THESE FORUMS NOW CLOSED (read only)
Comic Discussion => QUESTIONABLE CONTENT => Topic started by: sterlingdragon on 14 Jun 2010, 13:27
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Perhaps Pen-Pen has a serious case of MPD, and goes around masquerading as Pizza Girl...AND The Vespavenger.
BUT WAIT! There's more...
Perhaps she is also Sara, who was thought to have been eaten by a dinosaur!
And she is the eyeglasses worker, seen in episode 275: Homeless Hipsters!
And she's Natasha!
And just about every other blonde who's appeared in the comic!
:D
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Or she could be a time traveller who is every blonde in every work of fiction ever.
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Or she could be a time traveller who is every blonde in every work of fiction ever.
Penelope confirmed as Rose Tyler.
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We've never seen any of those together at the same time ...
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Or she could be a time traveller who is every blonde in every work of fiction ever.
Penelope confirmed as Rose Tyler.
Nah, Pen-Pen's teeth don't precede her into a room. :wink:
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It all makes sense now! The question is, how long until the comic where she shifts personalities mid-conversation? Or mid having sex with Wil? She's all moaning when suddenly she shouts out "Oh Wil, deliver my pizza!"
AND THEN THEY ALL FUCKED!
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She's a Cylon.
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If she has many identities and costumes, is that mass-querading?
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She is the allosaurus.
It takes on the characteristics of whoever it last ate.
Mostly blondes, apparantly!
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Or she could be a time traveller who is every blonde in every work of fiction ever.
Penelope confirmed as Rose Tyler.
C'mon, she can be a pain, but Penelope's not that whiny.
She is the allosaurus.
I find myself wondering what Lennon would think of that.
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She actually is an antelope. Or, more accurately, an antelope-derived humanoid developed by Hannerdad because he was bored one afternoon. She's actually only seven years old but due to the forced ageing and false memories, she's only subconsciously aware of this, but it makes her cranky anyways. Also, as an ungulate, she only has a life expectancy of thirty to thirty-five years, which will be tragic for Wil eventually, but drastically improve his poetry to the point he can actually make a living off of it. He just won't want to.
On second thought, maybe this should go in the jumping the shark thread?
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Or she could be a time traveller who is every blonde in every work of fiction ever.
Penelope confirmed as Rose Tyler.
C'mon, she can be a pain, but Penelope's not that whiny.
She is the allosaurus.
I find myself wondering what Lennon would think of that.
Koo-koo-ca-choo, I'd reckon.
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Actually, that was Paul Simon (in "Mrs. Robinson"). Lennon said "goo goo goo joob." Which, I suppose, shows what lots of drugs and smartass English masters will do for you.
She actually is an antelope. Or, more accurately, an antelope-derived humanoid developed by Hannerdad because he was bored one afternoon. She's actually only seven years old but due to the forced ageing and false memories, she's only subconsciously aware of this, but it makes her cranky anyways. Also, as an ungulate, she only has a life expectancy of thirty to thirty-five years, which will be tragic for Wil eventually, but drastically improve his poetry to the point he can actually make a living off of it. He just won't want to.
On second thought, maybe this should go in the jumping the shark thread?
<trying furiously to stop his hair from standing on end> MAYBE IT SHOULD!
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i have a much more reasonable theory:
penelope is sarah, but no plastic surgery or costumes or shapeshifting was necessary. the other characters simply did not recognize her due to jeph's drastically improved illustrative skills between her last appearance as sarah and her first as penelope.
qc can be very meta.
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and i don't think sarah was blonde or wore glasses either, J
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Sara was blonde but didn't wear glasses. Perhaps she was wearing contacts.
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[...]
qc can be very meta.
Why do I keep thinking of this (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=316)? ;-)
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Penelope confirmed as Rose Tyler.
Nah... Penelope doesn't wear a kilo of eye makeup.
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not that you know of
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not that you know of
I'm a girl. We notice these things... :angel:
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Then explain Lady Gaga
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she's an artist who makes catchy music?
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She gets banned from baseball games for wearing revealing clothing and sexing up the home team?
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How did we go from Penelope to Lady Gaga?
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Then explain Lady Gaga
Lady Gaga may wear a lot of eye makeup, but she knows she does.
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We've never seen Pennelope and Lady Gaga together.
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Dammit, she's schmoozing herself into everywhere!
Gaaagaaaaaaa!!!!!!!!!!!!!
(I just realized how infantile shouting that would make one sound. Chalk another win up to LG.)
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Penelope is Tai
and they're both Momo's human form. they're interchangeable
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She is a Founder
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Penelope is Tai
and they're both Momo's human form. they're interchangeable
Not possible, they've been in the same room at the same time.
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one of them is a remote controlled exosuit
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That would have to be Penelope, since Tai is the smaller of the two.
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You are completely disregarding the possibility that BOTH are powered exoskeletons for Arkellian princesses.
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Put a roach in front of them, see what happens.
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And watch out for men in black suits.
*FLASH*
Huh?
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If she has many identities and costumes, is that mass-querading?
ROTFL
Now that was a really great one :-D :-D :-D
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We also have to take into account Penelope's Homeric namesake. Think about it: she remains faithfully behind while her lover goes off on a voyage of self-understanding.
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I won't, and you can't make me.
Anyway, my infantile tendencies aside, comparing Wil's journey to the Odyssey is stretching things a teeny bit. After all, I think Odysseus pretty much knew himself from the start (didn't want to leave, clever bastard, would do anything to get home). Too, we haven't seen Penelope weaving, keeping her legs crossed, or refusing marriage proposals from a hundred-odd men while Wil was gone.
On the other hand, she is bloody stubborn, an observation that I'm sure was made by more than one of the Suitors.
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All we hear is...
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Yeah, I guess it's a tenuous theory. The only incontrovertible parallel QC has with classical Greece is ubiquitous homosexuality.
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All we hear is...
Radio Gaga....
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Yeah, I guess it's a tenuous theory. The only incontrovertible parallel QC has with classical Greece is ubiquitous homosexuality.
Ubiquitous? I haven't counted, but the proportion seems to be about the same as IRL. You know, the "1 in 10" thing that's spouted all the time (but may well be incorrect, thank you, Dr. Kinsey).
On the guy side you have Marten's dad, Maurice (if you choose to count him - he's more of a half-character as he was there as a foil), and Marten's old boss. On the hetero side, you have Marten, Steve, Wil, Sven, Angus, Mr. Bianchi, Dave (? Meena's hubby), that trustee from the copy room incident, and ntil we know more about him I'm going to count Dale. OK, so that's closer to 20%, but still...
Females? You have Tai. There are the other lesbians from her dorm (Brandi?), but again they're more like half-characters, having rare appearances with no real development. I guess you could also count Dora as another half lesbian? And that leaves us Faye, Hannelore, Raven, Penelope, Sarah (who wanted to ask Marten out), Meena, Victoria Vance, Mrs. Bianchi, Ellen, Cossette,... oh god, just trying to count the female characters is giving me a headache. Oh yeah, and Dora counts as a half character on the straight side!
So really, ubiquitous? I think you're suffering from something that a lot of straight people suffer from. Due to a lack of exposure to homosexuality (or a lack of acknowledgment of it), when you finally spend some time around someone who's homosexual, it seems that the entire world has the gay. And lately, we've been spending a good bit of time with Tai. Well, she's been in the room.
One of the funnier things that happens when you spend time with gay people is that you find out a lot of the people you didn't think were gay, really are! I've unfortunately been attending quite a few funerals recently (parents of friends), and I've found out a lot more about this town than I ever wanted to know... there's something about a funeral that brings out every little piece of "dirt" about the entire extended family. My recent favorite involved the matriarch of a family of eight, and all five of the sons are closeted homosexuals, prominent in the community. While two of them stayed single, the other three married, had children, later divorced... one of them was married to a lesbian friend of mine who caused quite a scandal when she came out after the divorce!
Ahh, fun times...
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The other aspect of QC that may make it seem like gay characters are prominent is their easy acceptance. With one exception, no one, so far, seems to be hiding (well, Marten's dad, but that's done and gone before the strip starts) their orientation, and no one seems to be upset by said either. Maybe that's the way it is up Nawth. Tip of the hat to Jeph for having the one character who does seem a little in the closet to be Faye's sister. Her mother's reaction is fairly typical, too, of those I've known; what we haven't got is the community's reaction. In some cases, ostracism is putting it mildly. Anyone read about the lesbian girl in north Mississippi a few months ago? Wanted to go to her senior prom with the person she was dating, a girl, natch, and the school canceled the entire fucking prom to keep the other kids from having to see that horror. And, well, there's <a href="http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/04/05/constance-mcmillen-fake-p_n_525856.html
">more[/url].
As for the Ancient Greeks, it sounds to me that, like many people, you've a limited understanding of exactly what was going on. Homosexuality was certainly not the path to instant pariahood it can be in the U.S., but it was much like pot in the Netherlands—okay in certain designated places, and used in certain ways, but not universally accepted. I'll add that Ancient Greece does not seem to have been a good place and time to be a lesbian.
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Well, except for the isle of Lesbos.
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Sounds like someone needs that greeting card Tai was talking about...
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That should have been universally acceptable. And I've never been clear if Lesbos was really a lesbian paradise or not, Sappho notwithstanding. I know the locals now aren't too fond of the connotations the rest of the world hangs on the noun 'Lesbian.'
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Some say she can change her fingerprints at will, and that the only reason she's still in the comic is because she draws herself in.
All we know is, she's called The Stig Penelope.
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Our tame librarian,
The Stig Penelope.
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I'll add that Ancient Greece does not seem to have been a good place and time to be a lesbian.
Ancient Greece wasn't a good place and time to be a woman, full stop. Pretty much all cultures treat women as inferior beings, but the Ancient Greeks regarded us as not quite human.
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you're painting with a pretty wide brush there
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I'll add that Ancient Greece does not seem to have been a good place and time to be a lesbian.
Ancient Greece wasn't a good place and time to be a woman, full stop. Pretty much all cultures treat women as inferior beings, but the Ancient Greeks regarded us as not quite human.
And, by the same basis, all women see themselves as superior beings to us menfolk.
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Pretty much all cultures treat women as inferior beings,
And, by the same basis, all women see themselves as superior beings to us menfolk.
I'm going to be the first to point out that these comments are both flawed in the exact same way.
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Pretty much all cultures treat women as inferior beings,
And, by the same basis, all women see themselves as superior beings to us menfolk.
I'm going to be the first to point out that these comments are both flawed in the exact same way.
That was exactly my point.
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you're painting with a pretty wide brush there
No, Akima's point was pretty much accurate.
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And, by the same basis, all women see themselves as superior beings to us menfolk.
Please note than I did not address my remark to individuals. I make no claims about the individual opinions of men or women, which can be equally silly in my experience. I referred to the judgement of the relative value of men and women made by human cultures. I have never experienced, or ever studied, any human culture that has ever treated women as being of equal value to men. I'm willing to be persuaded, but I'd require some actual evidence.
I fully accept that some cultures avoid the grosser inequalities like selective abortion, denial of equal legal rights, denial of access to education etc. But before we all develop double-jointed shoulders from patting ourselves on the back, count the number of women in the top ten best-paid professional athletes. Oh wait... :laugh:
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I was speaking of homosexuals—I'm well aware of how women, particularly upper-class women, were treated in ancient Athens, although Athenian customs were not necessarily representative of ancient Greece as a whole.
Beware of that word 'value.' It's not the same thing as equality. There were and are cultures where women were certainly 'valued,' which is one reason some powerful men amass large collections of them, much like gems or gold, to name a few other things people have valued more than human life, while cheerfully sending hordes of men off to die in battle or even labor. Rights, however, are another matter.
But, if we're going to talk 'value' as measured by monetary compensation, what sex has the most top paid athletes* is nowhere near the issue to me that the inequity between the pay given, say, male and female actors is, since it cannot be argued that the exact same job is being done by either gender (and sometimes women do it backwards—here's to you, Ms. Rogers!). It says more about our culture, too—people will apparently pay more, or go more times to see their favorite male actor than their favorite female actor in a given film. That's what's being claimed, in a round-about way, in any case.
Then there's the startling fact that suchlike as athletes, actors, and musicians are highly paid at all, idolized they way they are, or enjoy the social and political influence they do. But that's another subject.
*I think part of what sport is pays what is, and will always be, fad. Well, except for the hope that someone will be badly injured or killed while the audience watches. That 'fad' seems to be here to stay, having been around for a few millennia now. Take a look at what sports are truly high-pay, and how often permanent injury or death can occur while playing at a professional level, and I think you'll see a concurrence (except for soccer; that one I can't figure out). Anyway, this is paired by a certain squeamishness; apparently it's okay to see men get killed in the boxing ring, but not women. Many people watching female boxing don't even want to see the fighters bleed, or their faces become deformed by bruises. In other words, we 'value' women too much to see them come to bodily harm, and thus deny them a chance at the big bucks. Go figure.
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I always thought that comment was more than a li'l unfair to Fred given that he was considered an amazing perfectionist and choreographer as well as a dancer.
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Beware of that word 'value.' It's not the same thing as equality. There were and are cultures where women were certainly 'valued,' which is one reason some powerful men amass large collections of them, much like gems or gold, much like gems or gold, to name a few other things people have valued more than human life, while cheerfully sending hordes of men off to die in battle or even labor.
The establishment of harems and the like is never about the value of the women, but is always a symbol of the wealth and status of the man. Whether the "collecting" is parallel as in the Middle-East, or serial as in Australia or the USA, the message is always the same. "Valuing" women on the same basis as a piles of gold, big houses or fancy cars, is to rate them as equivalent to inanimate objects. The term "trophy wife" sums that attitude up nicely.
But, if we're going to talk 'value' as measured by monetary compensation, what sex has the most top paid athletes* is nowhere near the issue to me that the inequity between the pay given, say, male and female actors is, since it cannot be argued that the exact same job is being done by either gender (and sometimes women do it backwards—here's to you, Ms. Rogers!). It says more about our culture, too—people will apparently pay more, or go more times to see their favorite male actor than their favorite female actor in a given film. That's what's being claimed, in a round-about way, in any case.
I couldn't agree more. I plucked professional athletes out of the air, in an atmosphere heated by the festival of improv theatre currently being held in South Africa. There is a FIFA Women's World Cup too incidentally, but you'd be hard-put to know it, or watch any of the action, since it gets barely any media attention, and I suspect that the combined pay of all the players in the tournament would be less than that of one David Beckham. Also, I live in Australia, and down here (men's) sport is the national religion.
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<snip>
There is a FIFA Women's World Cup too incidentally, but you'd be hard-put to know it, or watch any of the action, since it gets barely any media attention, and I suspect that the combined pay of all the players in the tournament would be less than that of one David Beckham. Also, I live in Australia, and down here (men's) sport is the national religion.
That's funny, because the USA Women's World Cup squad is better known than the men's. (And NOT just because of Brandi Chastain's top-removal.)
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<snip>
There is a FIFA Women's World Cup too incidentally, but you'd be hard-put to know it, or watch any of the action, since it gets barely any media attention, and I suspect that the combined pay of all the players in the tournament would be less than that of one David Beckham. Also, I live in Australia, and down here (men's) sport is the national religion.
That's funny, because the USA Women's World Cup squad is better known than the men's. (And NOT just because of Brandi Chastain's top-removal.)
Since I'm an American... who two days ago was in a packed bar watching us get knocked out... and just had to check whether the tournaments overlapped or were staggered... I'm going to say you're full of it.
(Who's Brandi Chastain?)
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I always thought that comment was more than a li'l unfair to Fred given that he was considered an amazing perfectionist and choreographer as well as a dancer.
He was, and as far as I'm concerned, the statement has nothing to do with belittling Fred, an artist I've come to admire more and more over the years since I grew up*. Many people used to say that Ginger Rogers 'simply followed Fred's lead,' and that's what, to me at any rate, is unfair. If anything, she had to anticipate him. And yet, I promise that if Astaire simply showed up to dance, he'd still get paid more.
The establishment of harems and the like is never about the value of the women, but is always a symbol of the wealth and status of the man. Whether the "collecting" is parallel as in the Middle-East, or serial as in Australia or the USA, the message is always the same. "Valuing" women on the same basis as a piles of gold, big houses or fancy cars, is to rate them as equivalent to inanimate objects. The term "trophy wife" sums that attitude up nicely.
Which is why I say the word 'value' is a dangerous, ambiguous term to use. One must stipulate for what the individual is being valued. Honestly, I'd say that far, far too many pro athletes are almost in the same boat as those women we're discussing, the only difference being that, theoretically, they are free to choose for themselves. Although how a kid with a far less than half-assed high school education is expected to negotiate contracts well enough to do that wisely is less than clear. Many are at the mercy of their agents and managers, whatever sex those persons happen to be. That's where lovely people like Don King (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Don_King_%28boxing_promoter%29#Controversies) come in.
This is interesting. We're in a thread about Penelope, debating something she'd probably weigh in on and then hyperventilate. Anyone up for that part? :-D
*So to speak.
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he'd still get paid more.
For what it's worth, I agree with you in regards to the general topic you're talking about and realize that the Ginger Rogers comment is just a tiny subset of a larger conversation in which I have nothing to really add. It's just that the "backwards and in heels," thing has sometimes been used as a pithy shorthand for this issue in general and I get distracted by it 'cuz Fred was a much better dancer and I'm a huge film nerd. There really was a time in her career where Ginger really did mostly just follow his lead, because she didn't really have training or experience in partnered dance so they covered for it in part with good choreography as she applied herself, like in their first partnered scene (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y1oYTVzmx_0) in which a certain endearing coltishness was part of the charm. But hey, she was genuinely good at the partnered thing after a film or two (although she never really could tap worth a damn) and had always been a much better at acting than Fred (she won an Academy Award, eventually.) You could make the argument that she was the better entertainer, overall, really, and I wouldn't argue it, but Fred buried her as a dancer.
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<snip>
There is a FIFA Women's World Cup too incidentally, but you'd be hard-put to know it, or watch any of the action, since it gets barely any media attention, and I suspect that the combined pay of all the players in the tournament would be less than that of one David Beckham. Also, I live in Australia, and down here (men's) sport is the national religion.
That's funny, because the USA Women's World Cup squad is better known than the men's. (And NOT just because of Brandi Chastain's top-removal.)
Since I'm an American... who two days ago was in a packed bar watching us get knocked out... and just had to check whether the tournaments overlapped or were staggered... I'm going to say you're full of it.
(Who's Brandi Chastain?)
Ms. Chastain was the one who scored the winning goal in penalty kicks in the 1999 Women's World Cup. After scoring the goal to complete the win over China, she disrobed, revealing her sports bra.
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It's just that the "backwards and in heels," thing has sometimes been used as a pithy shorthand for this issue in general and I get distracted by it 'cuz Fred was a much better dancer and I'm a huge film nerd.
If it makes you feel better, put in Cyd Charisse instead (although she didn't do tap that I recall). Personally, though, I like watching Fred and Ginger dance together better, and for the general public I suspect those partnered dances were what sold the movies. For sheer dancing ability, Charisse was tops. But for some reason, I prefer to see her dance alone.
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This is interesting. We're in a thread about Penelope, debating something she'd probably weigh in on and then hyperventilate. Anyone up for that part? :-D
HEEEEEEEEE-HYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH-HEEEEEEEEEEEEE-HYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH-HEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE--------
More interesting that theres more agreement in this thread than disagreement...
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Ancient Greece wasn't a good place and time to be a woman, full stop. Pretty much all cultures treat women as inferior beings, but the Ancient Greeks regarded us as not quite human.
http://questionablecontent.net./view.php?comic=1143 (http://questionablecontent.net./view.php?comic=1143)
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Like she said, not quite human...