THESE FORUMS NOW CLOSED (read only)
Comic Discussion => QUESTIONABLE CONTENT => Topic started by: snoppyjanoppy on 18 Dec 2007, 16:03
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Just trying to stir up some conversation
:mrgreen:
I don't think so.
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Seriously fuck fat people.
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If you want to go right ahead. I don't want to be the one prying myself off the tremendous suction caused by a sweaty heaving abdomen.
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What do you mean by "last"? Get married, domicile together, and have 1.4 kids? No, nothing makes me think either are looking for anything that serious.
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It could. I don't see it ending anytime soon, but writers often like to mix things up when they feel something is getting stagnant.
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About how long have they been together, anyways?
And I think they will last for a while...not forever though. No way.
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Marten and Dora forever, but I also think marten needs a new sourse of conflict/drama/angst in his life.
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Marten and Dora forever, but I also think marten needs a new sourse of conflict/drama/angst in his life.
I can't speak for Jeph, but I sense the job will bring some hassles in the new year..
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I love Marten and Dora, they're perfect for one another, and I want to see them together for as long as the strip is around. Maybe even getting engaged this around this time next year.. and maybe if we're lucky that engagement could be enough to provoke Faye out of her stuper enough to realize that all the butting horns with Sven is just a way she shows she cares about him..
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I think Jeph is smart enough not to have to resort to that tired cliche in order to stir up conflict, at least not yet. Here's what I think will happen to stir up conflict:
* Amir and Natasha breaking up.
* Consequently, Deathmole breaking up.
* Hannahlore having more crazy mishaps fall in her lap.
* Raven coming back from Canada with something new to add to the strip.
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You guys should know that Jeph likes to suprise us... When it comes to how to imbue drama, he will likely try something that few people would really think of. Or, perhaps, drama could go on hiatus for a while and everyone's happy for a bit longer.
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Actually, it'll probably be revealed that Marten is still feeling things for Faye, and it's confusing him. That'll be the source of the comic's drama, I'm calling it.
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If they were real people, they strike me as the type to stay together for a while.
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Yeah. they will last.
at the pace that they age in the strip, their relationship will outlast Spiderman and Mary Jane. As well as Archie never deciding which girl to choose between Betty and Veronica. Hell, on that one, Id keep both too!!
More power to Archie!
Grimmy
wonders what it would take to be a serious boyfriend to a "raven" character.
(case in point, I dated a girl who was also "lacking in the common sense department" and it didnt work out.)
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I see 'em driving off into the sunset, à la Jesse Custer and Tulip.
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Actually, it'll probably be revealed that Marten is still feeling things for Faye, and it's confusing him. That'll be the source of the comic's drama, I'm calling it.
Actually, I think both Marten and Faye have unresolved feelings for each other...I dunno if they'll ever be resolved, but I wouldn't be surprised if their feelings for each other became the source of some future drama.
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Just think about the ramifications of a Dora, Marten break-up. Marten is no longer welcome at Coffee of Doom cutting him off from Penelope and Raven, as well as of course Dora. Faye could still work there but it would surely add tension to her friendships with both Marten and Dora. I suppose with enough time and an amicable break up Marten and Dora could work things out but that only seems to work in TV.
If Marten and Faye were to end up getting together I don't see how either could save any friendship with Dora, especially after how much Dora has worried about that very thing. Though it would be interesting to see where the strip would go after that.
All that being said, I hope Dora and Marten last. They seem good for each other.
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Yeah, the strip's "Great, Unresolved Plot Line" threads around Marten/Dora/Faye. I mean, Faye & Marten pretty much came right out and said "I'm crazy for you" during the infamous "Strip 500" arc, only to have Marten hook up with Dora right away. We've had some inklings of Faye's feelings over that (when she bitched to her shrink about how she's upset sometimes when the two are 'so happy together'), and even Dora's own angst (a near-forgotten strip where she talks to her cat and speaks of how insecure she still is), but nothing that's actually gone in-depth. I mean, there's SO MUCH untapped potential in that area.
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I'm sorry but I hate Marten and Dora. Their relationship has completely changed her whole tough-girl attitude and has made her really fragile, it seems. It's like she's completely changing herself for him, or maybe she's just happier and therefore acting different. I don't know, but anyhow, I still don't like them together. It just seems like their personalities are too different to work. I was fine with Dora being a minor character but lately I think she's become the centre of the comic.
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Just think about the ramifications of a Dora, Marten break-up. Marten is no longer welcome at Coffee of Doom cutting him off from Penelope and Raven, as well as of course Dora. Faye could still work there but it would surely add tension to her friendships with both Marten and Dora. I suppose with enough time and an amicable break up Marten and Dora could work things out but that only seems to work in TV.
Speak for yourself. I've managed to stay friends with all but one of my ex-girlfriends. From the way I see Marten and Dora, I think they'd both be able to maintain a solid friendship post-breakup as well.
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I'm friends with some of my exes, and not friends with others. You can totally break up with someone and remain friends.
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If you're not on good terms with most of your exes. you're doing it wrong.
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With the current storyline...
Do you think Dora would end the relationship out of fear of getting dumped?
It does happen, but will it happen here?
Grimmy
only broke up with one girl, and still feels bad about it.
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No.
I hated the match-up from the very beginning. I've been praying for them to break up ever since they kissed because they're just not right together. but whether I love or hate the relationship, I don't see it as lasting. Dora doesn't seem like the kind of person to last in a serious relationship in the first place. Marten, maybe, but hopefully not with Dora.
Also, I do like Dora. I just hate Dora being with Marten. It's... creepy. It's like Hannelore and Sven hooking up. It's just plain wrong. (Now that I've said that, Jeph will probably go and hook them up anyway, hahah.)
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Just gonna say...I find her whining like today to be kinda annoying. Probably because I see it happen a lot with one couple I know, and in real life it is the MOST uncomfortable thing to bear witness to. So I hope they don't last just so I don't have to see Dora freaking out like that any longer.
Otherwise I think she's a cool chick and have no problems with her.
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It wouldn't be something as simple as Dora and Marten breaking up then Marten and Faye hooking up. The timing would be more sinister...it would happen right when Faye hooked up with Sven. Then she would be caught between feelings, then something tragic would happen to pintsize and Dora would have to come fix him and Marten and Dora would hook back up right as Faye had decided to try to date Marten...and then it goes to one frame with Winslow having a bad guy mustache laughing maniacally with hanners who isn't really crazy she is just writing a book on relationships and controlling it the whole time.... and i need sleep...long tangents are fun
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I don't think its going to last.
I think in the end, Dora is going to break up with Marten, her insecurities about their relationship just driving to an apex. They're going to be reeling from it for a while, Dora is gonna take it harder than Marten, then it'll slowly build up to a just friends relationship again, but things will be a little weirder.
Of course I'm just describing one of my relationships from the similarities I'm seeing in the comic lately to my own experiences. :cry:
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I think it will work because they both equal in the relationship, if was Faye and Marten, Faye would be the in-charge of the relationship.
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They'll remain together for the time being. A year from now, though? I'm a bit skeptical. Not because they don't go well together (they really do seem happy together, and, at risk at getting shot here, they compliment eachother much[/b] better than Marten and Faye would. Dora's insecurities may well lead to the end of the relationship, but if so, it would be ridiculous to think that a relationship between Faye and Marten would work--Faye makes Dora look like the most self-assured person in the world.
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I definitely don't think Marten and Faye should end up together...but I absolutely agree that the insecurities of Dora are going to take a huge toll on the relationship. I mean, how often do we see Marten get all insecure and serious? Sometimes his feathers get ruffled, but he is always the one trying to pacify her :[
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I'm not too worried about Martin sabotaging their relationship, i think Dora will do it. She's keeps trying to ruin it with Martin because of her fear that Faye will pop out of the psychosis and steal him away.
If Faye woke up the next day in a good state of mind, it'd probably be two days before she had Martin under her powers. Not necessarily because of Faye, but because Dora will probably lose her mind, Martin will be thinking, I'm so happy for you! and of course Faye will take advantage of Doras knee jerk reaction to push Martin away due to lack of self confidence.
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I kind of see Dora dumping Martin in the future. These past strips have only illustrated Dora's insecurity, and her being in a relationship only magnifies it. She seems like a walking timebomb to me. Has anyone noticed that she keeps going off, for example, the haircut incident?
On the other hand, I really don't see Faye and Martin getting together either, I like them better as friends anyway.
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Dora's insecurity seems to run pretty deep, despite her outward self-assurance: see strip 293 for example.
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But if we put together Dora's comments to her cat:
1. The cat always suggests murder.
2. The cat isn't really talking to Dora, she projecting herself onto it.
:-o Has Marten jumped out the frying pan and into the fire? At least Faye just beat him up. If Dora thinks he's going to leave her, he might not make to strip 2000.
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Insecurities are normal for someone in a relationship. I don't think she's doing anything overboard that would drive Marty away, nor do I think she would break up with him because of her insecurities - they mean that she does NOT want to break up with him. So, if it's anything like reality, I don't think the insecurities are bad enough to make a bad toll on the relationship. At least, this is in my own experience, and I'm comparing it to reality. I guess in the context of a story, insecurities are maybe intended as foreshadowing instead of a normal thing in a relationship. I don't think they're that out of hand, really. If Marten would act a bit more jealous for some reason, they'd be pretty balanced.
I still want them to break up, though. I'm just saying, I think Dora's insecurities are normal in a healthy relationship. They're far and few apart; it's not like they're occurring every single time they're together. It's something I see in normal people who have been together for a time much longer than they have, and I don't see it as a reason to break up.
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I think Hanners is going to overcome her OCD and Steal Martin away from Dora so they can form a two person band that doesn't suck
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Quite honestly, I hate Dora now. And I think Marten should get the hell out of the relationship as soon as he can.
Dora's apologizing after her insecure spazz-outs isn't the QC-people-confess-quicker, she's covering. That part of her brain that sleeps the rest of the time suddenly kicks in with a "WAIT! If I antagonize him too much, he'll really leave me! OMGISORRYISORRY boohoohoo"
I mean, goddamn, Dora just bitched about Marten having girlfriends ten years ago on the other side of the fucking continent. Insecurity is one thing, this is fucking possession. It's not cute, it's not funny, and Marten should get the fuck out of there before it devolves into Dora bitching that he's spending too much time with anyone who's not her.
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I think Marten and Dora could possibly last...I remember reading somewhere that "soul-mates" are meant to look like one another...and so therefore an ideal couple comprises of two people who look exactly the same, just different gender (or same gender, if that's the way you are.) So by THAT token...hell yeah, Marten and Dora are going to be together for life.
That said, what I read could have just been new age mumbo jumbo, and may not apply to the world of ficitional characters.
I think they make a good couple. Will they be together forever and ever and ever and ever? I dunno. Trust seems to be an issue at the moment. But I guess we'll just have to wait and see.
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Yay me. I registered just so I could comment on this question.
I remember reading somewhere that "soul-mates" are meant to look like one another...and so therefore an ideal couple comprises of two people who look exactly the same, just different gender (or same gender, if that's the way you are.)
Just a quick comment on this first. I remember looking at the Mona Lisa either in some art class... or maybe it was a television program on the Discovery channel... but they compared her face to Leonardo da Vinci's face and pointed out how they looked the same, thus illustrating that you're really just attracted to yourself. :P
Okay, so... I'm of a mixed opinion when it comes to Marten and Dora.
Clearly, Dora has some issues. But we all do, so that's no surprise. What worries me is that she does seem to be a bit of a control freak. I mean, yeah, she's somewhat paranoid and rather insecure, but it does look like she's dealing with that somewhat. And that's definitely not grounds for "get the hell out OMG." I know I get stupid-paranoid, relationship or not. We've all got insecurities. And to boot, I hate conflict, so when something bad comes up, I'm prone to stewing and withdrawing until all Hell breaks loose. That being said, I at least know that I do that, which gives me the ability to recognize when it's happening and try to do something to break those trends. I think Dora's in the same boat. It just takes her longer to realize what she's doing. So I don't think that's grounds for a breakup, especially if she's actively trying to be less of a basket-case. :P
That being said, I don't know if I really like them as a couple. But I'm probably biased. I mean, they do seem pretty happy together when Dora's not having one of her little freak-out sessions, but seeing Dora get as bitchy as I have, I like her less and less. And the less I like her, the more I think Marten could do better. Granted, I'm one of those people who kind of always wanted to see Marten and Faye get together, but that's probably more because Faye reminds me a lot of myself (without the excessive drinking and punching people :P), and Marten reminds me of the boys I tend to be attracted to. So my subconscious would be really happy if they got together. But I don't know if that would be good for anyone.
In the scheme of this being a comic, it would probably be better for the story if Dora and Marten were to break up at some point, but, if we're just thinking of them as people and looking at them outside the context of it being for entertainment, then yeah, I could see Dora and Marten staying together. But I think Dora really needs to put forth some effort into figuring out WHY she's behaving the way she is, or at least recognizing it when it comes on so she can do something to counteract her negative impulses.
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I think Marten and Dora could possibly last...I remember reading somewhere that "soul-mates" are meant to look like one another...and so therefore an ideal couple comprises of two people who look exactly the same, just different gender (or same gender, if that's the way you are.) So by THAT token...hell yeah, Marten and Dora are going to be together for life.
What about different race? :( Hah, I do believe in soul mates, but not that they look like each other, considering my boyfriend being Asian and me being a redhead. Doesn't really work. Hahah. XD
But actually, the look-alike thing is creepy. It feels more like they're incestuous, as if they were brother and sister in a past life or something. Creepy. Don't like it. What happened to opposites attract?
Besides, if Dora had the chance, she'd totally date Marten's mom instead of him. She's only with him for a chance at his mom. I'M CEREAL, GUYSZ.
Okay, seriously now. I do absolutely HATE the Dora-Marten relationship, but I think Dora's insecurities are pretty normal. I think a lot of people, especially girls, do get these insecurities, and sometimes it's a phase. Some people are just really jealous. If Marten loves her and Dora loves him, that shouldn't hurt their relationship as long as she actually trusts him. Jealousy and trust are not the same thing, and little fights are healthy for a relationship. If they had NEVER had ANY problems whatsoever since they'd got together, I'd be getting pretty excited, because it would probably mean they weren't going to last. That kind of thing doesn't happen in a normal, happy, healthy relationship. Fighting and insecurities are NORMAL, and I don't think Dora's doing it all that often.
And you've got to admit, it would be really awkward for a minute after hearing that your boyfriend still has some feelings for a girl he dated before. Who wants their boyfriend to be thinking about past loves? It's not something to fight over, but it IS something that might give a girl a sad feeling in her heart for a few seconds. I'd say that's pretty normal, too.
EDIT - But I still want them to break up. The best breakup ever would be Marten catching Dora trying to coerce his mother into having sex with her. Seriously. I so want Dora to do something like that.
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I like Dora, she's cool, smart, realistic (usually) and she seems good to and with Marten, but I guess I was hooked long ago by Faye's mutual attraction with Marten. Indeed, I think they're so obviously well-matched that that became the reason Jeph didn't/couldn't hook them up. Sophisto-critics were posting "too obvious", "too trite" comments, and, admittedly, their tension is a potent dramatic fuel.
My subconscious would be pleased, too, if Marten and Faye get together. And I'll dare to theorize that someday in the far future, maybe something will happen to Dora and that will wrap up the grand QC arc.
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I think Hanners is going to overcome her OCD and Steal Martin away from Dora so they can form a two person band that doesn't suck
That would be awesome. They could name it, "The Band That Doesn't Suck"! I bet Hanners will come up with the name!
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Dora's getting into the age range for settling down. It might last because of that. On the other hand, what does she see in Marten? "He's a skinny indie dude" is not an adequate foundation for a lasting relationship.
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Dora's real problem, I suspect, is that while she really hasn't stolen Mwrten from Faye (you can't steal what someone else puts in the dumpster), she has done some relationship breaking in the past. Sven indicates this early on. "That's never stopped you before," he comments when she says she doesn't want to risk hurting Faye. Dora'd not be the first person to allow something she'd done in a past relationship ruin her current one. Hell, I know that, an' I don't even watch Ooprah.
If she can face her real guilt, Dora and Martrn will last. If she can't, Dora will likely break them up in penance for her past misdeed(s), even if she doesn;t realize she's doing so.
As for MArten, he seems to pretty much mean what he says. If Faye does get better, I don't see him dumping Dora for her. But I can see Dora dumping him to 'let him make a choice,' not acknowledging that at that point Maten won't have one. If that happens, Dora will insist everyone is welcome at CoD, which will have become her penitential cell. Maybe she can dig up a tawse from her kink closet and self-flagellate.
(Yeah, I know, but my subconscious wants me to misspell Martn, apparently. Ooprah, OTH, is intentional. Confusion to Oprah! Death to Phil! Pancakes for everyone!)
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If she can face her real guilt, Dora and Martrn will last. If she can't, Dora will likely break them up in penance for her past misdeed(s), even if she doesn;t realize she's doing so.
...my subconscious wants me to misspell Martn, apparently.
Deeper parts of our brains are doing things we aren't aware of (blind spots) or would even deny (denial) as we struggle with our inner (demons) shit.
Perhaps "soul-mates" looking alike, is some deep, ancient evolutionary mechanism at work, finding unexplainable but powerful comfort in a close genetic match... "You look like family! Let's be family!" (Or, as Miche said, maybe you're really just attracted to yourself...) :-)
[Marten and Dora] "...compliment each other much better than Marten and Faye would." I'd say Dora would complement almost anyone quite well. She's smart, well-balanced and -adjusted, realistic, knows what she wants and needs, seems loyal and honest, and knows to keep the power in the relationship approximately balanced; I think she's a keeper, and good for Marten.
That having been said, I still like Faye/Marten. Even though Faye would be in control (like she has been all along.) Many good relationships have the power on one side (we all learn how that works as children) - that's fine as long as both are ok with that. Sometimes that evens out somewhat over the long term, as the inhibited one matures.
So I think this is what dooms my naive polygyny fantasy - almost impossible to reach a stable power balance. I think it was Frank Herbert who said the triangle is the most unstable political structure. God, i miss him; why do the brilliant ones have to die? John Lennon, Frank Zappa, Philip K. Dick.
Edit: Department of Gender Studies: I think we have to ultimately admit men and women don't think and feel alike. I've always been all for equality, but sometimes Truth trumps our most fervent wishes. Just another case in point:
Male: "Dora just bitched about Marten having girlfriends ten years ago on the other side of the fucking continent. Insecurity is one thing, this is fucking possession."
Female: "u've got to admit, it would be really awkward for a minute after hearing that your boyfriend still has some feelings for a girl he dated before. Who wants their boyfriend to be thinking about past loves? It's not something to fight over, but it IS something that might give a girl a sad feeling in her heart for a few seconds."
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The tripod, Tomart. Herbert said the tripod is the most unstable political structure. A bit of a difference. A love triangle is actually pretty stable. That's why it's used to describe irresolvable romantic entanglements betwen three people—the idea is that the whole thing will never be resolved.
Never heard of a love tripod, although I'm sure some reader who's into bondage can tell us all about it.
Dune nut, Buffyverse analyst, Bloom county maniac, and now QC adict—where do my pop culture obsessions end?
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I used to think popular culture should be beneath us intellectuals. That was before Steppenwolf (the Hesse version) before someone's Popular Culture series on NPR, and before our subculture began begatting major feature films.
Of course, Britney, Tomkat, Bennifer and the like continue to be beneath us.
Love Dune and Bloom County, but I missed out on the Buffyverse; I only discovered Josh [edit: Joss] with Firefly. Should I go back now and experience BtVS at my age?
Oh, the topic, right. ...Yes, I see it lasting.
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Good lord, yes. You're never too old for Buffy. (The series, anyway.)
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Good lord, yes. You're never too old for Buffy. (The series, anyway.)
If you're lucky, you might be able to find the complete series (all seven seasons) in one box for a reasonable price. I bought mine at Costco a few years back for about $130.
If you've got the cash the spare, I would suggest it. Push yourself past the cheese and corn of the first season (and a little of the second). This series really expands and develops to a really well done series.
Edit: This is the box I'm referring to.
http://www.amazon.com/Buffy-Vampire-Slayer-Collectors-discs/dp/B000AQ68RI/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=dvd&qid=1202292950&sr=1-2 (http://www.amazon.com/Buffy-Vampire-Slayer-Collectors-discs/dp/B000AQ68RI/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=dvd&qid=1202292950&sr=1-2)
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I don't see why it couldn't. Marten, for all his inability to be truly assertive is generally an honest and truthful bloke - if he says something, he means it.
Dora has a few insecurities, but who doesn't?
I've seen people settle down with partners who really weren't right for them (or at least didn't seem that way from the outside). There's no reason that QC's resident black-tipped matchsticks couldn't do perfectly well together.
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Yeah. they will last.
at the pace that they age in the strip, their relationship will outlast Spiderman and Mary Jane. As well as Archie never deciding which girl to choose between Betty and Veronica. Hell, on that one, Id keep both too!!
More power to Archie!
Grimmy
wonders what it would take to be a serious boyfriend to a "raven" character.
(case in point, I dated a girl who was also "lacking in the common sense department" and it didnt work out.)
Uh, Spider-man kind of sold his marriage to Satan. Seriously, probably not the best comparison, there.
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Edit: Department of Gender Studies: I think we have to ultimately admit men and women don't think and feel alike. I've always been all for equality, but sometimes Truth trumps our most fervent wishes. Just another case in point:
Male: "Dora just bitched about Marten having girlfriends ten years ago on the other side of the fucking continent. Insecurity is one thing, this is fucking possession."
Female: "u've got to admit, it would be really awkward for a minute after hearing that your boyfriend still has some feelings for a girl he dated before. Who wants their boyfriend to be thinking about past loves? It's not something to fight over, but it IS something that might give a girl a sad feeling in her heart for a few seconds."
I wouldn't have made my post and case if the men in the relationships I know of broke up with their girlfriends when their girlfriends had insecurities. The guy in the relationship understands the insecurity, and most of them try to help the girl get over it. I've seen it cause small fights, but all relationships have small fights. It's normal. My post wasn't just about how the female feels about it - if the guy left the girl for being insecure at times, then I wouldn't have any case at all. Besides, the guys I know get insecure at times, too. That kind of breaks the whole male/female perspective thing. Looking in, one might think, "OH MY GOD insecurities they're going to break up," but in a real-life relationship, it just doesn't usually work like that, unless the insecurities are getting out of hand.
Still, a story and real-life are two different things. If Jeph allows them to have short fights and small insecurities, and yet doesn't make them break up over it, it's pretty realistic. If they do break up, then there are 3 possibilities: they're not realistic characters, they're not very good at holding relationships together and compromising, or maybe Dora will have gotten worse by that time. Dora's instances don't seem out-of-hand to me, they seem pretty normal for that stage of relationship.
Like I said, I'm going off of relationships I see around me, including my own. (Well, I'm long distance, so I guess I have a better reason to be temporarily insecure. I won't be much at all once I move in with him in a few months, but that's an entirely different story.) EVERYONE fights a little bit. It's totally natural. If they were married, it would be a little odd for Dora to be acting like this - but they're not married, they're in the "I like you - I love you - I want to be with you" sort of stage. Fighting and insecurities are COMMON in relationships like that. I've seen this in practically every long-term successful relationship around me - people have insecurities and people fight. It's NATURAL.
If Dora gets worse or more often, that might pose a problem. But I've only seen a few instances every so often, and in real life, that's kind of normal.
I hope I'm getting my point across well. Geh. Sorry, people. Maybe I'm just ranting and not making much sense. I hope I am.
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Just to be clear, I totally agree with you; I've been on both sides of that insecurities thing. It is natural, in that stage.
I was using your words to make a totally different point - that men and women still, in this day and age of supposed enlightenment, don't feel and think alike, and this still leads to misunderstandings.
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Supposed enlightenment. Hah!
I say this after enduring a month or so of my knuckle-draggin' relatives' (of both sexes, mind) opinions of, well, you can guess, and I don't want to start talking about that:
- Wemmins cain't think without them emotions gettin' in th' way
- Men ______s (fill it in) won't respect a woman
- Wemmins 'is too jealous-like (petty)
- Menses 're more level-headed (does this mean our skulls are flatter on top?)
I could go on, but me stomach is protesting,
To paraphrase a certain comedy show that I don't particularly like, sometimes I think we are so far from Supposed Enlightenment that the light from Supposed Enlightenment will take 100 years to reach us.
For the record, it seems to me that individuals have a hard enough time communicating, particularly when the subjects are repressed fears or insecurities to account for most misunderstandings, without sticking anything else in. Attributing misunderstandings to gender is very often either labeling culturally supported, imposed, and indoctrinated stereotypes as 'gender' differences, or just our propensity to try to impose a pleasing sort of order on observed phenomena. The Men/Mars Women/Venus thing, for example, is bullshit, but it's fun bullshit.
Also: So you see, Dr. Tomart, there is nothing you can post that I will not reply to.
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Many apologies if I offended with that last post. Thing is, if I say it to the folks whom I'd like to hear it, I'll get tarred and feathered. Virtual tarring and feathering sounds less painful and fatal. So slap it on, if you feel like it.
Also, I fervently hope now that when I next follow-up to one of Tomart's posts, my head doesn't explode.
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[Uh, Spider-man kind of sold his marriage to Satan. Seriously, probably not the best comparison, there.
Sorry to bring down the tone (which I'm findng intelligent and insightful), but what? Was that a weird storyline?
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My bad; I probly shouldn't expound on the touchy subject of sexual politics. I don't want anyone's head to explode on my account. Especially anyone intelligent and insightful.
On topic: Yes, I think it will last. |o_O/ They're both good people, good for each other, and the relationship keeps a Faye-tension going...
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I read about the Spiderman-Mephisto thing. My guess is it finally occurred to the Marble goons after their silly stunt had run it's course that unmasked Spidey = short-lived Spidey. So they pulled a Deus ex Machina to save their cash-cow. Only it was a Diabla ex machina. Is that better, somehow?
There would be a QC plot twist. The devil, or maybe Trent Reznor, offers to make Marten Dora's forever. But she has to listen to Shania Twain music exclusively, or the deal's off.
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I read about the Spiderman-Mephisto thing. My guess is it finally occurred to the Marble goons after their silly stunt had run it's course that unmasked Spidey = short-lived Spidey. So they pulled a Deus ex Machina to save their cash-cow. Only it was a Diabla ex machina. Is that better, somehow?
There would be a QC plot twist. The devil, or maybe Trent Reznor, offers to make Marten Dora's forever. But she has to listen to Shania Twain music exclusively, or the deal's off.
God, what a hideous fate. I'd rather just take my chances. I did wonder when I heard about the unmasking in Civil War. Spiderman making a deal with the devil does sound...odd. Did he have to lose Mary-Jane?
No, the plot twist will be a shattering blow to the QC world: Dora will die in a slightly suspicious manner. Faye will be accused of murdering her love rival. Marten, Hannelore and Sven will fight to clear her name.
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It's complicated, and it in the actual Spider-man continuity.
http://www.i-mockery.com/comics/longbox22/default.php
That's the whole thing, with it getting taunted and whatnot.
To put it in basic terms, Aunt May got shot by a bullet meant for Spidey. Spidey felt all sad about it, and tried to find a way to help her. He found none. Mephisto, who is Marvel's version of Satan essentially, shows up to help him. He will save May's life in exchange for his marriage.
Spidey and Jane talk it over, and they agree. May is saved, Spider-man never married Mary Jane, all those fancy upgrades he got in "The Other" are gone, and nobody remembers Spider-man's identity anymore. As in, they seriously just forgot who the hell he was. He still un-masked during Civil War, but nobody remembers who was under the mask. Nobody questions this.
It's basically the worst storyline since The Clone Saga.
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Marvel just killed a bit of my childhood.
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Edit: Department of Gender Studies: I think we have to ultimately admit men and women don't think and feel alike. I've always been all for equality, but sometimes Truth trumps our most fervent wishes. Just another case in point:
Male: "Dora just bitched about Marten having girlfriends ten years ago on the other side of the fucking continent. Insecurity is one thing, this is fucking possession."
Female: "u've got to admit, it would be really awkward for a minute after hearing that your boyfriend still has some feelings for a girl he dated before. Who wants their boyfriend to be thinking about past loves? It's not something to fight over, but it IS something that might give a girl a sad feeling in her heart for a few seconds."
I wouldn't have made my post and case if the men in the relationships I know of broke up with their girlfriends when their girlfriends had insecurities. The guy in the relationship understands the insecurity, and most of them try to help the girl get over it. I've seen it cause small fights, but all relationships have small fights. It's normal. My post wasn't just about how the female feels about it - if the guy left the girl for being insecure at times, then I wouldn't have any case at all. Besides, the guys I know get insecure at times, too. That kind of breaks the whole male/female perspective thing. Looking in, one might think, "OH MY GOD insecurities they're going to break up," but in a real-life relationship, it just doesn't usually work like that, unless the insecurities are getting out of hand.
Still, a story and real-life are two different things. If Jeph allows them to have short fights and small insecurities, and yet doesn't make them break up over it, it's pretty realistic. If they do break up, then there are 3 possibilities: they're not realistic characters, they're not very good at holding relationships together and compromising, or maybe Dora will have gotten worse by that time. Dora's instances don't seem out-of-hand to me, they seem pretty normal for that stage of relationship.
Like I said, I'm going off of relationships I see around me, including my own. (Well, I'm long distance, so I guess I have a better reason to be temporarily insecure. I won't be much at all once I move in with him in a few months, but that's an entirely different story.) EVERYONE fights a little bit. It's totally natural. If they were married, it would be a little odd for Dora to be acting like this - but they're not married, they're in the "I like you - I love you - I want to be with you" sort of stage. Fighting and insecurities are COMMON in relationships like that. I've seen this in practically every long-term successful relationship around me - people have insecurities and people fight. It's NATURAL.
If Dora gets worse or more often, that might pose a problem. But I've only seen a few instances every so often, and in real life, that's kind of normal.
I hope I'm getting my point across well. Geh. Sorry, people. Maybe I'm just ranting and not making much sense. I hope I am.
you make total sense.
a couple that doesn't have little arguments and fights over insecurities is a couple doomed to fail. part of developing trust is allowing yourself to be vulnerable and allowing your partner to be vulnerable. without doing that, how would anyone know what their partner's limits are? how would anyone be able to HELP their partner strengthen without knowing about where they squeak and crack?
of course, marten and dora's conflict was waaaayyyyy too perfect. i wish all my arguments could fit in 4-5 panels :laugh:
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nobody remembers Spider-man's identity anymore.
I'm really wondering about Venom in that case. "Huh, I was bonded to someone for a year...it was how I got to Earth in the first place....damn, who was it?"
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Rocketman, you're assuming they're, like, thinking at Marble. That nonproductive behavior hasn't gone on since Jim Shooter left. Why're you and I reading QC and not drooling over our latest copy of Whoever that is, The Amazing Spiderman. Cuz Jeph does think.
In fact, I'm pretty sure he often thinks, "Man, these people in the forums need lives. I mean, lookit this whacko who's counting character appearance."
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Rocketman, you're assuming they're, like, thinking at Marble. That nonproductive behavior hasn't gone on since Jim Shooter left. Why're you and I reading QC and not drooling over our latest copy of Whoever that is, The Amazing Spiderman. Cuz Jeph does think.
In fact, I'm pretty sure he often thinks, "Man, these people in the forums need lives. I mean, lookit this whacko who's counting character appearance."
"And the one writing a metatextual crisis for a character who was only in eight strips? Why do we let these people in?"
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Rocketman, you're assuming they're, like, thinking at Marble. That nonproductive behavior hasn't gone on since Jim Shooter left. Why're you and I reading QC and not drooling over our latest copy of Whoever that is, The Amazing Spiderman. Cuz Jeph does think.
In fact, I'm pretty sure he often thinks, "Man, these people in the forums need lives. I mean, lookit this whacko who's counting character appearance."
"And the one writing a metatextual crisis for a character who was only in eight strips? Why do we let these people in?"
I'm sure Jeph, like the rest of us, realises that the best kind of love is that obsessive, compulsive stalkerish love that only QC readers know so well. Well...QC lovers and stalkers. But let's stick with the QC lovers for now.
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Yeah, I sometimes speculate on Jeph's thoughts... (Magic Trolley goes past)
"Some of these forumites need lives. But I'm glad that guy's counting character appearances, so I don't have to. As soon as he's done, I'll take an obscure, minor character that isn't even on the cast page, like Beatrice Chatham, ha! and make her queen for awhile..."
"Hmm, I now realize the best kind of love is that OCD kind."
"And the best kind of crisis is that metatextual kind..."
"Cristi, tell me again, why do we let these people in?"
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Yeah, I sometimes speculate on Jeph's thoughts... (Magic Trolley goes past)
"Some of these forumites need lives. But I'm glad that guy's counting character appearances, so I don't have to. As soon as he's done, I'll take an obscure, minor character that isn't even on the cast page, like Beatrice Chatham, ha! and make her queen for awhile..."
"Hmm, I now realize the best kind of love is that OCD kind."
"And the best kind of crisis is that metatextual kind..."
"Cristi, tell me again, why do we let these people in?"
"Cristi! They're surrounding the house again! Get the rifle!"
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"Cristi! They're surrounding the house again! Get the rifle!"
"I told you putting stuff on the internet would only lead to this! Aim for the head! They're only internet types, it's not like they're real people!"
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Rocketman, you're assuming they're, like, thinking at Marble. That nonproductive behavior hasn't gone on since Jim Shooter left. Why're you and I reading QC and not drooling over our latest copy of Whoever that is, The Amazing Spiderman. Cuz Jeph does think.
I read Ultimate Spider-Man, does that count? :-P
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Dunno. Do you salivate as you read it?
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Dunno. Do you salivate as you read it?
Depends if Black Cat is in that issue.
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I don't see them lasting which is not to say they won't last for a long time I just don't see them staying together and getting married, etc.
Their relationship wasn't born out of the most ideal of circumstances and there's still unresolved emotional issues between Faye and Marty. Of course he still has some residual feelings for Faye, you can't just switch them off because you got shot down.
Although someone mentioned it earlier, it would seriously mess with the dynamic of the characters because their lives revolve around each other so much. They would have to have a fairly decent, amicable breakup that allowed them to be friends or at least tolerate each other well enough. Which would mean no cheating took place or anything of a highly volatile nature.. unless Faye's gonna get a new job and Dora becames a seriously minor character.
I think they'll be together a while but somethin' will happen to stir it up.
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With the current relevations, it's possible that they will stick together with Faye, potentially being off the market.
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Edit: Department of Gender Studies: I think we have to ultimately admit men and women don't think and feel alike. I've always been all for equality, but sometimes Truth trumps our most fervent wishes. Just another case in point:
Male: "Dora just bitched about Marten having girlfriends ten years ago on the other side of the fucking continent. Insecurity is one thing, this is fucking possession."
Female: "u've got to admit, it would be really awkward for a minute after hearing that your boyfriend still has some feelings for a girl he dated before. Who wants their boyfriend to be thinking about past loves? It's not something to fight over, but it IS something that might give a girl a sad feeling in her heart for a few seconds."
I wouldn't have made my post and case if the men in the relationships I know of broke up with their girlfriends when their girlfriends had insecurities. The guy in the relationship understands the insecurity, and most of them try to help the girl get over it. I've seen it cause small fights, but all relationships have small fights. It's normal. My post wasn't just about how the female feels about it - if the guy left the girl for being insecure at times, then I wouldn't have any case at all. Besides, the guys I know get insecure at times, too. That kind of breaks the whole male/female perspective thing. Looking in, one might think, "OH MY GOD insecurities they're going to break up," but in a real-life relationship, it just doesn't usually work like that, unless the insecurities are getting out of hand.
Still, a story and real-life are two different things. If Jeph allows them to have short fights and small insecurities, and yet doesn't make them break up over it, it's pretty realistic. If they do break up, then there are 3 possibilities: they're not realistic characters, they're not very good at holding relationships together and compromising, or maybe Dora will have gotten worse by that time. Dora's instances don't seem out-of-hand to me, they seem pretty normal for that stage of relationship.
Like I said, I'm going off of relationships I see around me, including my own. (Well, I'm long distance, so I guess I have a better reason to be temporarily insecure. I won't be much at all once I move in with him in a few months, but that's an entirely different story.) EVERYONE fights a little bit. It's totally natural. If they were married, it would be a little odd for Dora to be acting like this - but they're not married, they're in the "I like you - I love you - I want to be with you" sort of stage. Fighting and insecurities are COMMON in relationships like that. I've seen this in practically every long-term successful relationship around me - people have insecurities and people fight. It's NATURAL.
If Dora gets worse or more often, that might pose a problem. But I've only seen a few instances every so often, and in real life, that's kind of normal.
I hope I'm getting my point across well. Geh. Sorry, people. Maybe I'm just ranting and not making much sense. I hope I am.
you make total sense.
a couple that doesn't have little arguments and fights over insecurities is a couple doomed to fail. part of developing trust is allowing yourself to be vulnerable and allowing your partner to be vulnerable. without doing that, how would anyone know what their partner's limits are? how would anyone be able to HELP their partner strengthen without knowing about where they squeak and crack?
of course, marten and dora's conflict was waaaayyyyy too perfect. i wish all my arguments could fit in 4-5 panels :laugh:
Right you are but remember: It's a webcomic. It's part of the Internet. All that is internet works under a few rules. One of which is:
If it is too good to be true, then it is too good to be true.
Also there is another fact to ponder: nowadays there are no more couples that last a lifetime. I think a couple is lucky if they get past a year.
So I guess we should wait and see.
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This may sound like me starting a fight, but I assure you it's not.
I can't help but wonder how many people here really don't see Marten/Dora lasting, and how many people are really just still pining over Marty/Faye, and expressing what they hope will ha[ppen in the hope of mentally convincing Jeph to go that route.
As for the Spiderman thing above.
I knew I made the right choice when I stopped reading most major american comics. Jeeze! I knew that Quesade hated the fact that Peter actually grew up and got married, but this...what the hell is this!?
This is almost up there with DC's caving to H.E.A.T.'s demands in terms of bad/stupid decisions.
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I think there's still people who stay together for years. It's probably wrong to think "Well that's Marten and Dora sorted forever" but they seem stable. Even the potential drama to come may not rock them too much. It probably will to a some interesting degree, though.
Re: Spiderman, I read the I-Mockery piece. I'm not even that much into comics and I think it was bad to the power of awful. Explains reations like this. (http://www.somethingpositive.net/sp02122008.shtml)
On the other hand, I discovered I-Mockery.
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Also there is another fact to ponder: nowadays there are no more couples that last a lifetime. I think a couple is lucky if they get past a year.
'No' couples last a lifetime? Are you really that pessimistic? That's just not true. Not every marriage ends in divorce, our society hasn't got that rubbish at commitment just yet.
And to the question...
I think that Dora and Marten will stay together for a while, although things might get a bit rocky. I reckon Marten will get a bit mopey about the fact that Sven and Faye are together when/if they find out, but he'll want to stay with Dora. And even if Dora tries to break up with his so that he can have the choice I think he'll stay with her because he said he would, and I believe Marten (unlike most people... strange that. I have more faith in a cartoon character than a human...).
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Don't blame the high school smartass for saying what he sees.
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Some of these posts have me thinking of the lyrics for "The Things We Do for Love" http://www.lyricsdomain.com/27/10cc/the_things_we_do_for_love.html (http://www.lyricsdomain.com/27/10cc/the_things_we_do_for_love.html), but I think they're essentially correct, with one caveat: Dora and Marten, if they can survive this latest bit of drama, will last. It's going to test some basic problems of both: Marten's ability to get past any natural resentment he's going to feel (and, by extension, did Marten really 'settle' for Dora? I don't think so; I think he'd have thrown Faye over for Dora eventually. But whadda I know?) and Dora's getting past her massive insecurities (any girl who freaks about her boyfriend's new haircut like Dora did, she has them).
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I think not. Dora's crazy about him, but she's also crazy in general. She freaks out too easily, and while she lets Marten draw on her back, I think that she's still going to accidentally find another reason to get hysterical.
Especially with this new development. I predict that Marten will try to comfort Faye, and Dora's going to go nuts (both at Sven for sleeping with Faye, and Marten for trying really hard to make antoher girl feel a lot better about herself). If it manages to last through this, though, then my god, Dora's got the willpower of a saint.
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And even if Dora tries to break up with him so that he can have the choice...
Dora'd do that? The girl who jumped him two days after he was "pre-dumped" by Faye?
I don't see it. She wants Marten, she *has* Marten, and with her insecurities, any hint of Marten/Faye right now is just gonna make her hold on tighter.
Which could itself lead to a break-up.
Y'know, when Dora finds out--once she's convinced that Sven's not being sleazy about it--her biggest disappointment is going to be this:
No possibility of any *Faye/Dora* action. She likes girls, too. Especially *this* girl, if I don't miss my guess. Nice friendly Dora/Marten/Faye three-way shot down.
Not sure if Jeph would want to write on-screen poly anyway...
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Ah, but you forget, cwoolard, that Dora is often 'too nice for her own good." I can see her bowing out, especially if she thought it would make Marten happy.
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Y'know, when Dora finds out--once she's convinced that Sven's not being sleazy about it--her biggest disappointment is going to be this:
No possibility of any *Faye/Dora* action. She likes girls, too. Especially *this* girl, if I don't miss my guess.
That was my thought (http://forums.questionablecontent.net/index.php/topic,19310.0.html) as well. I'm wondering if it's happened before - Dora pissed because Sven 'got' a girl that Dora wanted. It would help explain Sven's "oh shit, she really WOULD kill me" comment.
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I can't help but wonder how many people here really don't see Marten/Dora lasting, and how many people are really just still pining over Marty/Faye, and expressing what they hope will ha[ppen in the hope of mentally convincing Jeph to go that route.
I sorta fit the bill for both. I really want Marten/Faye (again, how would one shorten that? Maye? Farten? Fayten?) to come to fruition at last, but I honestly think that Marten will try to comfort Faye to the point that Dora goes berserk and does something everybody's going to regret.
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Do not shorten!
:-oCouple Portmanteau = DO NOT WANT! :-o
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:-o
*Runs screaming from the forum*
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crawls in a corner in fetal position, mumbling insanely...
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Harsh but fair, raoullefere. We must hold back the madness from the WCT. :laugh:
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Ah, but you forget, cwoolard, that Dora is often 'too nice for her own good." I can see her bowing out, especially if she thought it would make Marten happy.
My thoughts exactly.
I could see Dora breaking up for Marten, and what I think or hope will happen, is that Faye and Marten still won't get together, and Dora will realize Marten actually likes her and isn't just settling.
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You know what? I don't see it working out because Dora is apparently 99% crazy. By volume.
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Come to think of it, is there any lady in the cast who ISN'T nuts? Maybe Raven, but she's an idiot. Or a sociopathic mastermind, but then that goes back to the first point. :-P
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the bigger question should be, how long till pintsize gets a girl
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In light of recent strips, anyone want to change their poll answer?
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^Boom: Or another pink boy robot.
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I say few days left to their couple!
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I can't help but wonder how many people here really don't see Marten/Dora lasting, and how many people are really just still pining over Marty/Faye, and expressing what they hope will ha[ppen in the hope of mentally convincing Jeph to go that route.
Well I don't see Marten/Dora lasting, but it's more due to my dislike of Dora than any hopes of Marten/Faye. I'm not sure if that's better or worse reasoning...
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You know, I wonder how long it's going to take Penelope to get fired after she complains that Dora's not helping her "not all girls are crazy" thesis.
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Come to think of it, is there any lady in the cast who ISN'T nuts? Maybe Raven, but she's an idiot. Or a sociopathic mastermind, but then that goes back to the first point. :-P
Dora's mother for a start. Meena seems okay. Despite, er, some bad decisions in the past.
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Penelope seems reasonably stable.
For a girl.
:flee:
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I love Marten and Dora together. I really hope Jeph doesn't take them apart.
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Penelope seems reasonably stable.
She's one of my favorite characters, actually. Partially because of how she ended up working there. :P
And I think that Dora is going to settle down before too long. Especially if she ends up having a real conversation with Penelope.
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Dora may have to talk with Pen, if only because there's no one left. Maybe now we can find out why Penelope is the "bitterest girl on Earth", as well as calming Dora down so that she and Marten can work things out.
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Not sure if Jeph would want to write on-screen poly anyway...
Nah, that would violate the monogamy clause of the Marten/Dora relationship. Which both of them agree with.
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Does that also mean that Marten's *never* going to pee on Dora? Darn.
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please, no more watersport references...
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Are you implying that watersport references have jumped the shark?
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:rimshot: (b'dum, tish.)
For terrible puns we're we're imposing waterboarding.
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And now it's torture.
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Actually, it'll probably be revealed that Marten is still feeling things for Faye, and it's confusing him. That'll be the source of the comic's drama, I'm calling it.
I totally see that. I'm calling it too.
To answer the original question, I don't think they will last forever, but a while longer at least. Although who knows what Monday's comic will bring!
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Actually, it'll probably be revealed that Marten is still feeling things for Faye, and it's confusing him. That'll be the source of the comic's drama, I'm calling it.
I totally see that. I'm calling it too.
I'll see your "Marten is still feeling things for Faye" and raise "That feeling is probably mutual".
They might last a couple more months (real time), but they're heading into rough seas. I can see next week going 3 ways:
1. Dora gets even more pissed off at Marten's drunken attempt at patching things up. Messy breakup soon to follow.
2. She's as drunk and remorseful as he is, "I'm sorry" "No, I'm sorry" for a while. Possibly a make-up, but they don't get back to where they were.
3. We get to see what happened at the CoD while they were at the bar, possibly learning where her insecurities came from.
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I hope no one has mentioned this before, but I can't help but think about how Jeph said that QC had only spanned about 6 months in story time (maybe pushing 9 months by now?).
My point? Well, usually it takes longer than that for a couple to decide to get married. And since the Dora/Marten relationship only started a little while ago in the greater scheme of things, they have a long way to go before they decide to do it. (Not to mention that neither one of them seems to even desire marriage to anyone until further notice)
So, it'd be a huge commitment for Jeph to develop this relationship long enough to lead to something like that. And would it be worth it? It'd take awhile to know for sure, and by awhile I mean at least a year in real time, if not two or more. I expect there will be more drama before that, of the relationship-ending kind, even, although I have enough confidence in Jeph to expect that it won't end up looking like a season of Friends. (in this case, I mean a breakup and subsequent hookups with the sole purpose of convincing the reader that the two "always loved eachother" :P )
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So, seeing as any one who's caught up knows, dora and martin broke up. however, i think jeph should bring back padma. have a padma-marten relationship
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Wow, what a Necro.
Would people PLEASE stop calling him Martin, I'm starting to develop a pet peeve.
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What we need is a character named Martin. Then people will have to spell Marten correctly.
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So, seeing as any one who's caught up knows, dora and martin broke up. however, i think jeph should bring back padma. have a padma-marten relationship
The post suggests you haven't yet read the rules, particularly the one against shipping. Among other things, the guy who owns the site, who hosts the forum for us, really dislikes anyone suggesting where he should take his characters. The post also suggests you haven't looked at the Public Spelling Announcement. Please read the rules, look around the forum to see what people are writing, how they're reacting, and get a feeling for the atmosphere here.
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Come to think of it, there's no clear reason for this thread to be open.
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I agree.