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Fun Stuff => BAND => Topic started by: Kanno on 10 May 2005, 05:44
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So.. I figured I'd give this indie rock a try. I went out and bought Mogwai's Come On Die Young and now I have questions:
Is this what all of indie rock sounds like? It's like... drone rock. Every song is played at such a slow tempo. I don't mean to bash the music, I understand that liking music is merely an opinion, but I don't get why people have recommended this band to me. I was looking forward to amazing build-ups and melodies, and I got... elevator music.
I guess this came off as more of a rant then it should have.
Can anyone point me towards a different indie rock band I should check out first before giving up? I'd never thought I'd say this, but I guess I'm looking for something a little more "pop-like".
EDIT: I really dig newer singer-songwriter type stuffs.. ala Ben Folds and Ben Kweller. Or anybody named Ben.
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Nothin' wrong with pop. Try the Shins if it's interesting melodies you're after.
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Belle and Sebastian
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awww, mogwai are great. this makes me a sad zekterellium.
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I tried a mango and didn't like it. Is all food terrible?
Anyway,
Darren Hanlon
James William Hindle
Iron and Wine
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Dude, Mogwai are totally post-rock, not indie-rock. You have to get these annoying, arbitrary labels right, or you'll never be cool.
Peace out.
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If you want the Indie Rock try some 'Stars'
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oh, fuck genres, I never know whats what anyway. Blur, Bush, Kasabian, Sonic Youth and a zillion other bands. Find a sound you like and start there. Audioscrobbler and the like are rather good ways of finding bands you'd probably like and once in a while randomly grabbing something you've heard other people rave about will expand your horizons. Thus endeth the lesson.
Mogwai are awesome though.
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Dude, Mogwai are totally post-rock, not indie-rock. You have to get these annoying, arbitrary labels right, or you'll never be cool.
Peace out.
Damnit... It totally slipped my mind that I don't even need to like the music, I just need to know obscure band names and have the right clothes so I can prove that I am the mostest indyest rawker around! YESH!
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I've decided that I'm going to start a post-prog-nu-neo-wave-rock-funk-fusion-sludge-acid-psychadelic-band. We're going to play all Beatles covers.
Other than that, I forgot to mention that I also bought Modest Mouse's Moon and Antarctica. That was one hell of an album, kind of a weird ride. I think I'm gonna grab the arcade fire cd next.
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man, i never got what indie is, other than indiependant. if you can call mogwai, modest mouse, sonic youth, american analog set, ambulance ltd and the blood brothers indie, then its not a real genre since those bands have very little in common...
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Yeah, I was under the impression that indie rock had a certain sound. I suppose it just means they are released on independent labels. Whatever... I like music.
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Damnit... It totally slipped my mind that I don't even need to like the music, I just need to know obscure band names and have the right clothes so I can prove that I am the mostest indyest rawker around! YESH!
That's better. Now you are on the right path. For extra cool, make up obscure labels as well, that's always good.
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Have you listened to any Spoon? It's probably more along the lines of what you're looking for. :)
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First my recomendation for "Rock' stuff both bands are great
http://www.nothingnice.com/index.php?pageNum_Recordset2=40&totalRows_Recordset2=249
Second off as to the label indie
http://www.nothingnice.com/index.php?pageNum_Recordset2=184&totalRows_Recordset2=249[/url]
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Dongs?
I mean, uh, try The Flaming Lips. Or The New Pornographers (or one of their members' various solo albums). Or, oh hell, just go take a gander at the "What I'm Listening To Now" thread.
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It can't be all like Mogwai because Indie artists can span pretty much any genre. Too bad you don't like Come On Die Young. It's my favorite Mogwai album.
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I much prefer Young Team and the My Father, My King EP. But yeah, Mogwai is definitely a weird place to start with "indie rock."
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So.. I figured I'd give this indie rock a try.
There's your first mistake. Go pick up this instead:
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B0007LLP06/qid=1115779464/sr=8-1/ref=pd_csp_1/002-0096531-7055228?v=glance&s=music&n=507846
It's more original and melodic than anything else suggested, and it's by the best band ever.
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Indie or not, I would not base one genre on one cd of one band...
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A quote from Varese and a Residents recommendation! Whoa-ho-ho!
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I like Mogwai a lot. It just takes a certain kind of person/mood to listen to them.
I end up listening to them when I want to hear some music but I don't feel like getting all excited, it's a bit more relaxing.
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I prefer Happy Music, For Happy People, which is an infinitely good album.
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I like Mogwai a lot. It just takes a certain kind of person/mood to listen to them.
I end up listening to them when I want to hear some music but I don't feel like getting all excited, it's a bit more relaxing.
Yeah, I decided that if I ever go the way of slow, painful suicide, I know exactly which album I would reach for.
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Hmph.
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Hmph.
I dunno.. am I wrong? Not that the Mogwai would induce the pain, mind you. I just listen to music and hear moods and emotion, and the mood and emotion I get from Come On Die Young is slow suicide.
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eh *shrugs* everything is subjective. I just think people who only listen to happy music or only listen to sad music are missing out besides the fact that much so called happy or sad music is not purely that but a mix. Not that I think you are one of these people but it just reminds me of this...if you were obviously this or completely out of line I would have followed up with some longer rant ;)
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Mogwai are so great I almost cried when I saw them live.
However the term "indie rock" has many and wide-ranging definitions. Just find something you like and go with it.
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Mogwai Fear Satan was one of the first songs I learned to play on bass, as (by my mate's reckoning, anyway), the bass line's only one note. For 9 minutes.
I don't think I really progressed from that.
Mogwai are ok, but there are sooooo many better bands around like everyone says, I just can't think of any right now.
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I like Mogwai. They're great to listen to while driving.
I don't see why people have to subscribe to one style of music. I personaly see "indie", "punk", "emo", et cetera, as lifestyles and/or adjetives, not as music types.
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For the most part, I think I've figured out this whole genre thing:
indie: rock and roll
emo: rock and roll
post-rock: rock and roll
...
And I went and actually listened to a couple of tracks off of Young Team, and Mogwai can kick some serious ass when they up the tempo a little! I guess I just bought the wrong album.
I'm sure I'll come back to it in a month anyways and proclaim it as the best album in my collection.
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That's just not true at all. Genres exist, although it's painfully cool to deny it.
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J'aime bien le Mogwai.
J'aime bien aussi l'Indie. Mais
Je n'aime pas le beouf.
A Haiku.
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Oh no.
Please no.
Not again.
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@James: Take a motherfucking chill pill. You have to, like, diss Skyclad to my face to make me that angry.
I downloaded some of that Mogwai stuffs.
*yawns*
Also, all the lyrics sheets say they're instrumentals when there is clearly some guy singing, very, very quietly. That's cheating.
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I think he was joking.
A full in-depth analysis of "Indie Rock" is on its way as soon as I can bring myself to listen to any of it.
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I have this horrible mental image.
Fred Durst is in a car and the only thing he will say is 'Keep Trollin' Trollin' Trollin' over and over again until I go insane.
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A good alternative to Mogwai on the insturmental front is Mono. Great Japaneese stuff, totally off the wall.
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SECOND'D
Mono are awesome. Also, Explosion in the Sky.
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Rock instrumentals are pointless.
No, seriously. It's like the joke without the punchline.
Unless you're Dream Theatre.
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Dream Theater...and how are they pointless? Words aren't even part of music. Like they say "Lyrics, just wasted time between solos"
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Lyrics are an extremely important part of music. Try to imagine John Lennon's "Imagine" as an instrumental, it would be great elevator music, but that's about it.
There's just so many bad songwriters out there nowadays that they seem like "wasted time between solos".
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Dude, listen to Air's Moon Safari album. You don't need lyrics.
I know there are some tracks with vocals, it's just that the tracks without are awesome too. Better even.
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Alright, maybe I was wrong in saying that rock instrumentals are pointless. Some people can do them well and still make great music. Some.
But the other thing I'm getting at is that you can convey more in music with lyrics than you can without. Music can convey all types of emotion, for instance, you can make a guitar sound like love, sadness, hate, violence, a sunny day... whatever.
But you can't make a guitar convey that "you like grilled cheese sandwiches".
I just think that music with lyrics can reach a higher point of greatness than an instrumental piece, since you can get all the splendor of the original instrumental piece, plus (if you have talent) have a poetic message which can make it even better!
Or you could sit and tell me that John Cage's 4:33 was the best song ever.
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Bad songwriters...you mean writing bad words or writing bad music? And it's what you look for in the music. If I'm listening to Neo-Classical Shred (note the very niche example) stuff, I dont care if the guy is singing about dragons or his wedding, I want the solos.
I listen to planty of bands with great lyrics...but I'm not overly bothered, half of those bands come from genres where the vox are an insturment anyway.
Next you'll say Classical or Ambient pieces are piontless. Music is about the music. Take the lyrics away and you still have music. Take the music away and all you have is words.
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99% of lyrics suck. I can't count the number of times I've heard a perfectly good song ruined by some crap singing. With very few exceptions (ignoring rapping in Hip-Hop / short samples) I can't stand non-instrumental music. Radiohead, The Eels, Portishead, John Butler, At the drive-in. That's about it.
I'm not a fan of singers.
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Bad songwriters...you mean writing bad words or writing bad music?
Bad words. Like MilkmanDan said, 99% of lyrics suck.
If I'm listening to Neo-Classical Shred (note the very niche example) stuff, I dont care if the guy is singing about dragons or his wedding, I want the solos.
Yeah, ok, but what if the guy was singing about something so powerful that it changed your life? That would make the song better.
Take the music away and all you have is words.
Yeah, and you have poetry. Is poetry worse than music? It's just a different medium of art, you can still accomplish the same things with it.
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Singing about something powerful it changed my life? If you can have your life changed by a song, go you or something. But music isnt going to change my life and I wouldn't like myself if it did. Listening to Goregrind hasn't made me vegan. Listening to NS Black Metal hasn't made me a Neo-Nazi. It certainly wouldn't make the music better to me.
Poetry yes...but most of it would be complete shite. As it wouldn't written to be poetry. Some bands do write poetry for lyrics but not many.
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Adding vocals to music were just about getting people's attention. It's an exploitation of an odd quirk where humans automatically focus on the human voice. It doesn't matter what it's saying we will focus on it.
The way I look at music from an painter's pespective. The instuments provide color while the lyrics provide the shapes. That said I still look at lyrics as something abstract that should be open to interpretation.
I think where to start depends on a person's background. I liked Mogwai the first time I heard them, but they fit into what I already liked before hand.
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I have mixed views on the whole "open to interpretation"...some songs are, because they're about just random or abstract things. But some aren't. Mostly when the artist has stated what they mean, and if they have, that's what the words mean, not whatever you might want to think.
And sometimes, that song about killing dragons is just about killing dragons. No struggle against life and power or anything, just some DnD nerds singing about dragonslaying.
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But you've got too much to wear on your sleeves,
It's too much to do with me,
And secretly I want you buried in the yard,
The grave remains of a friendship scarred.
I love The Shins and the Arcade Fire because their lyrics are both distinct and open to interpretation, so their songs adapt to the situation of the listener. But I think Laika is just a song about having a brother who's a vampire. Because I can't put any other slant on it.
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Then it's about a hat, right?
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just wondering... would you guys rather listen to six hours of instrumental music or six hours of a-cappella?
yeah, good lyrics are a bonus, but they aren't neccesary. if they were, we'd just listen to every time i die and converge all day. not that there'd be anything wrong with that...
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It depends on what the instrumental/a capella music was. If the instrumental music was something good, like Mozart or something, then that probably. If it was really dull, and the a capella music was really awesome, like a barbershop quartet, or 'Caravan of Love' or something, then that.
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hmm... that was me being a jerk. i personally can't stand a-cappella. in fact, the only vocals i really dig are screaming. instrumental music is awesome, i think. vocals can ruin a song - look at alexisonfire, if they killed their singer and kept just the music and shouting, it'd be awesome. and fear before need to loose the singing too, it sucks.
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All Alexisonfire sucks.
But man, how can you do without the lyrics, they're so intefral? Sure, you can have a decent song, but it need definiton, it needs a human soul (which is why some industrail type stuff works I suppose) IT NEEDS MEANING. 99% of lyrics od the stuff I listen to RULE. I got into this shit because the lyrics were about killing dragons and blowing shit up and hate and lust and vengeance and raw human emotion and crap! Fuck all you whimpy little life changy bla crap. Man crap is an awesome word, vut cunt is more satisfying.
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This discussion seems far too either/or. Instrumental music can accomplish things music with lyrics cannot, because it lacks that focus of the lyrics to me it's capable of creating a much grander, all-encompassing effect. Music with lyrics can be far more intimate than instrumentals. And that's just how I react. Both are good, both have wide areas they can operate in.
Personally, what I think is a shame is that a lot of bands bother with lyrics when they're clearly no good at writing them. If you can't do it just use the voice as an instrument, it works much better than bad lyrics.
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I don't think anybody got the point I was trying to make...
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But man, how can you do without the lyrics, they're so intefral?
From a musician's standpoint, you write music without considering adding lyrics to it. Musicians have a lot more freedom when they don't have to worry about someone warbling about whatever they feel is important over the music. This is just an observation from playing and writing with people.
Lyrics are good too. There is stuff I listen to because of the lyrics, but I still see them as just another instrument in compositions.
How many of those that say lyrics really aren't necessary play an instrument or have an orcheastral background?
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Even though Mogwai are not a groundbreakingly unique band (they had several influences), Come On Die Young is a very unique album. I have not to this day heard a band in "mainstream" music (they had been hyped up by the NME and others up until this point, and Young Team was beginning to give them some level of exposure) who had the sheer balls to then come up with an album made up of over an hour of tension-building and ensure that they would never ever make it REALLY big. I love the results, but it is certainly not an accurate representation of "indie rock".
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I just picked up goverment sessions. It is a wonderful album. Very interesting to hear them play live and pull that off as well as many of their studio tracks.
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I do like some instrumental bands very much. I just think that to dismiss lyrics totally is really stupid.
But then, in most of the lyrics of the bands I listen to, the thing the singer thinks important is impaling people or something.
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From a musician's standpoint, you write music without considering adding lyrics to it. Musicians have a lot more freedom when they don't have to worry about someone warbling about whatever they feel is important over the music. This is just an observation from playing and writing with people.
Lyrics are good too. There is stuff I listen to because of the lyrics, but I still see them as just another instrument in compositions.
How many of those that say lyrics really aren't necessary play an instrument or have an orcheastral background?
Wow, after starting to read a thread about one of my favorite bands, I never would have thought it would stretch into a 'singers vs instrumentals' tiff.
I was getting ready to say basiclaly the same thing Druid just did here about the beginning of pg. 2.
Music is all interpreted different by different people. Everyone has varying tastes, which is usually a given. Vocals vs instrumentals just fits into that catagory.
I listen to a lot of music that doesn't involve vocals, because words clutter the already clouded mind of mine. I can listen to instrumental stuff 24/7 in the background and be perfectly happy with myself.
And I will also quote this line verbatim.
"Lyrics are good too. There is stuff I listen to because of the lyrics, but I still see them as just another instrument in compositions."
And yes, I am a musician with an extensive orchestral background.
I can tell you every note and every chorus and chord of many of my cds, but if you ask me what the name of the song is or what the opening line to such and such song, I'll be lost.
At concerts, I hum.
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On the original point of the topic, Kanno should try the Unicorns.
Then it's about a hat, right?
Unless your hat is just a hat.
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Of course no one is going to believe you when you tell them it's just a hat.
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My hat is magical, I can pull a hat trick.
I like what I've heard by Mogwai and really like their weird Amish/Potato video for "Staneley Kubrick."