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Fun Stuff => BAND => Topic started by: Caspian on 18 Jan 2007, 10:27
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Ever since discovering Sigur Ros a few years ago, I have been very much digging epic post-rock stuff. While I've heard a few of the bigger post-rock groups (Slint, EITS, GYBE, Mogwai, Mono, Do Make Say Think, etc.) 3 or so years of playing these bands over and over again has made me want new post-rock stuff. So, does anyone know any other good Post-rock bands? I'd prefer the really epic kind, if possible. Some Post-Metal (eg, Isis, Pelican, etc..) would be good as well, although I know a lot more post-metal bands then I do post rock one. Thankyou!!!
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Funhouse, dude.
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Funhouse, dude.
Is that a band, or the stooges album?
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Maserati are really good. They have a new record and it is ace.
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God Is An Astronaut & A Minor Forest. ;)
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For post-metal, Agalloch is a very popular name around this board.
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Please tell me I'm not the only one who automatically thought of the Dirty Three.
SHAME ON YOU ALL.
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I wouldn't of thought Agalloch were post Metal. To me they're are a combination of Black, Doom and Folk
Labelling something post- is kind of retarded. I remember reading a review where someone was trying to argue Summoning were a post metal band because their music transcended the Black Metal asethetic or some such bullshit. It seems to be a label people throw onto metal bands that either:
a) Have Unusual/Oddly structured songs and riffs
b) An extremely abrassive or industrial sound
c) Contain uncommon (in metal anyway) instruments such as a drum machines
d) Are heavily influenced by Non Metal genres (especially Ambient, Avante Garde and Psychedelic music)
Espeically bands that get a tick in more then 1of these categories. It's just a bullshit way of trying to promote Elitism amongst certain bands.
Anyway this is a reccomendation thread so I should probably post a few albums that fit some of those categories.
Blut Aus Nord - The Work Which Transfers God
Rev Kriss Hades - Pagani Bloodlust Static Age
Portal - Seepia
Alchemist - Lunasphere / Organasm/ Eve of the War
Thorns -S/T
D?dheimsgard - 666 International
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For post-metal, Agalloch is a very popular name around this board.
Yeah, I know and like them. I should clarify: I don't know too much Post-Rock, but I am very much down with the Post-Metal. :-P Also, I agree with Scytale's thing on Post-Metal- personally, I don't think it should be called that either, but I'm yet to think of a better name. (I do like Post-Neurosis though, it works quite well in most cases.)
Also: Some excellent recommendations- I've got a Blut Aus Nord and an Alchemist album, and they're both really quite good.
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I tend to go with Avant-Garde metal, although blanket terms are inherently silly anyway.
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Since you're on the Neur-Isis train, I'll recommend Rosetta (http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendID=1618502) (for some pretty heavy metal-meets-spacerock type music) and Red Sparowes (http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendID=1899211) (basically an instrumental collaboration between Neurosis and Isis.) Also, since nobody's mentioned them yet, Russian Circles (http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendID=31220613) are also highly enjoyable.
Links go the these bands' Myspace sites, for easy listenin' access! Let us know what you think, 'kay?
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I tend to go with Avant-Garde metal, although blanket terms are inherently silly anyway.
Avante Garde metal I get because it's actually a pretty good description for the stuff that falls under it.
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Red Sparowes (http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendID=1899211) (basically an instrumental collaboration between Neurosis and Isis.)
Heywut? Why did no one tell me about this?
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maudlin of the Well and Kayo Dot: the first constellation being more metal, the latter absolutely amazing.
Fridge: Kieran Hebden aka Four Tet and Adem's post-rock band.
Envy: Japanese hardcore with quite a bit of post-rock, especially on Insomniac Doze. Very epic.
Battle of Mice: on Neurot Recordings, shares members with Red Sparowes and Made of Babies.
Bark Psychosis: Solid early post-rock, the vocals are lacking in my opinion though.
They made a comeback a while ago with Operation: Dustsucker but I haven't heard it.
Also I would suggest seeking out old krautrock bands like Ash Ra Tempel, Faust and others. The aesthetic is similar.
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Clann Zu
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Valdemar: great call on Battle Of Mice and Envy; those are both fantastic bands.
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Blut Aus Nord - The Work Which Transfers God
Dodheimsgard - 666 International
maudlin of the Well and Kayo Dot: the first constellation being more metal, the latter absolutely amazing.
I second these bands.
Also, Kayo dot are not really metal. I know Toby Driver hates it when people call Kayo Dot a metal band. Also, their album was realesed on Tzadic.
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Well Toby can squeal all he wants, I am still going to call Kayo Dot an avant-garde metal band or at the very least metallic.
Choirs of the Eye was released on Tzadik yes, but now they are signed to Robotic Empire. Dowsing Anemone With Copper Tongue topped my 2006 list.
Battle of Mice: They are quite good but that 911 call sequence in one of their songs is a bit icky and unfun, like that Coil song only not high on god knows how many drugs.
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I dunno if they're techincally post-rock, but I always thought that Low fit in with the whole aesthetic. Also, the Shipping News are pretty good.
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I still haven't been able to determine whether that 911 call is a real recording, or something they made in the studio. Neither would surprise me, and whichever it is, it's one of the most unsettling things I have ever heard. But damn, they make such great music...
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probably my favorite genre so i know quite a few bands in it.
try these:
magyar posse
sweek
friends in the mountains
eyelids like anvils
clogs
blueneck
jakob
mono
anoice
the capricorns
sparrows swarm and sing (epic, god speed-esque)
envy (for your post-metal fix)
if these trees could talk (their s/t is amazingly good)
because of ghosts
i might modify this and add more later but all of these are great.
EDIT:
More of 'em:
65daysofstatic
a silver mt. zion
Alamaailman Vasarat
the ascent of everest
broken social scene's "feel good lost" album
eluvium
the dead texan
helios
(the four above this are all very ambient but still post-rock and really excellent)
day for airstrikes
don't mess with texas (awesome croation post-rock. awful name though)
destroyalldreamers
september malevolence
this will destroy you
the drift
halifx pier
irepress
labradford
laura (australian post-rock. really great)
migala
the six parts seven (mogwai-ish)
tortoise
sickoakes
we're from japan! (not from japan, not mono, still good)
microfilm (lots of movie samples and stuff but all very cool)
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I dunno if they're techincally post-rock, but I always thought that Low fit in with the whole aesthetic. Also, the Shipping News are pretty good.
The Shipping News are a great band, yes.
Valdemar, I still dont think of them as Avant Grade metal, somthing about that seems wrong. MOTW fits better into that genre.
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Sleeping People is an absolute must.
If you want good post-rock music, check out this label:
Temporary Residence Limited (http://www.temporaryresidence.com/)
The absolute cream of the crop are on it.
Also, I really like A Northern Chorus. Their albums are minimalistic masterpieces.
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I too agree that there's not really such a thing as post-metal, however, I am definitely behind the idea of post-black metal, as it fits in to the pattern of labelling of post-punk, post-industrial and to a lesser extent post-rock, in that it seems to be a similiar sort of musical progression, pushing a genre forward conceptually whilst evolving beyond its musical limitations and also in that it makes much more sense than to just keep talking about endless 'waves' of BM, especially when you still have new bands doing interesting things within a definitely black metal framework. When I think of post-black metal, I'm thinking mainly of bands in that whole big clusterfuck around Garm and Vintersorg, and those inspired by them.
On the post black metal front, get yourself some Meads of Asphodel. I recommend their split with Mayhem (Jihad/Freezing Moon). Woods of Ypres are good too, very Ulver/Agalloch inspired.
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I am very bad at reading entire threads, so I don't know what has been mentioned, but since I am somewhat of a post-rock obsessed freak, I have some recommendations:
Ever since discovering Sigur Ros a few years ago, I have been very much digging epic post-rock stuff. While I've heard a few of the bigger post-rock groups (Slint, EITS, GYBE, Mogwai, Mono, Do Make Say Think, etc.) 3 or so years of playing these bands over and over again has made me want new post-rock stuff. So, does anyone know any other good Post-rock bands? I'd prefer the really epic kind, if possible. Some Post-Metal (eg, Isis, Pelican, etc..) would be good as well, although I know a lot more post-metal bands then I do post rock one. Thankyou!!!
Red Sparowes (explosions in the sky-esque collaboration between some Isis members and some other dudes)
Isis, especially Panopticon. these guys are amazing.
1 Mile North - minimalist post-rock that is soo good
Bell Orchestre - their debut album is one of the top 10 post rock cds in existence
Pelican - have been accused of hardcore instrumental and stuff. lies! listen to The Fire in our Throats Will Beckon the Thaw. it's like one big, long, rock orgasm
A Silver Mount Zion - GY!BE offshoot. neat stuff
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Be careful with A Minor Forest. I never really considered them post-rock, to me they were more math-rock. They're certainly not "pretty" like the big post-rock bands you mentioned. But, if you listen to them and like them, go for some June of 44.
Also, the first self-titled Rex album is amazing. It's kind of like a cross between Slint and country music.
Bardo Pond are more of a stoner rock band but they are great.
Roy Montgomery is epic and it's just ONE DUDE.
Flying Saucer Attack isn't really post-rock either but it's a safe bet you'd like them.
If you don't have the self-titled The For Carnation album (ex-members of Slint) then you are missing out in a big way. Ditto for Papa M's Live From a Shark Cage (and to a lesser extend Whatever, Mortal, which isn't post-rock at all but is pretty good).
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idk, i love the genre but red sparowes bore me for some reason. i've listened through a couple of thier albums and i don't really see the explosions in the sky comparison. for some reason thier songs never seem very compelling to me and i always end up bored with them before they end.
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If they've not already been posted, I wholeheartedly recommend the first Hope of the States album, The Lost Riots. It's one of my favourite albums ever; it's over an hour long discounting the gap between the last and hidden tracks (the hidden track is absolutely worth hearing by the way) and everything on it is kitchen-sink epic. It's fantastic.
The track to download if you just want a taster of them is 'Black Dollar Bills,' which is three mintues of normal song before the last four minutes of it is just one massive crescendo. One of my favourite songs ever. It's like an orgasm in music.
If you want tasters of them, go to the Halfway Home Fansite, because there's loads of legal, band-endorsed b-sides, demos, internet releases and live shows on there to watch.
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I love you Wombat; you have given me a plethora of music to listen to via that list, most of which I am enjoying.
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I am so post-rock, I- wait, this isn't that thread.
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idk, i love the genre but red sparowes bore me for some reason. i've listened through a couple of thier albums and i don't really see the explosions in the sky comparison. for some reason thier songs never seem very compelling to me and i always end up bored with them before they end.
Yeah, I can agree with that. THe Red Sparowes sound real pretty, but they're music never really goes anywhere, in my opinion anyway.
Thanks for the recommendations people! Some I have already heard but most I have not! Although I already know all of the post metal bands listed here. BUT, I do not know most of hte post rock ones, so that is very good.
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When I think of post-black metal, I'm thinking mainly of bands in that whole big clusterfuck around Garm and Vintersorg, and those inspired by them.
Which bands are you thinking of here. I assume you mean: Arcturus, Borknagar, Spiral Architect, Lunaris, Age of Silence, Winds etc...
Most of those bands are pretty far removed from BM, especailly nowadays.
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Yes, but most of them, especially Arcturus and Borknagar (and other bands not in that scene like ...And Oceans and Blut Aus Nord) did start out a lot more BM. That's why 'post'. They're something that has come out of BM and just gone somewhere completely different, whilst still recognisably taking elements of BMs aesthetics and whatnot forward.
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Yeah I guess so.
Arcturus are comming down here in March, I'm not sure if I'll go or not, tickets are $45 and I wasn't all that impressed with Sideshow Symphonies. Virgin Black are doing the support as well, another band I've never been hugely impressed with...
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idk, i love the genre but red sparowes bore me for some reason. i've listened through a couple of thier albums and i don't really see the explosions in the sky comparison. for some reason thier songs never seem very compelling to me and i always end up bored with them before they end.
I'm personally a fan of Red Sparowes, but I can definately understand that as well. I love bands like Red Sparowes and Russian Circles, but Pelican bores me to death for the same who-knows-what reason. I also don't get the EITS comparison - Explosions seems a lot more cinematic than Red Sparowes do.
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Whilst we're here, whats a good new post-rock band for a guy who likes a bit of GY!BE and Mono now and then, but knows for a fact that he does not like Mogwai, Slint or Tortoise?
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the aforementioned 'sparrows swarm and sing' are very god speed-esque. some might even go as far as to say they impersonate god speed. i wouldn't. but i would say any fan of god speed will like 'em b/c they're similar stylistically and pretty darn good to boot. try 'O?Shenandoah, Mighty Death Will Find Me.' tis quite excellent. also, if these trees could talk are awesome and should appeal to any mono fan.
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Whilst we're here, whats a good new post-rock band for a guy who likes a bit of GY!BE and Mono now and then, but knows for a fact that he does not like Mogwai, Slint or Tortoise?
The first Tarentel album isn't new, but if you like GY!BE and Mono you'd probably dig it. It's called From Bone to Satellite.
You might like their more recent material, particularly We Move Through Weather, for entirely different reasons. It's not really post-rock, it's almost industrial in a strange sort of way.
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woah, how did that slip my mind? tarentel is so damn good. i saw 'em live performing a 30 minute improvised set (it was continuous-no pauses at all) which was really amazing. i would agree that 'from bone to satellite' might be the best place to start. their other stuff tends to go towards being less accessible, especially the second of two companion eps to 'we move through the weather' entitled 'big black square.' it's one 45 minute track, the first 15 minutes of which is distortion and a recording of rain falling in an alleyway. sonically it's very intense. anywho, i second this reccomendation wholeheartedly.
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Thanks, I shall see what I can get hold of.
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A Silver Mt. Zion
Rachel's
Tarentel
Telegraph Melts, The Swords Project
The Spires of Oxford
The Azusa Plane
The Album Leaf
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My Disco!
Wait, post rock? Whatever, I do what I want.
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Speaking of disco, this thread has gone entirely too far without any mention of Disco Inferno, particularly Disco Inferno Go Pop, which should be owned by anyone interested in the slightly weirder side of post-rock.
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I didn't know anyone actually knew about Disco Inferno outside of the UK.
I don't think very many do, which is a shame. I was introduced to them by Tom Ewing of Freaky Trigger, back in the dark days of the mid-90s, when we were pals during the short-lived "alt.music.alternative has been taken over by a couple dozen people who actually have good taste in music" period of the interweb.
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the pirate ship qunitet are really really awesome. their album isn't out yet, and won't be for a bit, but what i've heard of it is fantastic.
http://www.thepirateshipquintet.co.uk/
listen to the two mp3s on their site.
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Oh shit yes.
I didn't know anyone actually knew about Disco Inferno outside of the UK. What a great band they were. Also, this is one of my favourite bits of vinyl -
(http://img.hmv.co.jp/image/jacket/190/18/6/0/044.jpg)
Yeah, that's great.
In the article in which Simon Reynolds coined the term post-rock he talked about Disco Inferno at some length. Because, you know, they were taking and breaking rock structures, dude triggering samples with a guitar and all that. Mind you he was also enthusing about Stereolab in this regard, which is kind of funny now given how utterly pissed upon his original image of post-rock has become.
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I hate to cast doubt upon your excellently illustrated point - and it remains so, even after I write this - but I typically find myself able to "get" or "not get" albums within five or six listens. Anything beyond that means I'm investing time into an album that may in fact be nowhere near as rewarding at the end of it all as another album which may catch my attention immediately. For example, I still can't get into Feels by Animal Collective, a record that invests itself entirely into atmosphere, after about eight listens, but every spin of Scott Walker's The Drift since I first heard it less than a month ago has revealed nuance and genius that I still managed to miss. The latter album resonated from the first listen and continues to resonate.
What makes this important is that the other album which may catch my attention immediately may turn out to be an album I will never hear. With that in mind you, and anyone, would be hard-pressed to convince me that I should sacrifice - let's say that three spins of The Gap equals one lost album just for the sake of argument - over sixty other albums for this one which is totally the record, man.
In the context of this argument, I'd say give the record a listen. Hell, Tommy produced a little "best of" compilation of Joan Of Arc's works, comprised of what I think were representative songs of each period in the band's development. I found a significant chunk of them almost instantly enjoyable. But I don't think you can justify two hundred listens of a record in order to "get it."
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Awesome post, Tommydski. Sincere art music ftw. Although I do have to confess I would never bother to listen to something 100s of times if I didn't at least like it a bit at the start.
The only thing I've heard from Joan of Arc is last year's Eventually, All At Once, which I understand is way more straightforward than a lot of their stuff. I've heard things about deliberate digital skips in recordings and all kinds of wilfull annoyances... sounds great. :)
Actually, heard some Owen, which is one of the Kinsellas, right? That was also really accessible.
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Hahah, that's the same thing co-frontman of Olivia Tremor Control Bill Doss said about their album Black Foliage. Well, approximately. Apparently, to fully understand that album one has to listen to it fifty times. I already like that album anyway and I've only listened to it around five times. I'm curious about this whole 'getting' an album thing. It sounds to me like the nirvana an audiophile finds at the end of a long road of searching for such music. What do you call it, enlightenment. I want some enlightenment, instant gratification. Too bad I have to listen to an album fifty times for it. And is it guaranteed? Hell no. But I'll take musical enlightenment over true nirvana anyday. It's way easier to listen to an album fifty times than to seclude myself in the wilderness, fasting for the rest of my days and such.
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(Sorry in advance. :oops:)
I think all we need in this world is more long, instrumental tracks based around a traditional band line-up, with either some moody piano or some tuned percussion (preferably vibes or maybe a xylophone) and a middle section where the guitars get much louder. Because, you know, that's really adventurous and interesting and, boy, it goes so far beyond the constrains of rock music into a world of NO RULES!!
Maybe if you're getting wild and crazy you can step things up a notch and have some distorted electronic beats that sound like what happened to "IDM" when that became all codified and conventional in the mid-90s. Boy. So dazzlingly inventive.
Even better would be if you put a singer back in the mix, bringing things into the same soaring blissed out format of shit like Cocteau Twins or the shoegazer bands or whoever and then have your fans decide it's the best example of POST-rock around. Because, man, having a band with a singer and loud guitars is really pushing the boundaries of the rock format into new territory. Fuck you all, Sigur Ros fans.
:x
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I guess that's why you should all be listening to the Dirty Three.
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the pirate ship qunitet are really really awesome. their album isn't out yet, and won't be for a bit, but what i've heard of it is fantastic.
http://www.thepirateshipquintet.co.uk/
listen to the two mp3s on their site.
the first song on their myspace, reminds me a lot like the drift(the 2nd song doesn't sound like them at all)
i would recommend the drift, i saw them open for eits in november
If you want good post-rock music, check out this label:
Temporary Residence Limited (http://www.temporaryresidence.com/)
The absolute cream of the crop are on it.
agreed
i mainly just wanted to say that i LOVE explosions in the sky, i have been listening to them almost everyday for over a year and i still can't get enough...and if you have the chance to see them live, do it...amazing
/dry humping eits :lol:
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to this day i am blown away by how great the temporary 10th anniversary fest in nyc was. there are so many great bands on that label and seeing a lot of them in one place was just incredible and hightened my appreciation of the label even more. if a dvd of the fest ever finds its way out (and it's supposed to i think...) you'd all be fools not to buy it. fools!
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Allmusic describes Joan of Arc's "The Gap" as "a complicated in-joke that no one else is privy to." I see what you mean, Tommy.
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Alamaailman Vasarat
I can't admit to having heard every band you listed, but I really think Alamaailman Vasarat doesn't fit in with bands usually listed as being post-whatever that I am familiar with.
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well it's not a traditional post-rock band but that's why i included it. it's different from most of post-rock i've heard, but i think it still falls into the post rock genre, just like beirut is unlike most indie rock but it's still considered part of that genre. i bring up beirut b/c like Alamaailman Vasarat they employ rather unique eastern european influences into their songs. Alamaailman Vasarat may sound different but i still think it's fair to consider it post-rock. there's lots of intense drumming and guitars, but a lot of non-traditional musical stuff going on as well. same goes for magyar posse actually. out of curiosity, if you wouldn't call them post-rock how would you classify them?
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Wow, fish across face, Did Efrim Manuck steal your girlfriend or something? Jesus, dude.
Personally, most of the post-rock I listen to I like because it's NOT really "experimental" but more based on what classically sounds good - GY!BE, Labradford, Mono, Mogwai, bands like that. I don't think most people think such music is necessarily breaking new ground in terms of structure, mood, chord progressions or whatever.
That said, I don't see how one could listen to, say, Hash Jar Tempo or Flying Saucer Attack and NOT think that those kind of "post-rock" bands are doing something original (whether you like it or not).
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well it's not a traditional post-rock band but that's why i included it. it's different from most of post-rock i've heard, but i think it still falls into the post rock genre, just like beirut is unlike most indie rock but it's still considered part of that genre. i bring up beirut b/c like Alamaailman Vasarat they employ rather unique eastern european influences into their songs. Alamaailman Vasarat may sound different but i still think it's fair to consider it post-rock. there's lots of intense drumming and guitars, but a lot of non-traditional musical stuff going on as well. same goes for magyar posse actually. out of curiosity, if you wouldn't call them post-rock how would you classify them?
Actually, there are no guitars. Those are cellos. Apparently cellos sound amazing with distortion. Giving them a strict classification would be difficult, so I might just default to something like avant-garde or RIO. Either that or just identify them by some of the more prevalent influences in their music.
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hmmm, interesting. thanks actually, that makes me appreciate them more b/c that's some damn cool celloing. either way, if i had to place them into a genre, i would certainly say not avante-garde. they're too structured and thier music feels like composed pieces so i don't think they fall into that category. at least, they're certainly not on the same level as 'selected ambient works' era aphex twin or gang gang dance's "god's money," or tarentel's "big black square" for example. in fact i think a fair number of "post-rock" bands are more on the avante-garde side than Alamaailman Vasarat are. for the sake of classification i'm fairly confident of their post-rock status. not that music really needs to be lumped into categories, but if someone asked that's where i would put them, albiet on the less traditional end of the genre obviously.
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Well, I don't think avant-garde is as strict of a definition as you put forth concerning unstructuredness. In fact, a lot of music that is or has been considered avant-garde is insanely intricately structured, just look at serialism. I was merely using the phrase as a sort of catch-all for forward thinking music that relies on a unique combination of influences or utilizes new compositional forms or techniques.
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ok, fair enough. i guess i was thinking of 'avant-garde' in stricter terms. but you make a good argument and with that definition it would be fair to place Alamaailman Vasarat in the avant-garde group. i still don't think i'd ever really consider them as such but i guess i'm sorta set in my understanding of avant-garde and oft unshakeable stubborness prevents that from changing. but i can see how they might be defined as such.
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So, you've essentially invalidated your use of language?
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or i've admitted that semantics exists and that often words or phrases are up for interpretation and that, while i may not agree with one interpretation, it may still be a valid one to certain people and therefore, when it comes to genres of music for example, i might define a particular genre title in one way and ergo not include a certain band in said genre while someone else might define the genre title another way and, by their definition, the same band might indeed fall into said genre. i can admit this without invalidating my own definition because quite often these things are very open for interpretation.
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Which doesn't apply to a term like avant-garde that has a widely established use. Considering its interpretation "very open" and disagreeing with interpretations of it undermine the efficacy of language.
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i'm not sure how true that is really. its interpretation is open. one would be hard pressed to provide a rigid definition for "avant-garde" that all would agree with. i was merely saying that various definitions exist. i personally have my own interpretation of the phrase which may or may not conform to someone elses. how does that undermine the efficacy of language? admitting something is open for interpretation should not have to go hand in hand with agreeing with all interpretations offered.
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So if there isn't a standard definition, what are you interpreting? The sound of the word? The way it looks?
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Well, I guess it just wouldn't be a post-rock thread if it didn't have someone being a snarky pedant in it.
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And it wouldn't be a forum if someone wasn't debating semantics.
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Well, I guess it just wouldn't be a post-rock thread if it didn't have someone being a snarky pedant in it.
Who's being snarky? Oh wait, it's you.
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#9
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Personally, most of the post-rock I listen to I like because it's NOT really "experimental" but more based on what classically sounds good - GY!BE, Labradford, Mono, Mogwai, bands like that. I don't think most people think such music is necessarily breaking new ground in terms of structure, mood, chord progressions or whatever.
Yay, I'm pleased to hear that. My beef is just that there are these new bands which I think are real, dyed in the wool, card-carrying Post-Rock Bands. They sound like they've heard post-rock stuff, that they have a clear picture of what post-rock is, and they want to do the same. Wait, that's not my beef. ;-) My beef is that fans of these bands seem to consider them more adventurous or more "out there" (dare I say, avant-garde) than other bands working to find their niche within a clean-cut genre, be it psy-trance or baile funk or garage rock.
I admit, I also really don't understand the deal with Sigur Ros being post-rock, and it is something of a bug-bear for me. I bought their first EP when it came out, just because it was on Fat Cat and up until that point I'd been following that label pretty religiously, but, man, it sounded tired. I'd heard things that were really similar before, even on quite improbable things like The Verve's early EPs and first album (back when they were Verve). No one would EVER call the Verve post-rock, right? But mostly I'm thinking about shoegazer stuff... Fat Cat had already released things by Transient Waves, which were sorta on some post-My Bloody Valentine kick, and I just thought "oh, more modern shoegaze, with some more Lanois / Eno shit going on ... no wonder these guys are massive rockstars in their home country". I sold it on pretty swiftly. Then suddenly this band which I thought sounded incredibly like a whole lot of late 80s / early 90s music suddenly got heralded as the flag-bearers of a genre which, when it was initially invented, described something quite different. I was a bit - how do you say? - "WTF dudes" about it.
That said, I don't see how one could listen to, say, Hash Jar Tempo or Flying Saucer Attack and NOT think that those kind of "post-rock" bands are doing something original (whether you like it or not).
Never heard Hash Jar Tempo. Fucking funny name... :laugh: Must be a pun on Ash Ra Tempel, right? Just did a google, if it involves Roy Montgomery it's probably pretty good. Another guy who's been churning out psychedelic waves of good times since before "post-rock" was coined.
I used to listen to Flying Saucer Attack a lot when I was at school, but again, this is an old band who used to be considered among bods I talked to IRL and on the internet as part of the shoegaze and blisspop school of things... fitting into that noisy, soaring 90s UK indie thing you might want to rope bands like Swervedriver or Ride or whoever else into. They've been retro-actively brought under the post-rock umbrella (like Labradford above and, most confusingly, Slint upthread), presumably exactly because they sound original... I think they're great, but I got quite sick of them. I wish I hadn't been so ruthless in selling off CDs.
So those examples are not what I was digging at (not that I made it clear in my other post - I'm not giving you shit).
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Actually I never considered Sigur Ros to be post-rock either, so I basically agree on that point. For better or worse, post-rock has been made into a genre so broad it doesn't mean anything anymore (I mean, if someone could tell me how the same genre can contain M83, Mogwai, and Stars of the Lid and have any kind of internal consistency, I'd be really surprised).
Hash Jar Tempo is indeed very good, I would say that the second album, Under Glass, is even better than most Roy Montomery solo stuff (but not as good as, say, "Fantasia On a Theme From Sandy Bull").
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m83 is electronica, not post-rock i'd argue. however, i do think sigur ros is. post-rock does not, i don't think, requier that music be purely instrumental or epic or anything like that. to quote the wikipedia entry on it, post-rock is "characterized by non-traditional use of rock instruments and high musical density." that sounds like sigur ros to me, especially in the way guitar is implemented. i prescribe to this particular idea of the genre and for that reason i feel sigur ros fits the bill. and if you do feel a lack of vocal is a neccessity for a band to be in the post-rock genre, as some people i know do, then consider the argument i once heard that jonsi's voice is something of an instrument in and of itself. it's certainly farily unique and the indecipherable (often, depending on the album, made up) lyrics, as well as the way they are sung, gives the vocals a very instrumental quality.
idk, just how i see it.
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m83 is electronica, not post-rock i'd argue.
I agree, but that's not the critical or public consensus.
to quote the wikipedia entry on it, post-rock is "characterized by non-traditional use of rock instruments and high musical density."
OK, but then you run into the problem that areguably the most seminal post-rock band of all time - Godspeed You! Black Emperor - was very traditional in both use of instruments and songwriting. "Non-traditional use of rock instruments and high musical density" sounds like Sonic Youth, to me, and nobody (I hope) is retroactively claiming SY is post-rock.
This is what I mean by that post-rock is a totally meaningless genre label and is a marketing term, like "indie rock" has been since the mid-90s and "college rock" was in the 80s.
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hmm, that is true. but godspeed did a lot of very non-traditional stuff as well. songs lasting well over the 20 minute mark, multiple movements in each song, definetly some very dense moments, and, at times, there are untraditional instrumentals. a co-worker of mine from over the summer saw them live once and described how a screwdriver was employed to play a guitar at one point.
but you're very right. sonic youth is most certainly not post-rock despite fitting the "definition" and claiming the lable is essentially irrelevant is very valid. it's obvious that that's the case but i've been using the label for so long to refer to bands that most people would not argue fit the lable (mogwai, mono, the aforementioed godspeed) that it's a habit. a bad one, granted, and one i should break, but a habit nonetheless.
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however, i do think sigur ros is. post-rock does not, i don't think, requier that music be purely instrumental or epic or anything like that. to quote the wikipedia entry on it, post-rock is "characterized by non-traditional use of rock instruments and high musical density." that sounds like sigur ros to me, especially in the way guitar is implemented. i prescribe to this particular idea of the genre and for that reason i feel sigur ros fits the bill. and if you do feel a lack of vocal is a neccessity for a band to be in the post-rock genre, as some people i know do, then consider the argument i once heard that jonsi's voice is something of an instrument in and of itself. it's certainly farily unique and the indecipherable (often, depending on the album, made up) lyrics, as well as the way they are sung, gives the vocals a very instrumental quality.
Completely pointlessly, I still defend Simon Reynold's original article about post-rock, and in that, as I mentioned upthread, he included bands like Disco Inferno and Stereolab. So I don't think vocals make something no longer post-rock.
But I think Sigur Ros records are as textural as, to take a deliberately provocative example, U2's slow songs circa Unforgettable Fire. U2-obsessed friends tell me Bono starts writing songs largely by singing wordless melodies over band jams and some of those are left in the tracks. On this and The Joshua Tree that involves lots of wordless keening over shimmering layers of guitar.
On the Eno-produced tip, a lot of the quieter Sigur Ros stuff I've heard puts me in mind of Eno circa Another Green World and Before And After Science.
Vocally and musically you can point to stuff the Cocteau Twins, with Liz Fraser in gentle warbling mode (made-up words again).
I know in performance the guitarists do some funny things, but as with what zerodrone said, this is like Sonic Youth or even Jimmy Paige..? Or back to Eno and the art-rockers...? All of whom are rock.
This is all deliberately avoiding the most obvious reference point, the shoegazer bands like Lush, Ride, maybe even My Bloody Valentine.
My point being that all of these touchstones have alwas been considered part of the big ol' world of rock, in one way or another. I don't see why the sum of all these rock parts is no longer rock. I don't hear external influences or sounds that push them into a new place.
Anyway, I've stated my piece, best leave it alone. :)
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hmm, that is true. but godspeed did a lot of very non-traditional stuff as well. songs lasting well over the 20 minute mark, multiple movements in each song, definetly some very dense moments
But Pink Floyd did that too - go listen to "Echoes". And besides that, 20+ minute suites with multiple movements is as traditional as you can get - one might even say it's downright classical, if you get my meaning.
I'm not down on anyone for saying "If you want to get into post-rock, pick up GY!BE and Mogwai albums", because most of us can (grudgingly) admit that "bands that sound like GY!BE or Mogwai" is a large enough genre that it should have some kind of name. But I really don't like applying the term willy-nilly to even stuff like Low, which I've seen done several times.
Also: fish across face, I feel your pain WRT people not acknowledging the huge influence shoegazer/britrock had. Whenever I hear someone compare Interpol's first album to Joy Division I'm all like "RARGH! HAVE YOU HEARD OF SLOWDIVE? LUSH? THE CHURCH? THE CHAMELEONS? HELL THE FUCKING PSYCHEDELIC FURS ARE CLOSER IN SOUND TO THAT ALBUM THAN JOY DIVISION! RARGH!"
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Hmmm.... "post rock" is a pretty vaguely used term, but, as I understand it, it's anything that deconstructs the traditional rock structure i.e. 4/4 time (3/4 or 6/8 if we're getting crazy) with a verse/chorus/verse structure in favor of something that strays from that formula, while maintaining some of the energy and at least some of the tools of rock (i.e. drums, bass, guitar). That's a pretty wide net. Given your tastes, I'd say check out the math rock thread from about a month ago for more ideas.
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Can someone give me some MP3s of a few Godspeed songs? Because the more I hear about them, the more I want to hear them, but I don't want to waste my money. I don't want any whole albums because that'd make buying them pointless, just a few individual tracks.
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I know I never formally introduced myself in the "Hi, I'm new" part of the forum, but I just had to add some stuff to this thread:
Some Brazillian Post-Rock bands:
Hurtmold (very Tortoise-like, but with some brazillian essence. I just saw their concert tuesday!)
Projeto dois pontos (Can also be called "Projeto :" - very epic, very noisy, uses a lot of different instruments but still havent found a good formula.)
Objeto Amarelo (Unfortunately ended. Minimalistic, improvised a lot.)
Shiksa (Same line as Objeto amarelo, but better. Great nonsense lyrics.)
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I really can't believe no one has mentioned Tarentel yet. One of the best post-rock bands around.
Hi louize 5... I LOVE Hurtmold! They rock.
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Can someone give me some MP3s of a few Godspeed songs? Because the more I hear about them, the more I want to hear them, but I don't want to waste my money. I don't want any whole albums because that'd make buying them pointless, just a few individual tracks.
Having looked into it, 'a few' Godspeed songs would result in an album, so just one would be fine.
I've downloaded a live bootleg (which I've read that they officially endorse) and it sounds amazing, but none of the tracks are titled and the quality is poor.
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i have two concert bootlegs, both quite nice quality (on in france from 2003 and the other is a two part piece called 'tiny silver hammers' but i don't know when or where it was played). anyway, godspeed albums are all very short track wise, the longest being yanqui uxo with 5 tracks, the shortest being slow riot for new zero kanada with only 2 tracks. i recommend you pick up 'life your skinny fists like antennas to heaven' it's two discs, two tracks on each disc, and it's incredible. trust me, you won't be wasting your money. if you like what you hear (and i find it hard to believe you won't) get 'F#A# ∞' then 'slow riot...' and last of all pick up 'yanqui uxo' (that's my personal order of favorites though...)
just take a chance. i don't think you'll find your money has been wasted.
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I really can't believe no one has mentioned Tarentel yet.
I really can't believe you don't read threads before posting in them. Sorry, that was a cheap shot.
I did mention Tarentel way back on page 1.
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An honorable mention is Valley of the Giants, formed by members of Broken Social Scene, Do Make Say Think, GYBE, Shallabi Effect, A Silver Mount Zion and Strawberry.
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Dynamite Kid, there are a ton of concert bootlegs for GY!BE to be found over here (http://www.archive.org/search.php?query=collection%3Aetree%20AND%20%2Fmetadata%2Fcreator%3A%22Godspeed%20You%20Black%20Emperor%21%22).
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The link's broken.
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I second Bark Psychosis (Can't remember who mentioned it), Codename: Dustsucker is a fantastic album, and i'm just getting into Hex.
I'd also recommend thelittlesorryselfyouare and Loss of a Child (both can be found on last.fm, the latter has an album available for free download here: http://www.archive.org/details/lost_children (http://www.archive.org/details/lost_children))
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Whoops. Please accept my humble apologies.
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The link's broken.
Worked fine for me. Go to archive.org and search for them if you're sure it's broken.
I downloaded a couple of these Godspeed You! Black Emperor concerts yesterday and had them playing while I was doing other things. I think I confirmed for myself that I'll never get the appeal of them...
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I think I confirmed for myself that I'll never get the appeal of them...
(http://991.com/newgallery//Faith-No-More-We-Care-A-Lot-28771.jpg)
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(Sorry in advance. :oops:)
I think all we need in this world is more long, instrumental tracks based around a traditional band line-up, with either some moody piano or some tuned percussion (preferably vibes or maybe a xylophone) and a middle section where the guitars get much louder. Because, you know, that's really adventurous and interesting and, boy, it goes so far beyond the constrains of rock music into a world of NO RULES!!
Maybe if you're getting wild and crazy you can step things up a notch and have some distorted electronic beats that sound like what happened to "IDM" when that became all codified and conventional in the mid-90s. Boy. So dazzlingly inventive.
Even better would be if you put a singer back in the mix, bringing things into the same soaring blissed out format of shit like Cocteau Twins or the shoegazer bands or whoever and then have your fans decide it's the best example of POST-rock around. Because, man, having a band with a singer and loud guitars is really pushing the boundaries of the rock format into new territory. Fuck you all, Sigur Ros fans.
:x
See, you used all these words, but all you ended up saying was, "I don't know what the fuck post-rock is!"
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I second Bark Psychosis (Can't remember who mentioned it), Codename: Dustsucker is a fantastic album, and i'm just getting into Hex.
I'd also recommend thelittlesorryselfyouare and Loss of a Child (both can be found on last.fm, the latter has an album available for free download here: http://www.archive.org/details/lost_children (http://www.archive.org/details/lost_children))
Hex is my favourite album. 'A Street Scene' especially. Mindblowing track.
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Whilst we're here, whats a good new post-rock band for a guy who likes a bit of GY!BE and Mono now and then, but knows for a fact that he does not like Mogwai, Slint or Tortoise?
I feel similar and can recommend This Will Destroy You. First listen reminded me a lot of GY!BE, but with shorter songs that have less random shit tacked on. pretty good.
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See, you used all these words, but all you ended up saying was, "I don't know what the fuck post-rock is!"
Eh? Do you mean I revealed a lack of understanding or that you think my complaint is that I don't understand the definition of post-rock?
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I understood your complaint and I'd like to add a bit; people who think that because of all the omg-we're-so-experimental bands that it's a less valid genre than any other. I like some post-rock, and if you hate me for that you can go to hell.
(that last sentence wasn't directed at you)
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(Sorry in advance. :oops:)
I think all we need in this world is more long, instrumental tracks based around a traditional band line-up, with either some moody piano or some tuned percussion (preferably vibes or maybe a xylophone) and a middle section where the guitars get much louder. Because, you know, that's really adventurous and interesting and, boy, it goes so far beyond the constrains of rock music into a world of NO RULES!!
Maybe if you're getting wild and crazy you can step things up a notch and have some distorted electronic beats that sound like what happened to "IDM" when that became all codified and conventional in the mid-90s. Boy. So dazzlingly inventive.
Even better would be if you put a singer back in the mix, bringing things into the same soaring blissed out format of shit like Cocteau Twins or the shoegazer bands or whoever and then have your fans decide it's the best example of POST-rock around. Because, man, having a band with a singer and loud guitars is really pushing the boundaries of the rock format into new territory. Fuck you all, Sigur Ros fans.
:x
Fuckin' emokids :roll:
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goddamn FATSTERS
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Fuckin' emokids :roll:
My railing against how the use of "post-rock" has strayed from Reynolds' original concept is kinda like Tommydski's stance about the definition of emo.
I guess I wouldn't be annoyed about it if I liked more of what is called post-rock now and less of what used to be called that.
ANGER ABOUT GENRE TERMS = EXCELLENT USE OF EVERYONE'S TIME!!!
:wink:
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My railing against how the use of "post-rock" has strayed from Reynolds' original concept is kinda like Tommydski's stance about the definition of emo.
Well, actually, no, not really.
Adhering to the "original" definition of post-rock is you saying "I believe this one dude made up a genre term that will never change to fit the common usage". Are you Catholic by any chance?
I think we all need to remember what Constellation Records said about post-rock:
"This is our 'post-rock' -- a term that must be construed politically in equal measure to its referencing of some diffuse 'instrumental' or 'deconstructed' musical aesthetic. 'Indie rock' was never a genre and its bastardisation as an aesthetic category was one of countless elegant corporate-intellectual coups during the 1990s. Sadly, all too many hipper-than-now taste-makers were happily complicit, ready to replace 'indie' with 'post' and thus help extinguish any abiding concern about the economies that ground and contextualise rock music. So fuck post-rock, and the smooth untroubled consumption it enables."
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Oh, I love Constellation Records.
By the way, even Efrim Menuck refers to his band's music as post rock. It's a useful term for largely instrumental rock that focuses on the repetition of riffs and the use of guitars to produce unconventional sounds.
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Some bands I would consider post-rock that are very good and fun to listen to:
Maserati
My Dad Vs. Yours
Do Make Say Think
Moly
Aloha (although really they just get called post-rock 'cause they used to have a marimba player)
Russian Circles (okay they do rip Don Cab pretty hard sometimes but I still like 'em)
Laura (okay they do rip GY!BE pretty hard sometimes but I still like 'em)
Some bands I would consider post-rock that are terrible and boring and derivative:
This Will Destroy You
Let Airplanes Circle Overhead
Gregor Samsa (oh god emo and mogwai had a baby noooooooo)
Red Sparowes
Dear post-rock bands: stop ripping off Explosions in the Sky. Please.
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Gah, I definitely don't adhere to Reynolds' definition - that would make discussions impossible - I just wish the definition hadn't changed. I agree, post-rock is now a useful term for largely instrumental rock (this irony is what I was moaning about earlier, alongside how stale it all is...), but is there a replacement term for describing groups of people performing live music made largely using electronic sound sources? I don't know one. If post-rock does still include that stuff, then it's utterly marginalised.
I suppose there's "indietronica (http://www.last.fm/tag/indietronica/artists)" ... :cry:
I'll leave this alone now.
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How about electronica?
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Some bands I would consider post-rock that are terrible and boring and derivative:
Red Sparowes
Maybe it's just because I don't really know anything about post-rock, but I love Red Sparowes. Could people name some other bands that the Sparowes are derivative of...?
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Fuckin' emokids :roll:
My railing against how the use of "post-rock" has strayed from Reynolds' original concept is kinda like Tommydski's stance about the definition of emo.
I guess I wouldn't be annoyed about it if I liked more of what is called post-rock now and less of what used to be called that.
ANGER ABOUT GENRE TERMS = EXCELLENT USE OF EVERYONE'S TIME!!!
:wink:
Why in God's name are you replying seriously to what I said? Are you actually[/] an emokid? Because otherwise you need not apply.
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Some bands I would consider post-rock that are terrible and boring and derivative:
Red Sparowes
Maybe it's just because I don't really know anything about post-rock, but I love Red Sparowes. Could people name some other bands that the Sparowes are derivative of...?
I mainly hear a big EitS influence, but my main complaint with them (aside from the retarded song titles) is just how boring their music is. No surprises whatsoever.
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"No surprises" is pretty much how I would sum up the new EitS album. It's not bad, it makes for pleasant background music, and a couple tracks rise above the mediocre, but there are a LOT of moments on the album where I think "this exact thing has been done before, and better".
As I recently said to someone, ever since the last two proper Mono albums, EitS has been rendered somewhat unnecessary. It's like EitS cured the flu, and then the next day, Mono cured AIDS.
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I'm definetly favoring Mono over Eits at this point too. I'll always love Eits but Mono just takes things to a level above what Eits had done. I disagree with your comment on their new album though. I think it's their best by far. It's better orchestrated and expands their sound in new ways which I really enjoy. Now it's not as good as Mono's stuff, especially not the new one. Maybe better than "Walking Cloud..." in some respects but "You Are There" is far superior. Come to think of it, "One Step More and You Die" possibly for the sole reason of "Com(?)" and "Under the Pipal Tree" are also albums I prefer to a majority of Eits' stuff. And "Palmless Prayer/Mass Murder Refrain" sure is a beautiful album.
What emphasises this even more for me, however, is the live show. Eits is great live. Their music is much better I think, and they have tons of energy and their passion for their music is pretty much palpable. I also like how they don't stop playing for the whole show. Each song melds into the next. But Mono live is just stunning. Ear shatteringly loud and immensely energetic, Mono puts on a frickin' fantastic live show which would be a tragedy to miss. So not only do I prefer their album work, but live Mono is superior to Eits too.
As for Red Sparowes, I couldn't agree more with Jeph. I find them boring and uninteresting. I get tired of each song long before it's over. And I'm not the type to be easily bored by music. I loved Tarentel's "Big Black Square." But when it comes to Red Sparowes I can't help but dislike them.
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I just got the new Maserati album last night and I just want to go on record as saying "Wow." It is really fantastic. More psychedelic - at times they actually remind me of bands like U Melt and Soundtribe Sector 9 (in a good way). I could actually see the more experimental jam-band kids getting into it, many songs have that kind of groove factor that is missing from most post-rock. And it is good to hear more up-tempo stuff in the genre. I don't know if the whole car-name thing is a coincidence or intentional but there is more than a hint of Trans Am in what Maserati is doing.
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Yeah the new Maserati is one of my albums of the year, for sure. "Show Me the Season" is just killer. There's Rush and Hum and all sorts of other influences mixed into their stuff. Also they've got one of the most dynamic drummers I've heard in recent memory. Great all around!
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Sorry for arriving 25 posts late, but can anyone point me to a site where i can listen to some of Joan of Arc's work? I've been hearing alot about them since i first arrived to this forum, and would appreciate the help. thanks
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There's some tracks here (look on the sidebar on the right):
http://www.epitonic.com/index.jsp?refer=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.epitonic.com%2Fartists%2Fjoanofarc.html
Sorry, that's all I could find.
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Thanks, that should help.
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"No surprises" is pretty much how I would sum up the new EitS album. It's not bad, it makes for pleasant background music, and a couple tracks rise above the mediocre, but there are a LOT of moments on the album where I think "this exact thing has been done before, and better".
As I recently said to someone, ever since the last two proper Mono albums, EitS has been rendered somewhat unnecessary. It's like EitS cured the flu, and then the next day, Mono cured AIDS.
While Mono are quiet awesome, I find myself listening to EITS more, just because EITS have much more stuff going in there tunes, and because unlike every other Post Rock band out there they're actually quite fun to play on guitar.
Having said that, I'm listening to Halcyon (Beautiful Days) by Mono and damn, it's freaking awesome. Mono are better when you're in the mood, for sure, but you can put on EITS at any time and still enjoy them.
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Yndi Halda - from Canterbury, UK. Wonderful, wonderful music.