking a wounded animal... nor do I think Marten would let her.
Of course, I could be wrong. Monday's such a LOOOONG way off!
I don't think so - Dora hasn't "fucked with her son" so much as fucked herself out of their relationship. I doubt Ms Reed would get much enjoyment from kicking a wounded animal... nor do I think Marten would let her.
Of course, I could be wrong. Monday's such a LOOOONG way off!
I don't think Dora is doomed. I think that Marten is doomed. :psyduck:
So hey guys how about that comic yesterday with the sq--
*sees today's comic*
.......
*lip twitch*
BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAHAAHAHAHAaaaaaa oh Dora you are FUCKED
I don't think Dora is doomed. I think that Marten is doomed. :psyduck:
I'm not intrigued, but I am perplexed. Why is Marten doomed? Unless you think he's going to try to 'save' Dora from his mother. As I said, I really don't think there's much threat there.I don't think Dora is doomed. I think that Marten is doomed. :psyduck:
Really? Why? I am intrigue at this statement.
Cue the Dora/Veronica shippers in 3...2...OMG
But, for some reason, Dora's earlier revelation that she used to masturbate to pictures of Veronica somehow factors into my predictions for Monday's strip. I don't know how. But I'll let you guys cook that stew.Dora awakens upside down and naked in an X-shaped cross experiencing pain in ways only a professional can deal it? :psyduck:
Dora awakens upside down and naked in an X-shaped cross experiencing pain in ways only a professional can deal it? :psyduck:
THEN THEY ALL FUCKED
Dora awakens upside down and naked in an X-shaped cross experiencing pain in ways only a professional can deal it? :psyduck:
Jeph's not THAT much of a blatantly pandering whore yet.
She drinks a whiskey drink, she drinks a lager drink... :angel:
Cue the Dora/Veronica shippers in 3...2...
:psyduck:
I'm guessing Veronica heads to COD without Marten's knowledge, goes inside...Then Rick Astley (http://xkcd.com/524/) walks in.
...and calmly orders a beverage, and then drinks it in silence, all the while giving Dora the flaming-laser-eye-of-death, and then gets up and leaves without so much as another word.
Cue Dora being all, "WTF?"
Other than that (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=440) time (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=441) they (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=442) had (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=443) lunch (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=445) together (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=446) you mean?I'm guessing Veronica heads to COD without Marten's knowledge, goes inside...Then Rick Astley (http://xkcd.com/524/) walks in.
...and calmly orders a beverage, and then drinks it in silence, all the while giving Dora the flaming-laser-eye-of-death, and then gets up and leaves without so much as another word.
Cue Dora being all, "WTF?"
Here is a question, did Veronica ever actually meet Dora in person, except that one time (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=455)?
Has anyone else thought about what happens when Miss Reed(*) goes through airport security?
(*)The form of address she asked for in 433.
Hmmm... I wonder if Jeph is setting up for 1812 to be accompanied by orchestra and light artillery... :psyduck:
Other than that (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=440) time (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=441) they (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=442) had (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=443) lunch (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=445) together (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=446) you mean?
Also, Miss Reed looks amazing with her hair down (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=448); I hope the new style does her justice.
I don't think Dora is doomed. I think that Marten is doomed. :psyduck:
Really? Why? I am intrigue at this statement.
Second: The goose on the grave saying isn't referring to something walking over your grave after you're dead. Back in the days of yore, people used to believe if you got a sudden chill, it was because someone was walking over the place where your grave was eventually going to be. I think the goose part of it came in because of people calling the bumps you get on your skin from a chill "goosebumps" or "goose pimples."
Indie music and drama no.
Animal fighting yes.
I suspect Ms. Reed Is Coming To Town to talk some stuff out with her son. I hope. Because in all honesty, seeing a grown woman who'd previously seemed insightful and mature go all assault and battery on Dora, who is already hurting pretty terribly, that would pretty much terminate my relationship with this strip. :|
Why on earth would Veronica go whoop-ass on Dora?! It wasn't like Dora cheated on Marten, strung him along, or was abusive--she just couldn't deal with her insecurities about Faye (and gee, I mean, it's not like Marten was living with Faye or had a huge crush on her for any significant amount of time, it's not like everything they did socially as a couple had Faye in the room too, and we certainly saw Marten doing everything he could to make Dora feel like she was his first choice, like how they got their own place together to start fresh, and remember that amazing strip where he finally said "I love you"?.... Oh. Wait.) That's not so much hurting Marten as it is "being the other half of a relationship between two flawed people that ended with both people getting hurt." There's a huge difference.
Veronica's son is the one with his life stalled out on the shoulder. The only major changes in his life since her last visit have been switching from one dead end job to another and his relationship with Dora, which he just sort of fell into, and, then, subsequently fell out of. Dora's insecurities were over the top, but most of them did fall in line with the idea that she couldn't fully trust Faye or Marten. Faye did what she could to get Dora to trust her, and I think it's significant that Dora's first heart-to-heart after the breakup was with her. Marten, on the other hand, never seemed actively invested in their relationship. He'd have fun with Dora when she was in a good mood, and he'd do what he could to placate her when she'd freak out, but my overall impression was that he let Dora take charge of things--and because Dora's never been in a functional relationship, she wasn't going to see that as a problem.
He's drifting along, not committing to anything... not even the things he seemed to enjoy--seriously close to slacker territory. And didn't he end up on the east coast for similar reasons? I suspect Ms. Reed Is Coming To Town to talk some stuff out with her son. I hope. Because in all honesty, seeing a grown woman who'd previously seemed insightful and mature go all assault and battery on Dora, who is already hurting pretty terribly, that would pretty much terminate my relationship with this strip. :|
Do I think that Dora will freak out when she finds out that Mart-e-mom is coming to town?
I do indeed.
Do I think the freak-out will be hilarious?
I do, I really do!
If Ms. Reed tries to intervene I hope Marten will tell her to let it be, like he did with Faye.
Actually, I think Marten's reaction is quite normal - "I'm an adult, I can deal with a break up on my own and don't need you to come rushing out to help."
And if Mom does overreact, then I can see Marten snapping.
This is going to prove very interesting.I prefer the version where she kicks Marten's ass then drags Dora back home, to be her new protégé, since Marten clearly isn't into it.
Either Ms Vance is gonna come and kick Dora's ass, or she's gonna drag Marten back home
Or both.
This is going to prove very interesting.I prefer the version where she kicks Marten's ass then drags Dora back home, to be her new protégé, since Marten clearly isn't into it.
Either Ms Vance is gonna come and kick Dora's ass, or she's gonna drag Marten back home
Or both.
Why on earth would Veronica go whoop-ass on Dora?! It wasn't like Dora cheated on Marten, strung him along, or was abusive--she just couldn't deal with her insecurities about Faye (and gee, I mean, it's not like Marten was living with Faye or had a huge crush on her for any significant amount of time, it's not like everything they did socially as a couple had Faye in the room too, and we certainly saw Marten doing everything he could to make Dora feel like she was his first choice, like how they got their own place together to start fresh, and remember that amazing strip where he finally said "I love you"?.... Oh. Wait.) That's not so much hurting Marten as it is "being the other half of a relationship between two flawed people that ended with both people getting hurt." There's a huge difference.
What? I can't be the only person who thinks that a Coffee Shop Match to the Death between Marten and Hanners Mom would be awesome
.... This is such a perfect idea!QuoteWhat? I can't be the only person who thinks that a Coffee Shop Match to the Death between Marten and Hanners Mom would be awesome
Actually, I think you just might be the only one.
I'm looking for the signup page for the 'moar jello wrestling' society, personally.
I am now shipping Marten's mom and Hanners' mom.
Marten never seemed actively invested in the relationship? Yeah I can agree he often let her take charge, but he put effort into their relationship, too. He was never distant with her or uninterested in her advances, wasn't afraid to be open with her, and when she suggested they live together, his first instinct was "I'd love it if you moved in!" (he only started to freak out a little when she suggested he move out and live with her alone, but it's important to note that his initial reaction was positive.) He bought her just-because presents. He wanted them to take a vacation together (after he won the bet with Hannelore's mom) Hell, he asked her why she hadn't taken him to meet her parents!*
Just because Marten's passive doesn't mean he's completely detached or uninterested; he was nothing but open and affectionate towards Dora.
What an amazing second post.
(I'm going to hell for that, ain't I)
I have a theory about how this will play out that is so awesome that I will not describe it here because I do not want it to not happen.
It is that awesome
I have a theory about how this will play out that is so awesome that I will not describe it here because I do not want it to not happen.
Marten, on the other hand, never seemed actively invested in their relationship.
As I said before, Veronica threatened Faye because what Faye was doing could be seen as leading Marten on, using him for a security blanket and a place to stay before Faye found what she thought was a better guy, at which point she'd dump Marten. And I can certainly understand Veronica making that sort of threat. Dora, on the other hand, is clearly doing this to herself, and Marten is merely caught up in her self-sucking maelstrom—she's far more damaged by all this than Marten, who simply needs to learn from the experience. Veronica may not like that this happened, but any mature person looking at Dora and what she's doing to herself could only feel pity, and it was her son's, the grown man, job to get himself out of it or not, not his mother's.Why on earth would Veronica go whoop-ass on Dora?! It wasn't like Dora cheated on Marten, strung him along, or was abusive--she just couldn't deal with her insecurities about Faye (and gee, I mean, it's not like Marten was living with Faye or had a huge crush on her for any significant amount of time, it's not like everything they did socially as a couple had Faye in the room too, and we certainly saw Marten doing everything he could to make Dora feel like she was his first choice, like how they got their own place together to start fresh, and remember that amazing strip where he finally said "I love you"?.... Oh. Wait.) That's not so much hurting Marten as it is "being the other half of a relationship between two flawed people that ended with both people getting hurt." There's a huge difference.
Parent Logic. Protect your own. And when your own happens to be your only one, it tends to amplify it a bit. I disagree on your thoughts about the relationship coming to an and and your thoughts on Marten, but that's not the point. You could point out how both parties are victims till you are blue in the face, the fact is, All Marten's Mom is probably gonna hear is "Some Girl hurt my son, my only son. Now I have to hurt her."
Her threat to Faye when she thought that Faye was gonna eventually date Marten, topped with the fact that she's flying out so, uhm, instantly, after hearing the news makes me think that There will be fear spread to Dora. I'd be surprised if there wasn't. :psyduck: <-my surprise face.
I would be pumped if, in an effort to Save Dora (or assume she'd need saving and panic), Hanners Calls her mom in to help handle this.
What? I can't be the only person who thinks that a Coffee Shop Match to the Death between Marten and Hanners Mom would be awesome.
THERE HAS TO BE OTHERS!
QuoteHere is a question, did Veronica ever actually meet Dora in person, except that one time (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=455)?Other than that (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=440) time (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=441) they (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=442) had (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=443) lunch (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=445) together (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=446) you mean?
What? I can't be the only person who thinks that a Coffee Shop Match to the Death between Marten and Hanners Mom would be awesomeNope, you aren't. But I think it would be over soon. Hannermom has enough money to have a full body suit made from Mithril or anything of similar quality.
YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHH
MY MAIN BITCH IS COMING BACK
I'm not even sure Henry even lives in the same part of the country as Veronica anymore.im pretty sure at some point they said something like he lives in Florida now, i could be wrong though
(over 9000 hours in mspaint)
Of course! This is Jeph's big reveal! Marten's Evil Twin Brother! MORDECAI. :-o
(http://i658.photobucket.com/albums/uu307/SharpArcher01/twittermarten_bigger.jpg)
(over 9000 hours in mspaint)
Of course! This is Jeph's big reveal! Marten's Evil Twin Brother! MORDECAI. :-o
(http://i658.photobucket.com/albums/uu307/SharpArcher01/twittermarten_bigger.jpg)
(over 9000 hours in mspaint)
QuoteWhat? I can't be the only person who thinks that a Coffee Shop Match to the Death between Marten and Hanners Mom would be awesome
Actually, I think you just might be the only one.
I'm looking for the signup page for the 'moar jello wrestling' society, personally.
I am now shipping Marten's mom and Hanners' mom.
Of course! This is Jeph's big reveal! Marten's Evil Twin Brother! MORDECAI. :-o
(http://i658.photobucket.com/albums/uu307/SharpArcher01/twittermarten_bigger.jpg)
(over 9000 hours in mspaint)
Is Marten's evil twin brother Jewish?
Of course! This is Jeph's big reveal! Marten's Evil Twin Brother! MORDECAI. :-oSnidley Reedlash?
(http://i658.photobucket.com/albums/uu307/SharpArcher01/twittermarten_bigger.jpg)
(over 9000 hours in mspaint)
Of course! This is Jeph's big reveal! Marten's Evil Twin Brother! MORDECAI. :-o
(http://i658.photobucket.com/albums/uu307/SharpArcher01/twittermarten_bigger.jpg)
(over 9000 hours in mspaint)
Is Marten's evil twin brother Jewish?
No, but he is part of the worldwide banking conspiracy/the Illuminati and shit.
He just pretends to be Jewish so conspiracy nuts will give Jews a hard time.
He's a dick like that.
Since nobody in the whole cast save Raven has ever shown evidence of possessing a car, perhaps not.
Since nobody in the whole cast save Raven has ever shown evidence of possessing a car, perhaps not.
Dora also has one though "even [she] forgets [she] has it sometimes."
Why on earth would Veronica go whoop-ass on Dora?!
...we certainly saw Marten doing everything he could to make Dora feel like she was his first choice,
...That's not so much hurting Marten as it is "being the other half of a relationship between two flawed people that ended with both people getting hurt." There's a huge difference.
Veronica's son is the one with his life stalled out on the shoulder.
...Dora's insecurities were over the top,
...Marten, on the other hand, never seemed actively invested in their relationship.
...he let Dora take charge of things
...He's drifting along, not committing to anything... not even the things he seemed to enjoy--seriously close to slacker territory.
...Dora, who is already hurting pretty terribly,
Since nobody in the whole cast save Raven has ever shown evidence of possessing a car, perhaps not.Penelope drove Faye to the gym.
Steve has a truck.
I don't think Veronica is going to do anything to Dora, nor should she. But to suggest the relationship was scuttled by anything other than Dora's issues is a trifle short-sighted, to say the least. Marten's stalled life had not a damned thing to do with it. Read the comic. Dora says repeatedly she's not expecting it to last. I suppose you could say she chose to have a relationship with Marten because she was sure it would fail, the same way I think Faye decided to have sex with Sven because she was sure that would go nowhere. But, unlike Sven, Marten did nothing on his end to screw things up, and everything to try to save it, including, as the comic Delator dug up shows, being scrupulously honest, which quite frankly puts the lie on any claim that he's in denial about carrying a torch for Faye.Why on earth would Veronica go whoop-ass on Dora?!
...we certainly saw Marten doing everything he could to make Dora feel like she was his first choice,
...That's not so much hurting Marten as it is "being the other half of a relationship between two flawed people that ended with both people getting hurt." There's a huge difference.
Veronica's son is the one with his life stalled out on the shoulder.
...Dora's insecurities were over the top,
...Marten, on the other hand, never seemed actively invested in their relationship.
...he let Dora take charge of things
...He's drifting along, not committing to anything... not even the things he seemed to enjoy--seriously close to slacker territory.
...Dora, who is already hurting pretty terribly,
Wait, hold up, STOP. Ok, realistically, many (most?) of us react to these characters and their behaviors mostly because of how (similar?) people have treated us or loved ones in OUR pasts. I'll even concede that I may be about to snap at this post because my life is also "stalled, close to slacker territory, drifting" etc.
But that being said...
I saw all of the hurting on ONE side, her stupid angry attacks, accusations, control issues, while even you, doing your best to make this failure BOTH of their faults, if not actually HIS!?!?... all you can come up with is a mild case of Marten depression.
I think you're judging Marten COMPLETELY unfairly, while elevating "poor, suffering Dora", to fucking MARTYR status.
Yes, when a relationship fails, both usually suffer, obviously. But this time, it WAS Dora hurting Marten. Yep, there IS a huge difference. Whether she's hurting herself also, is a separate issue!
I hope Ms Vance AT LEAST strings Dora up by rusty chains over a fiery pit. And stands there with a whip, in full dom accoutrements. In the Hell part of the triptych.
Dora might even like it. (Check out her back tattoo!)