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Fun Stuff => CLIKC => Topic started by: Leinad on 03 Aug 2008, 19:54

Title: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 03 Aug 2008, 19:54
<moderator comment>The original of this post was deleted by the author on 21 Dec 2010, which was the last day he accessed the forum.  This is all that survives of that post, taken from a quote in the thread:</moderator comment>

... when I was leveling my first toon to 70 my friends and I would ALWAYS without fail gank any horde we came across as often as we could, and camp their corpse til they rezzed at the graveyard and hearthed. We were vicious. ...

<moderator comment>The original post was replaced by the following, at the time that it was decided that the QC discussion forum, in particular, needed more moderation:</moderator comment>

The mods here are really stupid and pretentiously arrogant. Confirm/deny?
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Alex C on 03 Aug 2008, 20:47
I did the WoW thing pretty heavily pre-bc, and my behavior was pretty schizophrenic-- most days I would mind my own business and even save the odd lowbie who looked like they were in over their heads, while other days I'd be sneaking on board zeppelins murdering people (I played a rogue and a priest). For the most part though, I think world pvp is one of the weakest aspects of the game and the only fond memory I really have of it was the friendly rivalry I ended up in with a pair of Horde rogues. See, their raiding guild happened to have the roughly same MC schedule as my raiding guild, so we had plenty of opportunity to gank eachother. The progression was kind of funny-- it went from mildly amusing, then to kind of annoying and disruptiv, but then just became outright hilarious after they took to sneaking into the middle of the AH and ganking me. Nobody else, mind you-- they'd just waltz in, drop a cheapshot and an ambush then run around in circles jumping around like idiots as everyone killed them with the occaional KEK thrown in for good measure.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 03 Aug 2008, 20:57
Haha, that is ridiculous. I got like that with another warrior on the warrior side. While lvling through STV we pretty regularly ganked each other around lunch time and then again at dinner time. When we met up again in the OL I was a tank and he was a dps warrior, so I just bounced him around while mage frends ate him alive.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: clockworkjames on 03 Aug 2008, 22:56
This is why I like Age of Conan, you can PK ANYONE and so I do! As for WoW never really got past lv 33 in a pvp server but I was horde and flagged all the way, before that I got to 62 on a carebear server with some people I knew.

pvp EU server Battlescar for AoC :D
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 03 Aug 2008, 23:09
PK... hmmm, play alot of runescape?

Also, from my second post in this thread... another warrior on the HORDE side it should have read.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 03 Aug 2008, 23:54
... when I was leveling my first toon to 70 my friends and I would ALWAYS without fail gank any horde we came across as often as we could, and camp their corpse til they rezzed at the graveyard and hearthed. We were vicious. ...

You weren't "vicious", you were assholes.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Ozymandias on 04 Aug 2008, 00:01
Man. Ruining other people's game is pretty awesome. Fuck those dudes for trying to have fun.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Covetous on 04 Aug 2008, 05:08
Ganking and corps camping are just being a bully. The chicken system is what makes Warhammer onlien really interesting. That and that I finnally can be that cool tzeentch mage! :D
(ganking = killing people a lot lower then you).
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 04 Aug 2008, 06:21
I have played on a PvP server before.  Corpse-camping is fucking lame.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Yakob on 04 Aug 2008, 06:29
Yeah, camping is as low as you can get. Alright, you proved a point that you can kill me, now move along. It makes it significantly worse if the target is way lower than you. I'm all for a one-time friendly competiton, but don't be an asshole and camp.

Nótt on Warsong(US)
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: imagist42 on 04 Aug 2008, 09:10
Yeah, I used to play on a PvP server (pre-BC). Ganking is pretty retarded, and this is coming from someone who would wander around with friends at 60 that were interested in very little else. Don't kid yourself saying you're "vicious," or that you have to "understand the culture," you're an asshole through and through if that's the way you spend your time.

Pick on someone your own level.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Lines on 04 Aug 2008, 09:46
This is why I don't play on a PvP server and am never flagged unless I am helping capture a zone or whatever. Trying to turn in quests and have someone come up behind you and kill you before you realize what's happened isn't funny, it's annoying as hell. That's also why I stopped doing battlegrounds, because the group of people waiting around in the graveyard to kill you when you rezzed was also annoying as hell.

In short, don't be a dick.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 04 Aug 2008, 10:52
Gah, I don't know why, but I'm playing this game again. Why am I playing this game again?


Harifel on Twisting Nether
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Ozymandias on 04 Aug 2008, 11:05
est/Ozy, have you actually played on a PvP realm in an MMORPG before? I don't think understanding the ganking culture is even possible if you haven't experienced both ends of it first hand.

Yeah, it's mind-numbingly stupid. I avoid PvP realms just so I don't have to deal with both playing a game and avoiding people who I guess don't want me to play a game because they're level 70 and I'm 33, so clearly I am doing something wrong.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 04 Aug 2008, 11:41
No no no, guys, i believe you misunderstand me. I wouldn't go around ganking people lower than me, I would just hunt those people who were leveling in the same area as me, meaning they were obviously in my level range. And once you get to outland everyone is in a guild with at least a few 70's online at a time anyways, so PvPing in outland is no holds barred cause it will end up being fair one way or another. What is even more fun is ganking people higher level than you, cause you got more honor for it. I don't understand anyone who would corpse camp someone lower level than them, but corpse camping someone HIGHER lvl? That shows skill, buddy. I think the most fun I ever had was randomly organizing a raid to take halaa, and it ending up with 40 people in our raid group, and I don't know how many horde. It was pretty awesome.

Don't all spazz out, guys, I really didn't go around ganking people lower than me. Except that one time that my arena 5v5 teamed up with another 5v5 and we went into Ragefire Chasm and started ganking everyone. But it eventually turned into a all 70s battle and it got pretty epic.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 04 Aug 2008, 11:43
That's also why I stopped doing battlegrounds, because the group of people waiting around in the graveyard to kill you when you rezzed was also annoying as hell.

In short, don't be a dick.

In short, don't suck so bad that you get GY camped... I mean, come on, if you guys are losing that bad then you have to have at least 3-10 AFKers(depending on the BG), and if oyu don't, /wrist.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Lines on 04 Aug 2008, 11:52
Still don't like it, even if the person is my level. I don't like it when someone walks up behind me, stuns me, and then proceeds to kill my character when I am not expecting it and don't want them to. I don't mind PvP, but I think it can detract from the rest of the game when people you don't know come up and kill you for no reason. Ganking in general is just not appealing to me, at all.

Heroics are more fun than PvP anyways. :-P

Also, seriously, whether I'm on the winning side of a BG or not, I always have shitheads camping the graveyard. I don't care if I lose, but I actually want to play, not be suddenly attacked by 3-4 people over and over because my character is more powerful than theirs one on one. If people start going AFK in a BG I'm in, I usually don't bother sticking around because it's not worth it.

Edit: I have a love/hate relationship with this game. I think it's a fun game, but there are so many things that annoy me that I will take breaks lasting up to a few months or more. There are people who like PvP, but I'm just not one of them.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Trollstormur on 04 Aug 2008, 12:12
i used to play my girlfriend's character some times to level the poor guy up and if he got ganked I figured "yeah that's just how it goes" but if they killed him twice in a row or camped, I'd hop on my 70 vengeful gladiator shadow priest and knock their dick in the dirt until they logged. Rez at the graveyard? yeah i'm comin' to get ya.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 04 Aug 2008, 16:11
Evil, heartless motherfucker with no remorse or compassion? I'd say that's the definition of a ganker.

Yay me! I like that.

And yeah, I was ganked like, 80 billion times when leveling up, but the most fun that really happens is pvping while leveling up your first toon, imho. I mean, getting your first ever world PvP kill** is the most awesome thing ever.

**Kill: Killing a player so that it yields HONOR. I never kill anyone that does not yield honor. Also, this is a mildly moot point, because I deleted all my characters.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Emaline on 05 Aug 2008, 20:09
Man, Troll's post is soo much better if you read it in his avatar's voice.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: McTaggart on 06 Aug 2008, 14:22
No no no, guys, i believe you misunderstand me. I wouldn't go around ganking people lower than me,

Sorry to single out this one thing, but I find it funny how everyone always reverts to this. It's not really an important distinction. Either way you're disrupting someone else's whatever-they're-doing.

Full disclosure: I play eve, a game where loss hurts as badly as you let it, and I'll hunt down anything I think I can kill. Half the time it's dirty unfair ganks, the other half of the time I fall for some trap or bite off more than I can chew and it's unfair the other way. Why? Sometimes I can make a profit off it, sometimes it's vengeance, sometimes it's because my corpmates will give me shit for not as ruthless as I can be and sometimes it's simply skulls for the skull throne (or rather corpses for the corpse hangar). Do I feel bad about it after the fact? Sometimes.

In eve at least you can minimise the risk of people ganking and scamming and cheating you. I'm sure this is possible in wow as well; if you don't want to be disrupted in your playing to be disrupted by griefers and gankers, take the steps you can to avoid them. You consent to pvp by playing the game.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Ozymandias on 06 Aug 2008, 15:03
See, here's the thing though:

In WoW, there is no tangible loss to being ganked, nor is there tangible gain to doing so. The person killed doesn't lose XP or gold or even item durability. The person killing doesn't get XP or honor or gold. There is no outcome of someone sitting at a graveyard and killing people 40 levels below them when they rez except that they are doing it just to fuck with a dude. It's just being an asshole, no other reason.

I agree that you consent to PvP when you play on a PvP server, if it were limited to in-range PvP. If you are doing thing sin contested territory and someone a couple of levels above comes and kills you, well you should've been prepared, but you also could've put up enough of a fight to escape or even turn the tables and kill him. If a group of them comes and kill you, well that's the breaks, but you can still, in theory, escape with most classes if you see them coming. In either instance, there is some tangible benefit to them having attacked you (in the form of an honorable world PvP kill and the fact that you're doing quests in the same place they are and possibly even very similar ones) and it's just a hazard of the PvP environment. Honorable world PvP is excellent. I have enjoyed it on many occasions.

Furthermore, in Eve, it's actually entirely possible to succeed without entering low security zones and avoid PvP. It's low risk, low reward, but it's an option. This is not the case in WoW. After the first 20 levels, moving to PvP zones is required to simply progress through the game. There is no PvE option unless you just play a straight up PvE realm.

Honestly, there should've been a penalty for killing underleveled characters in contested areas in WoW. It just would've made sense. If dudes want to have an epic lvl 70 PvP brawl, that's what city raids are for.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 06 Aug 2008, 19:11
Ozy's just laid out my thoughts on the matter pretty well, especially in the first paragraph.

Also though, back in Everquest PvP you lost XP, gold and on some servers one item per death.  Corpse-camping was a pretty big deal and you could be banned for it if reported & caught.  There was a tangible gain for killing other players though, in the form of the gold and item you looted from them.  Some items were marked as NOLOOT if I recall right, but they were only high-level special items.

The gain was there, but there was also a fear of retaliation/official reprimand keeping most people from being pricks to one another.  In WoW that doesn't exist, so people are free to be cocks to one another with impunity.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 07 Aug 2008, 18:45
Sorry to single out this one thing, but I find it funny how everyone always reverts to this. It's not really an important distinction. Either way you're disrupting someone else's whatever-they're-doing.

Which is kind of the point... if you are on a PvP realm or flagged for PvP then there is really nothing wrong with it, in fact, you are INVITING it... not just allowing it. I think that is kind of like, umm, correct me if I am wrong... the whole like... point? Of PvP? Maybe?

See, here's the thing though:

In WoW, there is no tangible loss to being ganked, you don't gain honor

Yes you do. You do gain honor in world PvP if they are close to your level.

And as for a penalty for killing lower levels than you, I can kind of understand that, but there are just times when it is totally fine. I mean, going out and hunting a lowbie for no reason= bad. Killing one that is messing up players on your side already, fine. And as for massive brawls, go pvp anywhere in the Outlands and you will have a couple 70's there pretty fast, and it will just build up from there. In fact you can really start full on raid groups from just a minor little fight.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Ozymandias on 07 Aug 2008, 19:57
Did you read the rest of what I wrote? I was clearly referring to out-of-level PvP.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 07 Aug 2008, 20:06
Yes, I did, I didn't gather that you were reffering to out of level pvping, unless that is the only way you use the word "gank" I guess.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 07 Aug 2008, 23:35
Ganking is killing someone with a bunch of dudes, killing someone a lot lower level than you, or killing someone using shitty means.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: clockworkjames on 08 Aug 2008, 05:58
Wow, My rule of thumb is if you play on a PvP server, toughen the fuck up or go roll carebear. You choose a pvp server for the ability to kill anyone, that is how it is if you don't like it re-roll on PvE and stop fucking complaining, it's your own fault.

People are dicks about it, but the biggest dicks are the ones who play on a PvP server and moan about getting PK'd, PvP is IN THE NAME OF THE FUCKING SERVER SO GET OVER IT.

Also I played runescape for 2 weeks, never payed a penny so never got to try pvp.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Eris on 08 Aug 2008, 07:28
This is est on Han's account.

"PvP" is on the server name, yes.  "Being an utter fucking cockstain" is not.

There is PvP, then there is being a fucking jerk.  I have played on PvP servers for a pretty long time.  I know the fucking drill.  I have had very fun experiences stemming from being ambushed by enemy players.  Even when they are massively above my level and they kill me, laugh then move on that is totally cool!  When there is a bunch of them and they kill me and laugh, then go about their business that is cool too!  When they camp my corpse for no reason other than to piss me off I get a little miffed.  As I said earlier, when it happened in previous games such as EQ it was a bannable offence.  There was an unwritten agreement of loot & scoot.  You let the defeated guy loot his stuff & leave the area, because by beating him you've won the right to the area.  That's not quite as applicable any more either due to there being less in the way of camps as such, but surely there's some way of doing a similar thing.

I know it's probably expecting too much for anonymous dickshits to not be absolute cunts, but hey.  I live in hope.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: michaelicious on 08 Aug 2008, 07:53
i used to play my girlfriend's character some times to level the poor guy up and if he got ganked I figured "yeah that's just how it goes" but if they killed him twice in a row or camped, I'd hop on my 70 vengeful gladiator shadow priest and knock their dick in the dirt until they logged. Rez at the graveyard? yeah i'm comin' to get ya.

What is your priest's name? Getting Vengeful Gladiator as a shadow priest is pretty friggin' impressive.

My 70 is a shadow priest too, but I don't really play anymore.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 08 Aug 2008, 10:01
I only camp for a little bit, especially if I took the guy off-guard. I like to give him a chance to get revenge on me so I will hang around for at least one kill. And if after that he is not running away when he rezzes but attacking me I will keep fighting him til we get bored. It's actually really fun sometimes.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Ozymandias on 08 Aug 2008, 11:16
I don't understand why I have to choose between PvE or bullshit assholes. Why can't I play on a server where the threat of PvP is there, but I'm not going to be harassed by dicks while trying to level? Why can't I level up in an area where it's possible to cross paths with someone of similar skill of the other faction and have a scuffle without it also being possible to just keep dying over and over in the graveyard because some dick is going kekekekekekekeke on my corpse?
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 08 Aug 2008, 12:03
If that ever happens to me I do one of two things: Call in some guildies, or just log out and play a different toon for a little while. If someone wants to screw around with you like that it is simply going to happen. Honestly, I respect Blizzard for not following the route of many other games and softening the PvP aspect of the game in that regard. And if worst comes to worst, just corpse crawl back to your nearest faction base and let the guards terminate him for you.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Covetous on 08 Aug 2008, 14:47
PvP is for Player vs Player, not "player will get as raped" (sorry for the french). But then again I cant relate to killing people that dont have chans. It simply is'nt any fun. Btw, I dont like killing insects just cus there in the way either. And its about the same situation. So, fighting people that's fair fight, go on. Hang around and kill them again and again is okey. But if you feel that killing lowbies is your only chans to win, go cuddle with you carebear. Hiting on lower levels are just trying to show of you MMORPG-e-penis, and honestly, that wont give you any respect in the universe.

So long live the (chaos) chicken system in war. If your in a place were you shouldnt be you will be transformed in to a chicken.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Trollstormur on 08 Aug 2008, 15:27
i used to play my girlfriend's character some times to level the poor guy up and if he got ganked I figured "yeah that's just how it goes" but if they killed him twice in a row or camped, I'd hop on my 70 vengeful gladiator shadow priest and knock their dick in the dirt until they logged. Rez at the graveyard? yeah i'm comin' to get ya.

What is your priest's name? Getting Vengeful Gladiator as a shadow priest is pretty friggin' impressive.

My 70 is a shadow priest too, but I don't really play anymore.

oh, i probably shoulda explained better: my shadow priest is in full vengeful gladiator, I wasn't on the #1 team for my server on the 3rd season of arena. I mostly was disc for all the arenaing anyway. (s'why i was able to get 2 sets of vengeful >.>)
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: SirHardHead on 09 Aug 2008, 00:56
From reading this thread i have seen that:

Possibly they could grade areas like runescapes(old?) wilderness.(I hear they removed PvP?)
As you go to higher level areas in WoW you would be able to pvp against higher/lower level players.
This might prevent a high level player coming and senselessly killing lower level players.

This is just a thought and i am not saying this is how it should be.  :-)
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Ozymandias on 09 Aug 2008, 01:27
^ Which actually brings up a good point about why WoW's PvP is fucked.

The areas are sectioned off according to level, but they've actually done the opposite of that. It is actually easier for higher level characters to kill lower level characters in the areas that the lower level characters are supposed to be in. Leinad suggests going back to your nearest faction base, but faction base guards have levels according to the level of the area. So a level 70 character will actually have an easier time killing someone in a level 30 zone, because the guards are at most level 55 or so.

How does that make sense? If the faction guards are intended to create a safe zone, why scale them at all? A safe zone of level 70+ guards is safer than 55, and they'll kill someone of the other faction whose level is appropriate for the area just as quick.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: McTaggart on 09 Aug 2008, 02:00
Possibly they could grade areas like runescapes(old?) wilderness.(I hear they removed PvP?)

I heard about this and I found it amazing the lengths they went to to remove all player interaction from thier mmo.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: clockworkjames on 09 Aug 2008, 03:20
I can see what you mean about wanting to be able to pvp but not constantly be ganked, it's like wanting your cake and still having cake to eat later.

It comes with the territory but the bottom line stands, if you can't take it on the chin when a lv67 comes over and sticks you, laughs then proceeeds to stab you in the face when you are lv 43 then you just obviously aren't cut out for PvP, roll PvE and then do battlegrounds.

I only get pissy about the bunch of people who complain and try to define PvP, It isn't always kill on site for everyone, but alot of the time it is and the point I stress is if you cannot deal with this then roll PvE because PvP is what it is not just what you want it to be.

I'm at i34 in a aircraft hangar sized hall with 2000 other gamers, loads are doing arena in WoW and a few are on AoC PvP servers killing people and grouping with others.

Call it dickery if you want but I feel the real dickery is people who complain.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 09 Aug 2008, 09:35
EH, I still don't have much of a problem with corpse-camping. It has happened to me, and I do it to others, and if it gets really frustrating I remember, it is just a game. So it doesn't really bother me.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Alex C on 09 Aug 2008, 10:59
I'd be more sympathetic with the "well, it's what you signed up for" mindset if I hadn't seen things like players wandering around and slowly kicking lowbies to death (I mean that quite literally, by the way-- Let me tell you though, it takes forever to kill someone when all you're using is a spell interrupt that also happens to deal nominal damage) or hadn't seen my own guildies once get bored, head off to the Stonetalon Mountains and just repeatedly mindcontrol some poor slob and make him dive off cliffs. Of course, the nasty part about the Stonetalon Mountains is that there's really more moehills there than cliffs, so again, it takes a while to kill a guy that way. In fact, diminishing returns nearly makes it impossible-- unless, of course, you have a rogue nearby sapping the guy occasionally so you can wait out the 15 second timer.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: öde on 09 Aug 2008, 12:17
Possibly they could grade areas like runescapes(old?) wilderness.(I hear they removed PvP?)

I heard about this and I found it amazing the lengths they went to to remove all player interaction from thier mmo.

You'd understand if you played it when it first started getting popular. You'll probably understand if you try to play now. It's a shame, because once you get past the 'ooh, a whole world to explore' bit the only decent thing about the game was the other players.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: bryanthelion on 10 Aug 2008, 09:08
There was once this HUGE ass battle on the twisted Nether server. I dont remember exactly where it was. (it was in a level 30 zone, which had both alliance and horde cities, and it was REALLY green) There was atleast 70 characters duking it out, the lag was incredible.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Trollstormur on 10 Aug 2008, 10:09
I keep reading and talking about WoW online. I don't really wanna restart, but i keep finding myself in WoW communities for a while just talking about the game.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Trollstormur on 10 Aug 2008, 10:24
I have a free alternative right now, so I'm lucky in that regard. when I quit, I hit the end-game crossroads. either a. quit or start making more alts or b. get a 60 hour a week job as a raider for some purples

first i chose b but then a. the fancy ass purples i do got are nifty as hell though.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 10 Aug 2008, 11:26
I keep reading and talking about WoW online. I don't really wanna restart, but i keep finding myself in WoW communities for a while just talking about the game.

That is exactly the same thing with me, brother. If I had a job I would be playing again, but I cannot afford it ATM.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: imagist42 on 10 Aug 2008, 14:32
I would be playing it if I had no other ambitions in life, but after getting to 70 I just could not put in enough time to find the game at all rewarding. That said I will probably play again sometime after WotLK comes out, just to level to 80, but unless they seriously revamp the endgame I won't last much past that point.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 10 Aug 2008, 17:03
I got back into this a little while ago and got a Warrior to 50ish pretty quickly.  Then my main machine died on me and I was playing it on my laptop for a bit, which was ok I guess but felt less fun.  Then I dunno, I reinstalled stuff on my main machine but started playing other games and haven't really played it all that much for a couple months.  I should play again, because I was having a lot of fun with it, but the task to re-installing and patching all over again up doesn't sound like fun right now.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Yakob on 10 Aug 2008, 17:29
I think i have some form of WoW ADD. I have a 62 rogue, two hunters in the high 40's, a preist in the low 40's and I'd say about 10 characters in the 20-40 range. I just get bored.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Ozymandias on 10 Aug 2008, 17:34
Reinstalling WoW basically takes 4 hours.

It is hell.

I do it every three months.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 10 Aug 2008, 19:46
The install itself doesn't take too long, but the patches take roughly forever to download here in the Australias.  I will probably install then copy the old WoW directory over the top of the new one, then patch up whatever has changed since I last played a couple months ago.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 10 Aug 2008, 20:16
I started playing again. goddamnit


I've been playing this game on and off ever since it came out, and I've still never maxed out a character, my current one is highest yet, at 55. I've had something like 30 alts over the course of several years playing this damn game.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: imagist42 on 10 Aug 2008, 20:25
I would be playing it if I had no other ambitions in life

I think I should be slightly insulted by this. Should I?

No no, it is perfectly possible to enjoy the game and be a reasonably social, well-groomed person. Not for me, though. Once I get through gaining levels I just don't find the endgame rewarding enough unless I'm doing nightly raids with a well-tuned guild, which I simply cannot afford to do and eat my cake too. This is a personal insult, not a general one.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: SirHardHead on 11 Aug 2008, 06:38
Allot of my friends and it seems the general censuses is that most people who have quit wow after getting a few 70's are going to play again "just to get to 80". It will be interesting to see how many people will get hooked again and how blizzard will take advantage of these guys who come back. However I must admit you can't have a Real Life and a WoW Life. It just doesn’t work.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: 0bsessions on 11 Aug 2008, 06:55
Adunno, my girlfriend seems to be doing a rather decent job of balancing WoW, working, friends, a boyfriend and raising a toddler.

The thing a lot of people don't seem to be able to realize is that an MMO tends to be a lot more fulfilling if you don't spend eight hours a night on it. When you spend shit all amounts of time on it, you tend to plow through everything there is to do after a couple months.

I created an account last night. I've been contemplating trying WoW for a while now and since my girlfriend's already on there, I figured I'd take advantage of that recruitment drive they're doing and utilize that triple experience thing while I try it out.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: imagist42 on 11 Aug 2008, 08:01
Allot of my friends and it seems the general censuses is that most people who have quit wow after getting a few 70's are going to play again "just to get to 80". It will be interesting to see how many people will get hooked again and how blizzard will take advantage of these guys who come back. However I must admit you can't have a Real Life and a WoW Life. It just doesn’t work.

As I (think I) said, unless they drastically change the way their endgame works, they won't be able to keep me hooked more than 3-4 months (as long as I stuck around after TBC). All in all I haven't actually been playing WoW for more than a year, even though I was around at the beginning.

And your last statement is pretty retarded. I know plenty of people that balance going out and being social and having responsibility and such with playing WoW. My last roommate, half the people I work with, my cousin and his girlfriend (who are never even home at the same time to play with each other because he works nights now)... in fact out of everyone I know who plays WoW, I can only think of two who dedicate pretty much all their free time to it. I never said it's not possible to enjoy WoW at the same time as other things, I'm just saying that I, personally, can't do it.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 11 Aug 2008, 10:27
Yeah, I really cannot enjoy myself at max level unless I am raiding, and raiding(when you are an officer in your guild) means babysitting everyone in the guild, helping them do instance runs to get gear, helping them farm mats, helping them with dailies (For future reference, DO NOT COMPLAIN TO A PROT WARRIOR THAT IT TAKES FOREVER TO DO YOUR DAILIES. He knows, oh yes, he knows) and still farming mats for the guildbank, your self, and making enough money to do repairs and still donate to the guild bank. It was fun as hell, don't get me wrong, but I didn't do anything else with my life.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 11 Aug 2008, 16:06
I think i have some form of WoW ADD. I have a 62 rogue, two hunters in the high 40's, a preist in the low 40's and I'd say about 10 characters in the 20-40 range. I just get bored.

i think i have it too. i don't even have a single character at 40 and yet for some reason i feel it is necessary to make new ones.
i eventually started deleting some alts i made and never touched because it was just getting out of hand.

these are my remaining characters:

35 druid
18 hunter
12 pally
8 warrior
6 shaman

the sad thing is, i've only gotten into the game recently.
clearly it is eating my soul.  time to get back to leveling, guys.  (kidding....sort of)
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 11 Aug 2008, 17:16
It's okay, Jazz, go get your soul eaten.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: axerton on 11 Aug 2008, 18:37
for a long time I was wondering if I should get into WoW, I've played it a bit on my cousin's account a long time ago and the fun I had playing it was always counterbalanced by the fact that it had a magical ability to simply devour time, but I was slowly wavering closer and closer to "Fuck it, how bad can it be?". Now however I think I'll wait for Kotor Online and give that a try instead.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 11 Aug 2008, 19:53
don't give anything a try, they are all evil. And mean.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 11 Aug 2008, 22:15
They are not evil.  I played WoW for about an hour or so at a time sometimes.  I know that I have a tendency to meander but I want to get to 70 or at least 60 asap so I set myself a bunch of stuff to do and stick to the plan, only deviating slightly if I see something fun to do.  This way I get a bunch of stuff done in the couple of hours play, feel accomplished & level up fairly quickly.  I got from 1 to low 50s in about a month playing this way.  I know you can level faster if you're hardcore about things, but when I compare it to my previous efforts it is astonishingly fast and very rewarding.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Nelgraf on 12 Aug 2008, 00:01
Hello, I was just wondering if anyone here knows if Jeph still plays WoW, I remember reading a post a while ago saying he needed a healer in some server but that was quite some time ago. I didn't want to be rude and email him so am just asking here. thanks !

Hello everyone by the way.

-Nelgraf
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Imnawtinsane on 13 Aug 2008, 22:13
I'm Alliance on Arthas
70 Shadow Priest venge wep, s4, guardian gear
70 rogue
70 hunter
63 Druid (lazy lol)
I play red name=dead most often lol
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 14 Aug 2008, 06:50
it's nice to see that most of you are more addicted to wow than i am  :lol:

also since my last post i have gotten my druid to 37 (thanks guild!) and my hunter to 19 (i can picture my hunter becoming my main soon cause i find them more fun)
and i've started making new characters again, what the hell.   my boyfriend was partially to blame cause he was all BLAH STOP PLAYING YOUR HORDE HUNTER BLAH JUST MAKE AN ALLIANCE HUNTER IF YOU LOVE THE CLASS SO MUCH.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: axerton on 14 Aug 2008, 08:25
Night elf hunters are, from what I remember, what I believe is technically called, The Shit.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: imagist42 on 14 Aug 2008, 08:27
That's why you roll dwarf.

I still love my inactive Tauren Hunter, though. Screw class-relevant racial abilities, he was large and in charge.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Alex C on 14 Aug 2008, 15:26
Between the health bonus and war stomp tauren is never really a bad choice.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 14 Aug 2008, 16:48
I play a Dorf warrior.  Between that and Dorf Fortress Han seems to think I have a thing
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 14 Aug 2008, 18:19
That is my plan once I get to about 60.  I am low 50s at the moment, and if I get back to playing I should hit 60 by the end of August.  Once I hit 60 I'm gonna take a break from the levelling & explore the "old world" properly before heading to Outworld.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Ozymandias on 14 Aug 2008, 19:15
I wish there were a server where all QC peeps played.

Stupid servers. All my friends are always on twenty different servers.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: imagist42 on 14 Aug 2008, 22:24
If Blizz wasn't a money whoring hobag they would offer free (infrequent) server transfers, I mean it's not gonna hurt them because either everything would balance out in the end or they'd just have to split some more popular servers, which they already have a history of doing anyway.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 14 Aug 2008, 22:54
If Blizzard wasn't a money-whoring hobag they would let people play on whatever server they wanted like Dungeon Runners.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: imagist42 on 14 Aug 2008, 23:17
That would kind of ruin guild competition and server specific events, which I find kind of fun. Dungeon Runners is a much more solo-oriented game than WoW.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 15 Aug 2008, 00:25
I wish there were a server where all QC peeps played.

that would be kinda neat!



Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Alex C on 15 Aug 2008, 07:50
Agreed on the QC server thing. I'd be willing to move if other people were. My current guild is wearing thin on me.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 15 Aug 2008, 11:42
Agreed on the QC server thing. I'd be willing to move if other people were. My current guild is wearing thin on me.

i actually like the guild i'm in quite a bit, and wouldn't wanna leave.
it'd just be nice to have people to quest with when my other friends aren't on.

i'd also be willing to move if you guys are serious about this idea.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 15 Aug 2008, 13:24
you don't have to move, just do what my old guild did when a bunch of us realized we liked PvP more than anything. We all just got on vent (if you don't own your own vent use your guild's vent when no one else is on so they don't realize you gave out the info. if your guild does not have vent, find a new guild) picked a server, and made toons on the same side and started a guild. Was pretty fun.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Statik on 16 Aug 2008, 05:44
Yeah, I really cannot enjoy myself at max level unless I am raiding, and raiding(when you are an officer in your guild) means babysitting everyone in the guild, helping them do instance runs to get gear, helping them farm mats, helping them with dailies (For future reference, DO NOT COMPLAIN TO A PROT WARRIOR THAT IT TAKES FOREVER TO DO YOUR DAILIES. He knows, oh yes, he knows) and still farming mats for the guildbank, your self, and making enough money to do repairs and still donate to the guild bank. It was fun as hell, don't get me wrong, but I didn't do anything else with my life.

That.... that right there, thats why I fucking quit.  Because I knew I had that to look forward to.  Sorry to anyone who does find that enjoyable, but I do not.

More on topic:  End game pvp in WoW was boring.  I can only kill so many gnomes before it gets stupid.

Also:  If someone is being a dick (like corpse camping for a long long time) you CAN report them.  I should know, about a week before I quit the game, I was doing some questing on my level 20s warrior near southshore, got repeatedly ganked.  So, being a dick, I log onto my 70 warlock, and I go into Southshore, kill the guards, and climb on the roof of the inn.  I then proceed to fuck with every god damn person who comes into town. 
(Its pretty amusing seeing a level 25 or so get Seed of Corruption, then run into the Inn, blow up, and kill like five people).  Anyway, after an hour or so of that, I got a message from an admin, then a 24 hour ban.
Seems they dont like it when you "exploit" in order to "gank lowbies" and be "unkillable" blah blah blah...


EDIT:
I feel I should also mention that a lot of the low level pvp starts because someone attempts to pvp with a similarly leveled person in a low level zone, and no matter who started it, the loser tends to go crying to their guild of level 70s to come back them up.  This did happen to me shortly before I quit, I was leveling my warrior... somewhere, and some dude comes up behind me while I am killing something, I finish the beast off, then turn around and proceed to beat the other PC into tar.  I think nothing of it beyond "LOL I win" or w/e, then ten minutes later I have a level 70 corpse camping me.  Relog onto my 'lock, and corpse camp the 70 and the XX (whatever level the lower person was).  Then they call in more guildies/friends, so I call in more guildies/friends, and it ends up being a giant fucking brawl, which is pretty cool.

Another fun pvp experience - a group of level 55-70s tried to raid thunder bluff later at night.  And unfortunately, while you cannot fear someone off of a cliff, you apparently can/could mind control them off of the cliff.  A shadow priest friend just did that for a bit usually after I ran into the middle of them and feared them all.  I don't really think they came planned for the fact that you kinda have to ride an elevator up to the city, and while you are running around stupid on your little elevator, all the mages and locks have to do is rain fire and ice down on you.  Rather amusing.  Also the fact that they brough 55s to a city raid.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 16 Aug 2008, 09:22
you don't have to move, just do what my old guild did when a bunch of us realized we liked PvP more than anything. We all just got on vent (if you don't own your own vent use your guild's vent when no one else is on so they don't realize you gave out the info. if your guild does not have vent, find a new guild) picked a server, and made toons on the same side and started a guild. Was pretty fun.

hmmmm. i am not sure whether we have vent, i'll have to look into it.
also it might be hard to find a time when absolutely no one is on.

now for a bit of rant of my own.

you know what i hate? lazy people in instances.  if you're a fucking healer, stop cybering with your hawt night elf girlfriend and heal.  yes i can technically do it,  but my druid is feral, not resto, so why the fuck do i end up doing it most of the time? it is my least favorite thing. it stresses me out cause people will flip out at you if you are not able to heal cause you got stunned or something and their weak ass dies.

also, anyone who ditches without a valid reason? fuck you too.
and anyone who only runs until they get what they need and doesn't care whether the group can finish without them. stop being so damn selfish.

 
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 16 Aug 2008, 10:47
oh, i try to whenever possible.
but when there are no people around my level on, or i can't get a 70 to run me, or i'm playing my horde characters i have to resort to lfg. which can be pretty sucky sometimes.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 16 Aug 2008, 10:51
US
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 16 Aug 2008, 11:00
Yeah, I got to the level where whenever I would PUG I could just straight up tell people they were not good enough, gtfo. And out of the 10-20 heroics I would do a weak, one of them would be a pug. All the other times it would be completely with guildies, which rocks.

And as for quitting once you get your shit: once you get to 70 and start doing heroics, there are always badges of justice and Primal Nethers that drop from bosses, so people will stay in the instance til the end because there is ALWAYS something in it for them.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 17 Aug 2008, 00:54
See, none of that shit interests me all that much.  I just want to run about and have fun.  I was in a raiding guild in EQ.  It was fun for about maybe 10 mins of a 3 hour raid, the rest was clearing trash, setup, recovering from wipes, etc which was mundane as all getout.  By contrast I am the guy that when he gets to 70 will go back and make sure that all his weapon and shield skills are maxed, then maybe go do some harvesting for tradeskills, explore the parts of the world that I didn't get to see while leveling up, etc.  Then when I've done all that I'll probably freeze my account and wait for the expansion if it isn't out already by that point.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 17 Aug 2008, 05:25
Also, from the conversation in the WAR thread about using PvP rewards for PvE, I think that it is a very good way for casual players to get fairly decent gear to use in PvE.  I know that there is always a bunch of gear around your level that you can get from instances and such, but there's always gonna be people like me who a. like a bit of variety in their playing, so play some PvP every so often to mix things up a bit anyway and they may as well save the tokens up for something and b. really really really fucking hate PUG instancing and don't have the time available to join a "proper" guild.

At the moment I play WoW mainly by myself.  I play it this way because I've found that guildies expect me to drop everything to come and help them, and they expose me to an unmitigated shitstream of bullshit drama in chat.  Even when I've been in a guild with workmates and/or friends there's been situations where I've had maybe an hour or two to play and 1/2 to 2/3 or the time has been taken up doing stupid shit for guildies who've said it'd "only take a second".  Due to this I find PvP rewards pretty appealing.  I can drop into a battleground for a bit, get a few tokens, put them in the bank.  Then when I have enough to get something interesting I do.  Simple!
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 17 Aug 2008, 13:22
Yeah, PvP rewards are definitely great for a soloing player, but to be honest if I wanted to play by myself I would not have played WoW. The only reason I found it so addicting was the constant human interaction, which was totally awesome for me. But for a player who wants to advance through the endgame content you will end up with much better weapons by doing PvE than by doing PvP.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 17 Aug 2008, 16:06
okay time for another one of my rants.
when i am playing wow solo i do not want people who know even less than i do "helping" me.
i like exploring and figuring stuff out on my own, thanks.  nor do i want to be given stuff simply based on the fact that i am a real girl playing a computer game! now, if you wanted to buy me time cards that's a different story  :wink:

also guys, i ended up deleting my 39 druid. she was pretty well geared and had a lot of gold, but i just wasn't having fun playing the class anymore (for reasons previously mentioned) so i donated my gold/non-soulbound items to my guild (which ended up getting my alt promoted, and i feel a little odd about it since i haven't contributed THAT much to the guild otherwise)

i wonder if i'm gonna end up regretting this.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 17 Aug 2008, 16:10
All I can say is that, at times, I seriously HATED with a passion playing my warrior. But just stick it out, any class is fun once you get to 70 and you will have a lot more experience if you ever want to roll another toon. It will make it a lot easier to level up another character because you will have more resources and more knowldedge. For awhile I hated my warrior so bad it was not even funny. But stick it out and keep on rolling, you will get there. Once I got to 70 I was having tons of fun with my warrior, a good half of it just because he was 70, the other being I really like to tank. So just go to 70 with one toon even if you hate it at some point, you won't regret it at 70.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 17 Aug 2008, 17:06
Man, no.  Fuck that.  There is no way I would continue to play a toon that I don't feel right playing just so that I can get it to 70.  It'd still be a character I don't want to play, it'd just be level 70 and a few months wasted.  If a game isn't fun any more I stop playing, at least for a little while until I can figure out if I want to quit for good.  I already have two jobs.  If I wanted a third that I'm not paid for I'd go volunteer someplace.  For me games are about escapism, mucking about and having fun.  That is another reason why I avoid big guilds and raiding.  After a while the raid guilds I've been in tend to feel like work.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: michaelicious on 17 Aug 2008, 19:50
okay time for another one of my rants.
when i am playing wow solo i do not want people who know even less than i do "helping" me.
i like exploring and figuring stuff out on my own, thanks.  nor do i want to be given stuff simply based on the fact that i am a real girl playing a computer game! now, if you wanted to buy me time cards that's a different story  :wink:

also guys, i ended up deleting my 39 druid. she was pretty well geared and had a lot of gold, but i just wasn't having fun playing the class anymore (for reasons previously mentioned) so i donated my gold/non-soulbound items to my guild (which ended up getting my alt promoted, and i feel a little odd about it since i haven't contributed THAT much to the guild otherwise)

i wonder if i'm gonna end up regretting this.

You deleted your druid right before they start to get fun. Druid is a pretty tough class to level but once you hit 50 it gets pretty fun. If you are levelling as Feral, Mangle basically makes it a whole new game. You kill things super quickly.

Also, you will never get to be a laser chicken.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 18 Aug 2008, 00:48
@Est: I didn't add a few things. There were certain points I hated leveling my warrior simply because I was getting a little tired of the same old same old, but there were other times when I was having a blast. For warriors, at least, there really are AWESOME times to level, and sucky times to level. Some regions combine to make leveling hell, where as others combine to make leveling a pretty damn fun time. This happens with every class, and the times you hate it you just gotta try to find a way around that area or just plow through it. This happens in a lot of MMORPGs and can't really avoid it.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: CcAgan on 18 Aug 2008, 07:51
I am the GM of a raiding guild just pressing into Battle for Mount Hyjal(3/5) and Black Temple(3/9), and one of our goals is to enjoy end game with out that "hard core" way of doing things.  It has taken alot of testing and shifting of things to make that actually happen.  We only raid three nights a week in progression content (which means progression is slow), but this has allowed us to keep burn out from happening.  There are a ton of normal folks who are not on unless its raid night, and most of them enjoy a normal life since we dont raid on friday or saturday nights.  We have found that sat/sun mornings are best for kara badge farming, and we even will host the occational gruuls or mags pug raid with great success on off nights.

We also have an adults only membership rule and that has kept loot drama down.  Believe it or not we just /roll on loot and people understand that they should not be greedy and give some one else a shot if they got an item that week.

Alliance on Hydraxis server US.
70 Paly with Prot and Holy PVE sets, and Ret PVP set.
70 Frost Mage PVE Only
70 Resto Druid PVP Only
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Yakob on 18 Aug 2008, 07:57
@Est: I didn't add a few things. There were certain points I hated leveling my warrior simply because I was getting a little tired of the same old same old, but there were other times when I was having a blast. For warriors, at least, there really are AWESOME times to level, and sucky times to level. Some regions combine to make leveling hell, where as others combine to make leveling a pretty damn fun time. This happens with every class, and the times you hate it you just gotta try to find a way around that area or just plow through it. This happens in a lot of MMORPGs and can't really avoid it.

I enjoy every minute of playing my rogue. So there!

We also have an adults only membership rule and that has kept loot drama down. 

That is the most ridiculous thing I have heard in a while. Any adult can be just as bad or worse in the noob/"drama" department as any teenager. Likewise, there are plenty of mature teenagers that could outplay someone twice their age any day.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: 0bsessions on 18 Aug 2008, 08:45
Any adult can be as bad, but in my experience there's a larger percentage of teenagers that will bring drama or rudeness. I hate to say it, since it makes me sound old as dirt, but until you've lived through both your teen years AND some adult years, it's kind of hard to judge accurately since you simply don't have the experience of looking at it from both sides of the fence.

The most glaring thing I've taken away from moving from teenage life to adult life is that teenagers do tend to be the more dramatic sort when it boils down. Welcome to hormones.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: 0bsessions on 18 Aug 2008, 10:36
I find the law of averages bears out in all things. Put a guild of teenagers together and a guild of adults together and the odds lean heavily towards the teenagers being more likely to be jerks. That said, no average is an absolute and that won't stop one from running across a guild full of absolute prick 20-somethings or a guild full of thirteen year olds who are friendly, courteous and incredibly mature.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 18 Aug 2008, 10:49
Our guild was run by a married couple and half the other officers where married couples. It was wierd being one of TWO single teenagers who were officers. The guild I was in before THAT was run by a married couple, and our sister guild was run by a married couple. What the hell is going on???
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: 0bsessions on 18 Aug 2008, 10:59
Wait, wait, what? Did the dude's wife go into labor mid-raid or something?

Edit: I'm now compelled to ask Rachel if anything like this happened to her. She's mentioned she was big into the game during her pregnancy since she couldn't really do much else.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: CcAgan on 18 Aug 2008, 11:35

We also have an adults only membership rule and that has kept loot drama down. 

That is the most ridiculous thing I have heard in a while. Any adult can be just as bad or worse in the noob/"drama" department as any teenager. Likewise, there are plenty of mature teenagers that could outplay someone twice their age any day.

We have made a few exceptions for people we had leveled up and guilded with before who we knew were mature and could handle them selves well enough.  In fact our raid leader is 16 (and in a Navy family which has proven a great source of his leadership ability) and does a great job, however we screen new members and shy away from bringing in people who dont understand the demands of family and work.  At least we are not sexist as well and don't have a "you must have a penis to be in our guild" rule.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 18 Aug 2008, 15:04
boo. I need someone to play with.

would it be possible for me to make another character on a european server?

as for "adult-only" guilds, i think that's pretty silly. the one i'm in doesn't have any official minimum age requirement and there's been no drama that i know of. well, we used to have this one noob chick in the guild that was a whiny attention whore that kept on asking people to powerlevel her and kept bragging about the progress she was making in her professions and about crappy green items that she found while questing and kept drawing attention to the fact that she was a real girl, teehee. 
also, apparently some dude gave her 1000g (or more, i don't recall) for no reason.  i am still convinced that she bought the gold cause she was too damn impatient to earn it herself.  eventually she left because the guild wasn't active/social enough for her liking.  :roll:  we are social. we just got sick of your drugged up rambling (the reason she got into wow was cause she broke her leg and sometimes she would take too many painkillers and act even more retarded than usual) and started ignoring you.

Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 18 Aug 2008, 16:04
bah.  more lag? no thanks.
looks like i'm gonna have to find other people to play with. 



Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 18 Aug 2008, 16:58
Dude... wierd... Our GM was the dude and his wife was the main healer too... ok, this is a little odd.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 18 Aug 2008, 18:44
It's not really all that odd.  When you think about it the MT and healer are the archtypical dad & mum of the guild.  Our main healer was the GM in EQ, only he was a dude.  He was an older chap with a very level head and it worked very well.  We burned through MTs though, because generally they tried to take over and either got knocked down a couple of pegs or left in a huff.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 18 Aug 2008, 19:09
Yeah, main tanks (I was one, so I should know) tend to develop very large ego's, but a lot of this is that in PUGs and guilds it is often the Main Tank who is willing to work the hardest and it just sort of draws a type of person; one who knows what to do and wants to be in charge. Lord knows I was like that. It was why I pushed towards making a second raid group in our guild so I could head it up and not have to off-tank and not be raid leader (which I hated).
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Statik on 18 Aug 2008, 19:25
I've always hated most dedicated tanker players I've ever had to deal with.  Most of the ones I've had the displeasure of dealing with seem to think that they are somehow gods gift to the game, and give absolutely no credit to the healer keeping their ass alive.  Every part of a group is important, from DPS to tanking, to healing, etc.  Everyone has a role. 

What interesting about that though, is that the best tanks I have ever played at are always the ones who weren't assholes about it.  Most of the assholes were things ranging from mediocre to good, but rarely excellent.  (And they all thought they were better than they were)

To be fair, my perception of such things may be tainted by the fact that I tend to loathe pve.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 18 Aug 2008, 19:32
Well I definitetly was not an ass-hole, and I basically always worshiped the ground that a good healer walked on, kissing every place they stepped. If you find this odd, you have not played as a tank trying to organize a raiding group.

As for DPS: Hah! No DUH they are important, but it is pretty easy to find a DPSer if you are willing to put up with people who make Terrel Owens look modest. The real challenge is finding a well-geared DPS who is not a douche-rag. My guild eventually ended up with a bunch of them, which was nice.

I don't have a huge amount of experience with other tanks besides this one guy I leveled with from level 10 and the other two tanks in the guild who were both really nice. The reason being is that I always was tank for an instance, almost never dpsing unless it was to help gear out a tank in the guild. What frustrated me most was trying to DPS with a warrior, they are just so goddamned gear dependent compared to other DPS classes I found it far too hard to actually gear up enough to raid as DPS.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Alex C on 18 Aug 2008, 19:58
I've been in 5 raiding guilds in various games and in 3 out of 5 the guild leaders were married couples who played a tank and a healer and the other two cases it was a tank+healer combo who happened to be roommates. It makes sense really; if you're going to pair up in an MMORPGer then you may as well go for the most codepedent (but potentially most rewarding) combo in the game. Tanks tend to end up with a leadership role simply because they can't really help but learn how pulls and patrols go whereas a lot of other classes can often get away with just following his lead. The good players will learn how things go anyway, of course, but as long as aggro management is so important people will continue to defer to tanks when in doubt.

Anyway, I've never really had a problem with a tank. Some tanks get a li'l full of themselves, but I've never noticed it happen more often than with any other role. If I have a beef with any type of character, it's with healers, actually. A lot of them don't seem to feel any particular need to know anything about the instance or do much other than waddle around and make a half-hearted attempt to stay within casting range of the party. My guild was chock full of crappy healers who would happily disparage the dps classes despite the fact that we had to cover for them constantly by dealing stupidly high amounts of damage in a desperate attempt to minimize the amount of time we had to depend on their sorry butts. The funniest part was a couple of really high end guilds started raiding us for healers only to kick them out almost immediately when it turned out they sucked.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Lines on 19 Aug 2008, 08:32
It just really depends on the person playing the character. Since I'm a druid and am building sets for everything, I don't mind healing an instance that my gear can handle. (I've got a balance druid.) The only thing I really refuse to do is heal hunter pets. Hunters have the ability to heal their own pets and I'm not going to waste my time if the tank is taking lots of damage. I've had several hunters get pissy about this, but I don't think all hunters are whiny, annoying, and don't know crap about cc. (Yes, multi-shot the freeze traps why don't you?) The former GM of my guild is a pretty damn good hunter, so I know not all hunters can be idiots.

But since I have a pretty good DPS druid and am bored with spending massive amounts of gold to respec, I'm building up a tank and a healer now, because waiting around for a tank on Feathermoon is killer. Maybe because it's an older server, so all the tanks that have been around are raiding endgame stuff or taking a break until Wrath, but it's silly.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 19 Aug 2008, 20:31
k, low level hunters aren't that great at healing their pets.
so it's nice to get a bit of help with that occasionally!

Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 19 Aug 2008, 21:02
Low level hunters should not really need to heal their pets, TBH, because instances are not supremely difficult at that level. Once in Outland they can heal their pets fine and is the only time they might need help to do so.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 19 Aug 2008, 21:17
Started playing this again the other day.  I am currently at level 54 on my new Warrior named Hadron.  I doubt any of you are on the Oceania server Dath'Remar, but if you are then gimme a message/in-game mail.

Trivia! I picked the name "Hadron" because it sounded Dorfish and also because a Hadron is a small particle that reacts strongly with other particles.  Sounded like a cool description of my Dwarf Warrior, so I went with it.  Later I told Han about my Dorf's name and she almost immediately laughed and said "ha ha, Hard-on."  So yeah, now I can't help reading the name as "Hardon" in whois lists and so forth.  Currrrseeeeessssss!
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 19 Aug 2008, 21:33
Low level hunters should not really need to heal their pets, TBH, because instances are not supremely difficult at that level. Once in Outland they can heal their pets fine and is the only time they might need help to do so.

they're not, but being low level and not that well geared (yet) i'd rather have attacks focused on my pet than on myself because my pet is more armored.  so i do need to heal my pet. maybe i'm doin it wrong. shrug.

and i have to giggle at est's bit of trivia because i'm immature.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: imagist42 on 20 Aug 2008, 07:44
Well, in instances your pet should rarely be the one taking hits. Hunter pets simply cannot MT for instances. But, if you have to use your pet to take aggro off a squishy, then you're generally on your own because the healer will be otherwise occupied and/or be the one you're protecting, which would make it a supremely bad idea for him to continue healing his defender.

Outside of instances/groups you're probably going to have to heal your pet on a regular basis. I don't mean every fight, if that's true you are doing it wrong, but unless you run every time a fight doesn't quite go your way because of adds or whatever then yeah, you'll probably have to manage your pet's health or be halfway decent at kiting to survive. So yeah, get used to it there.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Ozymandias on 20 Aug 2008, 12:48
I have been calling the LHC the Large Hardon Collider for months thanks to Jeffrey Rowland (http://www.overcompensating.com/posts/20080331.html).
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 20 Aug 2008, 22:08
Well, in instances your pet should rarely be the one taking hits. Hunter pets simply cannot MT for instances. But, if you have to use your pet to take aggro off a squishy, then you're generally on your own because the healer will be otherwise occupied and/or be the one you're protecting, which would make it a supremely bad idea for him to continue healing his defender.

Outside of instances/groups you're probably going to have to heal your pet on a regular basis. I don't mean every fight, if that's true you are doing it wrong, but unless you run every time a fight doesn't quite go your way because of adds or whatever then yeah, you'll probably have to manage your pet's health or be halfway decent at kiting to survive. So yeah, get used to it there.

i have a dps pet. it only ends up being used as a sort-of tank if the actual tank ends up ditching.  and i don't see why i should keep healing my pet so my pet can protect a useless healer while they stand around not doing their job.

outside of instances it's not a problem at all. what is kiting?
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: KvP on 20 Aug 2008, 22:18
Started playing this again the other day.  I am currently at level 54 on my new Warrior named Hadron.  I doubt any of you are on the Oceania server Dath'Remar, but if you are then gimme a message/in-game mail.

Trivia! I picked the name "Hadron" because it sounded Dorfish and also because a Hadron is a small particle that reacts strongly with other particles.  Sounded like a cool description of my Dwarf Warrior, so I went with it.  Later I told Han about my Dorf's name and she almost immediately laughed and said "ha ha, Hard-on."  So yeah, now I can't help reading the name as "Hardon" in whois lists and so forth.  Currrrseeeeessssss!
I also read "hardon"

hehe hardon. Wheee fever!

Anyways, this must be what it's like to be a jock listening to a bunch of DnD kids discuss spell tactics or whatever. I love it.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 20 Aug 2008, 23:06
And of course if anyone makes fun of my name in-game I'll probably challenge them to a duel.

Dorfs don't play that shit.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: imagist42 on 20 Aug 2008, 23:14
i have a dps pet. it only ends up being used as a sort-of tank if the actual tank ends up ditching.  and i don't see why i should keep healing my pet so my pet can protect a useless healer while they stand around not doing their job.

outside of instances it's not a problem at all. what is kiting?

If your pet is tanking the healer should be healing it. In that case the healer is retarded. But then again, if your tank ditches in the middle of the instance and you have to have a dps pet tank, well, all normalcy has been thrown out the window anyway. As I said, hunter pets can't really MT instances that well, especially if that pet isn't a boar with gore.

Kiting is basically running mobs around so they can't hit you, taking shots just often enough to keep them interestied while you whittle away their health. You'll generally use instant shots like viper sting and arcane shot, and for this you need to learn jump-shots. While running away from the mob, you jump, turn really quickly with your mouse just far enough (a little over 90 degrees) that it will allow you to shoot and not say "you are facing the wrong direction," get off the shot and turn back around before you land so that you continue running away. You can do interesting things like use concussive shot to slow them down then get off a bigger shot like multi-shot, or lay traps and kite the mob right through them, but the basic idea is if you have enough mana and enough space to move you could kite just about anything to death. That is, melee mobs, casters are annoying because if they get within a certain range of you they will stop and cast a spell which can damage or snare you, rendering your kiting pointless.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 21 Aug 2008, 00:06
Not nearly as interesting as kiting some of the world dragons to major cities before they patched it, or to get the debuff that if you lose all your mana you will detonate and kill everyone around you(also from a world dragon). Why is this amusing? Pally gets it, bubbles, hearths, runs into the Auction House on a saturday afternoon and performs Lay On Hands on nearest target and boom! Terrorist attack wipes out entire Stormwind Auction House!
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: David_Dovey on 21 Aug 2008, 04:23
GODDAMNIT PEOPLE

SPEAK ENGLISH

FUCK
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 21 Aug 2008, 08:53
GODDAMNIT PEOPLE

SPEAK ENGLISH

FUCK

haha, even though i play the game there are still so many terms i don't understand. also sometimes people speak entirely in acronyms and that's kind of weird.

i do get that comic though.  so i'm not a complete noob.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: imagist42 on 21 Aug 2008, 10:56
Gabe's face as he says it all in the second panel is what makes the comic funny.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 21 Aug 2008, 11:44
Or "GD nubs, we told you before the raid, TSR on the OT's target before DPSing, and MD on the MT and don't bubble the damn OT you fucking priest, save your bubble for your own lazy ass when you draw aggro off the MT's target cause you OH more than I thought was humanly possible. AoE the crowds, don't AoE CC, don't TT the CC, and jesus christ, let the MT break CC so you don't get one-shotted.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: michaelicious on 22 Aug 2008, 07:11
Or "GD nubs, we told you before the raid, TSR on the OT's target before DPSing, and MD on the MT and don't bubble the damn OT you fucking priest, save your bubble for your own lazy ass when you draw aggro off the MT's target cause you OH more than I thought was humanly possible. AoE the crowds, don't AoE CC, don't TT the CC, and jesus christ, let the MT break CC so you don't get one-shotted.

Overhealing doesn't generate additional threat.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 22 Aug 2008, 11:14
Yes it does. Each point of healing that you do causes threat, which is why a lot of tanks will take the battlemaster enchant to heal themselves not becuase it heals alot, but because the healing generates and extra few threat.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: michaelicious on 22 Aug 2008, 21:21
Quote from:  wowwiki
Healing generates threat, a fact that is widely known. However, overhealing does not generate any threat for any amount that does not actually heal. In the above example, the healer sent 3000 points of heal, but only 2700 points of heal were actually absorbed by the target. The extra 300 points of heal do not generate any threat at all.

This is important. Overhealing a tank does not make the tank's life more difficult or threaten the healer with aggro above and beyond the given situation. It is therefore often advantageous for the healer to constantly be casting heals in anticipation of incoming damage, and occasionally cancel the heal just before it lands if no damage has been taken (to preserve mana). But if damage has been taken, even if only half of the incoming heal value, the healer can safely let it land on the target, resting assured that no additional threat is generated.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 22 Aug 2008, 22:32
FUCK YOU FOR BEING RIGHT!1!!1!
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Alex C on 23 Aug 2008, 10:47
I've always been in that weird subset of players that wholeheartedly embraces overhealing. Smart overhealing is a very good thing and a great insurance policy, particularly if you're overgeared but the tank is facing high burst damage. Pre-BC druids are the best example, since Nature's Swiftness was their only way to really crank out clutch healing in a pinch. There was really only two ways of avoiding reliance on the cooldown: bringing another healer along to smooth things out (often hilariously overkill) or by intentionally using heals hefty enough to offset worst case scenario bursts. Plus, there's always those gear check high end mobs that deal so much damage that reactive healing is a recipe for abject failure.

The no threat from overhealing thing is also why it's usually positioning or undergeared people that is the problem when healers pull aggro. You could theoretically use infinitely large heals and never pull aggro provided the rest of your raid is cranking out enough threat to outclass the damage coming in from the target.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 23 Aug 2008, 15:16
The question is, Leinad, how long have you been playing under this assumption?

My healers were good enough in raids I never thought to question them and I don't know where I got the notion that over-healing produced aggro... I think it was when I was helping one of our locks level an alt healer and he was all obsessing over his overhealing, so I just assumed that there was actually something bad about it besides wasting mana.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Lines on 28 Aug 2008, 14:32
k, low level hunters aren't that great at healing their pets.
so it's nice to get a bit of help with that occasionally!

Sorry about the late response, but I was away for a while. I was talking about a lvl 70 instance (Bot), a rather easy one at that, and honestly, if the hunter is doing his role correctly, there is no reason why his pet should take enough damage to kill it. The one in particular I was talking about was generally NOT doing what he should have been doing, considering the other hunter who was in there had no problems with his pet. If someone doesn't know how to play their character by lvl 70, well that's their problem.

Also, for the overhealing thing, HoTs are awesome and so are threat meters. Also having a paladin in the group that has Salvation. Oh Salv, how I love thee. Also, supposedly there's some little mod (if you're a healer) that helps you know how much you are healing a target and will warn you when you are overhealing. I don't know what it is, though, as I rarely heal on my druid anymore.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Leinad on 28 Aug 2008, 22:26
Linds, do you agree that Bot is the absolute best instance to run on heroic for a few quick badges? Cause I think so.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: 3Z3VH on 06 Sep 2008, 00:44
Aggro meters are a crutch.  I was in MC before any guild had ever killed Ragnaros, and had been raiding nearly every night from that moment, till the Burning Crusade was released... and I was a Rogue.  We know what it is to pull aggro, and know the delicate balance of too much, and too little aggro reduction, because our "mana pool" was time limited, rather than gear limited, so we had to use every point to it's maximum.  If you raid enough, you really get a feel for aggro management, and know when you are going to aggro before it actually happens.  Aggro meters are not only overly conservative just so you can't yell at the maker saying they were wrong, but they just plain take you out of the game.  I didn't become the undefeated champion of damage on Vaelestraz (as in every time I was there for the fight, I did top damage in the guild, no matter what anyone else tried) by using an aggro meter ;)

Also, the best time I ever had in a game of WoW was in a raid my guild started on the Crossroads.  Sure we had to kill some lowbies to get the Horde's attention, but once we did, more and more 60s from both sides kept rolling in until we had (literally) 60+ horde and 40+ Alliance in two big groups pushing back and forth.  Alliance finally got pushed against the mountains and wiped out, when we came up with The Plan (tm).  We had everyone wait as a corpse until our best geared tank-spec warrior spawned, all the horde immediately descended on him at which point we spawned a few healers for him, and EVERY AOE capable person all at once, and AOE'd all 60+ horde to death in a matter of seconds, while the rogues went around picking off the few who were outside the shitstorm of AOE.    Wiped out their entire faction in a matter of seconds.  My guild easily had 12-15 people with second accounts create a toon on the Alliance side to personally congratulate us on an awesome strat, and a well-played PvP session.  Sure, lowbie gankers suck, but many times they are just there to attract attention to pick a real fight ;)

Anyway, on the PvP note, who is starting up Warhammer ?  I am so excited !!! :)
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: teh pwn queen on 09 Sep 2008, 06:38
All that talk about PvP made me a lil nostaglic for Shadowbane.... now, THAT was the quintessential PvP game if I ever saw own ('course, I played it in it's prime, before it became a **gasp** free downloadable ^_^). You could do anything... kill a guild enemy, completely destroy a guild city, or if you were pissed off at a group member, you could kill them too.  I'm sure many of you wish you could kill someone on your side for being a complete dipweed in WoW.
'Oops...did I agro taht n kil teh enire grp??/??/ Sry mah bad >_< kk lol'
BITCH SMACK!!!!
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Noct on 09 Sep 2008, 12:40
As long as we're speaking of aggro...

I think the most fun I ever had in WoW was actually waaay back in MC on Golemagg (a very straightforward fight), long after we had the place on farm-mode.  Our kick-ass MT would usually take off a few pieces of armor so that he could get some good rage generation going, and I'd give him about 5 seconds of solid tanking time before laying in full throttle with my fury warrior.  The game was to see if I could draw aggro from the tank before the boss fell over, at which point he would turn around, splatter me into the ground, and we'd all have a good laugh.

I called this game Golemaggro.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Lines on 10 Sep 2008, 11:16
Linds, do you agree that Bot is the absolute best instance to run on heroic for a few quick badges? Cause I think so.

Underbog is just as good, I think. Well, Slave Pens, Underbog, Botanica, and Mechanar all seem to be about the same to me. That and the first boss in Mech actually becomes a lot more fun.

As for the aggro meters being a crutch, I think it depends on the person. I never used one before I hit 70 and still sometimes I don't, especially if I have salv. I rarely do enough damage in the groups I'm in to get notice, unless I'm running newer 70s or lower chars through something.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: justlikeaphoto on 17 Sep 2008, 11:57
Underbog and Slave Pens are supposedly the best for badge runs because you can skip trash mob pulls if you're with a semi-experienced group.

I too prefer Bot and Mech though.

And all this talk of MC is making me miss Pre-BC raiding.  Makes me almost want to consider trying to get a group together for a run on Naxx, especially since they'll be relocating it in two months.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: clockworkjames on 17 Sep 2008, 18:15
UB is okay, slave pens is boring as shit, I refuse to tank it ever now. Not done heroics but done every instance you can LFG for at 67 and am sick of most of them honestly.

Respecced to Arms fury (from pretty much the same but messy) and just gonna arena at 70 :/

Hate being a warrior, I know they are not the best for DPS but tanking is boring as shit, either getting praise for being an awesome tank for an arms spec, or getting told I cannot hold aggro well enough because the 70 hunter/frostmage/furywarrior decides it is his turn to pull.

Don't get me wrong, I have caused wipes because of stupidity, but people who don't even try to work in a group are just pricks.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Lines on 21 Sep 2008, 14:19
I have a friend who has a dps warrior. He says he knuckle bashes keys 123 because there's really no point in actually paying attention to what he does. I don't mind, because he's T5/6 and kills things quickly. Also, he has a resto shaman and is really funny when he's healing.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: clockworkjames on 21 Sep 2008, 21:39
9 revenge
0 sunder armour
- thunder clap
= taunt

Then spell reflect 7 shield bash 8.

Middle finger on 0 tap 9 when it lights up but mash 0 the most, - if for aoe or a new mob, = if a squishie takes aggro then shield bash if target heals or 7 if they cast on you.

Keep mashing tab to change targets regularly but don't hit sheep.

Congratz, you are now more competant as a tank than 70% of the tanks I have met.

Tanking is easy, doing it well is not so easy and also boring.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 21 Sep 2008, 21:50
I haven't really experienced the Joy of Tank just yet, as I am still a level 54 Fury-specced RiP-type warrior soloing about.  Once I hit 60 I may re-spec and have a go at tanking for a bit, but my gut feeling is that I'll just keep playing the solo RiP game as is until it stops being fun (which may or may not even happen soon, because the new expansion comes out in November).
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: justlikeaphoto on 22 Sep 2008, 13:19
Just stick with your Fury Spec for now.

There is a huge lack of Tanks on my server (and others I guess) because everyone and their brother wanted to go Fury and pretend to be a "good DPS" class, it'd only break the hearts of those playing to get you as a tank but then find out you wouldn't know how to fully play the class or possibly even play it competently.  I don't mean you specificly but man, that's about enough to make a person wanna quit playing.

I spent seven hours waiting to find a tank for Shadow Labs on Saturday.  Seven hours.

WotLK won't come out soon enough, hopefully the DKs will be able to tank in some half hearted manner.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 22 Sep 2008, 21:45
I understand what you're saying.  At first I was offended because I have a brain and can generally work things out very quickly in video games so I kind of took umbrage with you telling me I wouldn't know how to tank.  However, I realise that you are more bemoaning the fact that there are no decent tanks around these days and also that in the back of my head I have a certain idea of how my conversion to tanking would eventually play out, which includes reading up on the finer points, maybe hitting up a few friends for some training & then doing some lower-level instances where the lower-level dudes would appreciate a higher-level tank to get a feel for things before jumping into the higher level stuff.  I didn't say that in the first place, so I guess you've got every right to assume I'd down axes, pick up a mace and a shield and think "I R tunk nows :D"

That said, I doubt I ever will go over to tanking.  Specialising in tanking would assume that I would be focusing on group play instead of solo, which runs directly contra to both the time I have available to me and my preferred play style which is "avoid depending on other people so as to minimise disappointment."  To that end I tend to avoid instances and PvP for the moment, so Fury is a good way to get by in the PvE game.  I am currently running around with weapons 10 levels below what I should and yet I've still carving up everything in my way due to the effectiveness of the build & most of my damage coming from fixed-damage skills.  That said, I really should look at some new weapons :(
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: justlikeaphoto on 23 Sep 2008, 03:30
Hehe, yeah no personal attacks on you nor am I doubting your ability to research the roll a tank fills in group play.

Bottom line is we need more tanks and no one really wants to play as those any more.  At least not until WotLK comes out mainly because Fury does so well in solo play and PvP, and this totally bums me out.

There are few things worse then trying to get geared to do end game play and not being able to run the standard faire instances to do so.

As a Warlock (wait for the sighs and disapproving head shakes...don't worry mages, even though you're finally getting that buff you've been crying about for the last two years, we're still going to be a more effiecent DPS class) the best gear to stack before hitting Kara and other end game raids (such as Serpent Shine Cavern, Zul Aman, Tempest Keep, blah blah blah) is the Oblivion set, the Dungeon three set specifically for Warlocks.  Of course getting said set requires a minimum of four runs on four different instances (non-heroic mind you) and that would be if you're really, really, really, REALLY lucky and had the Robes and Shoulders both drop from Murmur in the Shadow Labs (I only had the robe drop but that's a good start).

Not only do you need to run Shadow Labs at least once (probably more like five to six times because you rarely see the drop you want on the first try) but you're also stuck running Shattered Halls numerous times, The Steamvault, and The Arcatraz, bearing in mind this is just to get you decently geared for Kara which is nice little bump into Tear 4 raiding gear.

But I digress, we need more tanks.  Simple as that.  Healers too.  WotLK should help fixes some of this, everyone is going to want to play as a Death Knight and according to the beta testing and information Blizzard has released on the class it should be able to tank about as well as a Pally can right now.  So that's good, and hopefully there will be an influx of tanks.  I'm still worried we'll be short handed on healers though.  There are few things worse then running and instance with a Druid or Shammy healer who ends up no being able to keep up because they aren't either specced or geared properly.

On a side note you should really check out group play, find a good guild or something.  I used to be like that too but if you can find the right people group play is so much more fun and rewarding then grinding out solo quests.  And don't worry about buying new weapons.  Once you hit Outland you'll be re-geared so quickly you won't know what hit you.

Something else I can gripe about will be getting Tier 4 and 5 epics replaced by Green Starting Zone Quest Rewards in WotLK.  Hehe.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: clockworkjames on 23 Sep 2008, 07:48
Apparantly Deathknights are going to be capable of tanking with no shield.

I would love to go full prot again, but at 68 rite now all I do is quest grind mobs in Nagarand so it would take too fucking long. This is my reason for there being no tanks, it takes too long to get a group for one shitty instance/raid unless you don't need a pug, this being the only way to level as using a shield to solo is slow. Safe, but slow.

Arms fury spec for now is a mix of PvE and PvP but I feel a PvP respec coming at 70 (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-talents.xml?r=Steamwheedle+Cartel&n=Melville)
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: justlikeaphoto on 23 Sep 2008, 08:46
Woot.  As much as I hate to admit it, I'm sure I'll end up rolling a Death Knight along with my Warlock and my Priest, not totally sure if I'll set him up to roll as a tank or possibly one of the two DPS based classes but it should be fun.

The fact that you get to start out at 55 is fantastic, and then tack on the fact that with patch 3.0.2 leveling from 60 to 70 in the Outlands will be easier and quicker I'll be running around in Northrend in no time.

By the way, has anyone heard anything as far as an official implementation date goes for the WotLK Pre-Patch 3.0.2?

*Edit* Also on a side note if you wanted an endless stream of love as a Pally, forget rolling Prot, roll Holy.  Everyone loves a Pally healer because of their blessings, I'm still crying over the impending removal of Salve.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Lines on 23 Sep 2008, 12:24
I am never tanking on my druid again. And if tanking with a druid is similar to other classes, then I probably won't ever have a tank. Maybe I'll finish leveling my pally some day or start a death knight, but I get too bored with tanking and I'm never going to have a warrior, because I hate rage. (Mana is so much better and so is energy.) DPS is more fun and sometimes healing is, too.

Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 23 Sep 2008, 19:06
My Warrior's at 56 at the moment.  With the expansion supposedly making Outlands content a little easier I will probably take a break from him next week once I hit 58/59 and muck around with an alt for a bit.  I have a Rogue and a Wizard I haven't played in forever as well as a low-level Priest I want to check out. 
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: clockworkjames on 23 Sep 2008, 23:24
56? My warrior was smacking helboars upside the head at that level, it is so damn fast to level in outland get there asap.

I went at 54 and rocketed to 60, if you have friends you can go there in a group at 50 and easily bang mobs one by one for mega xp but wait till 55 if you are going to be solo.

There is no point wasting time in Azeroth past mid 50 any more and when you get to 58 your quest items are insane compared to lv 60 blues and even some epics.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 24 Sep 2008, 00:27
How could you go at 54?  It's level-limited to 58.  Or is that a recent development?
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Covetous on 24 Sep 2008, 01:40
Force/Lure/pay/ask a mage to do a portal to shat and then start walking.
Alternativly I guess you could ask a warlock to summon you.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 24 Sep 2008, 02:49
Nuts to that.  I'll be 58 in a couple of nights play anyway :)
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: justlikeaphoto on 24 Sep 2008, 03:10
Warlocks hate being asked to summon people to random places.  Especially if they don't know you.

Besides, the grind from 50 to 58 is nothing compaired to what it used to be.  Un'Goro, Felwood, Winterspring, and a bit of Silithus will get you there in less then a day if you know how to power grind quests and which ones to skip over.

Then just talk a walk down to the Blasted Lands, make a little hop, skip, and a jump through the Portal and Ta-Dah.  Outlands.

You can easily go from 58 to 60 in less then 6 hours if you know the quests there.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: clockworkjames on 24 Sep 2008, 03:44
Yeah... but if you are 56 now you could be 60 by tonight if you get a portal :/

Just saying it is a lot faster in outlands.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: clockworkjames on 24 Sep 2008, 23:11
Because fury warriors with 2 1h weps are made of suck :/

Even full epic 70's only get like 1.5k per crit from what I have seen. Only really good if you have a healer, take the aggro of 3-4 mobs then start spinning like a mad cunt, then you do okay but sweeping strikes and a strong 2h wep, with slam will do simmilar.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 24 Sep 2008, 23:38
Everything I've read re: DPS has been to the contrary.  2x 1h with Fury for solo PvE, 2h with Arms for PvP, 1h + shield for tanking.  Where your mainly-Arms tree build is focused on increasing the damage your weapons do the Fury tree's damage generation isn't simply weapon-based, it is supplemented mainly by Flurry, Bloodthirst (which is propped up by Rampage if you like - and I do like) and your increased rage generation from Unbridled Wrath letting you make more special attacks and such.

I apologise pre-emptively because you probably already know all that.  I just don't want to assume you do, I guess.  It's just that I see lots of build analyses and such talking about Fury being sustained DPS with a small amount of healing from Bloodthirst (and it is noticeable, especially supplemented with a Lifestone or some other small, constant healing item) whereas Arms is more of a burst-damage model that achieves roughly the same amount of damage but is not as sustainable.  If you have information to the contrary then I'd love to know it.  I'm specialised in dual-wielding at the moment, but if I am missing out on a definite benefit then I'm open to other suggestions.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 24 Sep 2008, 23:43
Anyway, basically I am going to end up with a build something like this guy's: http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Jubei%27Thos&n=Dethecus

Here's my progress so far: http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Dath%27Remar&n=Hadron
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Alex C on 25 Sep 2008, 18:21
Yeah, est's got it right. Fury is ALL about flurry and stacking your strength stupidly high (once you have your +hit & crit up to snuff, of course). I don't play anymore, but here's an armory of my fury warrior guildmember Drago. None of his blows are all that terribly impressive individually, but it all adds up stupidly fast. The dude has got no mercy.

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Garona&n=Drago
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 25 Sep 2008, 20:09
That guy has made some odd choices like the 1 sec off Whirlwind cooldown, but whatever!  So long as it works for him.  I have been wondering about the effectiveness of Weapon Mastery lately, because I find myself getting disarmed a bit by certain mobs.  I am not sure why he's gone for Heroic Strike over full ranks of Deflection, because even at 57 I find myself not using it all that much because it sucks Rage up like nothing else.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Storm Rider on 25 Sep 2008, 20:50
Why am I dicking around with the talent calculator now it is not like I have any idea what any of this shit means
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 25 Sep 2008, 21:24
But but but: numbers in boxes!
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Alex C on 25 Sep 2008, 21:48
est: Dude's a pure raider and his gear hit the point where his rage generation was outpacing his typical DPS cycle, so Imp. WW and Imp. HS are great for tightening up his cycle and dumping off some extra rage. Heroic strike, btw, really comes into its own at high end play with all that extra rage you can get; on top of the flat tooltip damage bonus, you also get the 20% damage increase from Impale if it crits, which is a pretty hefty boost over a normal white hit. And yeah, deflection is really nice, but it's not really essential, per se, and in high end raiding pulling aggro can be deadly even to guys geared up as secondary tanks if the healers aren't aware that there's about to be an aggro transfer. A fury warrior is basically a dead man if he gets aggro in that scenario, deflection or not. As for Weapon Mastery, it's an absolutely beautiful talent, actually. Unlike players, mobs can still dodge even when being attacked from behind, it's just not something people notice too often for multiple reasons-- in your case, it's probably because you're not a raiding dps warrior and thus you likely spend your time in front of the mobs rather than smacking them in the ass alongside the rogues while someone else tanks. ;) And hey, an accuracy boost is an accuracy boost, even if you are the one tanking.

Really, the difference between Dethecus and Drago's builds simply comes down to how much tanking and pvping you do. Tactical mastery and Deflection are obviously great for longevity and stance dancing while Weapon Mastery is a awesome if you want to make sure every swing counts. The bread 'n' butter remain the same either way.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 25 Sep 2008, 21:51
Makes sense!  Thanks for the clarification.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Alex C on 25 Sep 2008, 22:05
Trust me, I'm not surprised ya questioned the Imp. Heroic strike. Drago's cheerily admitted that the first chunk of the Arms tree is kind of a crap shoot as far as pure dps is concerned, but Impale is just too good to pass up.

Plus, it's probably a lot easier to be cavalier about Deflection when you have 10k hps in your dps gear. For what it's worth, my old warrior alts all had 5 Deflection. ;)
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: clockworkjames on 26 Sep 2008, 01:18
SLAM is where it's at for arms, I never had it on my skill bar until lv 68 because how useless it seems but with a slow 2h wep, hits once every 3 secs at best, spending 15 rage to so an attack +100 dmg every half second+cd is brutal, then think sweeping strikes for PvE when you overpull, with a string of crits on 1 char you can keep over 1000 DPS.

In PvP it is a little harder, charge and then slam a squishy while they are stunned, but with rogues it is pot luck, .5secs is a long cast time but there is a chance by the time they jumped away they will jump back in front of you then BAM, mace to the head. If you want to PvE roll prot, you will get a group EASY and it's not tthat fun, takes more skill than most other jobs to do it rite and you learn the skill of marking targets.

I test all my shit on private instant 70 servers, and as such I have done serious experimentation in builds. I like PvP so I am arms fury. If you want to try PvE fury good luck, some people just don't take you seriously next to a rogue/mage/hunter for DPS.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 26 Sep 2008, 02:29
Yeah, I have heard a bit about Slam being good with slow weapons because it only takes the weapon's base damage value into account when calculating it's own damage.   Makes sense for PvP because you want to do as much damage as possible in a small timeframe.

Also, re: no-one taking me seriously over a rogue or something, that is ok!  For the most part I don't want to play with other people anyway and I am getting decent results solo quest leveling with this build.  Perhaps later it'll get harder, but so far I have leveled from 1-57 without grouping seriously.  Maybe once or twice to share kills for a quest, but once that's over we go our separate ways.  Haven't done any instances or anything like that because they are mostly a waste of my rather limited gametime.  I just skin and mine the shit out of everything I see and buy decent weapons with the proceeds.  My rogue alt can do Fiery weapon enchants, ammunition and scopes for rifles, so I generally add that to the weapons I have for the damage boost, and when he gets high enough for Lifestealing I'll probably change to that instead for more damage+self-heals.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: lief on 26 Sep 2008, 08:37
How about the new PVE to PVP server transfers, level up in the safety of the carebears, and then go kill people XD ... Just trying to stoke the flames a bit, Honestly I think my favorite PVP game overall was UO, you could lose everything (before item insurance) and people would just have brawls, PVP'ers would make houses near moongates and just fire off from the houses reds vs blues. Great system.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: clockworkjames on 26 Sep 2008, 08:41
Outlands is suck for solo-ing. Either boring grind quests or dying alone lots, gotta group dungeons. You can get from 10% to 40% of a level from the one dungeon, did about 30ish dungeon runs from 58-70, it is a good way to get some nice gear too.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Yakob on 26 Sep 2008, 11:59
I'm pretty much the opposite of est. I'm all about the instancing and hardly ever quest unless a certain quest yields a good piece of equipment.

Guys, let's talk about rogues so I can participate more.

I'm pretty psyched that they are ditching Flash Powder in WotLK. I'm always forgetting to buy that shit.

Edit: My rogue (you have to change the %F3 in my name in the url to ó (alt+162)) (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bleeding+Hollow&n=Nótt)
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Eris on 26 Sep 2008, 16:27
Ha ha, you play a girrrrrrrrl
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Eris on 26 Sep 2008, 16:36
In all seriousness though, I guess that build is pretty good for what you're doing.  I wondered why you didn't have anything in the top end of Subtlety as people normally do, but then remembered you group all the time so it's not important.  Are you going to go deeper into Combat or start getting things in the Assassination tree that'll be good in group, like the Imp Expose Armour?
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Yakob on 26 Sep 2008, 17:46
I'm not really sure, to be honest. I'll probably end up repeccing to fix up my current build.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Alex C on 26 Sep 2008, 19:43
Honestly, I hate the subtlety tree with the burning heat of a thousand suns for anything but PvP. You don't need Camoflauge or MoD to sneak up on mobs, Improved Sap doesn't even exist anymore, Hemo takes a LOT of fiddling to compete with Sinister Strike and daggers are kinda trashy these days so I'm not fond of Improved Ambush or Opportunity. There's things to like about the Subtlety tree, (Initiative and Preparation are dead sexy talents) but they're all buried at least 10 points down into the tree and even then I doubt I'd give up Combat Potency or Mutilate unless I was really hardcore about pvp utility. There's really nothing wrong with Nótt's build that shooting straight for Lethatlity won't fix.

Improve Expose Armor is OK in pvp builds, but for some dumb reason Blizzard refuses to let it stack with the warrior ability Sunder Armor. Even worse, dropping an Improved Expose Armor on a mob actually forbids the warrior from using Sunder Armor on it to build threat, which is a great way of really pissing off your tank.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: clockworkjames on 27 Sep 2008, 01:02
Improve Expose Armor is OK in pvp builds, but for some dumb reason Blizzard refuses to let it stack with the warrior ability Sunder Armor. Even worse, dropping an Improved Expose Armor on a mob actually forbids the warrior from using Sunder Armor on it to build threat, which is a great way of really pissing off your tank, then he drops aggro to you and you die.
Fix'ed.

And also for ó you can do ctrl+alt+o methinks...

I though subtlety was strictly PvP? But I dunno as I never played a rogue past 19. Jamés on Dunemaul EU I think.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Yakob on 27 Sep 2008, 06:21
Update: I repecced very shortly after my last post to get to the bottom of combat.

I'm with Whipstitch, subtlety is the bane of my existence.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Alex C on 27 Sep 2008, 10:47
Rogue talents are pretty easy, really; it's hard to go wrong with a heavy combat spec and dipping into assassination for Relentless Strikes and Lethality. After that, it's really just a matter of hitting max level and then changing your spec to match whatever is dropping for you. For example, back when I still mained a rogue, I was a bigger fan of using maces/swords/fists and Sinister Strike than I was of using daggers and Backstab, but with the right mix of Combat talents, you can make them all do pretty similar damage, even if Backstab is kind of a pain in the ass compared to Sinister Strike during solo play. Pre-BC, I actually ended up with Combat Daggers as my primary simply because the Perdition's Blade and Core Hound Tooth both dropped for me relatively quickly.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: clockworkjames on 28 Sep 2008, 06:05
I got a new purple http://www.wowhead.com/?item=37597

:/ Not too good for a 2h mace spec warrior... suppose I could use it to tank or something... Everyone passed it.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Alex C on 28 Sep 2008, 06:50
Man, that would have been such a sweet dagger prior to the attack power normalization.

/sigh

It's still nice though.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: clockworkjames on 28 Sep 2008, 11:12
It looks like a broken bottle.

Ultimate chib tool.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 06 Oct 2008, 17:07
So uh, I guess I am in Outland now and have hit 60 (jumped two levels last night while questing with a friend).  The jump in gear quality really is quite striking.  I've had pretty decent gear up until this point.  I've had people look at me and say "shit, that is some decent gear."  I got to some kind of "collect a bunch of trash" quest right outside Honor Hold and the resulting reward was only green and yet blew the shit out of the blue item it was meant to replace.

So yeah, anyway.  Been doing quests and such.  The mobs here are a bit harder than I am used to because they've all been 59-62 and I've been 58/59.  I've been kind of bludging for the last little while doing quests in areas that are a bit lower than my level, so the increased level of challenge is actually a lot of fun.  My next goal at the moment is to save up the money for my level 60 riding training + mount.  "Fun!"
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Alex C on 06 Oct 2008, 18:24
Hey, est, I was looking at your trinkets and thought you might want to pick this li'l beauty up: Strength of the High Chief (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=34423). It's really quite easy to get plus the quests should still net you experience, even if most of them are green  to you at this point. You go just go to Winterfall and kill Winterfall Furbolgs until one drops an Empty Firewater Flask (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=12771), which doesn't take long. It starts a quest chain that requires you to go back and forth between Winterfall and Fellwood once or twice, but you don't have to run any instances or anything, so it'd be a cakewalk solo, especially now that you've got some outland gear. Once you get to the part to where you kill the High Chief Winterfall it's a simple matter of looting a quest-giving book he drops (he only drops it when you're killing him for the chain quests, btw) and turning it in for a pretty nice trinket. The only real DPS upgrades to it prior to the mid-60s require pvp or running instances, so I thought I'd mention it. It's a pretty nice payoff relative to the work you have to put in to get it.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 06 Oct 2008, 20:05
Oh man, an I'd been looking into replacing that crappy loofa with something too.  Thanks for the heads-up, I'll email the details to my home account (I'm at work at the moment).
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Alex C on 06 Oct 2008, 21:22
I think getting rid of the Luffa as basically a WoW rite of passage for each character. It's especially egregious in your case since you can just stoneform out of bleed effects as a dwarf anyway. Blizz was crazy tightfisted with trinkets before BC came out though; it seems like practically everyone ends up hitting 60 with a luffa+carrot-on-a-stick combo. Can you believe they put the Strength of the High Chief into the game with a post expansion patch? I had done that quest like a million times before just for the experience, so I nearly crapped myself when I got that thing while leveling an alt.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 07 Oct 2008, 03:52
Just finished this little sequence.  Was pretty easy, just had to run back and forth a bit.  Thanks again for the tip, I like the new trinket.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: justlikeaphoto on 07 Oct 2008, 06:56
So uh, I guess I am in Outland now and have hit 60 (jumped two levels last night while questing with a friend).  The jump in gear quality really is quite striking.  I've had pretty decent gear up until this point.  I've had people look at me and say "shit, that is some decent gear."  I got to some kind of "collect a bunch of trash" quest right outside Honor Hold and the resulting reward was only green and yet blew the shit out of the blue item it was meant to replace.

So yeah, anyway.  Been doing quests and such.  The mobs here are a bit harder than I am used to because they've all been 59-62 and I've been 58/59.  I've been kind of bludging for the last little while doing quests in areas that are a bit lower than my level, so the increased level of challenge is actually a lot of fun.  My next goal at the moment is to save up the money for my level 60 riding training + mount.  "Fun!"

The easiest way to make money in Outlands (And you'll need A LOT of it.  Buying the training for the level 60 Epic Mounts, the level 70 Flying Mount, and then the level 70 Epic Flying Mounts will cost a ton and depending on what you want for the mounts themselves you can tack on another 600 to 2000 gold.) is grind every quest you can, sell any trade skill mats you can, farm Primals, and eventually once you reach 70, doing Daily Quests.  If you can managed to do at least 10 to 15 Daily quests each day you can rack up gold very quickly as each one generally gives you between 8 and 12 pieces of gold.  Do not waste money on trade skill items, gear, or gems for the most part.

A different option would be the scrub route.  Grind your quests, horde your gold, hit 70, and just do Daily quests.  Farm those until Wrath of the Lich King drops and continue in the same fashion.  When Patch 3.0.2 goes live (hopefully next week on the 14th) leveling Outlands will go by a lot faster.

If you're the type of person who really wants to get Exalted with the majority of the Outland factions run the starting level instances until the quit giving rep.  It's just about as efficent as questing and in some cases even more so.  If you don't mind running the instances that is.  Regardless of how you feel I really, really, REALLY recommend doing this once you reach Zangermarsh for Centurian Expedition.  There are a lot of really great thigns at the Reveared and Exalted level, especially the War Hippogryph (A level 70 Epic Flying Mount, with the Exalted discount it'll run you 1600 Gold).  I also recommend grinding rep on the Consortium.  There is a monthly repeatable quest where they'll give you gems based on your rep standing, the higher you are with them the better gems you get.  If you're at Exalted you have a decent change for some really nice Rare gems and even some Epic gems.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 07 Oct 2008, 15:53
Sounds good, guys.  I am a miner/skinner anyway & sell the mats on the AH.  It's how I've financed most of my gear so far.  The only money-suck I have is an alt who enchants, but now that he's up to Fiery weapon enchants I can put the brakes on for a bit until I get up enough money to get him up to whatever the life-stealing one is.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: ackblom12 on 07 Oct 2008, 17:24
Ok, guys, I think I'm actually going to restart my account. Any suggestions on servers? I'd probably be rolling Horde for my alt and trying to decide if playing my main Alliance Priest is still fun or not.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Imnawtinsane on 08 Oct 2008, 04:05
Honestly, after playing through the game at level 60, getting raid gear and such, then playing through 70 with multiple characters, getting 1850 arena ratings, 4/5 season 4 and whatnot, it all got boring. so I quit. Yeah I just do RL stuff now, and it was worth quitting. also looking to sell account with Amazing gear. (3 70s and a 65) Private message me if interested
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: justlikeaphoto on 08 Oct 2008, 11:30
Ok, guys, I think I'm actually going to restart my account. Any suggestions on servers? I'd probably be rolling Horde for my alt and trying to decide if playing my main Alliance Priest is still fun or not.

I are on Sisters of Elune currently.  I've played on a handful but so far this is by far my favorite.  Mok'Nathal comes in at a close second but only because I knew a ton of people on there.

SoE is a pretty stable server though, RP-PVE (Don't let the RP part scare you, it's no different from a standard PVE server except people are generally a little bit nicer and Silvermoon City is full of people aimlessly walking around in the streets together or RP-ing in the Inns).  It has a good economy (geared mainly towards level 70 players with a surplus of gold or alts they're feeding it to), a good population, and good progression.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: axerton on 09 Oct 2008, 01:46
Well encouragement from a cute girl finally pushed me over the edge and I bought the game three weeks ago. Currently on Aman'Thul server, with my main a lvl 40 Draenei arcane Mage and and 4 alts at lvl 10 (human rogue, Nelf druid, dwarf hunter, gnome warlock) currently really enjoying mucking around with the alts.

The timing on this however could have been better as I have my exams coming up soon. Hopefully I will manage to find the self discipline that I seem to have lost at birth, not likely but I'm remaining optimistic for the moment. Also I know that should this game cause me to fail my exams I'll never pay for another gamecard again.

The afore mentioned cute girl set me up with the recruit a friend thing - and we have characters made solely to play together but gaining 3x experince on everything (including quest experience) isn't as fun as you might think because you're progressing so fast you don't get any continuity with the quests and also I don't particularly like being in a constant party, don't get me wrong joining up with some people for a quest or two is fine, but I don't like to have someone waiting around wanting to go out questing while I'm jerking around with trades skills and such. It probably doesn't help that that character is a hunter and she's playing a Priest, a combination that doesn't seem to meld well. Money and equipment is an issue too, because by it basically divides the number of quests done and enemies killed by 3, meaning it's not always easy to afford all your spells let alone good stuff and you get fewer quest rewards or item drops.

Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: imagist42 on 09 Oct 2008, 08:13
Recruit-a-friend is retardedly broken, especially since Blizz already fixed levels 20-60 so they go by faster. The experience boost should be something more reasonable, like a constant 1.5x rested state or something. I guess they just figure people want to get to 60 and jump into Outland as soon as possible, but that's forgetting that millions of people found Azeroth fun enough before TBC.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: clockworkjames on 09 Oct 2008, 11:33
I found this shortly after I made my "thunder" hammer.
(http://i243.photobucket.com/albums/ff278/sekdar/stunherald_final.jpg)
"Rogues finally found their place in 5v5 arena"
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Alex C on 13 Oct 2008, 12:17
I keep having the craziest urge to renew my account and start over on a new server. Someone tell me I'm crazy.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: imagist42 on 13 Oct 2008, 14:09
Whoa man, those changes hella make me want to play. I did not even know there were changes to that extent!

I mean, if I even had a full month left in which I could play, I so would.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 13 Oct 2008, 20:28
Guys! Resist the urge! We've all been there, remember why you quit to begin with. Sure, it seems like you can just hop back on and pretend like nothing happened, but I've been down that way before, multiple times, and the stories' always the same. The grind, the gear, the frustration of trying to play a pickup game, the rogues. Down that path is a lot of heartache, and you need to stay strong. I love you guys, I just don't want to see you hurt.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Alex C on 13 Oct 2008, 20:31
But I could go back and just play for a little while! Just for a drop or two, for old time's sake. I can quit anytime I want.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Beren on 13 Oct 2008, 20:40
Quote
You can enter BG's without talking to a battlemaster! You can swap between two talent sets!

Neither of these will be implemented until the first patch after Lich King, unfortunately. =P
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: imagist42 on 13 Oct 2008, 22:16
Actually, if I were to be around when the level cap is raised (which I'm not), I probably would hop on again, level to 80, and then get bored enough to quit. As I've said before, I only enjoy the game when I'm a) growing as I explore the world (progressing from area to area and levelling with quests), or b) taking it on as some kind of full-time job, constantly playing through endgame content for better and better gear. And I have come to acknowledge (twice; both before and after TBC) that I simply cannot afford to do the second one. So while I will not be able to play the game for quite some time, I could easily see myself coming back eventually to catch up on all the former type of fun that I have missed, then dropping when I hit whatever the level cap is at that point.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: est on 13 Oct 2008, 23:57
I am still at 60 because I've been playing other things for a bit.  Some of the changes look good, but others like the Warrior talent tree revamp look like they are going to alter the way I play completely, which is not so good.  Oh well, I guess we'll see how things pan out.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: Covetous on 14 Oct 2008, 01:08
Indeed it is very tempting. Think about all the new fun blue and purpel stuff you can find. But I get so much done now that I'm not playing any mmorpgs. Thats one of my main reasons not to ever with start WoW again. It takes so "jävla" much time.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: 0bsessions on 14 Oct 2008, 06:26
Recruit-a-friend is retardedly broken, especially since Blizz already fixed levels 20-60 so they go by faster. The experience boost should be something more reasonable, like a constant 1.5x rested state or something. I guess they just figure people want to get to 60 and jump into Outland as soon as possible, but that's forgetting that millions of people found Azeroth fun enough before TBC.

The biggest problem with the Recruit-a-Friend is the monetary issue. You're not earning a proportionate amount of gold to properly up your skills. I'm currently level 40 with a whopping six gold to my name and only one blue item because I have to sink pretty much everything I get into skills. My Druid is rough enough (I solo with him a lot too, so that helps), but my hunter is absolutely fucked cause I overindulged in the grant a level from my brother, so now I can't afford ANY skills most of the time and my professions are practically non-existent at like level 32.

The recruit-a-friend drive seems less designed for new players and more designed for former players who'd like to circumvent the grinding and know enough ins and outs of the game to keep their earnings on proper pace. Rachel's got money on alts and from her dad and my brother played for years and knows how to easily earn gold. It kind of leaves the legitimate new users they're allegedly trying to entice out in the cold. That said, I'm still playing, so I guess they're doing something right.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: supersheep on 14 Oct 2008, 07:07
So I guess I am about to take the plunge into this seething pit of terror! YAY!
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: clockworkjames on 14 Oct 2008, 09:26
You write to gold beggers? I r-click>report spam :/
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: imagist42 on 14 Oct 2008, 10:11
Gold beggers typically don't qualify as spam. It's the gold sellers that do.
Title: Re: Jeph and WoW
Post by: clockworkjames on 14 Oct 2008, 10:21
<Trade> Valyuntbladworryur: CAN I HAS 1G PLEESE?!!
<Trade> Valyuntbladworryur: CAN I HAS 1G PLEESE?!!
<Trade> Valyuntbladworryur: CAN I HAS 1G PLEESE?!!
<Trade> Valyuntbladworryur: CAN I HAS 1G PLEESE?!!

Is spam.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 14 Oct 2008, 15:23
Ok so, here's a thing.  Last night I tried to log on.  It said something about extended downtime, then started downloading a 1.2gb 3.0.2 PTR patch.  I've never played on the PTR servers in my life, so why on earth did it start downloading it?  Anyone else here have a similar problem?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 14 Oct 2008, 15:41
I already did it, hehe.

Anyway, I've taken a quick look about on some WoW news sites and seen that it really is a public realms patch.  But here's the thing - 1.2gb for a patch?  Are you shitting me?  While it's true that I have only just reinstalled WoW I've also copied my old folder over the top of the new one.  Last time I reinstalled this went swimmingly.  It might not actually be a 1.2gb patch, but I am not sure what could have gone wrong with my install.  I'll double-check it at some point, not sure I want to just download the 1.2gb patch blindly.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dimmukane on 14 Oct 2008, 15:44
It is actually supposed to be 1.2 GB, it's supposed to be a preparation patch, has some new areas, adds the achievements, etc.  Not that I care, I don't play the game, that's just what I've read.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 14 Oct 2008, 15:56
Yeah, I just found some people talking about 1.2gb prep patch, then a 300mb secondary patch after that.  That is fucking insane.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 14 Oct 2008, 16:08
15 gig?  That is exceptionally unreasonable.  Like, to the point where I would take the game back and tell them to fuck off.  We have download quotas here in Australia.  If you go over them one of three things happen: 1. your service stops working until you pre-pay more money, 2. your service gets capped to something between 19.2k and 64k depending on the ISP, 3. you are charged extremely exorbitant per-gb rates.  I am on one of the higher tiers for quotas and I still only get 20gb.  Depending on what time of the month I'd be downloading it 15gb would either put me into a very cautious mode for the rest of the month or push me over the limit.  I'm gonna say that probably 60-80% of normal users in Australia would have download limits way less than 15gb.  The norm for entry-level type stuff (which is all some people get) is about 2-5gb.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 14 Oct 2008, 16:22
1.2gb prep patch, then a 300mb secondary patch after that. 

and then after you install the secondary patch you most likely won't be able to enjoy the new content anyway because a lot of the realms are down. bah.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 14 Oct 2008, 16:42
Realms and forums. Dammit, my vacation is over and I want to play around with my Druid! For fuck's sake, Blizzard, get it together!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: CursedMortivore on 15 Oct 2008, 12:38
Today, I broke all my WoW discs in two.

I am so proud of myself.

Don't worry. There's always digital download for when you get the jones again.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 15 Oct 2008, 12:46
I am impressed! You are my new hero!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Melodic on 15 Oct 2008, 13:32
I am happy for you, dude.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Liz on 15 Oct 2008, 13:33
Jens.

You are now a good man.

Congratulations.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 15 Oct 2008, 14:41
There's like a 90% chance I'll renew just to make a new rogue and go Sword combat again.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 15 Oct 2008, 18:18
You can always make yourself another account Jens. With World of Warcraft's crazy low price of only 29.99 and it now easier than ever to level up, you could have another maxed out character in no time! Hooray!!.....awwww.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Roivas on 16 Oct 2008, 01:01
WoW, I simply don't get the appeal. I mean I like killing people but not enough to actually pay someone to do it monthly. I prefer just taking the free ride version of killing random hobos in my spare time. I found the whole game to be a little shallow and dull with too much repetition and samey quests that never gave a feeling of accomplishment. Of course dealing with anyone in the game was like pulling teeth on top of being mildly like filling out a form.

I still have the discs, remember my user name and password, and feel absolutely no urge to pick it up again.

But I guess some people like doing the same three or four simple tasks endlessly.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 16 Oct 2008, 02:50
I like working with people and tinkering with builds and attributes. The rest is details, as far as I'm concerned. I find people who mostly enjoy solo play kind of puzzling, honestly. Then again, I don't give two craps about immersion in games or get all giddy because some game allows me to decapitate people, so maybe I'm a gaming anomaly.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 16 Oct 2008, 04:52
But I guess some people like doing the same three or four simple tasks endlessly.

FPS games: "you aim at a bad guy and then shoot.  oh god, so boring!"
RTS games: "you build the same things over and over then your little dudes walk around and hit things.  oh god so boring!"
Brawlers: "you press buttons and kill people over and over.  oh god so boring!"
Fighters: "you mash buttons and you dude hits th other dude!  OH GOD SO BORING!"

I know it's really easy to put shit on WoW because lolol only social retards play WoW but I am getting pretty sick of people coming in here to say how much they hate the game.  Ok, I get it.  You don't like it.  Great.  Why are you in this thread?  If I took this attitude I'd be in every second music forum thread complaining about how much whoever people are talking about sucked.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 16 Oct 2008, 05:22
Also: freedom
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: axerton on 16 Oct 2008, 05:24
I mean I like killing people but not enough to actually pay someone to do it monthly. I prefer just taking the free ride version of killing random hobos in my spare time.

Obvious troll is .... well you know the rest.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Eris on 16 Oct 2008, 05:42
Also: freedom

And fun.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 16 Oct 2008, 16:47
I don't think he is a troll, I just think he's a hyper-negative ass.  Look back through most of his posts and you'll see a trend.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 16 Oct 2008, 16:51
No Est I think the problem is your too positive.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Roivas on 16 Oct 2008, 17:45
"I don't think he is a troll, I just think he's a hyper-negative ass.  Look back through most of his posts and you'll see a trend."

No, he got it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 16 Oct 2008, 18:22
Ok great.  Roivas has been banned for trolling & just generally being a dick.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: David_Dovey on 17 Oct 2008, 00:35
If I took this attitude I'd be in every second music forum thread complaining about how much whoever people are talking about sucked.

This is why Khar doesn't get to be a mod
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 17 Oct 2008, 01:23
So, I play WoW now. I've got a level 44 Human Mage on Caelestraz. My boyfriend talked me into playing and he did the recruit-a-friend thinger, so we are getting triple xp until we hit 60. It's pretty fun so far.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: SnhKnives on 17 Oct 2008, 07:12
Hmm, i play WoW pretty seriously but i never had a problem quitting. I stopped several times for months at a time. Alas i do end up coming back but i never had to get my friend to disable my account for me just to stop playing lol...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 17 Oct 2008, 07:37
Thats how alcoholics describe it as well. :roll:

But ofc I dont think that wow is the same as alcoholism. Just a remark that its not a very good "defence". ;)
My self I'm having great troubles not buying the new expansion. It's allways fun when something is new and fresh. But sins _all_ my friends have left for war I thing WOTLK will have to wait untill we are a few who are ready to give it a try again.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: J-cob9000 on 17 Oct 2008, 09:02
I played WoW a while back on my friends account on a separate character. It was pretty fun, got pretty repetitive but I'd like to try it again sometime. We have better internet now and I might be willing to pay for an account myself.
I'm addicted to Battlefield instead, currently.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 17 Oct 2008, 09:41
FUCK YEAH! DAILIES FOR MONEY TO RESPEC! AGAIN!

I have learned Fury tree is suck, Titan's grip is not as awesome as it should be and arms is still the dogs bollocks. I would roll prot but all my gear is DPS, maybe later...

Oh, and FUCK YOU BLIZZ FOR WHAT YOU DID TO MACE SPECIALISATION YOU BASTARDS!
Everything else in 3.0.2 is pretty kickass.

 :|
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 17 Oct 2008, 09:45
I'd play again if I had a guild with meatlife friends or something.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 17 Oct 2008, 09:50
Man, 3.0.2 has been a dream come true as far as being a Druid. Entangling roots is usable in doors now, we got Revive aaaaaaaaaaaand we can now open chests and perform quest related actions without having to shift back to humanoid form! That last one's great as I've had far too many quests where I've burned the everliving shit out of my mana shifting out of cat or bear to collect something and then having to shift right back to keep fighting.

The talent tree has suffered a little now. Taking a couple of points out of some talents has resulted in a slight drop in my overall Dire Bear form's armor levels (I'm just now getting back to around 4,000 at level 43 when I was previously there back at 39).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 17 Oct 2008, 11:38
Yeah, I'm not surprised at all to hear people slagging on Titan's Grip. The second I heard about how it would work, I expected two things to happen: for people to have nasty miss streaks because many still don't have enough +hit but will spec over to it anyway and for people to have near-crippling rage starvation from said miss streaks plus the slow speed of the weapons. Fury warriors rock, but the key to their power is their excellent scalability. Dual wielding Fury warriors are stupidly gear dependent and you really want at least 95 hit rating at 70, and people in the know tend to shoot for 150-200 once they've gotten their crit percentage over 25% or so (in order to keep flurry uptime as close to 100% as possible). Hell, depending on your hit rating, you may be better off just single wielding a 2 hander rather than bothering with Titan's Grip. Misses don't deal damage, and Titan's Grip has another penalty beyond even normal dual wielding.

Anyway, with appropriate gear a Fury warrior should spank an equivalent Arms warrior in the DPS category although Arms certainly beats Fury in PvP utility.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 17 Oct 2008, 12:48
I can spin really fast for 6 seconds every 90 seconds, so fuck you.

15% of the time(!) I will be spinning really really really fast like a spikey dwarven dervish.

Also 0bsessions I am impressed by your understanding of the game at your level, I think at 40 I was running around with a 1h and shield, really badly specced arms/prot and being designated tank every group I joined.

I sucked up until I started thinking about the game circa 55  :-(
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 17 Oct 2008, 12:59
I've only been playing WoW since September, but I've played about four or five other MMOs (Star Wars Galaxies, Final Fantasy XI, City of Heroes, Everquest II), a couple table tops (D&D, Vampire and Big Eyes Small Mouth) and a ton of console RPGs, so I get all the basic conventions.

That said, for what I do know, I still have a long ways to go. I'm at 43 and have no mount, rather crappy items and am absolutely terrible at earning money (Though grinding and selling armor kits has been helping that lately and I'm at the perfect level for farming Black Dragonkin which is the fucking tits for earning money and leather at the same time).

Which brings me to my next subject. As a skinner, I have an obvious hard on for skinnable humanoids ever since being introduced to Yeti back in the Foothills. I'm getting ass tones of good stuff from Dragonkin, too (Which I did not know were skinnable). Once I'm leveled past Dustwallow, any suggestions for locations for good skinnable humanoids in the future? It's great being able to kill two birds with one stone on them. I'd been doing mostly quests that involved humanoids for a while and just last night I was able to grind my leatherworking up from 210 to 227 last night with the disgusting amount of thick leather I was pulling off the Dragonkin in the Den of Flames.

Edit: Here's my character for point of reference: Murphus (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Llane&n=Murphus). Though for the sake of recent developments, I'm now up three levels, found a blue ring to replace cobalt ring and upgraded my mace, chest, legs, belt and feet.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 17 Oct 2008, 13:35
If you don't have it, download the questhelper addon, it is the only one I really suggest (I use a few more but it is the only one I feel sucky without, then just do instances and quests for the next 15 levels, don't buy a thing (Mounts are optional for druids anyway to be honest) then jump over to outland, buy a mount and repeat. Should be 70 in time for wrath :)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 17 Oct 2008, 16:17
Feralas is not bad for skinning. More Yetis too. Giants along the coast though and a long ass boat trip out to the main quest givers.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 18 Oct 2008, 08:47
I'd play again if I had a guild with meatlife friends or something.

Join mine! I'm not on there, but my friends are nice!

I miss playing and the expansion comes out soon and I feel like there's so much to do before it does... Poo.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 Oct 2008, 10:28
I'm going to play again soon renew today but haven't decided on a server.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 18 Oct 2008, 10:40
Rachel and I are both on Llane, but she's not on all that often and I don't really do much in the way of grouping. So, essentially, this is kind of a worthless post.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 Oct 2008, 10:56
Yeah, I think that's a pretty common trait amongst feral druids since BC. They're so wonderfully self-sufficient and the cat outdoor speed bonus kicks so much ass. I had a much easier time soloing same level elites with a feral druid than I ever did with a rogue; maybe I did less damage but the ability to go bear or heal myself if I was losing or made a bad pull kicked so much ass. I love druids.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 18 Oct 2008, 14:04
Guys, QC guild on a server. Make it happen.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: ackblom12 on 18 Oct 2008, 14:18
It better be Horde.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 Oct 2008, 14:22
I'd rather be alliance, personally, so I can be human.

Diplomacy=win
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 18 Oct 2008, 15:09
I haven't played horde in forever (my last character before I quit again was a human mage) so I'd prefer to be Horde, but I'm flexible. That is to say if I'd restart my account (yet again) at all.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: ackblom12 on 18 Oct 2008, 15:10
I'd prefer Horde myself, but honestly, if we could actually agree to get a fun little casual QC guild going, I'd be all over it no matter which side it was.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 18 Oct 2008, 15:56
Very true, I wouldn't mind rolling a dwarf if it came to that. I still have absolutely zero interest in the Draanei.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: ackblom12 on 18 Oct 2008, 15:57
The dranei are just.. meh. Boring as all get out is a good description I think.

Which server would we hypothetically be trying to get this going on?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 18 Oct 2008, 15:58
I don't have an active account yet, so you tell me,  :roll:
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: ackblom12 on 18 Oct 2008, 16:03
Well, would we prefer a PvE or PvP server? Low or Medium population?

Also, what classes would everyone like?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 Oct 2008, 16:22
I'd prefer PvE; I've done the PvP thing and wasn't really impressed. If we go alliance I'll probably be a human rogue warrior or warlock. Expertise+Diplomacy= Win. Horde, probably a warlock or a paladin. Maybe blood elf? I don't know. None of the horde races have ever really done anything for me, other than tauren. At least Draenei get +1 to hit. God knows I'll end up looking to raid at some point eventually anyway, so how much anyone should ever plan around me is up in the air.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 18 Oct 2008, 16:45
At this point in the game with the way Battlegrounds are played I'm just as happy to play a PvE server, especially if its just a fun little side thing. I've never geared nor specced myself for PvP either so getting ganked out in the great wide open would be pointless. And then if we really wanted to get the competitive spirit since BGs are cross-server it shouldn't be that bad.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: ackblom12 on 18 Oct 2008, 16:58
PvE sounds good to me. It's not like it removes the opportunity to Raid and all, just means we can quest in peace if we wish.

Looks like there are no low pop PvE servers at all, but there are plenty of mediums. I've already got characters on Elune, so I'd prefer a separate server just to keep things interesting and not be tempted to just send all of my gold to the new character.

Khaz Modan maybe? Not sure which ones that aren't high population that have decent arena (assuming anyone is interested in it) and all that jazz.

Character wise, I think I'd like to roll Wizard this time.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 18 Oct 2008, 17:08
God damnit I'm just gonna go ahead and restart my account now and look through servers, after the mega patch I suppose I'll check out working on my mage's new talents, there are some pretty nifty new ones in frost that sound appealing, though I might actually try another specc for once. Would certainly take some getting used to.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: ackblom12 on 18 Oct 2008, 17:12
Any idea what you'd like to try classwise for our little endeavor here?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 Oct 2008, 17:44
So, if we're definitely hordeside I'll be a lock or paladin.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: ackblom12 on 18 Oct 2008, 17:48
alright, I've actually decided to go Priest despite my bitching.

Edit - I'm a fucking lier, I'm rolling Shaman.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 Oct 2008, 18:14
God damn it people. :)


I shouldn't complain though. I'm this close to going tauren warrior again. Fuck.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 18 Oct 2008, 18:31
Well as soon as this giant goddamn patch finished downloading I'm relatively certain I'm rolling Tauren druid.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: ackblom12 on 18 Oct 2008, 18:50
I'm thinking Troll Shaman.

Any dieas on what professions we're going with? I'm thinking of just going with moneymakers for a good long while. Mining/Skinning or something along those lines.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 18 Oct 2008, 19:12
The inscribing profession sounds interesting. I might try it, though its gonna require herbalism I think. come to think of it, you can make insane profits off of herbalism, everyone hates gathering for that.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: axerton on 18 Oct 2008, 19:51
I still have absolutely zero interest in the Draanei.

What?

Gift of Naru and an always on +1% chance to hit buff for you and all team members.

Plus Draenai have got far more interesting starting zone quests than any other alliance race.


Assuming this is being done on American servers, rather than European I'll create a character for the QC guild, unlikely that he'll be very active, but still fun.
just to confirm: Horde on Khaz Modarn?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: ackblom12 on 18 Oct 2008, 19:55
So far that's what it seems like.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 18 Oct 2008, 20:12
I'm not just in it for the racial bonus axerton, my characters have to have a certain aesthetic. Not to mention I'm not as heavy into the idea of PvP as most I suppose.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 Oct 2008, 20:21
Alliance never really had much on horde in terms of pvp racials though, really. Perception and escape artist are kinda nice but the NEs got kind of boned on that end, at least compared to WotF, War Stomp and Stun Resistance, anyway.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 18 Oct 2008, 20:53
I'd be up for this QC guild thing. I'd probably roll another rogue, just because i'm so used to playing one. As for horde v. alliance and pvp v. pve, it doesn't matter in the slightest to me.

Oh, and we're talking US servers, right?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 18 Oct 2008, 20:59
Yep, US servers, so roll Horde on Khaz Modan then i guess post your character here so everyone can friend up.

Edit: Right, I'm a tauren druid named Shazrun.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: ackblom12 on 18 Oct 2008, 21:44
Troll Shaman named Dwarfcutter
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 Oct 2008, 21:46
Tauren warrior, Smuckles.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 18 Oct 2008, 22:22
I vote Horde. I hate the peppy douche bag Alliance races and desire the ability to be a Tauren.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: ackblom12 on 18 Oct 2008, 22:23
Then roll on Khaz Modan and post your character name and class. I have hit lvl 2. EXCITING.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 Oct 2008, 22:55
I just wish there was another race worth playing other than tauren for horde. I'll probably stick with an alliance character somewhere as my main. I want to play a human rogue.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: imagist42 on 18 Oct 2008, 22:58
Everything is more fun when you're a giant War-Stomping cow.

Although Orcs are arguably better Hunters, and Blood Elves make decent magic-types.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 Oct 2008, 23:02
Honestly, I think orcs and trolls are both better than blood elves as casters, at least from a PvE perspective. I mean, the silence thing is kinda nice, but trolls can get an on command haste buff and orcs get both stun resistance, increased pet damage and Blood Fury, which is good for a 143 spell power for 15 seconds at 70, which is pretty nifty for warlocks. I just can't stand how non-taurens look, mostly. I play male characters and they all run around slouching like idiots.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 18 Oct 2008, 23:13
I actually think most of the horde looks better than the alliance, I mean, dwarves look cool and Night elves are okay, but Horde characters all have more, well, character to them than blank-faced humans or the just plain wierd tentacle rape Dranei. Orcs faces are battle-scarred and fierce, trolls got the face-paint thing and the tusks going on and undead are, well, rotting corpses that mosh.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 19 Oct 2008, 00:00
I'll roll an alt on Khaz Modan later tonight/this week.  Mebbe it'll be fun!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 19 Oct 2008, 00:40
So, if we're definitely hordeside I'll be a lock or paladin.

 :?

So, if we're definitely hordeside I want to do massive crits and make people QQ

Fix'd.
Nerf locks and ret pallys
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 19 Oct 2008, 06:42
Troll rogue named Novembeard  :-D
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 19 Oct 2008, 07:01
I've made a few possibles.  Undead Rogue called Stabbington, Blood Elf Mage called Estarriol & Orc Warrior named Bjorc.

Gonna try to figure out if I want to play another Warrior or if I want to give Rogue or a Mage another go (I've played both before and enjoyed them)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 19 Oct 2008, 10:53
I actually think most of the horde looks better than the alliance, I mean, dwarves look cool and Night elves are okay, but Horde characters all have more, well, character to them than blank-faced humans or the just plain wierd tentacle rape Dranei. Orcs faces are battle-scarred and fierce, trolls got the face-paint thing and the tusks going on and undead are, well, rotting corpses that mosh.

Once you start gearing everything up though you're just left with a dude with weird posture that looks like everyone else. It's the animations that bug me more than anything.


Made an Warlock named Whipstitch (shock, amazement).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 19 Oct 2008, 14:44
did you guys actually make a guild yet?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dimmukane on 19 Oct 2008, 15:18
Guys, I have gone through 4 free trials with this game.  I get to level 12 and just get tired of it.  Am I doing something wrong?   I mean, I'll play for a few levels, uninstall the game, and six months later get the trial again and repeat.  Why can't I stick with this game for more than a few days?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 19 Oct 2008, 16:23
We haven't made the guild yet but there's several of us on the server. Speaking of, what should the name of the guild be?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: axerton on 19 Oct 2008, 16:41
One of the things that influences my liking of a race is their hight, or rather lack thereof. Because when you're running along with giant a Tauren or Draenei taking huge strides you feel like you're going much slower than the dwarf or gnome despite the fact that they're going at the same speed, because the shorties have to move their legs just that much faster, makes me feel like I'm actually going somewhere with purpose. However this isn't enough to stop me liking my Draenei Mage main (now lvl 48) because the big blue dudes are just cool, as long as you avoid the faces that are too tentacle-y. 

Oh, and I'm a Forsaken Priest called Axerton cos I couldn't be bothered being original. 
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 19 Oct 2008, 18:22
what should the name of the guild be?

Questionable Contenders?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 19 Oct 2008, 18:30
I'd prefer to just go Questionable Content in that case. I mean, shit, there's already a few guilds around with the name anyway. Also, I have a BE Paladin named Akhilesh in my stable o' chars now.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: torontoguy2k8 on 19 Oct 2008, 19:04
A QC guild eh? I may consider going. I don't really lurk around here very often, but I wouldn't mind Checking out different kinds of guilds.
I currently run my own, rather active guild, so I spend most of my time looking after things there. But I would be happy to lend my magical finger-wiggling talent to this guild. Just don't bug me for water :P
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 19 Oct 2008, 19:09
Well then what good is a mage for? I'm thirstyyyyyy
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 19 Oct 2008, 19:26
Just don't bug me for water :P

i had to:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93umHXo6VUc
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 19 Oct 2008, 21:27
I have a bit of a problem with just going with Questionable Content as the guild name. I mean, first off, I love originality in names, and Questionable Content is the easy boring route. Remember tribal wars? And also its not as if this guild would be associated with the comic or Jeph Jaques at all, and I don't feel comfortable putting his brand name on something that he has no idea is being made (I assume). So here are a couple ideas spun by me and Whipstitch.

to get it out of the way, Furious Dickings*
Get In the Van
Salty Dogs
For the Love of Pirates
to take a leaf out of Mercenary Schlock (http://www.schlockmercenary.com/index.html)**, Tagon's Toughs or alternatively something like that using alliteration off of the guild leaders' name. Speaking of Which who is the guild leader?



*obviously wouldn't make it past the word filter
**goddamn I just finished those eight years worth of archived awesome.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 19 Oct 2008, 22:39
If we can get enough people to make a guild then it's obviously not going to be an official QC guild, just a QC forums-affiliated guild, hopefully with more of a slant toward the I LIKE FISH crowd than the General Discussion mob.  We could always call it "I LIKE FISH", but I am not sure if people associate that with this forum or not.

re: the guild leader, it should probably be a US person with an intent on playing on the server as their primary server.  Seems like a few people are making alts on Khaz Modan, but if there's anyone with intent to mainly play on the server they'd probably be better suited, as they can carry on the guild even if forum people come and go.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: axerton on 19 Oct 2008, 23:35
Why not "I like Hurr" or "I like ... hurr" or something of that nature.

Also if we want to get all the cool guild stuff - Tabard, bank and so on so forth apparently they are fifteen types of expensive, so maybe we all have gathering skills for the moment so that we can pool our money and afford it, I would suggest herbalism at this time, just because inscription has driven the price of all herbs, but especially low level ones through the roof.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 19 Oct 2008, 23:46
US servers I asume?

("Pintsize stole my cookies")
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 20 Oct 2008, 00:10
There's always Granfalloon.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 20 Oct 2008, 02:46
"I LIKE HURR" is only the new name for "I LIKE FISH."

And Covetous, no.  No direct QC references.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 20 Oct 2008, 02:50
This, btw, is probably why most guild nmes are awful.

I would play in a guild named Banditos, btw.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 20 Oct 2008, 06:03
How about "The Seventh Dick?"

Otherwise, I vote for Get In the Van.

I'm still trying to decide what I want to go with for this. On the one hand, I do so love Druid. On the other, I really should explore other options for the sake of variety. I'm thinking maybe an Orc/Troll Rogue (I get most of my Druid enjoyment out of my cat form anyway) or maybe just a slight variation and go Restoration or Balance Druid. I'm leaning Balance Druid just for the sake of self sufficiency when soloing. Just so long as I can avoid the douchier races like Blood Elves (I still wish I'd waited until actually dealing with Blood Elves before choosing Blood Elf over Troll for my hunter) and Undead.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 20 Oct 2008, 07:11
If you enjoy cat form you'll feel like you've been infused with the powers of Greyskull when you play rogue.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 20 Oct 2008, 07:20
So I've heard. Basically, as I know it, Druid is essentially a vaguely watered down combination of Rogue, Warrior, Mage and Priest. I love the versatility, though. It just makes the character so much more fun to play.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 20 Oct 2008, 07:35
I have a dream, a guild of nothing but specialized druids.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 20 Oct 2008, 08:35
There are more than a couple out there. It's actually amusing in how feasible it is.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 20 Oct 2008, 11:22
The watered down part doesn't really come into play much if you're mostly a solo player or non-raider anyway, and even in raids the advantages are sweet. It sucks that bears can't become uncrushable, but blizzard is moving away from crush mechanics and it's actually easier to tank in bear in terms of quick threat and rage generation. Rogues deal more damage than kitties, but they don't give buffs, battle rez, cast innervate or pop into bear form to emergency tank either. Besides, dealing less damage than a good rogue just gives you something in common with practically everyone else on the planet anyway. ;)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 20 Oct 2008, 11:33
Yeah, and warriors can't exactly pop between forms casting rejuvy on themselves and then turning back into bear, now healing while the enemy flounders, already my favorite tactic ever.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: ackblom12 on 20 Oct 2008, 11:42
So far, I am looking at the talent trees for the Shaman and man I am a little confused as to what to go with. Looks like i can leave elemental alone entirely with what I'm going for (support for groups with feasible soloability) but I need to sit down and really read all of the talents.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 20 Oct 2008, 11:45
Ok, so when I finally start up my account I will totally roll a character. Probably a druid (again), priest, or rogue. Up to you guys, if you "need" a particular class.

(This is also a reminder to myself to look at which server you guys are on and find you.)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 20 Oct 2008, 11:48
Oh, man, wait 'till you have the full suite of Frenzied Regeneration, Entangling Roots, 4-5 second Bash, and Nature's Grasp. It is so win; I was cheerfully soloing Devilsaurs at level 52 and beating the crap out of multiple mobs at once just because of the many ways you can safely heal and drag the fight out if you have to.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 20 Oct 2008, 11:53
Yeah, few things are more fun than soloing an elite by just kind of standing there in bear form and occasionally war stomping to cast regrowth. My default strategy when trying to handle a single elite is to prowl, pounce, shred, build up a combo, rip and then war stomp, heal and bust into bear form to just wear him down. Gorlash in STV went down like a punk for me at 42 with that method and I barely know what I'm doing.

The more I think about this, the more I like the idea of rolling an all Druid guild.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 20 Oct 2008, 12:04
Druids are my favorite class. I'm not a huge fan of tanking anymore in bear form, but I like cat form, being a boomkin, and druid healers are pretty awesome because of all the HoTs. Also the whole not having to buy a flying mount is kind of awesome.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: axerton on 20 Oct 2008, 17:04
How about "The Seventh Dick?"

I know this was a joke, and wouldn't work with Blizz's language filter but I would totally be in a guild called "Suck the Seventh"

Edit: and our tabard could just have a picture of a big lollipop... ok maybe not
 
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 20 Oct 2008, 17:50
"Suck the Seventh"

this.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 20 Oct 2008, 17:53
Gah. Please, no.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 20 Oct 2008, 18:30
Get In the Van

Even though I'm not familiar with the back story of this one (I think I've seen it in a sigquote or something), I'm alright with this one, too, I guess.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 20 Oct 2008, 19:03
How about "The Next Seven" or "Take the Seventh."

Appropriate and an excellent in-joke. "Suck the Seven" isn't really close enough to the original remarks to work.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 20 Oct 2008, 19:20
Get In the Van

Even though I'm not familiar with the back story of this one (I think I've seen it in a sigquote or something), I'm alright with this one, too, I guess.

i concur.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 20 Oct 2008, 19:32
A moderator has solved this internal forum dispute.

Our Guild name shall be "Get In The Next Seven."
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 20 Oct 2008, 20:19
no pirate theme?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 20 Oct 2008, 20:37
I'm not really that big on pirates. Sorry. I prefer est's Bandito suggestion over that one, actually. Of course, my sister occasionally refers to me as a bandito, so I may be biased.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: ackblom12 on 20 Oct 2008, 22:16
I'd be all for one of the "Seventh" suggestions personally.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 20 Oct 2008, 23:16
Naturally I still like the Banditos, but if people like "get in the van" can I request it be capitalised like a shouted order?

GET IN THE VAN.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 20 Oct 2008, 23:19
Also: I just realised I am mixing my references a little.  See the text under my avatar for the thing I'm confusing it with, which is from a gestapo-like secret police in-joke we had for a while here aaaaaages ago.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Eris on 20 Oct 2008, 23:43
"joke"
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 21 Oct 2008, 06:06
Considering Get In the Van/ Truck is before most of us showing interest's time here, I think the Seventh Dick references work a bit better. All of us were around for that.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 21 Oct 2008, 06:35
Seven > Van for "I know what this means" purposes, but Seven < Van for sounding better.

But really, just pick the one that will confuse the most people not from the forums.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 21 Oct 2008, 10:40
If you wanna know how hard you can push the boat out before it comes unnacceptable, my friends and I made a uild in guild wars called "Maddie is in our guild hall" and the name suffix is [raep], if you wana join PM me.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Oct 2008, 10:44
I have no idea what the Seventh Dick references.

I like the all caps GET IN THE VAN, personally.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dimmukane on 21 Oct 2008, 11:27
Suck the next six dicks you see, then.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 21 Oct 2008, 11:37
Source Material (http://forums.questionablecontent.net/index.php/topic,17340.msg533828.html#msg533828)

Quote from: tommydski
He's right. I tried to think of some good advice but I just don't know enough about you. Also, my advice wouldn't be much use because you don't know what kind of person I am. I might tell you to suck the next six dicks you see.

Wait.

Yeah.

Suck the next six dicks you see.

Quote from: 0bsessions
This is all shit advice. You should be able to get by on sucking just the next five dicks you see.

Quote from: tommydski
See Jon, this is where I think your commitment is lacking. Five dicks is just about adequate. You aren't prepared to put that last dick in your mouth if you think you can avoid it. Sometimes you have to endure just to prove to yourself you can do it. Have a sense of pride in your work. Take the sixth dick.

Quote from: ForteBass
3. Suck the next seven dicks you see. That shows real commitment.

You have no excuse, man! This was months after you joined!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Oct 2008, 11:52
I guess I have seen that before; I just never thought much of it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 21 Oct 2008, 12:30
It's no biggie. But I admire Jon's effort to go digging around to find forum references to sucking dicks.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 21 Oct 2008, 12:41
That shit took me so long to find, too!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 21 Oct 2008, 12:56
Guys I can't play while I'm at school and its pissing me off, this is not good. Anyway, seeing as I'll probably be spending a lot of time on this druid someone tell me what name y'all have decided on and I'll make the charter tonight.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Catfish_Man on 21 Oct 2008, 14:29
Um, I'm pretty sure 'suck the next N dicks you see' originated on 4chan, not here...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Oct 2008, 14:31
I've got the cash for the charter if ya need it boro, dunno how much you've had a chance to play. We can at least split the cost.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 21 Oct 2008, 15:49
I think the general consensus is that "GET IN THE VAN" should be the name.

EDIT: Oh shit, it's taken (http://www.wowarmory.com/guild-info.xml?r=Khaz+Modan&n=Get+in+the+van&p=1)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 21 Oct 2008, 15:54
I don't really see any consensus. I'm seeing a pretty even split between Get In the Van and some variation on the Suck the Next theme, not to mention that Get In the Van apparently isn't actually the right in-joke. I stand by Johnny's suggestion of merging the two as the best.

Um, I'm pretty sure 'suck the next N dicks you see' originated on 4chan, not here...

Considering google can find zilch in terms of that phrase anywhere BUT QC (It's the first result under "suck the next dick" "suck the next dicks"), I'm going to call shenanigans on this one and let Tommy keep the credit.

Not every internet in-joke started in that pit.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dimmukane on 21 Oct 2008, 15:59
I know a couple people on this board also frequent that den of seediness, and are probably spreading memes between the two, emulating the spread of gonorrhea. 
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 21 Oct 2008, 16:23
I honestly don't care what the name is or even if we make a guild or not so long as we can get a good handful of people together.

Also, I wish I had more spare time this week.  I need to get levelses on Khaz Modan so we can get to the fun stuff.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 21 Oct 2008, 18:51
Whelp. I just made myself a fresh Tauren Druid for the Khaz Modan server by the name of Hefferwolfe.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 21 Oct 2008, 19:40
I may or may not make a Tauren Warrior for comparison to my Orc.  Warstomp + bandages sounds too good to pass up.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Ozymandias on 21 Oct 2008, 19:47
FINE.

FINE, OKAY.

ALL YOU COCK SUCKERS.

I'LL REINSTALL.

YOU MOTHERFUCKERS.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Catfish_Man on 21 Oct 2008, 20:14
Um, I'm pretty sure 'suck the next N dicks you see' originated on 4chan, not here...

Considering google can find zilch in terms of that phrase anywhere BUT QC (It's the first result under "suck the next dick" "suck the next dicks"), I'm going to call shenanigans on this one and let Tommy keep the credit.

Not every internet in-joke started in that pit.

Hm, guess I'm wrong then. Probably remembering some other meme.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: imagist42 on 21 Oct 2008, 20:59
Guys. It's not worth reinstalling and activating my subscription to play for just two weeks, right? Please tell me it's not worth it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 21 Oct 2008, 21:25
okay, got the charter up and initially had the guild name as Get in the Next Seven. those of us who were on however decided we didn't like it and switch the name to Shanghaied. If there are any problems with this THEN YOU AREN'T AWESOME.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 21 Oct 2008, 21:56
Shanghaied?  Where the hell did that come from?

I mean, it's just a little out of left field.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: ackblom12 on 21 Oct 2008, 22:44
Guys. It's not worth reinstalling and activating my subscription to play for just two weeks, right? Please tell me it's not worth it.

No... but you're going to anyways so better sooner than later right?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 21 Oct 2008, 22:47
From wikipedia:
"The American term shanghaied refers to the practice of conscripting men as sailors by coercive techniques such as trickery, intimidation, or violence. Those engaged in this form of kidnapping were known as crimps. Until 1915 unfree labor was widely used aboard American merchant ships. The related term press gang refers specifically to impressment practices in Great Britain's Royal Navy.[1]"

Actually its entirely relevant, yet deviously misleading. Yakob didn't care but didn't like Get in the Next Seven, and Steve and Whip liked it, so I went with it. I've also gotten signatures by begging for them and the guild is registered.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: imagist42 on 21 Oct 2008, 22:50
Guys. It's not worth reinstalling and activating my subscription to play for just two weeks, right? Please tell me it's not worth it.

No... but you're going to anyways so better sooner than later right?

Well, the problem is that "sooner" is "now for the next two weeks only," and "later" is "two years from now."

Just tell me it's not worth it so I can go away.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: ackblom12 on 21 Oct 2008, 22:59
Return of the Lich King is out in 3 weeks.

Your mind will fall.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: imagist42 on 21 Oct 2008, 23:11
No, see, at that point it's not really an option because I'll no longer have the ability or liberty to play. I'm just trying to avoid paying $15 and wasting time on a character I probably won't get anywhere with just to play with you guys, and you're not helping! Hurrrrrrrrrrrgh.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 21 Oct 2008, 23:18
It's not worth it.



I mean, whatever's going to keep you from playing world of warcraft with us for two years, is not worth it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 22 Oct 2008, 00:30
Repent! Sell your account on ebay and get it ower with. WoW is never worth it. Think of all the fun you can have insted. Collecting pens or stamps, Walking through the neighbourhood watching the kids play (wow), doing stuff with your IRL friends (like drinking alcohol). Case closed, no WoW!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 22 Oct 2008, 03:19
I know what Shanghaied means, I just thought there were other things being discussed.  What ev ur.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 22 Oct 2008, 09:15
Yeah, okay, maybe a little out of left field.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: imagist42 on 22 Oct 2008, 10:30
I mean, whatever's going to keep you from playing world of warcraft with us for two years, is not worth it.

Okay, now I know you have no idea what you're talking about. So I have confirmation! Thank you!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 23 Oct 2008, 06:34
Tried starting out as a Tauren Warrior, but it didn't do much for me.  Warstomp + bandage doesn't work as well as I thought it would, so Bjorc's blood fury thinger is superior.  Still might play around with other race/class combos before I settle on one, though.  What level are people at at the moment?  I'm only 8, should I get a move on or what?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 23 Oct 2008, 09:53
Well, I'm 15, stopped to take a little break to gather herbs to try and make massive amounts of money on the AH. Unfortunately, people keep undercutting my prices so I lowered them this morning, hope they'll pan out and so we can go ahead and have a tabard.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 23 Oct 2008, 10:37
If money's the problem I'm sitting on around 30 40 gold right now. I don't mind paying for the tabard.


[EDIT] Sent along some gold.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 23 Oct 2008, 11:27
I'm 15 as well.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 23 Oct 2008, 15:10
(http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y110/Wildkyn/WoWScrnShot_102308_175932.jpg)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 23 Oct 2008, 15:55
Ok cool, I'll get a move on next week.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 23 Oct 2008, 15:59
(http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w274/Yakob42/WoWScrnShot_102308_195350.jpg)

(http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w274/Yakob42/WoWScrnShot_102308_193959.jpg)

/cower
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 23 Oct 2008, 16:20
Tried starting out as a Tauren Warrior, but it didn't do much for me. 

that's what i was planning on making. now i'm not so sure.
i still want a tauren though, because they are awesome.

also it shouldn't take me too long to catch up to you guys once i finally make an alt on your server because i can grind to about 15 or 20 really quickly. the challenge for me is getting to the higher level stuff.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: axerton on 23 Oct 2008, 21:24
When 3.02 came out I didn't notice much difference with my main mage, then I got round to playing on some of my other alt, rogue - fine, druid - nice, warlock - instantcast affliction, I'm happy. However they have completely screwed my hunter, rather than having a defensive pet only attack when you or it was attacked, now a defensive pet will charge out an attack your target when you shoot it... wtf. I found this out by walking up to a large pack of troggs, shooting the closest one to pull it away from the group only to have my wolf charge in thereby agroing all the other troggs, resulting in both it's and my death. The only time that this is a good thing is if you're just another dps in a raid, but if you're on pulling duty, or you're soloing this can never be a good thing so now I have to have my pet on passive all the time, meaning I have to micromanage it all the time. gah.

As far as the guild name and Tabard goes, I'll agree it was a bit surprising but pretty cool. You may have to wait, if you were hoping for me to be your main healer, as I have these pesky exams coming up, how annoying, don't they realise they get in the way of important things like wow.

On the subject of Tauren warrior's, I've just started one to replace my bloodelf hunter that I was playing with my friend, and I really like it, the extra health can only ever be a good thing on a tank, and warstomp is highly useful if you've over-pulled and want a head start on you're escape.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 25 Oct 2008, 20:03
Oh, wait, so we're taking screenshots now?

I'm the last thing anyone really needs: Another God Damn Belf Ret Paladin.

(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a207/Xyljin/pally.jpg)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 25 Oct 2008, 23:03
Actually I only did it to show off the guild tabard.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: ackblom12 on 26 Oct 2008, 16:04
Man, fuck zombies.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 26 Oct 2008, 17:28
Yeah, I've managed to hit 27 in the midst of the zombie event, but frankly, people shouldn't have to have the same demented dedication to a video game that I do just to get by. I've pretty much given up on selling anything or hitting the auction house until this thing is over. Good thing I was already using a bank alt for everything anyway. Getting my skills trained can still be an adventure in itself though.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 26 Oct 2008, 23:19
Trust my goddamned internut connection to get capped over the weekend.  I can't play all this week, which pisses me off greatly.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 29 Oct 2008, 16:34
Anyone looking into being a tailor? I've got a 193 linen cloth laying around and the stuff sells so cheap now that I'd honestly just rather help someone out instead of selling it or making a Tailor/Enchanter alt just to convert it all into Strange Dust.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: imagist42 on 29 Oct 2008, 16:43
I always used to take First Aid and make bandages out of my cloths. Bandages, IIRC, vendor for a decent amount.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: axerton on 29 Oct 2008, 17:51
I don't know how many clothies we've got in the group (not many I think) but having a tailor around is always useful as they can make some decent bags but being a tailor wont really pay off until you get to grand master status whereupon you can make your own mounts in the form of magic carpets, which are only usable by tailors. I would take you up on the offer but my main is already a tailor so I want to try something different.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Runa on 09 Nov 2008, 20:19
I feel like sharing one of my personal favorite screenshots.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v98/crimsonstitches/Reindeerhumps.jpg)

Uhm. My Reindeer just couldn't keep off of his?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 11 Nov 2008, 13:37
Guys, I caved and reactivated my account. So of course all the servers are down so they can fix things for WotLK. Which comes out in two days. Which I forgot. Crap.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 11 Nov 2008, 14:09
Ugh. What a god damn clusterfuck the rollup to WotLK has been. I've had a good week's worth of my R-a-F time eaten up by this bullshit.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: supersheep on 11 Nov 2008, 14:44
What? The servers are down? Buggeration. Finally managed to get the trial client downloaded (after accidentally deleting it earlier today) and now I can't play?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 11 Nov 2008, 15:07
Yeah so I actually just cancelled my account due to being broke. I passed on the guild leader stuff a good while ago though.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Runa on 11 Nov 2008, 15:41
New patch killed my computer.
Had to uninstall, and reinstall.
Problem was I was lacking my disks and key due to a former friend.
Borrowed my managers, his disks failed (not to mention missing the key). Go to walmart to buy it, after reaching my car I notice the seals were broken. I check. No damn disks. Ninja's done got themz before I could.

The world....of warcraft is very against me at the moment.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 11 Nov 2008, 17:49
We rule at organising things.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 11 Nov 2008, 17:54
Meh, it's not really our fault. I'd been on quite a bit, actually, (although, I was rather ill lately and didn't get on much over the last few days), and would be on now if the servers were you know, up. Also, it didn't help that Blizzard decided it'd be great if zombies were running killing Barrens quest givers. That was loads of fun.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Runa on 11 Nov 2008, 18:44
Meh, it's not really our fault. I'd been on quite a bit, actually, (although, I was rather ill lately and didn't get on much over the last few days), and would be on now if the servers were you know, up. Also, it didn't help that Blizzard decided it'd be great if zombies were running killing Barrens quest givers. That was loads of fun.

They removed that little special "feature" due to many complaints, but last night my friends on vent were talking about Thrall and such dueling and then scourge over runs.
I liked it to be honest because for once I didn't see politics discussed in Trade, instead everyone was QQ'ing about teh zombies. Haha
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 11 Nov 2008, 18:51
Man, it'd be great if I could get the last of my Refer-A-Friend level grants from my brother, but hey, the game is busted to absolute shit STILL!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: axerton on 12 Nov 2008, 04:49
Also, it didn't help that Blizzard decided it'd be great if zombies were running killing Barrens quest givers. That was loads of fun.

They removed that little special "feature" due to many complaints,

This just isn't true, it had absolutely nothing to do with all the people complaining about it. The zombie plague was getting better and better (plague time getting shorter - zombies getting faster and stronger ect) and by day 5 they had reached 1 minute before zombification and all of about 5 argent healers in the entire world (of warcraft) where could they go from there? instant zombies? can you imagine how shit that would be? so they had left themselves with no choice but to cure the plague.

Gah, why must the server go down on the night I finish my exams damn it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 12 Nov 2008, 09:43
Whatever they messed up yesterday, they messed it up good. I was at a friend's and we finally had to give up and reschedule for tonight. LAME.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Runa on 12 Nov 2008, 11:53

This just isn't true, it had absolutely nothing to do with all the people complaining about it. The zombie plague was getting better and better (plague time getting shorter - zombies getting faster and stronger ect) and by day 5 they had reached 1 minute before zombification and all of about 5 argent healers in the entire world (of warcraft) where could they go from there? instant zombies? can you imagine how shit that would be? so they had left themselves with no choice but to cure the plague.

Gah, why must the server go down on the night I finish my exams damn it.

If only the realm forums were up I'd find that screenshot someone made of the conversation with a GM about it.

Blizzard had said it was going to be an on going event until WotLK was released. But whatev's. It's gone now.
To be honest, I'm petrified of zombies. My friends are interested in seeing how I'm going to play when the exp. comes out. Same way I did in eastern plaguelands... zoom allll the way out and cut the sound. >.>
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 12 Nov 2008, 13:33
At least the game is up and runnin' now. Also: I HAS A SHINY NEW PONY.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 12 Nov 2008, 16:16
O M G

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v371/est_xplosif/random/fatpony.png)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 12 Nov 2008, 16:35
FATPONY4LYFE
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 12 Nov 2008, 18:29
whut.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 12 Nov 2008, 18:32
GIMME ME BACK MY PONY JEANS I SWEAR TO GOD
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Runa on 12 Nov 2008, 18:44
GIMME ME BACK MY PONY JEANS I SWEAR TO GOD

/comfort

There, there.
I'll be your---..... I mean, we'll go to the store and buy you a brand new pony.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 12 Nov 2008, 22:09
whut.

www.katebeaton.com

Check out the comix with fat pony in them.  They are awesommes.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 13 Nov 2008, 08:07
Alex, here's something about ponies (http://www.lfgcomic.com/page/42) you might enjoy.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 13 Nov 2008, 08:37
/comfort

There, there.
I'll be your---..... I mean, we'll go to the store and buy you a brand new pony.

Is it too late to make a joke like "hurr, epic mount, hurr"? Oh my god, I am so sorry.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 13 Nov 2008, 12:49
(http://upload.wowhead.com/images/screenshots/10531.jpg)

CARROT ON A STICK!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 13 Nov 2008, 13:01
I'm seriously considering going to that new fizzcrank realm just to try to get in on some of the world firsts and all that other happy bullshit.


Man, is fizzcrank ever a terrible name though.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Runa on 13 Nov 2008, 13:24

Is it too late to make a joke like "hurr, epic mount, hurr"? Oh my god, I am so sorry.

Never too late.

EDIT (accidental double post):

Zomg. New achievement.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v98/crimsonstitches/obamaachievement.jpg)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: KharBevNor on 13 Nov 2008, 16:55
Why is Barack Obama a shadow priest? Hidden messages omg.

I bought WotLK at midnight. Dunno why, because my highest character is 48. Maybe I can change that this weekend.

I might post a screenshot in a bit.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 13 Nov 2008, 16:58
Nah, looks like he's a priest.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 14 Nov 2008, 08:20
There is already a level 80 character on the French servers.

On one hand, I want to go get WotLK, but on the other, I have absolutely zero reason to. My main is level 60 and there is absolutely shit all I can find for content that I can actually use yet.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 14 Nov 2008, 11:13
My CD drive is busted, so I'm not going to worry about it for a while. There's still a lot to do in Outland and I have other characters I can level as well.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 14 Nov 2008, 14:46
My boy went and picked WotLK up for us both at midnight. He can take his hunter over (on frostmourne), but we are still levelling our other characters (will, his alts, which seem to be becoming his mains), and my first character. I just respecc'd my mage to frost and can actually play on my own now without dying every five minutes. I'm halfway to level 65 and I still have a shittonne of stuff to do in Outlands but we'll probably be heading over to Northrend at 68.

Also DK's look pretty cool and I might make one just because.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 15 Nov 2008, 16:17
I have no money for Lich King.

Gonna move money around at the bank soon and then buy it  :|
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: axerton on 15 Nov 2008, 19:34
I have no intention of getting WotLK for a while at least - as my main is only 59 and I already have seven active characters so I really don't need a DK.

From the little I've seen from people linking death knight abilities they seem to be incredibly over powered like death grip I think it was, that pulls all enemies to you and forces them to attack you and a version of counterspell except that instead of the 30 second cool down mages have it's 10 seconds plus the ability to turn any kill into a minion and automatically come back from the dead as a zombie for 45 seconds.

but I do like the way the citizens of stormwind react to Deathknights.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: CursedMortivore on 15 Nov 2008, 20:34
They only react that way to Death Knights as the DKs finish the last quest of their chain. After that, it's all cool.

But yeah, DKs do seem a bit overpowered, but I sure do love playing mine. Spending time levelling his mining at the moment, but once I hit being able to mine fel iron i'll definitely start levelling in the Outlands.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 15 Nov 2008, 21:07
I like Death Grip. It's actually a wonderful if situational pulling tool. I'd hate to see it get nerfed, at least in PvE, anyway.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: masquerade on 17 Nov 2008, 20:06
I haven't bought the expansion yet either. It's good to see that I'm not the only one (as it feels like on Shandris).

That aside, I'm building a steady, unhealthy hatred for Death Knights. They kill everything and I can't get a damn thing done on my poor level 64 dr00d. Outland has been taken over and instances are a nightmare. Some idiot kid said he could tank, and pulled mobs he couldn't handle (and therefore jumped on my ass because my damage was pulling aggro) THREE TIMES before the group was ready. We finally wiped and I had the 'lock eat his soul.

I had a nice long fight over the Twin Spire Ruins last night with a dumbass Bl'Elf though. That was fun. And even more fun when a guildie showed up with his 70 and trounced him once and for all. ::glee::
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 18 Nov 2008, 00:46
I accidentally bought it. (Honestly didn't mean to, just wanted to see how much it was to get from blizzard and then clicked submit CC details) Is 30GBP :/ 18 online or 25 in most shops. Man I suck at not spending money rite now.

[EDIT]
OHMYGODIJUSTRESPECCEDFURYANDDONOTKNOWHOWGOODANIDEATHISMAYORMAYNOTHAVEBEEN
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 18 Nov 2008, 07:02
I upgraded and am quite enjoying the Death Knight. I specced him for Unholy and the permanent Ghoul is fun, so far. The intro quests are a blast, too. You get to try siege weaponry and ride a frost wyrm. I'd relate the experience to 'like in GTA when you get bored of the missions and just start going around killing civilians, except that's the actual point.'

I will agree, though, that most Death Knights are inconsiderate pricks and death coil seriously needs to be nerfed already. It was bad enough the weeks leading up to the game dealing with level seventies coming in and kill stealing and wiping everything in lower level areas to farm rep and achievements while some of us were trying to actually PLAY the game. Now Outland is covered in Death Knights who, despite the fact they have to have been around for a while to even make one, don't seem to understand why people get pissed off when you kill steal and generally just run around being a twat. That's my major problem with death coil. It really breaks the game in favor of kill stealers. I've already dealt with dozens of douche bags death coiling away an add I just pulled but hadn't tagged yet.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 18 Nov 2008, 07:48
Death Grip, sorry. I mixed it up with another DK ability. Death Grip basically throws a long-ass purple coil at an enemy and pulls it directly to you. Should be great for raiding and keeping aggro, but it's fucking terrible in the hands of douche players.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 18 Nov 2008, 08:19
I think of it like charge but desrever.

Also FURY SUCKS.

I said I would play it for a week but...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 Nov 2008, 11:43
I can't help but suspect you're doing it wrong.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 18 Nov 2008, 15:20
Maybe it just doesn't gel with your playstyle?  My fury warrior is a goddamned meatgrinder.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 18 Nov 2008, 20:53
Yeah I think I suck as fury, as arms I was turning full vengefull fury warriors inside out with stormherald alone when they had stormherald and a glads 2h sword. Now with a greem sword in one hand and stormherald in the other all I do is stand around waiting for a hit beause it is soooo slooow and I am getting not alot of rage, I have no MS or sudden death or improved slam. Maybe I am just in an arms state of mind too much :(
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 Nov 2008, 21:31
Well, see, you're talking about PvP. Fury isn't for PvP; that's Arm's job. That, however, doesn't mean that Fury sucks, since with enough +crit and +hit, a fury warrior can approach nearly 100% flurry uptime, which leads to crazy rage generation which leads to a ridiculous amount of execute spam vs. raid bosses. Fury beats the everlovin' snot outta mobs, but it's not suited for beating down a heavily armored target in PvP. So stick with Arms by all means! Just don't go sayin' your angry plated brethren suck when they're built for a different job. ;)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 18 Nov 2008, 21:36
Yeah, what he ^ said.

Also, here is the post I was making before Alex posted his thing:

I am not sure what your new Fury spec looks like because your character sheet seems stuck on your Arms spec (even though it's updated your gear to show you dual-wielding 2hders) so I dunno.  Did you take 5 ranks of Unbridled Wrath?  Do you use Bloodthirst whenever it is available?  I am not sure how it is with the Arms tree, but I hardly use Execute unless the opponents are weak to begin with or I am taking things on 1-on-1 with a definite downtime between fights.  Charging into battle and using Bloodrage whenever you remember is also pretty helpful, but I guess that is a more general thing that you already know.  I mean, you are ten levels higher than I am so it feels odd suggesting things for you to try but I am guessing Arms is a very different mindset to Fury maybe and that is what's up.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 18 Nov 2008, 21:37
Man now I want to play WoW tonight instead of Left4Dead what the hell.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 Nov 2008, 22:19
Well, a big part of it is that Fury warriors like to get on a mob and work 'em like a speed bag whereas PvP, unfortunately, is more like a jousting match. People move around, hit you with crowd control constantly and even a simple lag spike can end up with your opponent being just out of your reach. It's rough on Fury warriors since they are so predicated on landing strings of white hits to deal their damage. Arms warriors, on the other hand, have lower optimum dps but can deal it in large bursts thanks to a big 2 hander and Mortal Strike, which also inflicts an all-important healing debuff. That's a huge advantage when you can't guarantee you'll be on top of your opponent for more than a few seconds at a time. Besides, Arms really does do plenty of damage for solo work. So it's really entirely possible that Fury is the wrong playstyle for him and that I was being a li'l over the top with my "You're doing it wrong" (which really should always be seen as tongue in cheek).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 18 Nov 2008, 23:21
I was talking of pve in northrend, just smacking about some mobs and I sucked at it so I went back to arms (I lasted about 5 hours playtime as fury, could not get the hang of it, peed a little, felt sad and respecced). That's what I love about arms is you can never fuck up your spec too badly so long as you stick to the tree. Just hate the whole "PUT TALENT POINTS IN A CERTAIN WEAPON TYPE NAIO!" mentality of it, I am going to be using quest reward bloos in like 3 levels no doubt. I didn't want to put in improved charge but I had to make up the points, I don't rend I leave procs to make them bleed, intercept is not improved because I am always in battle stance (shock horror I suck) and it just pisses me off you need to put points places I don't want to put them to get to the bottom of the tree. Prot tanks can use all the stuff in their tree and it is awesome. Might go prot at 80 but now most of my gear is dps and I am gonna have to quest, so prot is out of the question.

You can still weild 2h till you log out after a respec from my experience last time :)

If sudden death and bladestorm did not exist and maces still had stun over armour ignoring I would go back to my old arms fury spec. It was awesome

I had 25% crit chance as fury in berserker stance, may have been the problem as most good fury warriors have like 40 or something rediculous. Double mongoose or whatever.

Potential arms fury pvp lv 80 since you will be able to have two talent sets...
http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/warrior/talents.html?tal=050233212330010003221223031151305030130021000000000000000200000000000000000000000000
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 19 Nov 2008, 12:50
Yeah, fury is stupidly gear dependent since you need an ass ton of +hit on top of your +crit and raw attack power. Arms warriors still benefit from +hit, of course, but it's not quite so world shatteringly vital, so there's a lot more room to just stack strength and go to town on people. I've also heard that +hit rating scales badly post 70 (ie, it takes a LOT more +hit rating to get the same effect) too, so there's really no point in going fury now if your gear isn't built for it. Strength is an incredible dps stat and arms warriors have plenty of room for it, so go crazy.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: masquerade on 19 Nov 2008, 15:32
Hatedeathknightshatedeathknightshatedeathknights... /travelform and I'm out.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 19 Nov 2008, 22:02
Yeah, fury is stupidly gear dependent since you need an ass ton of +hit on top of your +crit and raw attack power.
Indeed
Arms warriors still benefit from +hit, of course, but it's not quite so world shatteringly vital, so there's a lot more room to just stack strength and go to town on people.
Yup, agi is nice too for crit and dodge though but you are right, str for AP.
I've also heard that +hit rating scales badly post 70 (ie, it takes a LOT more +hit rating to get the same effect) too, so there's really no point in going fury now if your gear isn't built for it.
Spot on, is about 0.03% hit rating increase per point at 80.
Strength is an incredible dps stat and arms warriors have plenty of room for it, so go crazy.
Yeah.

Back to arms fo lyf till 80. Prot uses strength alot too though, str and stam are all those rocks ever care about.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: KharBevNor on 21 Nov 2008, 01:24
Oh yeah, a screenshot.

Bask in my low graphics settings and unwillingness to clean off my HUD.

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v331/KharBevNor/WoWScrnShot_112108_085926.jpg)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 21 Nov 2008, 03:26
I like Death Grip. It's actually a wonderful if situational pulling tool. I'd hate to see it get nerfed, at least in PvE, anyway.

I haven't played in a month or two (last day I played was the Monday before 3.0 hit, amusingly enough), but I'm looking forward to working with DKs in my guild whenever I start playing again.  Death Grip looks like it's going to totally change the way 5's are played.  It'll probably be disturbingly easy to drop clothies, now - have the prot warrior (yeah, we do exist in PvP and last I saw, the 3.0 changes made us even better than we were before) get a stack of sunders on the clothie, then disarm them (Improved Disarm was a flat +10% damage taken last I checked), and then have the DK yank them behind a pillar, out of line of sight to healers and teammates.  Have one or two folks keep the rest of his team tied up (a well-placed frost nova or pet nova would make it very easy to pop off a perfect shockwave) while the rest of your team stomps on the poor bastard with both feet.  Even if he survives, it'll almost certainly shift the momentum of the match in your favor, and momentum is everything.  Even more, if you keep sunders up on multiple targets (which any decent prot warr will be doing), you can choose your burn target on the fly.

Despite how fun this sounds, I still suspect it'll be less fun than L4D :)

And Alex C, you look disturbingly similar to Barney in that picture you're using as your avatar.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 21 Nov 2008, 04:53
(http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/6034/melvillema4.th.jpg) (http://img404.imageshack.us/my.php?image=melvillema4.jpg)(http://img404.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif) (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)

Thumbnail cuz hueg.

I don't use many addons.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: KharBevNor on 21 Nov 2008, 06:15
Add-ons are for fucking pussies.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Nov 2008, 08:57
And Alex C, you look disturbingly similar to Barney in that picture you're using as your avatar.

(http://pbskids.kids.us/images/sub-square-barney.gif)

 :?

Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 21 Nov 2008, 09:25
I have very few add-ons and none of them are UIs, because those are annoying. (Basically Omen, Druid Announces, and Group Cal.)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dimmukane on 21 Nov 2008, 09:45
I am broke as dick at the moment, so I'm just levelling my mage alt for the time being.

I thought you got rid of your account in the most complicated way ever?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Nov 2008, 09:55
I use Autobar when leveling a new character, mostly because I dislike fiddling around and rearranging my ever changing lineup of consumables all the time. At the high end though I don't use it because I know exactly what type of potions and food I'm bringing with so I just use the appropriate macros and hotkeys rather than clutter things up. I'm also a fan of Grid for raid healing and I use ArcHud on my rogue to help keep my energy and combo points front and center. I never really liked HUDs much before, but now that the Sinister Strike glyph has made my combo point generation a bit more unpredictable, I find it pretty invaluable.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 21 Nov 2008, 12:37
Questhelper is for people who don't like tabbing out to thottbot to see where the game dev's decided to put a Q item in a stupid place.  Makes questing EASILY twice as fast and keeps you focused, makes questing fun.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: ackblom12 on 21 Nov 2008, 13:06
Questhelper is really all I've ever used.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: KharBevNor on 21 Nov 2008, 14:00
Macros are also for pussies.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 21 Nov 2008, 15:59
I have QuestHelper, Cartographer (yay instance maps yay!) with the addon's for herbalism and things. I use SpartanUI which is wonderful and pretty and I don't have ridiculous buttons all over the place. I think that's it. Oh! And SCT - nicer than the inbuilt one.

I'll post a screenshot when I get home to my iMac.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 21 Nov 2008, 17:01
Macros are also for pussies.
Said by the person who has never been a PvP warrior...

Change stance equip shield spell reflect change back
change stance intercept changeback
charge hamstring
change stance target healer intervene (Oh look I am now behind this pillar with you and you can heal me)

A Warrior with no macros is near enough useless in PvP.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: supersheep on 21 Nov 2008, 17:42
I've spent the past few hours drinking, playing WoW, and watching Star Trek: The Next Generation. I think this is probably the nerdiest I've ever been.

Also, I think the TV just tried to sell hair dye by encouraging small kids to encourage their dads to use it to attract new ladies after their mothers die.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dimmukane on 21 Nov 2008, 18:26
Alright, so I'm taking a LUA class next semester, and WoW is required for the course.  I'm worried that my guilt over paying for the account will force me into playing and thus suck me into the vortex.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Catfish_Man on 21 Nov 2008, 18:58
Nice. Lua looks like a fun language.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 21 Nov 2008, 19:07
I've spent the past few hours drinking, playing WoW, and watching Star Trek: The Next Generation. I think this is probably the nerdiest I've ever been.

I got that beat. Drinking and reading comics while waiting in the queue to get on WoW.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 21 Nov 2008, 19:30
Beer, CoD4 mixxes and WoW, but I moved my PC downstairs because I have a friend over and wanna watch him play megaman and Mirrors edge.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: KharBevNor on 22 Nov 2008, 02:58
A Warrior with no macros is near enough useless in PvP.

Learn to click faster, noob.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 22 Nov 2008, 04:54
Macros are always faster which makes mt attacks faster which makes me kill you faster and you die and I live. HAHA. Take that to your trolling.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 22 Nov 2008, 05:24
Okay, so if you log in today (23rd) you get an achievement about WoW's 4th birthday and they send you the cutest vanity pet ever - the Baby Blizzard Bear.

Sqeeeeeee!

(I am such a girl)
(Also, it rivals the wolpertinger for cuteness, zomg)
(It is also account bound, this is awesome)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 22 Nov 2008, 06:06
Even if you don't have WotLK?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 22 Nov 2008, 10:51
Note, by today, she means tomorrow for most of us.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 22 Nov 2008, 12:20
3 hours 40 mins... it made me put off changing realm because that might mean I cannot play my main for a day or two (Last time it was 30 mins), cheers for the heads up :)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 22 Nov 2008, 16:05
Okay, here is my screenshot (click for big):

(http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/927/picture5eq1xa8.png) (http://img372.imageshack.us/img372/2704/picture5eq1.png)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 22 Nov 2008, 18:05
(http://img376.imageshack.us/img376/4077/wowscrnshot112308020345qp5.th.jpg) (http://img376.imageshack.us/my.php?image=wowscrnshot112308020345qp5.jpg)(http://img376.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif) (http://g.imageshack.us/thpix.php)

Click for hueg, he is sitting down :D
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 24 Nov 2008, 17:58
Okay, so if you log in today (23rd) you get an achievement about WoW's 4th birthday and they send you the cutest vanity pet ever - the Baby Blizzard Bear.
Sqeeeeeee!

i actually logged in yesterday for the first time in weeks for the sake of getting the bear. it makes me happy. <3

other than that i seem to have lost interest in wow entirely. it's not a oh, my main is getting boring time to play a different class now thing, it is just that nothing about the game in general appeals to me at the moment. oh well.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 24 Nov 2008, 21:00
Yeah, I get that feeling about every two or three months of continuous gameplay.  The fun usually comes back after a month or three of playing other games or doing new and/or possibly dangerous things in Real Life™.  YMMV.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 25 Nov 2008, 01:40
Okay, here is my screenshot (click for big):

[IMG]
Oh, that was a nice UI!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 25 Nov 2008, 03:30
Yeah I might have stolen your spartanUI too... Took like over an hour to get it how I wanted it on 2 characters but now it is super awesome!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: KharBevNor on 25 Nov 2008, 04:42
Custom UI's are for noooobs

(I have never been able to get any addons working properly, though I have only ever tried to install, like, two)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: KharBevNor on 25 Nov 2008, 05:00
Not really. I suspect it's because I have vista and I only spent like, five minutes, six months ago. They're probably in the folder where WoW would be on XP, or some such.

I still think the custom UI's are retarded, I was trying to get auctioneer and atlas working. Not sure I really want auctioneer anymore though, tbh, because it's more fun working out prices and such on your own.

And I really have never encountered a situation where I need a macro. I have all the critical stuff on the primary bar so I just hotkey it. Any macros I did make would be for shit like bubbling and healing, and would just make me feel lazy. Timing and speed is really the primary gameplay for me.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 25 Nov 2008, 05:12
Well, not every macro does everything for you.  Most of mine are just for using a single button for multiple skills.  Examples:  cure poison and poison cleansing totem in a single button (press button for one, press button plus modifier key for the other), and a weapon swap macro (again using the shammy, swaps offhand with shield and vice versa.)

UI mods are definitely worth spending some time on.  I can't imagine playing without Bongos, PitBull, and Proximo - hopefully they won't have changed much whenever I return.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 25 Nov 2008, 05:28
Open up interface folder in WoW install location
Unzip Addon
Drag and drop folder into Interface folder
? ? ? ? ?
PROFIT!

I honestly don't see how so many people balls it up, I have had one guildie claim it "Broke" his PC. Damn rogues.

Is the exact same on Vista as it was on XP, I used auctioneer on both.

Addons fo lyf, and I am so hapy to now have spartan it makes PvE easy as pie without unnecessary mouse movements (Yes I am a clicker for anythihng apart from tanking).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: KharBevNor on 25 Nov 2008, 06:43
The interface folder? Maybe that was the problem. I put them in the 'addons' folder because, you know, logic.

The WoW install folder moved on vista two patches ago, dunno if it moved those things, maybe I'll have a muck around this afternoon. Maybe not, it's not like I need any of this stuff. Which is why I don't really have much truck with the addons. it just seems like standard geek wank bullshit. Besides, they'd probably murder my frame-rate.

EDIT: nope, the addons folder is in the interface folder. They're just not working. Maybe something to do with WoTLK. Too much fucking effort.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 25 Nov 2008, 07:21
While we're playing the screenshot game, here's me:

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v289/0bsessions/Random%20Forum%20Junk/WoWScrnShot_112508_012618-1.jpg)

Yes, I have Faerie Fire sitting in three different spots. One of them is humanoid form Feral Fire and the other two are the feral cast version. I just put it on my sidebar in an effort to get used to casting it from there, as keeping it on my main bar when it's the same spell for both cat and bear form is useless. I've left it on the main bar for now, just in case I slip up and forget its location during combat, since I use it a lot.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 25 Nov 2008, 12:09
My UI is hilariously ugly. Maybe I'll take a screen of it later.

As for macros there's really only a few I use, and I certainly don't use macros for everything. I use them mostly for trinkets and cooldown abilities that benefit from being used simultaneously. For example, I had a macro that would attempt to use any on-use DPS trinkets available whenever I used Blade Flurry or Adrenaline Rush and when I didn't have on-use trinkets I would combine AR/BF into one button via a /castsequence macro. And waaaaaay back in pre-bc when I was a Seal Fate build, I used the ridiculously popular Cold Blood->Eviscerate macro, because, frankly, what the hell else are you going to blow a Cold Blood on?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 25 Nov 2008, 12:33
I don't use any mods really, because I simply can't be arsed to bother fucking around with. As far as macros, I'm just a control freak to the degree I don't like preprogrammed actions.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 25 Nov 2008, 13:01
It really depends on the class and how straight forward something is for me. For example, I can't imagine making a cast sequence macro for something as basic as Sinister Strike and finishing moves, simply because I don't know when I'll have to drop everything and do something else or have to suddenly account for a miss. My favorite macros are probably "Oh Shit!" buttons, although I don't really have any characters set up for one at the moment. For example, when I moonlighted a resto druid pre-bc, I had both vanilla nature's swiftness sitting around ready to modify spells as well as an emergency macro that cancelled whatever I was already casting and dropped what amounted to an instant cast Healing Touch on my target at the press of a button-- literally a lifesaver.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 25 Nov 2008, 13:34
I don't bother with macros. (Read: I still haven't figured them out but I honestly don't care.) Add-ons are good for making gameplay easier, but I find that having too many just makes gameplay annoying. I like having coords, QuestHelper (when I'm actually questing, otherwise I turn it off), a damage meter, a threat meter, and Druid Announces (which basically tells someone when I innervate them and/or are going to rez them).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 25 Nov 2008, 13:45
I don't use any mods really, because I simply can't be arsed to bother fucking around with. As far as macros, I'm just a control freak to the degree I don't like preprogrammed actions.
You would if you were a boomkin  :-D

I am going macro free for now since I only use them in PvP anyways and all I do is quest rite about now.

Endgame as prot I doubt I will use any tank macros since there is only about 2.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 25 Nov 2008, 13:56
I'm a boomkin...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 25 Nov 2008, 14:08
The only macro I'd see myself using with boomkins would be trinket related again. About the only macros I'd use as a druid would be Nature's Swiftness related, really. Everything else and I'd rather go with the finer degree of control route.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: axerton on 26 Nov 2008, 00:34
I don't use any addons because I felt like I should play the game as it was meant to be played - at least on my first character and I don't use any macros yet, principally because I can't be bothered figuring out how to work them but once I hit 71 I will make a "Fuck You!" botton (instant cast pyroblast at 130% damage with increased spell power and an extra 30% chance to crit)

as a mage trying to level in outland I have one thing to say: Deathknights can all go get fucked. Death grip is ridiculous. not only rival hunters for "oops were you trying to cast fireball, too bad it's my kill now" but it has at least twice stolen my kill when I've already tagged it. admittedly it is ten kinds of useful for pulling in dungeons and an excellent way of dealing with runners - it's quite funny to be a caster standing away from the main fight (3 deathknights and god knows how many orcs in Blood Furnace) then see one orc leave the clusterfuck get about 5 steps only to have a purple string shoot out of what I can't help but think of as the kids cartoon dustclouds that appear whenever there's a fight and pull him straight back into the fray. This however doesn't change the fact that it's just too damn good at kill stealing give it a three second cast time and it might be ok

And please, blizzard, hire someone with original ideas and stop giving away classes special tricks - first you give hunters and mages a version of Steath then you give shamys Hex (basically pollymorph frog but it only lasts 20 seconds) if you keep this up you'll have no problems balancing the classes because they'll all be completely the same.

Jamie if you think the baby blizzard bear is the cutest pet ever you clearly haven't seen the sprite darter hatchling - I'll get a screenshot of it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 26 Nov 2008, 00:44
Considering Blizzard steals the best addon ideas and turns them into crappy versions of the same, I'd say the game is "meant" to be played with OR without mods :P

Simple fact is that a handful of specific mods can massively increase your efficiency in-game, though.  Ex: I can't imagine being able to successfully compete in arenas without Proximo, can't imagine tanking (or DPSing) without Omen, etc.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 26 Nov 2008, 00:49
Yeah, fireball has a travel time so it's possible to get the spell off yet not actually deal damage just as the mob gets pulled in by death grip. Add in the long range and instant cast, and it's a pretty sweet ability. Still, kill stealing is basically the worst reason for nerfing anything in the history of the universe. I mean, really, from the perspective of kill stealing it's really not all that much different from what Mages and Shamans have been doing since release with Shocks and Fireblast.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: axerton on 26 Nov 2008, 01:18
No, I honest to god have tagged things- like hit them with fireball and slow then the DK Death Grips and the mob goes gray. But DKs need to be taken down a peg or two in general I dueled one 3 levels lower than me and it had me down to less than a quarter health before I knew what was happening.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 26 Nov 2008, 01:56
Just because you got your ass whipped doesn't necessarily mean that Class X is overpowered.  DKs might just have an advantage against spellcasters.  I can't see them being very threatening to my warrior or pally, though my may have issues with em.

Or it could just be that his UI mods are better than yours :P
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 26 Nov 2008, 02:24
Yeah... WoW all depends on the quality of your ui. ;)
If  you play with macros depends much on what class and spec you are. Can't say I had much use of macros as a shadow priest, but my tankadin had quite a few. The most interesting/most usefull macro in my opinion is the ability to add triggerbuttons. So while a regular 1 just casts holy shield, a ctrl + 1 casts a bubbel, for example. Any addons/ui is just depending on taste. I usually allways have healbot and some kind of agro meater. A buff/debuff counter is quite nice as well. But most people can simply hold it in their heads if you need to reapply buffs/debuffs or not.

I restarted my account yesterday. Joining a new guild on alliance side and leveling up my (suprise suprise) druid (got him to 35 before I lost interest).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 26 Nov 2008, 03:25
Playing my DK now in Hellfire and yeah, it makes my awesome arms warrior look totally lame for survivability. If you are sensible you will NEVER EVER DIE EVER. and an just link killing sprees because you have approximately 0 downtime, no MB no food breaks.

I am having fun (Oh and baby murloc pet is still best).

When I said boomkins need macros I was meaning in arenas, which is the only place a boomkin should be outside of soloing quests since in instance runs nothing apart from bosses stay alive long enough for a boomkin to do enough dot's to do acceptable DPS.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 26 Nov 2008, 04:30
No, I honest to god have tagged things- like hit them with fireball and slow then the DK Death Grips and the mob goes gray.

Then death grip is bugged, not necessarily overpowered.

Anyway, if you think DKs have high survivability james, you should try out a feral druid. The crap you can get get away with as a feral druid is pretty crazy. Plus, I've always kind of secretly considered warriors kind of shitty as solo characters. They can hit like trucks and soak damage like crazy, but they can't really kite or self-heal, both of which are almost stupidly OP vs. mobs.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: KharBevNor on 26 Nov 2008, 04:46
Warriors are the opposite of priests really. Both classes are mediocre for solo play and BG, essential for group play (although warriors less so than priests).

I developed a huge dislike of macros back when I played The Specialists. I'm not the kind of egotistical spazzbag who wants to win at any cost: the complexities of targeting and timing are what actually make the game interesting as far as I'm concerned. Macros have always seemed terribly lame to me.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 26 Nov 2008, 05:04
It's the damned gear dependence, really. James probably has had a much better experience with warriors than I simply because I never geared one up all that terribly high and they don't really have much else to fall back on. That's not to say that warriors are a shitty class, mind you, it's just that so much about them is based on the idea that they can leverage a great piece of gear better just about any other class. I mean, really, a Mortal Strike crit followed up by some sword spec procs is either pretty okay compared to what other classes do or fuckin' amazing depending on your gear level.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 26 Nov 2008, 05:23
Well, all the classes are pretty heavily gear-dependant - getting shiny new purples is the whole reason for the endgame, after all, much like it was in D2X.

Physical DPS classes are a little more reliant than casters because their weapons are where a lot of the damage comes from, but a caster with 0 spellpower more than likely won't have it any easier than a fighter with a white weapon.

As far as solo warriors go, they're fine.  I've leveled two to 70, both as Protection, and this was pre-3.0, mind you.  The first one was pre-Shield Slam :)

It's about balancing how much damage you're taking versus how much you're putting out (heh.)  Generally speaking, Arms is the least gear dependent, while Fury is the most.  Protection is the most efficient, and I'll bet it's just downright superior to the other two, with all the crazy buffs it's gotten.  If you're focusing on leveling, I'd strongly recommend Prot.  It was already very efficient before 3.0, and I doubt the changes made it worse.  You also get the side benefit of finding instance groups pretty easily - everyone loves Prot warriors :)

How useful macros are depends on your class.  Shammies and Pallies benefit hugely from modifier-key macros, since it allows you to place more abilities within easy reach (ex, you could use 1-5, Q, E, R, F, G, C, and V for common abilities; if you make each key a modifier-key macro, you just went from having 12 abilities in easy reach to 24 or even 36, without even using an actionbar mod.)  A simple weaponswap macro is critical for any shield class if the shield isn't part of your normal loadout.  You cannot compete as an Enhancement Shammy in PvP without one - you MUST be able to quickly switch between DPS (dual wielding) and survival modes (heater and beater) on the fly, since Enh Shammies have all the durability of soggy Kleenex without the Armor that comes from a shield.  Your choice not to use em, but you'll be hugely more efficient with a few simple macros without really automating any part of the game; unless you LIKE digging through your packs to dig up your shield while butchering Alliance scum, of course ;)

Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 26 Nov 2008, 05:49
It's true that all classes are gear dependent, but really, my point is that warriors have traditionally come closer to being an outlier than any other class, since their "Oh shit!" abilities are tanking oriented and tend to work best when you've got a healer backing you up. For solo survivability they don't quite have anything that really compares with kiting, bubble or even a simple Evasion+AR beatdown, since if nothing else the poisons and fast combo point generation will kill things even if your swords suck. Although, I must admit, Retaliation is admittedly pretty sweet... if you have a great big two hander. Further, if nothing else, warriors have always been kind of fiddly stat wise. It was even worse before the attack power normalization many moons ago.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 26 Nov 2008, 06:51
Anyway, if you think DKs have high survivability james, you should try out a feral druid. The crap you can get get away with as a feral druid is pretty crazy. Plus, I've always kind of secretly considered warriors kind of shitty as solo characters. They can hit like trucks and soak damage like crazy, but they can't really kite or self-heal, both of which are almost stupidly OP vs. mobs.

Untrue. As someone who rolled Feral Druid from the start, I can assure you: Death Knights make Feral Druids look like pansies. With the time I've logged on him, I feel confident saying I'm pretty damn solid with Druids, but I still can take down things more efficiently with an Unholy Death Knight. Unholy Death Knights are like some disgusting union between a Paladin and a Hunter. You've got all these insane debuffs and instant cast pull bullshit and an incredibly tough pet. II have only actually seen my Ghoul die once, and that was my own fault for testing to see how many equal level mobs I could take at once in Hellfire Peninsula. The answer was about six. And this was with minimal experience with the class.

As James said, if you are playing competently, there is zero excuse for dying as a Death Knight.

That said, about ninety percent of Death Knights are completely incompetent. The other night, I was soloing a 63 Elite for a quest with my feral Druid, waiting for it to respawn as someone had beaten me to him. Two Alliance Death Knights creeped up behind me in a pretty clear and obvious effort to kill steal on me when the Elite respawned. Being Alliance Death Knights, they obviously had zero attention span, so the goons start ineptly pulling other mobs to pass time. While they did this, I furiously kept right clicking the spawn point and just barely snagged him before they could. Of course, being the kind of right cunt who would roll Death Knight, the two of them both started spitting on me, but hey, learn not to be a tit.

I deal with at least a couple of them doing this every evening of play I commit to. Add to this general attitude pretty much the majority of Death Knights have the whole Death Grip thing and you have a class that is pretty much perfectly aimed at being an absolute cunt.

It's at its worst in Hellfire, though. Thankfully, Zangarmarsh wasn't nearly as bad and Nagrand seems effectively barren of them thus far. There were points in Hellfire where I simply couldn't use cat form, my general primary form, because stealthing would slow me down too much to get anything tagged before some asshole DK would come in and pull six mobs onto himself in an effort to tag everything. I miss being able to actually use my usual elite soloing strategy (Stealth, pounce, shred, rip, mangle, ferocious bite, go to bear and enjoy a nice war of attrition), but half the time, a Death Knight will come in and I have to just start out in bear form due to a need to just run in on the elite, adds or not, to avoid the DK tagging it.

So yeah, Death Knights are a broken class that desperately needs nerfing, particularly the death grip ability. I figure, since its primary intent is holding aggro, giving it a really bad cooldown that's eliminated indoors would probably solve the problem.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 26 Nov 2008, 07:19
I dunno... I guess I'm just not a big ghoul fan.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 26 Nov 2008, 09:53
Ultimate DK macro...

/yell BANG!
/point
/cast Corpse Explosion(Rank 1)

YES.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: michaelicious on 26 Nov 2008, 10:43
You jerks are making me wanna play again. I think I'm gonna pick it back up over Christmas and switch back to disc from shadow on my priest for levelling. I miss healing.

I've been planning the perfect spec and everything. Pretty exciting!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 26 Nov 2008, 10:57
I'm working out my feral spec planned through to eighty right now. Trying to decide between Survival of the Fittest and Natural Reaction for my last three points is tough.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: KharBevNor on 26 Nov 2008, 11:08
I just have my weapons and shield (and my fishing rod) on the side action bar, swapping ain't too hard. It doesn't need a macro.

You can't 'steal' a kill, as far as I'm concerned. Maybe that's because I do it lots. Consecration and Avengers Shield are excellent for mass tagging. But then, I am geared for AoE grinding, from my mithril shield spike to my naglering. My comment on warriors not being optimal for pvp was based on the fact that, in my experience, all the other melee classes tend to trash them one on one, and they can often only take casters if they get a good jump. This may balance out in the end-game, I used to play a warrior but only took it to about 40, but warriors were a hard proposition in PVP. Whereas in PVE warriors are fucking indispensible, because they are by far the best tanking class at managing threat. It seems to me, from my admittedly limited experience, that each tanking class is somewhat speciliased: Protadins for mass brawls, warriors for ye olde fashioned tank and spank, and feral druids for DPS races. Not sure what DK's are designed for, except being annoying. I agree totally with the fact that they need nerfing, and it's mainly just Death Grip. Even a two second interruptible cast would balance it. I don't mind about the pets, because they just go the same way as warlock pets: Holy Wrath, Exorcism, Avengers Shield, Hammer of Wrath. I looooove fighting undead and demons. Might be a bit different for other classes though.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 26 Nov 2008, 11:15
Actually, yeah. Removing instant cast from it would sufficiently nerf it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 26 Nov 2008, 12:07
I just find it funny that of all the things death knights are capable of, it's death grip that's giving people conniptions. I would have thought it would be the dps, the excellent debuffs or the fact that they can essentially give Windfury to an entire raid group if Frost specd. I doubt Death grip will be nerfed any time soon, and if it is, it would probably be a range nerf rather than removing instant cast status. Even a half second cast time could get them mauled in pvp. Stopping dead in you tracks in an attempt to keep someone from kiting you isn't exactly a winning strategy, after all.

Anyway, I do think DKs have a tanking niche vs. casters due to mind freeze, strangulate and anti-magic shell, none of which are on a cooldown longer than 30 seconds. Throw in a gear swap and their disease debuffs and they should make fine offtanks/dpsers as well. Basically, DKs are likely here to handle gimmicky situations like tanking Leotheras the Blind's fire damage, a job that was typically just shunted off on warlocks before.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 26 Nov 2008, 13:48
EDIT: Alex C beat me to it.

And yeah, DKs are the sole reason why I stopped leveling my 66 rogue and started working on my spriest.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 26 Nov 2008, 14:19
I just have my weapons and shield (and my fishing rod) on the side action bar, swapping ain't too hard. It doesn't need a macro.

You can't 'steal' a kill, as far as I'm concerned. Maybe that's because I do it lots. Consecration and Avengers Shield are excellent for mass tagging. But then, I am geared for AoE grinding, from my mithril shield spike to my naglering. My comment on warriors not being optimal for pvp was based on the fact that, in my experience, all the other melee classes tend to trash them one on one, and they can often only take casters if they get a good jump. This may balance out in the end-game, I used to play a warrior but only took it to about 40, but warriors were a hard proposition in PVP. Whereas in PVE warriors are fucking indispensible, because they are by far the best tanking class at managing threat. It seems to me, from my admittedly limited experience, that each tanking class is somewhat speciliased: Protadins for mass brawls, warriors for ye olde fashioned tank and spank, and feral druids for DPS races. Not sure what DK's are designed for, except being annoying. I agree totally with the fact that they need nerfing, and it's mainly just Death Grip. Even a two second interruptible cast would balance it. I don't mind about the pets, because they just go the same way as warlock pets: Holy Wrath, Exorcism, Avengers Shield, Hammer of Wrath. I looooove fighting undead and demons. Might be a bit different for other classes though.
Oh, so you are a pally! Explains alot about your macro QQ ing because pallys without macros are like rogues without an offhand.

And warriors tank well, but so do druids, and in pvp warriors are back to being the fucking shiznit.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 26 Nov 2008, 16:03
BTW, I don't mean to imply that DKs don't need to be nerfed. I don't know that one way or the other. I just kinda doubt it'll start with Death Grip, that's all.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 26 Nov 2008, 16:13
For those of your installing SpartanUI - it can be a bit fiddly to get working because when you update bartender, it can mess all the bars up. There are replacement .lua's if you have that problem on the SpartanUI forums. It took me a bit of messing about, but once I got it set up, it worked great. When the WoTLK patch came out, SpartanUI didn't work, and I was back to the standard UI for a couple of days - it drove me mad. Had no idea where anything was and had to rearrange everything a bunch of times to get it right.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 26 Nov 2008, 22:16
I just have my weapons and shield (and my fishing rod) on the side action bar, swapping ain't too hard. It doesn't need a macro.

You can't 'steal' a kill, as far as I'm concerned. Maybe that's because I do it lots. Consecration and Avengers Shield are excellent for mass tagging. But then, I am geared for AoE grinding, from my mithril shield spike to my naglering. My comment on warriors not being optimal for pvp was based on the fact that, in my experience, all the other melee classes tend to trash them one on one, and they can often only take casters if they get a good jump. This may balance out in the end-game, I used to play a warrior but only took it to about 40, but warriors were a hard proposition in PVP. Whereas in PVE warriors are fucking indispensible, because they are by far the best tanking class at managing threat. It seems to me, from my admittedly limited experience, that each tanking class is somewhat speciliased: Protadins for mass brawls, warriors for ye olde fashioned tank and spank, and feral druids for DPS races. Not sure what DK's are designed for, except being annoying. I agree totally with the fact that they need nerfing, and it's mainly just Death Grip. Even a two second interruptible cast would balance it. I don't mind about the pets, because they just go the same way as warlock pets: Holy Wrath, Exorcism, Avengers Shield, Hammer of Wrath. I looooove fighting undead and demons. Might be a bit different for other classes though.
Oh, so you are a pally! Explains alot about your macro QQ ing because pallys without macros are like rogues without an offhand.

And warriors tank well, but so do druids, and in pvp warriors are back to being the fucking shiznit.

When did we ever stop?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: KharBevNor on 27 Nov 2008, 02:58
Oh, so you are a pally! Explains alot about your macro QQ ing because pallys without macros are like rogues without an offhand.

What?

And if warriors are so good at PVP, why do I keep seeing them getting owned by pretty much every class.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 27 Nov 2008, 04:00
Because you'll find that the vast majority of folks playing WoW either suck it, or aren't in a normal state of mind (as a guildie likes to say, "You can play this game sober?")

I don't claim to be anything better than average, but I literally kill greater than 93% of people I fight, both outdoors and in battlegrounds.  I've killed people rocking full S4 while I had nothing better than full S2 - and they started the fight at full while I was at 65%.  Part of it's not knowing what to do (warriors that don't disarm, shammies that don't use a shield, rogues that ambush instead of cheap shot or garrote. etc), part of it's bad luck (they get no crits, I basically autocrit), and part of it's bad reaction time (could be a clicker, may not be paying attention, may be stoned or drunk.)

As much as the e-peen stroking aspect of it sucks, I still look at arena stats to see how well a class is doing.  If they're doing well in high-rated games (2200+) in all three brackets, then the class is probably very strong.  Last I checked, almost every 5's team had a warrior, and many 3's and 2's did as well.

By the way, I'll post the macros I use if you want; all you'll need to do is copy+paste and change spell names around.  Hopefully 3.0 didn't bring any major changes to macro syntax.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 27 Nov 2008, 04:15
A warrior who is "not lazy" (Read: a stancedancer who uses trinkets and has macros for fear/CC etc) and knows how to play his class with good talents is going to fuck up pretty much any other class pretty fast. If my crits do what they should do I can maintain over 2kDPS which means I give you about 5-6 seconds tops. Failing that I charge into a big group of casters up the back SS/BS GG QQ.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 27 Nov 2008, 11:36
Warriors are pretty good in pvp, but the limitations of being a melee class means when they do die, it's often fairly dramatically. Warriors can't really do anything useful without crossing into what often amounts to no man's land and some massed focus fire can take them out pretty quickly if they don't have team support like in an Arena or can catch people with their pants down like in a BG. Since many players don't bother being very careful in a BG, it's pretty easy finding warriors dying left and right.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Runa on 27 Nov 2008, 13:23
I've taken a few weeks off.

But it's about that time to pick back up.
I've had to uninstall/reinstall the game 5 times due to my laptop just crapping out on me (I blame Vista).

As a combat rogue, I come asking for assistance.
Good add ons? I like action bars, I find them sexy, and I like less clutter as possible, so point this girl in the right way for new/updated add ons that cater to a rogues needs.
I don't stay in the loop with add ons if you can't tell, I let my former friends boyfriend install what I needed and just dealt with what I had.
So I'm in the dark here.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 28 Nov 2008, 06:15
Warriors are pretty good in pvp, but the limitations of being a melee class means when they do die, it's often fairly dramatically. Warriors can't really do anything useful without crossing into what often amounts to no man's land and some massed focus fire can take them out pretty quickly if they don't have team support like in an Arena or can catch people with their pants down like in a BG. Since many players don't bother being very careful in a BG, it's pretty easy finding warriors dying left and right.
Exactly which is where stancedancing to charge and intercept come in, and trinkets so you don't get stuck  :-D

Rolling a frost mage, lv 11 getting beaten up in Westfall :/
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: cheesepie on 30 Nov 2008, 09:02
So I started playing WoW again mid November.. So I reactivated my old account, invited a friend to play, and started a new character while taking advantage of the 3x experience promotion! (If you haven't heard of it, if a veteran player invites someone to start up a new account, the accounts are linked and they both get 3x experience while leveling and handing in quests together... the characters MUST be together though).

Anyway jI started a Draenei Shaman on Black Dragon Flight and really enjoy how much shamans pwn... I'm only level 40 though so i'm still a noob to the game through the eyes of a shaman. I used to have a 60 warrior when blackwing layer came out, got some tier 2 epics and sold my account for like 600 USD.

So I've been levelling as enhancement specced because melee is what i know :P Any suggestions for strategies with talents?
This is how I've chosen them so far:
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-talents.xml?r=Black+Dragonflight&n=Zbig

Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 30 Nov 2008, 10:41
Your talents atm are fine, for the most part. I wouldn't have taken Earth's Grasp and I would have taken Storm Strike before grabbing dual wield since you ave a pretty nice axe and it'll be a few levels before you've got Dual Wield Specialization maxed out. But really, that's pretty minor stuff since we're only talking about 2 talent points with the former and the latter is something that will be taken in a couple levels anyway since DW easily beats two handers in the long run, so it's mostly nitpicking. Certainly no reason to worry about respeccing at this stage in the game, anyway.

Really, my only advice is simply to mention that Unleashed Rage and Dual Wield Specialization are basically non-negotiable core talents, so make sure you grab them before even thinking of dipping into other trees.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: cheesepie on 01 Dec 2008, 16:27
What about totems? I am still trying to master the art of dropping the right totems at the right time. Any tips on that?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Trollstormur on 01 Dec 2008, 18:11
for sale: account Kel'thuzad pvp realm america

70 priest "Blasfemur"
70 rogue "Equimanthorn"
60something mage "Illdjarn"

rogue's got epic flier, 375 jc 375 mining some welfare epics
blasfemur 375 tailoring (mooncloth) and enchanting? I'm not 100% on that. full epic healing gear, some shadow gear. t5 type stuff.

pm me
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 01 Dec 2008, 19:45
What about totems? I am still trying to master the art of dropping the right totems at the right time. Any tips on that?

Not really; totem's are too expensive to drop thoughtlessly but too dang nice not to use pretty regularly. It's just something you're going to have to develop a feel for. Personally, I kept them up near constantly even while solo. I ended up taking drink breaks more often than I probably had to, but shamans are a bit flimsy without a shield, so I went the better safe than sorry route and just kept my buffs up. I've never leveled a shaman past 48 though, so I'm definitely no authority on the subject.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 01 Dec 2008, 21:36
What about totems? I am still trying to master the art of dropping the right totems at the right time. Any tips on that?

In terms of grinding/questing, you won't use totems too much - they're just too inefficient, even with Totemic Recall and Totemic Focus.  You will want to be using Grounding Totem (practice setting up a tot-shock-tot rotation; if you're tauren, you can use stomp in there as well), searing totem (anytime the fight will last longer than about half the totem's duration), and poison cleansing totem (cheaper than cure poison when you factor in totemic recall.)

I used to drop rank 1 Windfury totem literally every pull in instances, but the 3.0 changes both eliminated downranking (boooooooooooo) and changed the Windfury Totem mechanic, I believe.  In instances, though, set up totems on every significant pull (again, if the fight will last at least half as long as the tot;s duration, drop it; this is generally 60 seconds or longer), and always keep mana spring down if you've got mana users (hint: you are a mana user) unless you need a different water totem.  Drop tremor totem anytime you're fighting something that fears, sleeps, or charms, and drop it again if someone's affected by one of those - it pulses instantly on use.

Enhancement's talent tree got majorly changed with 3.0, so I don't know what buildf works best anymore.  I CAN tell you that you should get Stormstrike immediately at 40 - it's your ONLY instant attack, and it's every bit as important as MS, BT, and Shield Slam are to lvl 40 warriors - and not worry about dual wielding right away.  Try to get The Rockpounder out of Uldaman as soon as possible and enjoy one-shotting Alliance scum well into your late 40s - by which point, convienently, you get access to some good, slow one-handers (and have the talent points to make DW work.)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: masquerade on 03 Dec 2008, 17:08

as a mage trying to level in outland I have one thing to say: Deathknights can all go get fucked.

i love you. <3
except i'm a druid trying to level in outland.
either way deathknights are annoying the fuck out of me.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 03 Dec 2008, 17:41
On my main server I now have a 18 rogue, 20 mage, 63DK, 72 Warrior... and the warrior just respecced prot... then rite after 2manned Onyxia...
(http://c3.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/43/l_8a8b32df1db54e129de17534e42ce1ea.jpg)
With a blacksmith hammer...

Until I needed to change back to my sword because I could not use any attacks, it is not technically a weapon and did nothing in the way of damage (shield slam wil only get you so far in life).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 03 Dec 2008, 19:16
Weeeee! You are using Spartan! It seriously is so wonderful. One thing though, you've got a bunch of your pets in your bar on the right, if you hit 'shift-p' it brings up the pets tab, should be all in there.

My mage hit 71 the other day. I've also jumped ship to a different guild who are super friendly and helpful and we have managed to form a 5-man instance group. We've run Utgarde Keep, Nexus and Azjol so far. Planning on Old Kingdom runs next. Azjol hardly seems like an instance at all, really short, only took us about half an hour.

Planning on going back and doing a bunch of BC and original instances as well for the achievements.

I am really starting to enjoy this game and oh my my mage is powerful. Not really sure what spec I'll go with once I hit 80. I'm full frost spec now, maybe arcane for raiding? That's what I've heard.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 03 Dec 2008, 19:38
My Druid is a one-man wrecking crew. That said, I hated the fucking Ogre elites in Nagrand. Pretty much every fucking one is immune to stun and not being able to stun them to heal pretty much dooms me.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 03 Dec 2008, 20:13
Yeah, I can relate to that. The problem I have as a frost mage, is that when my Ice Barrier breaks, it has a chance to pretty much frost nova everything close to me. So if there are enemies around me, that I wasn't attacking, then they charge at me. Keeping some kind of shield up (I have a couple of options), is pretty much key for me staying alive. Also, Evocation (which with the glyph heals me as well), but that has something like an 8minute cooldown. Let's just say being an alchemist really helps.

Having said all that - I took down the 71 elite frost wrym thinger in HF for some quest on my own the other day. Frost against frost and I didn't die. Was awesome.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 03 Dec 2008, 20:40
Ugh, how can you stand all that opacity at the bottom of your screen?  It's a very pretty setup, much prettier than mine, but it doesn't seem very functional :(
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 04 Dec 2008, 06:35
I fill the blank grey stuff with the people I am supposed to keep aggro from in raids, because it is a 2man in the pic there is only the healer. Also I like having all my pets there... I use them more than most people and that square would be empty elsewise  :-D

But yeah it is the besy UI I have ever seen for WoW, thankyou jmrz :)

After installin spartan, across all characters I spent close to 2 days getting everything juuuust rite so now I have 3 text boxes (Combat/party-raid-general/Guild) and have a character in 2 of the best raiding guilds on my realm, they know about my alts so I have a warrior and DK at their disposal and they like it. Kinda slutty though.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Runa on 04 Dec 2008, 10:11
I think I'm going to try out Spartan. I like how it looks.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 04 Dec 2008, 10:57
It's pretty, but I tend to wonder how much use I'd actually get out of it since I'm pretty much married to HUDs and Grid at this point.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jace on 04 Dec 2008, 11:02
Man, reading this makes me want to start playing WoW again because you guys all play.
Jerks.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 04 Dec 2008, 14:17
The way I figure is that with all my casting buttons/macros/shortcuts to things in the one spot then I don't lose space around the edges of the screen - which gives me room for all my buff bars and such. It also really depends on the size of your monitor. On a 20" iMac (mine) and 24" iMac (boyfriend's), it really doesn't matter - there is still plenty of space to see what is going on.

And no worries - it's the best UI I've come across and my bf is struggling with learning a proper RAID UI because he loves the SpartanUI so much. The only thing I am missing, that I need to get is aggro counters. Lately, if I crit more than two times in a row (which is happening more and more), then I have aggro all over me like a rash. Makes hard work for the tank.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 04 Dec 2008, 14:19
Omen. (http://wow.curse.com/downloads/wow-addons/details/omen-threat-meter.aspx)

ETA: Here's the priest I've been playing to avoid the Death Knights. Armory Link (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bleeding+Hollow&n=Starsnostars)

(http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w274/Yakob42/WoWScrnShot_120408_184830.jpg)

I'm using ArkiveUI and I like it a lot.

Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 04 Dec 2008, 16:09
LHS top row stuff I use lots (Button mash) bottom LHS row less used stuff like charge which I click, far left box shouts, macros, rhs top HS, Mount, pots, food, bandages, bottom RHS professions and equipment, far right box pets and toys. 1680*1050 20"

YEAH!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 04 Dec 2008, 20:52
Heh, I'm stuck with a puny 17" CRT from back in the day after my LCD fried itself... two weeks past warranty  :x

Locked at 1024x768, and it was so fuzzy after being so accustomed to DVI-D, I thought something was wrong with my eyes.

I don't need too many buttons for my warrior; I use three rows of eight buttons for everything, with one of them being the stancebar, so I guess it's really 5x8 total.  My pally uses more bars, 4x10 and another mini-bar for my blessings (1x5), plus the aura bar, but I've honestly been thinking about selling him because they're so damn boring.  Plus going from my beefy cow to the frooty little elf makes me die a little on the inside.  Because all of my buttons are bound to keys within easy reach, I could probably set a good half of the buttons to invisible, but it just feels awkward like that, even if it does look prettier.

I just use PitBull for unitframes, and put Proximo, Omen (for the rare time I can be convinced to come tank some stupid dragon instead of Alliance scum), and the zone map all on top of each other in the lower right, since only one of them is ever active at any one time (Proximo in arena, Omen in instances, zone map everywhere else.)  I use Grid for raids on my pally (who is Holy) and not at all on my warrior, since it's just unnecessary clutter for him and anyone too stupid to pay attention to Omen deserves to die, anyway :P
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 04 Dec 2008, 22:47
Link your armoury page, I want to see who can "tank some stupid dragon" that is worth doing in a raid and also get any sort of PvP done against "Alliance scum" because PvP gear is not raid gear and vice versa... so either you have gold to respec between using 2 full sets of separate purplz or you are full of poopie.

I hope I am wrong in my assumptions as I understand not everyone has found it as hard as I have to find good gear, only now have I kept more than 1 piece of armour for each slot even if I don't see myself going back to arms any time soon.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 04 Dec 2008, 23:07
You're assuming I still play.  I haven't played in about four months or so now.  Gaming sites are filtered here at work, but Banetotem@Arthas-US is what you'll want to try and find.  I haven't logged on in those four months, but hopefully he'll still pop up.

Either way, I find PvE to be mindlessly boring after the first two or three kills of any encounter, hence I don't do much tanking these days; the rare times I get dragged into PvE, it's on my pally.

Gold is ridiculously easy to get, and Arms isn't the only PvP spec.

Gear is also fairly easy to get.  Run premades to get honor and just dick around in an arena ten rounds a week and you'll probably have your Savage Gladiator set in a couple months, a little longer for Hateful.  We were raking in about 2.5-4k honor per hour running AV premades, depending on if it was AV weekend.  About 500-850 honor per game, 10-15 minute games unless the Allies were being stupid and turtled instead of rolling over for their free mark.  Some of us would do that or like six or eight hours... I'd usually do two hours then get bored and go play another game or take a walk.

As far as PvE trash went, you could score some pretty sweet loot just by farming badges.  Do the heroic daily every day for your 4-6 badges and a KZ run once a week for an additional 22 and it'd only take a couple months to get some nice stuff.  I'd assume it's much the same at 80.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: masquerade on 05 Dec 2008, 13:16
My Druid is a one-man wrecking crew. That said, I hated the fucking Ogre elites in Nagrand. Pretty much every fucking one is immune to stun and not being able to stun them to heal pretty much dooms me.

You're feral, aren't you? Sigh.
I stay balance out of stubbornness and a love for doing ranged damage without heavy reliance on a pet (looking at you, 'locks and hunters...). Plus, starfall is so pretty. :D Further, it's fun scaring the newbies when I run around in Teldrassil.

I've actually converted a lot of low-level druids to balance. Being a boomkin is funfunfun. Except in Nagrand, only my problem is with those stupid elementals. Who resist everything except arcane spells. Which is annoying because those take a lot of mana. -_-
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 05 Dec 2008, 13:29
If I want to just cast spells on everything, I'll cut out the bullshit and roll Mage or Warlock. I picked Druid for the self sufficiency. Boomkims aren't nearly as self sufficient as Ferals.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 05 Dec 2008, 13:38
It's also so much better at being a MOTHER FUCKING BEAR THAT WILL KILL YOU IN YOUR FUCKING FACE!

A Boomkin may look like a dire bear, but ain't no fucking bear.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 05 Dec 2008, 13:54
Yeah, I mean, there may be a place in the world for boomkins as the game is tweaked, but wherever it is, it ain't at low levels. Feral druid dps isn't as good as that of a rogue's, but they make up for it with cat & travel form speed boosts, a virtual elimination of downtime and more emergency buttons than you can shake a stick at. If nothing else, the itemization is kind of a mess for boomkins.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: masquerade on 05 Dec 2008, 13:59
Umm the bears are fugly, for one thing, and are big fuzzy tanks, for another. I'm not a boomkin because I want to look like a bear. -_-

I've been balance from day one (or whichever day I hit level ten and started getting talent points), and I've thoroughly enjoyed it so far.

If I did go feral (an idea that I've been toying with because of its acknowledged superiority for leveling), I'd be in Cat Form 24/7. Pretty, graceful, and kickass DPS.

Then again, I don't play WoW to powerlevel. I've been playing for nearly a year and have just hit level 66. I play for the social aspect, and because of how dynamic the world of Azeroth is. It's very interesting and a lot of fun. I spend a lot of time running around and exploring, or helping the lowbies in my guild, or manipulating the Auction House. Leveling gets Godawful boring after a while, which is why so many people quit playing. Grind grind grind, whack at everything, gather bullshit, etc.

Out of curiosity, do you have your Aquatic Form? I know so many druids who don't because the quests are such a hassle.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 05 Dec 2008, 14:09
It's kinda funny how many people go for the cat form and end up staying for da bear.

I mean, really, I spent 90% of my time in catform when I played a druid. Cat form kicks ass. I love it, really I do, and along with the lure of utility, it's why I tried out a druid in the first place.

But that 10% of the time I spent in bear form consisted of stomping higher level elites, saving groups from wipes and generally performing minor miracles on a regular basis. You grow to love that gigantic fuzzy ass, almost despite yourself.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: masquerade on 05 Dec 2008, 14:17
I like it for the little dance it does. That's about it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 05 Dec 2008, 14:24
Boomkins only don't take aggro in raids because all they can do is DoTs, so they are bottom of the DPS list usually just above MT. Most mobs don't stay alive enough to take much dmg from DoTs, my friend is restro and we have so much fun together that feral seems less appealing to me. He is not a boomkin but does the lightning storm thing while I thunder clap.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: masquerade on 05 Dec 2008, 14:30
Uh, maybe boomkin that suck... I can get my DOT's slapped on and done pretty damn quick (Roots-Moonfire-Insect swarm... I don't really bother with the others because that takes too much time/mana), and set to spamming Wrath, with the occasional Starfire if I happen to get an Eclipse, and the refresh of Moonfire if it's needed. In instances I usually even get rid of Roots because the other party members' damage just destroys them anyway. In that case, I throw on Faerie Fire. And my contribution actually makes the difference in most cases, I thank you.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 05 Dec 2008, 14:59
I never said boomkins suck, just that since 3.0.2 onwards alot of them have been QQing about having lower damage output, and yeah they do have low DPS which only adds up impressively in PVP and on Bosses.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 05 Dec 2008, 16:36
I play with a 73 Boomkin and he's been higher than me in DPS rankings for nearly every instance we've done. The dude does 5k crits and throws in some healing when we are in tough spots.

It's pretty damn awesome.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 05 Dec 2008, 16:53
Boomkin? More like OOMkin, amirite?!


Nah, seriously, I don't have any real beef with the laser owls, I just think that as an offspec there's a lot of decent reasons not to play one right away since Blizzard screwed up their itemization and such fairly badly in the past; they're a lot better post 60, but sadly, blizzard's idea of balance druid gear used to mean crappy leathers with spirit tacked on. That seems to be changing, although I think their talent options are so fiddly it'll be a while before they really show their true colors-- hitting the right balance of raw damage and raw mana regen talents will probably prove tricky for most people for quite sometime. They do have some real nasty utility though. Besides, if Blizzard ever gets around to releasing a glyph that lets the raiders remove the knockback component of typhoon, it could become a great all-purpose AoE spell as well as a great pvp and 5 man trick.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 05 Dec 2008, 17:54
I could be, possibly, maybe, conceivably going to start playing WoW perchance.

But I would like to know, what class plays closest to a Battle-Sage from Ragnarok Online?  You know, constant flash pa-pow damage from spells avec a touch of melee.  I was told the Shaman, but this was by someone who likely has a vested interest in me becoming one for support reasons.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 05 Dec 2008, 18:33
Yeah, I'd say the closest to that would be an Elemental Shaman, but that's stretching it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: masquerade on 05 Dec 2008, 21:08
Yeah gear for boomies is a bit... difficult. It's getting better now that the expansion's opened, but it seems like everything I come across that looks badass is feral. Which only deepens my resentment and spurs my obstinacy to remain balance out of spite. And do damn good damage even with the handicap of other OP classes and specs.

And you're right, our damage has dropped since the expansion. I was critting over 2000 before it hit (and I was around level 62 or so, maybe a tad higher), and that's the crit that I'm managing now. It's frustrating, but you find ways around it. Stack the DoT's, spam high-damage, low mana-cost spells. Learn what works and what doesn't. ::shrug::

The class's limitations can be overcome by the player if they put effort into it. I think that's the point of playing different classes and specs -- learning your limitations and working with them so that they really don't matter.

As to those elementals, I'm going to find a mage or something to run around with to give them a big ol' "fuck you" for me. Mages do arcane damage, right...? I dunno, I've not really leveled anything past level 10 besides my main. ::shrug::
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 05 Dec 2008, 22:06
Get someone in plate to kill the elementals.

Oh and as for boomkins in PVP I charge in, try not to get hurt too much before intervening back to the closest healer :(

They are as bad as locks for kicking my ass.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: michaelicious on 06 Dec 2008, 18:00
My roommate just reactivated his account for WotLK the other day, and he went home for the weekend and told me I could mess around on his account. So I made a Death Knight and wow... what a boring class. Total yawnfest, man. I finished the starting zone quest-line in like three hours and then got bored.

I'm still pretty excited to get my Priest bumpin' in Northrend and get my Holy Fire on, though.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 06 Dec 2008, 18:31
No starting zone is ever fun, the first 20 levels are why re-rolling is so soul destroyingly boring. Dk's in outlands are the awesome for experimentation.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 08 Dec 2008, 13:29
I just frapsed a 3man onyxia run... will youtube it when I can be bothered.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 08 Dec 2008, 14:29
I believe I can recall a time when Onyxia was all but impossible for a guild to take down.  What happened?  Level cap increases make it easier?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: michaelicious on 08 Dec 2008, 15:36
Didn't people 3-man Onyxia at level 60 in Naxx gear?

Edit: Just wanna say I'm not trying to belittle your accomplishment, James, if it seemed that way. I think that would be a lot of fun to do. I just think I remember seeing a video of some dudes doing that with their ridiculously OP Naxx gear back in the day.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 08 Dec 2008, 16:02
Yeah we do it every time the instance resets purely for shits and giggles, it can be 2manned - Pally heals and tanks with a good pure dps or tank and spank like we did but a third makes it alot easier and faster.

Loot is okay and you get over 100g to split between the party + BOE bloos (lv 40-60) and BOP epix (lv58-60) and some other cool stuff, bags, her head (Take it to capital and hang it from the arches or on a spike) and it's just fun tbh.

I know it is easy now, heck we have a 80 healer (He dinged alot this week) and I am wearing alot of 70 epix (they still suck, argent stuff etc.) I am seriously wondering if an 80 pally can solo her. It is not a big thing, just a silly fun thing like that solo run I did of that EPL instance that I forget the name of.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 08 Dec 2008, 16:20
Stratholme.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 08 Dec 2008, 16:24
And Scholomance methinks. I remember reading a bunch of books.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 08 Dec 2008, 16:51
I believe I can recall a time when Onyxia was all but impossible for a guild to take down.  What happened?  Level cap increases make it easier?


Onyxia actually was never all that terribly hard (although she's definitely a bit of a gear check when it comes to your tank), there just happens to be a few ways to really screw up the fight if you've got a few bad players who are not paying attention or care too much about their epeen. She doesn't have a true berserk rage or anything, so the fight isn't a dps race; discipline was a helluva lot more important than sheer numbers. The first time we took her down in my original raiding guild, we were short 12 people-- but that last bit actually helped. It was just a practice run nobody expected to win, but losing those people pared us down to just our most competent and well-prepared players, which resulted in far less pressure on the healers and only 2 deaths on the fight (1 of which was immediately combat rezzed back up). Honestly, my first guild would have fared really well in BC had we stayed together 'till the expansion hit; the drop from 40 people to 25 people would have suited our number of "A-list" players perfectly. Hell, when we first took down Razorgore (on our 2nd try!), we were also on a short handed practice run (just a bunch of us bored after a  night of clearing MC trash), but since that fight was more about kiting and surviving a war of attrition, we managed to pull it off rather handily.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 08 Dec 2008, 21:44
Ony could be soloed by Rogues at 70, I believe.  Specific gear combinations could get you to greater than 100% physical avoidance, and I'd assume Cloak of Shadows handled Deep Breath.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: masquerade on 08 Dec 2008, 22:20
I tried Zul'Aman once. It was disorganized and confusing, and I haven't tried raiding since. I'm quite comfortable in my laidback "instance guild." I help my guildies level up with instance runs and bask in the light of their adoration. And I have connections with the best guilds on the server, who have reccomendations as to where to put the kids with the thirst for raiding blood. It works out quite well.

Shandris got a lot more competitive after <Broken> moved to Khargath or whatever. Something ogre-y sounding. Which suits them.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: michaelicious on 08 Dec 2008, 23:22
Onyxia actually was never all that terribly hard (although she's definitely a bit of a gear check when it comes to your tank), there just happens to be a few ways to really screw up the fight if you've got a few bad players who are not paying attention or care too much about their epeen. She doesn't have a true berserk rage or anything, so the fight isn't a dps race; discipline was a helluva lot more important than sheer numbers. The first time we took her down in my original raiding guild, we were short 12 people-- but that last bit actually helped. It was just a practice run nobody expected to win, but losing those people pared us down to just our most competent and well-prepared players, which resulted in far less pressure on the healers and only 2 deaths on the fight (1 of which was immediately combat rezzed back up). Honestly, my first guild would have fared really well in BC had we stayed together 'till the expansion hit; the drop from 40 people to 25 people would have suited our number of "A-list" players perfectly. Hell, when we first took down Razorgore (on our 2nd try!), we were also on a short handed practice run (just a bunch of us bored after a  night of clearing MC trash), but since that fight was more about kiting and surviving a war of attrition, we managed to pull it off rather handily.

Yeah I remember near the end of original WoW my guild doing 20 man Onyxias since only a couple people needed stuff and we didn't wanna PuG with a buncha nubs. Man 40-man raids were such a silly idea in retrospect but they were so much fun.

Also  :x Razorgore. Worst fight to be a priest. Man I miss BWL and AQ40. I remember one time we did a 23 mintue Ebonroc haha. Most of our raid got shadowflamed and died cause we were cocky and didn't wear our cloaks and a resto shaman and I kept the tank going for that long just for kicks before we ran out of mana. I think we each had like over a million healing done for that fight alone.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 09 Dec 2008, 00:36
I guess that just like everything else the difficulty was overstated because most guilds are full of people who suck.  My EQ guild found this out when we'd continually do things that people said required X people with say, 2/3 of X people.  It was a lot of fun.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 09 Dec 2008, 01:40
Alot of people only suck when they try to do new things, my friend was feral for 78 levels and he was a superb droodtank and solo dps monster, his healing is spot on too most of the time, but when he tries to help with some light AoE or he gets aggro for whatever reason thins go tits up fast. I liked DPS warrior-ing as arms because even if I stole aggro I could take it, I had platemail and good dodge without a shield and would be on top of the DPS tree alot but as a tank there is now sooo much to learn since lv 55. Sunder is replaced by devistate, remember shouts and that buff you put on the person 2nd in threat generation to charge taunt when they get hit and steal 10% of their threat, sword and board proccing means SHIELD SLAM NOW! When to block, when to interrupt with stun, when to stun mob with shockwave, when to spell reflect... That's about all I care about now. It takes some getting used to and yes, a fewdays back I was a sucky tank because of all the excellent new shit I did not understand.

That reminds me, I wish people would READ AND UNDERSTAND WHAT ALL THEIR SKILLS ACTUALLY DO.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Peis on 09 Dec 2008, 02:09
Also  :x Razorgore. Worst fight to be a priest. Man I miss BWL and AQ40.
i agree whole heartedly. I played a priest way back in pre-bc days, and razorgore was sooooooooo booooooring. but man, i miss bwl and aq40 and pre-bc naxx
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 09 Dec 2008, 10:55
I guess that just like everything else the difficulty was overstated because most guilds are full of people who suck.  My EQ guild found this out when we'd continually do things that people said required X people with say, 2/3 of X people.  It was a lot of fun.

Yep. And while I hate to use such ugly slang myself, WoW has a lot of raid encounters filled with what many people like to term "retard checks," situations in which multiple people or even the entire raid can suffer immense damage due to the inability of a single member to perform an extremely simple task. Onyxia has a few of them: Don't stand too close to anyone else in Phase 2 (she spits fireballs at people randomly and they can damage more than one person) and don't stand behind her in Phase 1 or 3 (she hits you with her tail, which can send you flying into a clutch of whelp-spawning eggs ala Leeroy Jenkins; this is pretty much always a wipe) and don't stand on the cracks in Phase 3, because they shoot lava. Everything else is simply a matter of watching your aggro.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 09 Dec 2008, 12:41
Oh, god, Hakkar.


My guild was the number 3 guild on my server in terms of progression, so our members were poached by the top guild fairly regularly (I was actually approached once or twice despite being a dps class). This led to us running ZG for fun, shoulder enchants and to test new recruits despite the fact that many of us were overgeared for ZG when it came out. The painful bit is when we'd try out a potential off-tank recruit and the dumb bastard would forget to burn his Intimidating Shout, leading to Hakkar Mind Controlling him and proceeding to fear a quarter of the damned raid, leading to a lack of heals and problems wrangling the Sons of Hakkar to get the damned poison cloud up etc, etc. Considering how much we warned people that burning Intimidating Shout was a non-negotiable requirement, I damn near ground my teeth down to the gums every time someone forgot.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 09 Dec 2008, 22:39
I was a raid leader when we were tearing through Zul'Gurub the first couple of months after it hit. My biggest obstacle was that we were not a raiding guild, but rather a social guild with a little raiding on the side, so the core criteria for us raiding at all was that everyone was to be allowed access to the raids as long as they signed up in time, we would never discriminate on gear or skill. I wanted to kick people out of the raid so badly when we were wiping four or five times on Hakkar because one or two doorknobs refused to understand the basic idea of the blood drain event he does, even after explaining to them time and time again what they are supposed to do (for those of you who haven't done this boss, it literally means running into a cloud of gas).

Sounds familiar.

Being in an FnF guild (that actually is able to put together a couple of fiercely competent 10-man raid groups), it just reinforces my belief in that you should never do business (raiding) with friends.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 09 Dec 2008, 23:12
But that's the only fun part with wow! But then again me and my friends were on the same level. Most of them had tried out hard core guilds. So we could put together a good raid and make progress quite well and still have a good time, trashtalking eachother and wipeing just for the fun of it (miss direct is a bad thing. <_<)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 10 Dec 2008, 00:10
Oh, I wipe raids routinely just because I can.  Perk of being a pally, I guess.  Just DI the main tank and watch the boss run around and wafflestomp the raid.  You, of course, are already dead, and no repair costs, either.

I rarely raid, and when I do, I usually do it out of the guild; the couple of competent in-guild groups very rarely need me (and I won't make them force someone else to sit out since I only raid when the mood strikes me, not consistently), and the remainder are... a bit lacking in the gameplay department, though they're all great people to shoot the shit with.

I do plenty of PvP with the guild, though.  Even the people that suck at the game are useful in battlegrounds as cannon fodder if nothing else ;)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 10 Dec 2008, 04:58
But that's the only fun part with wow! But then again me and my friends were on the same level. Most of them had tried out hard core guilds. So we could put together a good raid and make progress quite well and still have a good time, trashtalking eachother and wipeing just for the fun of it (missdirect is a bad thing. <_<)

Just a hint, since other people will be cockbags about it, you shouldn't quote a post right above yours, and unless strictly necessary when you quote a post with a quote in it, delete the older quote.  People reading will be able to follow the trail of conversation and it doesnt muddy up the flow.  Also if quoting pics, delete the pic and maybe use a txt reference to mention it. 

Otherwise you will get people bitching at you and it will take forever to reverse their opinions that you aren't a retard noob.  And nobody wants that.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 10 Dec 2008, 05:27
That is true and was simply me being sloppy. I'm sorry. (I'm a mod on other forums and get anoyed with just the same things usually.)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 10 Dec 2008, 08:56
Yeah, it's no big deal or anything. It's just always a bit of a worry, particularly with the video game sub threads; people from places like the PA forums are likely used to a much faster paced board than this one. As long as quote tunnels are avoided, it's all good.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 10 Dec 2008, 13:26
Ony could be soloed by Rogues at 70, I believe.  Specific gear combinations could get you to greater than 100% physical avoidance, and I'd assume Cloak of Shadows handled Deep Breath.
You can no longer get 100% phys dodge methinks.

2 days 3 hours till onyxia resets :/
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 10 Dec 2008, 14:18
If I want to just cast spells on everything, I'll cut out the bullshit and roll Mage or Warlock. I picked Druid for the self sufficiency. Boomkims aren't nearly as self sufficient as Ferals.

I know this was on the last page, but if I die doing PvE, then I am doing something majorly wrong, even if I'm taking on elites by myself. It takes me about the same amount of time to trap and nuke something to death as it did when I was feral to pounce and scratch. (Bear form always seemed/seems increddibly slow to me, so I only used it for tanking.) Also, you're an almost mage in plate armor. And someone mentioned not getting as much aggro due to all the DoTs, which is true, but whoever said that you'll be towards the bottom is wrong. You should be towards the middle or up. If you're not, your gear is crap or you're not using your cooldowns enough. (I'm usually #2 in 5 mans and 4-6 in 10 mans, depending on what other DPSers there are.) You'll probably never out do a rogue or a mage, but you can be up there and you won't be the first one to die either.

But it's true, Feral is the fastest and easiest way to level, but it's not as hard to be Balance as it used to be, since it's easier to find gear for it now.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: masquerade on 10 Dec 2008, 15:50

I know this was on the last page, but if I die doing PvE, then I am doing something majorly wrong, even if I'm taking on elites by myself. It takes me about the same amount of time to trap and nuke something to death as it did when I was feral to pounce and scratch. (Bear form always seemed/seems increddibly slow to me, so I only used it for tanking.) Also, you're an almost mage in plate armor. And someone mentioned not getting as much aggro due to all the DoTs, which is true, but whoever said that you'll be towards the bottom is wrong. You should be towards the middle or up. If you're not, your gear is crap or you're not using your cooldowns enough. (I'm usually #2 in 5 mans and 4-6 in 10 mans, depending on what other DPSers there are.) You'll probably never out do a rogue or a mage, but you can be up there and you won't be the first one to die either.

But it's true, Feral is the fastest and easiest way to level, but it's not as hard to be Balance as it used to be, since it's easier to find gear for it now.

<3 <3
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 10 Dec 2008, 16:44
You get plate as a druid?  What?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 10 Dec 2008, 16:50
Moonkin get the same 300%+ armor bonus Dire bears get, so both are roughly equivalent to plate and can go much, much higher (Warriors get by OK and tank as well as ferals thanks to the magic of Parry & Shield Block, not higher armor). Ferals typically have the highest armor in the game, but that's mostly just due to itemization and the Thick Hide talent. Since blizzard has decided to stop putting in so many items with boosted armor, Feral and Moonkin forms should be closer together in armor than ever before. Really, the big reasons ferals are usually given the edge in self-sufficiency is due to Improved Leader of the Pack and the fact that they don't need to burn mana or halt their mana regeneration to DPS; the only times a feral really needs mana is in emergencies. Moonkins, on the other hand, are still tethered to their mana pool.  At 60+ it's not a big issue since a properly geared moonkin will have much, much better casting stats and can do more with less anyway, but it can be a problem when you're still just leveling thanks the lack of balance gear in pre-BC content. On the upside, I'd much rather bet on a moonkin than a feral druid when it comes to stopping dps and dropping emergency heals.

I realize I keep throwing up walls of text, but I can't help it. I just love warcraft.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: masquerade on 10 Dec 2008, 18:00
And you obviously love moonkin, which is why I have decided that I love you. There, I said it.

Anyway, you're right about the emergency heals. I can shift to humanoid to cast a quick Regrowth or Rejuvenation and be back to Wrathing pretty damn quickly. It's why I keep heal spells up on the action bar above my regular spells (I don't use mods) so that I have quick access to them.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 11 Dec 2008, 00:41
My dwarf can honestly say his best friend is a tree.

Me (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Hellscream&n=Melville) and My tree (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Hellscream&n=Likme)

We do everything together apart from levelling.

And whoever said boomkins are less DPS than rogues and mages, mages and locks maybe but as a tank in def stance 1h and shield 17k armour 15khp I out DPS'ed DK's, Rogues, Hunters all higher levels than me in much better purplz gear. I am not saying I am awesome, just rogues and hunters in my experience suck for DPS. I was not trying to DPS, I was keeping aggro and making sure SS/TC/SW were hitting as much and as often as possible.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 11 Dec 2008, 01:43
Crapy rogue I would say. Rogues own the long fights sins they never go oom. Mages own the short fights due to high burst damge. But apperently boomkin can do silly much damage in long fights with 3.0.


Edit: corrected spelling sins I don't want to start a fight over nothing.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 11 Dec 2008, 05:50
Crapy rouge I would say. Rogues own the long fights sins they never go oom. Mages own the short fights due to high burst damge. But apperently boomkin can do silly much damage in long fights with 3.0.
Yes boomkins do hueg dmg in long fights since 3.0.X

(lol rouge)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: masquerade on 11 Dec 2008, 07:54
Btw, rogue is not a misstake.

Perhaps not, but you originally spelled it "rouge." Learn to read and spell, then defend yourself.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 11 Dec 2008, 07:58
So is hostility your default reaction when you don't get a joke?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 11 Dec 2008, 11:21
I decided to main a rogue again on the 100% new characters server, Grizzly Hills. It's tough sledding, relatively speaking. The sheer lack of utility and self-healing stings, since any combination of tanking ability and healing is pretty OP vs. brain dead mobs. I mean, really, even just a hunter's ability to heal their pet for a classic tank 'n' spank makes elites much easier than with my rogue. Sometimes I wish pvp didn't exist so rogues could get some utility buffs such as ways to remove those annoying mob diseases that inflict dots which last upward of a minute or two. Unfortunately, rogues are so good at what they do that it's hard to give them even mild new toys & luxuries without making them stupidly good at one on one pvp. I'm sure I'll feel better once I have the good old Cloak o' Skill, but until then I have a feeling I'll be missing the luxuries I'm accustomed to when playing a druid.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 11 Dec 2008, 11:46
I made a drood! Tauren on boulderfist.

(lol, misstake)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: masquerade on 11 Dec 2008, 11:48
Shoulda made a n'elf on Azuremyst or Shandris. XD
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 11 Dec 2008, 11:52
Making a druid is never a mistake. They just kind of suck for 10 levels, that's all. They're essentially a weak base class that makes up for it by having ridiculously powerful talents.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 11 Dec 2008, 12:07
My Rogue finally hit 70! (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bleeding+Hollow&n=Nótt) I'd obviously be much more happy if this was a year or even a couple months ago, but oh well.
(Again, change the %F3 in my name to ó (alt-162))

I'm loving Northrend to pieces so far, but this may or may not be due to me having a huge boner for Norse mythology (Nótt is actually the name of the Norse personification of night). The second I stepped off the zeppelin into Warsong Hold I was so unbelievably giddy.

Re: Cloak of Skill
I've had it for a couple levels now, but I don't find myself using it very often. This is mostly because I often forget that I even have it. I'm so accustomed to the way I play, I find it hard to fit a new ability into the mix. I came across the same problem when Disarm was introduced in the pre-Wrath patch.

Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 11 Dec 2008, 13:11
I do not understand that assessment at all, Alex.

Druid was a cake walk for one through ten for me. It takes less than a few hours to get to ten and while it was a pain relying primarily on spellcasting for those ten without my bear form, but it really wasn't all that painful. Really, the first ten levels are the most painful on pretty much any class in any given MMO.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 11 Dec 2008, 15:11
It's all relative; wow is not a hard game, particularly by the standards of earlier MMOs. Still, I created a new druid to double check things since I figured that times have changed since I started out my first druid, particularly since they eliminated downranking and changed spell costs from set amounts to base mana costs across the board. Turned out I was right. You see, back in the day when I started my druid, rank 1 Wrath did about half the damage of a Fireball for two thirds of the mana cost, which is kind of a problem since druids start out with the smallest mana pool of any caster and you were likely to run dry rather quickly if you chain nuked things. In short, druids were pure casters and they were kind of bad at it. Now rank 1 Wrath does more damage than I remember and it apparently costs six fucking mana now.


Six!


Holy crap. I swear to god if any new druid says that the first 10 levels are annoying I will stab them in the eye with my pen.


[EDIT]
The above statement should not be taken as a shot at newbies. I love newbies and think the petulant whining by veteran players who are bitchy just because they once had to wait 'till 40 to buy their mounts is just so much noise. Overall, I think the change is really clever, particularly since it looks like druid spells are actually rather expensive after enough levels, but by then people have the talents to make up for that. Crap like this is why I think Blizzard is smarter than many whiners give them credit for.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 11 Dec 2008, 15:47
To be entirely fair, as a newbie, I will echo the sentiment that anyone who thinks the first ten levels of Druid are hard should probably be stabbed in the eyes. It's probably only gotten even easier since the Echoes of Doom patch, which was a month or two after I joined.

I started up back in early to mid August and it was still fucking cake to blow through the first thirty or so levels. Now that the level cap is up even further, it's probably been even further streamlined.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 11 Dec 2008, 15:56
Yeah, hard isn't really the right word for solo WoW play. The game is not Final Fantasy online; you don't ever need buffs and a little luck to solo a same level bunny rabbit (although, I would recommend finding a group in any case). Like I said, I applaud the changes that were apparently made; the game wasn't hard as a druid before, but it was a bit annoying thanks to the craptacular mana pool druids (particularly taurens) started with. Having to drink or melee every couple of mobs as an essentially pure caster gets kind of annoying and really shouldn't be all that necessary at low level play.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 11 Dec 2008, 20:29
ctrl+alt+o=ó  :-D

And I am levelling with my belf/undead buddies so... I might get some sweet bloos but I will need to hearth to TB to get my new forms and stuff :/

Is not all bad, I got friends accounts linked so we can summon each other, YEAH!

As for wrath rank 1 it started as 6, then 9, now 12.

I don't geddit.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 11 Dec 2008, 20:39
Man, you are going to be so fucking devastated when your link ends. I remember the first time I PMed my brother telling him to summon me and remembered he can't anymore. You kind of start to take it for granted after three whole months.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 11 Dec 2008, 21:11
ctrl+alt+o=ó  :-D

And I am levelling with my belf/undead buddies so... I might get some sweet bloos but I will need to hearth to TB to get my new forms and stuff :/

Is not all bad, I got friends accounts linked so we can summon each other, YEAH!

As for wrath rank 1 it started as 6, then 9, now 12.

I don't geddit.

It's weird, but all mana costs are now calculated as a percentage of your base mana total. Each class has a base amount of mana per level, and spells cost a certain percentage of that number. You can see how much your base mana increases with each level when it says how many hps and mana you've gained- note how the amount is inconsistent with any intelligence gained-- it's like that for a reason I'll explain shortly. So if your base mana is a 100, a 10% mana cost spell will cost 10 mana, etc. Here's the important part- that base mana total does not include your attributes, so intelligence gear is still very useful. It's really quite a nifty trick; as it stands now, a low level mage and a low level druid can both cast enough nukes to get by just fine, but since druids gain base mana at a rate that outpaces their natural intelligence growth, they'll soon find their mana pool pretty inadequate if they don't start poking around for intelligence gear. Meanwhile the mage will begin to more fully enjoy the benefits of their high natural intelligence score. Hell, druids actually end up with a higher base mana score than mages in the long run-- but the way things work, that actually hurts more than it helps! Basically, it's all a nifty way of annihilating downranking AND letting blizzard each class's mana cost progression in one fell swoop. Now that I have really stopped to look at it, I must say that it's really quite clever.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: cheesepie on 11 Dec 2008, 23:33
Every class is pretty much equivalent for the first 10 levels. It shouldn't take you longer than 2-4 hours to get to lvl 10 unless you're just starting out or take pride in killing critters such as cats and rabbits =P
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 12 Dec 2008, 00:50
Just because something is possible with all classes doesn't mean some don't perform a bit better than others at it. I mean, really, some classes just have more of their top mob grinding skills at low levels than others do. Warlocks for example have Immolate, Life Tap, Corruption, Summon Imp, Shadow Bolt, and Curse of Agony by level 8 and by level 14 they add in Drain Life, which turns grinding down time into a virtual non-issue for them. Meanwhile Hunters have no pet prior to ten and used to have that damned dead zone eating up an extra autoshot. None of the classes are bad enough at low levels to make you think "Wow, this class sucks," before giving up, but you could easily be forgiven for thinking "Man, class X just doesn't seem to have a lot going for it compared to class Y." Granted, this is less true now than ever before thanks to all of the tweaks Blizzard has made since release, but I think it's a bit myopic to act like there isn't some meaningful differences sprinkled around at various points.



[Edit]

Sometimes people in WoW scare me. I have a few bank alts specialized in various types of items for the sake of organization. One of which is a female human level 10 warrior named Bankette. For whatever reason, she gets more guild invites than the rest of my characters combined. They always seem vaguely surprised when I decline saying it's just a bank alt.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 13 Dec 2008, 21:25
I'm about to go to bed, but I thought I'd share what I have done with my evening:

See, my brother came by and he had his laptop. We got the idea in our head to try something with his laptop and my projector:

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v289/0bsessions/Random%20Forum%20Junk/WoW%20Images/PC140005.jpg)

OH MY FUCKING GOD, IT IS A GIANT BEAR!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jace on 14 Dec 2008, 01:40
Woo, resubscribed and installing right now.

I guess I'm gonna reroll on the aussie servers so I can play with people since I'm up all night which is their afternoons.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 15 Dec 2008, 22:21
ctrl+alt+o=ó  :-D

And I am levelling with my belf/undead buddies so... I might get some sweet bloos but I will need to hearth to TB to get my new forms and stuff :/

Is not all bad, I got friends accounts linked so we can summon each other, YEAH!

As for wrath rank 1 it started as 6, then 9, now 12.

I don't geddit.

It's weird, but all mana costs are now calculated as a percentage of your base mana total. Each class has a base amount of mana per level, and spells cost a certain percentage of that number. You can see how much your base mana increases with each level when it says how many hps and mana you've gained- note how the amount is inconsistent with any intelligence gained-- it's like that for a reason I'll explain shortly. So if your base mana is a 100, a 10% mana cost spell will cost 10 mana, etc. Here's the important part- that base mana total does not include your attributes, so intelligence gear is still very useful. It's really quite a nifty trick; as it stands now, a low level mage and a low level druid can both cast enough nukes to get by just fine, but since druids gain base mana at a rate that outpaces their natural intelligence growth, they'll soon find their mana pool pretty inadequate if they don't start poking around for intelligence gear. Meanwhile the mage will begin to more fully enjoy the benefits of their high natural intelligence score. Hell, druids actually end up with a higher base mana score than mages in the long run-- but the way things work, that actually hurts more than it helps! Basically, it's all a nifty way of annihilating downranking AND letting blizzard each class's mana cost progression in one fell swoop. Now that I have really stopped to look at it, I must say that it's really quite clever.

Actually, I'm pretty sure the stats you gain on level up don't affect your scores.  They didn't use to, anyway.  Did they change it with WotLK?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 16 Dec 2008, 04:36
3.0.1 changed everything...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Gemmwah on 16 Dec 2008, 08:02
I'm tempted to change my Shaman's (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Twilight%27s+Hammer&n=Lyri) spec to Resto, because all I seem to be doing is healing. Even with the upcoming changes to the elemental spec, I still don't think I will have enough survivability or do enough damage. I seem to do alright in dungeons and raids, but in PvP I am the most useless thing ever, it sucks because I love playing Shaman.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 16 Dec 2008, 09:15
The way I see it, if you can tank you should, if you can heal you should. Pure DPS classes are common enough so if you are a warrior people assume you are a tank, but if you roll a tank or healer you will almost always be needed in a group.

Needless to say my mains are a prot warrior and restro drood.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Gemmwah on 16 Dec 2008, 10:08
Yeah but healing is boring. I rolled a Shaman because I liked the idea of being a support class, dps and off-healing, but all I seem to be doing is main healing and it bores me. And when things go sour, it's always my fault. And I can't be bothered to level another toon all the way up, the first 30 levels are deathly boring.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: supersheep on 16 Dec 2008, 11:05
So this is me. (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Crushridge&n=Makhno)

Been playing maybe a month or so, entirely solo with the odd run-through from the high-level friend who dragged me into this (also why I'm playing on US servers, lag's not so bad). My theorycraft is not so good, cos I'm lazy, but it's not like I'm going to be playing it other than for kicks.
I've also spent the past day or so farming eggs in Eversong, as they seem to be rather popular at the minute.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 16 Dec 2008, 11:46
Wandeag (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Boulderfist&n=Wandeag)

We don't quest, we just run instances with triple XP linked accounts so we got good gear and level fast, not uncommon for 2 dings each per run.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 16 Dec 2008, 12:34
I know you just said you're not into theorycrafting much, but if you're going to use Sinister Strike as your primary attack, I'd advise against using daggers, although the one you have now is so much better than quest reward replacements that it's not a big deal for now (heck, it's better than my sword). To make a long story short, a sword/mace will do more damage on a Sinister Strike than a dagger will even if the DPS and weapon speeds are otherwise identical. It's due to the way attack power is calculated and while it sounds counterintuitive, it beats the hell out of the old way of calculating things. On the bright side, weapon speed doesn't matter quite as much as it used to since the buffs to poisons means that faster weapons are a lot more competitive than they used to be; faster weapons mean more poison procs, and good lord, do poisons kick ass now. Still, I'd suggest selecting weapons based on DPS, weapon type, stats and then speed while leveling.



Anyway, here's the rogue I recently rolled on the Grizzly Hills server (which is actually a "fresh" server; it's roughly a month old now and doesn't allowe transfers.) Intruder (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Grizzly+Hills&n=Intruder)

Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 16 Dec 2008, 14:02
Mace rogues went from stunlock beasts to fucking dire.
Swords for potential instagibbage with sword specialisation.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 16 Dec 2008, 14:19
I skipped weapon specializations because I'm almost exclusively limiting myself to self-crafted items and quest rewards while reinvesting all my cash into AH speculation. I love sword spec as much as the next guy, but it wouldn't have done me much good considering I've spent as much time with a mace 'n' dagger combo as I have with a sword. My current build will net me 11% more avoidance over a raw DPS build, which is pretty damn nice for solo work; it's not like I'm hurting for damage thanks to poisons and Nightscape armor anyway. Once I hit 80 I'll likely change my ways, but for now, I'm happy with my almost shockingly durable rogue.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 16 Dec 2008, 23:46
Myself I'm leveling my (second) druid on a RPG server. Sadly theres hardly anyone actually doing any RPG. Leveling as feral due to how silly easy it is. You can handle allmost every situation with a good pounce, some bleed effects and than just going in to bear. But I can admin that after (only) having 3 70s I'm a bit bored with the bit between lvl 20 and 60. Don't think that it's going to be that much more fun in outlands either. But when I become 60 or so I think I will respec to resto. I have a shadow priest, boomkin and a tankadin (way fun to play). So would be fun to test the last part of the game as well. Kharni (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=The%20Venture%20Co&n=Kharni)

I think you should stick with elemental if you like it, Gemmwah. Personally I love having an elemental shammy with me. They have a very unic ability to addept after the situation and can boost any party in various ways. They are also really scary in PvP. Think you will have it easier when you hit 80 sins a lot of people respec to healing when they get max level. That's my experience anyway.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 17 Dec 2008, 00:11
Yeah, my boyfriend's alt (we are leveling alts together before our account link runs out) is an ele shammy and he loves it. He's doing a heap of damage and has quiet a good survivability rate, even better now that he can wear mail armor.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 17 Dec 2008, 03:43
Yeah but healing is boring. I rolled a Shaman because I liked the idea of being a support class, dps and off-healing, but all I seem to be doing is main healing and it bores me. And when things go sour, it's always my fault. And I can't be bothered to level another toon all the way up, the first 30 levels are deathly boring.

You won't be doing much of anything but the role you're specced for in coordinated instance/raid groups.  If you're Resto, you'll be healing.  If you're Ele or Enh, you'll be killing.  You might toss the occasional heal (or nuke), but every time you do, that means your overall DPS (or HPS) just took a hit.  Unless the group's gonna wipe, it's better to just keep killing.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 17 Dec 2008, 09:23
I am gonna dump links to my stuff now. Boulderfist, Wandeag-restro drood (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Boulderfist&n=Wandeag), Díck-Affliction Lock (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Boulderfist&n=D%C3%ADck), Hellscream,
Melville-Prot Warrior (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Hellscream&n=Melville), clóckwórk-Frost mage (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Hellscream&n=Cl%C3%B3ckw%C3%B3rk), Toebag-Blood/unholy DK (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Hellscream&n=Toebag), Dunemaul, omgwtfbbq-BM Huntard (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Dunemaul&n=Omgwtfbbq), Jamés-Halfassed Twink rogue (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Dunemaul&n=Jam%C3%A9s)

I have more but those are really the only ones that matter, another DK or rogue or pally here and there is all.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 17 Dec 2008, 12:51
"Set Sail for Fail" is a superb guild name.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 17 Dec 2008, 20:44
Got a chance to fiddle with my pally last night, and godDAMN is Infusion of Light fun.  Instant Flash of Light is incredible.

New judgement mechanics rock, and Seal of Corruption is so much better than SoR that it's not even funny.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 17 Dec 2008, 21:20
Re: Guild names.

My least favorite guild/player names are those related to ganking/griefing other players despite the fact they're on a PvE server. Set Sail For Fail made me happy for a moment though, which is more than most attempts at cleverness ever manage.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 17 Dec 2008, 23:05
I hate guild names based on memes... like Roflciers of the Lawl, crap like that.

I think my favorites were Razorfen Downs Syndrome (which got reported and changed to Razorfen Downsized), Keepers of the Groove (a play on the War3 hero, Keeper of the Grove), and The Corporation, which wasn't funny in and of itself, but they changed DKP to "Shares" and other corporation lingo.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 17 Dec 2008, 23:15
Set Sail For Fail works for me only due to the rhyming, not the meme bit. Personally, I think coming up with a guild name should be treated like writing ass shaking music. The name should be punchy and capable of worming itself into your brain no matter how much you hate it. Whereas that Roflcers name is just drek all around.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 17 Dec 2008, 23:41
Well, it did fulfill the purpose of inspiring me to camp them out of the zone every time I encountered them, which isn't a bad goal for a PvP server.

Not that I wouldn't have done that anyway, them being Alliance scum and all.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 18 Dec 2008, 05:05
My mates jamie and tyko made the guild I think, other awesome guilds I have seen include "Wipe scene investigation" and "CSI DUROTAR" both on boulderfist, then on SWC "The Da Vinci Kodo" too bad they are alliance. "The cheese n cracker co" is a raiding guild my main is in, pretty good.

I am not a great fan of all the guild names with "bretheren" or "brothers" or "warriors" or "darkness" or "souls" but there are alot on SWC, heck I have a DK in one that my warrior was in called "Legend Killers" which is kinda lame.

A good funny guild name makes all the difference.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 Dec 2008, 08:55
Lamest guild name I've been involved with was Noob Slayers. Truly a shit terrible name. But a friend of mine irl got to know a bunch of guys in the guild, joined up and insiisted they were actually a really good, smart guild. Turned out to be true, and they spent more time working on entering raid progression than living up to their name, so our interests dovetailed nicely and after a week of consideration, I joined up. It turned out to be a good match and they were the guys I first cleared MC with.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 20 Dec 2008, 19:02
Holy fuck I was just MT for a Kara PUG, it took 8 beers not counting the 4 beforehand.

Raid leader and the 2 healers were fucking ace, all but 1 DK was a prick and the hunters were pretty cool.

Everyone else SUCKED. I never got any purplz.

HC's with raid leader now, 80 boomkin yay!

Pics later.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: J-cob9000 on 20 Dec 2008, 19:29
I am currently downloading the game client and expansions. I'm going to join a private server because free is better than anything else.
Uh. Yeah. Not much else to say until I have the game. Any preference on race/class, anyone?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 20 Dec 2008, 19:56
I love being a warrior tank and I love to party with boomkins and treepeople.

So roll drood.

Ideal group would be 3 boomkins, a restro drood and me.

And pvt servers are laggy and suck overall. That and most people don't give a shit about anything since it is so easy to get, then there are all the bugs and stuff.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 20 Dec 2008, 20:34
They're kind of like WoW with an extra dose of suck.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 20 Dec 2008, 21:14
Not even that much like WoW, most have a custom area with a bunch of epix venders and you will get ganked all the time by someone who has donated money for a 700DPS weapon and has 100k armour... that's the healers.

A wise man (Well, my mate Phil) once said to me
"WoW is like a really nice hooker who you spent a night with and you think, yeah she was fun but I don't really need her any more so you go without but then a month or two down the line you get a little craving, so you look her up and find out she has a new hairstyle, she has only gotten hotter, had a bewb job, spent a few weekends at the gym, learned a few new tricks so you get her over and it becomes a regular thing" or something.

Pvt servers would be like a crackwhore who is also your grandmother.

Enjoy your gross incest gaming.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: J-cob9000 on 21 Dec 2008, 17:10
The one I'm using has three realms. The realm I'm on just has higher rates. The rates aren't too high though. It's fair. The other realm is the fun realm with all the PvP.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Dec 2008, 19:22
My current server is hilarious since it is 2 months old and wasn't created expressly for a transfer migration; this leads to a perfect storm of newbies and genuine idiots who weren't really missing out on anything by leaving their old characters behind. I rolled a hunter alt recently and was powered through Deadmines by a level 47 Hunter along with a few other players. I lost a need roll on the Impaling Harpoon (http://www.wowwiki.com/Impaling_Harpoon) to a paladin and was promptly scolded by the hunter for rolling on it in the first place (and no, I hadn't won anything prior to this). Apparently his rationale is that dual wielding is across the board better anyway, which is kind of silly since hunters really just treat melee weapons like stat sticks most of the time. Of course, this guy was also wielding a Phantom Blade (http://www.wowwiki.com/Phantom_Blade) he crafted himself on a server in which Breaths of Wind cost a small fortune, so I'm going to go out on a limb and say he has no idea what the hell he's talking about. I should mention that I'm not in any way upset, since it was just a Deadmines run and the story really just adds to WoW's grand tradition of huntard lore.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 21 Dec 2008, 19:44
Because pally's need agi...

Oh wait-

Also kara pics, 2nd on dps as MT, got beaten by a 80 boomkin who was AWESOME.

(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3094/3127254482_c8590a81fd_b.jpg)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 21 Dec 2008, 21:15
I lost http://www.wowhead.com/?item=28502 to a fucking DK (Deathjord, you can see him there above the healers on the Damage meter) and they would be far superior to my green daleran bracers of suck.

Block value, for a DK honestly.

Raid leader said it should go to me as MT, but he kicked up a fuss about how he won the roll so he should get them. Before he proceeded to roll for everything inc BoP epix cloth drops and a drood relic/idol/trinket I forget.

It was on the first boss too, later on we found out he sucks at DPS, needed 3rd most healing and was a dick.

Moral of the story is fun pug's are not fun for loot. I know all the gear is old hat and will soon be replaced by http://www.wowhead.com/?item=41116 but still, what a dick.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Dec 2008, 22:08
I think my all time low point was when a couple of my guildmates were helping me farm BRD for the Hand Of Justice (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=11815#comments), which was easily one of the premier rogue trinkets in the game since extra attack procs scale so insanely well as the rest of your gear improves. We took some random Holy specd paladin along because he had been mewling about needing to finish a quest in there all day, but when the damn HoJ dropped he rolled on it and won despite knowing that was the only reason we went. My guildmate who was leading the group immediately kicked him and was apologetic for days afterwards for not setting it to master loot in the first place.

And yeah, I feel for you Jens, luckily my own guild leader never did anything like that. Hell, one time, my guild leader's roommate (who played a hunter) raised a stink over not getting equal bidding rights to the first Core Hound Tooth that dropped for us despite the willingness of many rogues to respec to Combat Daggers for it if need be. It ended with me getting the dagger and my guild leader saying "Jason, I swear to god I will skullfuck you to death if you don't quit whining about this" over Ventrillo. Probably not the best way to handle things, but seriously, the dude was already first in line for the Ancient Leaf as it was.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 21 Dec 2008, 23:38
Quote
I lost http://www.wowhead.com/?item=28502 to a fucking DK (Deathjord, you can see him there above the healers on the Damage meter) and they would be far superior to my green daleran bracers of suck.
I LoLed IRL when I read that. That DK was stupid.
The loot part have allways been easy when playing with friends. We had a strict "mains before alts", "most need most get" and "main spec before off spec" policys. Worked really nice.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 22 Dec 2008, 20:38
Hey guys you ever heard of this skill called "Enraged regeneration"? Me neither, now my downtime is similar to that of a deathknight while questing.

This is good news for the next 3 levels.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 22 Dec 2008, 22:21
Mining is the worst thing. I hate those god forsaken stretches like the one between tin and iron. You know, when all the common nodes are green to you and the only times you're even remotely likely to get a skill up is when you stumble upon the odd silver vein. It makes me want to burn the whole world down.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 22 Dec 2008, 23:12
I am just pissed I gotta mine a bunch until 450, then I can smelt titanium and titansteel.
And BS can GTFO, I am only like 432 and don't get any new recipies until 440 then they start costing epix worth of mats because they are epix...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 23 Dec 2008, 02:22
Why are you running KZ at 80? :/
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 23 Dec 2008, 10:25
I do so love skinning. May not be as lucrative as mining, but I'm rarely ever wanting for mats.

My current goal is the "The Explorer" title. All I've got left is Northrend.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 23 Dec 2008, 15:03
I was 74, now I am 76 and I ran it for shits and giggles. Doing it again tomorrow... Me tanking, 80 restro drood, 80 boomkin, 80 rogue and a 71 hunter.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 23 Dec 2008, 16:46
I am downloading WotLK now! Yaaaay!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: mishy on 24 Dec 2008, 08:10
i feel compelled to make a post here, even though i have nothing to add to the current conversations.
actually, my interest in the game is waning. in september, my account was inactive for nearly a month.
trying to level my disc priest (76 currently) and boomkin (78) and just... not interested. there's so much more in the game now, but i hardly play.
what's wrong with me??!?!?!1
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 24 Dec 2008, 14:09
While updating my auctions at lunch on the ol' laptop, I ran into a guy on trade chat who insists that he's still a super casual player becaue he only spends 5 or 6 hours a day on Warcraft.

WTB: Perspective!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 24 Dec 2008, 21:04
See, I used to manage raiding on around 2-3 hours a day most of the week. and maybe 5 or 6 hours a day on the weekend when we'd bang out our raids.* And we were 5 on my server for progression (third on Alliance) and we were actually the first to down Vael. I guess I just don't understand how I used to be hardcore when people were regularly lapping me on logged in time.


Also, I'm not really an easy guy to offend or annoy. But there's a dude on my server who's spamming trade in all caps with the message "NEED GOLD PLZ, FOR CANCER!!," and if I could have one wish right now, it'd be the ability to teleport into his room and Falcon Punch him right in the gonads.


*I played quite a bit more that while initially leveling, but tapered down a lot after I hit around 53 or so.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 25 Dec 2008, 00:34
In other news, Warrior/Holy Pally is still an incredibly fun 2's comp and is actually fairly effective against the Warrior/Druid DK/Retardin FotM combo.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 25 Dec 2008, 00:39
Restro drood and Prot tank is slow but never fails in PvE.

I never seem to enjoy or find it worthwhile to party with a pally, but as I said before I fucking love partying with any drood.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: masquerade on 25 Dec 2008, 00:51
Restro drood and Prot tank is slow but never fails in PvE.

I never seem to enjoy or find it worthwhile to party with a pally, but as I said before I fucking love partying with any drood.

Because we're fucking awesome.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 25 Dec 2008, 01:27
Yes, but PvE is hardly a challenge, especially if you've done it more than once.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 25 Dec 2008, 01:48
I officialy love rogues again, although it was touch and go at first. On the one hand, there's some mobs that I could easily spank as a feral druid that are a lot riskier to tangle with as a rogue; it really comes down to the simple fact that unlike players, mobs are quite happy to regenerate all their health the second you exit combat via vanish; rogues don't have an emergency button so much as they have a reset button. It's a great trick, and a wonderful aggro dump in group situations, but for solo work it's not really going to be winning you any battles. Evasion and adrenaline rush are nice, but when it comes to laying the smackdown on the nastier types of elites, they're just not as reliable as the ridiculous kitty->bear->Frenzied Regen->Bash+Heal-> Bear=Victory formula. On the other hand, my rogue's a whirling dervish of pointy edged doom against non-elites; the speed is just ridiculous. Also, I'm slightly bitter that my favorite thing about playing a rogue again is all the god damned bug fixes, not interesting new gameplay mechanics. Ah well, other than that, it's been fun. The fragility vs. heavy hitting mobs issue will also go away for the most part once I'm actually geared worth a damn.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 25 Dec 2008, 09:27
Last night I reactivated my account and I knew it had been a while, but I never expected to get lost in freaking Stormwind. I mean, come on, that's my favorite Alliance city and I got lost. I felt silly. And then I found the docks and was all "holy crap" and jumped the boat to Northrend. Whee! I also made a DK out of curiosity, but I don't have a definite opinion on it yet.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 25 Dec 2008, 13:12
WTB 3.0.8

Gonna try to get to 80 before 2009.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: mishy on 25 Dec 2008, 13:29
WTB 3.0.8

Gonna try to get to 80 before 2009.

ditto.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 25 Dec 2008, 22:33
WTB 3.0.8

Gonna try to get to 80 before 2009.

I've been buying sets of Ornate Saronite since they're cheap right now, because the stat distribution is horrible (no INT, and STR on the belt?  What the fuck were they smoking, and where can I get some?), but it'll sell pretty good with the 308 changes.

I still want 308 for the various nerfs and changes, but I'm okay with it being another couple of weeks :P
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: messeduplilkid on 25 Dec 2008, 22:46
If anyone wants or is Rolled on Laughing Skull (us) Horde faction let me know.

Taioki, level 80 Restoration shaman.

I used to spec back and forth between Enhancement for pvp and Restoration in pve. But I wanted to really contend in this season of pvp and try to hit 1900. I hit somewhere in the 1800's in season 3.

I haven't had a good latency since I left my college apartment to come home for the holiday. I sure hope I earned 350 arena points this week so I can get my second piece of savage gear.

I also just finished heroic Naxx.

How far is everyone else when it comes to progession in pve and pvp?


Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 26 Dec 2008, 01:41
I'd strongly suggest you use your APs for Hateful gear and just use the crafted PvP set to tide you over until then.  The leap from, say, Ornate Saronite to Hateful Gladiator is much greater than the hop from Ornate Saronite to Savage Gladiator.  If you're confident in your abilities, then I'd say just save up for Deadly, but it may be difficult to compete in blues in the first season of the new expansion, and like crafted-Savage, the Hateful-Deadly hop isn't too big of a gulf, either.  You'll want to enchant both sets, but I'd suggest saving the high-dollar enchants for epic gear and go for the mid-range enchants on the rares - get +50 SP to the weapon instead of the much pricier +63, for example.  TBC enchants, in particular, are very cost-effective now with the massive price drop in primals.

Granted, Ornate Saronite fairly sucks right now (I'm using a mix of PvE and Ornate Saronite since OS has nowhere near enough INT on it till 308), and other crafted sets might suck, too.  But you really do need the high HP and Resilience those sets will give you, especially if you're gonna PvP as something as squishy as an Enhancement Shaman.  I do hope you're smart enough to use a shield.

In other news, Holy Pallies work ridiculously well with DKs.  A friend and I took over the Alliance flagroom for about 18 minutes - 2 minutes shy of reaching the +100% damage debuff.  At one point, it was 2v8 and we killed them all.  Way too much fun.

Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 26 Dec 2008, 02:03
I've been buying sets of Ornate Saronite since they're cheap right now, because they suck and people need to grind past them to get to decent 440 stuff and all the other saronite stuff is DPS warrior stuff with a little bit of sucky tanking gear.

Fix'd.

A little pissy about having thousands of G worth of armour nobody will ever use ever on my second bank only lv1 priest with a full bank of netherweave bags and inv full of crafted shitty blues and 30-80 green and blue BoE drops?

NEVAR.

Never going to get epic flying or cold flying.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 26 Dec 2008, 04:53
Hey?  Fuck off, I'm an engineer.  At least you can pawn your worthless shit off to enchanters.  What the hell is anyone gonna do with twenty hand-mounted rocket launchers only I can use?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 26 Dec 2008, 07:38
Engineering is a hugely selfish profession. I didn't realize this until after I made my hunter do it, but you know, who cares. I can make my own guns and bullets and soon I'll be able to make jumper cables. And yes, you can always get your stuff disenchanted and then sell the shards, etc.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: supersheep on 26 Dec 2008, 08:15
It has a number of nice get-out-of-jail-free cards - target dummies, for example, have saved my ass more than a few times, when Vanish has been on cooldown and I'm outta healing potions.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 26 Dec 2008, 09:02
I'm just happy about a couple of things when it comes to professions.

1. Regardless of how good it is relative to other professions, at least leatherworking doesn't suck as bad as it did pre-BC. Drums kick enough kick ass that I could almost forgive anything..

2. I can actually take leatherworking instead of herbalism/alchemy on a rogue without getting gouged on the AH for fadeleaf. Seriously, what the hell was blizzard thinking back in the day? How was it even remotely fair that one of our core class skills required a reagent that could only be gathered with herbalism? It's been a few years now and I'm still kind of bitter about it, particularly since I played on a PvP server back then. It's bad enough that I'm still stuck paying for reagents for the odd dose of thistle tea.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: thegreatbuddha on 28 Dec 2008, 21:38
The Epic Paladin Mount is such a headache. I've spent 400g so far, with another 50-60g to spend, as well as 3 instances. Had I known going in, I would have just spent 600g at the mount vendor.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 28 Dec 2008, 22:22
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b198/andthentherewaslindsey/Mabh.jpg)

There's my main. I am not a fan of the lag that's in Borean Tundra, but then one of my friends told me to wait until I got to Dalaran. Supposedly it's worse than Shattrath, which means I probably won't go there for fear of getting kicked off as soon as I step in the city.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 29 Dec 2008, 06:22
Oh God...Dalaran lag...

I have a solid connection and a nice set of hardware. That said, the second I step into Dalaran, my FPS tends to plummet from about 35 down to 15 while my latency jumps from the standard 115 I usually hit to around 300 or 400.

It'll pass, though. It's basically replacing Shattrath as THE place to hearth for high levels. It's bad sometimes, but it doesn't even touch the lag I've gotten in Orgrimmar on more than one occasion and I can't imagine it being any worse than Shat probably was in the early days. You could easily get to Shatt as soon as you dinged fifty-eight, but you need to be either 74 or bribe a 'lock to get to Dalaran, and even if you do, there's nothing much to do there before that, so you're really only seeing 74-80 players.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 29 Dec 2008, 07:37
Set your HS to lower city for faster load times and more managable framerate.

You still of course need to go topside for portals...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 29 Dec 2008, 18:34
Man, dude. I am running on 200 - 400 latency all the time. Dalaran jumps me up into the 800's to 1000's. It takes a good 10 seconds before my character even appears. It has gotten a lot better though lately. The first time I went there I couldn't even walk around properly.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 29 Dec 2008, 20:44
Who cares dude we get motorcycles

Correction: Anyone gets motorcycles.  Engineers are the only ones that can make them, but they do not require Engineering to use.  Complete bullshit, if you ask me, because no one's gonna pay 15,000 gold for a mount - and that's about how much they cost to make (around 12,000-14,000.)

That said, being an Engineer is still incredibly fun, just not particularly lucrative.  Rifles cost a lot of materials to make; it's cheaper to simply buy the enchanting materials off the AH.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 29 Dec 2008, 21:06
440BS and I can make like, 11 cool things (lv 80 Purplz) and that is it. Of them I will use 4 so unless someone wants me to make them something my skill will be no higher than 444 until new recipies start dropping (I hope this happens)... but then I will just replace it with raid drop purplz and the stuff for tokens :(

Also, I just looked for tanking weps, there are 3 for endgame...
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=37401 http://www.wowhead.com/?item=39344 http://www.wowhead.com/?item=40402
Each one is pretty damn awesome but what should I use until I can do (HC) naxx? Keep using this piece of crap http://www.wowhead.com/?item=44734 ?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 29 Dec 2008, 22:52
450 in a production profession is an accomplishment in and of itself, considering the sheer amount of materials it usually takes to get those last five or ten points.

I dunno about tanking weapons, but I know pretty much any of the Titansteel pieces are worth making, though it seems Brilliant Titansteel has the odd bit about having no stats...

Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 29 Dec 2008, 23:42
Sorry for anyone not into melee, but tanking weps have def/dodge/block/stam/str and a speed of 1.50 or 1.60 so you hit faster to get better rage.

It pains me to see tanks with a 2.50 1h because yeah you will rarely be hitting dry melee swings and rage builds fast after the initial charge/sunder of battle but on bosses a fast weapon makes the difference of downing an enrage effect boss and wiping on it.

Tanks should NOT be top of DPS or anywhere near it. Speccing that way cuts your survivability and aggro control.

Impale, Improved rend and Incite are the most common mistakes made by tanks who want the e-peen of out damaging a rogue. Heck I am putting 1 point in tac mastery so I can berserk/intercept/hamstring in pvp, or lose less rage if I blam off my def retaliation macro. Improved bloodrage makes people want to misuse it, it should rarely be used in battle and never to start a fight, it is made to keep your rage up and healthy while squishies take a quick MB or you are marking mobs before the next pull. It's a rage cache.

I am happy to be lower than everyone as far as DPS goes, DPS is not my job - just like the healer should not start nuking.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 30 Dec 2008, 02:19
Deep Wounds is better, point for point, than Cruelty for teeps.  It also greatly balances out fast-versus-slow in terms of weapon selection.  Obviously, you need Impale to get it.

Bloodrage is still a solid method of starting a fight, especially if you need a lot of threat immediately.  It's on a 60 second cooldown and should be used just like Divine Plea - early, and often.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 30 Dec 2008, 06:07
Deep wounds IS superb, I used it until 73 and loved it because bleed on crit for blood frenzy without having to dick about with rend, I hate rend.

But for Tanking the only thing I use out of prot for dmg is Armoured to the teeth because with a shield and tank defence of 24k-25k+ you get stupid (Over 400) extra AP for 3 talent points. I would rather have that over 3% crit or a bleed effect.

http://www.wow-europe.com/en/info/basics/talents/warrior/talents.html?tal=050231010000000000000000000000300000000000000000000000000053051225203012521330113321 Is mine, people will hate parts of it and I know that. No build is perfect for everyone but this one fits me, I don't do mega dmg but I tank really quite well (most of the time).

I sound like more of a nazi tank than a panzer :/

Also new toy http://www.wowhead.com/?item=36984
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 30 Dec 2008, 06:21
Correction: Anyone gets motorcycles.  Engineers are the only ones that can make them, but they do not require Engineering to use.  Complete bullshit, if you ask me, because no one's gonna pay 15,000 gold for a mount - and that's about how much they cost to make (around 12,000-14,000.)

That said, being an Engineer is still incredibly fun, just not particularly lucrative.  Rifles cost a lot of materials to make; it's cheaper to simply buy the enchanting materials off the AH.

Eh, I don't think that's a bad price at all for the level people are going to be using those at. The side car can be useful for questing, particularly with someone who's having to divide their attention (There's few bigger pains in the ass than when I set myself to follow on my brother so I can run and grab something to eat only to find he wandered too close to a wall and lost me) and the money's not all that steep. I'm level 72 right now and I'm pulling, on average, about 100-150 gold in any given hour through nothing more than quest rewards and vendoring shit items I find. I'd be pulling even more if I were just AHing my leather instead of using it to grind my leatherworking (And LW items sell surprisingly poorly at AH on my server). I figure a more dedicated player with more experience than myself could probably pull the 15,000 for a bike inside of a week of routine play.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 30 Dec 2008, 13:28
Man, don't hate on Rend. Seriously, I'll fight you. It's very rage efficient and the way they tweaked how it scales with weapon damage means it's one of the few early warrior abilities that's worth a damn.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Josefbugman on 30 Dec 2008, 16:05
As a new guy trying to introduce myself I have a little read of this and can't help thinking "good lord you guys know far more about WoW than I do and I have been playing for 4 years"!

As an attempt to save myself, a brief description of my character. "Josefbugman" (I am not really imaginative when it comes to names) is my level 80 Dwarven hunter, he's mainly BM at the momet but I am thinking of making him markshmanship as I only chose BM to be able to join raids. I enjoy leveling and doing my daily quests, my main goal for this expansion is to try and get to fight Arthas, or at least to help out in the war effort against him (don't say you can't forsee the changing of icecrown into a HUGE preperation/culling the undead camp ala the Isle of Quel'danas)

I am very very uninterested in maximizing my DPS, I play the game to relax but I have the limit of not simply pushing a single macro over and over again. I enjoy doing raiding and am more than willing to help out people leveling. I'm sorry to admit this but I rather enjoy the whole "lore" aspect surrounding Warcraft as I have taken part in it since WCII came out.

Also, I agree, Dalaran is hellish I cannot actually log in because my computer lags out, it has taken me 30 mins to walk from one side of it to the other.

Thanks for your time :-).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 30 Dec 2008, 17:52
If you're just interested in a PvE change of pace, I'd suggest Survival over MM. You'd do less damage than a BM spec, but you'd bring replenishment to the table and wouldn't have to just keep spamming Steady Shot for the rest of your life thanks to Explosive Shot, Lock 'n' Load and maybe even a pinch of trap dancing on relatively stationary mobs like Patchwerk. MM is a neat tree and all, but for raiding the rotation isn't really all that much different from Beast Mastery.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Josefbugman on 31 Dec 2008, 01:18
Dragonmaw EU.

And thanks for the info I may change to survival, sounds a bit more fun than the ones I am used to :-)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 31 Dec 2008, 04:06
I thought marksmanship was where it was at for raiding?
Also, ding motherfuckers - Before the end of the year just like I planned.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 31 Dec 2008, 08:30
For raiding the trees seem pretty even atm. MM will probably pull ahead a bit over BM during the course of an entire raid if they take Barrage for trash pulls, but honestly, I'm not really a fan of taking Barrage for progression content. You'll end up doing more damage over the course of the evening, but when the rough stuff like bosses roll around you'll end up spending more time in AotV since points spent on Barrage are points that would have otherwise been spent in Efficiency. It's nice to scale the heights of the damage meter and all, but at the end of the day, Hunters are there for their reliable single target damage vs. bosses more than for their AOE abilities; any truly vital AOE work is more likely to be assigned to the locks and mages, after all, since they can be really good at it without even really bothering to spec towards it.

Anyway, the big reason I said Survival but not MM isn't due to DPS, which Josef said wasn't the prime consideration anyway. The big thing is that MM just doesn't operate much differently than BM in a raid enviroment. None of the procs are really very reactive (ie, you don't really have to change your rotation at all to take advantage of anything) and Chimera shot doesn't really change your rotation much; it mostly edges out Serpent Sting and does a nice wad of damage. Lock 'n' Load+Explosive Shot is a more demonstrable change to your rotation since LnL can let you spam a couple ES's in a row; I know that doesn't sound like much, but it does keep things a bit more interesting (I know from experience; prior to Combat Potency and Glyph of Sinister Strike, Rogues were basically a set-in-stone optimal rotation class too).

Anyway, I'm a fan of Replenishment, which can easily help make up for the mild loss of DPS you get from going Survival, plus Wyvern sting is a fun tool to have and is basically mandatory since it's needed to take Noxious Stings. Even if you just do 5 mans most of the time, Wyvern Sting can be pretty handy if you're called up on to kite something due to a sudden lack of crowd control.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: mishy on 31 Dec 2008, 09:45
ding! 80 boomkin, yeaaaarghh!
now to get that titansteel guardian made for me...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 01 Jan 2009, 00:11
I will make your mace for you... BUT FIRST! Gather round WoWpeople for I have a story to tell!

Lake Wintersgrasp 1600 hours server time 31 Dec 2007

We were assaulting lake wintersgrasp well when I entered late and with 5 minutes on the clock and 4 HK's no deaths I was having fun smashing tanks open and beating the squishies driving ("Tank" killing a tank, hehe) so the clock drops to 2 mins and the horde are still made of suck so they all fail and we blam down the last wall and run to the big orb thingy then something happens and we win. There are people sticking around, I realise it is for the raid so I pipe up that I am a tank and will happily get beaten on in a group situation, so a 25 man raid group inv's me and my friend laughs and says "Good luck :P" in game. My def is still only like, 407 so I am crittable and say this to raid leader, "NP" he says, "you can OT" when I look at MT a Nelf warrior with a nice epic in each hand, 22khp unbuffed (same as me) and I ask my friend who laughed at me if he thought I could do it over Vent, he says "not a chance, the dude hits for like 4k you will get owned" but I am willing to try so I stick with it. About 15 minutes past 4 server time we fight out way through trash to the last dude, 9.9 million HP and made of massive rocks. Shit. So for those not familiar with 25man HC Wintersgrasp, Archavon the Stone Watcher is the last dude, a 5 minute to enrage DPS fight, my group was MT, OT, Restro shammy, Holy priest and some other warrior for if both me and OT mess up (He kicks away whoever has aggro at that point and the OT needs to come in and tank till MT gets back, simple) the rest of the groups were made up of healers and DPS.

First attempt everything goes fine but at 18% he enrages and we wipe. Okay, not enough DPS but everyone else did fine, was all good and do-able. When I rez I go to run back but my game shit's itself, drops to 4FPS and the ground dissapears, I quickly type that I have to relog, apologise and logout after being told that it was fine to do so. So i close the client, start it up again and log in... Or rather I try to log in but get the message "You have used all your prepaid time for this account" so I panic, open my browser and log on to WoW account management, hurridly enter CC details and notice that my account expired 16:25 paris/server time, the payment is good and I log back in 16:31 and explain what happened to be met with 25 LOL's and a PWND before apologising and getting on with it. We get him down to 8% this time, but then he enrages and MT dies instantly, Taunt is on CD so mocking blow to take aggro, about 5 seconds later everyone is dead. Futile. Raid leader gets pissy, prints DPS and kicks the bottom 3 (Less than 1500DPS) and we get in 1 lock, 1 fury warrior and one other DPS that I cannot remember. I take a look at the lock, full purplz good enough for me, then the warrior with sick bloos and purplz, titansteel destroyer and a 2h bloo rep sword, quick look at his talent build and I am in awe of this dude, awesome enchs on really quite good raiding gear, talents show NO solo survivability at all, totally group dependant and will crit like a beast. I guess an easy 7kdps or some shit so whatever, Archavon the Stone Watcher is going down. Groups get messed about a bit, fight starts. All goes well, 1 minute in we have him at 60%, pulling out all the stops, 2 minutes we have him at 18% being told to hurry up I am thinking no way do we need to rush, this is DONE and we down him before the 3 minute mark. 2 minutes to spare just like the battle for Wintersgrasp...
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3225/3154984967_ce9f9a8461_b.jpg)

Valorous Plagueheart Leggings (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=40422)
Deadly Gladiator's Felweave Handguards (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=42016)
Deadly Gladiator's Felweave Trousers (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=42004)
Deadly Gladiator's Silk Raiment (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=41951)


Group only had the 1 lock, the dude that joined before the final attempt.

Brix were shat.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 01 Jan 2009, 02:13
That lucky son of a bitch...

You get huge, massive bonus points for being a dwarf, because dwarves rule.  Whoever took one of the hideous Northrend wolves for a pet needs to be dragged out and strangled with the hide from his uglyass pet.  He should get himself a crab.  Named Itchy.

I really like that they're allowing folks to get PvP gear by doing PvE content (well, Archavon is MOSTLY PvE, anyway... you could just wait for your team to win and then go do him without ever actually killing shit.)  I just wish they'd do the same for PvP.  Why can't I turn my excess honor and APs into T7 or T7H gear? :(
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 01 Jan 2009, 02:21
Dwarfs make sick tanks, now all they need is a tanking mace and I am set. But yeah, DEF on PvP gear would probs never get done because RES is PvP but still, I do PvP because I don't need to get loads of people or wait for guild to do it, getting devent DEF gear is Damn hard. Just sucks how one of the DPS of that fight the first time (Got kicked) was using a RIDING CROP trinket, pretty sure it doesn't even work after 70 or some shit.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 01 Jan 2009, 03:43
No, you misunderstand.

By killing Archavon, a PvE raid encounter, you get access to Hateful and/or Deadly Gladiator arena sets, without having to spend the honor, APs, or even get the personal ratings to use them (unless that was added in.)

Why can't I establish my dominance in my arena bracket and use my APs to buy Heroic or Valorous pieces for when I want to do PvE?  Are they trying to imply that PvP is easier than PvE?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 01 Jan 2009, 05:25
I was looking at it from a tanks point of view, in that yes to but PvE tank gear with honour would be nice since the PvP gear can be obtained through spending time on it more than skill, there is no PvP gear or rewards that have def so as a tank PvP gear is useless for raiding. I know what you are saying how you can do PvE for PvP gear but not vice versa, no PvP gear is tank gear. NONE EVAR but some raiding gear could be used in PvP.

I need to raid :( Just did the Oculus and MAN that last dragon is a dick even with guild on vent, now to do some easy HC's for da purplz since all northrend instances are done.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 01 Jan 2009, 10:44
Frankly, I'd prefer they keep pvp as segregated from PvE progression as possible, but then again, my appreciation for WoW pvp hovers somewhere between zero and none.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Josefbugman on 01 Jan 2009, 10:47
I don't know, I am enjoying Wintergrasp and Strand of the ancients, but then I was always a sucker for sieges.

Oh yeah, thanks for the advice, its been odd going back to Survival after almost 2 years and I have to admit, its a tonne of fun :lol:
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 01 Jan 2009, 10:53
Yeah, see, that's exactly the sort of pvp that I can't stand. I'm not one of those goofy bastards who waves their e-peen around and insists that world PvP is the only "real" PvP, but I do have to admit that I tend to like PvP more the less organized it is.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Josefbugman on 01 Jan 2009, 11:10
I like my murdering of other players structured myself, I don't like killing people who aren't prepared to die, that said I enjoy PvE a lot more, but I don't generally play enough anymore to be able to really get into it to the extent I want. Also I am DPS, the chance of me getting a space for any group is 1 in 2 billion :laugh:

Were you a player when they used to have the huge battle between tarren mill and southshore?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 01 Jan 2009, 11:28
I've played off and on since release, yeah. I only took part in those once though. My guild rolled in and we ended up just camping out in the middle of tarren mill for a while. Was pretty dull after the initial ownage.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Josefbugman on 01 Jan 2009, 11:43
Ahhh, I wasn't there before PvP became structured, it must have been fun. :-)

So, hows your guild doing with the raiding in Wrath? If you don't mind me asking that is.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 01 Jan 2009, 12:29
I'm currently freelance, actually. I rerolled on Grizzly Hills, a fairly new server, since I became a casual player now, for the most part. Apparently my old guild has already cleared 25 man naxx though.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Josefbugman on 01 Jan 2009, 12:34
Ahhh, my one is at the same point.

I managed (just about) to be a casual guy in quite hardcore guild, I'm kind of enjoying it and it gives me the chance to see all the cool instances after they have cleared them :lol:
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 01 Jan 2009, 22:25
I was looking at it from a tanks point of view, in that yes to but PvE tank gear with honour would be nice since the PvP gear can be obtained through spending time on it more than skill, there is no PvP gear or rewards that have def so as a tank PvP gear is useless for raiding. I know what you are saying how you can do PvE for PvP gear but not vice versa, no PvP gear is tank gear. NONE EVAR but some raiding gear could be used in PvP.

I need to raid :( Just did the Oculus and MAN that last dragon is a dick even with guild on vent, now to do some easy HC's for da purplz since all northrend instances are done.

No, no, you're still missing the idea.

I'll walk you through it.  Archavon the Stone Watcher is a raid boss.  He is fought just like any other raid boss, and your tanks (and preferably rest of your raid as well) are wearing normal PvE gear - Defense Rating, Dodge Rating, Parry Rating, all that jazz.  Archavon drops random pieces of Heroic (NX10), Valorous (NX25), Hateful (mid-range S5), and Deadly (high-end S5) gear.  Thus, it's possible for people to get PvP gear (Hateful and Deadly pieces) without spending any time farming up honor and/or APs.

My point is that I'd like the inverse to be possible.  I would like to be able to use my honor points and/or APs to buy Heroic (NX10) and Valorous (NX25) gear, and I don't see why it'd be unfair to do so.  Say a Prot Warrior has 20000 honor and 500 APs left over, and is missing that one piece of his Heroic or Valorous set - why shouldn't he be allowed to buy it through the PvP system?  They're already allowing people to kill raid bosses to get PvP gear.  I think it's perfectly fair, and not only that, but a great idea.

Frankly, I'd prefer they keep pvp as segregated from PvE progression as possible, but then again, my appreciation for WoW pvp hovers somewhere between zero and none.

Why?  Why would it be so bad to allow someone that's a huge fan of one way of playing use that way of playing so that he can at least give the other side of the game a shot?

In TBC, if you were a hardcore PvE fan, but at some point wanted to see what all the PvP stuff was about, you'd have to spend hours farming honor to buy the HWL/S1/S2 set available, and then use that set to earn APs, which you would use to buy S3/S4 and really be able to compete at a high level.  Similarly, you couldn't really go into, say, Black Temple wearing your Vengeful or Brutal Gladiator set and expect to do very well, because itemization for PvP is often quite different from PvE (example, Holy Pallies focus obsessively on crit in PvP while mp5 and INT are also valued in PvE, and PvP gear has way more STA than anyone needs for PvE.)

Why shouldn't someone be able to use all that time spent in one game mode to get a start in the other game mode?

For the record, I don't like the idea of being able to get Hateful or Deadly pieces, which have PR requirements to buy, through drops, like they are on Archavon.  But I wouldn't really have too much of a problem if you could buy a piece of Hateful of Emblems of Heroism (at, say, 60 to 80 emblems apiece) or a piece of Deadly with Emblems of Valor.  You spent the time and effort to earn those badges... why shouldn't you be allowed to use them how you want to use them?  The same idea applies with PvP currencies - why couldn't I spend my excess honor (let's say, 35k or so) on Heroic set pieces (the NX10 set) or my excess APs (let's say about 800-1200 apiece) on Valorous (NX25 set)?  Are you trying to say that PvE gamers' $15/month is worth more than a PvP gamer's $15/month?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 01 Jan 2009, 22:55
Because if good PvE gear is available through PvP, whatever raiding guild I throw my hat into the ring with will almost inevitably start requiring people to use PvP as a way to fill out any gaps in gear selection. This already happens to an extent, and I frankly, I'd rather avoid it if at all possible.

Also, I really don't give a shit what happens to PvPers.They're blizzard's problem, not mine.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 01 Jan 2009, 23:34
Dude that is EXACTLY What I was getting from what you were saying, ATM you get PvP stuff for a PvE raid, You want to get PvE stuff for doing PvP ie. trading honour for PvE gear.

Take the res and AP/crit off PvP gear, add in Def and Dodge/Block and it's tank gear, just different set bonuses.

If they made a PvP set with Def/dodge/block and different set bonuses (Which they never would) It would be PvE tank gear.

Getting PvP gear from PvE is what there is, Getting PvE gear from PvP is what you want.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 02 Jan 2009, 02:29
Because if good PvE gear is available through PvP, whatever raiding guild I throw my hat into the ring with will almost inevitably start requiring people to use PvP as a way to fill out any gaps in gear selection. This already happens to an extent, and I frankly, I'd rather avoid it if at all possible. Also, I really don't give a crap about what PvPers think.

Also, I really don't give a shit what happens to PvPers.They're blizzard's problem, not mine.

Don't worry, we feel similarly.  I get annoyed every time they fuck with my talents and abilities because of some kind of PvE-related crap.

clockworkjames: I'm not talking about new sets.  I'm talking about the same sets.  Heroic Dreadnaught, Valorous Dreadnaught, that kinda stuff.

I still don't see why they wouldn't.  Giving carebears access to epic ilvl 200 and ilvl 213 gear without making them spend the APs or get the PR requirements isn't any different from giving PvP fans tier pieces without them doing the boss/badge grinds.  It's a double standard and makes absolutely no sense.

It's saying that carebears' time is worth more than PvP fans', and that's utter shit.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 02 Jan 2009, 02:59
I think they see it as skill over time spent, from the point of stuff like honour farming for instance. Pay someone to get you the honour for epix, but you cannot pay someone to do your HC's so easily.

Same reason they put in Island dailies, to stop gold sellers. It worked to an extent and the price of gold dropped like a lead balloon.

PvP gear = time spent (and skill for arena but you can still get sick gear from honour only, the bloo set)
PvE gear = Skill and time spent.

The worst WoW player in the world could get full PvP bloos, it would just take ages but they would not be able to get PvE gear if they really suck.

if you are good at PvP you get purplz faster, if you are good at PvE it will still take pretty much the same amount of time.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 02 Jan 2009, 05:21
Actually, even the Savage Gladiator set (ilvl 200 blues, I call it S4.5) requires APs to buy.  Granted, not many... about 200-300 per piece, so you're figuring a new piece every week or every other week.  And that's completely ignoring the fact that Archavon allows people to get their Hateful and Deadly pieces - both of which have personal rating requirements to buy, some of which are quite steep - without having to do the "skill" part in the personal ratings requirements.  I'm not sure how that'd translate to PvE content; maybe like downing Lootreaver and getting Illidan-quality drops?  Something like that.

Quote
if you are good at PvP you get purplz faster, if you are good at PvE it will still take pretty much the same amount of time.

Totally, completely disagree.  I've seen plenty of terrible people at this game (I'm talking fuckin keyboard turners here) get carried by the rest of the raid and those idiots manage to walk out with some shiny new epics, or at least some badges to put them on their way to buying them.

No, farming honor doesn't take "skill", but it's honestly a lot of work.  Saying that it isn't makes me think of people who've never done it before.  I used to lead AV premades back in 2.x, and we made over 2000 honor per hour (about 600 per game, 15 minute games; about 800 per game on AV weekends), and it still took a long damn time to get the honor needed to pick up some of the more expensive things.

Getting APs is subjective.  Anyone can lose 10 games a week.  Maintaining a 1700+ PR to buy Hateful pieces can be difficult.  Maintaining a 2100+ PR is decidedly difficult, certainly not any easier than high-end raiding.

I still don't understand how people think PvP is any easier than PvE at comparable levels.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 02 Jan 2009, 11:54

Don't worry, we feel similarly.  I get annoyed every time they fuck with my talents and abilities because of some kind of PvE-related crap.

Man, do you have any idea what it's like being a PvE rogue sometimes? Narrowest class in the game, and there's like a mllion and one types of utility we will just never be allowed to have because zomg, we have stealth and stuns! Which would be fine, except those two things are genuinely fairly useless in group oriented content. Until they gave us Cloak of Shadows, we had no way of clearing harmful spell effects from us even after the fight was over. It's pretty annoying having a 2 minute disease on you that does negligible damage but still keeps you from stealthing. Of course, I'd suppose it'd feel even worse if stealthing actually appreciably increased your DPS at all. Besides, even when we did get Cloak of Shadows, the first thing that happened was an epic bitchfests from PvPer mages and warlocks. While their complaints weren't entirely unwarranted, as a PvE rogue it's frustrating since such an ability is more of a luxury item than a truly powerful new ability., even if it it is kind of nice when it keeps you from eating an really nasty boss AOE.

Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 02 Jan 2009, 15:45
Gonna agree to disagree with you there, althought shitty players can slip through 25 man raids, as a tank or healer you will noticce who is doing truely badly with only a little observation, they will most often get pulled up on it and kicked or disciplined.

The thing about farming honour is it can be sold for real world currency, PvE gear cannot. There is no services from those damn goldselling powerlevellers to get you raid gear, but there is offers for honour farming. Blizz do not like that so the quite rightly do alot to stop it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 02 Jan 2009, 18:04
I watched my dad do a raid last night (Naxx25). This was first exposure to any sort of raiding at all and I gotta say, that shit is intense. I don't know if I would have the discipline to that sort of hardcore stuff though. Plus the scheduling would most likely get in the way of school. That being said, my dad stayed 6th in DPS pretty consistently the whole night and won the roll on his T7 chest, so that was cool.

Here he is if you want to check him out. (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Area+52&n=Darkfaux)

Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 02 Jan 2009, 19:18
Okay guys, I am after some guild advice.

A bunch of people from my previous guild jumped ship with me and my boy to start up our own guild. We've got everything setup - bank tab (working on more), tabard, website etc etc. We want a bunch more high leveled players so we can get together a raid team but I figure generally just having more members is a good thing to start with. So, aside from setting up a macro to post your guild spiel in trade, are there any good ways of expanding your guild numbers? Any particular way we should be wording our advertising?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 02 Jan 2009, 20:31
I tried that once with some friends on the server and it just didn't go very far. We ended up being absorbed by another guild that one of the guys knew people in that was much larger. We also had a chat channel that linked a few guilds together for when we were raiding and needed more people. But when I restarted, the guild had been absorbed by yet another guild and I left it to join one with my meat life friends. It's still a smaller guild of people we mostly know, but if we do group things with decent players that have no guild or are unhappy with theirs, we invite them. I think in all the guilds I've been in, adding people through groups was the biggest influx I saw other than trade macros.

As for wording, just state what you're looking for and what type of guild you want to be. Definitely mention that you have a bank and tabard and that there's a website on the way.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 02 Jan 2009, 20:55
If you're interested in quality over quantity and have raiding ambitions, the best tool is to be running instances constantly and to include one or two non-guildies with every run whenever possible. Any time you're working with new people is an opportunity to see what they can do as well as a chance to show off your own skills. Remember, unless you're an established guild, you're trying out for them as much as they're trying out for you. Back in my first guild, our best recruiting tools were easily the attunment quests for Onyxia and Blackwing Lair. There's no better advertisement than a group of guys with the same guild name floating under their name helping you quickly tear through otherwise time consuming content. It shows you know how to get stuff done and are interested in people who want to do the same.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jace on 02 Jan 2009, 23:08
A bunch of people from my previous guild jumped ship with me and my boy to start up our own guild.

Thanks for letting me know.  :x
(unless you sent me something in game, I haven't had the chance to log on lately, then its  :lol:)

Guys, I level really slowly. But I don't get the chance to play as often as I'd like. I totally wish I could play at work. Which is why I want to buy a laptop.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 03 Jan 2009, 01:33
If you're interested in quality over quantity and have raiding ambitions, the best tool is to be running instances constantly and to include one or two non-guildies with every run whenever possible. Any time you're working with new people is an opportunity to see what they can do as well as a chance to show off your own skills. Remember, unless you're an established guild, you're trying out for them as much as they're trying out for you. Back in my first guild, our best recruiting tools were easily the attunment quests for Onyxia and Blackwing Lair. There's no better advertisement than a group of guys with the same guild name floating under their name helping you quickly tear through otherwise time consuming content. It shows you know how to get stuff done and are interested in people who want to do the same.
QFT but watch you do not poach, I have my prot warrior in a sick raiding guild with some college buddies and my DK in a nice raiding guild with one of my meatlife friends that I see alot at LAN and we play together every day (the restro drood) so I can jump back and forward raiding with both guilds, the second guild know they can ask for me to use my main as OT but recently my friend has been dropping heavy hints that he wants my prot warrior in his guild, I am not cool with this as recruiting in that guild has stopped so if I left now I would never get back in anyway, but I do not want to leave ever as I like the guys. I got 6 +16 def yellow gems fo free from my friend, he would not accept payment but he has a bunch of 70/80's, but I suppose since I have been making THESE (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=41182) for any guild hunter I see who does not have a purpl on their back and offering to kit out peoples DK's for free (too much cobalt/saronite) so it all balances out.

I am not raiding until I get uncrittable, I am uncrittable in all HC's (490) but not in raids (540) so it will take a while before I am mega useful.

Oh, and whoever's dad is a hunter, might want to consider getting 2 of those swords then ench with agi/AP and it will be fucking ace until that item level 213 purpl drops.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: J-cob9000 on 03 Jan 2009, 15:57
So I am officially a lame loser. Yesterday, I played all day long. Seriously. And I only went up three levels.
I'm too ADD too level.

And also, how many FPS are you guys getting?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 03 Jan 2009, 18:55
Heck if I know. Depends on the area. High population areas (read: the popular cities) will make my movement seem erratic, but then again my computer supposedly isn't fast enough for WotLK. But who cares, it still works and I can still have fun.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 04 Jan 2009, 03:40
I played all yesterday too... 4HC's 20k honour, ran LBRS/UBRS solo, baked a delicious chocolate cake, made only about 170g, rolled a new warrior for that imba trash sword that I also farmed (Solo'd a 130khp giant 7 times for it) then solo-ed hogger at lv 4.

All I got from 4 HC's was a tanking ring from the last boss of UK HC.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 05 Jan 2009, 16:01
I have taken refuge from the ongoing outworld DK onslaught by going to the Plaguelands (as I skipped them previously) and doing a few quests there.  They are fairly low-level (55-60ish, I am nearly 63) so I am smashing all the mobs.  Fights regularly go like this: Charge, Victory Rush, Bloodthirst, Execute and last about 5 seconds.  I have about 25% crit at the moment, hitting for about 200-300 normal, 500-700 specials depending on armour, 1k-1.5k with crits.  I know it's nothing overly special but it gives a hilariously rompy feel to this depressingly-themed zone.

One thing that was uh, sobering or something maybe?  A level 60 undead Warlock griefed me a bit last night.  I was trying to do a quest and he trained a bunch of mobs onto me on purpose.  I died and rezzed and he stole the quest mob from me even though it looked like he wasn't doing the quest.  I attacked him (he was PvP flagged and was doing the "stand really close to you beinga shit-heel so you can't use your AE crowd-control stuff" tactic) and got his health down almost to Execute territory in about 2 seconds, but then he transformed into some kind of demon thing with full health and killed me.  What the fuck was that thing?  It was kind of embarrassing.  The point I guess is that it told me even though I churn through PvE content I need to know a bit more about PvP.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 05 Jan 2009, 17:00
And knowing is half the battle (http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=59672)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 05 Jan 2009, 17:21
GRAAAAAAH!

God, I hate, hate, hate limited availability patterns. There is nothing more pointless than camping a a bloody vendor; it's even worse than farming for a pattern, since you cannot get any better at it, you just stand there like a dipshit waiting and occasionally switching over to your bank alt in case someone just sells the damned thing on the AH. I don't even intend to use the items I craft with the pattern myself, I just want it because I can get relatively cheap skillups out of it. I mean, damn, I guess I can just use this time instead to go farm up the excess leathers I'd need to use another recipe, but it's still annoying. Alex is filled with nerd rage, Alex smash!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: masquerade on 05 Jan 2009, 17:35
I felt very sheepish last night being run through DM by a level thirty-nine paladin on an alt. I've been unsure of my ability to solo instances, even though people have told me I can ever since I hit forty. I'm now sixty-six and ashamed of myself. And will begin running lowbie instances post-haste.
Also, bag full of eggs from farming for Winter Veil ftl.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 05 Jan 2009, 18:18
Oh, you mean Deadmines, okay. 'Cause getting ran through Dire Maul by a 39 pally would be a sight to see (not that it's even possible).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: thegreatbuddha on 05 Jan 2009, 19:47
That comes up on m server so much I made a macro to spam whenever some lowbie asks for a DM run.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 05 Jan 2009, 20:44
And knowing is half the battle (http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=59672)

That ability is so fucked.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 05 Jan 2009, 20:45
Like seriously, what the fuck am I supposed to do to combat that.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 05 Jan 2009, 20:45
Fuck.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: michaelicious on 05 Jan 2009, 21:38
Guys I signed up for the 10 day Wrath of the Lich King trial since I can't afford to play right now. I feel kind of like a scrub since my gear is so mix-n-match because of the spellpower changes. I had my gear perfectly honed before I quit, now it's just an assortment of epics from my bank that I used to use for healing but are now better for my disc spec than my TBC shadow gear. I am sad that I can't play more. I can't even level to 71. It won't let me get that last experience point. I think I might just level up my professions.

Est, you probably just want to play defensively until the buff wears off. Go into Defensive Stance, pop a health potion, spam Piercing Howl and 5-7 him so he can't Demon Charge. Also you will stay out of range of Shadow Cleave and Immolation Aura. If you survive the 30 seconds I'm sure you can take him down considering you said you get him near execute range pretty easily.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 05 Jan 2009, 21:42
Locks are a pain in the ass. Metamorphosis isn't actually all that great, although the Immolation abilitiy is pretty nasty and is pretty much custom tailored to be a warrior deterrent. Still, it's a niche PvP tool, for the most part. The big problem you're really having is that Demonology is already a pretty decent PvP tree to begin with thanks to the sheer added survivability. The part where they turn into a big nasty demon is mostly just adding insult to injury.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 05 Jan 2009, 22:25
Two words for you: Turn.  Evil.   :evil:
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 05 Jan 2009, 22:33
I should be in bed right now, but I got sucked into a defense of Thunder Bluff (When the Alliance raid group started scouting the place, I was one of maybe five people over level 70 in TB). I've never done PvP before, but fuck that was fun. I even got like five or six achievements out of it. For those curious, we smacked their asses around.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 05 Jan 2009, 22:43
The problem for me though is that I am geared and specced to be a PvE dude.  I charged him and got him to about quarter health, then he bamfed into a demon and I was like "ok what the fuck is that?" and suddenly he had close to full health and I was the one near death.  There wasn't really a chance to go into def stance and even if I did I'm not sure it would have helped me last through 30 secs of demonlololol.

I think my main problem was that the transformation kind of threw me off so I stood there looking for where the dude was for a second, then realised "oh, I guess he's that demon thing now" for another second, then looked up at the health bars and just kind of looked at them quizzically for another second trying to make sense of why I he was at full health and I was nearly dead, and then I was actually dead and also very annoyed.  What that all says to me is that I don't have very much PvP experience at all and that I should probably practice a bit by accepting a few of the duels that I have been thus far supremely uninterested in but people quite annoyingly keep throwing my way all the time.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 06 Jan 2009, 02:10
PvP servers!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 06 Jan 2009, 03:11
Armoury link please, I wanna see what you are working with.

In other news I went arms for my guilds nax raid yesterday and today.

Good times.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 06 Jan 2009, 04:37
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Dath%27Remar&n=Hadron

I r teh noob.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 06 Jan 2009, 10:28
Really nicely thought out gear, I assume the tank shoulders are part def for solo surviving as well as the best you could get your hands on, not bad at all I must say.

Might suggest blood craze for added solo survivability and pvp to a degree, with Improved charge as a nice way to start a fight with some rage even if it does mean stance dancing back into berserker stance.

Also mega man points for rolling a dwarf + :-D :-D

Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 06 Jan 2009, 14:44
Yeah, dueling would definitely help you avoid the "Wait, wtf did they just do?" factor in the future.

I'm going to be honest though; when it comes to 1vs1 world pvp, there's always going to be someone out there with a spec and gear layout that has your name on it, since that's just how blizzard kind of designed things. To consistently take on all comers, you'll need to be prepared with expensive consumables, which basically means you'll have to want to win that much more than they do. For example, when I played on a PvP server, I had to look out for Hunters on my rogue. If I got the jump on them, they were manageable, but I would still have a much narrower margin of error than they did, and most of my wins against them were the result of one of two things: 1. They were dumb or 2. I was a geared, wealthy Alchemist with a mean streak a mile wide. I mean, seriously, I used to routinely gank annoying warriors by combining a partial stunlock with hideously expensive Limited Invulnerability Potions (back then, they literally made you immune to physical damage for 6 seconds, AKA, an eternity vs. a t1/t2 rogue :-D). In the case of that warlock, he planned ahead and straight up took advantage of you; he obviously had cooldowns and a potion/healthstone available. If you're going to be fighting on someone else's terms like that, at the very least you'll need to bring a health pot of your own to the party.


Also, I really like checking out my stats on wowarmory for some reason. I find it gratifying to know that despite working almost completely on my own and thus virtually always tanking for myself, my level 54 rogue built around evasion and random quest/crafted gear still manages to deal around 7 damage per every point 1 point of damage he takes in despite being right in the face of every mob he fights. It's kind of embarrassing to realize I've died 36 times though. It doesn't feel like I've died that much.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 06 Jan 2009, 16:14
Thanks guys, yeah the shoulders are kind of a case of "ehhh, they are good for now."  I think I got them off the AH a couple levels ago when they looked like the best thing at the time.  It's kind of hard to find +AP or something shoulders so I went for the old str/sta standby instead.  Also, I am halfway through a gear refresh going from max str/agi/sta to "oh god I'm level 60 what am I doing now uh maybe as much AP/to hit/crit as I can I guess? oh god" so things are a little less uniform than I want at the moment.  I've tried to augment things by throwing a few mid-level enchants/scroll of enchants onto things to fill in the gaps and got a really really good price on a Cobrahide thinger for my pants so I really couldn't pass it up.

I think I will take you advice and add Blood Craze back into my spec.  I had it in there a while back, but then I read a few things that said it probably wasn't "optimal" or someshit.  I have a feeling I am pretty much done with the Arms tree at this point and will be shooting for Titan's Grip eventually.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 06 Jan 2009, 16:49
I hear you on that est. Prior to level 60, my rogue's upgrade path basically boils down to MOAR AGILITY. Post 60, I'll have to do things like choose between crap like Clefthoof Hide Leggings (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=31544) and Oilcloth Breeches. (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=31545) Technically, I think the Clefthoof pulls ahead, particularly if you're soloing due to +dodge from agility, but the fact that the items are both rewards from the same quest makes things more than a bit confusing. I'm guessing it must be like that because there was once a special druid only version of expertise that they consolidated into regular expertise.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 06 Jan 2009, 18:07
So for the last 2 days I have been offspeccing for my guilds 2 days Naxx raid, today on the second boss we downed I got a polearm. A bitchin' one since there was no huntard and my offspec was dps arms (no laughing plz). This convinced me to bite the bullet, remove some old 70 dps gear I was using and make me some savage saronite, my offspec may stay for a while yet before returning to prot but as I was doing utter shit dmg (9% from 6 dps in a 10 man raid) before I realised how warriors could now use pretty much whatever skills they want in most stances, I dropped battle stance and berserked my way through the end increasin my DPS by over 400 on avg. making me an almost capable DPS.

To be fair I was using 7 pieces of tanking gear and the rest was lv 70 dps gear, still no excuse. I bit the bullet, bough some gems, got some enchants, added a few sockets and made alot of new armour.

SICK AS FUCK (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Hellscream&n=Melville) even if I did balls up my build alot, all I knew about raiding and being the only warrior in the group was make my shouts count and do heavy DMG. You live you learn.

Now about that 500g worth of tanking glyphs I am using...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 06 Jan 2009, 18:47
I wouldn't make fun of your decision to go DPS arms offspec if weren't for the fact that you've said in the past that you hate Rend. Arms Warriors who hate Rend make baby Uther cry. You, Rend and a Feral Druid should be hanging out together and downing brews every Saturday night.


EDIT

Also, I love it when warriors get polearms like that due to no hunter being around. You just know some random hunter will be mentally trying to give you cancer every time he sees you swing it. It takes me back to the days when virtually everyone in my guild had an Ancient Leaf.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 06 Jan 2009, 21:36
Takes me back to the days of UBRS and seeing Hunters with Dal'rend's swords.  Remember that old meme?

"You.  Roll.  On.  EVERYTHING."
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 07 Jan 2009, 03:22
I was thinking about my spec while lying in bed this morning and realised fick parry, heroic strike and rend MUST be better.

ANOOTHER respec for offspec.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 07 Jan 2009, 11:21
I keep forgetting that mangle isn't quite the Arms dps booster it once was to be what with buffs/debuffs not really stacking. Whatever. Rend is still good, although I sort of understand why you dislike it. I used to have much the same relationship with Rupture; the direct DPS for both Rend and Rupture aren't really all that great, and for solo stuff where the mob dies super fast it's pretty meh. But they're both so inexpensive in terms of damage-per-rage/energy that once you realize that using Rupture/Rend lets you get off more special abilities in general, you never go back.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 07 Jan 2009, 12:23
I specced better now but only really missed out on improved cleave/incite/armoured to the teeth because of commanding presence, I will be further down the DPS list but bosses will fall much more easily, specced for the greater good even if I lose some AP and crit the group gains 6khp or a shit-ton of AP.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 07 Jan 2009, 15:57
Rend also has more utility than straight up damage-dealing.  Sometimes I'll lay a Rend on a mob late in the piece at the same time as a Hamstring if I know it's gonna run or fear me.  The I know that even if that happens and I can't finish it off myself directly it'll just hobble around Hamstrung and bleeding for a while before falling over.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 07 Jan 2009, 16:39
I rarely used hamstrink in pve since any mobs that DO run away (Orcs in LBRS come to mind) get killed pretty fast anyways but an intercept/hamstring macro is not just for battlegrounds.

DPS meter got up to 7k DPS today (DPS trink, Battle shout, Sweeping strikes and bladestorm over a  group of 6-7 mobs in Utgard Pinnacle) so I was chuffed.

1 mob or boss fight I get a little rage starved and struggle to get above 1400, at least is better than my 920dps on patchwork *shame of DPS'ing in tank gear*

I was thinking, on my PvP server hunter I have a PvP trink pretty much all the time, is good to have.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 07 Jan 2009, 17:01
So I respec'd my mage a bit. Took a bunch of points out of the frost tree from talents I don't use and threw them into arcane. Oh Clearcasting, how I missed you. I'm pulling in 700dps at the lowest and 950ish at the highest at the moment, when I'm pulling out all the stops - throw up ice barrier (for uninterrupted spell casting), icy veins (spell haste like wow), hit water ele and trinket on cooldowns and just spam Frostbolt in between with a Fireball when I get Brain Freeze.

Once I get to 80 I'll be respeccing to the Fire build based on Frostfire Bolt which is apparently the top raid build with seriously epic DPS.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 07 Jan 2009, 20:42
What do you guys use to check/monitor dps?  CombatMonitor or something else like that?  Kind of curious what my output looks like now.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 07 Jan 2009, 21:01
Recount (http://wow.curse.com/downloads/wow-addons/details/recount.aspx) ftw
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 07 Jan 2009, 21:42
Armored to the Teeth is, point-for-point, superior to Cruelty for all Warrior specs.  It really is just that good.  Any Warrior that's taking 5/5 Cruelty without 3/3 Armored to the Teeth is losing significant DPS/TPS.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jace on 08 Jan 2009, 01:53
Why does it feel like I'm constantly grinding in this game? Will it ever get to be fun?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 08 Jan 2009, 04:00
Frostfire is best for spell reflecting at squishies in pee vee pee hahah :evil: even if it is widely used for being awesome.

I just wanted crit over AP because I don't want TPS when I am DPS but thanks, is something to think about next time I offspec.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 08 Jan 2009, 04:27
Why does it feel like I'm constantly grinding in this game? Will it ever get to be fun?

WoW is a grind.  Before 80, you grind XP.  After 80, you grind equipment, reputation, professions, and gold.  In fact, all pay-to-pay MMOs are grind-y, because those grinds are how they get you to keep paying those monthly subscription fees.  Doesn't mean it can't be fun; just be aware that the whole game is a grind.

Armored to the Teeth is superior to Cruelty for every Warrior spec, not just Protection.  You should really get both (I really can't think of a build that doesn't suck that doesn't include both), but if you just have to choose one or the other, Armored to the Teeth is better.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 08 Jan 2009, 10:24
Armored to the Teeth is a sweet, sweet talent. What really blows my mind though is that DKs have an equivalent talent (Bladed Armor) that goes up to 5 attack power per 180 armor. I mean, shit, my level 58 dk in his quest blues already has nearly 8k armor while in Frost Presence. Holy extra threat batman.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 08 Jan 2009, 13:55
New tank build... Made for survivability, aggro control and tanking... NOT ANY DPS AT ALL EVER.

Pretty sure THIS (http://www.wow-europe.com/en/info/basics/talents/warrior/talents.html?tal=050230010000000000000000000000300000000000000000000000000053051225203012521330113321) is where I am now.

1 unused point...

Where to put for good tanking with dps low low low low on priorities.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 08 Jan 2009, 16:23
I haven't looked into the prot tree all that much, but from there I'd probably put the last point into Imp Disarm if you'd use it.  The 5% dmg isn't much, but I'm sure that the DPS guys in your group would appreciate the boost.  If you don't use disarm at all then perhaps Tactical Mastery?  I am not sure how much you need to dance while tanking.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 08 Jan 2009, 18:14
God, I am such a WoW nerd. I already have a pure DPS melee character in the form of the rogue I'm leveling, so my tank alt on my new server won't be a warrior; it will likely be a DK simply because it starts at level 55 or a Druid since I can always make them a healer/boomkin if I get bored of tanking. Despite all of this, I ended up spending the last half hour nerding out and using highly speculative napkin math to come up with a prot tank spec anyway. Behold, Alex's Probably Terrible Tank Spec. (http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/warrior/talents.html?tal=350200002300000000000000000000300000000000000000000000000050351225002012521330113321)


It doesn't have as many points in Puncture and it loses Improved Thunder Clap completely in order to put those points into Impale and Deep Wounds of all things. I can defend this! The big thing is, I don't think losing those talents is a big enough problem to offset the advantages gained, particularly during fights where you can burn off some rage with Heroic Strike. After all, Prot tanks crit a lot more often than people suspect; they have talents that provide Devastate and Heroic Strike with +15% chance to crit 24/7 and Shield Slam also has +15% chance to crit during Critical Block procs, plus they are often spamming crap as mobs furiously pound on them. Basically, in any situation where paying 1 more rage on a Devastate isn't a burden, this build should be a straight up TPS/DPS increase. In high rage fights, your TPS/DPS should go through the roof, since you'll hit harder on crits and Improved Heroic Strike will help equalize the rage you gave up earlier from not having so many points into Puncture.


...Okay, yeah, fine; the loss of Imp. TC means you'll suck a bit worse at AOE tanking, and yes, TC creates a fuck ton of threat in general. You already kind of sucked at AOE tanking anyway compared to DKs, Bears, and Prot Pallies anyway. In other words, make the offtank do it, and if he dies, laugh at him.


Edited because I somehow accidentally put points into intervene and made a few really dumb typos.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 08 Jan 2009, 21:16
New tank build... Made for survivability, aggro control and tanking... NOT ANY DPS AT ALL EVER.

Pretty sure THIS (http://www.wow-europe.com/en/info/basics/talents/warrior/talents.html?tal=050230010000000000000000000000300000000000000000000000000053051225203012521330113321) is where I am now.

1 unused point...

Where to put for good tanking with dps low low low low on priorities.

Low DPS will mean low TPS.  You really need to read up at Tankspot and Elitist Jerks, because it seems like you're somewhat misinformed about how tanking works in 3.x.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: kgbisouttogetme on 08 Jan 2009, 22:08
ive had a bm hunter for the better part of 2 years. im no noob but i really dont understand the statictics enough to maximize my dps...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 08 Jan 2009, 23:13
Try reading threads at Elitist Jerks, and I wouldn't be surprised if there's a stickied guide or three in your class forum on the official WoW boards.  The information's out there, you just gotta make yourself read it :)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jace on 09 Jan 2009, 01:05
So right now my 35 Mage is FS and has decent DPS, but I'd like my DPS to be better than my MBPS, I don't know if it's a direct correlation, but I think my HRPS and MRPS is subpar for what I could have. Now sometimes I play while I have the RHPS on and that can distract me and bring down my DPS while raising my HBPS, but it's pretty negligable because I can ignore the RHPS. So what I am wondering is if I use FB/FS, AM/RT, and TV/TS skills, will my DPS be higher than my ESP?

(I made up like half of the acronyms, just so you know)

Actually I'm wondering about maybe moving my mage from the RP server he is on to a normal server.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: thegreatbuddha on 09 Jan 2009, 03:20
Low DPS will mean low TPS.  You really need to read up at Tankspot and Elitist Jerks, because it seems like you're somewhat misinformed about how tanking works in 3.x.

BS. My 61 protadin hits for around 200 white damage/ 1.8 speed, and I crit for around 300. I never lose aggro. Sure, I'm spamming Holy Shield and Consecrate, but I consistently place lower than everyone except the healer on the damage meters. If I use Seal of Light and Judgement of Light, I occasionally place below the healer in DPS.

DPS=/=TPS
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 09 Jan 2009, 06:16
I should clarify... High threat moves heavily outweight dps for threat, as of 3.x it is harder (but still not impossible) to steal aggro, I do easily 1200DPS and by "dps low low low low on priorities" what I mean is I don't want to be that dick of a tank with a shield spike instead of a +20 def ench, or a 2.5 speed sword that should be used by a rogue, or with incite instead of points in anticipation, with improved rend over deflection etc.

Tank gear is str/stam and strength = AP and also BLOCK which means damage shield gets a hefty boost and so does shield slam.

I am not low on DPS (For a tank) by any stretch of the imagination. What I meant was that climbing the dmg list is not important to me, I would rather be a good tank than a high dps tank. My TPS is built on improved threat moves like devastate3 times then revenge and shield slam when sword and board procs, when both of them are on CD it's heroic strike, another devastate, shockwave on a stunnable mob, concussion blow or even another devastate.

If I can keep aggro off a full purple lock/rogue and a +1950 bonus healing restro, I am doing something right.

Incite or impale?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 09 Jan 2009, 09:24
I'm leaning towards Impale. After all, Devastate and Shield Slam have pretty decent crit rates when their talents kick in and 10% more damage on a Shield Slam crit is pretty hefty chunk of threat, especially when you get a few more drops and can tack on some more Strength to along with all that Stam you're packing.


And yeah, I agree with the gist of what you're saying. It's typically a hell of a lot better to mix and match specialized backup items you keep in your bags for special occasions than it is to constantly make weird talent concessions and to throw odd enchantments/gems on your primary tanking gear. For example, my old guild's MT Menergy used to swap out to lower tier stuff that had expertise rating or was gemmed for dps/threat generation on trash pulls and farm status bosses, but that's a far cry from slapping a shield spike on a Bulwark of Azzinoth. I imagine it's not so bad now that prot warriors deal so much more damage than they used to in general, but there was once a time where you could hit so much mitigation that being overgeared actually led to rage starvation.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 09 Jan 2009, 19:26
I am happy to say that I never get rage starved anymore. I love it.

Ragebeast! I can get uncrittable if I swap out my good helm for a not so good helm, or the tempered cobalt lv76 one...

But fuck that tbh, new trink I got an hour ago is SICK for def, just gonna need to put a socket and yellow def gem on my next purplez gloves whatever they may be.

Thanks for all the help guys, appreciate it! The point will be unspent until I am sure of what to do or forget it is there and accidentally click on something.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 12 Jan 2009, 21:13
Low DPS will mean low TPS.  You really need to read up at Tankspot and Elitist Jerks, because it seems like you're somewhat misinformed about how tanking works in 3.x.

BS. My 61 protadin hits for around 200 white damage/ 1.8 speed, and I crit for around 300. I never lose aggro. Sure, I'm spamming Holy Shield and Consecrate, but I consistently place lower than everyone except the healer on the damage meters. If I use Seal of Light and Judgement of Light, I occasionally place below the healer in DPS.

DPS=/=TPS

You'll generate more TPS if you use Seal of Corruption/Vengeance.  What you judge is up to you... if your DPS is mana-heavy, judge Wisdom.  If it's not, judge Light.  Occasionally judge Justice if you're concerned about runners (though I honestly can't recall any runners in LK instances.)

Doing decent DPS while tanking does not mean you are a poor tank, nor does it mean you're not doing your job.  It's very possible for the tank to place third or even second above less-than-optimal DPS, especially if you're AE tanking.  This goes double for DK and Pally tanks, because your only realistic target cap is how many mobs your healer can keep you alive against.  It's similar for Warriors and Druids, but they're still marginally weaker in terms of AE tanking, though not by much.

For some reason, people seem to think doing DPS as a tank is bad, when it's pretty much exactly the opposite.  The Defense enchant on your shield is less powerful than a Stamina enchant or the upcoming shield plating if you've already reached the softcap.  If your healer(s) are not having issues keeping you alive, then it's in the raid's best interests for you to generate more threat, which in turns allows your DPS to step it up.

Tanking was changed for LK, in that now a significant portion of your threat comes from damage dealt.  Moves with threat modifiers (like Shield of Righteousness and Revenge) are still plenty important, but the amount of raw DPS that you put out is now very important as well.

Quote
Incite or impale?

Both.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: thegreatbuddha on 12 Jan 2009, 22:55
You'll generate more TPS if you use Seal of Corruption/Vengeance.

My 61 protadin

My 61 protadin

My 61 protadin
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 13 Jan 2009, 00:01
So use Seal of Righteousness then.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 13 Jan 2009, 00:18
Yeah, that still doesn't really change anything about the entire threat-damage dynamic.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 13 Jan 2009, 01:20
Mitigation/avoidance > threath > DPS

Have all (dps-)classes/spec become easier to play? My paladin was never very hard to play before 3.0. You could come in tricky situations, but now it's silly easy. I don't have the best gear but I can easily go up vs up to 6 mobs that are higher level then myself and kick there ass. Sure I have quite alot of panic buttons but I hardly need to use them ever. Link (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Kazzak&n=Calzi) [http://eu.wowarmory.com]
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 13 Jan 2009, 03:55
Yeah, that still doesn't really change anything about the entire threat-damage dynamic.

Except that your damage increases your threat.  SoR is inferior to SoC/SoV, so once you get it, you pretty much won't use SoR ever again.  It judges for more intially, but after five stacks, JoC/JoV hits pretty much every bit as hard, and potentially a little harder.

People seem to think that you can't get good DPS and good EHP with the same spec - you can, and you should.  Seriously, go read Tankspot and Elitist Jerks.  The numbers do not lie.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 13 Jan 2009, 04:37
PizzaSHARK, but what is most important for a tank, threath or DPS?
You should do dps, but that is not the main priority for a tank. When looking at a tank you should look at how good they survive and then how much threath they put out. There are several low damage high threath abilitys out there. But all other tank classes (except death knights perhaps) have to sacrifice damage output to add survivability and therefor they have to do more threath compared to damage output. That's the whole idea of a tank.
If a tank do more damage then a dps in the group/raid the dps should be kicked, banned and laughed at under normal cirkumstanses. If it is in any way implied that a tank should do good dps compared to pure dps-specs then theres something wrong with the ballance in the game. Then you should just bring tanks and healers sins you would have the same amout of dps but way better survivability.
This is ofc from a wow point of wiev. Someone might make another mmorpg that revolves around a different mechanics (and they should sins this would be fun). Also, they might have changed their thoughts about tanks and think that a tank is someone who do good DPS while he is being the target of the mob but bad dps otherwise. This is not really the case for any of the tank classes to what I know. The one who get closest is the paladin who do quite a lot of reactive damage. But neither bears or DKs have this. And warriors rather have focus on high threath when they are being the target (more rage).

So, simply put, what I'm trying to say is that any thank should focus more on makeing sure he is doing high amount of threath and not care about the dps until he is sure that none of the dps will reach him in threath. And these two things are both after he made sure his survivability is good enough.


Edit: removed a sentance that wasen't that important.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 13 Jan 2009, 06:59
You should do dps, but that is not the main priority for a tank. When looking at a tank you should look at how good they survive and then how much threat they put out. There are several low damage high damage abilitys out there. This is mainly the case for warriors. But all other tank classes (except death knights perhaps) have to sacrifice damage output to add survivability and therefor they have to do more threath compared to damage output. That's the whole idea of a tank.
If a tank do more damage then a dps in the group/raid the dps should be kicked, banned and laughed at under normal cirkumstanses. If it is in any way implied that a tank should do good dps compared to pure dps-specs then theres something wrong with the ballance in the game. Then you should just bring tanks and healers sins you would have the same amout of dps but way better survivability.

QFT
From where I am coming from that was nail on head else I would not have quoted. Show me a tanking build with Incite and Impale and I will show you where those 5 points could be put to far better use for tanking. As for Def on shield, Alof of the purplz you get have alot less def than the tempered saronite stuff I still use a piece or two of, this allows me to wear purples instead of blues but stay uncrittable at every point. Also DEF is still a gread stat even past the cap for what if does to your defence, not just being uncrittable.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 13 Jan 2009, 10:17
Actually Clockworkjames, no, you can't.

You guys are missing something fairly obvious here. DPS talents are traditionally maligned because of two things:
1. You often have to give up too much survivability to get them.
2. They don't improve the abilities tanks actually use enough to be justifiable. Mortal Strike is a shitty tank talent because frankly, you wouldn't be using it even if you could easily fit it into your build.

With the bigger and better trees available to warriors though, that is no longer necessarily the case. Quite simply, it's easy to get abilities like Incite and Impale without touching survival talents, and they DO improve some of your bread and butter abilities Strike. Instead, you can steal a few points here and there from things like Puncture, which when it comes right down to it, is just another threat talent, and not even a particularly good one. I mean, yes, it increases the Devastate's threat-per-rage, but that doesn't really matter all that much since there's often something better to do with your GCD and because being rage starved is so rarely a major issue these days. All it could really net you is a few more rage per fight, but since you're converting that rage straight into threat anyway, you have to ask yourself if 3 points into Puncture can match 2 points of Impale (and 20% larger Shield Slam crits!) in terms of threat. Personally, considering the devastate nerfs that have gone down, I tend to lean towards Impale, which also gives the added bonus of dealing more damage, which, all things considered, is a good thing. At worst we're talking about sidegrades. YMMV.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 13 Jan 2009, 10:43
Provide an example then. When someone says they can do something and you say they cannot, prove them wrong with a solid example.

Tankspot is rarely updated, most of it is from 3.0.2 and lv 70 bullshit, so much has changed in 10 levels, you mention MS as not being a good tanking talent and yeah, it really isn't because to get MS you cannot get to the gold at the bottom of the prot tree.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 13 Jan 2009, 11:24
Well, there's always Kungen's Armory profile (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-talents.xml?r=Magtheridon&n=Kungen) to look at, and he's the MT for Ensidia, AKA, those crazies that cleared 25 man Naxx & Malygos on Nov. 15th. Sco (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-talents.xml?r=Sylvanas&n=Sco) of Method (http://eu.wowarmory.com/guild-info.xml?r=Sylvanas&n=Method&p=1) and  Tango (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-talents.xml?r=Azshara&n=Tango) of Irae AoD (http://eu.wowarmory.com/guild-info.xml?r=Azshara&n=Irae+AoD&p=1) both use nearly the same spec and their guilds are pretty uber as well. Basically, all I'm saying is that in WoW, you spec/gear for the fight. Sometimes your survivability is fine and the raid has more trouble beating enrage timers than keeping you on your feet. That's when you take Impale; it adds a ton of damage, and more importantly, a ton of threat. Giving up points in shield specialization is an iffy choice if your guild has a tough time keeping you standing, but when it comes to raw threat generation, Imp. Heroic Strike+Impale generally beats out Puncture, so they're not bad choices at all even if you decide to leave Shield Spec alone. Also keep in mind that as a warrior the threat bonuses to most abilities (I believe Thunder Clap is the exception, which would help explain why people ditch Puncture & Shield Spec before Imp. TC) is actually just a flat bonus that does not scale with gear (paladins and righteous fury are a whole other ball of wax that I won't get into). As your buddies gear up, you'll need to start dealing more damage to stay ahead of the curve because there is no way to increase the threat bonus to your abiliities, just your damage.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 13 Jan 2009, 16:10
Easter Egg! I know this is already widely reported, but I've yet to find any pictures.

I'm pretty sure Linds is the only other WoW player on here who'll get a kick out of this:

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v289/0bsessions/Random%20Forum%20Junk/WoW%20Images/WoWScrnShot_011309_190205-2.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v289/0bsessions/Random%20Forum%20Junk/WoW%20Images/WoWScrnShot_011309_190816.jpg)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: ackblom12 on 13 Jan 2009, 16:43
Oh my god that's hilarious.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 13 Jan 2009, 17:00
From those links I went into the respective guilds then checked out the Talent trees of some of their Fury-specced Warriors for tips.  I then realised how stupid this was, because they are level 80 raiding guild Fury Warriors and I am a level 64 Solo PvE dood.

Also, I have tried stance-dancing between Battle & Berserker in the past without too much joy, but I thought maybe I was doing it wrong or maybe I had to be specially kitted out to do it or something.  I tried it again recently using Recount to monitor the difference in my DPS output and my DPS actually went down when dancing into Berserker and back during/after fights.  I think maybe the problem is that my fights are too short?  My fights look like: Charge, Vic Rush, BT, Exe.  They last maybe a few seconds each unless I get two at once, then it looks more like: Charge, Vic Rush, Thunderstrike, Bloodthirst, Execute, Vic Rush, Bloodthirst, Execute and last a couple of extra seconds.

At the moment for what I do I really can't see the benefit.  Am I missing something here or what?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 13 Jan 2009, 20:47
PizzaSHARK, but what is most important for a tank, threath or DPS?

The two are not mutually exclusive, and in fact, a large part of threat generation relies on DPS output now.

Quote
You should do dps, but that is not the main priority for a tank. When looking at a tank you should look at how good they survive and then how much threath they put out. There are several low damage high threath abilitys out there. But all other tank classes (except death knights perhaps) have to sacrifice damage output to add survivability and therefor they have to do more threath compared to damage output. That's the whole idea of a tank.

No, they don't.  In most cases, you very rarely need to decide between survivability or threat, because the talent trees are very streamlined now for Pallies, Warriors, and DKs.  I don't follow Druids much because I honestly think bears are the worst tanks right now.

Quote
So, simply put, what I'm trying to say is that any thank should focus more on makeing sure he is doing high amount of threath and not care about the dps until he is sure that none of the dps will reach him in threath. And these two things are both after he made sure his survivability is good enough.

And I'm gonna tell you for what's probably the fourth or fifth time, DPS and TPS are not mutually exclusive, and TPS in fact relies quite a bit on your DPS.

Your EHP and TPS are effectively equal in terms of importance - holding aggro doesn't matter if you die, and staying on your feet doesn't matter if the boss hits his enrage timer and begins wafflestomping the raid because your threat ceiling is too low.  If your healers are not having any trouble keeping you alive (ask them), then you should adjust your spec and/or gear for increased DPS/TPS so that your DPS can pull out the stops and get the boss down faster.  This is the only possible way to earn many of those time-based achievements.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: kgbisouttogetme on 13 Jan 2009, 21:38
sinister squashling on your bar? excellent.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 13 Jan 2009, 23:23
Than I shall be satisfied to say that I don't agree with you, PizzaSHARK. I have made what it clear what I think the prioritiees are. And no, DPS and threath are not the same thing in all situations. Threath scale with DPS but will go beyond dps with some abilitys. But if blizzard have changed so that it is that dps and threath is the only thing that scale, then the PvE part of the game have become quite a lot more boring.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 14 Jan 2009, 00:38
Blizzard completely changed the way tanking's done with LK.  Strength on tanking gear prior to the 3.x changes would have been regarded as wasted itemization points, because almost all of a tank's threat was generated via threat modifiers (Pallies were and still are a bit of an anomaly in that regard.)  Now, most of those modifiers have been removed or altered so that many abilities no longer have a static threat bonus (a good thing) and so that threat generated is often directly related to damage done.  An excellent example of this is Revenge.  As it first started out, Revenge did very little damage, but produced an immense amount of static threat.  During TBC, it was changed so that it did (a lot) more damage, but it was still a static threat generator.  With LK, it's been changed to do a significant amount of damage (modified by your Attack Power) and the threat it generates is modified by the damage it deals.  You do more damage, you generate more threat.  And almost every single tanking ability in the game behaves this way; Shield Slam, Concussion Blow, Shockwave, Devastate, and even Thunder Clap will generate more threat if you're doing more damage with them.  Why do you think they put Strength on tanking gear and adjusted the Paladin skills so that Pally tanks would benefit from some AP (all judgements and most seals have both spellpower and attack power coefficients.)

I'm not saying you should start out with Spiked Titansteel instead of Tempered Titansteel, or that you should spec for Titan's Grip instead of Shockwave.  I'm saying that deliberately ignoring extremely fucking good talents (like Armored to the Teeth and Impale) because you think they're only for the DPS spec is completely wrong.  After a certain point, that extra 5% block is gonna be shit compared to the threat increase you'd get from Impale, for example.  When you reach that point depends on your gear, your healers, and the content you're tackling.

But, again: If your healers say that you're surviving just fine, you are screwing over your raid by wasting talent points on more survivability instead of more threat.  If you're doing fine in NX10 and find that you still need those survivability talents when you hit NX25 and need to drop some threat talents - do it.  But the inverse is true; if you're at a point when you really don't need more survivability, you should spec so that you raise your threat ceiling, which will allow your DPS to push harder.  Doing anything less is being an irresponsible tank.

EDIT: And I don't see how it can be more boring.  Tanks (and healers, too!) have more options now than they ever have had before.  Did you ever try tanking in vanilla WoW, when it was actually better to tank as an Arms spec 15 deep into Protection (for Defiance)?  Deep Protection was worthless!  What about TBC tanking?  Tanks couldn't put out jack for DPS and were largely just a gimmick spec for PvP.  If you wanted to farm or PvP effectively, it often necessitated acquiring a completely different set of gear and respeccing.  It's not like that anymore, and it's a good, progressive thing for the game as a whole.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 14 Jan 2009, 00:58
Not more boring as player (perhaps) but more boreing as game dynamic. If threat = DPS then they have i reality removed one aspect of the game; threath makeing. My list can be simplyfied down to survivability > dps/threath. I liked it when you hade to make a decission between makeing threath, survivability and trying to add some extra damage. Insted of removing these things to make the same spec good i more parts of the game, why not remove the cost for respecing instead.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 14 Jan 2009, 01:27
I could see how that could be a concern in theory, but let's face it, at one point prot warrior tanking came dreadfully close to basically consisting of spamming Devastate and Shield Slam every time they were available.*  Now thanks to Sword & Board procs, the Revenge buff and the Devastate threat nerf, warrior tanking is more varied than ever.

*Mind you, I don't say that to minimize the difficulties of playing a tank; god knows you guys have to put up with a lot and you're typically forced into a leadership role whether you want to be or not. I just meant that most of the challenge involved actually came from learning the pulls, positioning and how to handle whatever wacky new gimick or threat dump the boss threw at you; which abilities to use at any given time is often too clear cut to be a big issue, at least after a bit of practice, at any rate. Plus, I'm completely aware that when us rogues fail an idiot and die to something silly, people usually just end up pointing and laughing at us while the guild leaders divvy up the loot. Tank idiocy, on the other hand, is often a wipe.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 14 Jan 2009, 21:08
What's wrong with streamlining the system?  You didn't make a choice between DPS and threat previously, because tank DPS was nonexistent, even for pallies and druids.

Dual specs will come someday... maybe with Ulduar in 310.  But until then, respeccing costs a negligible amount of gold and some time.  Look at the Druid's Feral tree - it was always heralded as a great tank tree, because you could easily get all the good tank talents, switch to kitty gear, and still do respectable DPS when you weren't tanking.  It was why bears were the offtanks to have in TBC.  It's a very similar situation now with DKs - all three specs can tank (though Unholy is better for TPS and Frost is better for EHP) effectively, and all three specs can also DPS effectively.  Why shouldn't the Warrior, Paladin, and Druid trees be the same?  Tanking is one of our class roles - why shouldn't we be able to tank at least reasonably effective as any spec, instead of being forced to be the designated tank spec in order to tank?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 15 Jan 2009, 06:38
I think the solution is to nerf Death Knights, not make the rest of the classes even more of a clustered mess. What's the fun of picking a specific spec if there's very little that really sets it apart from any other spec?

In terms of Druids, it's not like all three specs are viable for tanking.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 15 Jan 2009, 09:11
You can tank as a boomkin... to an extent.

Boomkinz with the right glads MT's kara at 70.

Dk's DO need a nerf, 2.5kdps constant and up to 8kdps when geared (Some broken dual wield thing or something).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 15 Jan 2009, 11:01
No, but druids can choose between being great with magic or great at melee. With the unification of +heal & +damage, druids can pitch in with healing OR damage yet still excel in a particular role; in raids of course they'll be asked to stick to their specialization more often than not, but that's true even of DKs. Just because a druid build doesn't always tank doesn't mean druids aren't capable of bringing multiple things to the table, plus they still have some unique class skills such as a battle rez and Innervate regardless of spec. No offense, but it's really, really, REALLY easy to think that classes already step on eachother's toes too much when you're a druid, since multi-tasking has always been a core ideal of the class. Besides, like it or not, blizzard now seems to think everyone should be pretty decent at dealing damage so you can "take the player, not the class." As a rogue player, I can't help but think that if this is true than frankly, I had better be able to start getting to do things that other classes can, since basically as it stands "the thing that makes my class unique" is standing behind things and wailing on them while bringing extremely limited utility.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 15 Jan 2009, 21:30
Yep, it's one of the big hurdles they're either facing right now, or will be facing soon.  Making it so that your talent choices matters somewhat less as to what your class can do (example, Shield of Righteousness is available to all Paladin specs and comes with a huge bonus threat modifier, which allows both Holy and Ret to produce acceptable TPS, and thus tank) makes classes with more than one role to fill - and that's almost all of them, folks - much more fun to play.

But single-role classes, like Rogues, Hunters, Mages, and Warlocks, are going to start feeling left out.  Sure, how you spec changes how you do your DPS (well, kinda), but it doesn't change that you're always gonna be DPS.

Specifically to Rogues, I do think a number of problems they'll be facing is their strength in PvP.  You really can't give them too many new tricks or abilities, because they're already extremely powerful in PvP - giving them more tricks would certainly make them overpowered, and they're pretty damn close to that point already (Deadly Brew, anyone?)  You could make Sap usable on targets that're in combat, which would make Rogues more desirable for instances (as compared to a Ret pally which can do good DPS, toss some heals, buff the group, and do what amounts to an in-combat Sap), but would make them ludicrously powerful in PvP.

Personally, I think the best solution would be to completely and totally separate the PvP and PvE sides of the game, but that's a mammoth undertaking, and I'm not sure if we'll ever see it; and even if we do, it's probably gonna be a year or two from now, not a few months.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 15 Jan 2009, 21:39
You don't need to do anything that drastic.  If they want to add utility to some classes just make the new abilities mob-only.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 15 Jan 2009, 22:16
That runs counter to their design philosophy, however; they want an ability that works against mobs to do the same thing when working against players in order to keep things neat and tidy for the newbs. Frankly, they considered the whole diminishing returns thing to be quite the concession as it is.

Anyway PizzaSHARK, that's exactly what I was driving at earlier when I said that as a PvE rogue I've always been painfully aware of our 1vs1 PvP capabilities (as much as people hate us, most of our strengths start to bleed away the second you get in a fight bigger than 3vs3). For example, here's an ability that would be no big deal in PvE but could have dire consequences in an arena: Letting combo points accrue independently of who you targeted. In PvE, it'd be nice because you could tab to a new target to quickly throw out a gouge on an add or something without having to worry about blowing energy on a finisher first lest you waste your combo points. Sure, it'd let you build up combo points on lesser mobs before engaging with elites, but that's hardly that big of a deal; I hardly doubt it'd be enough to let us solo troublesome mobs as easily as a warlock, druid or hunter can. But in an arena? Such a thing could potentially lead to epic nerd rage. I doubt Blizzard is comfortable with the idea of a couple rogues burning someone down with sustained dps and then immediately moving onto the next target with 2 or 3 combo points each in the chamber. And yet it's a confluence of little things like that which limits our flexibility in PvE. Not to put too fine a point on it, but unless we actually ARE doing more damage than everyone else on an important single target like a boss, the narrow focus of our abilities is as big of a liability as our lack of utility.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 16 Jan 2009, 04:09
Which is why I don't play a Hunter, Mage, Rogue, or Warlock :)

I'm not sure how to really ensure these classes get raid slots and are made equal with the multi-role classes.  Mages already get slots because of their vending machine status, along with some useful buffs and abilities.  Warlocks are much in the same boat - healthstones, summons, soulstones, and probably imp totem too.  Hunters are a little less varied, but their CC's pretty strong between trapping and pet offtanking.  But Rogues don't bring buffs, their only really reliable CC is Sap (which can't be used in combat), and a lot of what makes them so deadly against players (poisons, easy and frequent spell interrupts, the goddamned stun chains) is either of limited useful against mobs, or not useful at all.  The only suggestion I can provide is to have faith in Blizzard - a lot of the time you're sitting there wondering what in the fuck they're doing, but then look at how they changed tanking for LK: every tank I know (and, as a healer and former tank myself, I know a lot of tanks) is ecstatic over how much better things are for them.

They've said us healers are next up on the game-changing changes list, and I wouldn't be surprised if DPS was far behind.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 16 Jan 2009, 08:33
Yeah, honestly, I'm not really very worried about it all, contrary to my cranky late night post. Rogues do damage, very, very well, and sometimes raw damage is all you need someone to contribute; I don't play in a hardcore enviroment (anymore), so it is not like becoming truly obsolete is a real worry here. And the last thing I want to see is classes like Paladins get pigeonholed into being healbots again.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 16 Jan 2009, 16:18
Easter Egg! I know this is already widely reported, but I've yet to find any pictures.

I'm pretty sure Linds is the only other WoW player on here who'll get a kick out of this:

pictures

Bahahahaha, I am so visting that island when my computer stops making evil noises.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 16 Jan 2009, 20:28
Okay so I took some thinking and respecced 8/8/55 and my dps has not changed and I am getting more than a little rage starved from using HeroicStrike so much.

I dun get it, even with my new toy.

http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Hellscream&n=Melville

(fuck mongoose)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 16 Jan 2009, 21:09
I'd blame the loss of Anger Management and the fact that you're getting used to a new spec which tempted you to Heroic Strike more often, leading to spikey rage generaiton. I wouldn't be surprised if that spec is actually capable of actually generating more rage than your old one thanks to the new epic and damage talents; the problem is likely that instead of getting 1 extra rage every 3 seconds, you're getting extra rage in unpredictable bunches (ie, when Cruelty gives you a crit on a white hit that you wouldn't have been a crit before.) I'd try giving the spec another go while throwing out slightly less Heroic Strikes than you did even with your old Anger Management build and see how that goes before throwing it under the bus.


Gratz on the sword, I love the looks.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 17 Jan 2009, 10:33
Thanks  :-D Fuggin love the sword, me and my old college buddies/some guiildies have a pretty sweet 5man team (warrior/rogue/shammy/huntar/Mage) so we do a few HC's per night to get geared and the gauntlet in UP had caused alot of grief, everyone was pretty stoked when the sword dropped because of how awesome it is.

I was also wondering what I should have done with points, they kinda got messy about shield shield specialisation/spell reflect/1h weps where I went fro 2/1/5 but I am thinking I should have gone 4/0/4 just because reflect is pretty much only going to be used on the MT since it does not work with AoE and I should be the one getting casted on.

Gonna leave it this way for a while, see how things play out.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 17 Jan 2009, 20:57
Improved Spell Reflection is primarily a PvP talent, though it has some utility in 5-mans.  I'd personally go 3/5 Shield Spec/1H Spec unless you really, really need that extra 1% block.

Generally speaking, Heroic Strike a ragedump ability used when you're swimming in rage.  If you're having issues with not generating enough Rage (generally this happens when you're avoiding a lot of swings or not getting hit very hard), you shouldn't be using Heroic Strike unless you have an excess.

If you're talking about soloing, you should almost never use Heroic Strike unless you're swimming in rage; spamming Devastate is much more efficient.  But you should be soloing in DPS gear, anyway.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: thegreatbuddha on 18 Jan 2009, 00:05
Settle down beavis.

Not everyone plays the game as a second job. Those of us that like having fun instead of doing calculus to optimize our toons don't enjoy being corrected on every talent point and itemizaions point, and those that do optimize every nitty gritty detail probably already read Tankadin, Elitist Jerks, etc.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 18 Jan 2009, 02:28
It's really not hard to stay current on how to do your job properly.  The major stickied threads at Elitist Jerks and (usually) under your class forums on the official WoW boards are often very easy to understand and don't require you to do any math at all - it's all been done for you already.  Tankspot also has a wealth of information, but it's a little more difficult to find; I mostly use Tankspot for their Project Marmot videos these days to help teach new people how they can expect a raid fight to proceed.

I wouldn't classify my WoW gameplay as a second job; if it was that way, I'd be logging in every single day to do my dailies and all kinds of other crap like some folks on my server (and a handful in my guild.)  On the contrary, there are entire weeks where I may not play at all, or at most just log in to fiddle with my auctions.

I've never understood the viewpoint that you have to be a supernerd in order to be good at the game.  It makes no sense at all.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 18 Jan 2009, 17:02
So I got a few equipment upgrades (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Dath%27Remar&n=Hadron) in quick succession yesterday taking me from an "eh, doing alright" status in the area that I am currently (Zangarmarsh) to being a meatgrinder again.  I got my first gem-slot item as the result of a quest (three slot red-blue-yellow. I put in a +12 str red, a +21 sta blue and a +12 to hit yellow).  The socket bonus was +4 str and it had 16str/22sta/15crit on it naturally, so I was quite pleased with it.  I also put some heavy knothide onto it for the extra stamina boost because even though I'm treating sta as a dump stat it's about the only thing I could add to it at the moment.  After that I got a new belt with 15 hit rating (I think) and find that with all the extra +hit I am generating a lot more rage (who'd have thunk it, right?) due to less misses.  I am now swimming in rage and dumping using HS a lot - Charge, Vic, HS, BT, HS, (repeat as req) then Exe if needed.

Thinking about doing some dungeons/instance runs with some PUGs or at least trying to convince a high-level mate to train me in what I should be doing in them.  Keep looking at some of the gear I could be getting in these dungeons and thinking that it would be kind of nice.  I've run a few instances one other chars around level 20-30 and they were fun-ish, but I guess I've been fairly solo-focused for so long it's hard to get out of that mindset.

edit: oh man, I just realised that I was getting a little rage-starved before the latest upgrades mainly due to removing a few points from "Unbridled Wrath" last week in a re-spec experiment.  Now that I am generating enough rage again I guess the experiment has worked?  Will see how it goes.

Also, I am guessing that if I want to go into dungeons I'd re-spec yet again to go more heavily into Imp Whirlwind/Berserker stance so I can just stay in Berzerker stance to lessen the threat and use WW?  Guessing I'd charge less as DPS in instances and technically Enrage would become less useful, as I should not really be getting hit enough to activate it in a useful way.  So the 7 pts in Blood Craze, Piercing Howl & Enrage would go out in favour of 2/2 Imp WW and 5/5 Imp Berzerker Stance?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: masquerade on 18 Jan 2009, 19:35
A hypothetical situation, in the midst of class discussion/argument.

Say you and your best friends form a guild on a server away from your mains to simply play together, since one of you has moved very far away and hanging out in real time is no longer possible. It is agreed that you are all officers with equal power, and that you are the core of the guild. Adding new members is not necessarily the goal.
Say you, as one of the friends, are not on as much as the others, because you have school and work full time, in addition to a significant other and attempting to build a social life in a state halfway across the country. After a week and a half or so, you log on for some serious play time because you finally have a night that's free and clear of obligations. Upon finally getting in [because the other two are the smart ones who chose a nearly full realm to start on, which is now a locked realm], you find that you've been demoted. You have no power within the guild. One of the others signs on, and you ask them why. They say that it's because the other members [aka strangers] have been complaining about you never being on and having more power than them. Would you be upset? Do you think it's understandable to be upset? Finally, would you think that your best friend kicking you out of the guild would be a viable reaction to you being upset?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 18 Jan 2009, 19:43
I would think it would be normal to be upset, as it was supposed to be a guild of friends.  Kicking you out of the guild would be a fucked thing to do.  I'd feel pretty shit that the best friend had chosen the feelings/thoughts of some strangers over me, and would tell him so on the phone (ie: not in-game) to let him know that this is an action that has real-world repercussions, not just some in-game bullshit.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: crohnsy on 18 Jan 2009, 22:17
A hypothetical situation, in the midst of class discussion/argument.

Say you and your best friends form a guild on a server away from your mains to simply play together, since one of you has moved very far away and hanging out in real time is no longer possible. It is agreed that you are all officers with equal power, and that you are the core of the guild. Adding new members is not necessarily the goal.
Say you, as one of the friends, are not on as much as the others, because you have school and work full time, in addition to a significant other and attempting to build a social life in a state halfway across the country. After a week and a half or so, you log on for some serious play time because you finally have a night that's free and clear of obligations. Upon finally getting in [because the other two are the smart ones who chose a nearly full realm to start on, which is now a locked realm], you find that you've been demoted. You have no power within the guild. One of the others signs on, and you ask them why. They say that it's because the other members [aka strangers] have been complaining about you never being on and having more power than them. Would you be upset? Do you think it's understandable to be upset? Finally, would you think that your best friend kicking you out of the guild would be a viable reaction to you being upset?

Sounds like ingame bs. maybe the guild is heading in a new and different direction than it was previously formed upon. who cares if you have no 'power' in the guild.  it is just agame just play it to have fun. you dont have to be the same rank to chat when online with your friend do you?  hell you dont even have to be in the same guild to chat and run things with them.

Sure you can be a little upset but remember at the end of the day it doesnt really matter, its only a game and sometimes plans change.

I dont know if est is trolling you or not but seriously dont let a game dictate your real life even if your friend 'demoted' you and you are feeling all buthurt
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 18 Jan 2009, 22:45
est - keep doing what you are doing and run some instances ASAP, I can assure you that the people you will be put in a group with will have put nowhere near as much though as to how to play their class as you have, so just go with it. Nobody takes fury warriors seriously but you need to learn how to play in a team situation as early as possible. Also your build looks pretty spot on.

masquerade - Take it on the chin and shrug it off, there is no real use to being an officer other than E-Peen, if the rank affected how you played the game you should not even bother playing, guilds are meant to be for banter and easy groups, then at engame raiding and HC's. If you never played for ages you should expect to be demoted, people move on and progress but getting pissy enough about it so as to have your "best friend" kicking you out of the guild is a bit lame, in fact you make it sound like a bunch of friends played WoW for the first 30 something levels then you stopped and now your friends are all in outlands trying to improve the guild.

I play on 4ish servers, my main is alli hellscream and I play boulderfist horde with friends, the friends have nowhere near as much experience with the game but I play with them for fun and linked accounts makes it a laugh, they had the guild "set sail for fail" which I am still in but due to naxx/hc's/that 25man dragon raid I was not on for a week and 2 members made a new guild (we eat tables) that alot of my SSFF friends joined. I nevber got an inv, I didn't expect one. In SSFF I never even had GB privelages and didn't care, I am good at what I do, I help my friends and that is all that matters. We are not even in the same guild, getting annoyed over guild status is not just pathetic but more than a little retarded. My main on hellscream has restricted GB access (1 stack a day) but I put loads of ore/mats/random scrolls and pot's I will not use in it all the time to help the guild because it makes sense.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: masquerade on 18 Jan 2009, 23:17
It's not the demotion that really bothers me all that much, it's that they're kind of going back on what they said. Originally, the guild was supposed to be just the crew, no one else unless we really hit it off with another player. And it was agreed that if we decided to grow, that the crew would remain the core officers, with equal power [like I said]. It just irritated me that they'd taken the whining of inexperienced strangers to heart rather than the agreement we'd all made as friends. Also, I confronted her about it, yes, but it didn't warrant a kick from the guild. That's just how she handles things. She "punishes" her friends for making her mad or calling her judgment into question.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 18 Jan 2009, 23:26
My point was that a bunch of friends said they would do something and then ditched one of the friends because some random fucks said so.  Who cares where it happened, it's the thing itself that would give me the shits.

And yeah, that sucks, masq.  Sounds like your friend is a bit of a bitch :(
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 19 Jan 2009, 04:51
Just use her email address to register for a bunch of porn and crap.   :evil:
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: masquerade on 19 Jan 2009, 06:55
Thanks, Est. I always worry whether or not I'm getting upset about something that doesn't really matter. Sometimes it doesn't, but it's nice to feel justified when it does. :]
And Chesire, that would be a wonderful idea, except it can't be regular porn. Must be lesbian porn. She'll spontaneously combust.  :evil:

Okay [/drama], back to class discussions haha. :] I'm leveling another druid, and I decided to give feral a shot like everyone told me to a while back, but I just can't do it. I'm so much faster at shifting through spells and layering them on top of each other because I almost instinctively know their cast times. Melee just makes me want to bang my head on a desk.
Also, there's this guy who was about six levels lower than me that was beating my ass in duels. He was using Enti's Quenched Sword [http://www.wowhead.com/?item=37659]. This is the first I've seen or heard of this thing, and I was beyond irritated.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 19 Jan 2009, 11:25
Hahaha, entis :3

http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Hellscream&n=Indapooper

Q_Q moar plox.

That sword is so much fun, item lv is 200 (a normal 80 epic) but there is no lv req so a warriors rend can hit for 140+ per tick and you get rend at lv 4.

I can EASILY beat a non twinked lv 25 with just what you see there, cleft and a piece or two of lame armour.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 19 Jan 2009, 14:33
Ok so, I probably don't get how Rend works.  How can that 2-4dmg/0.8dps sword make Rend hit for 140+ dmg per tick?

oh hey:

(http://twinkinfo.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/entireal.jpg)

"Hidden stats" or something.

Quote from: rhagus
My level 4 warrior just dueled a level 12 mage and one-shotted him (257 crit). I love that sword! :D
Quote from: savagy
clearly outplayed that mage

hurr.

Apparently Blizz have said that the sword is bugged & will be "fixed" in 3.0.8
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: masquerade on 19 Jan 2009, 16:57
I was exasperated, to say the least. Haha.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 19 Jan 2009, 18:11
I dunno if they will "Fix it" yeah it is broken but they also put it there for a reason.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: masquerade on 19 Jan 2009, 18:17
The guy said it was so rogue twinks didn't have all the fun dealing out damage.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 19 Jan 2009, 19:14
It's supposedly an in-joke "homage" to Inte's Sword from EQ.  An "unkillable" mob called Inte was killed by FoH (a guild that some of the Blizz team used to be in) and they looted it.  2h, Paladin-only, 150dmg, 15 delay (150 base dmg every 1.5 secs), about a bazillion times better than the Pally epic.

Oh man, looking at the loot screenies brings back memories, heh.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 20 Jan 2009, 01:39
http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=14318919433&pageNo=1&sid=1#4

Quote from: Ghostcrawler
We wanted to make threat easier to manage, especially at earlier tiers of content. However threat generation is still the responsibility of the tank as well as the rest of the group. If your tank has trouble with threat generation, then you may run into encounters where you can't beat the timer.

It is only my opinion, and some groups can still make it work, but often the tanks complaining that they can't hold aggro or always asking the dps to slow down are the ones who choose gear and talents solely for survivability over threat-generation and try and argue that they don't care how terrible their own dps is.

Hopefully this illustrates my point :)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 20 Jan 2009, 10:01
Quote
It is only my opinion, and some groups can still make it work, but often the tanks complaining that they can't hold aggro or always asking the dps to slow down are the ones who choose gear and talents solely for survivability over threat-generation and try and argue that they don't care how terrible their own dps is.

HOLY FUCK THEY NERFED OUR THREAT Q_Q

[sensible]Coolies[/sensible]
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 20 Jan 2009, 10:03
3.0.8 today! Hooray! I hope the rumored kitty swipe makes it in there!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 20 Jan 2009, 16:07
Oh man awesome.  3.0.8 is gonna remove the to-hit penalty of the 51 pt Fury talent - or has that happened previously?  I forget & I'm not up to it yet - wait, I could be if I re-spec.  Oh man, yeah.  I could do this (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=LVZhxhsEiubxo0zVo) immediately and work my way toward this (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=LVMhzfhZhxhsEiubxo0zVo).  Not sure what to do with the extra point, but by that time I'll probably have changed my mind/focus anyway so keeping it open is probably a good thing.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 20 Jan 2009, 17:06
I'm jealous of the Titan's Grip buff, but on the other hand, that Fan of Knives buff made me giddy even back when it was just a rumor, so complaining about it would make me fee like an ungrateful git.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 20 Jan 2009, 18:18
Yeah, just be thankful you are not a hunter! (nerf)

Titans went from 15% to 12% to 5% and now to 0% if I remember correctly.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: crohnsy on 20 Jan 2009, 20:05
Yeah, just be thankful you are not a hunter! (nerf)

Titans went from 15% to 12% to 5% and now to 0% if I remember correctly.

 :roll:

yeah sucks being #1 dmg dealer by a considerable margin to now being competitive with everyone else...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: michaelicious on 20 Jan 2009, 22:54
Yeah, just be thankful you are not a priest! (nerf)

fyp
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 20 Jan 2009, 22:56
Last time my guild did naxx, a hunter was both top and bottom for dmg dealt minus the healers, I was 2nd bottom as OT.

The top damage hunter was in front of the lock and the mage, doin 9.7% of a 25 man raids total dmg by my count... So he was doing more than the lock, the mages or anyone else. He wasn't even going to come on the naxx run because he felt he wasn't geared (his words).
Hunters do sick dmg, but then so do alot of locks, mages, geared rogues...
Hunters do perhaps need a balance which they are getting but it seems like a super big nerf.

Now any feral droods gonna comment on staff changes?

Also priests can go to hell, a shadowpriest caused 4 wipes and the group to give up due to screwups. The dude is not that bright and everyone in the guild is super nice, not always a good thing even if they are all awesome people.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: michaelicious on 20 Jan 2009, 23:14
Yeah I guess that makes all priests bad.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 20 Jan 2009, 23:23
Wanna know something really sad? I once finished a night doing 8.9% of the raid's damage... in a 40 man. At one point I was doing around 14%, which led to the guild leader pausing the raid, kicking two other rogues out and bitching at everyone else for slacking. Granted, I was one of the few guys left in the guild who was into theorycrafting and the like (many of our best members had been recently poached by the #1 guild on the server), but it was still pretty inexplicable, and in retrospect it was a clear sign that it was the beginning of the end for the guild. Shit like that really makes me wonder what blizzard was thinking when they thought 40 people was a good size for a raid. It's like herding cats, I tell ya.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 20 Jan 2009, 23:41
Priests are fine.  It was stated that the 6 second CoH cooldown was intended for 3.x, but didn't make it into live, because they were worried about Priest players whining too much about changes.

However, it was deemed that current CoH without the cooldown was indeed overpowered, so they added in the cooldown.  The only difference is they've done it four months after 3.x hit, not immediately.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 21 Jan 2009, 06:50
Now any feral droods gonna comment on staff changes?

I haven't actually managed to get on the game for more than a couple minutes since the patch, so jury's still out for me. From everything I've heard, though, I like the sound of not being stuck permanently working with staves.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 21 Jan 2009, 10:53
Yeah I guess that makes all priests bad.
I get your point, one priest healer I partied with recently was sick as fuck, kept me topped up on health all the time instead of waiting until I was low then megahealz.

also patch notes HOLY FUCK DROOD WITH A POLEARM
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 21 Jan 2009, 14:14
See, I can see droods with a spear, but a halberd, for example?  I've always thought it was odd that they lumped all polearms into one category.  The way you'd brandish a spear is very different to a glaive which is a bit different again to a halberd, and if they are going to combine them all then why split out staves?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Jan 2009, 14:28
Let's face it though, half the weapons in this game look like something out of power rangers anyway. Besides, lord knows you spend most of your time looking at some druid form rather than their equipment anyway.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: crohnsy on 21 Jan 2009, 15:12
See, I can see droods with a spear, but a halberd, for example?  I've always thought it was odd that they lumped all polearms into one category.  The way you'd brandish a spear is very different to a glaive which is a bit different again to a halberd, and if they are going to combine them all then why split out staves?

yeah that's what bugs me with this game too.  The inaccurate depiction of weapons has got to stop....
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: ackblom12 on 21 Jan 2009, 16:13
Innaccurate depictions of weapons in a fantasy world? Oh my god.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 21 Jan 2009, 16:29
I don't see the harm in having a layered approach to weapon skills.  Instead of "1h Sword" or "2h Maces" you have experience with 1h/2h weaponry, then separate experience for stabbing, slashing, blunt, hook-type, flail-type, etc.  I mean really, how would you class a halberd?  It is a 2h weapon with a sharp point for long-range stabbing, an axe blade for hacking and a hook on the back for disarming, pulling people off horses and just general CC-type utility.  In addition it can be used more or less as a staff if people get into close quarters combat with the wielder.

ps: this is probably why any game idea I'd design would be "unmarketable" :(
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 21 Jan 2009, 19:11
Halberds/spears/staves and other polearms all are weilded pretty effectively, less Q_Q because it's just a game. If you want something realistic instead of complaining, go play outside in traffic.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 21 Jan 2009, 19:20
I think you are taking my off-hand comments for a real gripe about the game and find your harsh comment quite out of character for you.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 21 Jan 2009, 19:27
My tounge was so far into my cheek it poked out my ear.

To clarify yeah it was a little uncalled for, maybe because of all the things I have read of similar things, like people complaining about minor things about wepons in video games, "KATANA SHOULD NOT BE USED WITH SHIELD!" is a popular one.

I should not have taken this dormant niggle out on you, but it was obviously not intended as to cause real offence to anyone.

tl;dr please don't play in traffic.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 21 Jan 2009, 19:29
Man, that sounds uncomfortable.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 23 Jan 2009, 01:25
Got my Libram of Renewal, Lv80 medallion, and Titanium Spellshock Ring in about two hours of gametime today.  Resilience is up to 318 and I'm closing in on 17,000 base HP.  It's been a good day.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jace on 23 Jan 2009, 02:31
Goddamn stupid panther mastery. I just wanna do quests and level up, and you just don't spawn for like 40 fucking minutes.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: masquerade on 23 Jan 2009, 08:46
Fuck all the mastery quests. Honestly.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: crohnsy on 23 Jan 2009, 09:21
Got my Libram of Renewal, Lv80 medallion, and Titanium Spellshock Ring in about two hours of gametime today.  Resilience is up to 318 and I'm closing in on 17,000 base HP.  It's been a good day.


yikes 17k  I'm a clothie with that in my pve gear..
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 23 Jan 2009, 09:32
From what I know, if you've got 17K health in cloth, you are probably doing something exceptionally wrong when it comes to gearing.

For the record, he said base HP, not armored HP.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: crohnsy on 23 Jan 2009, 10:09
From what I know, if you've got 17K health in cloth, you are probably doing something exceptionally wrong when it comes to gearing.

For the record, he said base HP, not armored HP.

my only guess is the pally is in blues and greens.  epics make your hp skyrocket.

With my imp out I am at 19.6 k hp

Warlock and that stat just comes on my gear  i also have 2150 spellpower  just about full 25 naxx epics.  but hey.  I must be doing something exceptionally wrong

and for the record it is his hp wth gear on  maybe not buffed  but im not buffed either.  raid buffed im quite abit higher
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 23 Jan 2009, 10:14
21 man raid buffed

(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3400/3220001729_758ef9a717_b.jpg)

34k, not bad for a warrior with no tier I guess.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 23 Jan 2009, 17:36
We did OS last night and the glove token dropped. I really really hate having to roll on things with DK's and rogues. We had three DK's, a rogue and me (only mage) in the party so damn did I have competition.

We also had druid heals, who rolled on that nice purple spirit trinket that drops in OS. DRUID HEALS ROLLING ON A SPIRIT TRINK. Made no sense to me. The raid was all "WTF? Priest heals need that, I vote he gets it" which is the way it went in the end. Druid had a big whinge about it too.

We also did VoA the night before and I ended up with a nice set of pants - pvp s5ish apparently. Spell power jumped a bunch after I got everything socketed. Now to get revered with Kirin Tor for the spell dagger, nice robes and the head enchant. Then I'll get the offhander from Emblems.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: crohnsy on 23 Jan 2009, 18:07
Spirit is an awesome stat for resto druids.  priests and druids that heal should be all over that trinket. 

Doesn't matter now anyways the patch broke it. doesnt proc from instant cast spells.  might be fixed by tuesday....
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 23 Jan 2009, 18:21
Why druids though? Druid heals are more heals over time aren't they? Priests don't have heals like that and really NEED the extra mana regen because they tear through it fairly quick.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: crohnsy on 23 Jan 2009, 18:35
talents for 15% more spirit  and also talents for 15% sp from spirit  also they may cast alot but spirit is a way better form of regen then mp5  in alot of cases. specially because of the way talents interact with spirit

while priests d spend alot of time dancing around the 5sr good druids make use of it aswell
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 23 Jan 2009, 20:05
The mage in my guild I do HC's with each nite (saintly) forbids anyone but healers rolling on mp5 gear, the way it should be tbh. The other casters have ways to get mana back, mp5 benefits healers more than any other role.

All I won from OS was the dragonhide bag (yay!) :-D

The dps meter shows hunters still kick ass (this was after 3.0.8), fourplusfive aka 9 is an awesoem beartank (and raid leader) who let me tank the boss which was 8 different kinds of awesome and maybe for the best as he could AoE tank the adds better, andras too since he is pally OT with the mega AoE threat building ability. 9 is happy with the changes to droodz, he has better AP and armour now.

As for bad rolls, the rolls in my guild follow rules which work when followed. Alot of the time if a bad roll is made the attitude is usually "We are doing this every week, it will drop again" or ticket a GM and get it sorted if it is a mega biggie.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 23 Jan 2009, 20:13
Ugh, yeah, I hope you guys weren't too harsh to that druid over it, since they actually do benefit quite a bit from spirit now. I mean, they have the two previously mentioned 15% talents, can Innervate themselves, and much of their mana comes from their 30% regen while casting talent. Druids are already rather mana efficient, but in a perverse way that's also why they prefer Spirit (which indirectly boosts their spell power as well as regen) to mp5 and pure regen boosters like the Blue Dragon card. A druid can't really ask for a more well-balanced healing trinket than the Majestic Dragon Figurine prior to clearing 25 man naxx.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 23 Jan 2009, 22:27
Druids have been Spirit users since TBC, but they're only just now seeing a lot of Spirit on their gear.  Did your raid miss the memo, or what?

MP5 gear is acceptable for Priests and Druids, great for Shamans, and completely fucking useless for Paladins.  Naturally, they put MP5 (which, by the way, is a very expensive stat) on the plate Salvation gear.  I swear to god I'm gonna stab someone if I ever visit Blizzard.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: crohnsy on 24 Jan 2009, 06:06
might be a good idea to apologize to that druid now. and tell your guild to learn whats important to each class before they start dictating who gets gear.

thats one downside to a loot council looting process bad players who have no clue what gear is good for different classes/specs
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 24 Jan 2009, 15:11
DKP is a good way to do it, people will only ever roll on stuff they need, smae with the crude lewd suicide kings game.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jace on 25 Jan 2009, 00:08
I started a Tauren warrior and got him up to like level 9 in 2 hours without ever playing horde previously. Why did nobody tell me that horde was so ridiculously easy compared to alliance. Also, I got like a shit ton of bags in the starting areas. WHEN DID THIS HAPPEN?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 25 Jan 2009, 05:31
And don't have anything with the fact that you are more experienced to do?
Cus can't say I have found either side "easier". The first 10 levels or so are quite easy either way.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 25 Jan 2009, 11:34
Plus, when's the last time you played a lowbie warrior? Warriors are also a lot better at low levels than they used to be thanks to all the tweaks that have been implemented over time. For a long time they didn't have much going for them besides mail and battle shout prior to level 10; they were rather like crappy paladins. I used rend mostly because I didn't have anything better to do. But now? Thanks to all the Rend buffs (particularly the scales with weapon damage bit), I've found that slapping rends on multiple mobs and rolling out some thunderclaps deals pretty nice damage. When it comes to handily dealing with multiple mobs, I've found that only warlocks can compete with warriors now prior to level 10.

Of course, this has less to do with difficulty and more to do with just exactly how many dumb risks you can get away with taking on your trip out of Elwynn. In the case of warriors, the answer is now quite a bit.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 25 Jan 2009, 12:25
DKP is a good way to do it, people will only ever roll on stuff they need, smae with the crude lewd suicide kings game.

DKP has always seemed hugely counter-productive to me, because if you're intent on progression, your tanks and healers should be getting priority on loot drops, if it's a healer-v-DPS situation (Grieving Spellblade in NX10 and The Turning Tide in NX25 are excellent examples of this.)

Either way, we don't use DKP and have never had any drama problems.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 25 Jan 2009, 12:45
I've never really agreed with the gear healers first approach when it comes to items that actually benefit each role equally, particularly since that just usually means the item has a big honkin' pile of spellpower on it and little else. Unlike with DPS, raw HPS throughput can more or less go to waste in some situations; as long as people aren't dying left and right, I'd rather work on improving dps than on making life a bit easier for the healers; if nothing else it lets you bull through troublesome phases that much quicker. Then again, I am biased; my guilds always took the brute force/as few healers as possible approach to raiding.


[EDIT] Man, I love WotlK gems, particularly when rolling a new character. Being able to waltz into the AH and cheaply pick up 3 plus 12 Agility gems to plunk into your Warden's Hauberk (http://www.wowwiki.com/Warden%27s_Hauberk) feels almost like cheating. 75 total Agility on your chestpiece without hitting 70 or even bothering to run an instance? Yes, please!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 27 Jan 2009, 00:34
Well, the general idea is that healers and tanks are absolutely crucial for any kind of progress in PvE.  DPS are certainly necessary, too, but DPS classes and specs tend to be a lot more common than healing and tanking specs - the idea being, that if you need DPS, it's usually not hard to find some, while quality healers and tanks aren't nearly as common.

That's becoming a little outdated with the changes Blizzard keeps adding to the game, but in general, I would still give first priority to healers and tanks.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 28 Jan 2009, 00:21
It's totally situational, on an enrage timer fight DPS is key, but on patchwerk the tanks and healers also need to be beasting. Youc annot just say "Gear healers first then DPS" since for alot of fights DPS is crucial but others can be done by a MT, OT and 3 healers but it will take you 20 times as long, these fights are not as dps intensive but you still want to finish up before healers end up OOM.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 28 Jan 2009, 03:55
Fact is, healers and tanks are what make or break any encounter in any PvE content in the game.  There are fights where DPS is the real poster child, but every fight needs good tanks, and good healers.  If your tanks can't take the hits and the healers can't heal the hits, your DPS is gonna get nowhere fast.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 28 Jan 2009, 10:36
What about OS? I tanked the 25 man HC while still crittable in no epix, just non HC bloos. The healing here could be done similarly but we needed to kick 3 DPS and replace them before we downed him.

THis is the kind of exception I speak of.

But yeah, gear tanks and healers first and all will be okay, the only time I can think of tank/dps toes stepping on is rogue/feraltank gear or maybe an offhand/tank wep when you get past needing def so you go for that rogue offhand that drops from that dragon dude.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 28 Jan 2009, 10:39
My argument isn't that healers don't need to be geared, it's that healers aren't so much more important than the DPS classes that items that equally benefit both necessarily have to go to the healers out of hand. A certain amount of healing output is a minimum requirement for handling an encounter, but once you've hit that you're golden; the only question becomes how long it needs to be sustained versus how long it can be sustained. At that point, there isn't much functional difference between higher dps and raw endurance, except the former has the advantage of helping the raid to beat enrage timers, bull through tough phases, quickly take down adds and to make raids shorter in general.

Honestly, I liked how my old guild handled it best, since it was basically classic compromise situation. The roster was basically set in stone and the vast majority of items basically went to whatever class benefited from the item the most with little prejudice as to class role. The only thing that we were adamant on was tier tokens, in which case set bonuses often acted as a sort of tiebreaker along with what alternatives would theoretically be soon available. Basically, if you've got a single piece of tier six and your class has a sweet two piece set bonus, then I'm afraid everyone else is probably SOL when another tier 6 token you're capable of using drops. Likewise if you're not going to use something right away because it'd break up a particularly sweet lower tier set bonus, than I'm afraid you're going to have to get back in line for a while regardless of how nice of a guy you are. For example, rogues tended to be favored over mages and resto druids in terms of tier 6 tokens because frankly, the druid & mage set bonuses were kind of stinky, 4 piece mage bonus aside. In exchange the other two were slightly favored when going after best-in-slot non-token drops. The only role that was really favored were the tanks, and even then that usually took care of itself, tokens aside. Even then the implications of the 4 piece Gronnstalker set gave people some pause.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: justlikeaphoto on 28 Jan 2009, 14:35
As far as I'm concerned tanks and healers shouldn't have priority over DPS.  All three play a role in every encounter and honestly, if you're raiding you should easily be geared well enough to take on any current end game content.  If you're fresh from constant Heroic and Emblem farming then you should easily be able to do 10 Man OS (and 25 Man OS) and most of 10 Man Naxx without a problem, regardless of your role.  The one issue that most guilds run into is they're hitting 80, maybe do a Heroic or two, and then think they're going to be able to MT Patchwerk or that their healers are going to have the endurance to last through Loatheb.

The way we do it in the guild I'm in is if you can use the loot you /roll.  End of story.  Now we all play on the honor system too, we expect our fellow players to factor in several variables before making a decision on if they're going to roll or not.  Depending on how big of an upgrade it is or if it has a role specific bonus (like a piece of MP5 gear, obviously meant for healers and not a DPS) helps a lot in deciding if someone should be rolling on it but generally if you can wear it / use it / benefit from it you can roll on it.

Of course there are some exceptions to the way we do things.  We try to make sure everyone gets a piece of loot as long as it's humanly possible.  If you win something you don't get to roll again UNLESS no one else wants it or can benefit from it.  In Naxx 10 you're going to have people getting multiple things.  Excluding Tier gear you're looking at roughly 30 pieces of loot on a full clear (this doesn't factor in BoE & BoP static’s or anything) plus four or possibly five Tier 7 tokens.  Everyone can roll on a piece of Tier gear if they fit the bill.  If you've one a piece of Tier gear, you don't get to roll on another in that instance (unless as before no one else can use it, which believe it or not does happen).  This system has worked very well for us and while I can understand the thought process behind gearing healers and tanks first I really don't see it as being a viable choice.  All three roles are needed for every encounter (except maybe Heigan, technically you can do that fight with just a tank and a healer since he doesn't have an enrage timer or anything else that would act as a faux one) and therefore all three of the roles should be on the same plane.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 28 Jan 2009, 23:06
The way we do it in the guild I'm in is if you can use the loot you /roll.  End of story.  Now we all play on the honor system too, we expect our fellow players to factor in several variables before making a decision on if they're going to roll or not.  Depending on how big of an upgrade it is or if it has a role specific bonus (like a piece of MP5 gear, obviously meant for healers and not a DPS) helps a lot in deciding if someone should be rolling on it but generally if you can wear it / use it / benefit from it you can roll on it.

It's how we do it as well.  I still think that healers and tanks should get priority, but since I've always been either a tank or a healer, I'm probably really fuckin biased :)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 29 Jan 2009, 09:48
Yeah, see, I've raided to some extent or another in all three roles and frankly, I found that gear was most limiting as a tank or DPS class. Being a tank is like being a li'l kid at the amusement park; there's a very clear "must be this tall to ride" requirement, so to speak. DPS is nice to gear up because they run under a more is always better mentality. As a healer though, I found that there was a fair bit of wiggle room gear wise as long as you knew what you were doing and coordinated with your other healers very well; I'm not saying their job is easy or anything, just that experienced healers with a good rapport with one another are often capable of doing ridiculous things provided they properly read up and prepare for an encounter. So, generally speaking, most fights that REALLY require you to have beastly stats on your healers are all-around gear checks anyway. For example, Brutallus was going to wreck your shit if you had undergeared players, period; he really didn't care who it was in your raid who sucked. Your tanks are Charmin Soft? That's a wipe. You need too many healers to keep everyone up and thus don't have enough dps classes? A wipe. Your tanks and healers are beasts but your dps sucks? Enrage timer and wipe.

Again, I'm not saying healers don't need or deserve good gear, just that once you have consistent attendance and quality players on board these things usually take care of themselves unless you're working on downing a boss with fairly specific requirements.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 29 Jan 2009, 16:34
As an aside from all this raid & gear talk, you know what I find annoying about WotLK?  The Burning Legion are supposed to be baddass, right?  Not sure why mobs and bosses in Northrend are more powerful than those in the Outworld.  Maybe the official answer has something to do with them being the minions of the Lich King and that he imbued them with some of his power or someshit, but seriously, come on.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 29 Jan 2009, 16:51
When you are in outlands everything is multiplied by 1000% but looks the same, so multiply all the values to what it would be in azeroth and your characters get this done when they go through the portal.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 29 Jan 2009, 17:13
Yeah, that's something that's always bugged me a bit too, to be honest. It's like how Ragnaros was supposedly a near apocalyptic level weapon of the Old Gods but for all practical purposes he's a wuss who would have been spanked like a bad monkey by Instructor Raz even before TBC ever came out. It's an unfortunate but likely unavoidable consequence of keeping the progression treadmill going.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: DavidGrohl on 29 Jan 2009, 20:30
  If anyone has one of those free friend trial cards, could you PM me a code, please?  Thanks!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 30 Jan 2009, 04:02
Get someone to send you a friend free trial that isn't a card, triple XP and a mount/free time etc.

If you wasnt an EU one PM me your email.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 30 Jan 2009, 17:51
My guild was offered a merger with some awesome guys in another guild. We took it and on our first day of being in guild, we ran Naxx10 with them. We did the military wing! It was fun and my first Naxx raid. After the first wipe we had, I threw up a table and everyone was all "ooooh!!!! A TABLE! Sweet! THANKS!" - apparently every mage they've had in their raid teams before has sucked ass. I felt pretty damn good. I felt even better when my chest piece token dropped and there were no rogues or DK's in the party to roll on it with me. Hello first piece of t7 :D
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: crohnsy on 30 Jan 2009, 18:12
grats  you should run the VoA 10man and heoric Im sure lots of people on your server pug it when you have wintergrasp.  Be rolling in T7.5 in no time
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 30 Jan 2009, 19:12
The guild has started doing 25 mans (well, like 3 weeks ago, doing VoA, OS and Naxx every week) so the group of 5 of us that 2-6 did HC's every day/nite have got 5 more people and we do 10 man naxx instead, is really good fun to do it without guild leaders and stuff. I got my tanking ring from the spider quarter and we downed patchwerk but both tanks died when he was on 7k hp :P luckily it was all ranged DPS and he died before reaching everyone else. Was awesome.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 30 Jan 2009, 19:52
grats  you should run the VoA 10man and heoric Im sure lots of people on your server pug it when you have wintergrasp.  Be rolling in T7.5 in no time

Yeah, I've picked up some PVP pants from there. We've done 10man OS too. Both were fun, and we are going to be doing more of them.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 31 Jan 2009, 02:08
OS is my favourite dragon fight.

IT'S SO MUCH AWESOME!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 31 Jan 2009, 04:10
3D on OS10 is not for the faint of heart.  So hard :(
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jace on 31 Jan 2009, 07:40
I keep coming into this thread, but I have no idea what any of it means. And I play the game.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 31 Jan 2009, 07:44
3D on OS10 is not for the faint of heart.  So hard :(
Hardest fight to do in the game atm. 3 dragons down is not hard, is easy as pie and alot of fun.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: crohnsy on 31 Jan 2009, 08:28
So I got Dying Curse last week in Naxx 25. now this week on patchwerk I led the way doing 6,072 dps over the 4minutes he was alive.  Next closest players were around 5000 dps. Fully raid buffed and when both my trinkets proc I have about 3900 spellpower  !

Armory here if anyone is interested.
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Blackrock&n=Unravelled
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 31 Jan 2009, 10:17
Pics or it didn't happen.
/me is jealous as a warrior tank who pushes 1200dps on patchwerk :(
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: justlikeaphoto on 03 Feb 2009, 12:17
I'm seeing no love for Malygos.  What is going on here?

And Three Drake OS is beyond insane.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: crohnsy on 03 Feb 2009, 12:31
I thought I ss'd it but cant find it.  So I don't know where it is.  think it was just a lucky fight  perfect buffs and lucky crits
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 04 Feb 2009, 00:37
Pics or it didn't happen.
/me is jealous as a warrior tank who pushes 1200dps on patchwerk :(

Our primary MT was breaking 2400 on Omen earlier today, and he's a warrior, too :(
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jace on 04 Feb 2009, 04:12
I don't know why, but whenever I go into a cave/building, my client starts to lag. Its not my internet connection, I run the game fine outside. It only ever lags when I go inside, and sometimes when I am using a vendor (very rarely though). Any idea what is causing this? Outside, even in towns, I can run around fine, but it seems that as soon as I put a ceiling above my character, the lag starts happening. It has led to me dying a couple times, and has also led me to be unable to finish quests that take place inside of a building. Also, I cannot do any instances since most of them at my level require me to go inside some place.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: justlikeaphoto on 04 Feb 2009, 05:35
Well that sounds just odd.

When you say Lag are you actually talking about latency (ping between you and the servers) or Video Lag (poor frame rates and performance)?

From what you've mentioned it doesn't sound like Video Lag (that's usually way worse when you're out in the world then it is inside buildings/caves) but I've never heard of ping spikes in interior locations (other then raid instances like Naxx and OS) but not exterior.

I know that pre-patch 3.0.8 there were horrible latency issues (especially in instances such as Naxx) that were supposed to be fixed (and post-patch 3.0.8a they appear to have been) however what you're describing (if it is ping related and you don't mean Video Lag) is just perplexing.

I thought I ss'd it but cant find it.  So I don't know where it is.  think it was just a lucky fight  perfect buffs and lucky crits

As for this, it'd be possible.  I've broken 4.5K DPS on 25 Man Naxx before on Patchwerk with my Affliction Warlock.  I've seen a Fury Warrior hit 6K on the same fight as well as a DK break 5K.

If it was a fight where some kind of DPS buff comes into play (such as Loatheb, Thadeus, Malygos) then you can run even higher.  In my 10 Man raiding group our Rogue, DK, Hunter, and myself (Warlock) pretty much run 3.5K consistantly on every fight (with the exception of fights like Heigan the Unclean).  However I never put a whole lot of stock into Damage Meters (Recount or otherwise) because they aren't terribly accurate nor do they display just how much of a role you played in the fight (IE like with Thadeus where movement and positioning is beyond important).  I gauge how well someone is performing on if they're still alive at the end of the fight and if not why they died.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jace on 04 Feb 2009, 07:22
I thought maybe my grafix were too high and it was rendering too much, too close. I turned them to the minimums and still I have the same issue indoors. It feels like video lag, basically, I can't do anything but if I activate spells they will still go through. Only indoors though. I have no idea whats up with this, but its very annoying. (I have still not been to ironforge yet
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: justlikeaphoto on 04 Feb 2009, 10:43
That's video lag but not in anyway I've ever heard of before.  So...

Without knowing much about your machine the only thing I can say is it sounds like a Driver issue.

Check with your graphic cards manufacturer's website and ensure you're running the latest drivers for your card.  If you aren't download and install the newest ones.  If that still doesn't fix the issue I have no idea.  WoW is a fairly rescource friendly game.  You don't need an uber PC to run it comfortably but if you're using a PC that has low RAM, an onboard graphics engine (integrated into the Motherboard rather then actually a seperate component, this is rather common in PCs that aren't specifically labled as Gaming Rigs, systems like e-Machines, HP, and lesser Dell & Gateway machines generally do this), or a slow processor it can cripple your experience.

HOWEVER, as I said before, your little problem isn't acting like the typical subpar PC issue (unless you were in like Shattrath City or Dalaran, then Video lag is pretty common).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jace on 04 Feb 2009, 12:34
It is probably my drivers I am betting. I had to use the previous version of the drivers when I had a graphics problem in City of Heroes, so I may just need to update them. I'll try that.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 04 Feb 2009, 12:58
Have you tried turning the new fancy ass shadow settings off? Rendering those things can be tricky for older GPUs plus they're the only real graphic upgrade WoW has recieved relatively recently, so it's worth looking into. I'd also try turning off the reverb effect and see if that helps; audio lag is pretty rare in modern computing, but then again, the echo effects are about the only thing I can think of that really depend on whether you're indoors or not. It's doubly worth looking into if you have a Creative Labs sound card; Blizzard used a middleware developer to create their own software audio solution, and it has a history of not always playing nice with hardware solutions.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jace on 04 Feb 2009, 14:02
When I said my graphics were the lowest, I have everything turned to the lowest setting pretty much. And all special effects are off. I'm guessing that it's the drivers, I'll update those tomorrow and try playing again.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 08 Feb 2009, 03:58
Driver update help?

Also I have been playing more and more often on boulderfist where a bunch of my friends play, they are all mega higher lv than me (lv 70 while I am 60) so I am stuck pugging as a broccoli and getting dicked by some DK/Pally/etc. whenever I walk out the instance, On avrage I get killed by some alliance player every 2 hours. When this happens I res and get on with it, if they camp I log my warrior on hellscream and do some BG's or dailys since as a restro drood I stand no chance at all in pvp (I am full restro in alot of cloth so cat/bear form will still suck), other than that it is a low pop server with a shit economy but my friends still insist it is by far better than Hellscream which is full to the point of a 2 minute wait once in a while (95% of the time it is straight in) with a really good bunch of people on it. What do you guys look for in a server? I like high pop PvE serverswith lots of lv 80's.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jace on 08 Feb 2009, 04:37
Didn't get the chance to update my drivers yet, but, I found a smokin deal on a new desktop, so... you know, I bought that. And it seems to run pretty well thus far, I'm just trying to get used to a widescreen instead of my normal aspect ratio. The upgrade added a gig of ram, and took me from a Nvidia 4400 to a 7800. Also I think the new one has a better processor too. It was a much needed upgrade.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 08 Feb 2009, 16:09
I like PvE servers, and seeing as I solo almost exclusively population size doesn't affect my gameplay all that much.  When I think about things other than immediate gameplay however I guess that a decent sized pop is good for AH activity, so a high pop server means more customers for my ore, which is a definite plus.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 08 Feb 2009, 17:14
Oh also, I have been taking a break from Outland questing.  I went back to Stormwind and Darnassus to do noob quests until I was Exalted with both.  That makes me exalted with SW, Darn and IF.  I am tossing up continuing this trend with the tentacle monsters.  I tried doing it with the Gnomes by going into Gnomeregan, but two things: 1. god dammit if that place isn't a goddawful clusterfuck of a place and 2. after unning the entire goddamn thing I am still only at 10k/21k Honored.  Is there some other easy way to get Exalted with Gnomes or am I stuck running around the fucking world finding a gnome here a gnome there and running quests for them?  I am trying to get all 5 Alliance factions Exalted to get the "Ambassador" title.  Ideally I would also love to become exalted with both Cenarius factions, but we'll see how my rep grinding stamina holds up.

Also, I have been going through all the lower-level dungeons to get the achievements for them.  It's pretty fun running through all these things and just smashing everything.  I've been using it as a chance to skill up all the weapons I am not very good with, so in addition to having fun and filling in my achievements it's also pretty useful.  I've got all the major melee weapons maxed (except staves, which I am pretty uninterested in) plus my throwing skill up to about 310/330 from 0 last week, so it's going pretty quickly.  Throwing is pretty good because I don't need to keep buying ammunition.  I only use it as a pulling tool, not a damage tool so I don't care what the damage is on it.

Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 08 Feb 2009, 17:58
Most of the time, and especially as fury for dps thrown has better bonuses for melee than guns/bows/crossbows and so warriors and rogues use throws weps so all warriors should be using thrown weapons unless you have a danm good reason not to (combat plated shotty etc.) and also staves are scarily popular for arms warriors as drood staves can be better than alot of other 2h weps as well as easier to get/slower speed for high top end hits.

As for killing noems, it's fun so keep it up :/
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 08 Feb 2009, 19:24
Yeah but I wish it was as easy as killing a bunch of leper gnomes and troggs in Gnomer to get faction :(  I've done all the Gnomeregan Exiles quests in IF and SW and I'm still only 10k Revered (not Honored as I thought before).  Apparently the best way to do it is to just go through all the little Alliance quests and keep getting as much rep as you can, because whatever rep you get with the Alliance races you get quarter that for with the other Alliance races.  So I guess if I go to the Exodar and do all the starting out quests there, then see where that leads me I will slowly but surely get there with both the tentacle monsters and the delicious little gnomes.

edit: apparently it's a quarter, not half.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 08 Feb 2009, 20:06
I just read an interesting article claiming that this build (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=LGMZhZVIzrxczibIzsGo) is very good to respec to once I hit 70, due to prot tanks being very fast to level using AoE grinding.  This page (http://www.wowconfidential.com/2008/12/19/warrior-70-80-leveling-spec-protection-talent-build) claims that you can take on 10-15 mobs at a time using Thunderclap and 51pt prot ability Shockwave to AoE them to death.

James, as a prot warrior do you think this is a viable option, or do you think maybe they are talking out their asses?

edit: If it looks viable I could probably respec to this asap so I can AoE the crap out of the early level quests I'm doing and rip through them more quickly.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 08 Feb 2009, 20:53
I'm talking out of my ass here, but 10-15 mobs without dipping below 90% health sounds like a bit of a stretch depending on your gear level; besides, simply tagging that many mobs can be kind of a pain in the ass in the first place depending on the zone (although, on second thought, I bet you could definitely do it with a wooly rhino or mammoth herd). The more practical question is "Can I AoE grind enough mobs for it to be worth the effort?" and I'd say the answer is definitely yes to that one; I've seen more than a few people do it and easily handling a half dozen mobs or so safely is always a nice trick to have in your pocket whether you really intend to use it or not. One bit of good news/bad news for you though; the trinket linked in that article isn't really available outside of the Brewfest event, but the Figurine of the Colossus is. (http://www.wowwiki.com/Figurine_of_the_Colossus). It's not that great of a trinket overall (Shield block rating is kind of a crappy stat), but the on use effect is tailor made for the aoe grinding multiple non-elites.


In other news, I am giddy that they are buffing Killing Spree for rogues. It's already pretty nice when combined with Blade Flurry for leveling, but at 80 I can totally see how it'd become an afterthought the second you can combine Adrenaline Rush or Focused Attacks with Fan of Knives. Hopefully they'll do enough with it that I won't completely forget about it once I decide to stop being a casual again.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 08 Feb 2009, 21:28
Well alright, I may give it a try.  I wish that Blizz would patch in the alternate spec changer thinger they have been talking about lately, that really would be tops about now.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 09 Feb 2009, 00:39
If you want me to summarise alot of tanking stuff for you to get the basics fast I will type it all up and pm you it, I would pretty much just be making all the shit on tankspot/tankingtips etc. a fast read with no bullshit. I can tell you the pros and cons of each tank build is good for each situation, like the build mentioned in your link is not great for what is trying to be done tbh but I don't want to kill this thread with megahuegwalloftexthitsyoufor100000physical(crit)youdie.

James, as a prot warrior do you think this is a viable option, or do you think maybe they are talking out their asses?
Very viable, keep shield block up and get as much str on your gear as possible and go apeshit on mobs. Instead of 15 mobs then a big downtime, with warbringer you should do 2-3 mobs then charge at another 2-3 mobs rinse repeat then when you get to 70% hit enraged regeneration, or for an added bonus try commanding shout/last stand/enraged regeneration, so say you have 20k hp as prot, you get over 2k from commanding shout then another 30% from last stand gets you ~28600hp then enraged regen gives you back 30% of THAT number as hp (8580hp) back so when you lose last stand you still get the stupid high regen rate giving you more like 45% of your hp back. Repeat this every 3-5 minutes and you should have zero downtime.

This is also what I do in arenas and duels (often with a trink popped) and it REALLY fucks your oponent off something aweful to see your hp creep back up at an alarming rate with no healer in sight.

As you are 66 atm, I might suggest starting here (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=LZhhZMIurxczibIzsGo) for solo play.

Shield block rating is kind of a crappy stat

NO.

IT IS AWESOME.

SHIELD SLAM.

END.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 09 Feb 2009, 01:51
I said shield block rating, not shield block value. Shield block rating is a very vanilla stat that only affects how often you block. It's an OK stat to help get you over the crushing blow hump, but it should be replaced with +defense or parry/dodge whenever possible. Shield block value enhancers, however, I have no beef with because yeah, they increase how much your shield slams hit for, increasing your aggro and general solo pwnage potential; that's why the good ol' Autoblocker is more of a dps/threat trinket than a mitigation tool. Hell, my former guild leader noticed that a lot of ZA gear had a bunch of block value on it and decided to stack the stuff for his threat set on farm nights. Throw in Impale and he could easily crit for around 2.5k in real play. Block value would be ideal for this li'l project, which is why I had planned on suggesting hitting the Borean Tundra and grabbing the Icechill Buckler (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=37521) at his earliest convenience. If there's such a thing as a "threat/dps" shield at that low of an ilevel in Warcraft, that one is it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 09 Feb 2009, 02:21
Yeah to be hoinest I never clicked any links until after I posted...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 09 Feb 2009, 02:24
It's cool; I always thought they should have come up with a better set of terms than block value and block rating anyway. Synonyms ftl.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 09 Feb 2009, 10:21
Also I just rewatched patchwerk from sunday nite, I was doing 1730dps so I wonder what I would be doing with agi ench on my sword... hmm. Top was the lock with 3871 followed closely by an unholy DK with 3703 (but there was another DK with 1603 so I dunno). I was 14th in a 25 man raid as MT on him, so I am pretty chuffed atm.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: crohnsy on 09 Feb 2009, 10:39
What enchant do you have on your weapon now?  were you taking hatefuls or just his normal hits? whats your tps?  I think thats a more important thing to be concerned about than dps.  Who were the  4 people you out damaged? I'm guessing the other two tanks and then 2 dps that are in greens?

I think the consensus for tanks is accuracy is the best choice for tanking but its not cheap.  titanium weapon chain and mongoose are next for the favourites.

oh also agility would be more for mitigation than upping your deeps
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Gemmwah on 09 Feb 2009, 10:57
Installation is the longest thing, guys. HATE.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Gemmwah on 09 Feb 2009, 10:58
HATE HATE HATE.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: justlikeaphoto on 09 Feb 2009, 11:13
Your DPS will get better with gear.  Our Frost DK MT runs about 2.5K on average (3K spikes in several encounters) in Naxx 10 (I myself run about 3K to 3.5K and up on my Warlock).  In Heroic Naxx you can only go up (as I mentioned in an earlier post, or at least I think I did, I was doing a 25 man Naxx run where a Fury Warrior was pushing over 6K).

But onto a different topic: I'm bummed out.  The guild I'm part of decided it'd be a good idea to merge with another guild.  Now while I'm all for making the jump into the 25 Man content more accessible (although there wasn't really an issue in the first place, we were doing content before the merger as two guilds rather then one) but the end result is less then desirable.  Perhaps it’s because I'm not really excited for change but I'd be lying if I said I'm enjoying myself.

Last night our 10 Man group from last week finished up Naxx and we moved on to jump in on a 25 Man.  Needless to say it went poorly.  It has nothing to do with the skill level, because everyone there is talented; it was (to put it bluntly) just a giant cluster-fuck of fail.  Other then being called out during the Four Horsemen encounter by a Paladin (because I'm sure he knows how to play my class better then me, which he demonstrated by his overall lack of knowledge on just how the spells I have available for self healing work) for not staying up while Drain Tanking in the back (and if you've done Sir Zelik on Heroic you already know that his spells hit for about 8K to 12K every two seconds, when you're a Warlock with about 22,000 HP that's half your life every two seconds) when he himself turns around and dies in the following attempt after the switch off.  Besides that there were multiple fucked attempts and false starts on Instructor Razuvious along with a horrible strategy for Gothik the Harvester.  Needless to say I was pretty irritated but that's neither here nor there.

The point I'm trying to get across is if you have a great guild, hold on to it.  If you're a GM, for the love of god, talk to your members.  I asked a few of my fellow guildies how they felt about the situation and every one I spoke with privately was nervous, adamant, or totally opposed the idea.  So why go along with it?  Because no one wants to be left out.  I have a strong feeling our GM didn't bother asking anyone other then possibly an officer or two when he decided to do this but that's his choice.  Do I agree with it?  Obviously not otherwise I wouldn't be sitting here bitching about it.
  
Take my advice and be a good GM, talk to your members as well as your officers.  I know a Guild doesn't equal a democracy but you should have some kind of idea on where your members sit before making rash decisions.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 09 Feb 2009, 11:36
What enchant do you have on your weapon now?  were you taking hatefuls or just his normal hits? whats your tps?  I think thats a more important thing to be concerned about than dps.  Who were the  4 people you out damaged? I'm guessing the other two tanks and then 2 dps that are in greens?

I think the consensus for tanks is accuracy is the best choice for tanking but its not cheap.  titanium weapon chain and mongoose are next for the favourites.

oh also agility would be more for mitigation than upping your deeps
Woah you said a mouthful, I just put 26 agi on hatestrike (my threat tanking sword) and it had no ench beforehand and I have titanium wep chain on red sword of courage (my "staying alive" sword). I outDPS'd 1 offtank (the pally) and a DPS dk in 3 pieces of 25 man naxx gear as well as inevitable defeat and alot of emblem gear, the rest bloos. I never looked lower than that.

My tps is not below 5k in the fight peaking at 7.5k and sitting just over 6k most of the time.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: crohnsy on 09 Feb 2009, 12:59
thats sounds pretty solid.  bummer for the dk, maybe hes got to figure out his rotations.  Your enchants are pretty set  I probably wouldn't bother with accuracy till LL comes your way. our main tank got it a couple weeks ago and damn its hot.  our mt gives me vigi and he never looks back on threat its nuts. I think hes in the 7k sustained range with spikes here and there depnding on how big my soulfire crits are.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 09 Feb 2009, 17:05
The DK is a DOÚCHE.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 09 Feb 2009, 17:41
I just rejigged my spec.  So many new toys to play with!

James, can you please gimme that quick PM summary you were talking about?  Probably not really a tanking tanking summary, but which abilities are the main ones I should spam and which are circumstantial, etc.  I respecced just before running into the Eredari noob area to run through low-level quests for rep, but predictably I haven't really been pushed hard enough to need to worry about what skills do what yet.  Oh, I am already really enjoying the shield spike against the low mobs I think?   Either that or Damage Shield working its magic, I guess!

At the moment I am guessing that against single-target doods I use Charge, spam Devastate, hit Revenge as it pops and Shield Slam if I have the rage available and need extra damage.  Situationals would include Shield Bashing healers, maybe Disarming mobs with big weapons.  For multiples I would probably uh, Charge, Thunderclap, start attacking one of them, manoeuvre into a good position and use Shockwave, Thunderclap again when it pops, same with Revenge.  Then do the HP mitigation stuff you talked about if/when it gets low.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 09 Feb 2009, 19:55
You got the basics nailed, I will write up full rotation pros/cons and talent breakdown's tomorrow, along with some gear you may want to look into for levelling and things all tanks should know for instances etc.

Will write it up in the morning or tonite if I get bored enough.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 09 Feb 2009, 20:19
Ok man, thanks for that.  I figure that if I can level effectively with this kind of build then from time to time I can also go run a PuG instance or something and slowly learn how to tank.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 09 Feb 2009, 20:27
Writing it up now as I camp this elusive bitch (http://www.wowhead.com/?npc=32491) in the corner of my eye.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 09 Feb 2009, 23:36
People that camp spawns for the Northern Exposure achievement or Time-Lost Proto Drake make me giggle.  I got Northern Exposure while doing my Frenzyheart dailies and sold the blue it dropped for 225g on top of the 18g that was in the bag it dropped.  I haven't found the drake yet (not that I really care to), but I'll wager it'll be the same way for me.  I may just sit and have it tapped and wait for Allies to come try and take it from me.

We use people that can heal themselves for 4H if we're not going for the achievement.  Last time it was me and a Holy Priest switching off between the chick and the white guy.  We switch at three stacks and do that the whole time.  The damage gets high at three stacks, but you have ample time to regenerate some MP while the other's debuff starts stacking on you.  Shadow Resistance helps on the chick, but there isn't too much you can do on the white guy except just grit your teeth and keep healing.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 10 Feb 2009, 01:11
Maaan I have been writing this shit for close to 6 hours...

I lied about a quick summary, this is gonna be a meaty read of tankdom.

Seriously though, fml I am tired.

[EDIT] F M L SERIOOUSDLSY

http://files.filefront.com/tankingdoc/;13256577;/fileinfo.html

Enjoy.

Warning- is 7 pages.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 10 Feb 2009, 03:15
Holy shit, man.  This is about 6.5 pages more than I expected it to be.  Thanks a lot for the tips, I'm gonna skim it tonight, but I'll print it out and read it properly tomorrow on the train.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 10 Feb 2009, 11:53
So my guild is now running 25 man Naxx on a regular basis, plus 10 Man Naxx, all the random ten and 25's, and starting to eye Maly. The guild master and I being the MT's for the guild are in basically every raid and its starting to really get fun. If you armory/be.imba me right now you will see my shitty dps gear, but my tanking set be.imba score is 448, should give you an idea.

Anyways, just wondering how you guys are doing and which bosses you are having the most fun on. I personally have only been 80 for a month but I am loving Sartharion +1/2D on ten man, Heigan the Unclean any time, and patchwerk for simplicity. I don't really like the boring fights (loatheb, Anub'Rhekan, Gluth) but I find Thaddius to straight up be a bitch. I never have problems but our dps wipes us every time /sigh.

One of these days I will finally kill KT and be able to do Maly (which i am far more than geared for). Until them, Thaddius is whats going on, lol.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: justlikeaphoto on 10 Feb 2009, 13:11
The best fight ever is Heigan the Unclean, it is so fun words can't describe.  I do have a lot of love for the simple fights like Patchwerk and Anub'Rhekan but I like some of the more complex encounters too (such as the Four Horsemen and Thaddius).

And speaking of Thaddius, where are you tanking him at and how are you moving during the charge changes?

Also, I just thought I'd note, Malygos is by far a more difficult encounter then Sapp and KT.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 10 Feb 2009, 15:25
Only one thing that sorta bugs me about those suggestions: "You should always be the group leader, if the healer or dps in your group doesn't understand that then you don't want them in your group, they are not astute enough to play the game and they don't know the rules." I mean, yes, as a tank you should absolutely know how the pull will go, so being assertive if you don't think everyone on the same page IS necessary. But at the end of the day, there's worse things in the world than letting the main assist/CCer set up the marks, particularly if they know the instance better than you do. You're the tank and you should definitely know how to do the marks in any given instance, but as long as it's getting done it's not really worth getting into a pissing match about it.

James covered an awful lot, so really I only have couple generic suggestions that are mostly 5 man related; bosses and raids are less likely to be tank 'n' spank affairs and thus follow their own rules.

1.  Always have an ideal tanking spot in mind, because in 5 man content adds are far more likely to get you killed than being sloppy with your abilities or making a goofy gear choice or two. One of the reasons James' and other tanks do things like "shoot a mob, walk backwards and then charge" is because it helps to keep the fight right in front of them and because they already have a "safe" spot in mind in order to avoid patrols. The more players and hostile mobs you have spread out over a large area, the easier it is to accidentally pull yet another mob into the fight, and getting adds is the quickest way to cause a wipe in all of WoW. Meanwhile having everything in a relatively small area* away from other mobs is a good idea because the melee gets to spend more time swinging and less time switching targets, the casters don't have to worry about casting range and fleeing mobs have to run farther before they can cause any mischief. And of course, you have an easier time keeping track of where everyone is in the room. Everybody wins.

2. Learn how/when to line-of-sight pull, since it helps you with my previous suggestion. Ranged mobs are often a pain in the ass because they like to just stand there in the middle of the room, threatening to attract other wandering mobs. In this case you may want to draw aggro and then turn a corner or run behind a pillar so that the mobs need to approach you before resuming their attacks. It's often unnecessary, but it's a good trick to keep in mind.

*You don't really want to pull mobs inside of melee range of the healers/ranged dps; that's a bit overkill particularly since many mobs have cleaves or AoE abilities like whirlwind. Just another good reason why it always pays to know what kind of mob abilities you have to put up with BEFORE you enter an instance.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 10 Feb 2009, 17:08
Damn, I cannot believe I forgot corner pulls :/ and I wrote that a few hours after doing HoS HC  :oops:

Another thing I left out was enchants, shoulda covered that as there are not many you need before lv 80.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 10 Feb 2009, 19:10
I am currently going through this doc you wrote up.  It's all making sense to me, so I guess that is a good start!  I am going through and reformatting and editing bits as I go because I am a god-damned pedant (and because it helps me absorb the info better).  Once I have finished I'm gonna upload it someplace and PM the link to you if you're interested, James.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 10 Feb 2009, 20:05
Damn, I cannot believe I forgot corner pulls :/ and I wrote that a few hours after doing HoS HC  :oops:

Heh, it's so easy to leave things out. I couldn't teach a rogue to dps if my life depended on it; back when I was raiding I'm pretty sure my brainstem ranked "refresh slice and dice" slightly ahead of "continue to breathe" on the vital priorities queue. After a while you just don't think about things anymore.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 11 Feb 2009, 14:02
Hah, i was the same way back when shield-block was part of your gear, not a sub-par oh shit button.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 13 Feb 2009, 00:14
http://www.wow-europe.com/en/info/underdev/dualspec.html

Worth posting...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 13 Feb 2009, 03:29
Yeah, it's been on mmo-champion for a few days now.  The one-time cost will be a useful goldsink, and it'll pay for itself within a month for most folks.  I respec twice a week at 50g a pop for arenas, so that's 100g a week.  If I was swapping between Holy and Protection, you'd also factor in cost of replacing glyphs (which would quickly become very expensive.)  Also time spent re-arranging actionbars, though this is less of a problem than you'd think with UI mods.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jace on 14 Feb 2009, 09:13
Screw you Fozruk, why don't you show up where questhelper says you'll be?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 14 Feb 2009, 13:32
He's a roving mob. QuestHelper is useless with most giants since they have an extremely wide wandering radius. You're better off checking WoWhead for his path.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 14 Feb 2009, 13:39
Yeah, I would imagine that questhelper cannot do any better than providing a spawn point in such a case.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 14 Feb 2009, 13:47
I'm not sure if it's questhelper or some other mod doing it, but when I keep my mouse pointer over the icon shown on the map created by questhelper it will show and area where the mob(s) have been killed. That way you can see wanderingpaths as well.
But I use arkiveUI so might just be some other addon.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 14 Feb 2009, 14:13
I wouldn't really know; I don't use Quest Helper. But, really, about all the mods you're talking about really could do is archive information from contributors or sites like wowhead. Personally, I'd rather they just stick to confirmed spawn points since "killed here" locations are often skewed by kiting and the like. YMMV depending on the mob involved and the sample sizes used, I suppose.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jace on 14 Feb 2009, 14:32
I know his wander path, its just that when I go along that path, I cannot find him. I am wondering if either he stops wandering at one point and stands around, or he despawns when he gets to the end. I can't even find his corpse, so I'm certain that it isn't someone else killing him before I get there.

Fuck you, wandering mobs.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 14 Feb 2009, 18:35
Guys we should start up the QC guild again. No one's been on in 3 months (including me). Or maybe we can start fresh on a new server?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 15 Feb 2009, 05:38
Man this game has some real dickheads who overreact at the drop of a hat and are very rude :/
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 15 Feb 2009, 13:19
I think WoW has a pretty decent mean-to-friendly ratio, but its popularity works against it. There's always enough people logged in at any one given time that there's bound to be somebody out there threatening to shit up trade chat. In the last 3 months I've been playing there's really only been one guy I'd call a shithead.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 15 Feb 2009, 18:36
Loads of awesome people, a bunch of idiots who try hard so you gotta be nice to them, then there is a handful of shitheads who should be k lined.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: TheViscount on 15 Feb 2009, 23:02
I USED to play on Stormreaver pre-bc, then Dalvengyr and then Illidan. Horde. Always end-game. Anyone else?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 17 Feb 2009, 00:02
Man this game has some real dickheads who overreact at the drop of a hat and are very rude :/

We've been weeding a handful of those out of our guild in the past couple of weeks.  I'm not quite sure how they got in.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 17 Feb 2009, 01:08
I got exalted with all five Alliance races recently, ending my Alliance rep grinding.  The hardest to get was the Gnomeregan Exiles, so to commemorate that I've grabbed a robot chicken to ride about on.  It's pretty tops.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 17 Feb 2009, 01:22
My paladin finally turned 80 yesterday (CET time). Horay for him!
Now is the question what gear and where it is. Turns out he's going protection again (guild need).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 17 Feb 2009, 04:23
My paladin finally turned 80 yesterday (CET time). Horay for him!
Now is the question what gear and where it is. Turns out he's going protection again (guild need).
Run HC's pug, shield from CoS, Pants from VH, Sword from UP, rep gloves from Kirin'Tor trink from normal HoL, ring from that place with the huuuuuuge dinosaur, belt from Azjol-Nerub, crafted boots and helm... some other junk and you're done.

If in doubt, tempered saronite crsfted stuff gets you def capped for not alot of gold.

Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 17 Feb 2009, 04:41
Quote
saronite crs[a]fted
Ty for that. Shortens my search a little. Will most likely have most of that stuff made.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 17 Feb 2009, 08:08
trink from normal HoL (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=36993)

important one, also http://www.wowhead.com/?item=36984 until you can do HC UP easily (the Gauntlet can be a bitch)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 17 Feb 2009, 14:58
So so, I just thought I'd report that I am enjoying the Prot respec so far.  With a couple of cheap AH purchases plus a relatively expensive Crystalblade of the Draenei (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=31234) I rejigged my gear enough to give me another ~2k hp, so that coupled with the higher armour level leaves me feeling far less fragile.  My DPS has taken a hit, but not as big a hit as I expected it to.  I have a feeling I am still straddling between Fury and Prot gear at the moment, and to be honest I am a-ok with that because I still need decent DPS while soloing.

I am still learning the flow of battle using the new skillset, but the overall feel is good.  I'll generally throw something at one mob, then charge past a second mob toward a third if possible.  Once they're all in range I'll Thunder Clap, Cleave, then by that point Revenge will maybe pop, so I'll hit that and play it by ear.  Devastate a few times if the target isn't too squishy, Heroic Strike to dump Rage, Shield Bash to stun casters, Shield Slam if Sword and Board procs (or if I have Rage to burn) and Concussion Blow when I feel like smacking the crap out of people.  If I have enough Rage at the start of the fight I'll usually also Shockwave.  It feels like I have a bigger bag of tricks than when I was playing Fury, and I haven't even started getting to the point where I need to hit Last Stand yet.

I grouped with a Mage last night.  He seemed kind of quiet and unsure of things, I got the impression that he was a young dude.  I learned a little more from grouping with him, though.  I was very quick to map Taunt to an easily-accessible hotkey, because he seemed to like mana burning.  He would go OOM a lot, which shows me he was maybe trying a bit too hard.  I have a feeling this was due to a lack of communication, because as I said, he was pretty quiet and I didn't really talk to him all that much either because we were just questing.  In hindsight I probably should have told him that 3 mobs wasn't a big deal and that he didn't need to do quite so much as he thought.  He could probably have stood back and cast Blizzard or some kind of AE fire spell and we'd have done fine.  A couple of times he did some kind of knockback AE that would piss me off, as I would invariably be about to Thunder Clap at that same moment.  Point is though, I think I am going to try to group a bit more even while questing, because that short time with a squishy party member to keep mobs off of taught me a bit more about managing aggro and good ways to keep mobs focused on myself rather than my team-mate.  Will need to feel pretty confident with that sort of thing before I venture into instances.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 17 Feb 2009, 17:30
Will need to feel pretty confident with that sort of thing before I venture into instances.

Start now, seriously you need to tank asap. No point in starting at 80 so the sooner the better, I was tanking all outlands instances arms fury so there is no reason for a full prot warrior not to be able to do it regardless of skill or experience, it is honestly the only way you will get better as solo play is nothing like 5man or raid. Other than that try not to shockwave at the start of a fight, even if you have rage to burn because you will get rage starved from a TC/Cleave/Dev before they stop being stunned. You need to be getting hit to get rage, bottom line.

Rage is fucked anyway, http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=14990466279&pageNo=1&sid=1#19

Good discussion on what it is from some person off tankspot. I have sick evasion with my new shield (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Hellscream&n=Melville hero's surrender, logged with it on) but this means until you get rage from dodges I am gonna be rage starved as you only get rage as
Quote
Currently, the formula for rage intake is R = 2.5D/C, where C is 320.6 at level 80. That gives us 4 rage for a 500 point hit, 8 rage for a 1k hit, 47 rage for a 6k hit, and 156 rage for a 20k hit. This is where the main problem is. You're either on fumes or you're always full.
which sucks for offtanks, 5mans and even fights where the MT only gets hit once every few seconds. It is not scalable for 5mans since you take tiny hits in comparison so you never really get over 50 rage and it sucks balls. 24 rage for a 3k hit? That's enough for 1 HS+devastate. Not enough when you only have 1 healer and most of the time you are getting hit for 300-400 dmg.

I pulled 1900dps on patchwerk 4 hours ago, when I trinked for his 5% enrage I got rage starved, like fully rage starved because he could not hit me at all. If it was not for vigilance on the bear next to me, I would not have so much of a threat header and it could have caused some major issues, maybe not a wipe but certainly some deaths and panic.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 17 Feb 2009, 20:27
So, I jumped ship from the guild we merged with. I don't know whether I posted the story here or not, but basically, they downed NAXX10 due to the help from our members for the first time, so they decide that they would do OS with three drakes up. Uh... wtf?! You just don't do that. Seriously, half the 10man group hadn't even been OS before. When we mentioned it, we were apparently discouraging the guild and whatever. On top of that I only got a chance to go Military Quarter + Sap + KT because they were dps heavy and rotated everyone out each raid night.

So I jumped ship and am now in a super awesome guild who have NAXX25 on farm.

New raid week this week and we are hitting up Maly (for the third night in the row, that last phase on the drakes got us every time. We had him down to 6% on one try) and then wiping NAXX again.

So I've pretty much done the entire NAXX25 before I got to finish NAXX10. It makes a huge difference when a guild actually knows what they are doing.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 17 Feb 2009, 21:38
I'm not really surprised you jumped ship. I mean, it was a guild in which you said a couple of people were like "Zomg, you has table!" after a wipe. Reagents are kind of a pain in the butt, and I hate how they take up inventory space, but honestly. Were the other mages they bumped into dumb or just that cheap? If they were that cheap, I'd shudder to think of how they'd react to having to get geared up for an old-school resistance fight like Rag or Mother.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 17 Feb 2009, 22:46
Don't forget to pick up Essence of Gossamer from H-AN off Hadronox.  The proc isn't very useful for raiding, but it's really tough to beat +111 STA on a trinket slot.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 18 Feb 2009, 00:57
3 drakes is harder on 10 man than 25 man because of the number of tanks needed and .'. the lack of DPS meaning the drakes stay up longer and you normally don't want to have more than 1 alive at a time for the debuff.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 18 Feb 2009, 23:32
Bloodlust and Divine Guardian are damned near required for OS10+3, along with excellent gear; most everyone should be rocking ilvl 213 and ilvl 226 gear if at all possible, and you basically have to have a DK tanking Sartharion; people sporting Of the Nightfall are not people to be taken lightly ;)  On the other hand, OS10+1 is pretty simple, and OS10+2 isn't too hard (though having Divine Guardian and Bloodlust helps a ton.)

I love listening to people try and tell me that ganking, griefing, and camping isn't PvP because it doesn't conform to their ideas of "fair, honorable combat."  I just call them a scrub, refer them to Sirlin, and chuckle  :laugh:

Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 18 Feb 2009, 23:59
Ganking (lowbies) is bullying. Combat is by deffenition not fair on the other hand. (Youd be stubid to leave half of your tricks at home just becaus it's going to be "fair".)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 19 Feb 2009, 14:08
Man, what the fuck.  Ganking, griefing and camping can be classed as "PvP", sure.  It's still a fucking dick thing to do.  You can called someone a scrub and chuckle as much as you want, you're still being a fucking cunt.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 19 Feb 2009, 15:43
First rule of freedom: You can do what you want, but everyone else is still free to dislike you for it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 19 Feb 2009, 18:16
So arena tournament eh?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: PizzaSHARK on 20 Feb 2009, 01:03
Man, what the fuck.  Ganking, griefing and camping can be classed as "PvP", sure.  It's still a fucking dick thing to do.  You can called someone a scrub and chuckle as much as you want, you're still being a fucking cunt.

Your opinion, not mine.  If they can't handle it, they can transfer to a PvE server.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 20 Feb 2009, 06:11
If they don't like people acting like a fucking jerk to them they can go somewhere else?  People like you are what's wrong with multiplayer gaming.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 20 Feb 2009, 13:51
So, I got mocked today by an 80 DK for having a rogue as my main, despite the fact that the guy was a DPS Blood spec and couldn't push over 1k dps.

To put that into perspective, I was pushing around 1k dps at level 75 in quest greens despite being specd like this (http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/rogue/talents.html?tal=32500000500000000000000000002503521000350102231005212510000000000000000000000000000) for leveling.

I mean, I'm not an elitist by any means; I'm an outright casual these days. But if you can't push 1k dps at level 80 while specd for raw DPS, you should do us all a favor and throw your computer out the window right now.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cartilage Head on 20 Feb 2009, 16:26
More like World of BOREcraft.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 24 Feb 2009, 11:48
Undocumented 3.1 mount details (http://www.wowinsider.com/2009/02/24/new-pets-and-mounts-found-in-the-3-1-files/#continued).

...aquatic mount? Interesting...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Ozymandias on 24 Feb 2009, 11:58
"Mimiron's Head - Summons and dismisses a rideable mechanical gnome head."

...what?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 24 Feb 2009, 12:18
"Mimiron's Head - Summons and dismisses a rideable mechanical gnome head."

...what?
Wat?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 24 Feb 2009, 12:53
Apparently it flies.


I'm as confused as anyone, really.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 24 Feb 2009, 18:29
At 310% speed so I am guessing a rare as shit drop tbh.

Most epic flight mounts are 280% but the merciless arena drakes and shit do 310% as does the pheonix one from that thing blah blahbjl;ajdknaxxtonitewasgash.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 24 Feb 2009, 18:51
I think that someone in the comments for that page hit on the most possible scenario. Mimiron (http://www.wowwiki.com/Mimiron) is probably gonna be a mechanical boss from Ulduar.  Alternatively, his name appears as the creator of the Voltron weapons platform robot, so maybe it's actually the head of that thing?  Not sure that the Flame Leviathan is gonna ne a gnomish head, though.  Would make more sense for Mimiron to be a giant gnomish robot (son of, or built in the image of Mimir (http://www.wowwiki.com/Mimir), perhaps?)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 25 Feb 2009, 22:08
"We are also looking at granting rage when the warrior blocks, dodges or parries." (http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=14990472390&sid=1)

Yessssssssssssssssssssssssssss.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: TheViscount on 25 Feb 2009, 22:27
"We are also looking at granting rage when the warrior blocks, dodges or parries." (http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=14990472390&sid=1)

Yessssssssssssssssssssssssssss.

You know when that would have been good?

Pre-bc Naxx. Ffs.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 26 Feb 2009, 05:59
We mighty bears already get that. Old news.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 26 Feb 2009, 17:25
I hit 68 last week then went over to Northrend to do quests.  As a result I am now 70 and kitted out (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Dath%27Remar&n=Hadron) in close to full WotLK starter greens better than most other stuff I could find on the AH, giving me about 11k hp, close to 13% dodge, almost 10% parry and almost 9% block, plus 11.9k AC - enough that 53% of damage is mitigated.  However, I've been taking a look around at other prot Warriors my level and found that I still have a way to go.  A level 71 Warrior I saw had 15k hp, 24% dodge, 16% parry, 17% block and about 17k AC giving him 60% mitigation.  I'll be checking out some gear upgrade recommendations today & making plans for questing/dungeon runs.

Despite not stacking up against other Warriors my level I find I am able to solo really well and the only time I miss my Fury spec is when I see a Rogue or dual-wielding Warrior ripping shit up near me.  When this happens I usually go pull a handful of mobs onto myself, then I feel better.  One thing I am noticing though is that at some point in the future I will probably respec to remove the point I put into Heroic Strike.  I am basically swimming in Rage at the moment, as well as only really using HS after Revenge when it's free unless I am dumping excess.  In addition, the 1 rage that point saves me is hardly worth it compared to say, 1% more parry, 1% more crit, or 1% more block plus 20% more chance to generate 2 rage on a block.

I've now come back to Outland to continue/finish off my questing, and I only just last night realised that I could train/buy a flying mount now if I had the money to do so, so I guess it's time to grind out some gold.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 26 Feb 2009, 17:37
Yeah, I like Northrend much better than I ever cared for Outland. I think having two different potential starting points helped a lot, as it saved on a lot of the major pain in the ass caused by everyone grinding in Hellfire Peninsula at once giving absolutely zero opportunity to actually kill any spawns you needed. That aside, the gear is so easy to come by early on. I'm still using the staff I picked up at level 73 because it's really one of the better feral Druid staves you can get short of instances. Northrend is also a skinner's dream. So much crap to pick up.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 26 Feb 2009, 17:41
I need to figure out what the most lucrative easy skinning stuff is, go grind that for a bit and dump it on the AH.  At the moment mining isn't paying off as much as it used to because I think that the shine of chasing after nodes has worn off.  With skinning it's easier because hey, I am already murdering things, why not skin them also while I am here?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 26 Feb 2009, 20:31
Hearth in thirty minutes or your pizza's free! (http://www.wowinsider.com/2009/02/26/hearthstones-down-to-30-minute-cooldown-in-3-1/)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 26 Feb 2009, 21:04
Seriously, I love being a mage so hard because of portals. It makes my life so much easier. Also the gold is a bonus - I've had people pay me crazy amounts of gold to port to one city, meet them, port them back somewhere else.

In other news - 25NAXX on farm oh yes. I have my t7.5 shoulders, pants and gloves (25NAXX) and my t7 robe (10NAXX).

Also, the new weapons from ulduar look awesome, seriously.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 26 Feb 2009, 23:18
Nvm, I was wrong.

But HS CD 30 min is... meh. [irony]Teleport to anywhere for free is the way to go.[/irony]
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 27 Feb 2009, 04:39
I disagree.  Travel from one side of the world needs to take an appreciable amount of time or else the player loses respect for the size of the game world.  In my opinion the quick travel in Guild Wars made the world seem smaller and less impressive than it should have been, for example.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 27 Feb 2009, 09:01
By the sound of your prior post, I'll assume you haven't spent much time in Northrend yet, but you have to have at least spent plenty of time in Outland.

The novelty of how huge the game world is stops being a novelty and starts becoming a hindrance once you get to Outland, especially for Horde. When I was in Outland, if I wanted to do something in Azeroth, I had to go to Shat, port back and then either pay some Mage like ten gold to port me back to Shattrath or spend ten to twenty minutes getting back. That's ten to twenty minutes I'm spending running/flying and riding and waiting for zeppelins that I could be spending actually enjoying the game (Game being the operative word, not a chore). For Horde, this often meant flying all the way back to Shat from Netherstorm or Shadowmoon (Which is like six or seven minutes on its own) then porting to a Horde city to fly to wherever it is I had to be, then back to Orgrimmar or Undercity and from there (Depending on which) either flying ten minutes from Undercity to the dark portal or waiting a few minutes for the zeppelin and then riding said zeppelin before even being able to do that much.

And it's not much better in Northrend. If I'm down in Azeroth, I have to travel to Undercity or Orgrimmar and then travel all the way back to Borean Tundra or Howling Fjord, which then resulted in a ten minute or so flight to wherever I had to be.

Bear in mind, I could use a bank alt to do my auctioneering and such, but the grind from 58 to 80 becomes a huge pain in the ass due to having to travel back to Azeroth to train because there are no class trainers in Outland or Northrend. I've had points where I wasn't sure if it would take more time to just wait out my hearth or actively travel. The hearth cooldown is something that should've been done when the Burning Crusade first dropped. It's either this or add an AH and a full array of class trainers to Shattrath and Dalaran (And that still doesn't account for levels 68 through 74, where you can access Northrend but can't get to Dalaran without a mage).

I've heard people say it's an "easy" matter to manage your hearth cooldown, but it's really not. Not when you're questing in Sholozar Basin or Grizzly Hills, where you have to travel a pain in the ass distance to get back to Dalaran to port or travel a slightly less pain in the ass distance to Borean Tundra or Howling Fjord only to have to catch a boat or zeppelin back to Azeroth.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 27 Feb 2009, 10:10
est the lv 71 tank had more than likely been a MT in a raiding guild at 70 so he will have sick tanking gear. One or two tank trinks and pieces I had I did not replace until high 70's so don't worry.

Also you willl have 3-4 setf of tank gear, not full sets but pieces you swap in for boss fights/trash/5man/pvp for shield block or dodge or whatever. It gets annoying but is useful when you have 2 of most slots item lv 213 stuff  :-D

Example being having 25% dodge in a 5 man HC when you are fully naxx 25 man geared is bad since you dodge too much and get rage starved lose aggro and wipe. The fix to rage when dodging has been spoken about for ages but I do not know when it is coming.

I got over 30khp unbuffed in my 10man and trash gear :D 33  is pretty much the best tanks get atm.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 27 Feb 2009, 18:09
Jon, I guess I can see where you are coming from, but for me it's not that big a deal to jump on a gryphon headed to Shattrath, then go off to the bathroom or make a cup of tea or something.  By the time I am back I can mount up and run through the portal, go train or AH or whatever, then hearth back to Shattrath and gryphon back to where I was.  If my HS isn't up yet I just grind or quest until it is.  If I'm running our of space in my bags I'll mail shit to an alt at the nearest town.  At the moment it is getting kind of fiddly for me due to me straddling three places (ie: Original, Outland & Northrend) but I am gonna concentrate on getting Outland done first.

To be honest I think that the amount of running around has seemed to decrease for me in Northrend.  The areas are pretty big, but they have flight paths all over the joint and a handful of different quest hubs in each zone, so it seems like there is a hell of a lot to do in each area.  As a result I started out mis-reading your post and thought that you were talking to Jens, and was surprised when I realised you were saying the opposite thing.

James, he was, but I like to hold myself to a high standard.  The fact is that I could have that kind of gear, so it is my fault for playing the way I do instead of the way that would get me that kind of gear.  Also, even if I was doing PvP or running PUG instances I'd be getting gear that is better than mine, so I am trying to incite myself to get cracking on that.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 27 Feb 2009, 18:55
In all honesty there is no point, not as many people do the raids he did for those items and he will have spent MONTHS getting it all to be replacing it now, it's not much fun doing old content with a bunch of PUG's, you will replace it all so don't worry about getting it, focus on getting to 80 and fuck your gear, it just gets in the way.

Get xp now, and gear when you hit 80.

It's all about the endgame which will blow your fucking mind.

You done many pug's atm? don't bother with HC 70's just do the nexus and utguard keep tbh  :-D
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: crohnsy on 02 Mar 2009, 06:37
In all honesty there is no point, not as many people do the raids he did for those items and he will have spent MONTHS getting it all to be replacing it now, it's not much fun doing old content with a bunch of PUG's, you will replace it all so don't worry about getting it, focus on getting to 80 and fuck your gear, it just gets in the way.

Get xp now, and gear when you hit 80.

It's all about the endgame which will blow your fucking mind.

You done many pug's atm? don't bother with HC 70's just do the nexus and utguard keep tbh  :-D

agreed  you are wasting your time. get to 80- asap and then the gear will come and also you can go back and do allt he quests you missed for tons of gold. then buy your epic flyer and cold weather flying and you'll be set.  that is until you decide you want the 310% flyer  ^^
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 02 Mar 2009, 10:35
I think it's a bit much to say he's wasting his time; he's a relatively inexperienced player so much of the 70s content is just as new to him as any of the 80s content, so there's definitely some fun to be had from an Azeroth-Outland world tour. Basically, raiding is other oriented and solo play is self-oriented. I like raiding because I like meeting goals and keeping up with the Joneses. But if you're just interested in puttering around and seeing the gameworld, then nobody's interests but your own should matter. Granted, I myself have been skipping pre-80 instances on my rogue, but that's mostly because it's a case of been there done that. That said, yes, if you're worreid about gear quality the most time efficient thing to do is hit 80 and work from there.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 02 Mar 2009, 17:04
Well, at the moment I am just tooling about, having fun.  Was in Terokkar earlier but ran out of quests.  I went down into Shadowmoon Valley after that but it wasn't as fun for me at the time.  I'll think about heading back there after I've finished up my tour of the verdant fields of Nagrand.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 02 Mar 2009, 17:22
Yeah but unless you have the most understanding guild ever there is no way you will get a competant group for a 70 hc or raid. It won't be so much fun with a group of 80's going fro the achievement.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 04 Mar 2009, 18:09
I did a real live instance last night.

Well, not really actually.  I did a portion of Dire Maul with some random dude because I found a Warrior-only book on the AH that I got curious about.  The resulting trinket was kind of boring, but whatever, it was a lark.

After that I went fishing.  With Alt-Z, some sort of fishing buddy add-on and in the right spot it is surprisingly soothing.  It would almost be enough to convince me to take up fishing for real, but I am deathly afraid of fish hooks and not very partial to waking up at the crack of dawn to stand near water.

Anyway, my cooking is at 375 at the moment, waiting for me to train it to the next level, my first aid is currently just above 400, so fishing (at about 165?) is letting the side down.  I am pretty sure I want to get both the Chef and Salty titles if I can, because I love all this useless shit.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 04 Mar 2009, 19:39
I wouldn't want to stand near water if I lived in Australia either. I'd be afraid a fifty foot tall dingo with gills would jump out at me or something.

I've been running classic instances lately too. On my level 80...

I wanted the achievements, but fuck if I wanted to legitimately work for them. Of all of them, though, Wailing Caverns was easily one of the biggest pains in my ass. Only the Blackrock Depths and lower spire were worse.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 04 Mar 2009, 19:50
I hate BRS. I used to hang around in there before MC/BWL raids; I would solo Pyromancers in the hopes of getting the Greater Fire Protection recipe to drop. Never did get the damn thing; by the time I saw one on the AH we already had Rag on farm with minimal buffs.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 04 Mar 2009, 20:06
That is what I had been doing a little while ago while skilling up the weapons I had neglected.  I had used 1h axes for the longest time, so most of my other weapons were lacking.  I put together a cache of weapons to practice with while doing noob area quests for rep, then to break up the monotony of smacking the bejesus out of low-level mobs in the great outdoors I'd venture into the low-level instances I'd skipped and beat the snot out of those guys too.  It's pretty amusing hearing the boss of an instance gloating over how dead he's going to make you, then ripping him and his lackeys apart in a few seconds.

Doing this kind of stuff is also a good break from "serious" levelling, because it's a bit of a romp, really.  Tonight I am probably gonna hit 225ish fishing and head over to Theramore to talk to Nat Pagle about some fish.  Hopefully by the time 2-4pm Sunday PST rolls around I'll have enough skill to participate in the Stranglethorn Fishing Extravaganza thinger, which will be pretty fun.  (actually, fucking hell scratch that - Sunday 2-4pm server time is Monday 9-11am Sydney time, and I can hardly tell the boss "hey, sorry man, gonna be in late Monday morning - got me some virtual fishing to do."  Fucking fuckers)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 04 Mar 2009, 21:00
Oh man fishing, bs maxed, mining maxed, cooking 2 points off maxed, first aid maxed, fishing about 200.

It's the most boring thing ever, fucking hate it but I need it to cook raid food /sigh.

Oh and a trink dropped for me last nite after naxx when I was mining to sell ore for epic flying lessons... flew over to a node at a quarry in storm peaks and started hitting it before 3 mobs came and ate me, stunned them all with shockwave and mined then realised I was still in combat so could not mount and fly away, killed them and looted... second best healing trink in the game is now on hellscream AH for 9k bid or 14k b/o

Need to sell it before it loses value on release of Uldar etc, some servers it goes for 20k but on mine it's 10-14k (some servers is 3-4k) but some lucky rich drood might make me happy.

http://www.wowhead.com/?item=37835
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 04 Mar 2009, 21:07
Oh man, so.  Dire Maul last night, right?  I helped the random dude kill some kind of big tree man, but we didn't realise that you have to clear the front hall first, so a whole shitload of other trees came charging in when the guy was at about a quarter health.  The other dude died pretty quickly, but I managed to finish killing the main guy then survive for about 30 seconds longer with the entirety of the front hall trying to beat on me.  I couldn't do much due to them practically stun-locking me (which I have to do something about if I can, srsly) but for how many of them there were it took them a rather long time to kill me, so I guess I can take small comfort from that, heh.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 05 Mar 2009, 00:37
other than speccing pvp stylee for reduced stun duration (and meta gem too) nothing you can do about stun locks apart from trinking...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 05 Mar 2009, 01:50
After posting that I realised I hadn't hit Iron Will in my current build yet, so I am guessing it'll become less pronounced.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 05 Mar 2009, 11:02
Man, that happened to me like a week or two ago when I ran Dire Maul. I'd never run a single instance until I started running the low levels solo for the achievements. I managed to run through BRD and Lower BRS with no trouble (I went by continent rather than difficulty to save myself a bunch of jumping back and forth), but that fucking tree stampede absolutely demolished me.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 05 Mar 2009, 12:07
Naxx patchwork construct thingys, the massive fat dudes all do the tauren racial war stomp thingy but it's instant cast. Sucks when all 3 tanks are getting stunlocked at the same time so the dps need to hold off, or a tank runs in and out so as to keep aggro without getting stunned (intervene/charge ftw).

[edit]
Shammy got http://www.wowhead.com/?item=40264 :( Ehancements should have 2 slow weps but she needed on that I was so sad because my tanking buddy got both http://www.wowhead.com/?item=40189 and http://www.wowhead.com/?item=39730 while I got nothing Q_Q
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 10 Mar 2009, 18:54
Considering I hit eighty in Storm Peaks, I am just now getting around to the quests in Icecrown for funsies. God dammit, this shit is fucking epic. Some of the quests are just absolutely badass. Not to mention the fact I managed to make like 800 gold over the course of today just running through a bunch of them. The dailies alone netted me most of that.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 10 Mar 2009, 18:58
I think that the most amusing set of quests I've done so far have been the ones for the Murlocs in Borean Tundra, with the King Mrgl-Mrgl dude.  Absolutely ridiculous.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 10 Mar 2009, 19:06
The Wrath Gate event is still probably the coolest I've dealt with, but the major quest chain in Storm Peaks involving the Hodir and then the questline involving the ghost child in Icecrown have both been awesome.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: BeoPuppy on 11 Mar 2009, 02:37
I think the most ridiculous quest ever was making those two seals fall in love. that really elevated the game to a surreal level ...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 11 Mar 2009, 03:17
I think that the most amusing set of quests I've done so far have been the ones for the Murlocs in Borean Tundra, with the King Mrgl-Mrgl dude.  Absolutely ridiculous.
oh noes the tadpoles?

If they didn't despawn I would never have handed that quest in EVAR.

Also just downed KT on 25 man finally last nite.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 11 Mar 2009, 05:22
Oh man, yeah.  Those murloc tadpoles were the cutest little things.  I looked around online to see if there were any pets you could get, but alas :(
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 11 Mar 2009, 11:06
I have lurky the murloc pet, he is my favourite.

And as for naxx, just spent the last 5 hours clearing 10 man, then we had to stop before the big bloo dragon because people needed to feed children and such. Ptch.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 11 Mar 2009, 18:53
Naxx is actually starting to get boring now - we have all 25man raids on farm status, so we are really only doing it for the loot that people still need (I still need a couple of things).

WTB: Ulduar Raids.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 12 Mar 2009, 00:30
Yeah we had all but the 4 horsemen on farm and now that seems super super easy, the dragon fight is just another dragon fight and KT wasn't that tough.

First Malygos tonite woo!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 12 Mar 2009, 16:00
I think that the most amusing set of quests I've done so far have been the ones for the Murlocs in Borean Tundra, with the King Mrgl-Mrgl dude.  Absolutely ridiculous.

These are so funny. I loved running around in a freshly cleaned murloc suit.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 13 Mar 2009, 16:16
Yeah definitely.  Galumphing along like a tard.  I couldn't stop jumping around and laughing at how ridiculous I looked.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 15 Mar 2009, 00:14
Yeah we had all but the 4 horsemen on farm and now that seems super super easy, the dragon fight is just another dragon fight and KT wasn't that tough.

First Malygos tonite woo!

It took us a while to get Maly on 25man, but last week we one-shotted him. Was rather awesome. It's a fun fight.

I've been questing in Borean Tundra to get the gold and acheivement (I started out in HF) and I just finished those murloc quests - the baby ones are SUPER CUTE. I was spam clicking them to hear the silly sounds they make.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 15 Mar 2009, 03:15
Fuck malygos I hate that fight because I cannot tank, all I do is jump around spell reflecting and taunting adds, and doing a half assed dual wield ass kicking of a dragon.

Bring on more proper raids tbh, none of this 1 boss pish.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Stupid Human on 17 Mar 2009, 09:10
Fuck malygos I hate that fight because I cannot tank, all I do is jump around spell reflecting and taunting adds, and doing a half assed dual wield ass kicking of a dragon.

Bring on more proper raids tbh, none of this 1 boss pish.

You weren't much for old world dragon bosses were you?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 17 Mar 2009, 16:59
I MT'd them
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 18 Mar 2009, 01:15
Useless fact: Back in EQ some of the dragons were not MT'able because they ignored threat list rules and just attacked whoever the fuck they wanted.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 Mar 2009, 10:02
Another fun but useless EQ fact: Prior to expansions and raid quality gear, a max level Magician's Fire Elemental pet could easily solo a max level Warrior. My friend who played a magician had absolutely no problem with this and called warriors who complained about their utter lack of soloing capability "whiney bitches."


Everquest!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 18 Mar 2009, 15:29
I totally had an epiphany.

The next hero class should be an armored murloc. It would be like the anti-DK, way underpowered. You'd play it for the prestige of saying shit like "Yeah? Well I downed such and such DPSing with an armored murloc!"
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dunxco on 18 Mar 2009, 21:20
Fuck malygos I hate that fight because I cannot tank, all I do is jump around spell reflecting and taunting adds, and doing a half assed dual wield ass kicking of a dragon.

Bring on more proper raids tbh, none of this 1 boss pish.

You weren't much for old world dragon bosses were you?

He's got a point. As it stands, your choice is between a 14-boss slugfest of easy proportions, or two one-boss encounters, one of which has a scaleable difficulty mode. It's not exactly thrilling. I always get stuck being an add tank on Sarthation and it's dull as hell. Malygos is even worse, because my job is to do craptacular DPS in my tanking gear while Death-Gripping and Chains of Ice-ing the sparks to the middle of the platform. Whoop-dee-ferkin'-dooI guess what made bosses like Onyxia epic was the feeling of it was you and 39 mates going to kick her teeth down her throat. While that isn't necessary in multiple-boss dungeons, the absence of a coalition is really felt on the current one-boss content (for me, at least). Downing Malygos or Sarthation with 25 people just isn't as epic. Downing them with 10 is a fucking joke. Then again, that's probably my lore-nerd getting all angry about this.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 19 Mar 2009, 04:50
I totally had an epiphany.

The next hero class should be an armored murloc. It would be like the anti-DK, way underpowered. You'd play it for the prestige of saying shit like "Yeah? Well I downed such and such DPSing with an armored murloc!"

Jon, I would love this if I could galumph about like you do in the murloc suit in that set of quests.  Or no, it's actually just a dude in a murloc suit who thinks he's a murloc hero.  Tops.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 19 Mar 2009, 06:24
Thought they were gonna make a rogue/lock combo called a witch hunter?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 19 Mar 2009, 10:52
You mean Demon Hunter? (http://www.wowwiki.com/Demon_hunter)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 19 Mar 2009, 18:37
That's it, witch hunters are those human dudes in warhammer online. Which sucks balls.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 20 Mar 2009, 19:41
Jon, maybe they'll meet you halfway and make murlocs one of the next races.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: messeduplilkid on 21 Mar 2009, 00:20
Anyone in addition to me have their twilight vanquisher yet?

Also, anyone in addition to me a hardcore griefer? I can't help but ninja everything with my friends when we bring a bring a pug in or do vault.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: philharmonic on 21 Mar 2009, 19:28
BEAVERSTICK
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Mar 2009, 20:00
PvE griefing is incredibly douchey. I've ganked my share of players before. I mean, I used to play a rogue and moonlighted as a shadow priest on a PvP server, for god's sake. I've killed lower level players as they stood in front of a mailbox on occasion. I've mind controlled people and forced them into the lava of Blackrock mountain before as an act of retribution for killing my guildmates. I've repeatedly killed guys so I could have farming spots to myself. But even I think colluding to keep a Pugger from having a fair shot at the loot is pretty low.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 23 Mar 2009, 00:27
I'd like to think that the dude is mucking around or maybe trying to evoke a response from us.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 23 Mar 2009, 10:59
Like trolling? Is he a troll rogue?

HORDE SCUM TASTE MY BLAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAADE!

Thinking of an evasion tank dual wield dps build for offtanking so I don't get rage starved when not MT'ing something but also being able to tank bossfights,

http://www.wow-europe.com/en/info/basics/talents/warrior/talents.html?tal=040000000000000000000000000000305043000500302000000000000203351205003011521330110000

No shield, opinions? Obviously this only has a hope in hell of working if they don't ditch the "Rage granted on dodges and parries" idea for 3.1 (dinosaurface)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 23 Mar 2009, 14:34
I dunno, I'm not really a fan of Fury sans Flurry, particularly since you'd need an awful lot of +hit on your gear to truly benefit from offhand attacks. If you intend to do a hybrid build for offtanking farm content and heroic tanking you might just be better off with an Arms build and swapping to a shield vs. bosses. After all, an Arms warrior can reach Unrelenting Assault if they're willing to give up a few points elsewhere. It's a crap DPS talent, but it's actually pretty sweet for tanking since it lets you spam Revenge like crazy, netting you big threat gains.

If you've got a druid or arms warrior in your guild that can keep Mangle/Trauma up, you may want to consider something like this: Sweeping Strikes Prot spec (http://www.wow-europe.com/en/info/basics/talents/warrior/talents.html?tal=152200212303010000000000000000000000000000000000000000000203351025003012521330113300). It won't greatly increase your rage generation but you will get more damage per rage, since this build would let you swap in a two hander to tag enemies for crits & big bleeds thanks to Taste for Blood, Improved Overpower and Impale/Deep Wounds. And if it turns out that you don't really need Sword and Board/Crit Block for single target threat gen and want more trash damage, you could try modding the build to look like this. (http://www.wow-europe.com/en/info/basics/talents/warrior/talents.html?tal=152200202303010000000000000000305000000000000000000000000203351015003012521330110000) The damage probably won't be terribly impressive, but I kinda doubt that the Fury build would do much better; all the gems and gear you'd need to make the dual wielding viable could just as easily go towards attack power and crit when using the 2 hander. Besides, arms has better synergy for situations when a shield becomes necessary.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 24 Mar 2009, 09:53
Yeah I was looking at MS tanks and shit too, 1sec cd on revenge would be sweet but only as a MT. I could gear for ALOT of dodge/parry and a fair bit of hit/expertise atm so I really just want to try out a dual wield tank who doesn't need aggro to build rage/put out dps/steal aggro of trash without taunt to build more rage.

Depending on what happens in 3.1 I think it might be viable, or completely shit.

As for hit, you got every +hit+expertise talent apart from strength of arms that a warrior can have. I think it could work nicely perhaps.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 25 Mar 2009, 14:15
I should mention something: I realize that +hit typically isn't that great of a stat in WotlK for warriors, particularly beyond the yellow hit cap and when compared to strength/attack, but the reason I mentioned it is that I tend to think it would have a slightly inflated value in this instance since I would think your total white hits would end up making an unusual proportion of your damage relative to other warrior builds. After all, for Fury warriors things like Titan's Grip Whirlwind and Bloodsurge proc Slams end dealing stupid amounts of damage. Then again, you don't have flurry, so maybe I'm completely wrong about what your white damage should be like. And if enough damage comes in that rage isn't an issue, maybe you actually could do decent with devastate spam.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that your build idea puzzles the hell out of me.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 25 Mar 2009, 16:36
So I've more or less abandoned playing my rogue in favor of playing my holy priest:

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bleeding+Hollow&n=Starsnostars (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bleeding+Hollow&n=Starsnostars)

I'm loving every second of playing her. I've been healing instances non-stop since I hit 59 and I'm sure that won't stop on my way to 80. The only thing that is worrying me right now is the 3.1 patch. At the moment, I'm pretty much taking intel and spirit 1:1 (of course favoring spirit). With spirit being nerfed 40% next patch, I don't know how much my itemization is going to have to change.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 25 Mar 2009, 20:09
My idea is to make a prot warrior without a shield who can still offtank and dps without aggro without getting rage starved, but can also tank when it comes down to a boss fight through avoidance.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 25 Mar 2009, 22:20
Well, I understand literally what you're trying to do, I'm just kinda lukewarm on speccing towards dps while offtanking in situations where survivability is a concern, that's all. It's just a byproduct of my old ways. Empire usually just stuck to bear offtanks for a lot of things, and when another prot warrior was brought along, typically he was specd no different than the MT, except with points moved around for improved shouts.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 26 Mar 2009, 00:01
So I've more or less abandoned playing my rogue in favor of playing my holy priest:

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bleeding+Hollow&n=Starsnostars (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bleeding+Hollow&n=Starsnostars)

I'm loving every second of playing her. I've been healing instances non-stop since I hit 59 and I'm sure that won't stop on my way to 80. The only thing that is worrying me right now is the 3.1 patch. At the moment, I'm pretty much taking intel and spirit 1:1 (of course favoring spirit). With spirit being nerfed 40% next patch, I don't know how much my itemization is going to have to change.

Spirit is getting nerfed in how much mana regen it is, but meditation is increased in amount (from 30 to 50% while casting) so the difference shouldn't be that great. How much healing your getting out of extra spirit won't change. That's my conclusion anyway.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 26 Mar 2009, 11:50
Well, I understand literally what you're trying to do, I'm just kinda lukewarm on speccing towards dps while offtanking in situations where survivability is a concern, that's all. It's just a byproduct of my old ways. Empire usually just stuck to bear offtanks for a lot of things, and when another prot warrior was brought along, typically he was specd no different than the MT, except with points moved around for improved shouts.

MT is a drood with me and a pally for OT's but for different boss fights I MT while the drood DPS' and the pally OT's or the pally MT's while I pick up adds etc. it works well but a good DK tank would be a nice addition for magic fights.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: BeoPuppy on 27 Mar 2009, 00:56
Jesus. How many acronyms can fit in a post.

Reading this I feel such a casual gamer. I just want to get The Seeker as a title.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: pen on 27 Mar 2009, 08:17
Did not know there was a Seeker title.  Never paid that much attention to achievements and such, but I think I may need to try for that one. 
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 27 Mar 2009, 09:59
The sad thing is I didn't even really notice those acronyms anymore.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 29 Mar 2009, 08:18
So...I finally tried to go to Dalaran last night. That was a bad idea. First attempt completely shut my game down. Second attempt logged me off. So I gave up and tried again this morning just so I could get OUT of Dalaran. It was harder to move my character around early on a Sunday morning than it was to move my character around in high traffic times in Shatt.

Fuck you, Dalaran. I will visit you when another patch comes out.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 29 Mar 2009, 09:58
Dalaran runs super awesome for me.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 29 Mar 2009, 10:24
Well, my issue with it probably stems from the fact that I'm playing on a 5 year old laptop that technically doesn't meet all of the requirements for WotLK (just the video card I think) and really I have far too much crap on my computer.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 29 Mar 2009, 15:26
I am about to do gothink the harvester, bleh.

This is actually a pretty fun fight, on the undead side with all the ret pallys wewt.

/readycheck
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 30 Mar 2009, 00:30
A friend of mine sent me a recount today from when he took his alt through regular Drak keep. He found this notworthy because they had a level 80 rogue in the group who topped out at 780 dps for the run. And this was in a group that consisted of a warrior tank, a kitty, an enhancement shaman, and a holy paladin.

My reaction: (http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a207/Xyljin/nitefite.jpg)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 30 Mar 2009, 05:51
We had this once in the nexus HC back when I was mostly in blues and hc's presented some time and planning, not like now where it is "I PULL EVERYTHING AND KEEP AGGRO SO JUST NUKE AND KEEP ALIVE K THX" when our healer only had 1900 bonus heals or so, a nelf rogue came along doing 300-400 dps, we were confused on vent as to why this was, maybe they were all white hits, an ebayed account spamming sinister strike? no. Turns out he had levelled with swords and just started using daggers with a wep skill of about 30 when he entered the instance.

So yeah, there are all kinds of people in WoW, you just need to tolerate them.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 30 Mar 2009, 11:10
So I deleted about 11 GB of music I don't listen to from my laptop and now Dalaran isn't the pit of death, but it's still worse than Shatt ever was and I don't think I'll be going there unless I absolutely have to. (I had to go and get the flight point because silly Violet Hold doesn't have a meeting stone like Stocks does, which is kind of stupid.)

Alex, that's really sad. But what was sad about the instance I did last night (Old Kingdom) was that I was basically tied with a 78 ret paladin. I'm a level 74 moonkin. And the other sad thing was the two of us did about 70% of the dps, followed by the DK tank and then the other DK. But I'm sure if the healer had done more DPS she could have out DPS'd the last DK too. (I wouldn't have let the one guy in the group at all but it took forever to get a group together for it and I wasn't leader, so whatevs.)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 30 Mar 2009, 15:35
I wish blizzard was competent and I wish the damned patch would hit so I can go back to using items that are actually, you know, upgrades. I've gone back to using my old Fang of Truth (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=44187#sold-by) again simply because IP & Shiv scales better than with my other weapon and because Shiv ends up beating Sinister Strike into the ground in terms of combo generation. Right now, I take attack power, haste and +hit over everything, especially agility.

In other news: Human sacrifices, dogs and cats living together, mass hysteria.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 01 Apr 2009, 08:56
A piece of advice: If you have DoTs, use them. Don't let some little 74 with the same spec out dps your 78 behind because you don't use your DoTs. Yes, Wrath is nice and you did double the damage I did with that, but I doubled everything else. Come on now.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: michaelicious on 01 Apr 2009, 14:05
April Fools jokes were pretty awesome this year. I like what they did with the forums the most.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 01 Apr 2009, 19:45
Saying "Remember dots" is like saying "Remember to breathe"  :|
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 02 Apr 2009, 14:29
Mmm, dots. I am still kind of mystified by the fact that I have never mained a Warlock, since in pretty much every other MMO I gun straight for the class that with the most instant cast dots and general utility spells; on paper, I really should be playing a lock. I mean, honestly, the farming capability alone gives me boners. Besides, in world PvP, there's few better tactics than simply dotting someone and running like hell.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 02 Apr 2009, 18:55
Oh warlocks. One of my friends plays a warlock and anytime inane chatter in places like Goldshire would annoy him, he'd strip his character and drop Rain of Fire. Such a fun little spell.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Beren on 02 Apr 2009, 23:29
Mmm, dots. I am still kind of mystified by the fact that I have never mained a Warlock, since in pretty much every other MMO I gun straight for the class that with the most instant cast dots and general utility spells; on paper, I really should be playing a lock. I mean, honestly, the farming capability alone gives me boners. Besides, in world PvP, there's few better tactics than simply dotting someone and running like hell.

You know, same. I've played an spriest to all hell, played a feral druid (which is half just dots at this point), and a boomkin, but getting my warlock past 62 just isn't happening. There's something very weird about that class that's making it not fun and I can't figure out what it is.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 03 Apr 2009, 10:01
Rachel and my brother both have Warlocks and they find it to be a blast.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 03 Apr 2009, 10:58
Yeah, actually, about half the reason I first passed on a Warlock is due to the fact that my roommate already had one so I grabbed Shadow Priest to avoid redundancy; it's never been the class itself that stopped me. Although, I will say that the sheer number of spells they have kind of irritates me when I get the chance to play someone else's lock. It's not like the cycles are confusing or the class is difficult or anything, I'm just a sucker for having everything hotkeyed, bound and macro'd. I get the feeling I'd spend more time fiddling with a Lock UI than playing, since I'm the kind of person who'd prefer to be able to start summoning in under a couple seconds even if it isn't really a time sensitive ability.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 03 Apr 2009, 13:54
The only reason I haven't made a lock is because they can't heal themselves and they are stuck in dps. I gravitate towards hybrid roles for that reason, mostly. I like doing dps and soloing, but sometimes it's nice to be able to heal/tank on the same character without having to level up something from the ground up in order to be able to do that. I hate leveling from 1-40 because it just takes to freaking long. Which is why I have a DK now so I can tank instead of carrying around 3 sets of gear and respeccing every so often if I want to tank with my druid. And since now we get dual specs, my druid will be balance and resto, because I think mostly I prefer healing to tanking.

3.1 - I can't wait.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 03 Apr 2009, 16:05
Locks can actually heal themselves. I'm not sure how, but Rachel's yet to have real problems keeping her health up. I seem to recall locks having a drain health spell.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: pen on 03 Apr 2009, 16:13
Drain health is not very useful, I find.  I'd rather have mana.  My main heal is Lifeblood from Herbalism.  That shit comes in handy.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 03 Apr 2009, 16:55
Yeah, I genuinely hate that about the "pure" classes. They're kind of a relic from an era in which Blizz was silly enough to think they could balance hybrids in such a way that they could contribute in multiple areas simultaneously without utterly gimping the class. Whoops. As a rogue, I really don't give a shit about dual specs. I just end up performing the same song in a different arrangement. Now, if they'd let me swap to an unequipped Shaman for a few gold, they'd have something.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 03 Apr 2009, 17:49
So I cancelled my subscription. I don't have time to raid anymore and I can no longer bring myself to sit in front of my computer for hours on end running around and just grinding for hours. I might go back and play for a month or whatever when the patch comes out, but blegh.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Beren on 03 Apr 2009, 18:50
Yeah, the lock self healing with Siphon Life/Drain Life/Haunt is pretty ridiculous (large solo capabilities), but of course they can't heal other people.

Yeah, that must be it, the only toons I have stuck at a certain level are a rogue (42) and a warlock (62). It must be because they can't do anything else. Oh, a mage I suppose, at 71, but it was my main for 2 months or so in BC so I could get into a decent guild, then I went resto druid.

Leveling a rogue has been the worst so far. Bandaging after every other mob, yech.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 03 Apr 2009, 19:09
I thought of that before I started my Rogue, since I was used to a Druid. He's an undead (Cannibalism), herbalist (lifebloom), alchemist (health potions). Keeping my health up was a huge pain in the ass through the first 25 levels, but since then, it's been pretty much smooth sailing.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 03 Apr 2009, 21:38

Leveling a rogue has been the worst so far. Bandaging after every other mob, yech.

lol, wut?

Nah, in all seriousness, rogues are a good news/bad news class. Bad news is, rogues are little more than bullies. Dual wielding means you miss like crazy and depending on dodge for defense really kinda sucks. Fighting elites and mobs a level or two higher than you leads to annoyance and downtime since you can't drop them so fast that they only get less than a half dozen swings in. On the brightside, rogues are extremely efficient bullies; you can cream mobs that are 1-3 levels lower than you at a truly mind boggling rate. Kitties are good dpsers and all, but it's mostly through the magic of bleeds & Shred; on any fight that lasts under 30 seconds, they get kind of shortchanged. Same with DPS warriors; their numbers are good largely because bosses give them plenty of time to milk bleeds and spam those sick executes. Rogues, on the other hand, have the option of plain blowing their load practically at will.


Oh, and btw: Cheapshot is a really shitty PvE opener, so make sure you're not using it in the vast majority of situations.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 04 Apr 2009, 09:08
You are the only person I know of that thinks cheap shot is overrated for PVE like I do, other than myself. I just find I'm much better served opening with ambush. In subtlety spec, you're going to get the same amount of combo points, but I'd rather have the major burst damage of ambush over the all too brief stun of cheap shot.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 04 Apr 2009, 19:25
Honestly, stealth has no value to me whatsoever outside of PvP and opting out of encounters/threat wiping via Vanish. They could remove Ambush, Cheap Shot and Garrote from the game and I'd be excited; Maybe then they'd consider giving me something I'd use more often. I mean, sure, all the openers can be sort of useful useful, but they generally need talents and glyphs that could be put to better use elsewhere in order genuinely outperform running up to someone and spamming SS/Mutilate.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 04 Apr 2009, 19:36
If it wears leather or cloth or mail I WILL DESTROY IT.

Seriously I fucking love pvp.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 05 Apr 2009, 08:10
I wear leather, but that leather gets an armor bonus equal to plate. So.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 05 Apr 2009, 09:41
And big time heals too.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 05 Apr 2009, 10:52
Warriors have always supposed to have been a counter to rogues but it's never really actually happened in my experience.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 05 Apr 2009, 13:58
I facerolled a feral drood in bearform today 4 times, dude was geared too, just too fucking weak to compete attack wise.

And plenty of rogues, I lost count after 5 duelling each one more than 3 times.

GG.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 05 Apr 2009, 16:07
To be fair, duels are pretty much the worst possible way for a rogue to fight since it puts an arbitrary size limit on the fight area; on my pvp server I would just savagely maul warriors, leave and then wander back to kill them later. Warriors are sorta tricky kind of if they have Second Wind, I guess. Other than that they're only scary if they've got a pocket healer and I don't. Of course, that counts for any class.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 05 Apr 2009, 17:45
Oh my pvp server hunter I often armoury a player before attacking them. True story.

As for rogues, I never really understood the whole "WE ARE PR0 @ PVP" since all they seem to do is take advantage, it is part of their class and they are created to do so, but really how much skill does it take to stunlock someone then cheapshot/kidneyshot them to half death, vanish rinse repeat?

Saying "on my pvp server I would just savagely maul warriors, leave and then wander back to kill them later" is alot like a warrior saying "I just wait for a rogue to loot the corpse of whatever it was fighting, charge stun and bleed it to death" where the ONLY reason arenas and duels are unfavourable to rogues is because it puts everyone on a level playing field, rogues don't like that.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 05 Apr 2009, 17:50
See, the thing is, I typically win or at least escape when a warrior does things like that. We have escape skills and like mages we can essentially "reset" a fight if needed. I fight on at least even terms against the warriors I fight in duels and slaughter them in world pvp because there's no forfeiting if the fight reaches an arbitrary distance away from the flag. Besides, it's warcraft; you might as well throw skill out of the equation now while we're at it. My old warrior wasn't any more complicated to play than my rogue, he just had intercept instead of cooldowns. WoW is a game of best practices and most pvp wins beyond a certain point come down to discipline and communication with teammates.

Anyway, I'm not saying warriors suck or something, I'm just saying I've never really found them to be as effective against rogues as has been advertised.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 05 Apr 2009, 18:12
From when I did PvP, the ones who were the biggest pains to beat weren't warriors, it was either another druid (usually balance) or warlock. Everyone else I just dropped entangling roots on and kept nature's grasp up. And when I was feral, I did defense and stayed in cat form and snuck up on people. But I don't do battlegrounds very often, because the Alliance on my server don't know the meaning of defense and then get confused as to why we always lose. Oh well!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 05 Apr 2009, 18:35
Paladins are brutal in PvP, and 2 locks vs me and a ret pally with no res was swift but a good learning experience.

As for "it's warcraft; you might as well throw skill out of the equation now while we're at it" that is the biggest load of shit I have ever heard, it's like saying it's pick up and play and once you know what you are doing it's easy and you cannot get any better.

Of course it takes skill, is why some people are better than others.

Vanish, sprint & autorun takes no skill, runaway rogue, nuff said.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 05 Apr 2009, 18:53
I'm defining skill here as technical ability. WoW has extremely few hurdles to jump in terms of hand eye coordination or precise timing. Global cooldowns provide a built in amount of breathing room between committing to attacks. There are no narrow hitboxes preventing you from scoring a headshot with every click. You work with keybinds and macros rather than convoluted sequences like in fighting games. You can and should set up your UI to inform you of exactly what spell effects will be ending and in what order, so most information can and should be available to you at virtually all times. The game is well-documented, widely discussed and the pertinent information on class abilities and skills are all a few clicks away. Whether a stunlock is easy to perform or not is really quite immaterial because virtually every technique in Warcraft is easy. It is a game of research, judgement calls and discipline, not twitchiness. Stunlocks are easy, true, but if I applied stunlocks willy-nilly to everyone I fought, I would win very few matches indeed. When people get killed in WoW it's typically due to a lack of discipline, poor communication, luck or falling prey to their own self-imposed limitations on what is or isn't an appropriate tactic.

I've played warriors before; they're hardly any more difficult to play in PvP than a rogue. Get off your high horse.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 05 Apr 2009, 18:59
Tomato, tomahto, you say properly balancing DPS and proper placement for optimal damage while vanishing to wear down a heavily armored retard is easy, I say standing there and absorbing damage while chipping away at other, more lightly armored, classes is easy.

Yeah, skill comes into play, but it's a two way street. Your seeming disrespect for any non-tanking class seems both arrogant and lacking anything tangible to back up your mouth-running, considering I'm not sure I've ever seen you talk about experience with a single non tank class in this thread.

Me, I've never really had problems with warriors on my druid, it's Paladins that cause me the most trouble. I can't say much for my Rogue, as I've yet to actually do any PVP with him, but I'm confident that I could take a like-leveled one.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 05 Apr 2009, 19:20
The rough thing about heal capable classes is that even when they're losing or have made a dumb mistake or two they still have a decent chance at hanging around until you make a mistake of your own. I have to be really mindful of not throwing a kick or burning a cooldown too early lest I fail to close the deal, so to speak. I've had my fair share of "Coulda woulda shoulda" losses against my old druid guild leader, let me tell you.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 05 Apr 2009, 19:32
I would think that as with pretty much every other thing in WoW how class A would go against class B would depend on their individual builds.  I am pretty sure that as a prot-spec Warrior I would have a bit of trouble with PvP in general, but I don't know, maybe against Mages I'd be ok seeing as I have more stuns than the other Warrior builds?  PvP isn't really my thing.  I am not really sure I've dueled or done any PvP at all since the spec change.  Back when I was Fury-specced I lost that one encounter with a Warlock in a fairly spectacular fashion, but I never had problems with any duels.

Oh hey, I just realised that I would probably actually stand a better chance in that Warlock encounter now because I can now Shield Bash (with Gag Order) to stun & silence, then Shield Slam which damages and dispels, then start Devastating and Shield Slamming to dispel all their buffs.  Well, in theory anyway.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 05 Apr 2009, 19:35
Yeah, builds can be hella important. Second wind definitely changes how I approach taking down a warrior.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 05 Apr 2009, 23:20
I miss the time when SAP, sheap, ice trap and fear actually had a use in PvE. I have yet to do any isntance where it is needed. And since a retri paladin (for example) can't fill any other role than dps (heals can bli ignored since they add nothing pretty much) they have to do just as much DPS as pure DPS classes to be worth taking. And that makes it more fun to play a multi purpose class since you can change role when ever you want pretty much. Before the WotLK the pure DPS classes had a purpose in CC atleast. In my opinion Blizzard have forfeited the dynamic between classes to let all classes be able to top the Damage Done table. And everyone allways want to be in the top of the Damage done list.
WoW is to easy now days.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 06 Apr 2009, 03:51
Yeah, skill comes into play, but it's a two way street. Your seeming disrespect for any non-tanking class seems both arrogant and lacking anything tangible to back up your mouth-running, considering I'm not sure I've ever seen you talk about experience with a single non tank class in this thread.
Touché, because I find most other things besides tanking boring as shit (apart from my restro droob, that's a fuckton of fun).

I have played all classed to 30 but only a few beyond. My arrogance is towards the person on the other side of the keyboard, with the rogue that challenged me to a duel 3 times in a row while getting pumped harder each time.

Quote
Oh hey, I just realised that I would probably actually stand a better chance in that Warlock encounter now because I can now Shield Bash (with Gag Order) to stun & silence, then Shield Slam which damages and dispels, then start Devastating and Shield Slamming to dispel all their buffs.  Well, in theory anyway.
Yeah, locks can still be pretty tough though, in 2v2 a succubus makes you blow your trink so that your arena partner doesn't get fucked by 2 locks and a felhound, but in 1v1 you have the rite idea, berserk out of fear, trink out of scream, then interupt anything else you can with either heroic throw or shield bash etc. and let the pet chip away at you for some revenge procs to use on the clothie, run away and charge every 15 secs for a stun/interrupt too.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 12 Apr 2009, 00:20
So, I was involved with an aborted Heroic Nexus run last night that was truly surreal, and not just because I've never had to quit on a Nexus (or hell, any Heroic) run before. Basically, a couple of guildies and I ended up with a DK "tank" who did around 647 dps. As you can imagine, his threat was, uh, not so good. Honestly though, we had a lot of fun as my guildies and I attempted attempted to see how far we could get by essentially stunning, pet tanking and fearing our way through the instance as the DK did his level best to get us all killed (the answer: not terribly far; only two bosses downed). The DK was truly amazing; he did a li'l bit of everything, really, including falling off a ledge and dying at one point and getting murdered by flowers after one of the wipes. Honestly, we weren't even mad; the guy wasn't lazy or a jerk, just amazingly thick. Picking on him would have been about as productive as getting mad at a 5 week old puppy for peeing on the carpet.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 13 Apr 2009, 17:24
I have encountered my fair share of thick players even while trying to remain relatively insular.  I guess you get that when a game is so massively popular?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 13 Apr 2009, 21:33
Patch 3.1 has been confirmed  (http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?sid=1&topicId=16365836582&pageNo=2&ST=US-732716-LXb25gb30S6Ysx34IdQvAPYm9fvIaSlxn0q#30)for tomorrow, folks.

See you in Ulduar...after about ten to twelve hours of extended maintenance and server crashes, in all likelihood.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 14 Apr 2009, 02:33
Fuck yeah
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 14 Apr 2009, 02:37
I mean, I am not of a level to enjoy Ulduar yet because I've been on a break for a bit, but still, the other stuff they've been talking about sounds great.  I am gonna dual-spec Prot and something else.  Maybe I'll take Fury as my second, but mebbe I'll give Arms a shot, because I would like to try something a little different and also because it'll gimme a chance to use some of the 2h quest reward weapons a bit.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 14 Apr 2009, 10:42
I'm not really excited about dual specs, but that's mostly because it's completely worthless to me as a rogue and because my guild asked me to switch my main to a class that's more flexible since there is now little reasons not to wear different hats on different raid nights. I do good dps and all, it's just that we're a guild with only 30 people on the raiding roster and we don't bring along puggers to raids, which is unfortunate since Naxx 25 punishes groups for bringing more than 3 melee dps to Kel'thuzad. This isn't unusual on Grizzly Hills, the youngest server in the game. They're the least wanted class here and few people have been playing long enough to feel attached to rogues, so there's no real reason to play one, particularly since the top Alliance guild on the server doesn't have any rogues at all and couldn't care less. It's pretty shitty and I'm kind of hating hybrids a little right now. Anyway, off to transfer my old 70 druid to Grizzly hills.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 14 Apr 2009, 12:24
Dual spec is what I'm all about. As a Druid, dual spec is fucking epic. My one problem is going to be deciding between going resto or balance for my off spec.

I have to disagree in terms of the usefulness of dual spec for a Rogue. It might not be very useful level eighty, but it's going to be very nice leveling mine. I won't be getting it tonight, as I'm level 38, but as soon as I ding 40, I'm snagging it. I stick to the subtlety tree since it's so useful for soloing, but I'd like to have a more DPS oriented off spec for PVP and dungeons.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 14 Apr 2009, 12:34
Yeah, see, I really don't see the point in switching specs before 80 on a rogue maybe more than once or twice. Subtlety's only real weakness is the crappy sustained white damage, which isn't exactly a big deal in pre-heroic 5 man content simply because mobs don't stay up for very long. In a bad group, respeccing won't do enough to make up for their badness and in a good group your damage shouldn't take a big enough hit for it to really matter because mobs won't be alive very long anyway. As for me, the pvp gear is all sidegrades at this point anyway.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 14 Apr 2009, 12:39
I have been thinking, when I get dual spec (UA prot build and my normal prot build I guess) I will change back and forward from one to the other 20 times rite at the start for no other reason than to justify paying the cost of 20 respecs.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 14 Apr 2009, 15:51
I think I may end up choosing feral as my other spec. I can heal rather well off spec as is, but am lousy at tanking with +int/spell power talents. So. Back to the scritchy scratch.

Also! I know this failed epically the last time people tried, but you guys should come play WoW with me and Tyler on Ravencrest. (Horde side.) DO EET.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 14 Apr 2009, 16:56
The second horde has a race that provides expertise and reputation grind bonuses, I'll think about it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 14 Apr 2009, 16:58
I'd consider Alliance if any of their races (Excepting dwarves) weren't a bunch pf pussies.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 14 Apr 2009, 18:26
Roll dwarf, be awesome.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 14 Apr 2009, 18:50
Maybe after they decide they're finally done nerfing them.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 14 Apr 2009, 18:56
Doesn't matter what they do to stoneform or frost res/avoidance, dwarves are still superior to every other race in every way shape and form.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 14 Apr 2009, 18:57
Tell that to my free racial pvp trinket.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: BeoPuppy on 15 Apr 2009, 01:03
Doesn't matter what they do to stoneform or frost res/avoidance, dwarves are still superior to every other race in every way shape and form.

... no, not in shape and form, actually.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 15 Apr 2009, 06:06
Tell that to my free racial pvp trinket.
So? I like my 84 res from the pvp trink.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Tyler on 15 Apr 2009, 19:05
Whatever. You should come play horde with me and Linds. We are pretty much cooler than you.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 15 Apr 2009, 20:06
So, after further review, the Greatness card and Mirror of Truth trinket combo is much, much better than I had hoped it would be.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 15 Apr 2009, 22:15
Oh, and I made a tauren warrior named Bludgeon to play around with on Ravencrest.

EDIT: I think I'll run around with Whipstitch the Undead Mage for a while instead.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 16 Apr 2009, 06:21
Yuss. I made a warlock, but considering I keep wanting to melee, I need to make something else.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 16 Apr 2009, 12:33
Yeah, I nearly went warlock since I think overall they tend to be the better class (not so much after the patch), but in the end portal and sheep won out.


That and I don't know how much I'll really end up playing for sure anyway since I'm in a guild that raids a few nights  a week atm.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 16 Apr 2009, 14:25
Well, looks like I'm rolling melee if I do decide to hang with you kids off and on.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 16 Apr 2009, 15:15
Man, I forgot how lame high end mage gear looks. Screw it, I'm playing bludgeon.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 16 Apr 2009, 15:39
Also! I know this failed epically the last time people tried, but you guys should come play WoW with me and Tyler on Ravencrest. (Horde side.) DO EET.

I'll bite. I made an undead priest named Starsnostars, but i'd be happy to switch to something more suited for deeps if someone already has dibs on healing.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 16 Apr 2009, 15:45
DPS is easy to get these days anyway, despite the fact that blizzard has a gigantic stiffy for almost instantly lethal melee range AoEs for some dumb ass reason. Really, whose bright idea was it to leave only enough room for 3 melee dpsers on Kel'thuzad? This is supposed to make sense on a 25 man encounter? Really?


Honestly, I can't decide what to play right now. It'd be easier if horde pcs weren't a big pile of clipping issues.

EDIT

Okay, definitely Bludgeon, even if he is another damn melee character for me. Tauren rock.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: KharBevNor on 16 Apr 2009, 18:01
Psh, American servers.

I need to get some good pvping in before they realise what they've done. Protadins have now got fucking ridiculous. The new talent builds let me have everything I need for tanking, AND full stoicism, and still go deep enough into the ret tree to get both ranks of Pursuit of Justice. Time to get some flag runs in.

Looking above, I think people are being a bit off talking about PVP solely in terms of how well you can scrap with any other class. The PVP battles in the end of the day are about completing objectives and preventing the enemy from completing theirs. If more people remembered this then the Horde wouldn't keep getting raped in AV (this happens constantly on my server group, dunno about anyone elses). I have unfortunately come to realise that, as well as almost continual unbalancing, a lot of that has to do with the fact that a lot of people don't actually seem to know how AV works. Witness twenty horde desperately trying to defend the Frostwolf Graveyard whilst allies ride straight round behind them, capture the relief hut and then surround the keep, using the hordes own defences against them. This happens almost every time I play AV, and it is extremely depressing.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 16 Apr 2009, 18:23
I've created a couple chars on Ravencrest, just trying to figure out if any of them are ones I like playing.  I have Estarriol the BE Mage, Bjorc the Orc Hunter and twin brothers Malachias and Stabbington the Undead DK (woo redundancy) and Rogue respectively.  I'll give them a go for a bit and see if I enjoy playing any of these classes.  Whatever I do I may use Malachias as a gold-producer for the rest of them.  This whole "you can make a DK on any server" biz really does give people a bit of a beachhead to work with.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 16 Apr 2009, 18:34
The whole pvp plate parade they've got going right now is definitely a well-known phenomenon; it's wall to wall DKs and pallies atm.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 16 Apr 2009, 18:47
I made a tauren shaman named Clodagh. I can melee and heal myself! Woo!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 16 Apr 2009, 18:51
I think you're misunderstanding, Khar. While I myself tend to stick to Battlegrounds, I believe the others are primarily referring to world PvP and Arenas in terms of class versus class stuff.

In terms of your analysis of piss poor strategy, that tends to depend entirely on the server. Battlegrounds are almost the same way as you describe on my server, BUT that is primarily because I am on a very Alliance heavy server (There's about 3 Alliance for every two Horde on my server) and that really throws Battlegrounds because you tend to see the better players gravitating toward the higher populated faction in a given server. My brother's on a primarily Horde server (Same ratio, except reversed) and the Alliance on there can't get from one side of the Valley to the other without doing something so monumentally stupid that they pretty much hand the match away.

Warsong Gulch is damn near impossible to win Hordeside on my server since it's so hard to get a PUG even the vaguest bit organized or even using basic common sense. Inexplicably, Eye of the Storm tends to run very smoothly for some reason.

Linds, I fail to see why you're so impressed with that. Don't you already have a high level Druid on another server?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: KharBevNor on 16 Apr 2009, 19:19
There's been a few times in WSG where I've personally managed to salvage a battle just by yelling at people. If you can get three people to mount a proper defence in the flag room and get everyone else attacking properly as a group then it's almost impossible to lose. BGs are lost by people who just want to run around trying to rack up their HKs. Also people who have no sticking power. One of the main reasons AV is always unabalanced on my server group is because at the start horde players turn up, see the alliance have a 5 man lead on us, and quit, meaning the alliance has a six man lead on us. From then on it just steamrollers, as the games desperate attempts to balance the sides can hardly keep up with the horde wussing out en masse, and within 5 minutes the allies outnumber us 2:1 or more. Given that AV can be won with a steady, grim defence, especially if people take the time to do the battle quests to buff up the NPCs, the initial imbalance is by no means fatal. Have these people never heard of force multipliers? Unfortunately, the general attitude seems to be that it is preferable to lose three ten minute games to the Alliance to get your three AV marks, rather than grind them down in one epic 45 minute battle. I think this is a fundamentally wrong and anti-fun attitude, but what can I do? Normally, get ganked by hunters whilst trying desperately to defend Drek'thar from the raid-strength force camped outside, whilst the rest of my side fights unrelentingly for strategically unimportant graveyards* whilst the alliance methodically destroy our towers one by one.

I would just stop playing AV, but I REALLY want that wolf.   




*All except the two level 76 DKs who are inexplicably under the impression they can solo Belinda.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 16 Apr 2009, 19:35
I had a situation like that in WSG once before. I tried taking charge, and it was a pain, but more people listened over time as I said what I planned to do and stuck with it. I was guarding the flag most of the game while trying to give people time to get the opposing flag.

I honestly wish I didn't deal with so many incompetents there, because WSG is practically tailor made for a Druid to excel.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 16 Apr 2009, 19:42
Yes I do. But it is an improvement over a warlock which can neither melee or heal itself. This is about lowbie characters on Ravencrest, not in general.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 16 Apr 2009, 20:22
Ya know, I had almost forgot about the whole you can start a DK on any server thing. I'm somewhat tempted to go DK now. I kind of hate pets though.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 16 Apr 2009, 20:33
Well there goes over half the money I'd been saving for epic flight form. But considering I can't fly in Northrend for a while, I think I'd rather have the dual spec so I can guarantee a spot in instances if a group is lacking a healer.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: KharBevNor on 17 Apr 2009, 00:10
I'm considering Dual Spec, (probably dual spec to ret because I'll need completely different gear and glyphs to be anywhere near effective as a healadin, my mana pool is tiny) but I haven't got epic flying or cold weather flying yet, so that's frankly quite a distance off.

Or do you get two different sets of glyphs and action bars when you dual spec?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 17 Apr 2009, 00:35
I'm considering Dual Spec, (probably dual spec to ret because I'll need completely different gear and glyphs to be anywhere near effective as a healadin, my mana pool is tiny) but I haven't got epic flying or cold weather flying yet, so that's frankly quite a distance off.

Or do you get two different sets of glyphs and action bars when you dual spec?
Yes, you get a completly new set of glyphs when you buy dual spec. The actionbars was intended to change when you switch your spec. But it seems they forgot to implement it in the live patch. There are however addons that will handle it for you.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Beren on 17 Apr 2009, 05:10
My action bars change when I switch spec.  :?

Also, FUCK YES SEA TURTLE MOUNT a;eojgna;f

you are slow but I love you.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 17 Apr 2009, 05:31
Strange, 'cus it doesn't work for any of my friends. Are you an US server perhaps?

And, omg, I want the turtle! It's the coolest mount in all of WoW (or any MMORPG for that mather)!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Beren on 17 Apr 2009, 08:44
Yep, US Server, and my action bars switch every time.

Although, I do get all of my talents back every 12 hours or so, still. I'm pretty good at speccing at this point.  :-P Stupid bug.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 17 Apr 2009, 09:41
I've been having the same talent point refund problem, which is really annoying when you have dual spec. No problems with the action bars, though. Mine switch fine.

I don't have my epic flying and I'm a long ways off (I've got about 1500 gold left after buying dual spec, so I'm a ways off), but I at least got cold weather flying as soon as I hit 77.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 17 Apr 2009, 18:14
My action bars switched, but I don't know about the talent refund bug. We will see whenever I log on next.

And yeah, I still have enough to get cold weather flying, but I'm still at 74, so I'm not really in a rush. Also I don't know how much I'll be on my druid right now unless I really feel like raiding. Depends on how sick I get of leveling the new character.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 18 Apr 2009, 05:54
I'm considering Dual Spec, (probably dual spec to ret because I'll need completely different gear and glyphs to be anywhere near effective as a healadin, my mana pool is tiny) but I haven't got epic flying or cold weather flying yet, so that's frankly quite a distance off.
Tank gear is just as different to dps gear as healing gear is to tank gear, int and MP5 is healing gear, str stam crit hit is DPS gear and str stam def dodge block parry is tank gear. If you spec ret in tank gear nobody will let you in their group, so go for whatever you enjoy and roll dem dice.
Or do you get two different sets of glyphs and action bars when you dual spec?
Yes.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Tyler on 18 Apr 2009, 14:27
Ok I am going to start adding you kids. My 80 on Ravencrest is Disinterest. Just send me a line when youre on and who you are, and ill make a quick bag/gold drop for ya. Once everyone starts getting up, ill fly you through instances, etc.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: KharBevNor on 18 Apr 2009, 14:51
And who said I want ret for group work? I enjoy tanking, and everyone and their mother is DPS. As you noted, ret and prot share strength and stamina as their critical primary stats, which is a lot more than prot and holy share. With tanking gear on, switching to ret and switching out trinkets would be enough to give me a bit of DPS fun in PVP, whereas prot and holy share absolutely no stats (you're not even going to really get much benefit from increased expertise). I enjoy WoW, but nowhere near enough to acquire two sets of epics.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Beren on 18 Apr 2009, 15:18
you'd be more dead weight than anything dpsing in gear like that. Just saying. You'd be better off pvping as prot (which is a barrel of laughs, I know)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 18 Apr 2009, 17:30
You said you would probably dual spec ret, as for int and mp5 they are just as important as the green stats for dps, if you are going to dps in tank gear don't take it further than 5mans because then you would be dead weight. Stamina isn't integral to dps, it's just there which is why I listed it as a stat on dps gear, alot of the time the green stats are more important than the str or stam.

All I was saying is don't base your dual spec choice on what you can bodge gear together for, do whatever one is most fun, gearing holy would be pretty easy to gear for anyways.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: KharBevNor on 18 Apr 2009, 20:12
Up there I say DPSing in instances does not interest me because I enjoy tanking. I also state that I will base my dual speccing on what I want to do not on what gear I can club together! Also healing is insanely boring!

Please read posts before replying thank you!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 19 Apr 2009, 05:31
I think it's interesting to note that after I bought my dual spec on the day after the patch I started thinking about how to spec and instead logged out and went to play Witcher Enhanced Edition for like, five days straight.  I think maybe it's WoW break time again, or that perhaps this Ravencrest thing is well-timed in order to gimme a break from things.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 19 Apr 2009, 08:40
Up there I say DPSing in instances does not interest me because I enjoy tanking. I also state that I will base my dual speccing on what I want to do not on what gear I can club together! Also healing is insanely boring!

Please read posts before replying thank you!

Oh, so you like tanking but not DPS or healing? (I can relate) THEN DON'T DUAL SPEC. You were talking about going ret, read your own fucking post you moron. Was just giving some advice since you posted as if you have no clue about how to dual spec.

Quote
I'm considering Dual Spec, (probably dual spec to ret because I'll need completely different gear and glyphs to be anywhere near effective as a healadin, my mana pool is tiny) but I haven't got epic flying or cold weather flying yet, so that's frankly quite a distance off.

Or do you get two different sets of glyphs and action bars when you dual spec?

Nowhere do you say you don't like to DPS or that you find healing boring, I was advising you on what you had said, sorry for helkping you not make a fool of yourself turning up to an instance dps specced in tank gear and getting laughed out of the group.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: KharBevNor on 19 Apr 2009, 08:52
I have said three times now that I do not want to use DPS for instances! Please try!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 19 Apr 2009, 09:59
Jesus.

And who said I want ret for group work? I enjoy tanking, and everyone and their mother is DPS. As you noted, ret and prot share strength and stamina as their critical primary stats, which is a lot more than prot and holy share. With tanking gear on, switching to ret and switching out trinkets would be enough to give me a bit of DPS fun in PVP, whereas prot and holy share absolutely no stats (you're not even going to really get much benefit from increased expertise). I enjoy WoW, but nowhere near enough to acquire two sets of epics.

Up there I say DPSing in instances does not interest me because I enjoy tanking. I also state that I will base my dual speccing on what I want to do not on what gear I can club together! Also healing is insanely boring!

This is where I saw why he wanted to dual spec, so he could do something different in PVP. Don't call him a fucking moron when it's you who can't read.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 19 Apr 2009, 11:57
The irony of seeing Khar clearly struggling to not call person an idiot only to have that person respond by being a douche gives me a chuckle.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 19 Apr 2009, 12:22
Drama up ITT.



Anyhow, Malygos is a pain in the ass when you're breaking in a relatively new healer. Gah.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jimor on 19 Apr 2009, 13:40
Just checking in to say I've been playing since Oct, so my main is still only 45, but having fun beating on things and exploring. I like running into a new area with NO idea what to expect, and if half the things there can swat me down with 2 hits, all the better.  :-D

Anyway, Human Paladin, Jimor, on Blackwater Raiders, mining/blacksmithing, with some alts in the 15-30 range so I can try out other classes and professions.

I'm not stressing about gear and precise builds until I get high enough to do some of the more interesting stuff.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 19 Apr 2009, 15:11
Jesus.

And who said I want ret for group work? I enjoy tanking, and everyone and their mother is DPS. As you noted, ret and prot share strength and stamina as their critical primary stats, which is a lot more than prot and holy share. With tanking gear on, switching to ret and switching out trinkets would be enough to give me a bit of DPS fun in PVP, whereas prot and holy share absolutely no stats (you're not even going to really get much benefit from increased expertise). I enjoy WoW, but nowhere near enough to acquire two sets of epics.

Up there I say DPSing in instances does not interest me because I enjoy tanking. I also state that I will base my dual speccing on what I want to do not on what gear I can club together! Also healing is insanely boring!

This is where I saw why he wanted to dual spec, so he could do something different in PVP. Don't call him a fucking moron when it's you who can't read.
Which was stated after I had made my post referring to what had been said beforehand. I was replying to what he said first about dual spec, not what was posted after you decided you didn't like what I suggested.

But whatever, enjoy your shit "DPS" in prot gear, just don't be surprised at people when they give you a hard time about being in the wrong gear doing less DPS than the tank and 2 healers. you MUST be right obviously.

Goddamn, fucking paladins
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 19 Apr 2009, 15:17
James, you're being a bit of a dick here with all the swearing and condescension. Maybe Khar isn't doing what you want him to do, but that doesn't mean it's okay to be a dick. Futzing around in the BGs with a ret spec and a bunch of tank gear or reputation blues isn't optimal, but neither is it serious business.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 19 Apr 2009, 15:19
I just wish we could get through a single page of this thread without James being a condescending, know-it-all prick about someone else's play style.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Ozymandias on 19 Apr 2009, 15:20
This is the video games forum, that means you have to NERDRAGE about shit that other people do and think that doesn't affect you in the least.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 19 Apr 2009, 15:25
I pretty much have nothing to say ever about paladins because I generally know fuck all about the class.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 19 Apr 2009, 16:07
Dude, my point was that he said nothing about instances and you kept bringing up instances. I was hoping that post would just end all of this nonsense because it's really annoying, but obviously not! It's a fucking game! Move on!

If paladins had more ranged attacks, I'd be all over that. I love having a pally tank in my group. Great buffs, great auras, and high damage when you know what you're doing.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jimor on 19 Apr 2009, 17:07
The patch change for paladins I'm liking is that exorcism now can be used against any opponent, not just undead. With undead and demons now, it always crits. Not having a ranged attack of some kind is the biggest pain, but can't have everything.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Beren on 19 Apr 2009, 17:08
You guys are dum.

I'm so tired of my guild. I gave up my raiding slot. We have 10 or so good raiders out of 30, the officers don't bother to read strats for fights until we get there to do them. Our raid leader doesn't log on for anything except for raids. Bleh.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 19 Apr 2009, 18:04
The patch change for paladins I'm liking is that exorcism now can be used against any opponent, not just undead. With undead and demons now, it always crits. Not having a ranged attack of some kind is the biggest pain, but can't have everything.

This has been a long time problem I've had as a feral Druid. Grinding/farming in a heavily populated area is just a fucking pain in the ass because I have to get right up there to tag something. They helped a bit by giving a low amount of damage to feral faerie fire in bear form, but cat form is still without a ranged attack. They've been saying for a good while that they were going to alter faerie fire so that its application would tag an enemy, but I'm still finding myself hitting shit with faerie fire, only for it to amount to little more than debuffing the thing for some douche bag Ally jumping in on something I was practically on top of.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 19 Apr 2009, 18:15
This is pretty much every day of my life as a rogue.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 19 Apr 2009, 18:45
Rogues at least have thrown weapons. Not exactly ideal, but not much worse off than using a bow.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 19 Apr 2009, 19:21
At least it is something to tag with?  I use my thrown weapon all the time to tag from a distance.  I'll generally tag it to get it out of wherever the hell it is, then back up a bit and charge it once it's safe to do so.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 19 Apr 2009, 21:11
Faerie fire doesn't tag? I've never had that problem, but I really haven't had to compete with horde much on my druid when it comes to things I want to kill. I also rarely use faerie fire anymore because I just snag things with moonfire and just nuke them to fast to even bother with it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 19 Apr 2009, 21:45
Feral faerie fire doesn't tag things in cat form. It will aggro them, but not tag them.

I'm unsure if this has changed since 3.1, but it's happened to me as recently as a week before it hit. It didn't really come up before hitting Outland, but I hit Outland right around the same time Wrath dropped and it became an extremely apparent problem. I ended up with a lot of cases of a Death Knight death gripping something I'd hit with Faerie Fire, robbing me of the tag before it got into melee range.

 Also, it's not the horde I have the problem with, it's Alliance.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 20 Apr 2009, 05:09
I said horde because I'm alliance and you're horde and said alliance. Problems with opposite factions.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jimor on 20 Apr 2009, 08:13
Oh gods, noob mistake. Putting something in AH for 20s instead of 20g.  :oops:

EDIT: and then Karma smiles and gives me a nice blue weapon drop I can probably sell for 4x as much, LOL.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Tyler on 20 Apr 2009, 12:12
So far I have seen Yakob and Jon and Linds on Ravencrest. Come to me, my pretties. You shall all be mine soon.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: pen on 20 Apr 2009, 12:20
I've got a couple up on Ravencrest, but I haven't seen you on or I'd have said hello.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 20 Apr 2009, 12:29
Rogues at least have thrown weapons. Not exactly ideal, but not much worse off than using a bow.

Actually, using a bow is god awful if you're not a hunter. Hunters have autoshot, which increases their range to 35 and eliminates the 1.5 casting speed when firing a ranged weapon. For non-hunters, bows are honest to god pretty useless when it comes to getting to a mob first thanks to casting time and because you need to train with the damned things to avoid having a ridiculous miss rate; I've never really used one for anything other than pulling in some instances on a warrior. Between the cast time, the projectile travel time, and cat form's movement speed bonus and feral charge, I'd take my kitty over my rogue every time when it comes to racing to tag a mob; if nothing else I can shift to cheetah then drop to caster once in range and nail 'em with moonfire. Thrown weapons are a bit better off since they have a .5 second casting speed, but they're still hardly ideal and often have worse attributes than ranged weapon of the equivalent item level. Personally, I have a gun equipped now and no ammo in my bags because it's worthless compared to sprint and Fan of Knives.


Also, I'm now not sure at all how much I'll play on Ravencrest 'cuz I'm switching to a guild that fits my needs a bit better now.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 20 Apr 2009, 12:37
On my rogue, I just see my ranged slot as another place to stack attributes. I never train my thrown, bows or guns because I hardly ever pull using them and even when I do a miss still pulls the mob.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Beren on 20 Apr 2009, 15:29
There are mobs in which you can't get into melee range for 30 seconds or so. You could be doing over a hundred dps with a ranged weapon. :O
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 20 Apr 2009, 15:46
So far I have seen Yakob and Jon and Linds on Ravencrest. Come to me, my pretties. You shall all be mine soon.

I saw Alex and Est (but only for 5 sec) and you. Rachel, what are your characters?

Also, I think I will be playing my DK Ceiva.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: pen on 20 Apr 2009, 15:49
Zediculus and Kanna.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 20 Apr 2009, 16:33
There are mobs in which you can't get into melee range for 30 seconds or so. You could be doing over a hundred dps with a ranged weapon. :O

Really? Which ones? If you can find a WotLK fight in which I really should be using ranged rather than concentrating on positioning and avoiding damage or bandaging, I'll give you a cookie. Keep in mind that I've been pushing at least 2.5k dps once buffed from pretty much the first day I had a piece or two of badge gear. If taking the time to fire off an arrow causes me to lose a a second or two of time on target, it can become a net loss rather quickly, and the discrepancy will only get worse the better my gear gets.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 20 Apr 2009, 17:48
Alright guys, just started my first char on my first real account.

He is Chorbrak on Jaedenar, Im a lvl 15 Orcish Shaman and enjoy long walks on the beach and donations of Blues
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 20 Apr 2009, 18:02
Can't donate you blues if you're not on Ravencrest!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: BeoPuppy on 21 Apr 2009, 02:00
And I just ticked off the box 3000 quests completed.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Beren on 21 Apr 2009, 03:50
There are mobs in which you can't get into melee range for 30 seconds or so. You could be doing over a hundred dps with a ranged weapon. :O

Really? Which ones? If you can find a WotLK fight in which I really should be using ranged rather than concentrating on positioning and avoiding damage or bandaging, I'll give you a cookie. Keep in mind that I've been pushing at least 2.5k dps once buffed from pretty much the first day I had a piece or two of badge gear. If taking the time to fire off an arrow causes me to lose a a second or two of time on target, it can become a net loss rather quickly, and the discrepancy will only get worse the better my gear gets.

Hitting the mobs on Kel before the aboms get there. There's trash you shouldn't be meleeing. I'm sure I could think of half a dozen more. =P

Being a druid I know there are a lot of times where I have to just twitch patiently until I can hit a mob.

On another note, fuck XT and his fucking enrage timer and having two or three dps not pulling past 4000 so we're having a pain of a time making it. I am, however, really happy with sustained feral dps on a steady target. I'm pulling 5800 on the best attempts for 3-4 minutes. It's sexy.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Apr 2009, 10:42
The banshees actually only fire off their knockback if they're close enough to whoever has agg; meleeing them as a rogue is actually surprisingly manageable if you watch your threat. I FoK the skellies.

Most of the time though I just don't take a rogue to ke (unless we need the interrupts).


I've got some free time on the ol' raiding schedule this week, so I've decided to re-roll Bludgeon as an orc DK to farm up some cash for my Belf priest Akhilesh. Belfs are easily the lamest horde race, but Arcane Torrent is better than flasks and only costs a global cooldown. Besides, those two class selections can easily be tweaked to cover whatever class role I want.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 25 Apr 2009, 08:46
God, why do I keep running into crappy shadow priests? Their job is not hard. These people should just download Event Horizon (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T6b49x87uGk) already and quit making me QQ. Christ.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Beren on 25 Apr 2009, 10:37
Guy in my guild hit gold cap today.

(http://img220.imageshack.us/img220/8406/goldcap.th.jpg) (http://img220.imageshack.us/my.php?image=goldcap.jpg)

Fucker.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 25 Apr 2009, 10:53
Yeah, you won't ever see me hit the gold cap. Just not enough motivation; beyond a certain point it's all just bragging rights anyway. I can't really get past 15 or 20k without wondering why I even bother to loot things anymore.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 01 May 2009, 14:12
Who needs gold when you have Titanguard (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=45110) with blade ward on it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 01 May 2009, 20:08
So I've started playing again - rolled a belf priest on Saurfang. It's a fairly new server (only opened in January this year), so there are plenty of low level people running about which makes questing and stuff a bit easier. I may end up transferring the toon over to another server with more people doing end-game stuff later on, but we'll see how it goes.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: messeduplilkid on 04 May 2009, 12:39
Yay guild downed Yogg Saron last night!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 04 May 2009, 16:20
We can only do razorscale and the first dude, but the molten rocks guy was at 12% tonite :) Good fun.

In other news 10g40s repair bill per death is... soul destroying.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 04 May 2009, 20:29
Oh yeah and I started playing again. Fuck this game. Level 12 human paladin on Darkspear EU.

Started a new account?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: thegreatbuddha on 05 May 2009, 17:18
Anyone roll ally on Altar of Storms?

Just /gquit over some BS and am looking to MT for a guild not filled with douchery
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 05 May 2009, 19:08
Yeah, I've started a belf priest on Saurfang - only level 12 now and shit it's hard to level. It was never this hard when I leveled my mage. At least it doesn't take as LONG to level, but still, I hate being killed by one mob, going back to get my body and not having enough mana for when it attacks me while trying to escape. It sucks and is painful

I've been doing the children's week acheivements on my mage - only the pvp one to go. My second spec is for pvp, which means nothing really because I have no idea what I'm doing in pvp, so I see how well I do at trying to get that last achievement for the title.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: michaelicious on 05 May 2009, 19:13
You guys should have tried levelling a priest back in 2005.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 05 May 2009, 19:21
The key to leveling a priest at low levels: Get your hands on a wand as soon as possible!

Typical early rotation I would use: PWS, pull with a smite, SWP, mind blast, maybe another smite and then wand the bitch to death. It gives you a head start on some mana regen while doing some pretty decent damage.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 05 May 2009, 19:48
Yeah, that's pretty much what I've been doing - my wands, daggers and maces are maxed out for my current level, which is cool. It's fun though, this is my first horde toon so there is all this stuff I haven't done/seen before, which is awesome.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 05 May 2009, 20:23
I think I'm going to cancel my account again. I've been getting bored with it again. Sorry Tyler.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 06 May 2009, 01:30
Honestly, I've never liked playing a priest until at least the mid teens when you can finally have Mind Blast, Psychic Scream and Spirit Tap. For whatever reason Blizzard was just really stingy when it came to handing out low level versions of some of the best priest soloing tools. It always hit me as kind of silly, particularly compared to warlocks,* who can end up with a pet, 2 dots, Curse of Weakness and a nuke by level 4, all of which have rather obvious solo applications. By level 10 Locks get two pets to choose from along with good ol' Fear and Lifetap to play around with as well as a third dot. Meanwhile Priests are adding Fade, Resurrection and (thank God) their first rank of Mind Blast. Nothing wrong with those spells, mind you, it's just that only the last one is really useful at level 10, which is something that hits me as a rather needlessly discouraging.


*That is meant in no way as a dig at warlocks. Low level locks are fun and powerful; if anything they should be seen as a shining example.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 06 May 2009, 04:52
Spirit tap doesn't help that at all?
At level 72 I'm having no mana trouble at all due to spirit tap. Going for meditation now that I filled out shadow but mostly for lazyness.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 06 May 2009, 05:16
Oh, I thought you rerolled 'lock. :-D
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: philharmonic on 06 May 2009, 07:28
So Ravencrest seems to be the realm of choice for peeps in here eh! Kinda sucks to be me then. My bro in Ontario got me into WoW long before I ever noticed this thread. As a result I've made my toons on Echo Iles. My mage I named Penpen (inspired by Penelope) is at last check level 33. I also got a Gnome Warrior on Borean Tundra. Grind On. Perhaps i'll look into making a horde toon to grind on Ravencrest in the future.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 06 May 2009, 09:05
Well, I haven't really played on Ravencrest much, tbh. IRL keeps rearing its head.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 06 May 2009, 10:23
I've been spending time primarily on my Ravencrest Shaman lately. That's been cut into this week, though, since I've been working on CHildren's Week and the Argent Tournament on my Llane Druid.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 06 May 2009, 18:36
Finally got 'Matron Ayniah'. I tried pvp, and I just get so annoyed with it so fast so I gave up. The boy was trying to help me but he was only getting frustrated about me not knowing what I was doing. I gave up and went back to watching House. He logged on and then spent another hour getting the remaining three pvp things so I could get my Children's Week thing complete. Finally, all done, YAY.

I've got 'Matron', 'Jenkins' and 'Champion of the Frozen Wastes' now. Going to spend some time getting the boy his 'Champion of the Frozen Wastes', because for some reason, he hasn't got it yet. I actually really like the achievement system, it gives me something else to work on when I get bored of the constant grind for gold.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 06 May 2009, 19:07
I absolutely hate the Oprhan PvP achievements. No offense to you, Jamie, but you kind of exhibit why. It basically broke PvP for the week because you had tons of people coming into PvP and just going for the achievements while ignoring the actual point.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 06 May 2009, 21:24
/ding

Just hit 31 on my Orc Shaman, only 9 lvls to go before I can duel wield like a badass
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 06 May 2009, 23:43
The though thing with hiting 40 witha shammy is getting the right weapons. Your going to do ZF quite alot. (Good mace from the cave boss, and really good axe from the last boss.)
My shaman hit 44 just a few days ago so just did that grinding.

But right now I'm trying to decide what class to level frist. I want to try a no multi purpos class (or really just a class not being able to heal). But can't decied between mage, rogue or warrior. I want to differ as much as possible from my other classes, Priest, Druid (boomkin, leveled to 68 as feral) and paladin. Also got an enhancement shaman att 44, but wasn't very fun to play it turns out. I guess warlock is an option but never really liked them.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 07 May 2009, 01:54
See, I didn't just go in there do the achievement and get the hell out - I actually made some effort in terms of attacking the other team (horde) and trying to build up some honor etc. I did make a decent effort at it, I just got so easily frustrated because I am just not very good at it. I would kind of like to be better, but it's just a complete adjustment from PvE stuff.

And yes Jeans - I play the game for fun, the achievements make it more fun for me. I don't see the point about getting super serious about killing some of the opposing faction.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: philharmonic on 07 May 2009, 06:44
If by PvP you mean Warsong Gultch then I can relate. Went there and didn't have a clue what to do. My daugher (plays lvl35 blood elf) suggested i msg the team and stay to gaurd our flag. Simple right? Nope other team comes in with 4 ppl. At least the rez comes fast there. An I managed to get in 1 hounerable kill on the way back from graveyard. YAY FUN !!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 07 May 2009, 10:27
Depends what your class is. Always a good idea to have a tanking class guarding the flag, but you should never leave them alone. I like to see a tank and a healer hanging out in there. Gives enough time to call in reserves, should you get mobbed.

This seems like it should be common sense, but I've seen my fair share of clothies trying to guard the flag on their own get absolutely destroyed. As I've said before, I think a BM hunter or a feral Druid is best for guarding it. Either one has track humanoid, which is great for getting advanced warning when a bunch of them are after you.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 07 May 2009, 12:42
I absolutely hate the Oprhan PvP achievements. No offense to you, Jamie, but you kind of exhibit why. It basically broke PvP for the week because you had tons of people coming into PvP and just going for the achievements while ignoring the actual point.

If they were having fun, I'd say they got it right...

Well, the thing is, it's like you have weekly paintball matches with your friends, right? And one day, about half of your teammates are swapped out for new guys who just came because they wanted to fingerpaint, and so at random intervals that is just what they do. They're still having fun, but it's still kind of a bummer if you came to actually try to win anything.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 07 May 2009, 13:00
See, I would hold that management should have thought things out a bit better when making a mixed venue. It's like with achievements in TF2. I totally understand why everyone was simultaneously playing the scout. I just sort of wish Valve had handled the incentives differently.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 07 May 2009, 13:11
All I'm saying is that you can't expect everyone to be happy about it. I don't see anyone boycotting the game over it, but I do think there's definite reasons why it's getting mixed reviews. The hardcore guys have just as much right to what they enjoy as anyone else.

I don't even do bgs or have done any of the orphan events, so it doesn't really matter to me. I just think Jon's complaint has some legitimacy even if I can understand the other side of the argument.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 07 May 2009, 14:19
Pretty sure most of the achievements had alot to do with what you need to do to win the BG.

Thoughts on Ulduar anyone? I like it alot.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 07 May 2009, 14:48
Haven't gotten to do it. My guild is mid-power struggle atm and I may have to stage a minor coup.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 07 May 2009, 15:12
This seems like it should be common sense, but I've seen my fair share of clothies trying to guard the flag on their own get absolutely destroyed. As I've said before, I think a BM hunter or a feral Druid is best for guarding it. Either one has track humanoid, which is great for getting advanced warning when a bunch of them are after you.

When I was feral, I'd always guard the flag because very few people remembered to do this! I think the most fun I had with it was me, an elemental shaman, and a hunter. Traps and totems all around the flag, the hunter positioned above, the shaman hiding in a corner and me stealthed right on top of the flag. Everyone who ran in on their own was killed and groups made really good fights. Actually, I think that was the only time I remember winning WSG...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 07 May 2009, 15:25
Pretty sure most of the achievements had alot to do with what you need to do to win the BG.

This is true, essentially, but it leads to a problem of "too many generals." When you've got half of your group in WSG or Eye of the Storm all gunning for the same flag, people stop thinking about the team and start employing an every man for themself mentality. As a RAIDer, imagine if one of the Achievements were "personally deliver a killing blow on Yogg Saron." Imagine how absolutely bad that would fuck the pecking order of a RAID group and put that mentality in the shoes of a PVP fan. Eye of the Storm is no fun when everyone there is camping the flag instead of guarding towers or trying to get the flag for themselves.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 07 May 2009, 15:38
Yeah, unless you're a disc priest you really don't have much business trying to play ironman. Even then they're pretty dependent on cooldowns to really play the endurance game.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 07 May 2009, 16:13
For the record, I don't think PvP should be without its holiday achievements, I just think we'd be better served with stuff along the lines of "win such and such battleground with your Orphan out."
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 09 May 2009, 18:45
One of my guildies took their alt on a Naxx 25 pug last night that had no less than 7 DKs in it-- he would have quit immediately but we insisted he stay in it and give us a play by play over vent. Guess how well that turned out!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 09 May 2009, 23:59
dangit leatherworking sucks I havent had more than 20g since before I bought mount training
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 10 May 2009, 00:29
Professions aren't for making money.

Well, except maybe enchanting, and even then it's never the enchanting itself that makes you money, just the disenchanting process.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 10 May 2009, 00:48
Well how do you make money, seems like every item I pick up is soulbound or shit greens
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 10 May 2009, 00:58
Quest.

Either that or take up enchanting and DE everything and sell the mats you get.

Either that or figure out the economy on your particular server and get really acquainted with the AH.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 10 May 2009, 01:07
Mining never hurt anyone's pocketbook either, particularly on established servers where longtime players don't hesistate for a second when it comes to paying 8 gold a citrine just to power level jewelcrafting on their 7th alt.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 10 May 2009, 01:47
Dont want to take the time to master the AH, and at lvl 33 the 25-50 silver a quest isn't enough.

Is it worth it to dump my lvl 160 leatherworking for mining or enchanting?  And just power lvl skinning once I have a million skins at a later date?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: thegreatbuddha on 10 May 2009, 03:05
Look through your AH and find something that's way overpriced for its level and rarity, and then farm it. Looking to see prices over multiple days is they key here, and Auctioneer will help a lot.

Case in point, on Jubei I regularly farm Wool Cloth. I can get 4-6 stacks per hour grinding mobs in the Barrens, and they sell for 10-20g a stack (Horde AH).

If you roll on a PvE server it may be possible to take advantage of price differences between Horde And Alliance AHs if you have toons on both sides. Put your stuff you want to Xfer up on a neutral AH (there's one in Gadgetzan) for a ridiculously low price, log on to the other side, and purchase it. You might need 2 accounts for that, I'm not sure....
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 10 May 2009, 05:22
One of my guildies took their alt on a Naxx 25 pug last night that had no less than 7 DKs in it-- he would have quit immediately but we insisted he stay in it and give us a play by play over vent. Guess how well that turned out!
Naxx 25 is well and truly on farm, half the raid is alts but it's okay because the mains can pick up the slack pretty easily. It's when they bring alts to 10 mans when people are trying for the achievement or to get one piece of gear that it fucks everyone off not being able to get past the first boss in the arachnid quarter because the healers are in blues and greens with 1ksp.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 10 May 2009, 07:51
If you want to make money and not actually make items, gathering professions are going to be the best bet. Skinning, herbalism, and mining are all useful and have materials that are used in all the creation professions. Also, you can make money by selling DE mats, like shards, etc. which are always overpriced and people will always buy since they aren't easy to come by. But I like having a gathering profession and then one other profession that I find useful. My druid is an herb/alch and I sell more herbs than anything else, other than the rarer flasks and transmutes. My hunter is a miner/engineer and engineering is the most selfish profession ever (you can't sell much of what you make, because a lot of stuff requires engineering to use), but I sell a lot of ore on the AH. And I power leveled skinning in a few hours on my DK and got a ton of money on the leather. Really if you find out what sells really well with your profession and sell that, then you'll do well. Also spamming LFW in trade sometimes works. (I only ever do that with transmute cooldowns anymore.)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 10 May 2009, 08:51
Well I refuse to pump the time necessary for any of your suggestions thegreatbuddha.  I have one lvl 33 character and am not going to roll anther any time soon.

That being said, I have 3 friends who play, one already has a get rich quick scheme involving DEing items, so I think Ill go mine.

As far as alt professions go, skinning is pretty integral to my build as I am an enhance shammy, the boost to my crit it gives me is important, especially with so little gear choices.  But thanks for the input, you have been most helpful, gracias.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 10 May 2009, 08:56
Yeah, Linds is right. Production professions are not the way to make money at a lower level. Once you hit the top levels, you can make tons. I make about 110 gold for a leather bag that takes maybe fifteen minutes to farm the mats for, but I was always broke in the lower levels.

If you want to make money, pair up a couple gathering professions. Scan the auction house and see which mats are most expensive. I'd recommend skinning and herbalism, as they rarely involve going out of your way.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 10 May 2009, 10:58
Naxx 25 is well and truly on farm, half the raid is alts but it's okay because the mains can pick up the slack pretty easily. It's when they bring alts to 10 mans when people are trying for the achievement or to get one piece of gear that it fucks everyone off not being able to get past the first boss in the arachnid quarter because the healers are in blues and greens with 1ksp.

Keep in mind that my server (Grizzly Hills) is kind of a unique case since it is exactly as old as WotLK and it was created as a true "fresh" server rather than a migration server, so nobody could transfer over until halfway through February, so there's a high portion of newbs and rejects looking for a fresh start. The top guild on the server (all vets who rerolled together) had a bunch of internal conflicts and went through about a month and a half period of time where they had no rogues or shamans at all and recently about half of them ended up transferring off the server because there isn't much to recruit from here. So, yeah, anyone with a lick of organization has Naxx 25 on farm here, but that doesn't apply to the general population. Plus, according to Wow census, about 38% of the player base is either a DK or hunter.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 10 May 2009, 16:34
Because hunters are easy as shit to pull good dps... as are DK's (and mages but they are a little more gear reliant) if my raid experience is anything to go by. Yeah you get a few shitters but they are not so much par for the course, DK's and hunters are ezmoed to good dps and level mega fast.

Hunters are good in pretty much any fight, melee DPS isn't always great and casters can be volatile in certain fights so hunters are a safe bet for DPS, you are right about your server I guess, I am just lucky I found a guild that suits me on a fucking ace server with alot of my friends on it.

Professions for me are all about what they give you, mining gives me 50 stam or 500 hp or summit I dunno so that is pretty sweet as a tank, but JC get awesome gems to use and skinners get more crit, BS can put 2 more sockets on their gear than anyone else and can make the belt buckle for anyone.

That is now what I take into account when choosing professions rolling a new char because fuck unlearning something.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 10 May 2009, 16:39
Oh, they're great classes. I've ran with 3 dks and a hunter in 10 man naxx and done just fine plenty of times, and in 25 man it's even easier to fit in a half dozen or so DKs and hunters without any problem. It's just that pugs aren't happening here. At some point somebody needs to be healing and it's kind of hard to get much going in the way of buff synergy when nearly half the people interested in pugging hunters and DKs who refuse to tank. On my server, I can name exactly 3 shamans I have ever raided with, and that's including VoA pugs. :(

Healers are cherished here, like a rare flower.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jimor on 10 May 2009, 19:41
For spending money for my low level toons, I have a nice setup. There's a guy on my server who for some reason is trying to corner the market on colored linen shirts so he can sell them for 2g each. So for 2 stacks of raw linen, I can make 9 shirts, usually 3 red, green and blue, then I put them on AH for 1.5g. He immediately buys them and relists at 2g. After the dye and thread expenses, I'm basically making 6g per stack of plain linen.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 10 May 2009, 20:08
Someone sold a stack of Large Radiant Shards for 50g, I had 25g at the time, my friend had the rest, and they sell for around 9g on my server, Ive already sold 2 at 9, sell one more and I basically break even, the rest is profit, cha-ching.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 10 May 2009, 20:13
I think the only low level production profession that made me money was alchemy and purely because of health and mana potions. Higher level ones aren't selling so well, so I don't make them unless I want some for me, but mid range ones made me a lot of gold. Now I think the only ones I routinely put in the AH and expect to sell are agility potions, which I find kind of weird. (Like seriously, agility potions and stacks of cloth are the first things to sell when I put stuff in AH.)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 10 May 2009, 20:24
Agility potions aren't surprising. I go through shit tons of them on my Rogue and once I hit seventies/eighties on my Rogue, I'll probably start sending high level ones along to my Druid.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 10 May 2009, 20:38
I'm a little surprised; I use Flasks of Rage and Potion of Speed pretty much exclusively, with the odd Runic Healing potion thrown in once in a while; usually I get enough of the latter just from pickpocketing during dailies, however.


EDIT: Perhaps it's a survival hunter thing; I just remembered that they can dip into talents to convert Intellect to a straight attack power boost as well as a 15% agility boosting talent. That means for some people I could see a Mighty Thoughts+Mighty Agility elixir combo being a good alternative to flasking, whereas the Flask of Endless Rage is the top rogue buff pretty much by default due to a lack of interesting guardian elixirs.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 11 May 2009, 15:27
TBH once you have an 80, even if you don't do dailies the majority of cash is easy to come by if you put in any effort at all. The rest of your cash will be from levelling alts, when you realise where to spend money levelling you spend so much less and from 50-80 will make a super ass ton of gold just from BoE drops and quests (selling quest rewards too).

Just get a char to 65ish asap spending as little gold as possible, will do you good in the long run.

In other news, the main raiding guilds on my server have been dropping like flies and reforming together under new names, this can only be a good thing for putting Hellscream up there with the big boy servers, maybe it will become the alli answer to maggy :D
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 11 May 2009, 19:17
No I meant weird as in how much less health/mana pots I was selling compared to agility.

Also, I was bored so I played quite a bit today. I may or may not stop playing, who knows. But I have to say the quest chain towards the end of questing in Dragonblight was pretty cool. (There's the video of a battle and then a bunch of people @ Fordragon Hold dying and then you end up raiding Undercity with the king of Stormwind.) I am so happy that they are involving so much more of the lore into game play. It makes it more interesting and I hope that isn't the last quest chain in the game that is like that. (The whole starting area for DKs is similar, but I haven't seen many more.)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 11 May 2009, 19:39
Nothing else past it really compares, though there are some pretty cool quest chains in Storm Peaks and Icecrown concerning the Sons of Hodir and a young ghost boy (Whom I won't go into much detail on to save you some spoilers) respectively. The Wrath Gate event is pretty much the biggest quest line event of the game as far as I experienced. Although, from the Horde end, it involves heading to Undercity with Thrall and Sylvannas instead (Culminating in a brief standoff with that bitch little twit Varian).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 12 May 2009, 02:17
How to make 250+ g in 30 min:
Take one 80 tank, one 80 healer and two 80 dps. Go to Shatrath. Fly to Doom lord Kazzak. Kill. ~130 g.
Mount up. Fly ower to Shadowmoon and Doomwalker. Kill. ~130 g.

Also, sell the BoE items that dropp (2 from each) on AH and get another 400+ g. (That was on my server, EU Kazzak. 100g a piece was probably a little cheap.)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: philharmonic on 12 May 2009, 06:35
Did "Rituals of Power" last night with my mage. Getting into the monastary solo was easy enough. Right up till they start coming at you 2 by 2. On my 2nd rez there was a lvl70 hunter and his pet that was awesome enough to tank me through it. Even though I only wanted the one item the dudes like "well take this and that and if you don't want then sell or auction later". Blew me away. I cant wait til I get to that level so I can go return the favor to some one else. I guess cash flow at that level isn't much of a problem for someone like that. Anyway OK NOW GET BACK TO WORK lol
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 12 May 2009, 10:21
I've done that a couple of times. Dude was quite probably looking for the Achievements. Couple months back, I was grinding my way through old world dungeons on a level eighty just for the Achievements, and I typically dragged someone along for the sake of there actually being a point to it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 12 May 2009, 14:54
People do that and put it on FFA not to be nice, but because there is no point in looting, at that lv the loot isn't worth stopping to rclick, if someone loots it for you, you still get half the gold.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 12 May 2009, 15:03
Pretty much. As long as they don't lag too far behind you, it'll get them easy crap experience. I actually had an occasion running Rachel through Razorfen Kraul where she was low enough she leveled once or twice.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 12 May 2009, 15:10
Yeah, I've been thinking of going through all the old dungeons and getting the achievements, even though I did most of them and should already have the achievements. But hey. It'd be an easy way to get a bunch of trash and it's always fun to see just how fast you can kill things around half your level.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 12 May 2009, 15:17
It's so easy to get careless, but you'll probably do better than I did. I'd never done any of the dungeons, so I didn't know anything. The first trouble I ran into was Scarlet Monastery. I got careless and got mobbed at the end of, I think, the Cathedral. I managed to survive it, barely, but I wasn't so lucky when the same thing happened in Dire Maul and Lower Blackrock Spire.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 12 May 2009, 16:34
That's pretty understandable if you'd never done the Scarlet Monestary before. All the adds past the Cathedral gate are linked to Scarlet Commander Mograine; no matter how you engage him, any mob left standing will come to his aid.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 12 May 2009, 16:37
Yep, I learned that one the hard way. Seeing as how I ran it on my own, I didn't see the need to go around killing everything, I just headed for the boss. I whacked him, he went down in one hit and then suddenly I had a few dozen 30 something elites on top of me. I went into bear form, popped survival of the fittest, berserk and bark skin and just started hitting swipe and mangle like a madman. I barely survived. The same cannot be said of when I pulled the exact same idiot move in Dire Maul and was raped to death by trees.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 12 May 2009, 16:44
Yeah, that's one of those situations where the sole drawback of being a bear tank becomes readily apparent. Against heavy hitters shield block isn't that incredible, but against a ridiculous number of pokes block is pretty godly and easily more than makes up for the (relative!) lack of armor warriors/paladins have compared to a kitted out bear.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 12 May 2009, 20:22
Well, it turns out I can run Stockades in 15 minutes. Oh starfall, typhoon, and hurricane, how I love thee. Damn it feels good to be a boomkin.

And yeah, SM library and armory are pretty easy to solo (I've run guildies through it before and it was cake) but I don't know about cathedral. I will try it and see, but if I've ever got the inkling to do DM, Scholo, Strath, BRS, or the other upper classic instances, I'll just offer to run people through. Right now I'm just going to do the ones under level 40 and see how those go and work my way up if I really feel like it. Also it'd be fun to get Jenkins.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 12 May 2009, 22:18
Cathedral's actually pretty easy and I used to do it fairly often as a hunter at 60, although obviously it helped that I knew not to pull the whole room at once. It's really only a problem if you're just bulling through the thing and happen to be OOM/hurt when you activate the entire room. Personally, as a rogue, all I need to do is hit FoK and Evasion and I can take on the whole interior at once and win very, very quickly.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 13 May 2009, 06:28
1 pulling SM cath is funny as shit, thunderclap and shockwave then keep shield block up they hit like flies before dropping like them too. Demoralising shout makes it even better.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 13 May 2009, 06:46
Consecration, sealf of light and holy shield. But paladins are a bit op in those situation imho.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 13 May 2009, 10:06
Anyone with AoE can do it, mages with arcane explosion, DK's with D&D and unholy swarm, rogues with fan of knives... it's not hard to do but the most fun I have had was on a prot warrior doing it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 13 May 2009, 12:15
Prot warriors are fun to do that kinda thing with mostly because you definitely get the feeling that you could go afk grab a coke and still be standing when you come back. Whereas with my rogue I actually, you know, take damage. On the upside, I mowed through them so quickly that it bordered upon being anti-climactic.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 13 May 2009, 14:24
It's the Barrens. What'd you expect, fun and cupcakes?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 13 May 2009, 15:23
Well after dumping skinning for mining, and mining roughly two deposits because I have level nothing of mining I cant help but think that was a bit of a fail for money making.

That being said, off that 25g investment Im now sitting at a pretty much full upgrade to all my gear and about 150g-170g and own the Large Radiant Shard and Wool Market
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 14 May 2009, 05:47
You just have to keep mining. Stacks of copper ore (or any ore really) will make you quite a bit of money, trust us. Just make sure to leave it as ore and not bars.

So since I'm partially stupid and couldn't seem to find the entrance to Deadmines (I always followed people, shut up), I did SM graveyard and library instead! It was also really really fun to kill about 10 elites at once with two spells and not have much damage done to me, I'm not going to lie. Now I just have to get someone to let me into the locked parts, because I don't seem to have a key for whatever reason. Also I made more money out of Stockades trash than I was expecting, because for whatever reason wool is in high demand right now.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: philharmonic on 14 May 2009, 06:47
Could it be us grinders killing all the sheep for wool? I went just outside of Stormwind to try out some new stuff on the defias there. Ended up targeting a sheep by accident. Some other guy was there and he's like "oh sure loot those guys BUT THE SHEEP IS MINE!!!"
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 14 May 2009, 09:58
Linds, have you finished the boss in the Armory yet? She drops the key to the rest of SM.

And nothing beats sneaking into the Stockades Horde side all by your lonesome.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 14 May 2009, 12:06
Apparently not, but I will do it again because I honestly don't know why I don't have that key.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 14 May 2009, 12:08
Linds, have you finished the boss in the Armory yet? She drops the key to the rest of SM.

Actually the key is in a chest in the room where you fight the last boss in the Library.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 14 May 2009, 12:12
I meant to say Library, considering you need that key to even get into the Armory. I thought she had it on her, though.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 14 May 2009, 12:22
Daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaamn it. No wonder I never got it. GUH. I'll run though it again though, Library is insanely easy.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 14 May 2009, 15:21
Lol barrens chat because YOUR MUM is a good subject to discuss on the most boring part of the internet.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 14 May 2009, 23:22
At least i hvent't seen any krol blade spam in quite some time.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 15 May 2009, 06:54
Last night in trade, people were talking about lynching and then about bacon in attempts to change the topic. This is why I never hang out in cities...

Got the SM key and finished the last two wings in about 45 min last night. Where to go next... maybe sneak into Ogrimmar?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 15 May 2009, 17:14
Dirge and willy seem to be popular on this server, on SWC it was all about the thunderfury.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: messeduplilkid on 19 May 2009, 10:00
Downed Yogg in my 10 man tonight. Also did Hardest mode of Council!

Ulduar is the most fun I've had as a healer since the end of Black Temple.

 
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 19 May 2009, 13:18
I like raiding with my guild, I also like watching scrubs, but when they are one and the same...

It's shit.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 25 May 2009, 00:49
Finally the guild have enough people online to do naxx25, and whoopie LOOT for me!
T7.5 Shoulders and Chest, new boots, and neck. Sad part is that a warrior who was dps but tank in mainspec stole the shield from patchwork. :(
Also some random healing plate but haven't healed since level 40 anyway.
Edit:  oh and new waist as well. Hopefully I will be a bit better as off tank in ulduar now. Oh and head as well! Damn, was a good run yesterday.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 25 May 2009, 20:21
I logged in to an interesting error earlier this evening:

(http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w274/Yakob42/WoWScrnShot_052509_223238.jpg)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 26 May 2009, 17:54
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2440/3568810434_103c6eb1a1_b.jpg)

Skeleton surfing a chopper doing drivebys with a shotgun in ulduar...

Was funnier when we had the power to turn each other into bunnies and the RL/MT was a bunny on a chopper.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 31 May 2009, 14:39
So far I have seen Yakob and Jon and Linds on Ravencrest. Come to me, my pretties. You shall all be mine soon.

hey guys remember when we were all going to make toons on khaz modan? whatever happened to that?

i do have one on ravencrest though, an orc warrior named naraikona. (yes, another warrior. gonna try speccing arms instead of fury this time though) if anyone could help me out with some bags and gear, that'd be fantastic. i am really in desperate need of bags. i have none whatsoever. :|

also, i am finally going to get around to buying wrath of the lich king soon now that there's a point in me having it.  i can has death knight?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 31 May 2009, 17:08
I made an alt on Khaz Modan back then, but I was still leveling my main at the time, so I never went anywhere with him.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 31 May 2009, 17:43
I jumped ship to what is one of the very few functional raid guilds on my server now, so I doubt I'll be active on Ravencrest.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 31 May 2009, 19:02
active?  nah, probably not but i am there and we can chat and quest together and whatnot. it will be be fun times?
 
do we have a guild or not so much? i kind of ended up joining a random guild because this guy just offered to pay me 2g to sign his charter but i ended up staying there cause the people are friendly and not total noobs. so yeah. 
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 01 Jun 2009, 05:50
5 bosses into ulduar and we are kinda stuck now, every week it seems we steamroll the first 5 bosses with no problems then BLAM! no more progress. Crap.

In other news, dual boxxing triple xp is awesome, undead warrior/priest is pretty good and so is druid/shammy + anything.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 01 Jun 2009, 13:03
A couple friends of mine decided to come back to warcraft and abused that system recently. Apparently they set up a mage twobox and simply shared the accounts until 80 and then each took one of the mages as their main. I can easily imagine how being able to portal AND summon eachother along with standard smart hearthstone use could keep time wasted on training and turning in quests to a minimum. Apparently a lot of the downtime disappears once you've got enough firepower to simply burn mobs down without having to dink around with crowd control as well.


[EDIT]

5 bosses into ulduar and we are kinda stuck now, every week it seems we steamroll the first 5 bosses with no problems then BLAM! no more progress. Crap.


Yeah, my guild is 7 kills in with what I kind of think of as our A-list group but when we don't have all our top guys available we occasionally have a rough time getting past 5 or 6 kills. In terms of raw skill I think most of our raiders are actually pretty evenly matched (we rarely if ever screw up the kinds of things that lead to immediate deaths), but we do have a few healers and casters who are a bit undergeared for various reasons which has resulted in making the endurance matchups like Ignis a bit nastier than they should be, which of course then leads to having less time to really work on the fights that REALLY give us a trouble. It's a good thing that gear is easier to fix than idiocy, so a few more naxx/Uld10 clears will make the stuff that really should be considered pure farm a bit cleaner and quicker.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 02 Jun 2009, 13:43
Mind you we did it with 3 priest healers, no shaman and maybe only half of the people were A list...

Hit+crit dps gear with ulduar gear stam and str would be lovely to tank in...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 02 Jun 2009, 18:20
Yeah, see, my guild if anything lacks priests. The good thing though is that we have a druid as second in command of the guild and a holy pally that is an absolute horse. I know holy paladins are often seen as one trick ponies, but a top flight tank healer who's deft with Beacon of Light is pretty much priceless.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 03 Jun 2009, 17:05
Sitting in vent with a few mates I play horde with, they got flame lev down to 1% with only 8 people. They keep going for 8mans.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 09 Jun 2009, 18:16
Jebus Christ, the server just went down like 20 seconds after I got my Golem-shard Sticker (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=45246#comments), the BiS offhand when excluding hard modes. This could end badly.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 10 Jun 2009, 11:37
Oh yeah? Well I spelled out "819 455 7177135" in my guild bank before killing Illi...
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3565/3613896127_12a7b97775_b.jpg)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 11 Jun 2009, 15:03
I was bored today when a pug H-VH group said they needed one more dps. The group turned out to be a microcosm of WoW's problems in general: 3 incompetent death knights, 1 mildly elitist rogue (me!) and a horrified Holy Paladin. All plate, all the time baby! That said, the Holy Paladin actually turned out to be really good. This was fortunate thing since only the DK tank was scraping by with 1k DPS; the other two were flailing around with their Titansteel Destroyers to the tune of 800 and 700 respectively. All told, I ended up doing 54% of the group's total damage and probably could have done more of it if I wasn't desperately spamming every threat reduction I had (yes, including feint! :?) to keep from eating any more pavement. The really hilarious bit? The Holy Paladin and I carried the group to the point that the DKs praised everyone lavishly and spoke of friending all of us.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 11 Jun 2009, 15:47
The Argent Tournament is fucking fantastic for casuals. This week, I've gotten my Staff of Feral Furies and I've managed to pass the 3,000 gold mark for the first time. Between the AT and Sons of Hodir dailies, I've made around 1500 gold in two weeks without even touching the auction house (Though now I'm using my abundance of borean leather to sell bags on the AH for a little supplemental).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Llewellian on 12 Jun 2009, 07:03
 :-D Yeah. Gotta love them dailies.

Btw: When you love it casual (and you are no priest), empty all your bags, turn on Autoloot and do Stratholme single. Depending on your skills, it takes (even for a clothie) about 10-20 mins per run. 50-100 g in coin looting and selling runecloth in AH brings a little fortune per each run. And the rest of the crap sells good at every merchant. Oh, and you get the chance on the Barons Horsie...

Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 12 Jun 2009, 08:50
Just that miniscule chance of getting the Baron's mount is the only reason I ever helped pallies out with their quests in Strat.

I am thinking of reactivating my account... Oh dear.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 12 Jun 2009, 10:44
That Strat strategy is rather server dependent. Runecloth sells for shit on my server, so a Strat run isn't really worth the time.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 12 Jun 2009, 11:45
Fuck basic flight form. Fuck it right in the ass. Figures that as I'm just about 1000 gold from swift, they're talking about buffing flight form speed in the next patch.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Llewellian on 12 Jun 2009, 13:06
Not only this. According to the 3.2 pre-patch-info from Blizz, lowest riding skill will be available at Lvl 20 now, epic at 40, flight at 60, epic flight at 70. Oh, and you start with mounts and riding as cheap as 5 gold then.

@Obsessions:

Strat farming is not for runecloth, yes, serverdependend selling that brings a nice extra penny, but if you are good in gear, no matter what sort of character you are, with 80 you clear Strat in about 20 mins. Even Magicans in greens and blues can do that.

And if you loot every shit and silver the dead NPCs have with them, you leave with (incl. selling crap at merchant npcs) around 100-150 g in 20 mins. Do that for an hour.... (like "a daily"), reset the instance... all'sgood. Yeah, there are forms far more profitable to get money, but Strat can be done with hitting only 2 keys, dont having to travel around much and so on.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Beren on 14 Jun 2009, 12:50
I always enjoyed leveling alts the most, and now that I quit they make it more fun. Erggh stop tempting me Blizzard.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 14 Jun 2009, 13:09
i am pretty excited about 3.2 and actually being able to afford my epic mount! yessss.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 14 Jun 2009, 13:38
The Argent Tournament is fucking fantastic for casuals. This week, I've gotten my Staff of Feral Furies and I've managed to pass the 3,000 gold mark for the first time. Between the AT and Sons of Hodir dailies, I've made around 1500 gold in two weeks without even touching the auction house (Though now I'm using my abundance of borean leather to sell bags on the AH for a little supplemental).

I'm a li'l impatient with the Argent Tournament, personally; it'll be great when the patches hit and it becomes something more than a daily quest rep grind. That said, I can bang out the dailies so fast (particularly since I combine the 15 scourge kills quest with the Ebon Blade "Leaving our mark quest" for extra change) that I feel like it'd be really petty to whine about it. Even as a raider it's quick, easy money and more than a few of my guildies use the rewards to fill in the few remaining holes left in their alt's off specs. My druid alt is definitely intended to be a spare tank first and a healer second, but between crafted epics and the AT quest rewards, I can get by as tree in Naxx just fine without having to really step on anyone's toes when it comes to passing out the gear once the boss is downed. Besides, as I've said before, my server was the first pure non-migration server Blizz created in ages, so the general population is fairly inexperienced and way behind the curve gear wise; people simply don't grab random dudes from trade chat and go do naxx 25 successfully here. Anyone who can potentially fill a wide variety of roles is stupidly valuable here on Grizzly Hills, so raiding guild alts tend to be geared accordingly.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 14 Jun 2009, 13:54
As a rogue, I don't really have a leg to stand on in regards to this issue, but this still made me lol:

 (http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/2033/seasonsix.jpg)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 14 Jun 2009, 20:01
Haha, nice. I kind of want to know what Holy Shit, Buttons! actually does...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: axerton on 14 Jun 2009, 20:36
Ok, I have got to stop reading this thread, it's bringing the WoW urges back. and I'm already doing badly enough on my assignments.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 14 Jun 2009, 21:08
For the moment I am still pretty glad I canceled/put my account on hold.  However, all this talk of new content and upcoming patches adding more stuff and etc etc is makin' me happy that when I do eventually reactivate my account (and I will, I am almost sure of it) I'll have a bunch of new stuff to come back to :)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 14 Jun 2009, 21:10
Strangely enough axerton I check into this thread now and then as well, and the funny thing is looking at this thread has only kept my resolve strong for not playing WoW. Maybe its because I never maxed out a character in the couple years I played but goddamn I never thought anyone could make a game so dry like you guys do. Before this thread happened I would've never compared WoW to say, EvE Online, but from reading this thread it all just looks like another stat spreadsheet.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 14 Jun 2009, 22:02
The game isn't actually all that dry, at least not in my guild, anyway, despite the fact that we raid. We tend to have our good days (clearing out Naxx 25 in under two hours, no wipes, 4 deaths, one of which was on frogger, the other on a DC and two people who fail at dancing  :roll:) followed by moments of being really damned stupid and somehow wiping on Emalon immediately afterwards. The last bit was really kinda funny though, in context. Or, at least vent was pretty entertaining, anyway.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 14 Jun 2009, 23:51
Up until ulduar the content have been pretty boring honestly. Naxx is a joke looking at the difficulty. However, ulduar give a few new chalanges where you most of all need to coordinate what you are doing and deadly boss mods can't do it for you. I'm hoping alot on the new content as well, allthough my guild haven't even cleared Ulduar 10 yet. General is a bitch for our healers. (Oh look green goo, far away from the tank, let's all go and stand in it!)

Achives are however one of the worst things ever. I am a pretty good player and I know what I'm doing, but when you can't come naxx10 due to not being able to link the achive with your alt, it's plain silly.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 15 Jun 2009, 00:09
I'd like Ulduar a lot better if they quit nerfing the crap out of it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 15 Jun 2009, 00:20
Agreed.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 15 Jun 2009, 05:32
The only thing that irritated me with achievements was that mine said I did none of the old dungeons and barely explored Azeroth. Which I did. But really, not having the dungeon achievements encouraged me to start soloing the low level ones which really is quite fun. It's a fun break from questing and since I'm not in a raiding guild anymore, I don't really have the need to level rapidly, so hey. Also, I like the new content a whole hell of a lot more than I did in Outland. More of the story line is involved.

I think I need to stop reading this thread, though, for the same reasons as Axerton...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: pen on 15 Jun 2009, 05:41
I actually cancelled my subscription finally.  I'm going through and will probably delete my characters so I don't start up again since I really don't have the time or money for it.  I have until July 3 to decide on this. 
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Llewellian on 15 Jun 2009, 15:37
Try to get some money out of the time you played. Sell your account on Ebay... heck, even if you should get only 5 dollars out of it, thats a cool pack of beer to spend with friends in your now free sparetime. Just do not forget to delete all financial data in your account and change the address to some nonsense. Oh, and leave your guild and tell your guildies to delete you from the friendslist. Same to all your friendslists you have on your chars.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 16 Jun 2009, 16:50
I spent the last 2 days after work balancing gear.

I'm happy with it but everyone else seems to think stacking stam is the be all and end all to tanking, they might be right but if they aren't... I'm the hit and exp capped one with massive avoidance and no shield block HAH!

(seriously more than 10 gems, most of which got socketed over within an hour and numerous enchants and gear swappings)

I would trade 17 hit rating for 64hp though...

http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Hellscream&n=Melville
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 16 Jun 2009, 18:59
Yeah, some of the health bar fascism I've seen going around is getting fairly ridiculous. A dude in my guild just got his new his warrior alt to 80 3 days ago. I ended up filling in the last dps slot in his H-UP pug with my rogue because some mage saw his 24k base hps and immediately quit the group. I mean, okay, yeah, you're not going to be eating Frozen Blows like that but that's exactly why we were doing H-UP instead of taking on servants of the Titans.  :roll:

I'll admit that sometimes I look at people's gear when deciding to go into a group or not, but I'm mostly just seeing to make sure they have an idea what the hell they're doing. My guildmate had dutifully done his homework and met the defense soft cap and had every starter blue you could ask for from a beginning tank plus his Titansteel Shieldwall. Heroics are not serious business and everyone has to start somewhere. The funny part is that this mage is from a recent transfer guild. I hate to be the one to break it to him, but not every warrior he groups with on Grizzly Hills is going to have the same hp pool as ilevel 200+ geared bear. I can't wait until he meets some of the other jokers we have lurking around in trade chat claiming to be tanks. 24k hp warrior tanks will be the least of his worries.

[EDIT] This is the third week in a row in which my server/battle group crashed on Tuesday night, which also happens to be when we try to get the bulk of our raiding done.  :x
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 16 Jun 2009, 23:19
HP fetish was more of a problem in TBC imho. But now days I only put pure stam in crapy socket bonus and blue sockets. Defence is a really good stat now days. But knowing what to do is (almost) always more important than gear.

Yesterday was a good day. After some counting we realized we can start up our TBC guild again and start doing 10-man instances. Like 5 people leaving warhammer online due to the crapy servers in europe and restarting wow. Since 3 of them are unemployed and one can actually wow at his work I expect them to become lvl 80 quite soon.


[EDIT] http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Kazzak&n=Calzi
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 16 Jun 2009, 23:47
I looked at your char sheet James and all I can think of is how that stupid Repelling Charge is currently driving one of our offtanks absolutely up the wall because it refuses to drop for him. Normally that wouldn't be too big of a deal, but it would make his life much easier to at least have it in his bags so he could tank Hodir's Frozen Blows without having to juggle quite so much gear to avoid crippling his defense rating when we do Uld10s. Being able to tack on that much defense with a trinket must be damn nice.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 17 Jun 2009, 17:24
You have NO FUCKING IDEA WHAT I WENT THROUGH FOR THAT.

8% drop chance.

Numerous naxx 10 runs failing after a wipe or 2 on grobb due to poison clouds and scrubs...

No drops until one day... an ex guildy of mine inv's me along to naxx 10, on thadd... RL is an undergeared warrior tank with ML on... I figure I will just go along for one boss, down him then log but no... the trink dropped...

(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3353/3636545399_46ba578f4e_o.jpg)

He asks me to link my trinks, I say fuck it, he won it fair and square, dude PUTS IT IN MY FUCKING BAG.

Needless to say I was shocked, he said "Rather not lose 57 stam from my current trink" as he had gossamer and the MGT tank trink, I was awestruck. I cleared the SHIT out of the other 2 quarters, let him decide what he did and didn't want to tank, held back HUGELY on threat so he could stay ahead, dude was nice as hell and a sick tank, just mega undergeared.

He died on KT at 70% where I decided to then tank KT+Adds down for clear. Good night, new friend, so I sent him 2 stoneblood flasks, a 275hp ench for chest, 20 doughnuts, 55stam22agi leg patch, some tanking ench's I saw he had missing, basically gave the dude a few hundred G of tanking essentials after he refused my offer of 300 or so G I had on me at the time.

He mailed me back saying it was in the top 2 nicest things anyone has ever done in his 3 years of playing WoW, shit like that makes it all worth while.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 17 Jun 2009, 21:00
I love it when people are nice in game. When I was in my 40s, some random 70 saw me standing in Stormwind and decided that my gear needed some help (which it did), so she went and bought me a bunch of pieces and then helped me get up 5 levels in one night. Then I ended up raiding with her once I got up to 70, which was weird, but pretty awesome.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 Jun 2009, 09:49
I'm basically a dick in game.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 18 Jun 2009, 15:09
I have don e some nice things for lowbies, but you tend to regret it when they add you to their friends list and msg you while you are raiding asking you to help them with 10 quests in grizzly hills.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 Jun 2009, 15:33
All joking aside, I just tend to limit my overt generosity to my Druid alt for the very reasons you just mentioned. Plus, you know, I main a rogue; the true neophytes typically don't use damage meters or run aggro monitors and so they don't quite realize just exactly how much sheer damage and aggro frontloading I bring to the table (I <3 Tricks of the Trade+FoK; it's a godsend when working with inexperienced tanks). If anything they just want some gold or into my guild. But my poor Bear/Tree alt? I get swamped with tells on that guy. It probably doesn't help that every 3rd player is a DPS death knight at this point either.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 18 Jun 2009, 17:09
I've only ever been overly nice to other guild members. Otherwise my niceness happens to be passing out flasks, etc to people I'm grouped with. Otherwise I run around by my lonesome. I like soloing mostly for the fact that most people who play this game are really freaking annoying. Also then you get all the loot and xp to yourself, bwahaha.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: messeduplilkid on 20 Jun 2009, 00:06
To counter act all the nice things that you guys do in game.

 A friend of mine was in 25 man naxx with his guild which is done via Loot Council. Loot Master obviously being the Guild Leader. During the raid piece after piece was offered as side grades to the cliques or to friends not even in the guild over guildies in greens. It eventually gets late and they call it quits at KT, so they can finish it fresh the next night.

 My friend calls me at 11 in the morning, "I have a raid ID for 25 man naxx. But we have to clear it before 7PM server". We end up pugging the entire raid, Ninja'ing what we needed, Auctioning the 7.5 helmets, and his guild chat gets the lovely: "Vampwang has completed Naxxramas" Achievement in the middle of the afternoon.

 Luckily the GM was on at the time and stupidly asks in guild, "How did you get that achievement when you ran with us last night?".

Que G-quit. Que virtual high fives.

Ninja Raid ID, Ninja Loot, Ninja G-quit.

Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 20 Jun 2009, 01:47
Honestly, you kinda have to expect such things from a dude named Vampwang.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Nodaisho on 22 Jun 2009, 00:08
So, I'm planning on starting playing WoW. I have played some MMOs before, mainly EQII, but I've got a real life friend that plays WoW, so I'm going to give it another spin. I've been reading up on it, trying to figure out what I want to do, but I want some advice.

In EQ2, I play a swashbuckler (rogue) and a shadowknight. The Swashbuckler is pretty standard DPS with some abilities that give threat to a groupmate and some others that drop threat by a pretty big amount. With him, I open up hard early and then drop the aggro once I get it from the tank, leaving him with a good amount more aggro than he would have normally. The shadowknight is more geared towards group tanking/off-tanking, enough threat to be able to take the reins when our main tank gets too hurt, enough damage to not be useless otherwise, and enough self-healing to be able to solo or duo well, and tank waves of really difficult enemies (orange-con ^^^ heroics, four at a time, if you know EQ lingo) when I've got the right group, even though that was a miraculously beautiful group.

Anyway, that is just to give you an idea of what I like playing. When I played WoW, it was summer of '06, before BC came out. I tried a few classes, but I found a problem, I just couldn't get my spam on like I wanted to. I like always having abilities to use, timing them, never having to sit back and watch my character trade hits with an enemy as I keep an eye on that timer. At higher levels, can I start spamming with the rogue? If not, what can I do so with? And do you still have to have a level 55 character to play a Death Knight?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 22 Jun 2009, 05:42
I do believe so, but that may change in the future. And really, every class has its cooldowns. From what you talked about, maybe a rogue or a paladin might suit you? Or even maybe a shaman. I mean, the first 10 levels are really boring, but once you get to about 20 things start picking up. Really you just kind of have to try the classes out and see how you like them.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 22 Jun 2009, 09:27
As someone who played EQ II as well, I have to say WoW is a lot better and much more fun. EQ II's not bad per se, it's just too low in population for anything but high level content to be any fun.

I'd agree with Linds that a Rogue would be well suited if you're into spamming DPS. That's pretty much what I was doing by level forty.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 22 Jun 2009, 10:39
I would point out though that playing a rogue well consists of controlled spamming, at least at the raid level; when you're soloing normal mobs mashing works fine because things aren't going to live through more than a combo or two and mashing maximizes your DPS at the cost of damage per energy, a non-issue when grinding. But in a raid setting the hardest habit for new rogues to break seems to be the urge to mash Sinister Strike as fast as the global cool down allows. If you want to eke out those last bits of damage you could be doing, then you need to learn when to pool/burn energy in order to maintain cycles that max out uptime on skills like Slice and Dice and Rupture, so patience is still a bit of a virtue. That said, when you play a rogue, you'll always be mere seconds away from hitting a button, and you actually can get away with just mashing 'till 5 combo points are available and do reasonable to very good damage, you just won't ever hit your full potential against raid bosses playing that way. And trash pulls? Those are total spam fests.

Anyway though, your EQ characters do sound quite similar to the way rogues and death knights operate. The Tricks of the Trade ability rogues get at level 75, for example, allows you to take all the aggro youg generate for 6 seconds and dump it on the party member of their choosing, which is obviously a great for pulling while Vanish is an instant aggro dump and escape tool. Meanwhile Death knights are a DPS/Tank hybrid class that has several attacks that allows limited self-healing.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 22 Jun 2009, 20:38
I'm starting to think that the Mjolnir Runestone will drop or that patch 3.2 will hit before I get my greedy paws on Grim Toll (and no, we haven't done Thorim hardmode yet). It just will not drop for my guild; it dropped for I think the second time in ages and there's just far too many people it's good for.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Nodaisho on 22 Jun 2009, 22:26
As someone who played EQ II as well, I have to say WoW is a lot better and much more fun. EQ II's not bad per se, it's just too low in population for anything but high level content to be any fun.
I didn't have a problem with that, I tended to do mostly soloing (which made the Shadowknight great, since I had self-heals, great armor, decent damage, an evac, and an oh-shit nuke every 5 minutes) or duoing (a self-healing tank makes it so much easier), with some groups on occasion. Having a good guild makes a big difference, I have yet to find an MMO I would play nearly as much if I didn't have a clan/guild.

So the rogue allows you to run up combos pretty well? Sounds like my type of thing then, I'll try that and the paladin, then the Death Knight when I can. I don't have a problem with having to pull back on my energy usage in more difficult situations, I just want to always have options of what I can be doing. The low level rogue bored me because I was having to wait, not having to decide when it would be best to do something. I have the most fun when I'm having to focus on my aggro, my recharge timers, the health of the tank and the mobs, incoming adds, and the like, then picking the best thing to do, over and over.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 23 Jun 2009, 10:48
Soloing is so much easier and more fulfilling in WoW. I was able to grind from 1-80 on my first character in WoW in less time than it took me to grind to level 40 in EQ2, without a guild. Though, I did have the advantage of the Recruit-a-Friend triple XP bonus.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 23 Jun 2009, 11:51
So the rogue allows you to run up combos pretty well?

Yeah, the class is basically built around a relationship between your energy (which constantly regenerates) and combo points. Once you have your full suite of moves the class mostly consists of running up some combo points with the combo point generator of your choice (typically Sinister Strike or Mutilate these days) and then deciding whether you want to spend combo points and energy on sustained damage via dots, buffs/debuffs, try to end things quickly with direct damage or simply avoid incoming damage with a stun. Obsessions is at the point in the game where the right answer almost always comes down to the stun (Kidney Shot) or the direct damage (Eviscerate), but in raid settings with more durable mobs that typically ends up costing you too much damage output in the long run. For example, last night I was typically maintaining a buff on myself (Slice and Dice), a debuff on my opponent (Expose Armor) as well as trying to keep my dot (Rupture) up whenever possible, which can be a bit tricky considering none of those effects lasts much longer than 30 seconds per application and that they all consume combo points rather than generate them.

[EDIT] You know how I mentioned that my guild is pretty fun recently? I just want to say again how stupidly happy I am with it. We're hardly top flight, but guilds here disband so often that I kinda gave up for a while and just accepted that I was consigned to the Naxx 10 pug ghettos. Luckily, I got into my current one via the backdoor; a couple highly geared former guildies of mine insisted I get in as a condition of their joining. PH already had several rogues with decent attendance so this was done somewhat grudgingly. A few guys didn't show up for a raid though, and before you know it I ended up outdpsing all the rogues but one despite being vastly out geared, which quickly convinced them to put me on the fast track to some neat gear. My armory even looks halfway respectable now. (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Grizzly+Hills&cn=Intruder&gn=Phoenix+Horizon) Now, if only I could replace that damned helmet and cloak...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 23 Jun 2009, 17:23
Did the last of the fire festival things today, was fun. Think I might just stomp out some more fires over the next 2 weeks for an insane amount of easy free gold, and to get the pet and brazier.

Other than that I did dailies while theorycrafting my tits off,

5.6% crit chance on you from raid boss, takes 689 def rating to make the 140 def or you could use 472 res, 1 res = approx 0.01186% crit chance reduction and 1 def rating = about 0.00812% crit chance reduction, so I am now under def softcap but still crit immune as the 15 res 40 stam shoulder ench is better for me than def/dodge shoulder ench even if I lose some block and avoidance I gain 40 stam which gets me nicely over 30k while still soft exp capped and hit capped.

For anyone wanting to do something similar, please look over my figures and see if I have cocked up anywhere, on my armoury my pants show a 8def12stam gem but to change this to 8crit12stam to still be crit immune but with a tiny bit more threat and fraction less survivability from def giving me avoidance and mitigation, as atm from def I am getting 5.48% towards the necessary 5.6% for crit immunity from def and 0.18 from my res giving me 5.66% giving me 0.06% to get shot of, translates to 7.38 ish def to get rid of, rounded up to 7, would I still need the 8 def rating to stay crit immune...

Depending on how many figures it actually counts to where blizz looks at it, now if I could just find an avoidance/def macro that takes res into account...

http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Hellscream&n=Melville
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Kukla on 23 Jun 2009, 21:45
Soloing is so much easier and more fulfilling in WoW. I was able to grind from 1-80 on my first character in WoW in less time than it took me to grind to level 40 in EQ2, without a guild. Though, I did have the advantage of the Recruit-a-Friend triple XP bonus.

We really didn't even get 30% of the potential of that though. Most of the time was spent with either me catching up to you (before level 40), or you trying to catch up to me. It was nice, and I think it's a great feature, but I regret the wasted time.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 24 Jun 2009, 03:13
1. Make second e-mail account
2. Send recruit a friend email inv to new e-mail address
3. Make new WoW account for 7 quid and dual box
4. ?????
5. PROFIT!!!!

Go something worthwhile to lv though, synergy like priest/warrior or rogue/druid, or a pally and a... pally?

I levelled disc and prot, it was kinda slow but I only died about 3 times questing from 1-60 not including getting ganked.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Kukla on 24 Jun 2009, 18:17
1. Make second e-mail account
2. Send recruit a friend email inv to new e-mail address
3. Make new WoW account for 7 quid and dual box
4. ?????
5. PROFIT!!!!

Go something worthwhile to lv though, synergy like priest/warrior or rogue/druid, or a pally and a... pally?

I levelled disc and prot, it was kinda slow but I only died about 3 times questing from 1-60 not including getting ganked.

I'm aware how RAF works, and don't have any particular intention of doing it again.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 26 Jun 2009, 12:49
Fair doo's, I only did it because it takes half the time and at the end I can sell a vanilla account with a bunch of 60's. for more than the 8 quid I paid.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 29 Jun 2009, 22:36
Hmmmmm...interesting. (http://www.wow.com/2009/06/29/faction-changes-coming-to-the-world-of-warcraft/)

Probably won't be doing that myself, but interesting nonetheless.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Llewellian on 30 Jun 2009, 00:25
Hmm... yup.

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=18031079410

Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jimor on 30 Jun 2009, 12:47
As far as realm balance, just have a rule that unless the Horde/Alliance ratio is within 10%, the switch can only be from strong --> weak faction.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 30 Jun 2009, 13:24
That's retarded, so perhaps only half a guild can swap over if it makes it a 11% imbalance?

I might do this and see how my main rolls with my mates on boulderfist...

Dwarf > tauren?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 30 Jun 2009, 14:14
It's too bad they have an atrocious array of racial abilities though. They're probably the only alliance race I couldn't be talked into now, which is a shame, since thematically they'd be my top pick. My favorite part is how they removed treasure chests from WotLK content but left in the racial ability to find them. Now that is some vigorous shafting!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Nodaisho on 30 Jun 2009, 17:11
I think EQ2 did faction changes pretty well. Maybe it wouldn't go so well with the way WoW is set up, but in EQ2, you had to go through hell to get your faction changed. Earlier on, you could only do it at really early levels as well, but they made it a bit easier since. I'm pretty sure you can only betray once, which prevents guilds from hopping back and forth, and on PVP servers, you have both factions gunning for you, as well as anyone else that is currently exiled, and on top of that, the normal level limits on who can attack you to prevent 80s ganking 10s don't exist when you are exiled.

Why hadn't it been done before in WoW? What was the worry?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 30 Jun 2009, 17:39
Well, first off, faction rivalries are kind of a core piece of Warcraft history. The orcs and the humans have literally been fighting to the death since the orcs poked their noses through the dark portal and started killing everyone they could get their hands on. With all the rivalry and faction specific mounts, items, achievements (and at one point even faction specific classes), it just would have been weird to up and have a gnome swap sides and start tooling around on his shiny new worg. Plus, this way Blizzard gets to monetize it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: kemon on 01 Jul 2009, 03:30
from what i've read and understand about the faction change, there will not be horde gnomes.   you will have to change to a legal horde race for your class.   so a gnome lock would become an undead lock.  for it to be otherwise would take a massive shift in the whole concept of the game.   blizz would have to allow characters to start on the wrong side as well.  as cool as that would be in my opinion (even better would be every race allowed every class),  it seems like too big a stretch for blizz to push it.

i think it's funny how the thread that llewellian linked went so nuts about races on the wrong side.  like tab targetting would no longer work for some reason.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 01 Jul 2009, 07:27
Yeah, I knew that you'd have to change to a "roughly equivalent" character, as Blizzard put it, I was just pointing out how the Everquest 2 method (in which your character swapped sides, race intact) didn't fit very well with the good ol' Orcs vs. Humans Warcraft universe. You've always been able to get along fine with every race in Everquest, it's just that some race/class/religion combos required you to put a helluva lot more work into it than others. It's not a world without nasty grudges or anything, but compared to Warcraft the wounds aren't quite so fresh; there's still plenty of people alive from the First War, after all.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 01 Jul 2009, 09:45
And they're now currently at war again. Alliance-Horde hostility is a basic conceit of the setting. They really didn't have a choice when it came to the Burning Legion. There's some spirit of cooperation here and there amongst a few forward thinkers like Thrall and Jaina, but Joe Peasant from Westfall remembers fleeing to Kalimdor by ship as a wee lad and keeps it in the back of his head that the orcs were quite literally demon worshiping marauders less than a generation ago. Besides, WoW isn't really filled with RPers and what little of it I have seen often has been sparked by good ol' fashioned faction rivalry.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 01 Jul 2009, 15:28
Blizzard doesn't want to give PCs that choice. The bulk of the orc and human population working together isn't something they want going on in the franchise as a whole. I would think this was made pretty clear when they made cross faction communication verboten and set it up so that the only meaningful interaction you can have consists of kek, /spit, and murder. From a game design stand point, the sides exist to antagonize each other. There are characters in the universe who can look beyond all this stuff but apparently Blizzard doesn't want PCs to fall under that category. I'm completely fine with that. Perhaps that feels limiting to those who want to roleplay as an idealist, but it suits those who want to kill the Alliance/Horde scum perfectly. Is it an arbitrary excuse for conflict? Sure, but again, I don't have a problem with that any more than I do with Warhammer's Legions of Chaos being satanically evil just so there's always somebody around spoiling for a fight.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Mynah on 01 Jul 2009, 18:02
Blizzard doesn't want to give PCs that choice. The bulk of the orc and human population working together isn't something they want going on in the franchise as a whole.

Well, then maybe they could make it extremely difficult and/or time consuming to change factions or be to able to communicate with the other faction in a nonviolent manner.  Then it wouldn't really be the bulk of the population, it would just be a few people with a whole lot of time on their hands who are very interested in being able to cross that line.  Maybe they could give language a bigger role in the game and allow people to learn the languages of races on the opposing faction, but in order to learn them, you have to do some ridiculously long and complicated quest in order to just be able to speak with one race, or something like that.

I don't know, that doesn't sound like it would ruin the whole story.  Actually, it might make the story more interesting.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 01 Jul 2009, 18:33
Yes, because we all know WoW players love extremely difficult quest grinds and that a player frustrated with being stuck in a stagnating faction will be just dying to go through all that rather than look into a server transfer.

Anyway, this is silly; I don't genuinely hate the idea of doing it EQ2 style, I just don't think it adds enough into the game to be bothered with. If Blizzard can make some money off this and stick with their established vision of horde-alliance relations this way, than well, more power to them, I guess. Besides, it's bad enough that the poor Horde has to put up with elves too; making them put up with both would be sad.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Mynah on 01 Jul 2009, 19:28
That's the point, though.  A really difficult quest grind really isn't all that appealing except to the people who really, really want the reward.  If it was difficult, then only the people who really wanted it would be able to communicate with the opposing faction and/or switch factions for the sake of roleplay, for the sake or realism, or even just for the sake of a challenge.  And if it's just them, then the story doesn't have to suffer from giant human/orc dance parties or what have you.

As far as people who are simply bored with their faction, sure, a simple transfer would probably be fine for them.  But I wasn't really referring to those people.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 01 Jul 2009, 19:57
And my point is that it should be convenient. Joe Pugger doesn't play WoW because it's hard. That's why I prefer the option that doesn't make waves lore wise, gets people get out of their current funk quickly and makes Blizzard some money. I think the whole thing should be handled in the same vein as server transfers; if nothing else it lets Blizzard have a bit more fine control on who goes where and occasional voluntary free faction transfers could help ease some of the server population imbalances out there.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 01 Jul 2009, 21:04
I agree with Alex. Faction rivalry is a part of the game and factions are based on race. If you really want to switch factions, you should be willing to switch your race. I really don't see why people would put up much a fuss over being an undead and being Alliance, because everyone knows that in the game, the Alliance hates the undead. (Actually, so does some of the Horde, but whatever.) So yeah. If I decided I really wanted my main to be horde, yes, I would be okay with switching from night elf to tauren, considering I wanted to make a tauren anyways, but noooo my friends were alliance and you can't chat if you're on opposing factions.

And yes, if it's going to be paid for, it should be convenient. You should be able to customize your new character, pick your mount, and everything else should be able to switch smoothly (such as rep, achievements, etc.). I wouldn't want to do an arduous quest chain to do something I've already paid for. You don't do it for name changes or character customization, so why would you for changing factions?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: messeduplilkid on 01 Jul 2009, 21:46
One thing, Holy Fuck... people care about Lore in World of Warcraft? I thought it was all about numbers....

*cough* Seriously it IS a very nice breath of fresh air to hear you guys talking about mechanics the light of the lore... I just find it hard when Blizzard so frequently tosses it aside when it's convenient for them... It's as if they develop content then use a Lore Paintbrush like they're dabbing in some color.

It's such a fine line thinking about the game in so many parts: Class balance, Raid composition, PVP balance, Lore. And the biggest problem I have with lore is that I don't even READ the quests. Hell the first thing when you get someone to play most of the time is to tell them to get Carbonite or Quest Helper, so they don't even have to READ the quests. Or when you can post it in General and ask for help and someone tells your the coordinates for where to kill things.

I dunno. I'm just so sick of this game. I wish I could stop playing... But it's WoW... So I can't.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 02 Jul 2009, 03:23
At least I have like, a few months before it is implimented to theorycraft whether I should turn my dwarf into an undead, tauren or troll tank... because fuck orcs.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: kemon on 02 Jul 2009, 03:36
tauren.  cause stam stacking is for the win!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 02 Jul 2009, 15:58
My guild could really use a feral druid or another warrior to provide more debuffs and off-tanking muscle but every time we try one out it never ends well. The last guy seemed fairly promising until I had this li'l gem of a conversation:

Me: "You're doing pretty good, but we need you to play a li'l less risky because you're dying too early."

Potential Recruit: "That's not fair."

Me: "What? You'll be doing great if you were a bit more careful around voids. We just want you to take things a bit slower."

Potential Recruit: "Recount says you took way more damage than I did."

The part that he's not getting here is that I'm taking way more damage because I'm not consistently get picked off by the first couple of "Don't Stand There" checks. Even that wasn't really a big deal, but in retrospect I should have seen it as a bit of a warning sign since by the next week he left the guild in a huff when he got passed over for our first team Ulduar 10 group and proved incapable of taking "We can only take 10 people, sorry" for an answer. The dumbest part is that we would have gladly penciled him into our second group, he just got all pissed off before it could happen.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 02 Jul 2009, 16:39
Stomping sucks even just for 1 more interrupt, and the tauren stam racial is only base hp +5% which for me would be... not bad but maybe not as great as undead would be for shadow dodge and another berserker rage or trolls would be for berserking and a tiny bit of regen etc.

They might not be stoneform but a bit of theorycrafting for my play style and habits can't hurt.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 02 Jul 2009, 19:44
We had a rough patch for a while and had to kick out some dead weight over the last week or so, but apparently we're stronger for it. We got to Mimiron for the for the first time on 25 man this week and one shotted him. The fact that the majority of us had done 10 man a time or two helped, obviously, but we're still fairly stoked about it. Hopefully we'll get Yogg down by Sunday.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 02 Jul 2009, 21:42
I miss my old guild. I join a guild that my friends made and what do they do? They either quit or leave for another guild. And my old guild had been merged with a different one and now I can't remember the name and none of the guildies I was really close to are on anymore and waaaaaaaaah. This was more fun when I had an awesome and active guild. :x
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 03 Jul 2009, 12:45
Guys I got my priest to 80 last week! Woo! She's my first 80 and it's pretty awesome so far. I've been basically healing heroics non-stop all week, most of them with my new awesome, super-friendly guild. Despite this, I have the shittiest luck with drops most of the time. The only super awesome thing that's dropped for me has been my mace from H Nexus yesterday.

But yeah, woo!

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bleeding+Hollow&n=Starsnostars
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 03 Jul 2009, 13:33
Actually, I'd say it's a touch pessimistic to say you've had bad luck with drops since you're not going to find many upgrades over a lot of that stuff without venturing into Naxx10 or spending a lot more Heroic Emblems; for example, there really isn't a better alternative to that hood short of being an Engi and that's not really something I'd recommend at this point anyway. You also appear to have done a pretty good job of prioritizing your item slots and reputation rewards too, since it looks like your best gear also happens to be in the slots that give the most stats (Chest, Helm, Mainhand-offhand combo). From a pure gear check standpoint, you're perfectly capable of doing 10 man Naxx and I wouldn't even object to taking you on 25 man either, provided you got your enchants all in order and brought consumables, anyway. You're trucking along quite well and I don't really see how you could gear much faster short of being in a guild that considers 25 man Naxx to be alt loot.



[EDIT]

I'm kind of annoyed that the Armory doesn't really properly display one's Armor Penetration rating. My gear (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Grizzly+Hills&n=Intruder) becomes a lot more impressive once you mentally factor in the fact that I ignore anywhere from 14-60+% of my opponent's armor depending on whether or not Grim Toll has procced.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 04 Jul 2009, 09:58
Which is why I use more than armoury when epeening,

http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Hellscream&n=Melville
http://be.imba.hu/?zone=EU&realm=Hellscream&character=Melville
http://profiler.wowhead.com/?profile=eu.hellscream.melville

As for war mace of unrequited love, ran that instance every day for almost two weeks to get it for my restro shammy buddy, it simply refused to drop.

But yeah, almost 1.7k unbuffed bonus healing? Get to naxx tbh, you are more than ready.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 04 Jul 2009, 10:20
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Feathermoon&n=Mabh

I need new gear. Half of my gear are from when I was raiding and doing heroics before WotLK came out. This is no good. But I did get a new weapon yesterday from Amphitheater of Anguish and it's a nice mace. I am just not having very good luck when it comes to gear that is leather, but at least I am still healing rather well with old gear (not shown) and still doing pretty well soloing.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 04 Jul 2009, 10:21
Yeah, what really bothered me is that a few of those kind of sites merely take what armory says at face value and then tack on a gear score based on item budget. It's nice to know that wowhead at least takes care of the issue.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 04 Jul 2009, 14:05
Thanks for the comments guys. I was in the mind set of "holy shit, need best gear ever before even stepping into Naxx" even if something was just the tiniest bit better than what I already have. I've never really raided before so it's always loomed over me as being super intimidating. Now I feel way more relaxed about it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 04 Jul 2009, 14:21
Healing raids has never been a problem for me and I've got pretty lame +heals. And from what I've heard, Naxx really isn't too bad.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 04 Jul 2009, 15:41
Well, as the saying goes, tanking is strategy, dps is a science and healing is an art. Tanks and DPSers go in with an idea of what optimal play should look like on their end going into the fight. Good tanks know where they want the mobs and good DPSers should have a clear idea of how to maximize their time nailing the target; in a very real way the tank is responsible mostly for themselves while the DPSers are responsible for responding to the tank. Healing, on the other hand, is less about preparation (although it is definitely important for coping with spike damage!) and more about cleaning up the mess when the other two roles do something stupid. Hence how much gear a healer needs at the minimum is often directly related to how good his teammates are.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 04 Jul 2009, 16:31
Wandered into a new 10 man guild btw, first 2 parts of ulduar down the other nite, then today we did EoE and sarth1d without too much trouble. It's crazy because the people are much less geared than my last guild but they are so much more capable it's insane.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 04 Jul 2009, 23:42
Yeah, it's kinda funny how that works sometimes. See, there were 6 really good players counting myself in my old guild and a handful of scrubs. Our experience consisted mostly of carrying idiots through Naxx 10 on our backs. Out of that group of 6 people my current guild has gained what could best be described as their new co-maintank (let's face it, with WoW being what it is today you need at least 2 top quality tanks in the raid, period), the new primary main tank healer (A beast of a paladin (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Grizzly+Hills&n=Logan) who has stacked so much int that he basically never runs out of mana due to gaining something ridiculous like 400+ mp5 just from replenishment)  and 4 dpsers that regularly place within the top 5 or 6. The bit that amuses me the most is some of the vent chatter that took place the first time the 6 of us decided we would form the core of the guild's unofficial "Group 2" Uld10 team and promptly tore our way through to General Vezax in the space of an evening on our second week of running it; we likely would have downed him but we really only have time to do 1 evening of Uld10 a week. We took one of our guild officer's alts through with us and he has gone from saying we shouldn't feel bad when it takes us a while to get things down to admitting that he thinks as a unit we're probably better than the "primary" group.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 05 Jul 2009, 05:15
I dun get the mana batteryisms of holy paladins these days, raid buffed they have more mana than tanks do health.

It's fucking stupid.

BEACON OF LIGHT ON THE TANK K THX.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 05 Jul 2009, 09:07
Yeah, Blizzard dropped the ball when they made Intellect the best scaling stat for paladins bar none. It helps their spell power, it helps their crit, it scales with Blessing of Kings and point for point it's a more effective form of mana regeneration than the same item budget's worth of Mp5 once Replenishment is factored in. Logan doesn't run OOM. Ever. Even against General Vezax the dude has Judgements of the Wise to fall back on. We've had half the raid wipe and all the healers but him die and he'll still manage to keep most of who's left standing up until the Enrage timer hits; we don't ever just all killed in our guild, we call wipes when it's clear we've taken too many losses to bother continuing. The only thing preventing him from being the most grotesquely overpowered healer I've seen is the lack of multi-target heal, and even that doesn't seem to slow him down much.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 06 Jul 2009, 00:26
Well the mana-thingy for palys will change in next patch. Or rather, they will have to stack more mp5 since they will only gaine 30% of the base mana instead of 60% when they crit. And some other nerfs. They will also buff flash of light a little to force them to start thinking outside the holy light spam.

Last night my old guild finally did naxx10 for the first time. We were a quite good but small guild during TBC but lost a few people to Warhammer online. But a month back moste of them decided to come back. Unfortunatly we are only 8 active right now. The crazy thing is that with only partially heroic geared we did Naxx10 dedicated few. None of us who have been playing for a while brought our mains. So Naxx10 is a cake walk and as long as the group can communicate it will be fine. Oh wait, one guy brought his shammy healer who is partially naxxx25 geared, but he had never done naxx10.


Quite a lot interesting changes coming up in the 3.2 patch. The new ardent defender talent for prot palas is crazy.
http://www.wowhead.com/?patchnotes=3.2-ptr
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 06 Jul 2009, 06:28
I don't know about anyone else, but rogues with axes doesn't sit well with me.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 06 Jul 2009, 15:20
So I've healed HoS and HoL and I feel that when your tank has 3x the health you do, it's ok to dps. Why? Because it gets boring really fast. But at least we only wiped once. Lightning to the healer + poorly timed lag = bad bad thing.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 06 Jul 2009, 16:15
I've never really minded a healer dpsing a li'l as long as they prioritize correctly. Hell, the priests in my guild typically keep shadow word pain up on everything for trash fights since it scales so well even without talents.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 06 Jul 2009, 20:50
The only thing I don't like about it is switching back and forth between tree form and caster form. But lifebloom is pretty nice, so I have been throwing that up when I'm dps-ing and popping HoTs if there isn't crazy damage going on.

Also, I don't mind healing, but I don't like being squishy. I like my moonkin armor bonus. *pout*
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 06 Jul 2009, 20:57
General Vezax hit me for 185k+ today in Uld25; we were mid-wipe when Surge of Darkness hit and he turned around and crit me.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 07 Jul 2009, 18:25
I don't know about anyone else, but rogues with axes doesn't sit well with me.

I don't know why this bothers people. We're a melee dps pure class that's essentially limited to one armor type since there's no cloth itemized for melee dps. Further, there's basically a single rogue of note in the history of warcraft and we know jack squat about her. Lore wise we're essentially just lightly armored brawlers; our history is so sketchy that they're naming the alliance side tier 9 set after a level 20 elite. Having another weapon type that's used universally by the three melee classes that actually still use one handers for dps hits me as a good thing.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: messeduplilkid on 08 Jul 2009, 06:45
So I've healed HoS and HoL and I feel that when your tank has 3x the health you do, it's ok to dps. Why? Because it gets boring really fast. But at least we only wiped once. Lightning to the healer + poorly timed lag = bad bad thing.

In my Naxx and heroics I run. As a healer I would often pull whatever group I can get to, even if we aren't remotely finished with mobs we're currently on. People that come with me often down groups in a hurry when they realize that their healer isn't there.... and is probably down the hall pulling groups and running back.

Groups moving, worrying about repair bills, and down trash faster = more enjoyable time in boring content.

Downed XT on hard mode on monday. And started an alt 10 man ulduar group, downed the first 3 bosses in quest items and some 10 man pieces!

Healing, on the other hand, is less about preparation (although it is definitely important for coping with spike damage!) and more about cleaning up the mess when the other two roles do something stupid. Hence how much gear a healer needs at the minimum is often directly related to how good his teammates are.

I agree that Healing is an art, BUT

Reactive healing will lead to a lot of dead raid members. This is why Shaman and Pallys struggle in current hard-mode content. It all comes down to coping with AoE damage, which in Ulduar is... insane? Not Sunwell era raid wide AoE damage insane, but incredibly frustrating as a shaman because everyone is so spread out. Druids and Priests have the ability to be mobile and AoE heal the raid instantly. Shaman and Paladins have 1 instant on a long cooldown that is both expensive and has little effective healing.

This is why Omen is a great healer utility, because you can see a dps who might pull aggro and be ready to attempt to save them. This is why instant cast Aoe healing and absorb shields are so effective in Ulduar if you use them at the correct times rather then just spamming. This is why they nerfed mana regeneration of replenishment and will yet again nerf healer regen. This is why... ect ect ect.

As mentioned, I recently did XT-Hardmode which is quite simple in terms of execution, but the raid damage every minute is almost unbearable  when you are partnered with a shaman. I'm in the group of Sixthy, the greatest shaman in the world, and have to agree that current content should be Lesser Healing Wave spam. But why should I be pigeon hole'd into a 1.2 Second cast, int or spell power stacking, and spot healing low members in the raid for REAL healers to actually top off. Why can't I assist raid damage with chain heal?

3 reasons.

1) Cast time is too long, by the time we get it off priests and druids will have taken care of it. Thus we end up over healing.
2) Heals for too little compared to other AoE that costs much less in terms of mana per health.
3) Chain heal doesn't jump nearly far enough to hit 4 people.

Healing is become a lot less about how intuitive you are or how well you can read a fight, but more your ability to roll a druid or a priest. Next patch Pallys get some love with the Beacon change. Still Shaman are gonna be sitting on the bench when it comes to hard-mode content, which really is all that matters since the normal content is so easy for the casuals.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 08 Jul 2009, 07:51
Reactive healing is dead as a far as tank healers are concerned but in terms of raid damage you still need to be able to perform triage since raid members are still quite capable of doing goofy things that strain the healers' mana pool and makes them scramble. Reactive doesn't even seem like the right word since a glance around the raid can often tell you who is most likely to be needing the extra heals before it happens. For example, last night we had someone mentally check out during a fight and ended up getting a half dozen people hit with a gravity bomb just a bit before Deconstructor's only tantrum of the night. We didn't lose anyone but that particular moment required the healers to be three things: 1. Aware that the tantrum was coming 2. Aware that a guy with gravity bomb didn't appear to be moving 3. Geared enough to make the adjustment without skipping a beat. I have friends who haven't played since BC who I am terribly confident could have have met the first two criteria, but they would have had serious issues with the last one.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 08 Jul 2009, 19:13
Question - I've definitely noticed my mana being spent a LOT faster than it was in BC, but with healing especially so. I used to be ok with just a crap ton of int, but now is it better to have int, spirit, or mp5 on my gear? I feel like I'm burning through way too much mana, but then again, that could be due to having inadequate gear. (Seriously, a lot of my gear is still from Kara because I haven't been finding jack. And I don't want to waste gold on enchants when I'm trying to get rid of most of what I currently have.)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 08 Jul 2009, 20:30
Intellect is still the mana pool stat of choice these days; I don't know the exact numbers, but the gist of it is that it's always at least competitive with Spirit and it pulls quite a bit ahead whenever Replenishment is involved. The thing is, however, that good Resto druid items typically have a big fat chunk of Spellpower, Spirit and Intellect on them these days anyway. The other stats are all fairly marginal aside from Haste, which should probably be your first choice when blending in other stats, but keep in mind that the Gift of the Earthmother talent should let you get by until you can start adding it without giving up much SP/Int/Spi in the process.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: messeduplilkid on 08 Jul 2009, 20:58
Alex, definitely agree on your situation with the gravity bomb. I definitely don't think that's reactive healing at all. In fact that's what I would call effective healing. I would also add a 4th note that the healer also knows what heals to use in what situation instantly.

Linds, again agree'n with Alex. It depends on your class but intellect is an insane stat to stack. It really depends on your gear level and content, but a little int goes a LONG way. Int will give you all of the essential stats you need for healing but most importantly scales with replenishment. If you are having trouble in heroics or in normals because of unlucky drops or poor quest gear itemization. Bring a Ret Pally, Shadow Priest, Affliction Warlock, or a Survival Hunter. Mana regeneration is based on the healing classes having a situational mana regen ability and replenishment.

As a druid? To be honest you have a TON of options in terms of stat stacking. With the changes to innervate you don't need spirit to make it effective, so when I get my druid to 80 I plan on going straight throughput (spellpower) to really maximize HoTs and Wildgrowth.


I would probably go: SP>Haste~Crit>Spirit>mp5

I used to be one of those people that took a balanced approach to a single set. But now I'm finding I have to sets that totally boost one stat. As a shaman: int set and spell power set (I have a chain heal set with almost 900 haste, but I don't count it since I only use it in one fight)

Spell power will always provide maximim benefit for spells

Haste isn't so much used to reduce cast time, but to reduce the GCD to a minimum of 1 second. As a class with many instant heals, getting more spells out because your gcd is at 1 rather then 1.5 could probably help a ton. But you need to STACK haste for it to be effective.

Crit.... well RNG has never been my friend. So I go with a sure thing like spell power. But Critical strikes are for fact more throughput in healing. Big question, are those huge crits effective heals? Pallys next patch and Shaman on live benefit from over healing to some degree. You have to ask yourself if crit'ing for a billion when someone only needed a 1K heal is really all that great.

Spirit, it got nerfed. True story.

Mp5, well... mp5 is going to be really controversial next patch. 80% of the time you don't get mp5 on cloth or leather. But mp5 is also getting an enormus buff.... I want to say DOUBLE, but I might be thinking of shield block rating. This coupled with the fact that mana regen is again getting nerfed might mean mp5 might be a nice stat to not stack, but supplement in blue sockets over spirit. MAYBE. I'll theory craft when the ptr doesn't have such a horrible build and let you guys know what I find out.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 08 Jul 2009, 21:40
Well, my problem with crit is that it only affects the direct heals and that druids have an awful lot of talents that give Spirit increased synergy as well as an awful lot of HoTs. As a shaman I probably wouldn't touch spirit with a ten foot pole, but trees get 50% mana regeneration while casting, 15% increased Spirit and bonus spell power equal to 15% of total Spirit. So, if you're like one of my guildies and can hit 1k Spirit after buffs you end up with something like 150 Spell power and the equivalent of 250 Mp5. I would still stack spellpower and intellect first if given a choice in the matter, but it's such a well-rounded stat for druids that I'd be inclined to rank it over crit, particularly when you consider that your Regrowth and Nourish will have a 25% crit bonus after talents anyway.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 09 Jul 2009, 00:52
Just going trow in some numbers here about mp5 and such for healers. I have a disc priest and a resto druid.
Disc priest, fuck spirit. It's a crap stat and you will allways get more out int. But you can't avoid it and the three points to meditation isn't that much. But still, never ever stack spirit.
So i prio something like this right now. SP > Int > crit/haste > spirit.

Holy priests on the other hand likes spirit but not as much as druids. I would say that spirit and int is of equal value for holy. So SP > int/spirit > crit/haste.

Druids love spirit and its a great stat for them. But spell power is still their prio but not by much. So SP > spirit > haste/crit > int.

I don't know that much about shammy healing more than what my friend tells me, but it looks to me that they should stack a hell of a lot of mp5 and int (for replenishment).

Pallys just have one prio, get as much int as you can. This might change in the next patch.

Crit and haste is allways dependent on how much you have of each of them. Allthough haste is slightly better for druids while crit is better for paladins. As a disc priest I stack crit since I allways have borrowed time for the important heals. Thats my experience anyway.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: philharmonic on 09 Jul 2009, 07:18
My daughter just hit lvl 40 with her Night Elf Druid last night. Its cool to watch her in action. She seems to do a good balance of tanking and healing on any of the instances i've seen her play.

In the meantime i've started a human warrior who i've called Angusteak well actually he's lvl 15 already. And for fun I've also started a Troll mage i've called Marshmello. both toons are technically on my wifes account.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 09 Jul 2009, 08:09
I guess my thoughts with druids is that it depends a lot on just how geared you are and what your needs are. When just starting out with my druid I've had more issues with regen than raw healing output, so at my gear range I think in terms of Spellpower>Int>Spirit>Haste 'till 1 sec gcd soft cap>crit=Mp5>Haste post soft cap. My druid's just an alt though; I would bet that someone geared enough to be trying hardmodes as a druid would probably be thinking more along the lines of Spellpower>haste 'till softcap>Spirit>Crit>Int>Haste post soft cap. After all, endurance is nice for hardmode encounters, but first you need to be able to keep up to begin with.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 09 Jul 2009, 16:51
Thanks guys! Really I just need to do more instances so I can get gear, because once I hit 80 I may start running Naxx and then Ulduar if I can get good enough gear to get me through it. They joined another guild so hopefully this new guild doesn't need a full time healer and will let me continue to dps. I don't mind healing, but I don't know if I want to do it all the time.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 09 Jul 2009, 17:13
Just keep doing naxx now, even 25 mans will take you along unless they are full of idiots. You only need one or two of the tanks and healers to be capable to get to kt.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 13 Jul 2009, 20:02
Ding, level 40

dude i thought you "quit"

i am level 60 and well on my way to becoming someone who has no life and raids every day.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: anamnesies on 14 Jul 2009, 06:53
Playing a rogue for too long leads to sociopathy and assorted mental illnesses (been there, done that). You've been warned.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 14 Jul 2009, 11:02
Case in point: I main a rogue.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: BeoPuppy on 14 Jul 2009, 11:51
I hate rogues.

There's just dick a nice sweet druid can do against those sneaky bastards.

But then again ... there's quite a few classes a druid can do dick about. Maybe I suck as a druid.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: messeduplilkid on 14 Jul 2009, 11:54
Shred is raids = bullshit.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 14 Jul 2009, 11:57
Perhaps you do suck? I find dealing with a Rogue is a simple matter of popping bear form and hitting frenzied regeneration, casting faerie fire, popping Berserk and then spamming mangle. Rogues generate a fuckton of rage.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: BeoPuppy on 14 Jul 2009, 11:59
Not an option for me. Boomkin and healing specc'd.

And I probably do suck, I admit that freely. Half the terms lobbed about in this thread are alien to me.

You have much knowledge.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 14 Jul 2009, 13:23
as boomkin, faery them up, root/dotdot that other root thing where they get rooted if they hit you then spam moonfire?

Fuck it, fairy then spam moonfire.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 14 Jul 2009, 15:04
Gear comes into this a lot as well. Any class can beat down someone they outgear given a large enough margin, but rogues are uniquely suited to making such encounters embarrassingly one sided if there's a big gap involved. For example, my rogue is stupidly dominant in an encounter in which both parties are wearing PvE gear; I'm running with around 37% crit and with procs I can ignore roughly 60% of my opponents armor. Hell, one time I killed a Paladin and a DK with a single Blade Flurry->Sinister Strike->Killing Spree combo simply because of the grotesque gear disparity and because I had jumped them in a space roughly the size of a phone booth; putzing around in the BGs isn't really the best way to ensure an even encounter. High grade pvp gear and resilience stacking, on the other hand, makes it a whole new ballgame.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 14 Jul 2009, 15:37
Nobody should ever spam moonfire. One, that's a stupid, annoying move that honestly doesn't work as well as people think, and two, you anchor their ass down with roots and use starfall, moonfire, faerie fire, swarming insects, blah blah blah. If you are resto though, yeah, you don't really have a chance. But seriously. Rogues may be sneaky, fast jerks, but you just have to remind them you are basically a mage in mail/plate that can cure poisons. Really the only classes I've had problems with are mages, due to lack of resistances, but once you get close enough, that's not really a problem. Also, treants are good friends to have in pvp.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 15 Jul 2009, 16:07
In my pvp set I can get to 1020 res.

Just bring it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 15 Jul 2009, 17:21
Yeah, 1k resilience is easily enough to take Combat specs from "I can burst people to death before they know what hit them" to "Crap, they lived and now I'm being kited again. I knew I should have specd for Preparation."
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 15 Jul 2009, 18:32
Mutilate prep is possibly on par with prot for annoyance level, but for a totally different reason, seeing as they actually have the ability to kill someone instead of being an unbreakable rock with shutdown but the inability to do enough dmg to kill anyone at all ever.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 20 Jul 2009, 05:54
I love how questing in certain areas of Storm Peaks turns you into a frost vrykul. What's even more amusing is when you're in flight from over these areas and you turn into a swimming frost vrykul. Just swimming through the air. That's not weird.

(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b198/andthentherewaslindsey/FreeSnap001-1.jpg)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 20 Jul 2009, 12:52
The flying machine one is pretty cool as I found out on my dk, legs should be getting shopped up :P
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: variable_star on 25 Jul 2009, 09:35
I was a lvl 54 undead warrior named "Morrissey" on Azjol-Nerub. I quit in '05.

Strange, everyone thought I was a big fan of Morrissey. Is making him a zombie killer really a tribute?

I don't know, but Viva Hate was a pretty good record. In 1988.

Wait, what were we talking about again?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 25 Jul 2009, 14:59
1988 was an awesome year for music.

And people being born.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 29 Jul 2009, 23:14
I'm kinda bummed out 'cuz I thought I was going to hit 40% unbuffed crit with my next upgrade, but when I equipped it I topped out at 39.94%. Which, you know, is pretty nice, but I really wanted to hit that benchmark.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 30 Jul 2009, 00:19
Patch next week (most likely).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 30 Jul 2009, 17:59
A paladin in my guild is up to 33k mana when buffed now. Holy shit.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 30 Jul 2009, 20:26
I can has mana?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 31 Jul 2009, 12:51
Only if ICH steady rage.

Also, druids never get rage starved, have an AoE instant attack on GCD, don't need to gear for crit immunity, hit the hit and exp hardcap with ease and can switch to dps instantly while in combat.

I only really realised what this means now.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 31 Jul 2009, 15:03
Druids have been pretty much OP since BC hit.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 04 Aug 2009, 09:59
Prot paladins will kill us all.

Oh yeah, I'm also playing this game again. Nurfbat on Greymane, Alliance US PvE.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 04 Aug 2009, 12:27
Patch day!

Hope nobody was planning on playing today.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 04 Aug 2009, 12:42
i am gonna be able to afford my flying mount now. woot.
that is pretty much the most exciting thing about this patch for me.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 04 Aug 2009, 13:11
Sadly, I managed to get my flying mount, leatherworking epics and enough mats to make a Greatness card within my first 5 days of being level 80. I wish I could say it was easy or that it took anything approximating normal, well-balanced lifestyle to pull that off, but really, it just means that I'm a sad obsessive. Things like that is why I have since made a conscious decision to only play three nights a week now, tops.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: kemon on 04 Aug 2009, 13:12
Prot paladins will kill us all.

Oh yeah, I'm also playing this game again. Nurfbat on Greymane, Alliance US PvE.

yay for prot pallies!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 04 Aug 2009, 13:59
Prot warriors got 3 massive huge buffs too, I like it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Kiki on 06 Aug 2009, 15:07
Actually taking a break from raiding, but I play now and then.

Kiboú - 80 resto druid on Hyjal
Inryoku, Shuu - 80 warlock/priest on Dawnbringer
Ènt - 71 balance druid on Nesingwary

I'll be going to Blizzcon this year too :3

My wow/personal blarg with a lot of WoW stuff x3 http://lovelyblackdress.wordpress.com/
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 08 Aug 2009, 13:16
I'm not really upset since it's just loot (hell, loot that I'll be replacing shortly now that the patch hit), but honestly, what's with people getting a best in slot item and then leaving the guild? I mean, I passed on the Golden Saronite Dragon in favor of a dude with a naxx 25 weapon 'cuz it was a bigger upgrade for him. Plus, he's always been exempt from our (rarely enforced) attendance policy to even get into the raid to begin with, so I'm kind of at a loss as to why he's wandering around general chat linking his Leviathan achieve and BIS mainhand weapon as a reason as to why you should recruit him.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 10 Aug 2009, 11:44
Additional instances cannot be launched, please try again later.


Also, I got Rivendare's Deathcharger this morning. You may commence being jealous of me.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 10 Aug 2009, 18:06
I'd be jealous since that damn thing won't drop for me, but I got a shiny new Steel Bladebreaker (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=46958) so I'm content for now.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 11 Aug 2009, 17:54
Downed Lord Jaraxxus but he didn't give any loot. Gonna chew me out some GMs.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 12 Aug 2009, 19:20
Additional instances cannot be launched, please try again later.

What the crap is up with that? I never had problems with instances until Ulduar came out.

Also yes, I am a bit jealous.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Aurjay on 12 Aug 2009, 21:29
So im a little late to the game but i finally got Lich King. I was a very well equipped resto druid on BC and now thats all gone to crap. O'well i just ran UK for the 1st time and got a nice BLUE...its been forever since ive had a blue...anyways so far im liking northrend and all my new resto traits. Omen of Clarity as passive FTW. Only thing really bugs me is that i worked my ass off for epic flight form and now its trainable and i cant even fly in northrend wtf!!!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 12 Aug 2009, 22:48
Guys I'm terrible at making (and/or saving) gold. Tell me how.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 12 Aug 2009, 22:53
Dailies. Once you hit eighty and start doing dailies, gold comes hand over fist.

Oh, and also:

Onyxia is gonna fuck your shit up, seriously this time. (http://www.wow.com/2009/08/12/onyxia-returns-in-patch-3-2-2/#continued)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 12 Aug 2009, 23:03
Are there certain ones I should be doing? I'm only really doing the Argent Tournament ones currently. I just wanna get epic flying. I normally wouldn't be bothered by not having it, but now I have a bronze drake I won from a timed CoS run just sitting in my bank.

P.S./Update: I'm now healing Naxx10 and the occasional OS10/25 and I'm really enjoying it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 12 Aug 2009, 23:25
Before I got exalted, my rotation would start at the AT (Which gives a fuck ton of dailies), head to the Shadow Vault, to Sholazar, to Dalarn for the fishing and cooking dailies then finish up in Storm Peaks with the Sons of the Hodir (These were great as a leatherworker, since I would gather shit tons of discarded leather doing those and in turn sell it on the AH).

You can make about 325 gold minimum a day running dailies, more if you're an Argent Champion, since you can get those coin purses instead of the Champion's Writ if you so desire.

Basically, find your own pattern. Get a bunch you can do swiftly and form an order that's quick for them. It's even faster once you get epic flight. I got it about three weeks ago and I've built up enough money to dual spec some of my alts.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 16 Aug 2009, 10:03
So I just got a new laptop and it runs WoW gorgeously.

(http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w274/Yakob42/WoWScrnShot_081609_121727-1.jpg)


Oh, and ty for the daily tips.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 16 Aug 2009, 13:49
The only thing that bums me out so far about this patch is that the Loliseum is waaaaay too easy and that I can't even really say anything about it without people saying I'm an elitist who hates casuals yada yada yada. Please believe me when I say I do not have a stick up my ass! I think it's great that people can afford their epic mounts and that players can breeze through the (sadly barren) old content on their way to 80. When I say bitterly that this patch represents free loot for everyone, it is only the fact that this apparently includes raiders that upsets me. The easy conquest tokens means fuck all to me. It just kinda sucks to wait ages for new content to contend with only to utterly steamroll each encounter, that's all. It literally takes much, much longer to figure out how to divide the loot than it takes to down any of the new bosses. This makes me a sad panda.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 17 Aug 2009, 10:55
I'm genuinely shocked no one's gotten around to posting this, major POTENTIAL lore spoilers ahead, I'll shrink the relevant text.:

Alleged details of next expansion pack leaked (http://www.mmo-champion.com/index.php?topic=92919.0).

Now, I'll be the first to admit that a lot of this seems dubious at absolute best. The gameplay mechanic changes make a lot of sense. With Outland and Northrend covered, short of going to the Emerald Dream, I don't see much latitude for adding zones shy of absolutely fucking the current Azeroth landscape. The race additions are sensible and some of the class changes seem cool (Troll Druids sounds neat, but sounds VERY suspicious without adding another Alliance Druid). The Thousand Needles being flooded and the Barrens being split both sound like absolute brilliance, in my opinion and opening Gilneas would be a long time coming. It's also a very sensible idea for adding flight to old world Azeroth and damned if I haven't been wanting a Hyjal zone since I started playing last year. Also, despite being a Horde fan, I think the idea of outright destroying Orgrimmar and opening a new Orc city seems ballsy and really cool.

On the other hand, most of the lore ideas mentioned seem absolutely idiotic to me. The Wolvar and Goblin rationales both make sense and I like the Cataclysm idea, but it pretty much ends there. Thrall as the Guardian of Tirisfal? No thanks, I like him as the level headed flipside to Jaina Proudmore, who would make so much more sense as the new Guardian (And my brother rightly points out that Velen would make the most bitchin' choice and the most sensible). And Hellscream as the Horde leader? No fucking thanks. I hate him. He's our version of that petty, whiny little bitch Varian, who is the biggest obstacle to me ever rolling an Alliance alt. If Thrall had to be replaced, I'd go with Saurfang, personally. He's wise, sure handed, has experience with the whole blood of Mannoroth mess and is an absolute badass, The Cairne/Baine thing makes zero sense as well. The only way I could imagine Cairne being executed as a traitor is if he stood up and said "Ummm, dude, Garrosh? You're being a tard, knock it off" and Baine stepping in after his father's executed and then STICKING with the Horde makes negative amounts of sense. All told, the ideas sound like actively making the Horde full fledged bad guys, which would really water down the experience to me.


We'll see what shakes out as true and what doesn't this weekend, one way or the other. A lot of it does sound like red herrings Blizzard might be throwing out there to keep people off track and keep the guessing games about the expansion to a minimum.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 17 Aug 2009, 12:10
Colloseum is awesome for gearing alts, because gearing alts is boring as shit.

Other than that it is baws, even if the massive red dude in 25 man is megapainful.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 17 Aug 2009, 13:26
Yeah, but some decent kicks and proper spreading makes him pretty cake. Losing half the raid just means that the Fel Lightning is less likely to bounce, so even if you take ridiculous casualties he's still pretty easy to down.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 17 Aug 2009, 16:09
I heard about the linked changes as well Jon, and despite my decree to never play WoW again, but if a quarter of that stuff is true (besides the whole class thing, I couldn't care less about changes) it made me very interested to hear what they have to say at Blizzcon.

Quick, you guys, start going into long and boring rants about numbers and stats and gear and dps, make me not want to play the game again!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 17 Aug 2009, 16:23
My Saronite Dragon gave me an estimated 118.2 dps increase when compared to my other options if used perfectly in a fight that matches a scenario that exists only in the mind of some dude who spends too much of his free time with excel.


Is that boring enough? I think I threw up in my mouth a li'l while typing it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 18 Aug 2009, 16:40
Stuff.

Whoa. That could be interesting!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 18 Aug 2009, 17:16
Yeah, but some decent kicks and proper spreading makes him pretty cake. Losing half the raid just means that the Fel Lightning is less likely to bounce, so even if you take ridiculous casualties he's still pretty easy to down.
Just one shotted him as fury in a pug. Was boring but a little fun tbh.

I always ran over to the ad but since I was the only warrior my DPS was barely over 2k because of target changing and feeling the need to apply sunders...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 Aug 2009, 22:42
Yeah, that's one of those fights where I try to convince the casters to suck it up and be on adds. Luckily that's not really an issue for me since people need me on interrupts anyway, since Fel Fireball does around 45-50k odd damage once you factor in the dot, and nobody really feels like healing through that too often. Just volunteer to be on pummel duty next time; you'll do a lot more good and as a tank you're probably more practiced at that sort of thing than a lot of dpsers.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: kemon on 19 Aug 2009, 01:19
I'm genuinely shocked no one's gotten around to posting this, major POTENTIAL lore spoilers ahead, I'll shrink the relevant text.:

Alleged details of next expansion pack leaked (http://www.mmo-champion.com/index.php?topic=92919.0).


if this is true, i guess my pally is switching sides.

Tauren Paladin!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Skelley on 19 Aug 2009, 05:49
I'm genuinely shocked no one's gotten around to posting this, major POTENTIAL lore spoilers ahead, I'll shrink the relevant text.:

Alleged details of next expansion pack leaked (http://www.mmo-champion.com/index.php?topic=92919.0).


if this is true, i guess my pally is switching sides.

Tauren Paladin!
Tauren Paladins and Dwarf shamans.

Cataclysm has the potential to be amazing.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Pengupower on 20 Aug 2009, 16:08
If there is a dwarf shaman it will be the first time I have ever leveled a class twice (hoping so much).  All my characters are dwarf except my shaman since he couldn't be.  It all started with a female dwarf priest because there didn't seem to be any female dwarves around.

Even if these leaks turn out to be false, it seems to have given blizzard plenty of free advertising for Blizzcon.  Before all this, we probably would have just been asking why aren't the instance servers working right.

I'm hoping these turn out to be true though.  Giving the starting zones some big changes would be nice.  Right now the earliest levels feel like the most unpolished. Depending on the path you choose to take while leveling can make it worse or better of course.

Now if they could just find a way to make the player base nicer to each other (seems highly unlikely).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 20 Aug 2009, 20:29
SO Mimiron hard mode is pretty hard. Like, really really hard.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 20 Aug 2009, 21:18
Haven't actually given it a try. I was bummed when they nerfed normal Mimiron though.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Skelley on 21 Aug 2009, 04:02
The idea of Grom Hellscream being the new Warchief and declaring open war on the Alliance makes it seem less likely that they're going to encourage the player base being that much nicer.

Of course, even inside each faction most people seem to hate each other. Especially Gaetusk. There is no one on my server who is hated by more people than Gaetusk.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: maxusy3k on 21 Aug 2009, 12:30
Expansion Details (http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/94064-BlizzCon-09-Blizzard-Announces-WoW-Cataclysm) announced at Blizzcon.

Some of that stuff sounds wicked crazy, you guys.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: maxusy3k on 21 Aug 2009, 12:41
Considering the actual confirmed stuff, Gnome Priests are the least of your lore issues.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 21 Aug 2009, 13:39
I haven't seen anything that doesn't make sense confirmed lore-wise yet. The only shit I've had a legitimate problem with hasn't been touched on even briefly as of yet.

But hey, the trailer looks fucking badass: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ujjEhgEDA-c (http://) and most of the gameplay changes have been confirmed, with some exciting new stuff and some slight changes (It appears Orgrimmar WILL stick around, but I get the feeling Durotar might be fucked and it's looking like Duskwood will be flooded instead of Thousand Needles).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 21 Aug 2009, 13:55
Heroic Deadmines. Oh yeah.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 21 Aug 2009, 16:55
Fuck Thrall. Please, god, enough with the Thrall-centric bullshit, I've had it with Orc Jesus. He's a boring mary-sue and needs to be killed.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Skelley on 21 Aug 2009, 17:25
Gear changes everywhere!

MP5? GONE. Replaced by Spirit
Spell power? GONE. Replaced by Int for mana and spell power.
Attack power? GONE. Replaced by Agility, which provides two attack power for rogues, hunters, shamans. Replaced by Strength for Warriors, Death Knights, and Paladins
Defense? GONE. I should've been paying more attention to this, I can't remember what it was replaced with.
Armor Penetration? GONE. Too mathy, they said. Gonna be replaced by something called 'Mastery'

Spell changes? RANKS GONE.
They're now just gonna scale based on level. Fun.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 21 Aug 2009, 18:43
I'm going to have to admit, I have no idea what you're angry at, because I don't like reading spreadsheets in my free time, I like playing video games.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 21 Aug 2009, 18:44
So basically they are reverting it back the way it was originally?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Aug 2009, 19:35
I like tinkering with gear quite a bit, but I do think that their attribute system turned into a big hot tranny mess at some point. Talent synergies aside, Spirit, Intellect and Mp5 are all essentially regeneration stats under the current implementation, which makes for pretty boring and unintuitive decision making. For example, choosing between more spell power or mana regeneration attributes hits me as a potentially interesting decision. A balancing act between brute force and staying power is a pretty intuitive concept and with a bit of experimentation I think people could get pretty close to figuring out what balance they need to strike through gameplay. Intellect vs. Spirit, however, is not really like that these days. They both essentially serve the same purpose, so the trick is simply recognizing which item has the arbitrary ratio that spits out the bigger numbers.


As for Armor Penetration, I won't miss that either. It's a powerful stat and I plan to abuse it while it's available, but it's unintuitive as hell and cannot really be properly evaluated without knowing your target's armor value.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 21 Aug 2009, 19:57
Defense will essentially be replaced by talent tree stuff.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 21 Aug 2009, 20:09
TBH, I'm glad they're switching mp5 and spell power back to spirit and int. Whatever they did with WotLK changed what it was with TBC and I don't understand it as much as I used to and have been having gear problems because of it. Really, it'll be a lot easier when you think about it. Instead of balancing at least 4 different things (dunno if penetration and haste are affected by this?) when looking at what to wear for what spec in what situation (ie. pve and instances for me), this will make it much better for people like me who don't get/want to bother understanding everything about gear just because darn it, I just want to play the game.

I like that they'll be changing the landscape, but I don't know if I like the idea of a tauren paladin or gnome priest and having other races become druids. (Personally, I like that it's only NElves and Tauren. Are there any worgen or troll druids NPCs anywhere?) Also considering I think the lore is so strong in WotLK, why go and mess with it? It's my favorite part of this expansion! :-(
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Aug 2009, 20:20
I can't bring myself to care too much about that stuff 'cuz I'm still annoyed that the Tier 9 warrior set is named after Varian Fucking Wrynn instead of Lothar. Hell, I'd be happier with Bronzebeard gear than Wrynn. They're about as active in the lore and theirs doesn't mostly consist of them being douche bags.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 21 Aug 2009, 21:26
It's ok. My warlock gear looks like mage gear and is named after a mage.

And it sucks ass.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Aug 2009, 22:09
Well, my main is actually a rogue, so I'm actually stuck with VanCleef's corset, not Wrynn's gear. But even so, the Lothar snubbing annoys me worse than any questionable fashion choices.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 22 Aug 2009, 08:38
More evidence as to why I hate Armor Penetration: According to my most recent number crunching, I'll hit just enough Armor Penetration that suddenly it becomes far, far more effective than raw agility for me... but only if I re-gem everything with the highest grade shinies, which will be prohibitively expensive, particularly since I'll need to burn some more JC tokens. I'll probably have this li'l project completed by tomorrow since I'm a hopeless obsessive, but oh, will my gold supply be hurtin'.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 22 Aug 2009, 13:51
http://www.blizzard.com/blizzcon/video/stream-wow.xml Anyone following this? I am enjoying teh arena coverage tbh.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 23 Aug 2009, 23:50
Well how bout that, the leak was real. Goblins, bout time, and Worgen, interesting twist.

Also fuck I restarted my subscription.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 24 Aug 2009, 08:09
Deleted my shaman and I am holding off rolling a druid until the expansion. FOR OBVIOUS REASONS.

As for the item changes, all my theory crafting and understanding is for nothing now huh...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: axerton on 24 Aug 2009, 09:31
just remember that there probably still a year until the expansion actually hits, so probably not nothing.

but damn it I wanted a draenei druid
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 24 Aug 2009, 10:47
There's too many space goats in game already, no need to give them Druids too.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 24 Aug 2009, 12:08
Man, maybe its just because I haven't played for a while, but playing a Paladin is a little more fun than it used to be.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 24 Aug 2009, 21:06
I still don't get how worgen can be druids, since technically they are human, but way better them than draenei. And will I make a worgen something? Oh yes I will. I've been waiting for a more fun looking alliance race. Also their starting area looks awesome.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Skelley on 24 Aug 2009, 21:38
Well, if you think about it, being able to transform into some kind of feral beast probably makes them a little closer to nature than normal, not worgen humans.

I will make a worgen rogue, however, and specialize only in first weapons. Worgarine.

We've still got a week before that joke starts getting old.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 24 Aug 2009, 21:48
i am so excited about worgen.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Aurjay on 24 Aug 2009, 22:07
looks great and cant wait to get my hands on a worgen.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: est on 24 Aug 2009, 23:42
does ChristopherWorgen fit?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: JD on 24 Aug 2009, 23:51
Or YourMomsAGoblin?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yayniall on 25 Aug 2009, 07:54
GoblinDick?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 25 Aug 2009, 11:20
Anyone else think worgen backwards is a bit risqué?

(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3520/3853924806_d9436be0b1_o.jpg)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 25 Aug 2009, 14:57
Well, if you think about it, being able to transform into some kind of feral beast probably makes them a little closer to nature than normal, not worgen humans.

From what I can tell, I don't think they'll be switching back between human and Worgen form, looks like they'll have some sort of ability tied to the moon or some jazz that maybe will make them stronger/more bestial than they already are or something, but I think the change is a permanent curse.

Also, looks like they're going to be stressing the ancient alliance with the night elves and Gilneas, so if they're getting druid as a class it'll probably be because the night elves will be helping them to handle their more primal nature.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 25 Aug 2009, 20:35
The former is false. The Worgen will have both a human and worgen form. They can switch at will out of combat, but in combat, it's worgen only.

The latter, though, is right on target. Judging by trailers and blue posts, it's being heavily implied that the Night Elves are the ones bringing the Worgen into the Alliance, teaching them Druidism.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 26 Aug 2009, 13:34
Oh, sweet. Hmm. I may just have to change races... >.>
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Gemmwah on 27 Aug 2009, 03:08
Oh my god. I need to get my new rig so I can get playing again, and then be ready to roll a couple new alts when this pops out. So excited. I think i peed.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 27 Aug 2009, 11:43
Jens, what did you roll on darkspear? Horde or Alliance? I'll pop on whichever side it is, especially if its horde since I don't really have any leveled horde anyway.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 27 Aug 2009, 13:03
There are few people as casual as me actually. My highest character is level 58, and I've been registered off and on since WoW came out. I don't even know if I'd be able to catch up to you, knowing my pace and the fact that the schoolyear is coming up. Could always try though. Registered under the name Felundyr. Orc Hunter.

Strike that, Tauren Hunter Kalh.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 27 Aug 2009, 14:03
Talking about casual, my main finally hit 80! And now I have no idea what to do because very few of my friends play anymore and I have pretty much no guild, which means no raiding. So uh. Yeah. I guess I could continue questing and stuff and try to get my epic flight form, since I can't seem to ever make enough money for that.

Maybe I'll play with you guys on Darkspear.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 27 Aug 2009, 14:37
I'd tell you guys to come to Grizzly Hills but that'd be a terrible idea because my server is so awful. It's packed mostly with newbs due to being a Wrath baby, but that's not really the problem. The real problem is that our backwater status meant that we had a lot of crappy raiding guilds transfer here because they had burned too many bridges back home and because they were the sort of people who really, really care about getting server firsts. These people also seem to really resent having to recruit from non-veterans. Which, you know, is something they really should have fuckin' thought of before they moved to a server that's less than a year old and didn't allow any transfers for the first 3 months of its existence. So far, we haven't had any last a month without collapsing and bombing trade chat with idiotic drama. Thankfully my guild has remained stable and since has been trucking along nicely, but man, I would not want to be a freelancer on this server.

Oh, and most pugs have 2-3 dks in them, minimum. The other two spots are paladins. So, hey, that's a plus if you're a clothie, I guess.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: kemon on 27 Aug 2009, 15:11
so is there not a qc guild somewhere?   maybe someone should start one so i can mess around on a low level character until cataclysm hits.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 27 Aug 2009, 16:39
We had one for a bit, and then people like me dropped off of WoW again, and others didn't feel justified in leveling an alt on a server for a guild that no one was playing in.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 27 Aug 2009, 19:04
Yes, but I think you can play on both? Like, there's an option for which set of servers to choose from before you choose an actual server, US or Oceanic (I think).

I'm going to try now...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 27 Aug 2009, 19:12
For my fellow Hordies, The Forgotten Coast is a great Horde server and I'd be willing to lend a hand to any of you who pop up on here. I've got a level 80 Druid, a level 58 DK and a level 32 Hunter.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 27 Aug 2009, 19:16
Nope, Jens, no luck. :( It says your character can't be found.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 27 Aug 2009, 20:22
Damnit, my Tauren is already level 8... and it sucks ass leveling in early Mulgore...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Gemmwah on 28 Aug 2009, 03:07
Hey Gemm, let's hit Darkspear! I am on there most days of the week (still levelling my priest), and Khar is too though I haven't seen him in, like, fuckin months. I need companyyyy

I'll roll an alt on there once I get playing again. None of my friends play on Twilight's Hammer any more, which is a bummer 'cause I really like that server.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 28 Aug 2009, 07:03
This thread makes me wish I could send bind on account items to different servers.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 28 Aug 2009, 10:08
Damnit, my Tauren is already level 8... and it sucks ass leveling in early Mulgore...

What's his name?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 28 Aug 2009, 11:08
lv 8? Must have take a whole evening!

Reroll on a friends server, will be well worth it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 28 Aug 2009, 15:04
Ha ha, funny. staring at a screen leveling a low level character is boring as hell and strains your eyes for the first two hours, and I'm a whiny bitch. Anyway, doesn't matter, Tauren gone, hunter on The Forgotten Coast, Orc named Felundyr, will go BM with.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 28 Aug 2009, 16:40
Sooo just logged into my Shaman after being in the bush for 2 mos cherry picking. And I must say, this Totem Bar is rad! I just got beefcake!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 28 Aug 2009, 22:49
Made an undead rogue named Lilliane on Forgotten Coast.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 29 Aug 2009, 14:18
I'll be on to quest with you guys after the weekend. I'm spendin' time with the lady.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 29 Aug 2009, 18:06
Sorry Jens. :( I'd play with you if the silly servers would let me.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 30 Aug 2009, 15:09
I'd consider rolling an alt on The Forgotten Coast if Tauren could be prot pallies.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 30 Aug 2009, 15:15
They could be...in a year.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 30 Aug 2009, 15:17
Yeah. If it weren't for that I'd actually consider sucking it up and just putting up with being a belf. Consecration is that good.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 30 Aug 2009, 15:48
I was going to make a paladin on TGF, but I freaking hate how female blood elves look. They look wimpy and like a good gust of wind would knock them over, which is not a good look to have when you are a holy meat shield. Pansy race...

Also, I am getting sick of how shitty my gear is. Also I'm getting tired of people not knowing what they're doing when they are level 80. Granted I just now got there, but I've been playing for a few years now and kind of have the gist of the game. It's really not that hard. Also I don't think it should be that hard to pay attention when you're tanking. I used to do it, you kind of need to pay attention unless you feel like letting everyone die and jumping on their corpses and laughing. (I have a friend who's a resto shaman that does that when people are stupid and piss him off. It's quite funny to watch, actually.) Anyhoo. I'm just annoyed that I have been trying to run heroics to improve my gear so I am not 4th on the damage meter and it just isn't going well because I keep getting stuck with tanks who don't have a clue and don't take directions well.

Blah blah blah, I like this game, but I hate sooo many of the other players. I miss having a well rounded guild. :(
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 30 Aug 2009, 16:11
What bums me out is when the shitty tank doesn't even know how to pull correctly. The worst part is that I end up spending all run boot strapping these idiots into something resembling competence and then get to hear everyone praising the guy lavishly at the end. I guess most puggers didn't get the memo. (http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=57934)

I don't even want to really go into how much Evasion tanking I get stuck doing. Thank god I have 35%+ dodge.

Anyway, that's kind of why I wanted to make a pally tank. I don't really want to be more than a part time tanker and Consecration face rolling is really about all you need to handle a 5 man OK.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 30 Aug 2009, 16:26
That is an awesome thing to have.

Well, I tried to run some heroics last night but Nexus didn't go anywhere because someone had to leave and the tank and healer were jerks. My damage was way low anyways, so I was like hey, might as well do the norms I haven't done yet and got invited to heal Culling, which I've wanted to do for a while because I like CoT instances. I knew nothing about it, but hey. Turns out they wanted to do heroic, I and one of the others said this was a bad idea, but the other three outvoted us and so we decided to try and the pally would help me heal. Well, our tank didn't have a clue what to do, even though there is an arrow on your mini map telling you where to go, and he and the pally weren't paying attention on the first boss, so of course we wiped. One guy left, I told them to change it to normal or get another healer, then another guy left and the group leader wanted to bring in a rogue and still run on heroic and I was all eff this crap, I'm going back to questing since tonight is obviously not the night to do heroics. I just want better gear so I can have the two friends that still play take me to Naxx and maybe even Ulduar!

I'm such a nerd.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 30 Aug 2009, 17:16
I can't really put my love for Tricks of the Trade into words. You can be so stupidly aggressive with it and once the initial pull is over it basically becomes a flat damage buff with no real drawbacks OR an emergency threat dump. It's even better for fights with multiple add phases like the Halls of Stone gauntlet or Thorim's arena. Fan of Knives gets all the headlines but Tricks is quietly one of the best abilities in the game.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 30 Aug 2009, 17:22
I used to try Kitty DPS. I have since given that up in favor of healing the fuck out of people. Healing in Wintergrasp is so much god damn fun.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 30 Aug 2009, 18:38
Fan of Knives gets all the headlines but Tricks is quietly one of the best abilities in the game.
+1

"Tricks / MD me on pull please if you wanna go apeshit on dps"
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 30 Aug 2009, 20:14
So yeah. Did ToC 3 times in a row with a great group and got 7 new epic pieces. (2 are purely for healing.) Yesssssssss.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Skelley on 31 Aug 2009, 04:53
I've come to hate leveling alt characters. I don't have any urge to get my priest past 70, my Death Knight past 68, I'd like to get my Hunter past 28 but then come the low thirties which are a pain in the ass.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 31 Aug 2009, 15:00
On my days off work, I do this http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Hellscream&n=Amashark
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Llewellian on 01 Sep 2009, 07:59
Ah... european server ^^.

Well, stopped playing about two months ago.... waiting for the new update...

http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Alexstrasza&n=Mullemulle

Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 01 Sep 2009, 09:00
Is a wakeup call from my main gearwise, http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Hellscream&n=Melville
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 01 Sep 2009, 10:35
It amazes me that so many tanks haven't bothered to get the Black Heart yet. There's so few good tank trinkets in the game that the Black Heart and a Monarch Crab could last you a very, very long time and there's no reason a fresh 80 can't have either of them easily. It's crazy how itemization dependent trinkets really are though (I still use Grim Toll and the Darkmoon Card: Greatness), so maybe people just don't realize how good it is.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 01 Sep 2009, 12:34
It's probably because running the fucking ren faire a billion times waiting for it to drop is too soul-crushingly horrible.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 01 Sep 2009, 12:53
Yeah, but we're talking about a game filled with masochists here, the sort of people that have 2 or 3 alts yet still think of themselves as "casuals."
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 01 Sep 2009, 12:58
I have 3 alts and consider myself casual. I think the difference is a combination of time played, and extreme effort to understand ever facet of the game.

For instance, when it comes to gear, I go to the AH and look for something that is cheap and better. I dont look up online and say I want X mace and I will fuck Naxx up until I get it. Hell I dont even really get how Naxx, Uldular and maybe Caverns of Time work. I know I wandered into CoT after killing a dragon on the way in with much effort. But once I was in there it was like a little town. Is that how these places are? Like a huge where there are multiple instances that can be run? Or are these instances just soooo massive that you generally only take down a little at a time?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 01 Sep 2009, 16:49
CoT has a whole bunch of normal 5man instances. The most recent one is CoT: The Culling of Stratholme which looks like a city when you're in there.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 01 Sep 2009, 17:14
Is that how these places are? Like a huge where there are multiple instances that can be run? Or are these instances just soooo massive that you generally only take down a little at a time?

A raid is just big instance, basically, although there's usually a couple of "wings" per raid zone these days. For example, Ulduar has 14 bosses and technically it's divided up into a few decent sized zones. Other than that the biggest difference is the number of people you need to have a chance at the encounters. I personally raid about 12-14 hours a week, which is admittedly a bit high, but I don't really do heroics or dailies anymore either, so it evens out.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 01 Sep 2009, 19:27
CoT is one of the biggest entrance areas you will see in most places. I think Blackrock Mountain is another one of the big ones, but most just have a small area with a few different portals. (I have gotten lost in CoT and always get lost and fall in the lava in Blackrock. Always.) In CoT the only raid is Mt. Hyjal, the others (Durnholde, Black Morass, and Stratholme) are all 5 man.

From my brief experience with Culling, I quite liked it. I only ever ran Stratholme for the tiny chance of the Baron's mount but never really cared for the instance. Then again, it has to do a lot with the lore of the game, which is why I like the CoT instances.

Here's me! (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Feathermoon&n=Mabh) All the epics minus the pants are what I got at ToC. I bought the pants the same day because I was so fed up with my gear, but it was worth it. I'm already noticing improvement in both healing and dps.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 01 Sep 2009, 20:48
Fuck it, why not. Here's my Armory Page. Murphus! (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=The+Forgotten+Coast&n=Murphus)

Also glad you linked your profile. Just nabbed myself an Ember Skyflare Diamond at AH. That should work much better than my Starflare.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 01 Sep 2009, 20:55
My armory. (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Grizzly+Hills&n=Intruder)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 01 Sep 2009, 23:52
My Warlock (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Greymane&n=Nurfbat)
My Alt Shaman (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Greymane&n=Chrianshaman)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Skelley on 02 Sep 2009, 04:04
My Paladin (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Alleria&n=Urdin)
My rogue (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Alleria&n=Urdal)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 02 Sep 2009, 04:08
We doing the armory thing again? Alright.

My priest. (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bleeding+Hollow&n=Starsnostars)

I've gotten significantly more geared since the last time I posted here. I definitely took advantage of the new emblems as much as I could.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: philharmonic on 02 Sep 2009, 06:51
After reading someones rant on how awesome a rogue is vs hunter I've decided to start one. I've called him Kimurachun and he's on Echo Iles US. (Night elf) case anyone cares. So far I'm quite impressed on how cool sneaking around cloaked is. Can't wait to level up and see what else he can do.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 02 Sep 2009, 08:54
nah man, roll horde on forgotten coast. all the cool kids are gathering there
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 02 Sep 2009, 09:41
Not that they're ever online!

Also, what's with all the fucking Alliance on here, huh?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 02 Sep 2009, 10:46
Better racials, bigger player base. Don't have to be the lamest race in the game to play one of the best classes (Paladin).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 02 Sep 2009, 11:00
Whelp theres a MUCH larger Horde base on Jaedenar (or whatever its called). But also, alliance races are kind of weiners, I mean, in every game ever I played a human (or elf/midget(gnome or dwarf)). So to be the bad guy or monter type thing is fun.

Though my new alt is a Gnome Warlock, though I am a total softie and cant live for shit because it goes against my playstyle.

Though I truly wish I was a Troll and not an Orc Shammy

*edit*

And my char sheet for my Enhancement Shammy (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Jaedenar&n=Chorbrak) or, a call for help gearing me.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 02 Sep 2009, 11:50
Your gear is fine for leveling and you made a great choice by having slow weapons in each hand. I wouldn't worry too much about your gear yet since none of your choices look egregiously bad, which implies you at least have the basics of which stats you want down. Besides, draenor is a tricky place for shamans because they still used strength back then, which means that a lot of the quest rewards will kind of suck until you hit Northrend. Some underpowered bits of gear here and there is something you'll probably just have to live with if you're mostly relying on quest rewards and dungeon drops. Slapping on some rogue leathers here and there in place of strength gear would help, although I wouldn't go overboard since armor class is kinda nice to have for soloing.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 02 Sep 2009, 12:28
I was going to roll a belf pally on forgotten coast today but sadly the name "Retcon" wasn't available.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 02 Sep 2009, 12:52
Not that they're ever online!

I will play tonight perhaps! But I may or may not ditch the rogue for a death knight because of how much I hate leveling before lvl 35. But then again, maybe that's because early Alliance zones suck? (Especially for humans. Ugh. I want to punch Goldshire in the face.) I'll give it a shot at least.

Better racials, bigger player base. Don't have to be the lamest race in the game to play one of the best classes (Paladin).

I've decided I wouldn't hate belfs so much if they were built more like night elves but with different coloring. (Which technically I think they should. Weren't they originally all the same race?) They are just so puny looking. Especially the females.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Pengupower on 02 Sep 2009, 13:27
If you really hate leveling in the early levels have you tried out the PvP in battlegrounds for experience?  I know that isn't everyone's cup of tea, but I know we have a few guildies that hated leveling alts that have started doing so due to that.

My death knight: http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Doomhammer&n=Pengu
My alt shaman: http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Doomhammer&n=sayam

I just took the shaman out of retirement last night to help heal the normal 10 man ToC.  After only healing once since early Ulduar (brought it for 10 man knock,knock,knock on wood once) it takes a bit to get adjusted to healing again.  Was fun to do again after some of the rust shook off after a few attempts on the faction champions.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 02 Sep 2009, 14:07
I'm not too good at pvp, but I do it for fun occasionally and do a ton of instances when leveling. It's just that even with my first characters, it was not nearly as much fun the first 30 or so levels as it is later on.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 02 Sep 2009, 14:27
Yeah it kind of dragged until 41ish, Improved Storm Strike was my turning point as at that point I didnt need to use Water Shield anymore so and had an additional dmg spell. Basically my offensive output skyrocketed and downtime became a myth. Also 30s in Stranglethorn SUCKED, I got picked on hard by higher level guys. Some guys even camped my corpse for kicks.

*edit*

Also, what I am really good at is the AH, and I just bought 5 Frozen Orbs for 2g total. They appear to go for about 40-50g each with a couple stacks available for around 35g apiece. Either way, so as to not be entirely greedy and because I have 18g Ill try for 35g bid and 40 buyout to move stock after all, 100x /ea profit isnt something to scoff at!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 02 Sep 2009, 15:28
I gave away 300ish gold and whatever stock of sellables I had when I went off the grid to pick Cherries, so this was an incredible boon for me. But largely my money always came from buying low and selling high. I got good at it during my Ragnarok Online days when I owned the market on a private server.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Skelley on 02 Sep 2009, 15:48
The only issue I've ever had with PVP experience is that it's usually fairly low. 378 a cap in WSG in the 10-19 bracket? Bah. That's only about 1000 experience for three caps, which probably takes longer than your average quest.

Also, I have discovered it's tremendous fun to troll private servers.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 02 Sep 2009, 15:55
In an effort to elevate my status from casual I have mapped out the cost of getting a [Gnomish Flying Machine] (http://www.wowwiki.com/Flying_Machine_Control) at 628g which includes Journeyman and Expert riding (as I still am an Apprentice rider) and all supplies for the schematic itself, sadly I must also raise my Engineering another 86 pts to 300 which has an unknown cost (though the schematic trainer says you need 350 Engineering to buy it, it was supposedly lowered to 300 in 3.2). But if I grind my mining (238) at the same time it should be alright, though I need to grind in Kalim/Eastern Kingdoms to get my Mining high enough for the Outlands where I currently level.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: kemon on 02 Sep 2009, 17:06
k, i finally got onto forgotten coast.   ud priest by the name of kemon.  yay for my name not being taken already.   course, i've only seen like 2 servers where my name is being used by someone else.   been wanting to play a priest horde side.

well, i was gonna put my armory links in here too, but armory is throwing errors instead of showing me pages.  maybe i'll try later.

oh, ps, everyone should '/join qc' so we can chat and stuff without having to set up a guild or anything.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 02 Sep 2009, 18:30
I only have 363 gold, although I probably have a few hundred gold worth of stuff laying around in my mailbox if I really wanted to scare up some cash.

Gold doesn't do me much good at this point anyway.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 02 Sep 2009, 19:20
I have around...1700g? But I am saving it (not very well) for epic flight. I can't seem to get past 2000g though.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Aurjay on 02 Sep 2009, 21:32
Ive been working on my resto druid for a long time. Only problem im having is I still rely way too much on my old PVP healing gear or Kara gear. Ive been running instances continually on LK but too be honest everything that drops still doesnt seem to be better than what I already have. Really just wanted to gripe but if anyone has any suggestions love to hear them.

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Turalyon&n=Aurjay
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: kemon on 03 Sep 2009, 00:17
70 purples last a ways into wotlk.  you should only start worrying if you're about to be 80 and still use 70 epics.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 03 Sep 2009, 01:49
My three 80's (yeah, I'm casual!). Anyone else playing on kazzak (eu)?
My Druid Main (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Kazzak&n=Stürm)
My Paladin alt (main up until about ulduar) (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Kazzak&n=Triela)
My Priest alt (TBC main) (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Kazzak&n=Triela)
I was playing my protadin for most part of Wotlk but when my old guild resurected we need a healer and a druid so I switched main. Starting to get a grip on healing as tree. Yesterday we did ulduar with only two healers (For the most part) with great success. Most of the time I have to be top of the game to follow the shaman and priest (holy) in healing done. When we were only 2 however my hots got loads more time to tick and I was miles ahead on most bosses. I had like 70% of overall healing done on ignis.

Fun thing with my priest a few weeks back was when I did a naxx25 pug and I won the quest from saphiron and a mage bought it from me for 2k. Brought me up ower 5k all in all. Boring thing is all my characters allready have epci mounts so don't really have anything good to do with the money.

It feels to me that all classes have gotten a boost in leveling around 30. Downtime seems to be a thing of the past.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: BeoPuppy on 03 Sep 2009, 04:21
http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=The+Maelstrom&n=Coinina (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=The+Maelstrom&n=Coinina)

My Druid.

Any thoughts on gear?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 03 Sep 2009, 05:36
Depends, are you aiming for PvP or PvE? If PvP, just stack as much resilience as possible to start with. If PvE, don't use PvP gear. ;)
Either way, get a new idol as fast as possible. That is probably one of the worst idols Ive seen. Coresponds to about 40sp every know and then. Without looking it up I would say it's on averag 5-10 sp and some small amount of mp5.

Also, alliance lance is cool looking and all... ;)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 03 Sep 2009, 12:34
My advice to you, Aurjay, is to go buy dual spec as soon as humanly possible. Forgo anything else: gear, epic flight, etc, in favor of dual spec. Dual speccing is useful enough to begin with, but as a Druid, it's brilliant. Dual spec yourself a resto build and leveling will be easy. I love resto on my Druid, but leveling a resto Druid is just an epic pain in the ass. Their survivability is great. but everything moves at a snail's pace.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 03 Sep 2009, 13:16
For leveling, feral is the best. For getting yourself into instances/parties guaranteed, a feral/resto dual spec is best, because then you can literally do everything.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Aurjay on 03 Sep 2009, 15:33
thanks for the advice. Ive been thinking of dual speccing for awhile just to help in my levelling cuz just as someone mentioned it takes forever to level as resto. Ive got about 500g so got a good ways to go but i think your right in that it would be worth it. 
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 04 Sep 2009, 15:29
Update on my Gnomish Flying Machine. I hit 300 in Engineering and Mining, so I have the recipe and will be Mining Hellfire Peninsula for Fel Iron and Motes of Fire for the ingredients I dont have. Next up, I have around 200g out of the 510g I need for training all other expenses have been taken care of or will be mined in the next few days.

Not bad considering I was about 100 levels of Engineering, 75 levels of Mining shy of what I needed and only 18g, not to mention I didnt even have Journeyman Riding Training when I started this push. Not bad for not having any help if I do say so myself.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 04 Sep 2009, 19:01
Heh, flying machine, hardest part for me was the elementium charges as you need someone who can make them with the rep they need for the recipie, engi was piss easy to grind all the way up to 440 then it just becomes trivial the shit you need to do so I don't bother since it won't make much worthwhile. Levelled ench on the same char so it worked out quite nicely, both are 440 or something without too much effort.

Had the rest of the mats in my alt bank so was pretty easy, dunno if I would have bothered if it was my first 80 but then again I did spend about 2 weeks of dailies/bg grinding for stunherald and 2 piece glads back in tbc...

Also

My Alt Shaman (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Greymane&n=Chrianshaman)
2*2set bonuses instead of a 4set bonus, I used this for my tier 7.5/8.5 so I had +10% shield slam damage and +10% dev crit for quite a while, I FELT SO DAM SMART I COULD HAVE BEEN IN PALADIN GEAR WITH MY UBER HIGH INTELLECT ^_______________^
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 04 Sep 2009, 19:26
I have no idea what you just said. But I originally got Engineering to get the flying machine back in April, but never got passed 205 engineering before I left for the summer because I had to finance my works myself because my mining was too low (I started with Skinning for the crit bonus and Leatherworking for the latterday Mail Armours and Leg Patches). But since then they lowered the requirements to get the recipe and the supplies to make it.

Actually the supplies are rather retardedly simple to get, the killed for me is making enough money to get flight training in the first place. After all this is my first char and when I came back this push to get the training (and everything else) started with 8 gold on the account. And all skills in the AH aside, it takes money to make money.

Though I do see your point, Enchanting would be marvellous as I cant afford any of the sweet enchants I want (Tuskars Blah Blah for extra speed even though instacast Ghost Wolf makes it redundant in most situations, and Mongoose is 400g let alone Berserk which is 900-1000k on my server).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 04 Sep 2009, 20:20
If you can find someone who can do the enchant, you may want to consider Cat's Swiftness (http://www.wowwiki.com/Enchant_Boots_-_Cat%27s_Swiftness) over the Tuskarr enchant. It only gives 6 agi compared to 15 stamina, but that's not really too bad of a deal, particularly since most people prefer offense over raw stamina, even while leveling. Plus, it's a BC era enchant so you could farm up a few of the Primal Airs needed yourself while still gaining experience if you wanted. The Large Prismatics would be a pain in the ass though, so I couldn't tell you whether it'd actually be cheaper or not on your server.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 05 Sep 2009, 08:39
tuskars sux, 22 stam ftw

/tank
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 05 Sep 2009, 10:31
Feh, movement speed bonus >>>> 7 stamina, even for a tank.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 05 Sep 2009, 10:31
Well ingredients are always cheaper because you find people trying to make a quick buck offselling old materials. But the completed item, well the only reason you see those on the server is because people want to make money, so they are rarely cheap unless they are used to level.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 05 Sep 2009, 21:16
Ran ToC a few more times tonight. (New shoulder item, woo!) First group was not so great*, but I found a well rounded group the second time and we ran it three times rather well! That place is really hard on my computer due to all the traffic, but it's worth it for the gear and gold. Also it's fun.

*When I joined there were two warriors and a shaman and I was like, ok, I'll give this a shot, hopefully they get a mage or something. No. They got another warrior. We wiped. The shaman immediately disconnected. One warrior asked what went wrong. Another said we were undergeared. I said we had no cc. The first warrior then blamed it on me. Yeah. 3 warriors and an enhancement shaman is a GREAT SET UP GUYS, YOU TRY HEALING THAT. So I thanked the dude for putting the blame on me and left. I quickly found another group, which was more well rounded (warrior, elem shaman, hunter, and dk) and we didn't wipe at all. HMM, I WONDER WHY. It's really not that hard to build a groups. You get a tank, a healer, at least one melee dps, some form of cc, and then another dps. And when shit goes wrong, you can't always blame the healer or the tank. Having done all three, they are all equally easy to be very good and very bad at.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 05 Sep 2009, 23:09
bought WotlK, made DK, may have fallen in love completely, goddamnit.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jimor on 05 Sep 2009, 23:17
My Paladin main is 2 levels from 55 where I finally get to try DK.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 05 Sep 2009, 23:19
I really liked the tutorial, really good, really interactive.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 06 Sep 2009, 05:42
One of us! One of us!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 06 Sep 2009, 05:50
Feh, movement speed bonus >>>> 7 stamina, even for a tank.
I can charge, and that amounts to like 77hp with kings and then some more with gotw and stuff so it's almost 100hp, or a slight movement increase, it's silly since I can zip around with relative ease using charge/intercept/intervene.

If I was a paladin however... You would have a strong case.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 06 Sep 2009, 13:51
I started playing again yesterday and I now remember why I quit.  I hate leveling 20s-30s.  Any tips guys?  I hate Stonetalon Mountains and Ashenvale.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Llewellian on 06 Sep 2009, 14:16
Get a mount ;o).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 06 Sep 2009, 23:45
Tuskar's vitality > * on boots. Movement speed is simply the best.
(Btw, paladins is the only tank who doesn't need it since it's no problemg geting 15% move from the ret tree.)

Cire27, what faction/rase?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 07 Sep 2009, 00:25
Well I got my Gyrocopter, and its pretty rad. Though I kind of want a mount that, you know... lives. I mean, my is silly and fun, but doesnt really suit my char.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 07 Sep 2009, 19:42
Undead Rogue.

Oh wait, you asked for faction and race.  Well I threw in class as an extra.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 07 Sep 2009, 20:07
Why the hell are you questing in Kalimdor? Eastern Kingdoms might be a nice change of pace for you. I think Tarren Mill is your 20's hub out there.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 07 Sep 2009, 20:50
Anyone know what the "fastest" class is to level? Or have opinions on the matter?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 07 Sep 2009, 21:02
Assuming one of the "pure" classes, prob Rogue or Warrior.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 07 Sep 2009, 21:22
Why the hell are you questing in Kalimdor? Eastern Kingdoms might be a nice change of pace for you. I think Tarren Mill is your 20's hub out there.

Crossroads was a lot more interesting than Silverpine forest when I played an undead warrior two years ago. Plus I liked WSG.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 07 Sep 2009, 22:17
Anyone know what the "fastest" class is to level? Or have opinions on the matter?

Hunter or Warlock. Possibly rogue or feral druid, stealthing bye shit can be very, very clutch.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 07 Sep 2009, 22:55
Uggg "clutch"
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 08 Sep 2009, 01:22
 Back in the day, I would have said hunters, bar none, since they are pure DPSers with great survivability via pets and a sweet travel power (Aspect of the Cheetah). They're also incredible at kiting, which is really noteworthy since kiting is a great way to solo nasty elites that give other classes trouble (many elites are outright immune to stuns, sadly, and most CC heals them to full). That said, the competition is a lot stiffer now. After all, the Feral and Enhancement trees for shaman and druids are a lot stronger than they were back at release, and both of those classes have travel forms that can best Aspect of the Cheetah. Plus, it's not even really that huge of a deal now to have sweet travel forms because everyone can get a mount at 20 anyway. The game's in a really healthy place right now in terms of leveling parity. If you must be the first guy to hit 80 on your server, I'd say go hunter, but other than that I wouldn't worry about it.

As for rogues, I'd say that we're actually pretty vanilla from a farming at 80 and leveling perspective. Basically, there's two big reasons why our damage is so potent in a group setting. Unfortunately, neither of those mean much when we're going about our business out in the wild.

1. We scale really, really well with epic gear and raid buffs. We're one of the top DPS classes in the game right now because we scale so well. We don't even have any real melee "junk" stats. Armor Penetration? So good that I'll soon be gemming it. Haste? Buffs our energy generation and our massive white damage. Agility? Yes, please! Heck, we do so much poison damage now that I can even get a noticeable DPS increase from a moonkin's spell crit aura! The downside to this? I'll just go ahead and quote Blizzard directly: "one of the disadvantages of scaling so well in a raid scenario is that you need to start at a lower baseline." (http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=10222015462&pageNo=1) The higher you go, the farther you have to fall. We still do competitive DPS solo, but without full buffs we actually do regress to the mean. I curb stomp hybrids and most casters in raids, but solo or in a 5 man? I'm just another dps class.

2. Finishers kick ass. Our best sustained DPS moves are Slice and Dice and 5 point Ruptures. Hell, Slice and Dice is so good that we're not even really raid viable without it. Key word is "raid viable," however, since the move is actually pretty vanilla against non-elites points since it only helps sustained damage and because the buff is so short that it's often counterproductive to chain together multiple mobs just to get full use out of it. Rupture is even worse. Most non-elites won't live long enough for us to run up 5 combo points on them, much less take several ticks of the dot. After all, warlocks only get such good use out of dots because they can quickly chain cast them against multiple targets and then finish them off with a few blasts of direct damage. Rogues have the formula backwards.

So, really, rogues are perfectly competent soloers. Our dps is as high as anyone's and stealth is pretty alright. But our dps isn't actually outright better in solo situations and our utility is kinda low. Stealth is cool, but frankly, I don't use it all that much simply because stealth is slower than walking or riding. Overall, we're good but nothing to write home about.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 08 Sep 2009, 02:13
As to what I've heard lately warlocks is great for leveling. More precisly afliction. Just dot and run, dont and run. Just can easily dot 5-10 mobs and keep running or let your blue dude aoe taunt if geting in to a tight spot. MEanwhile you get heals from drain life, talents and glyphs (som % of dot damage becomes hp) and never runs out of mana with life tap. Wicked combo!

But as Alex C said, it's quite even between lower levels. All clases have nice synergie for soloing now days. It's just a mather of level where the synergie is fully in place. Paladins don't get it until level 60 (divine storm = heals, damage and mana if you so like). Feral druids will as good as allways have mana to heal themselves every second or third mob. Hunters just let's their pet tank while they heal it. If you're a good player a frost mage have great utility to handle a lot of weird situations.

So if you want to level fast DON'T pick:
Boomkin (can't be boom while oom)
Priest (nice synergie but not until level 60 and hardly no burst)
Warrior (great earlie but the later it get's the slower it becomes imho)
Elemental shamie (no aoe, and the mana synergie comes quite late)

Might be that mages need to be down here as well since they have some downtime while they have to drink. Also, rumor has it that they have some rather big trouble with mana.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 08 Sep 2009, 06:28
Warlocks have been one of the very best levelers for a very long time now. Demonology has a lot of survivability and Affliction is as mana efficient as it gets.

As for mages, I actually think they're pretty underrated as levelers. Nukes aren't as efficient as dots, so they have more downtime than Warlocks, but it really isn't as bad as a lot of people make it out to be if you play right. To put it bluntly, the problem is that a lot of leveling mages are cheap bastards who are terrified of taking the occasional melee swing and thus reflexively Frost Nova every damned thing in sight while bitching about their outdated conjured water. If you take one on the chin every now and again rather than dropping a Frost Nova for every single pull and use your conjured stuff to stretch your store bought water while out in the wild, you'll find the downtime is actually pretty manageable, particularly since Mages can tag and burn down NPCs as fast/faster than anyone. Plus, you can take out a whole camp of quest mobs at once pretty easily if you know how to AoE grind, which is a pretty nice trick.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 08 Sep 2009, 11:01
When did you level your Rogue, Alex? There's been a lot of changes to Rogue lately, and I don't think I've ever gotten a class to forty faster than I got my subtlety Rogue there. The first twenty levels were a pain in the ass (My survivability was terrible), but once I got a little depth in the subtlety tree, I was a soloing machine.

To be honest, every class I've tried has been a bigger pain in the ass to level than both feral Druid and Rogue. Stealth makes everything infinitely easier, and once you get Vanish as a Rogue, everything's cake.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 08 Sep 2009, 15:28
I rolled my current rogue a li'l bit after WotLK came out (this isn't my first account), so he's been 80 since around mid-April. Please note that I'm not saying rogues are bad levelers. Hell, I'd say we're quite healthily above average. I just don't think we are quite up there with the cream of the crop levelers either. We have a few really big advantages, with one of the biggest ones being the simple fact that we're a pure DPS class that doesn't really ever go through an "awkward phase" like many of the hybrid classes do. We don't have to wait 'till level 40 to get role defining abilities like Shadow Form or Storm Strike. But that said, we struggle a bit against elites when compared to classes like feral druids, DKs, hunters and warlocks since we can't heal, we can't tank and we don't have terribly many kiting tools. Hell, I know from experience that it's entirely possible to employ each of those strategies against a single elite when playing a feral druid. Rogues can escape death easily enough, but that isn't really the same thing as running right up to an elite quest mob and curb stomping it like I could with my feral (mind you, there's still plenty of elites I've killed with my rogue. But my druid could fuck with damned near anything and come out smelling of roses). These classes also each have next to no downtime, free travel forms/speed buffs or mounts. Rogues are foolproof, but each of those classes can be outright abused. I love rogues dearly, but we've never killed mobs so fast (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TSWb9zCODYw)  that Blizzard had to nerf the spawns. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EQ9DOKIGotw&feature=related) Do some of these things rely on bad pathing and borderline glitches? Yeah, but that's part of the game and you'll a level a lot faster if you know when and how to abuse such shenanigans.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 08 Sep 2009, 16:10
Gotta love AoE.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 08 Sep 2009, 21:42
I totally agree with the mage levelling comment. My main is an 80 mage and once I swapped her to frost spec'd while I was levelling it was SO EASY. And yes, sometimes you do need to get in there and beat shit down with your staff. Just throw up an Ice Shield or a Mana Shield and you're good to go. Also, on top of that if you're low on mana, Frost Nova and wanding them works really well.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 08 Sep 2009, 22:28
The real irony is that it's the super paranoid guys who blow their cds constantly who are often the most vulnerable on pvp servers. It doesn't matter how much health you have; Mages fold like a deck of cards without their cool downs. It's those crafty bastards waltzing around at 3/4s health with a Blink and Frost Nova in their back pocket that you have to worry about, not the dorks who absolutely insists on perfectly kiting every murloc from here to South Shore.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 09 Sep 2009, 05:33
Well I started a warlock on a server a friend moved to and though I like having a little guy to run around with and I drop stuff really fast, all the downtime I spend drinking or eating is crazy. It's only level 6, but does this get better? I've never leveled a warlock, so if anyone has one, tips would be welcome.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 09 Sep 2009, 05:42
It gets much better. Go affliction until you can get felguard, dot and drain things to death/lifetap in between. If you don't feel like going felguard later on, wait until you can get soul leech/imp soul leech, then go destro and 2 shot things.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 09 Sep 2009, 11:01
Yeah, it'll be much different once you've have drain life and lifetap. Plus, there's a big difference between how fast a warlock can kill something and how fast they probably should kill something. Untalented warlock nukes are powerful but they simply aren't mana efficient. To put things in perspective, Shadow Bolt has a higher base mana cost than Starfire. Without the talents and gear to support their nukes, Warlocks are more like the oomkins of old than Mages. At that level range I just ignore shadow bolt most of the time and instead just dot up mobs in pairs. Two sets of dots ticking at once is great dps and it costs way less mana than just about any other tactic out there.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 09 Sep 2009, 15:36
That holds true until the 60s, imo. I picked up my warlock when I came back for Wrath, he was at 68, and I just went full destro and never looked back. The mana/health return from ISL/SL and speed with which you simply nuke things into oblivion make downtime almost nonexistant.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 09 Sep 2009, 17:19
Well, yeah, with enough talents Destro Warlocks can push their damage per mana so high that it becomes a non-issue. But at level 6? Just slap a Corruption and a Curse on 'em and start dotting up the next guy.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 09 Sep 2009, 18:06
The real irony is that it's the super paranoid guys who blow their cds constantly who are often the most vulnerable on pvp servers. It doesn't matter how much health you have; Mages fold like a deck of cards without their cool downs. It's those crafty bastards waltzing around at 3/4s health with a Blink and Frost Nova in their back pocket that you have to worry about, not the dorks who absolutely insists on perfectly kiting every murloc from here to South Shore.

See, this is another reason frost specced guys are someone to step lightly around, Cold Snap. I took down a level 67 warrior with my lvl 59 mage today, and that certainly played a part. that and the damn water elemental saved my hide.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 10 Sep 2009, 11:17
I saw a feral dps druis with an epic ArmourPen gem in every slot, dude never had a single socket bonus, grim toll and the ToC normal AP trink.

Hate to be that guy when 3.2.2 comes around.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 10 Sep 2009, 11:41
Yeah, the potential of such a nerf if is one of the big reasons why I held off on gemming ArPen and swapped to Mutilate when Twin Spike (http://www.wowwiki.com/Twin_Spike) dropped on Tuesday. I don't really have super high ArPen anyway (No Mjolnir  :cry:), and this nerf will put me even farther away from achieving that fabled gear level in which Combat plain demolishes Mutilate hands down, so going with the immediate upgrade seemed like the smart move.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 10 Sep 2009, 12:35
I'm happy to say I don't have a single point of armor penetration...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 10 Sep 2009, 12:54
Yeah, that's probably a smart move for a non-raider like yourself, even if you do spend a lot of time in cat. Armor Penetration will still probably be the best raw dps stat at the high end even after the nerf, but agility is still probably the best stat in pre-Ulduar gear. Besides, ArPen is shit compared to Agility when it comes to tanking, and having that option is half the fun of being a casual feral or having a feral offspec.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 10 Sep 2009, 13:34
Still makes 3way cleave faceroll OP, warriors do too much burst for a MS class when GT procs.

My DK has 34% armour pen without a trink or talents, and 34% with a talent atm in dps spec, is nice even if that is far from close to being a good improvement, not bought any arp gems though...

Oh and that dagger may as well have "FOR THE ALLIANCE" engraved along the blade in 72pt arial.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 10 Sep 2009, 13:52
That and I'm primarily resto these days, Alex. Kitty wasn't getting me anywhere in PVE OR PVP. I'll probably get some welfare epics for my cat form for PVP and the most basic of five man tanking once I'm satisfied with my resto gear, but it's full speed ahead on healbot for me.

I also didn't realize until a couple months ago how viable resto is in PVP. I fucking rake honor in Wintergrasp as a tree.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 10 Sep 2009, 14:16
Yeah, honestly, when I rolled my druid it was for Tree and Bear in roughly that order. Cats are high quality dps when in a raid environment with full buffs and debuffs applied. Trees are just plain awesome.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 10 Sep 2009, 14:47
Still makes 3way cleave faceroll OP, warriors do too much burst for a MS class when GT procs.

Warriors do far too much damage for an MS class period. I can be gibbed in seconds by a bladestorm while spamming heals on my shaman if I get UA'd/MS'd.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 10 Sep 2009, 15:38
Getting dual spec to get resto has really made me love the tree. Best HoTs ever. I do still love being a boomkin, but I feel like I'm doing more as a healer now that I've been doing it more often.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 10 Sep 2009, 23:21
If PvP you, tuskars vitality is your friend, kite the crapy bladestorm warriors you can. (My heads messed up after watching the latest zero punctuation.)
When warriors do bladestorm they don't get any movement improving effects.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 11 Sep 2009, 11:43
Yeh but a good one will hamstring and/or demoralising shout first. Meta speed increase is normally better as stam on boots in pvp is kinda ugly.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 11 Sep 2009, 13:43
It's pretty ridiculous how geared I am getting. (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Grizzly+Hills&n=Intruder) The only thing I really wish to change right now are my trinkets.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 11 Sep 2009, 15:30
Likewise. The warlock 2 piece t9 bonus is kind of absurdly OP for destruction with the new empowered imp. I'm in almost entirely 10-man gear, and starting to see 6k dps on non-gimmick 10 man bosses.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 11 Sep 2009, 15:43
Lucky. The rogue tier 9 set bonuses are a sad joke.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 11 Sep 2009, 15:47
Well, I mean, my 4-piece is the same as my t8 2piece. But that's ok, b/c that bonus rocks the shit too.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 11 Sep 2009, 16:27
I lose DPS by going with anything but 4 piece 25 man Heroic gear. The drop off is that bad.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 11 Sep 2009, 17:06
Jeez, I cant PvP worth shit and havent really instanced much or raided ever before. So my gear is merely of the old fashioned quest or more likely AH variety. Really the only reason I get by is through my sick DPS when compared to other 'non-hardcore' players
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 11 Sep 2009, 17:55
I just went through and really properly configured my UI to work with my new spec. I barely managed to top the meters last week despite having a few key indicators unavailable and little practical experience with modern Mutilate specs, but now I've got Event Horizon set up and I have a series of sound events that go off when certain conditions are met. I've managed to tighten my rotation up to the point where I can maintain 5.1k dps against the top level combat dummy without any sort of buffs or even weaving in Expose Armor. I think my guildies are going to be pleasantly surprised when we finish off Ulduar on Monday.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 12 Sep 2009, 16:31
My mate was in a failpug and decided to make a vid.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6dfpGW7pfzo
My idea etc. because I am a dick abnd have often hearthed out of raids while in combat to save a repair bill on groups that are not worth it (Getting an OT to taunt off me on thadd 25man because I had over 100k threat header in front of the person 2nd on ome, with the thaddius buff... that is how bad the dps was then they failed while I was safe and sound in dala).

Audio was removed, was some FANTASTIC polka.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 12 Sep 2009, 17:02
I doubt anything will beat the time I did Nexus and the DK tank fell off a ledge to his death and then promptly got killed by the li'l flowers on his way back to the group.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 13 Sep 2009, 15:59
Haha, I've had people be curious and jump for the hell of it, but not do it by accident and get killed on the way back. Hell, I've jumped off the side of Hellfire Peninsula for the same reason. (You fall for a minute, then you get the loading screen, and end up in a graveyard, if you're curious.)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 13 Sep 2009, 16:20
Dinged 70, dont have WotLK... now what.

Chorbrak (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Jaedenar&n=Chorbrak)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 13 Sep 2009, 16:21
Yeah, to be honest, the falling didn't really bother me. It's just a game so it's reasonable to expect people to be careless or even curious once in a while. But dying to the flowers? They only have 5,000 health! I just don't see how a DK tank couldn't at least limp back to the group against those things. Keep in mind that this was a couple patches ago when DKs were at the height of their powers.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 13 Sep 2009, 19:30
Oh, I've fallen a lot. Blackrock and I do not get along. I ALWAYS fell in to the lava, ALWAYS. It's stupid. But really, like I'm sure everyone else has, I always doubt the skills of DKs. I mean, I have one and I haven't had any major catastrophes when tanking with it, but just about everyone has a DK alt and most of those people don't know how to use them. Basically the huntard has evolved into the dumb knight. Not saying every DK is stupid, as I've partied with several good ones, but it's rare to get one that doesn't make you facepalm at least once.

But the again, I find that true about just about any party. I really enjoy this game, but I don't like most of the people who play it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 13 Sep 2009, 22:39
I pugged some heroics the other day and the daily with AN. There was another mage in the party, better geared than me, same spec and I was out-dpsing them by about 500-800. It made little sense to me until they somehow managed to get lost trying to get back into AN, then decided to swap specs because "that might be better" and basically had no idea what they were doing. It was a massive facepalm moment.

I also ended up with a pugged pally in another party who gave all the casters might and the melee and tank kings. Also a bit of a fail moment there.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 13 Sep 2009, 23:31
Guild finally downed the faction champions and after that the valkyria twins and anub'arak was a cake walk. The loot part was a disapointment. Brought a freshly dinged hunter (1 week). He was with us when we did our farmbosses in ulduar and got 4% crit and 800 ap as upgrade in the end that day. And guess if the blody x-bow doesn't drop from anub'arak AND mail shoulders. No one else could use em. Lucky he's a good player that will continue raiding with us. But the thing is he allready have a ulduar geared warlock from his last guild, a descently geared warrior, druid and priest.
A new klassik falling down moment is kologan. I did it as tank, our rogue did it, our MT did it. Just happens at least every second week that someone panics or doesn't look where hes going and falls down.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jimor on 14 Sep 2009, 00:15
My paladin main just hit 55, so I fired up the Death Knight, almost done with the starting quests. Fun stuff.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Pengupower on 14 Sep 2009, 11:57
For those with curious jumping habits, you can also jump off in Razorscale's room as our paladin decided to when he wondered if he could.  I might have fallen early in Ulduar when I was tanking Kologarn and was wondering how close I had to be to melee him  :|.  It is memorialized in one of our channel join phonetics in vent being "needs more handrails".  The week before I think it happened to one of our other tanks (I was gone that week).  It did give her the defense of see it wasn't just her.

The loot thing usually follows the way of inverse need.  If you bring a brand new person to fill out your last spot gear that only they could use will drop.  The corollary to that is if you are trying to gear up said 25th person quickly to fill a main raiding role then all of the gear they could have used had they been their weeks before that got disenchanted will suddenly stop dropping.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 14 Sep 2009, 12:26
Yep. The day after I finally got my tier 8.5 glove token (after much internal debate since we go by loot council and have had terrible luck with that token), we did VoA and in accordance to Murphy's law Emalon dropped two of pairs of rogue tier 8.5 gloves which were both promptly disenchanted.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 14 Sep 2009, 18:59
Apparently I do about 7.5k dps under optimal conditions with my new spec.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 14 Sep 2009, 23:12
Based on spreadcheet, training dummy or patchwerk?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 15 Sep 2009, 17:36
Ignus. Didn't pad dps with FoK either.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 20 Sep 2009, 16:18
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8khZcx5LZ-M

One of my rl mates spent like 2 hours doing this, he has done it like 3 times now.

Is on mmo champ and US forums naio,

Internets fame?

Dude is a tard though.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 21 Sep 2009, 07:25
Wow... two hours and no alliance came to stop him? I mean, the two alliance that popped up at the end were just watching him do it. How many goes did that take him to do?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Sep 2009, 07:53
I probably would have waited until he was about done and then hit him with Dismantle.   :-D
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 21 Sep 2009, 07:57
He did it a few times, often people would come to kill him and fail then give up, one point he had a retadin and a rogue on him but they both died and gave up.

Sometimes when you see shit like that, you don't really want the honour kill, you want to see if they can do it.

Even dismantled his avoidance is pretty high so I doubt much would happen with some well placed CD's.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 21 Sep 2009, 08:08
Well, a retardin and a retardogue can't really take a prot pally anyway so they were just stupid.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 21 Sep 2009, 08:24
Still impressive, if you wanted to mess him up, dispell all his buffs tbh, or as a warrior 5 sunders and a shattering blow while silencing him.

Many ways it could have been done, but he found a way that works well on a "soft" hitting mob and used it in a good way.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Sep 2009, 08:31
Even dismantled his avoidance is pretty high so I doubt much would happen with some well placed CD's.

Yeah, that's probably true; Varian does do pretty shitty dps. And yeah, I would have hit him with dismantle and expose, basically.


Well, that and I can ignore somewhere around 60%+ armor when trinkets proc.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 21 Sep 2009, 08:47
To be honest, I would have just watched, too. If someone made it up there and was still alive, it's worth watching. (Unless I was really bored and had a way epic'd out caster. There's no way I'd ever run up to a pally tank and start beating on him.)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Sep 2009, 08:52
Yeah, but I'm a rogue. We have standards to sink to.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 21 Sep 2009, 09:02
60% arp on proc is low, base for my dk ain't much lower than that in dps gear :x
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Sep 2009, 09:06
I haven't checked my paper doll in a while and that's in my "I'm in mut gear but about to kill a pally so I'm using Grim Toll again (mostly for the hit rating, actually)" setup. If I was sticking with combat it'd be much, much higher because I'd actually gem for it and swap out a ton of expertise for ArPen.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 21 Sep 2009, 09:41
http://forums.wow-europe.com/thread.html?topicId=10920983376&sid=1

FU blizz.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 21 Sep 2009, 15:17
Since Im level capped and not involved in the game enough to know 5 people to instance I started a Pally, what talent tree is 'better' Prot or Retrib?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Sep 2009, 16:22
For short term leveling the answer is definitely Retribution. Prot pallies are pretty OP right now and are worth investigating at higher levels, but you don't get Consecration until 20 and Holy Shield is deep in the talent tree, so even if you want to go that way it's probably best to just wait until 40 and respec for it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 21 Sep 2009, 17:05
Couldnt have asked for a better answer, thanks!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 21 Sep 2009, 20:04
http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Boulderfist&n=Vagoo

My pala hordeside, levelling prot is fun as a motherfucker.

(bring drinks)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Sep 2009, 20:41
(bring drinks)

And that's why I tend to recommend Ret until 40. Behold! (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=41094#created-by) That said, I can totally buy into Prot being as good at 40 or higher once. Reckoning, Consecration, Holy Shield and a shield spike adds up really damn fast when you're fighting a half dozen mobs at once. Before then it's still fun, but also a bit slower overall.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 21 Sep 2009, 23:52
Ah, there is a use for seal of command!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 22 Sep 2009, 10:16
Well, Seal of Righteousness is still lot better, to be honest. But if you want to scare up some mana quick by Judging Wisdom for a couple pulls, Glyphed SoC is a good option. It's too bad that the Glyph of Seal of Righteousness has the level 55 requirement though, or else the question of what to slap in alongside the Judgement Glyph while leveling would be a no brainer. The Consecration glyph is a good option too, if you use that a lot, but Consecration is kind of expensive when used on a limited number of targets.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 23 Sep 2009, 01:30
12% less arpen... ouch.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 23 Sep 2009, 10:31
Yeah. The other rogues in my guild were all combat specd and riding the glyphed FoK train to glory and they're all really hurting now after the patch. It's kind of sad, really, since they never should have gotten into the habit of leaning on FoK that much in the first place, because honestly their single target damage was never really that hot to begin with. But between my decision to "wean" myself off of FoK a bit before the patch hit and the Envenom & Master Poisoner buffs, my Assassination spec has actually been slightly buffed after the patch. I plain destroyed the other rogues in my guild last night on the meters.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 23 Sep 2009, 15:26
Levelling my rogue I want a cleave, but I dunno what FoK is apart from an AoE interrupt put on GCD in 3.1, how does it work into single target rotation?

Also onyxia is the new ezmoedlewt 10 man, exact the same as at 60 bur now with elite dragonkin adds in phase 2.

WAY TO KEEP IT FRESH BLIZZ.

Oh wait-
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 23 Sep 2009, 15:47
I don't get all the people bitching relentlessly about the lack of originality in a random little bonus boss.

If this were all we were getting for a major content patch, that'd be one thing, but 3.2 hit, what, a month and a half ago? And people are still crying that Onyxia's more of the same?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 23 Sep 2009, 16:06
Well, it's like this: Rogues in high end Ulduar gear have two real priorities: Keep Slice and Dice up, and keep Rupture up. Beyond that, they just work on fitting as many Eviscerates/Envenoms with mutilate rogues envenom refreshes slice anyway, which is nice) in as they can. Simple in theory, sometimes impractical in reality. In a lot of trash scenarios you had two real options:

1. Maintaining Rupture (preferably on multiple targets) and Slice and dice, blending FoK between refreshes rather than going for Eviscerates etc. In essence, keep the majority of your single target rotation and sprinkle in AoE whenever it wouldn't cripple your single target dps. FoK can apply poisons, so you're actually depending a lot on Deadly ticks to do your real aoe damage.

2. Face roll FoK. Before, you could often get away with this any time there were 3 or more targets and not really lose any damage potential. Your single target dps turned to dog shit, but glyphed and with the right talents and enough targets it worked, often well enough to top the meters.

But after the Fok nerf? It's usually much, much better to go with option 1 and rogues who never learned to approach it that way are feeling the pinch. Which, really, is a good thing for high end raiding and rewards skill rather nicely; I've barely felt the nerf in raids. But it's a pretty raw deal in Heroics, and I have a bit of a rough time keeping up with other classes there now because AoE is king vs. weak content.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 24 Sep 2009, 00:27
Onyxia was fun but easy. Droped druid boomkin helm x2. Sadly I was there with my paladin as off tank instead of my druid main. :( Going to try to pug the 25-man version tonight.

How crapy is arpen now then?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 24 Sep 2009, 07:31
It's not crappy. Most builds that highly valued it before will highly value it now. For most people it probably shouldn't change how they gear, although a few rogues and ferals may need to go back to gemming Agility (I don't know if the strength classes ever went with ArPen gems; I know Retribution paladins didn't thanks to talents & Seals). Like me, for example. If I had remained combat, it would have been optimal for me to gem for ArPen before the patch and now Agility ever so slightly outperforms it again even for combat rogues. Doesn't really matter either way, however, since I'm specced into Mutilate now.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 24 Sep 2009, 14:56
Few things beat an epic Wintergrasp battle. We (Horde) were on defense and we managed to run the timer down with two siege engines on their way into the courtyard, about 100+ people in said Courtyard and a sliver of health left on the relic door.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 24 Sep 2009, 23:53
Feral druids should gem Streanght as I understand it from elitist jerks until about 11k-12k ap. Previously they should gem arpen as soon as geming it would bring them above 200 arpen rating. Should be 220 or something now then.

Warriors love arpen, especially one of the specs, thinks it's fury.

Paladins never cared about arpen and do even less now. Haste was more crap before 3.2.2 but now even haste is better. Why is due to Arpen only affecting less than 25% of our damage. The rest is holy.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 25 Sep 2009, 04:09
Fury is a strength spec, ARPen is still pretty tits for Arms though.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 25 Sep 2009, 10:00
Strength? Buh wha? Good luck with that considering there's almost no end-game leather with strength on it. Feral Druids want to spec stamina and agility. Gemming strength seems absolutely pointless to me as you'd be supplementing a stat that will actively be coming in lower than your spirit unless every single gem you use is strength oriented.

Feral Druids, be they cat or bear, sink their stats into agility, not strength. Agility is the stat for Druids that effects a Druid's attack power. Strength barely comes into play with a Druid tank, if at all. Either you're reading EJ wrong, or they've gotten a Warrior/Pally who somehow doesn't realize Druids cap never get higher than leather armor writing their theorycraft for Feral Druids.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 25 Sep 2009, 14:13
Gemming strength seems absolutely pointless to me as you'd be supplementing a stat that will actively be coming in lower than your spirit unless every single gem you use is strength oriented.

That doesn't really matter though since strength scales in a relatively linear fashion and isn't subject to any sort of caps. It may seem counterintuitive, but when you think of Strength as being Attack Power's bigger, nastier cousin, it begins to make sense. Normally, strength provides 2 attack power per point, but since it scales with Kings, Improved Mark and Survival of the Fittest while raw Attack Power does not, it comes out even better than that. In fact, with full buffs a 34 strength gem ends up being worth nearly 90 attack power. That's quite a lot. This sort of thing has often led to Strength and Agility being more competitive against each other than you might think, particularly since Dire Bear actually doesn't get any attack power from Agility, just crit and dodge, which means that for raw threat Strength is actually pretty good and also leads to having a stronger Savage Defense shield.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 25 Sep 2009, 14:30
1 agility is about 1.1 ap while streanght is about 2.3-2.4 ap in cat form. I'm not sure about the math for bear form but youre geming agility there anyway just for the sake of avoidance. And just cus blizz haven't done the math to the full extent doesn't mean it's wrong. :)

Also to clearify, when I'm talking feral in this case, I'm talking cat form since bear form falls in the tank section and if you tank a whole bunch of other things mather there. When playing prot paladin or prot warrior you never gem streangth. DKs might do it since it also gives avoidance, but don't think so. Pure parry rating should be better.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 25 Sep 2009, 16:03
Yeah, Agility is good for bears primarily because it's an avoidance/mitigation stat. It adds to armor, it adds to dodge, and it adds to crits, which in turn adds to Savage Defense and more rage.


As for DKs, even parry stacking is unlikely since parry has a nastier diminishing returns formula than dodge. This is due to the fact that making a parry can reduce/reset your swing timer and thus has a mild threat component instead of being a pure avoidance stat. The swing timer thing was actually a big part of why Unholy tanks were so overpowered back before the Bone Shield and Blade Barrier talents were nerfed. With stacked avoidance and Blade Barrier, you could achieve virtually 100% Bone Shield uptime, which meant you could tank as well/better than the other specs. But what really broke it was how all that parry meant you got more Rune Strikes (can only be done after a dodge/parry) and more Bloodcaked Blade & Necrosis fueled autoattacks, leading to unmatched threat and Blizzard breaking out the nerf bat.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 25 Sep 2009, 17:40
Also to clearify, when I'm talking feral in this case, I'm talking cat form

You want strength for a cat form druid? Huh? I always stuck to stam and agility. I'd try to find items with more strength for bear form, if I could find anything decent, but not for cat... And Jon is right. There is almost no end game leather armor that has strength on it. I mean, things have definitely changed since I was last feral, but I didn't think they'd have changed that much.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 25 Sep 2009, 18:10
Again though, that's immaterial in regards to gemming. Strength scaling is fairly linear; a 34 strength gem doesn't increase your damage less simply because you don't have many other sources of strength. In fact, the math involved says quite the opposite: a crit isn't worth all that much if your base attacks are weak to begin with, which is why BC druids traditionally had to hit a balance between strength/AP and agility to really hit their full dps potential. Blizzard doesn't give druids much opportunity to strength stack these days, but that doesn't mean it's a poor stat or that you should dismiss it out of hand while gemming or when selecting cloaks and rings. Hell, for a long time the very fact that you were forced to wear agility gear meant that filling your sockets with gems gave you that much more value. 3.1 and Primal Gore shifted things further in favor of Agility than it once was, but that doesn't mean ArPen and Strength can't be superior stats at various gear levels. It's also best to remember that what we're ultimately talking about here are very small differences on a point for point basis. For example, I bet you could swap out all of my rogue's Agility gems for Attack Power gems and I'd ultimately lose under a dozen damage per second. As long as you're avoiding the truly abysmal stats you'll likely be in pretty good shape.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 25 Sep 2009, 20:01
Well, AP is one of those things I never really thought about when I was feral and probably wouldn't really think about now, either. I didn't even think about spell haste, crit rating, etc until Wrath. Really, I think all of those are fairly silly and tend to go with things that boost int, spirit, and spell power, sometimes stamina as well. And out of the misc. boosts, I don't really care what I have as long as I have something and it works.

Basically I'm really looking forward to Cataclysm just because it'll make balancing this stuff a whole hell of a lot easier. Actually, I wish they'd not wait and do it in a patch.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 25 Sep 2009, 22:19
Sadly, I don't think stat consolidation is really going to help things much in the long run. Some attributes are more complicated than others, with Armor Penetration being the poster child for shit that should never have happened, but ultimately, the difference between your top two or three attributes is usually rather small and not really worth worrying about unless you're a raider or perfectionist. There's a few egregious examples, such as Retribution Paladins, for whom strength is unusually good and ArPen is unusually bad, but for the most part as long as you can identify your basic priorities you won't hurting too bad since Blizzard's item budget table is pretty good about making the item with the higher level win when it comes to raw attributes. You might not be optimal, but most of the time you'll be functional enough that most people won't even notice anything awry without inspecting you (defense rating being the obvious, heart breaking exception).

No, what really ruins everything forever are weapon speeds and pretty much anything with a proc. Trinkets are an easy example. Quick, what would be better on my Mutilate Rogue? The Heroic ToC10 version of Victor's Call (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=47948) or the Banner of Victory (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=47214) from 5 man normal ToC? The answer is the Banner of Victory, and it's not even close; I lose somewhere around 100 dps going with that other piece of crap, despite a 45 item level difference! Such things are hard to eyeball though because so much depends on information that you're simply not given, like the proc rate and the internal cooldown. As for weapon speeds, they're worth mentioning since they're uniquely capable of butchering your performance if you don't match the speed to the right hand. For example, I saw a combat rogue dual wielding Hatestrikes (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=39270) the other day and unfortunately he's just plain murdering his dps. Frankly, he'd probably be better off gemming for strength than continuing to use such a fast mainhand.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 25 Sep 2009, 22:33
Honestly, I think the worst thing to happen to the game since I started is achievements. Now, I'll admit, I am an absolute whore for achievements. I love collecting them. They're a fun little distraction. The problem is that all those serious players have taken a lot of fun out of the endgame by making achievements yet another source of judging other players. You don't have the Heroic Archavon achievement? Good luck actually getting into an attempt on the VoA. It's like, just one more reason for the elitist douche bags of WoW to take the game way too seriously. I've only been playing for a little over a year now, but I'm already absolutely fed up with hardcore players. Can't the game be fun?

Achievements really exacerbate this whole overdone theory crafting bullshit. I mean, before them: who the shit cares if you wipe on whatever RAID? You can do it again some other time. With the Achievements, everyone's all about bullshit like World First or Realm First or what the fuck ever. Just take whatever trink you prefer, as long as you can get the job done.

I don't think I'll ever want to join a group that's using any kind of meters whatsoever. I just want to do the content, get some gear and feel like an imaginary badass for a couple minutes, why people got to shit it all up with numbers and applications?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 26 Sep 2009, 00:32
Meters are a tool for self-improvement and constructive criticism in a guild setting. Anything else and yeah, you're basically being a dick. I'll admit to having a few laughs at a truly bad pugger's expense from time to time, but I keep that kind of shit to forum posts and guild chat. It's a guilty pleasure and what puggers don't know won't hurt them. I would argue however that theorycrafting is the symptom of a greater problem, however, not an issue in and of itself. Quite simply, there's items out there that can serve as stumbling blocks for players who put in an honest effort but who understandably aren't aware of some of the more counterintuitive and frankly bad design decisions present in the game. Feral druid gemming, hell, most gemming, doesn't fall under that category. It helps to do it right, but ultimately, if you have enough gear of a high enough item level, you can make up for it through competent play.

But that's why I brought up the trinket and weapon speed thing as being the real problem; those differences are unintuitive yet are genuinely capable of being show stoppers for some classes. Having the wrong speed weapon (even if it is otherwise level appropriate) as a rogue leads to terrible dps which leads to missed enrage timers which ultimately leads to people never getting to do the level of content they want to see. Some people think that such players should have done their homework and deserve what they get. I think the people who say that can suck it and that Blizzard needs to make it a more intuitive process if the consequences are going to be that severe. I'm not sure Cataclysm's stat consolidation is going to do accomplish that unless they go farther than they've currently indicated they will.


As for screening people, I don't do that in general, period. Well, unless I've grouped with you and I know for a fact that you routinely take on content you can't handle. I hate those douches that want like 30k health and an achieve before doing simple content though. Honestly, get a guild if you're that uptight.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 26 Sep 2009, 05:08
The only screening I've done is for hybrids asking what spec they are. And the only meter I use is a damage meter, but only so I can see whether or not I personally am doing enough damage. (Lately I haven't though, as I've been healing.) And using achievements as a screen is stupid. They are meant for fun and another thing to do when you're bored.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 26 Sep 2009, 11:32
As for screening people, I don't do that in general, period. Well, unless I've grouped with you and I know for a fact that you routinely take on content you can't handle. I hate those douches that want like 30k health and an achieve before doing simple content though. Honestly, get a guild if you're that uptight.

Jesus, it gets so bad sometimes. I was looking to run Direbrew with a friend and a PUG the other day. Direbrew's tougher than he looks, but he's a pretty generic tank and spank and this Mage actually dropped out after bitching out my friend for not having enough HP to tank (He had about 25K). What the fuck should our DPS care about anything to do with the tank other than his threat ability (Which having done the quest him before, I knew was fine)? If the healer says "Nah, it's cool, I can handle it no problem," shouldn't that be the end of that? The same Mage was still looking for a group an hour later, once our eventual group had long since finished running our daily of him with nary a death.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 26 Sep 2009, 13:12
The sad thing is I know for a fact that a guildie of mine has tanked Coren a few times with his druid alt's off-spec bear form. We're talking about a guy that only has about 23k hitpoints, a number that is comically low for a bear tank, but he gets it done. I also know a few prot pallies who have soloed him. Just judging a tank by their hitpoints is horrible though, particularly when talking about warriors since they don't have the same health pools as DKs or Bears but make up for a lot of it through oh shit buttons and mitigation.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 26 Sep 2009, 19:51
Quote from: "Wolf Like Me" by TV on the Radio
Say say my playmate
wont you lay hands on me
mirror my malady
transfer my tragedy

Got a curse I cannot lift
shines when the sunset shifts
when the moon is round and full
gotta bust that box gotta gut that fish

My mind's aflame

We could jet in a stolen car
but I bet we wouldn't get too far
before the transformation takes
and bloodlust tanks and
crave gets slaked

I think I'm playing this game too much.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 26 Sep 2009, 20:08
Coren is a cakeboss now, fucking shadow of who he was back at lv70 where so many attempts at him were actually lost because of wipes and this was accepted.

HH gave way to seasonal cakewalk bosses, I tanked him arms spec holding aggro with bladestorm and mocking blow.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 27 Sep 2009, 12:21
My gear is getting pretty good, 3 Epics, 4 Rares and the rest uncommon, have 10 gemslots (only one blue). Pretty much as geared as I can get without stepping into some instances.

Im kind of at a brink though, I want to get Revered with Cenarion Expedition so I can have a Hippogryph (provided they look similar to Griffins while flying) and I want blah blah's Legendary Hat from CoT doing Tauren Hill on Heroic, to do that I need Honoured with CoT. Though I want that so I can summon a Ghost Wolf non-combat pet, summon Ghost Wolves for combat and turn myself into a Ghost Wolf just so I can look fucking rad running around town.

Now for a real question. While I generally can solo anything that is realistic (meaning every non instance/raid Group quest that didnt involve killing a Gronn) I am tempted to trade my Fire Elemental Glyph for the Stoneclaw totem Glyph which combined with Earthen Power and Earthen Grasp I can effectively give myself a ~2700 bubble every 30 seconds using a Stoneclaw totem. Is this advisable? I know its not really group or raid friendly but on paper it seems the utility of it is pretty high.

Chorbrak (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-talents.xml?r=Jaedenar&cn=Chorbrak)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 28 Sep 2009, 00:23
Coren is ezez and we usually don't have a healer when we do him. Just bring dps! :D

As for achivements: FU!
But it's a must, cus when you're being nice and brings "n00bs" and asks people "Hey you know what to do here? If not, just say so now and I'll explain" and all the n00bs sit quite.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 28 Sep 2009, 04:59
Uhhh that doesnt sound like it would be exclusive to "n00bs" that sounds like something "pe0ple" do. Especially give the fact that WoW can be an unnecessarily harsh environment its no wonder people clam up and dont ask.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 28 Sep 2009, 08:07
People who whine about achievement screening are pathetic.

Chances are if you are good enough to have the achievement you have it, if you aren't then you don't regardless of whether or not you got carried through.

It's like saying "I did it on my main" which means nothing in a fight that tests gear/dps.

It's like people with ungemmed/enchanted gear, make an effort even if it is a cheap blue gem and a 6 dust enchant. If a piece of gear is good enough to use, it's good enough to enchant and gem no matter WHAT the future holds dropwise.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 28 Sep 2009, 15:23
It's like people with ungemmed/enchanted gear, make an effort even if it is a cheap blue gem and a 6 dust enchant.

Couldnt agree more for the most part. I mean for some Oranges I use (+hit/+expertise) its 200-250g for +10/+10, 40-50g for +8/+8 and ~2g for +6/+6. I always buy the shitty stuff if I cant afford something nicer or the AH is sold out of the one I want (I aim for the rares as 200g+ is too much for +2/+2 boost)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 28 Sep 2009, 17:48
If I haven't done a fight, I'll ask if there's anything special I need to know. I don't want to get people killed. Same as if there's a wipe, I'll either ask what I can do better or ask if someone could off heal if they notice me having problems. If after that someone complains, usually I'll either get over it or leave. I'm not going to waste  my time listening to people whine about a silly game.

Also saying "if you're good enough to have the achievement you have it" is pretty stupid. Not everyone has the time to run every instance ever nor has everyone had the chance to be properly geared to run end game stuff. If people are screening you by an achievement, how are you ever supposed to get it? Also, just because you have it doesn't mean you aren't a crappy player.

This is what I really miss about my old guild. They actually wanted to help people with things while most people in this game don't. I got a lot of help gearing up for Kara and I always helped other guildies level or ran them through instances they needed if I had the time. I mean, it's a game. It's supposed to be fun, not a popularity contest.

Also: Been leveling up a shaman named Lilybird on Forgotten Coast. I'm liking it better than the rogue.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 29 Sep 2009, 16:46
You would have done it when it was new content and a small/nonexistant percentage of the population did not have the achie, or you would do it with your guild.

Quote
If I haven't done a fight, I'll ask if there's anything special I need to know.

No, watch a strat vid and read up on wowiki or something.

There is honestly not alot worse than taking time out to explain in detail boss strats when 90% of the raid know it, you are just going to piss people off and get more "GOGOGOGOGO" or people inspecting everyone systematically while whispering the raid leader about someones blue trink and how they should be kicked, when really it is because they are playing the same class and spec and share loot rolls.

If that 10% just take their own time to watch a vid they don't waste anyone elses.

Fuck you, dorf on a kodo.
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2575/3967620594_589fe535ae.jpg)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 29 Sep 2009, 17:09
On one hand, I can understand what you are saying, because shit damn it's annoying when you pug a group and none of them know what they are doing and a 20minute run turns into an hour. It's annoying, it's painful, but if they at least learn SOMETHING then you've helped them out.

I guess this is the one thing that I'm going to have to start thinking about now, because my guild leader has given me the go ahead to set up my on 10man team. We have one already, but they raid during the day (as they are mostly americans who keep weird hours) and are therefore on an aussie server. I can't raid during the day at all, so I'm setting up a team to run through the 10man content two, maybe three, nights a week. Why only two? Because it's a game and dedicating four nights a week to raiding in said game is kind of soul destroying.

So, I figure I need to set up some kind of balanced 10man team.

I have so far:

- 1 prot pally (gearing up)
- 1 boomkin (played by the same guy with the prot pally, so not sure which he's going to raid with)
- 1 resto druid
- 1 mage (me)


What should I be looking at for a balanced team? I figure a resto shammy would be great, would prefer to have a warrior MT, a mage (me), lock, hunter, rogue? for dps? Any ideas?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 29 Sep 2009, 17:25
Prot Pally>>>boomkin. You're going to want pally buffs and you'll likely need 2 tanks. A holy or disc priest would be tops. I actually sorta favor disc priests for 10 mans, tbh, but both are good. Shamans also rock.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Aurjay on 29 Sep 2009, 17:37
So i hit 80 and i thought hey i can do Heroics. So I tried to do Heroic ToC and got my ass handed to me. Now I am a healer and yes i still use mostly PvP healing gear in the 70's and Kara, Gruul's healing gear, but damn that shit was hard. Neeldess and rightfully to say my group wasnt pleased with me. I need to gear up as one pointed out, which is true. Any suggestions where i can do this? Some Heroics that maybe i can still heal for or soemthing.

Thanksomuch
Aurjay Turalyon 
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 29 Sep 2009, 18:04
Yeah, don't just straight into ToC. For a heroic, it's pretty easy - providing you're at least somewhat geared and have a good party.

I'd suggest starting the Heroic Utgarde Keep and or uhm, Gundrak, VH is pretty quick and easy. You'll get badges from the Heroics which you can then spend on some gear - which is pretty great. You'll also be able to pick up some decent gear through most of the Heroics as well. Start with the easy ones (the ones that were designed for the lvl71/72 crowd in Normal mode) and work your way up from there. ToC is a difficult instance if your heals are not up to scratch.

Alex: yeah, he will probably raid with his prot pally - he's got a shammy as well, which isn't far off 80 either, but I'd prefer him to raid with the pally. I would LOVE a disc priest. My ex played a priest and respec'd into disc for healing and his heals were much better than any holy priest I'd had in a 10man group before. I'll have to really sit down and look into what I've got. I do have a priest (not sure what spec she is) for heals, but she's not guild hopping, but she's definitely up for coming along, so she will probably pick up my priest heal spot.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 29 Sep 2009, 18:06
And yes, from back when I did raid all the time, yes, it is really annoying when most of a pug has no idea what's going on. But having to read up on every instance before I do it takes the fun out of it. I'm one of those people who likes to try everything once, but not if it's going to inconvenience an entire raid and I'll always say straight up before we even go that I haven't done something before and let the leader decide from there. Whatever, it's not like we're ever going to be in the same party anyways.

Jmrz, the pally buffs are better than boomkin buffs and you'll get all the good druid buffs from the tree anyways. If he runs with the boomkin, try to find another pally to fill ot, dps, or healer. Resto and elem shaman are fun to raid with, especially since they can self res (just in case). And I agree with Alex, priests are awesome to have.

So maybe warrior (tank), pally/warrior/bear (ot), tree (healer), priest/resto shammy/healadin (healer), mage (you), at least 1 more ranged dps, 2 melee dps, and then any other dps with useful tricks. I would recommend at least one rogue and a lock, because of stun and soulstones. Definitely find a pally, or even two, if you can.


Edit: Sorry if this is redundant, but two people posted when I typed this out.

Aurjay - I would recommend running regular ToC a few times first. You need new gear badly. Believe me, you'll probably switch out most of your gear after a few runs, which is pretty much what happened to me the first time I ran it. Also maybe do other heroics first, because I think ToC is one of the higher end heroics.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 29 Sep 2009, 18:31
Alex: yeah, he will probably raid with his prot pally - he's got a shammy as well, which isn't far off 80 either, but I'd prefer him to raid with the pally. I would LOVE a disc priest. My ex played a priest and respec'd into disc for healing and his heals were much better than any holy priest I'd had in a 10man group before. I'll have to really sit down and look into what I've got. I do have a priest (not sure what spec she is) for heals, but she's not guild hopping, but she's definitely up for coming along, so she will probably pick up my priest heal spot.

Yeah, holy priests have a lot of tools. They're great raid healers. But in 10 mans I'd take the superior tank and spot healer, and that's disc priests. They're simply better at saving someone's ass right now, and they're especially good if you can't figure out a way to squeeze a holy paladin in the group too, since then the Disc priest will be your logical tank healer.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 29 Sep 2009, 22:18
You would have done it when it was new content and a small/nonexistant percentage of the population did not have the achie, or you would do it with your guild.

Quote
If I haven't done a fight, I'll ask if there's anything special I need to know.

No, watch a strat vid and read up on wowiki or something.

There is honestly not alot worse than taking time out to explain in detail boss strats when 90% of the raid know it, you are just going to piss people off and get more "GOGOGOGOGO" or people inspecting everyone systematically while whispering the raid leader about someones blue trink and how they should be kicked, when really it is because they are playing the same class and spec and share loot rolls.

If that 10% just take their own time to watch a vid they don't waste anyone elses.

First off, that is exactly what I feel is wrong with the game. It's a fucking game, I should be PLAYING it, not treating it like a god damn history test. People constantly bitch about how all the new content is easy and people clear it too fast. Yeah, that's going to happen when all anyone give's a shit about is server firsts and the like. Content isn't so easy when you do it by trial and error and treat it like a game, rather than a second job. I'm sorry, but as someone who likes to maintain a life outside of his computer once in a great while, I'd rather not be spending my time studying for a fucking video game boss. I really enjoy the game, but that's just entering a new level of depressing.

What happens to people who just started playing? Or people who just got into raiding? That "well, if you want in, you should have the achievement" attitude is just a bunch of bullshit elitist posturing.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 29 Sep 2009, 23:54
Just aim at geting about one of every class. Try to not get more than 2 of the same class. As a new group, also aim at geting three healers.
What content are you starting with?


BTW. Yogg down yesterday. Horay for my guild!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 30 Sep 2009, 15:07
Depend on what else you have, prot pallys atm > every other tank bar none. They have better survival and good threat, however warrior tanks are much higher on omen if both are similarly geared and hit capped.

I have nowhere near the level of survivability a pally has, but I can out-threat them like a motherfucker.

Saying pally buffs are better than boomkin buffs is not true, it is often true but if your 10 man group has caster heavy dps, the boomkin becomes rediculegood. Freya 2 elders 10 man for my guild was 3 mages a lock and a boomkin, prot pally holy pally druid healer, dps warrior and me. It was pretty effective on burn stages and nuking lashers.

Disc priests in 10 mans are obscene. 25 man holy wide raid healing is sick, better than restro druids even but 1 druid for motw and a battle res is nice. There is no best group, but 10 man combinations based on these may work nicely.

Prot pally - Awesome survival, Bosanc on other tank, BoW on casters, death cheating AD,
Prot warrior - Commanding shout, thunderclap, demo shout, sunders, threat like a depressed nuklear technician, Unfearabletonk(psychic scream? fuck you, shield bash.), stuns.
Disc priest - stam boofs, shields on the entire party, fear ward
Holy pala - BoK/BoW/BoM depending on what the prot pally is doing, resistance auras
Resto shammy - hero/BL, good raid healing and single target healing, totemz (OMGTREMOR)
Destro lock - SS/Summon/lockrocks/good dps
Mage - Int... food? Portal at end I guess... :P
Hunter - Crit crit crit/nature res
Arms Warr - bleeds, battleshout
FeralDPS - battleres, bleeds, MotW, FF
Boomkin - Battleres, MotW, spell crit, FF
Blah blah blah.

More than 3 pally is overkill, but one is enough for BoK. Priests for stam buffs, shamans for hero/BL, not many other classes bring this much to the table.
Melee dps go well with melee dps (Mixing bleeds, armour pen on sunder) and casters go well with casters, (boomkin aura, arcane int etc.)

Just realised how many times I used the word "depends", because it really does. If a spare warrior can do BS why use BoM? If there is only one warrior and no pally, BoM and the lock can use imp blood pact etc. etc.

Obviously I value some classes over others, but that is just from grouping with them more.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 30 Sep 2009, 16:24
Well, the thing is, I can't imagine not wanting a Prot Pally tank in a 10 man. A boomkin? That's more negotiable. They have great synergy (which is nice since a mage is already involved) and can drop form to battle rez in a pinch, but the bottom line is that groups start with tanks and paladins are some of the best right now. After all, if they end up with warrior as the offtank and a rogue, ret paladin and a Hunter instead of more casters, suddenly you're probably going to want an enhance shaman over a boomkin. Prot pallies, on the other hand, are always in style and they've got a buff for everybody.

Really though, it's not that big of a deal; there's a wide gap between what's needed and what's optimal. There's some advantages to having a fairly even split of caster and melee dps even if the synergy isn't always there, particularly for fights like Yogg Saron. Just make sure to try and get a shaman of some sort in there. Between Purge, Totems and Heroism/BL you'll get some nice buffs and an offensive dispel to go with Remove Curse, which is nice for stuff like faction champs. Rogues and Enhancement shaman are also good at interrupting without taking serious DPS losses, but depending on your tank setup that might be easily managed in other ways.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 30 Sep 2009, 18:08
Yeah, if a large portion of your group is made up of casters (including the two healers), then yes, having a boomkin is pretty good. But even I, as a boomkin, would rather group with a pally of some sort than a boomkin if I had to pick between the two. Balance druids have two good buffs - MoW, which if you have a resto druid is redundant, and a caster buff. Pallys have auras and buffs that benefit everyone. But if you feel like you might need a 3rd healer, in a pinch a boomkin or an elemental shaman can easily help out, since they tend to stay out of the fight and can easily cast a heal here or there.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 30 Sep 2009, 20:54
I just cannot get myself into Boomkinism. I leveled a feral and have recently fallen absolutely in love with my Resto spec, but Boomkin just never did it for me.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 30 Sep 2009, 21:38
I like all three. I like being a boomkin because you're like a pseudo-mage that wears plate armor. The DoTs and buffs you get on pretty much every cast are nice. Also starfall is one of my favorite spells next to Innervate, Lifebloom, and Wild Growth. Plus you get treants. I love my treants. I would probably be 100% happy with resto if it had Force of Nature. I do miss feral sometimes, but not really. I switched at 70 and really, you still can do a crap ton of damage and drop mobs just as fast as a moonkin as you would in cat form.

Also, the dance is totally worth it...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 01 Oct 2009, 03:11
I have to disagree with the pally glorification here. Kings is nice but paladins are NOT the ultimate tank right now. To my knowledge most guild use warriors and DKs mainly for progression tanking. Except the silly northrend beasts heroic. There paladins rock due to BoP and Bubble. :-/
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 01 Oct 2009, 16:26
No, pallys are rocks due to their survivability, they get more HP than warriors in the same gear, they have AD, they can dispell falcon punches and stuff from themselves, they block alot more and generally take a huge amount less damage. Warriors are only better for CC/fear/interrupt/high threat fights.

Boomkins/non restro shamans should never heal unless the boss is on 2% and the tank is still standing with another dps or two and it is a hail mary attempt. The loss of DPS outweighs the shitty shitty healing non specced healers do.

If your guild is using DK/Warr over a paladin they just don't have a good pally tank. Even a sub par pally tank can be better for taking megahits than a good warrior tank or an obscenely good DK tank.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 01 Oct 2009, 16:44
Yeah, you guys have been saying basically what I was thinking re: 10man team. At the moment I'm not too fussed about having three healers, as long as we are fairly balanced.

At the moment the guild is particularly melee dps heavy, so I need more casters and I need more healers. Argh.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 01 Oct 2009, 20:40
Boomkins/non restro shamans should never heal unless the boss is on 2% and the tank is still standing with another dps or two and it is a hail mary attempt. The loss of DPS outweighs the shitty shitty healing non specced healers do.

That would be considered being in a pinch.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 01 Oct 2009, 21:37
Heh, even then I'm not so sure tossing the heal would be the right thing to do. We've had a few cases where our first kill came from me tanking down the last couple hundred thousand health via cloak of shadows, evasion and kiting like a maniac. Hell, one time I was the last man standing because I had vanished recently and was last on the threat list; my 15 seconds of evasion was enough for dots and an eviscerate to finish Auraiya. Of course, other times you hit Evasion and just end up getting RNG screwed and eating about 30k+ worth of overkill. But overall, it's still usually better for everyone to just stick with what they do best. If nothing else, shortening the fight by remaining on dps means there'll be less opportunities for the healers or tanks to end up behind on heals again in the first place.

Of course, though, I'm biased; I do around 10k+ in Hodir fights and play a spec with a decent amount of ramp up time to hit my max dps. If doing something else for a few seconds means that I have to blow combo points on reapplying crucial buffs/debuffs, that means I can easily end up cutting my dps in half for a few seconds even once I get back on target, and even 10k damage counts for an awful lot in a "he's at 400k but we're about to wipe" scenario.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 02 Oct 2009, 01:12
I just have to say that I don't agree with the warrior vs paladin. AD is just last stand in disguise. About my guild, we are IRL friends who play together. We have two very good warrior tanks but that is due to everybody geting to play whatever they wan't to play while I play whatever is needed (resto druid (main), boomkin, tankadin or retri pala).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 02 Oct 2009, 04:08
Except it's got a shorter cool down, has most of the user error massaged out of it and is paired with Divine Protection, which in turn has a shorter cooldown than a talented Shield Wall, despite being on a class that can stack stamina more effectively.

Here's how it works in my guild. When we're looking for raw survivability in the face of predictable bursts of damage (think Mimiron's Plasma Blasts) we go with a Blood DK or Prot Pally. When we just want raw effective health it's the Druid or Blood DK. When we need a mix of all of the above plus flexible threat generation, we go with a Prot pally. That's not to say that warriors are useless, however. They've got a ton of utility these days. They're mobile as hell, they bring their own Sunders to the table and they're better than anyone at dealing with knock backs and fear effects plus they can interrupt spells damn well to boot. They can make a lot of fights easier, particularly since you don't really need the sort of overkill, one dimensional survivability tools of a Blood DK most of the time anyway.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 02 Oct 2009, 04:22
On the other hand, when AD procs, they lose the other effect (Less damage taken while under X% health).

Some initial information about 3.3: http://www.mmo-champion.com/
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 02 Oct 2009, 05:21
If the boomkin can offspec resto, and has decent gear, consider going with that, especially if you're going to run a caster heavy team. It's somewhat absurd just how much a single boomkin can buff a raid's magic damage. 5% crit/3% hit/13% damage is very, very nice.

I'm in a 10 man guild, our makeup consists of:
Warrior MT
Frost/Blood DK (Dps/OT)
Bear/Resto Druid (Healer/OT, usually healing)
Holy Priest
1-2 Holy/Ret Paladins
2-3 of Arms Warrior, Mut Rogues, Cat Druid
1-3 of Boomkin, Ele Shaman, Shadow/Disc Priest
Warlock (me)

So our groups can be kind of weird? We don't really have mages or hunters, and run extremely druid heavy. But it works, we got Glory of the Ulduar Raider and 4/5 in H ToC10 so far. I think one of the keys to successful 10 manning is versatility. It's nice to have a bunch of people who can do a lot of different stuff, depending on circumstances.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 02 Oct 2009, 06:32
I still think prot pallys > warriors only for the fact that I've seen pallys survive a boss when everyone else has wiped and have yet to see a warrior do so. Warriors are good tanks, but the survivability of a prot pally is pretty much next to none. But for 10 mans, I really like having one of each. Warriors can do a lot of stuff pallys can't and vice versa, so it's great when the two work together.

Alright, this is what I mean by in a pinch - your healer is about to die, there's you and one other person who isn't a healer left, your healers are dead and you're keeping the tank alive until you can battle rez the healer. Yes, you may lose some dps, but really, it does not take more than 5 seconds to lifebloom the healer and get back into moonkin form and continue dps. (This is why instant cast HoTs are pretty great.) I do not mean stay out of form the entire fight, just that if there is a need/emergency and someone more important than you is about to die, it does not take much to drop a heal on them, or at least for me it doesn't. Usually if this is in a raid, you're probably on vent or whatever anyways and you can tell your party what you're doing as you're doing it or they can ask you to do whatever.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 02 Oct 2009, 11:49
But it works, we got Glory of the Ulduar Raider and 4/5 in H ToC10 so far. I think one of the keys to successful 10 manning is versatility. It's nice to have a bunch of people who can do a lot of different stuff, depending on circumstances.

I really wish my guild bothered with 10 mans more often. We did Uld10 hard modes a few times to scare up some mjolnir runestones, but other than that we can't be bothered.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 02 Oct 2009, 16:41
I still think prot pallys > warriors only for the fact that I've seen pallys survive a boss when everyone else has wiped and have yet to see a warrior do so. Warriors are good tanks, but the survivability of a prot pally is pretty much next to none. But for 10 mans, I really like having one of each. Warriors can do a lot of stuff pallys can't and vice versa, so it's great when the two work together.

Alright, this is what I mean by in a pinch - your healer is about to die, there's you and one other person who isn't a healer left, your healers are dead and you're keeping the tank alive until you can battle rez the healer. Yes, you may lose some dps, but really, it does not take more than 5 seconds to lifebloom the healer and get back into moonkin form and continue dps. (This is why instant cast HoTs are pretty great.) I do not mean stay out of form the entire fight, just that if there is a need/emergency and someone more important than you is about to die, it does not take much to drop a heal on them, or at least for me it doesn't. Usually if this is in a raid, you're probably on vent or whatever anyways and you can tell your party what you're doing as you're doing it or they can ask you to do whatever.
My healer dies, last stand + enraged regeneration + pray.

I had rediculously more survivability than all the paladins in my old guild, when naxx/eoe was endgame and I played with lesser skilled players.

I was pretty much infamous for those "Oh SHit the MT/RL/GM Bear who insists on tanking everything is face down and humanform, Wipe it.

No, Fuck wiping, I canot afford the rep bill "Mel is tonk" on KT so I tanked the boss and the adds from 28%.

Saw plenty of pallies dying when trying to do that one.

Cy@~~
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 03 Oct 2009, 18:31
But it works, we got Glory of the Ulduar Raider and 4/5 in H ToC10 so far. I think one of the keys to successful 10 manning is versatility. It's nice to have a bunch of people who can do a lot of different stuff, depending on circumstances.

I really wish my guild bothered with 10 mans more often. We did Uld10 hard modes a few times to scare up some mjolnir runestones, but other than that we can't be bothered.

We just really dislike 25 mans. Too much administrative bullshit, and having to deal with bad players who we don't really like to begin with in order to do anything. It feels more like work and less like a game, so we just run 10s.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 05 Oct 2009, 17:25
I understand the whole idea of how if you play on a PVP server you should expect to get ganked, but man, if you're going to gank someone, don't turn around and cry when they log their eighty and tear the shit out of you. Really now, one would think the result of ganking someone wearing heirloom gear would be obvious.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: wargrafix on 05 Oct 2009, 19:33
gah, this WoW of confusing. the crafting jobs are really confusing.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 05 Oct 2009, 19:53
I understand the whole idea of how if you play on a PVP server you should expect to get ganked, but man, if you're going to gank someone, don't turn around and cry when they log their eighty and tear the shit out of you. Really now, one would think the result of ganking someone wearing heirloom gear would be obvious.

I miss being on a pvp server now that I'm crazy geared again. Unless they're wearing quality arena gear I can chew through a health bar REAL fast.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: BeoPuppy on 08 Oct 2009, 00:17
gah, this WoW of confusing. the crafting jobs are really confusing.

THAT'S what you find confusing?

I read this whole thread and because of this I'm not sure I'm even playing the same game as some of the other people in here.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 08 Oct 2009, 06:04
Crafting professions are confusing? How? Usually you pick a gathering prof. to either provide supplies or make money and then a crafting job that uses those things you gather, i.e. skinning and leatherworking. And then you sell stuff. Or you can pick two gathering prof.s and sell all of that. Really, your goal is to level up the crafting one and make a bunch of stuff that's in demand on your server. Like I've been selling a lot of titanium bars to make money because I can transmute them and once I finish leveling up my alch, I'll train for gem transmutes and sell a lot of those.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 08 Oct 2009, 19:09
Yeah, I leveled fine with leatherworking, but that's 'cuz 1. I'm a vet and 2. I was fine with letting it fall behind at various points.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 09 Oct 2009, 06:24
I started up on my first character with herbalism and alchemy pretty ok. It was pretty easy to level up and people almost always buy health and mana potions, so I got some income off of it, but to be honest I think I may have made more off of selling stacks of harder to find herbs. Now mostly I just sell herbs because Sholazar Basin is great for farming and I make more off of herbs and transmutes than anything else. Feathermoon doesn't really want a whole lot of potions/elixers anymore, for whatever reason.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 13 Oct 2009, 22:13
Got into an argument today with someone who thought that EU Affenjung was the number one guild in the world and that Premonition wasn't even top 50... Was kinda funny.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 13 Oct 2009, 23:53
After checking guildox, yeah that was kind of funny.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 14 Oct 2009, 14:04
Wowprogress pwns guildox.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 14 Oct 2009, 16:26
That's funny. I'm not in much position to talk smack though; I'm in the 2nd farthest guild on the second to worst US server. "A small pond" doesn't even begin to cover it. Most of the raid ready talent comes in through transfers (the  current top guild has been here less than a month). Grizzly Hills quickly hemorrhages away what little talent there is on the server.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 14 Oct 2009, 23:41
I think I'll stick with guildox. There you can see strict 10-man progression and since my guild is only like 15 active players it suitse us a bit better.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 17 Oct 2009, 23:53
Holy shit that server really is terrible.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 17 Oct 2009, 23:55
Yep. My guild is pretty much an anomaly here; we raid 2, maybe 3 nights a week and this qualifies us as "hardcore raiders" by GH standards.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 18 Oct 2009, 00:19
Seriously? I am sorry, bro. Transfer to either Stormscale or Ner'zhul. I can vouch for both servers having a mix of very good guilds (number 50 world ranked guild on Ner'Zhul and 200 on Stormscale) plus guilds that are alot more like yours.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Oct 2009, 17:52
So, I'm not an expert on other classes, so I was just curious: Is there another progression quality item set with a worse 2 piece bonus than that which is attached to Rogue Tier 9? (http://www.wowhead.com/?itemset=-150) Keep in mind that rogues shouldn't even be using Rupture at all with best-in-slot gear, so for your class's 2 piece bonus to be worse, it would actually have to hurt your performance if you were foolish enough to try and make use of it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 21 Oct 2009, 20:23
I am trying to think, but yeah I know that sucks dick. The 4 set bonus is decent.

Oh, worse than that, t7 for Warriors might be close. 3 extra seconds on your shield wall ability...so?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Oct 2009, 20:25
The 4 piece is actually kinda gimpy too, believe it or not. A combat rogue in 245 gear is better off skipping it in favor of really well-itemized offset pieces like the 25man Ony hood, the Cuirass of Calamitous Fate and the badge shoulders. If it was a flat 5% crit, it'd be sweet, but 5% to just your combo builder makes it a bit more sketchy. The sheet says I'll use 4 piece 245 as mutilate, but that's just because ArPen isn't so hot for Muti.

Actually, here's another contender I forgot about: The Tier 9 Holy Pally (http://www.wowhead.com/?itemset=-206). At the very best, it's a half-assed GCD saver. Then again, the reason I kinda forget about it is due to the 4 piece bonus it is paired with, which is basically balls out amazing. I think one of my guildies may have complained about it once, but that 4 piece probably keeps the complaints to a dull roar.

But yeah, the shield wall one is pretty bad. 3 seconds is a swing or two, if you timed it right. Maybe more if you're getting parry gibbed.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 21 Oct 2009, 20:31
Seeing as you normally only pop shieldwall for a fight mechanic it is, for all intents and purposes, useless, as I can't think of any that last all that long anyways.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Oct 2009, 20:55
All I can think of is when shit is hitting the fan on hard modes, and I highly doubt it'll make much difference in that case.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 21 Oct 2009, 22:04
Shaman Resto 2 Piece t9 is pretty shitty. Riptide is an awful spell and only actually useful for the haste buff to HW and topping people off while moving.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 21 Oct 2009, 22:15
There are quite a few fights where cooldowns such as Sheild Wall, Last stand, IBF, Pally shield wall, blah blah blah, stop being OHSHIT buttons and start getting used at specific times. Specifically Ulduar hard modes. I.E. Mimiron, Gen V, so on.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Oct 2009, 22:36
I wasn't referring to that, I was referring to the only times I could think of where 3 seconds might theoretically help. 3 extra seconds on a shield wall won't really do anything about Mimi's plasma blast since it only lasts what, 6 or 8 seconds? I'm not a tank healer, so I forget. An extra couple seconds might help against hard mode Steelbreaker though, since once his damage gets upgraded it never goes back down. That fight gibs tanks in the long run no matter what you do though, so it's probably a moot point.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 21 Oct 2009, 22:39
Oh I misread that my bad. Yeah you're right.

It's wierd, warrior t8 and 9 have great 2 and 4 set bonuses.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Oct 2009, 22:44
Oh! And a pre-emptive post, before any Paladins points and laugh at me for giving the 4 piece pally bonus the thumbs up: I really like it because it makes FoL a great supplementary ability for fights like Anub'arak or throwing in a "buffer" heal between waves of damage. I know Holy Light is still the go-to pally move more often than not. But anything that broadens the use of a niche spell is typically pretty nice for healers, since it's often a job that's more about picking the right shaped peg for the particular hole you're trying to fill at any given time. Before the 4 piece and the recent Sacred Shield changes pallies sucked at giving buffers, they just bombed the hell out of everyone whenever they're forced to spot heal. But being able to throw out a buffer on whoever happens to be SS'd at any time is the kind of thing that often helps more than some tiny overall raw throughput buff. God knows blizzard won't give anyone a set bonus that just gives an overall general boost anyway; that'd make people happy, which isn't working as intended.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 21 Oct 2009, 22:49
I like butts?

Too tired to type. Will talk more nerdage with you tomorrow.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 22 Oct 2009, 00:00
The Boomkin t8 4p (http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=64824) set bonus is really really crapy. It is at best a minor dps increase if it procs at the right time. And also keeping some dps while moving but usually you just refresh your dot's while moving.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 22 Oct 2009, 07:56
All six Druid set bonuses for T9 are pretty nice. Not that I'll ever touch them outside of the PTR, but Rejuvenation critting would be nice, though the 2P isn't phenomenal (I tend to lean on Swiftmend a lot more often than Nourish), extra crit to Nourish isn't something I'd turn down.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 22 Oct 2009, 12:08
Warrior 2 piece for DPS is actually very nice, as is 4 pc. I'm kinda reeling about all this warrior love.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 22 Oct 2009, 12:31
Yeah, the set bonuses this time around are really about getting all the classes on a more even footing, I think. The reason 245 tier 9 isn't completely amazing for rogues is because rogue tier 8.5 was frankly too good. I was the top single target DPS in my guild by a wide margin prior to the release of TOC, and now, with ToC being around for quite some time, I can still top the meter on many fights and I am consistently within the top 5 at worst. And that's despite the fact that I've passed on trophies and am still actually wearing Ulduar level or lower gear in the helm, chest, legs, gloves, belt, shoulder and trinket slots. I've gone mutilate and acquired new accessories since the release of ToC, but even the new weapons weren't that big of an upgrade since I was rolling with the good ol' Golden Saronite Dragon (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=45132) before that.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 22 Oct 2009, 12:38
Warrior tanking sucks these days. Makes me cry. I hate wow. Why the fuck am I playing again? FUCK.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Beren on 22 Oct 2009, 14:41
All the paladin healing set bonuses have sucked for a long time.

So long I don't look at them anymore.

One set bonus that gives me something to Divine Plea, Beacon, or maybe HOLY LIGHT would be really, really appreciated. But no.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 24 Oct 2009, 05:02
Warrior tanking sucks these days. Makes me cry. I hate wow. Why the fuck am I playing again? FUCK.
Then roll FotM scrub.

/jokes

But seriously, I know threat is hardly ever an issue and warriors can peel off pallys at the drop of a hat, but pallys survival makes us warrior tanks the lesser choice.

We are currently inferior, tbh with hp scaling of like, 6% over a paladins 14, they should bring one of us to 10% (Buff or nerf, I don't care, just equalise it)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Gemmwah on 24 Oct 2009, 07:44
I always forget about the epic patch required when going back to WoW after a hiatus... :/
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 24 Oct 2009, 18:51
I hate Heroic Faction Champions. They're easy, but there's always the odd chance that all of a sudden a Shadow Priest, Hunter and Mage focuses fire on you at the same instant and suddenly your shit is ruined.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 24 Oct 2009, 20:18
Uhh yeah, H FC is the worst fight in the game.

This week, on 10 man,

MS Warrior
Ret Paladin
Warlock
Shadow Priest
Resto Druid
Resto Shaman

Totally unkillable.

EDIT: We've been farming the encounter for weeks.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 24 Oct 2009, 20:20
But seriously, I know threat is hardly ever an issue and warriors can peel off pallys at the drop of a hat, but pallys survival makes us warrior tanks the lesser choice.

We are currently inferior, tbh with hp scaling of like, 6% over a paladins 14, they should bring one of us to 10% (Buff or nerf, I don't care, just equalise it)

Lol why do you think I posted?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 24 Oct 2009, 23:40
Another way in which my server is sad: Today, I vendored a bunch of my old epics that I've been hanging around to for a while. I jotted down the ilevels and double checked a few armory compiler sites, and the gear I sold would gear a rogue well enough to make him top 8 on the server.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Beren on 25 Oct 2009, 07:12
But seriously, I know threat is hardly ever an issue and warriors can peel off pallys at the drop of a hat, but pallys survival makes us warrior tanks the lesser choice.

We are currently inferior, tbh with hp scaling of like, 6% over a paladins 14, they should bring one of us to 10% (Buff or nerf, I don't care, just equalise it)

Lol why do you think I posted?

Haha. Pally threat >>> Warrior threat
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 25 Oct 2009, 08:36
Alex, that is pretty sad. Does this mean you're also top 10, though?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 25 Oct 2009, 10:11
Yeah. I've been anywhere from 1-5 among rogues for the last few months, basically. I'd probably be 1 or 2 if I bothered to use all the tier 9 I have lying around, but I need another piece or two until breaking the 8.5 set becomes worth it. The problem is, I have tons of gear, but none of the stuff I actually need. I have had a huge mass of weapons, but none of the damned offset armor pieces I really want, which is really getting tiresome. I've got the the Spinebreaker (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=48712), for example, but due to weapon specialization that leaves my Westfall Saber (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=47971) languishing in the bank.

But you know what really, really, really bothers me? My guild's trinket situation. The Mjolnir Runestone (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=45931) has only dropped twice for my guild. Between that and only one Death's Verdict (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=47115) dropping in ToC so far, a lot of our melee is perilously close to full on nerd raging. We have an Unholy DK who can come within a couple hundred dps of me on anything but single target fights, but the poor bastard is still using the Bandit's Insignia (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=40371). We have never even seen Blood of the Old God. (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=45522) Even the casters haven't been spared; Mimiron has only dropped two Pandora's Pleas (http://www.wowwiki.com/Pandora's_Plea) for us and even then he waited until after Blizzard nerfed Intellect stacking to do it. This shit is getting ridiculous.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Gemmwah on 25 Oct 2009, 10:43
I need a new realm, mine is almost exclusively 80 now, and as my main is only 70 I need somewhere where there's people who actually want to do instances with me. As it stands, I have the opportunity to go for an instance about once per day, and then somebody drops out and we have to quit. I need better gearrrrrr.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 25 Oct 2009, 11:14
Unless you were levelling 70-80 in January...

Story will be pretty similar on all servers unfortunately :/
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Gemmwah on 25 Oct 2009, 12:02
It's balls! I got WLK and made it to 70 then had to take a hiatus because my laptop couldn't run it any more without overheating and dying. Now i've fixed my laptop but there's nobody to play with.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 25 Oct 2009, 12:36
Another way in which my server is sad: Today, I vendored a bunch of my old epics that I've been hanging around to for a while. I jotted down the ilevels and double checked a few armory compiler sites, and the gear I sold would gear a rogue well enough to make him top 8 on the server.

Oh wow, i'd be second highest hpriest hordeside and 12th overall if I was on your server. I'm not extremely geared, either. (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bleeding+Hollow&n=Starsnostars)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 25 Oct 2009, 12:49
Pretty much all the horde priests transferred away, so yeah. About half are alliance and about half are god knows where now.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 25 Oct 2009, 21:50
I dunno wut im doin as ass spec fuck. what the fuck do i do? do i use SS? or just Mut? FUCK I DUNNO
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 27 Oct 2009, 05:10
Epeening about being biggest fish in a tiny pond lol.

I am nowhere near being the best geared warrior tank in my server, but pre ulduar I was 2nd best geared tank on a busy alli heavy realm, in the most casual slackcunt of a raiding guild.

Now it's hard to judge, I seem to always log out in pvp gear as I do arena then bed :/
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 27 Oct 2009, 09:50
You know, you THINK you are that good, but trust me, pre-ulduar, that meant shit. Any retard with a keyboard could be the best geared tank, seeing as everything was SOOOO hard and we only had, what, 6 fucking months to do naxx? Seriously, any scrub could look good. During Ulduar in the first few weeks, when I was actually raiding, I stayed in the top 5. Ofc that changed when I quit raiding for three months, lol.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 27 Oct 2009, 09:51
Oh and really. My rogue is 69 and I DUNNO WTF I AM DOING WITH MUT HALP!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 27 Oct 2009, 12:02
I suppose you'd probably just slap a rupture on the mob, make sure HFB is up then Mutilate and Envenom once you have at least 4 points then Mutilate again if it's still standing. The HFB thing is part of why I'm not really the biggest fan of mutilate leveling, or, at least not with a full-on HFB spec; I'm not really convinced using a dot opener that is unlikely to get most of its ticks is the best way to use your opening energy pool. I went combat for leveling, personally, although I'd bet a build based off mutilate-prep pvp builds would work just as well due to Vigor, Overkill and Initiative actually mattering a bit vs. things with low health totals. Also, faster stealth.


As for the epeening thing, all epeening is silly. I just really do honestly think that my realm is far enough behind to be comical. It's just a different game here at times.


Anyway, my guild was chipping away at H25 Northrend Beasts last night and got to Icehowl cleanly on our last pull only of the night only to have  2 people fail the damn charge dodge, which led to us barely missing the enrage timer. Hrgarbablarbabla.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 27 Oct 2009, 12:30
Ugh. I am getting really fucking frustrated with this Hallow's End meta. I have now run Headless Horseman a grand total of 56 times and only seen the Hallowed Helm, which is the only thing I'm missing for said meta, drop once. With only four days left on the holiday, I'm getting really antsy.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 27 Oct 2009, 12:57
Ok, I meant mut for PvP, lol. And I figured out.

(http://i114.photobucket.com/albums/n280/Danny_California/WoWScrnShot_102709_124815.jpg)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 27 Oct 2009, 13:06
There is no excuse for that Rogue twink in third coming in behind a Rogue learning a new spec and a lock who's four levels below him and decked primarily in greens.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 27 Oct 2009, 13:11
Being a rogue in a bg is def. pretty easy for the most part. The relative lack of resilience gear makes it a lot easier to just straight burn people down, particularly since rogues get so much mileage out of crits.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 27 Oct 2009, 14:14
Yeah, that lock was pretty decent, but I was 6 of his deaths, and he only got me like 2-3 times. I am straight up LOVING this new spec tho.

Oh and did you see that rogues spec? No clue what he is thinking.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 27 Oct 2009, 15:25
If he had been thinking that he woulda looked up a spec, not just specced w/e looked good.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 27 Oct 2009, 16:20
Looks more like a combination leveling/whatever spec than a pvp spec to me. It is kind of odd though; what with the one point Deadly Brew, which really is just a pvp talent. Plus, I still think Cut to the Chase and HFB aren't really something worth chasing while you're leveling. Preparation Mutilate is would still be my go-to dagger spec for leveling though, precisely because you can BG in it very well and enjoy faster movement speed while stealthed when doing pve stuff. Still, I've seen a lot worse.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 27 Oct 2009, 16:44
Ugh. I am getting really fucking frustrated with this Hallow's End meta. I have now run Headless Horseman a grand total of 56 times and only seen the Hallowed Helm, which is the only thing I'm missing for said meta, drop once. With only four days left on the holiday, I'm getting really antsy.

I got my helm in one of the first runs I did, I was more worried about getting the squashling, I'd only seen it drop once (the same time the helm did). I saw it drop the other day and two of the people in my party already had it, one didn't particularly care about any of the holidays events, so I asked if they minded me needing it for my title. It was the only thing I needed to get. They let me, I got my title and spent a good five minutes sqeeeeeeeeing about it.

The broom has dropped at least once every run and I wish that mages actually got a broom as a class-based mount. It looks so cool and we're practically witches... right?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 27 Oct 2009, 18:15
I actually agree, that would be really cool.

@Random: My mom thought it was really cool that I was flying around on a magic broomstick, just like Agnes or Granny Weatherwax. Although to be fair Esme is terrified of them, even if she does end up on a stick fairly frequently.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 27 Oct 2009, 18:28
I've never done any of the Hallow's End stuff because I hate fun.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 27 Oct 2009, 19:36
Just DE'd everything that came off the Twin Val'kyr. Still 1 Death's Verdict in the whole guild. God, I hate loot tables sometimes.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 27 Oct 2009, 19:49
More bosses= more fun. Like Naxx!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 27 Oct 2009, 20:25
I have only done HH once, me healing a DK tank. Sadly, nothing important dropped and I've been running around collecting candy. And jmrz, that would be super sweet as a class mount.

I am over 3/5 of the way to being able to get epic flight form, woo! Pretty much outside of the Hallow's End stuff recently all I've been doing is dailies and farming and trying to get in an instance here and there. I think I may start browsing the forums though and see if I can find a new guild so I can do more than just farm.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 28 Oct 2009, 00:43
Yeah, the running around collecting candy is the easiest gold.

And yeah, I really think that every class should have their own class based mount - DK's, Warlocks, Druids and Pally's all get one, why not everyone else? *sulk*

I'm pretty happy with my guild, a bunch of us have been in and out of the same guilds together and these were the first friends I made in WoW and now we are all back in the one guild again. I'm an officer and am leading our second ten man team. We've successfully downed the first three bosses in Uld10 with no difficulty and I'm really happy! Most of us hadn't even been there at all, so I'm pretty impressed. I just need a full raid team now and I'd be even happier - I'm really not a huge fan of pugging those last few spots.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Gemmwah on 28 Oct 2009, 08:41
It's balls! I got WLK and made it to 70 then had to take a hiatus because my laptop couldn't run it any more without overheating and dying. Now i've fixed my laptop but there's nobody to play with.

Um, I recently reactivated my old account with old chars and I have a rogue, a priest and a warrior around 65-70. Aggramar.

Oooooh so tempted, Jens. So tempted.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 28 Oct 2009, 10:03
You know, you THINK you are that good, but trust me, pre-ulduar, that meant shit. Any retard with a keyboard could be the best geared tank, seeing as everything was SOOOO hard and we only had, what, 6 fucking months to do naxx? Seriously, any scrub could look good. During Ulduar in the first few weeks, when I was actually raiding, I stayed in the top 5. Ofc that changed when I quit raiding for three months, lol.

Wow, nerdragemoar?

WoWheroes put me 2nd on the server, that is where I judged it by. So it's not that I "THINK" I am good.

Gear != Good player I never said I was "that good" but what I am saying is, measuring people by gear league on server is dumb, don't do it.

2's and 3's as prot prot prot is fun :D
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 28 Oct 2009, 10:50
Sorry wasn't nerdraging AT you, just nerdraging, lol. Honestly, the "best geared tanks" were normally ones using the norgannon instead of a stam trinket, which only meant you had a high iLevel and were gimping yourself.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Gemmwah on 28 Oct 2009, 11:40
you're just lying now. It's okay I don't mind that people hate me

no seriously i want to but i don't know if i have the money for the transfer fee, we'll see after i get paid.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 28 Oct 2009, 19:34
http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Hellscream&n=Melville

2 shitty pure stam trinks, because heaven forbid ulduar stam trinks should ever drop (And BH procs don't help much throughout ToC).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 28 Oct 2009, 23:00
High five, same here. Sucks dick, don't it?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 29 Oct 2009, 08:38
Oh, man. Our main DK tank posted his frightening ui in the realm forums.
(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f39/dumsmartguy13/WoWScrnShot_091509_205141.jpg)

The reaction has been gold. Responses range from "Dude, you play on a GBA?" to "He has 60k health; he could play on a cell phone for all I care," with the posts ultimately culminating in this bad boy:

(http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/1452/upgradescomp.jpg)


So, on the one hand, I'm terrified to realize that this is what our main DK's screen looks like, but the thread made it all worth while.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 29 Oct 2009, 09:11
Peggle, bejewelled, atlasloot, DBM, omen.

Well he has the 5 important ones.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 29 Oct 2009, 10:20
As good a segue as I'm going to get.

That was me a week ago. Hell, I was worse. I'm of the mind that tanking doesn't really need any fancy UI tricks or anything. I was running like that as a healer. I had rewatch up and it was useful, but god damn did it clog up valuable screen real estate. It wasn't a problem in dungeons or small groups most of the time, but try running Wintergrasp or Isle of Conquest with a healing addon taking up half your screen. I'm still tinkering around, but this is what I'm running now:

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v289/0bsessions/Random%20Forum%20Junk/WoW%20Images/WoWScrnShot_102909_124416.jpg)

God damn do I love Vuhdo. At this point, I'm running Carbonite, Bartender, Bagnon, TitanPanel, Xperl, Vuhdo, KoS and Omen. Still have some dicking around to do, but overall, this is working out well. I managed to top Horde on healing with third overall on that BG and I came in well over halfway into the battle (Third overall with about 860K healing).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 29 Oct 2009, 12:47
Yeah, healers are infamous for having their screens half obscured by the raid frames they need to play whack-a-mole properly when the damage really starts flying around; I think pruning the damn UI is basically a rite of passage for you guys. But the fact that tanks need relatively few crucial UI mods it's also exactly why I was kind of surprised to see Upgrade's UI; as James said, Omen and DBM are the important mods, with just about everything else falling under the category of stuff that cleans up the screen so you can spot the really important info ASAP. I just woulda thought he'd have done something to clear up things like the 4 rows of buffs while in combat by now. I've had Dalaran Brilliance blacklisted from my buff bars for months now.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 29 Oct 2009, 17:37
UI below. When I'm in raid, I have the raid windows (dragged and dropped from the raid tab) sitting in that space on the left above the main section. Also, when in combat, the map on the left gets covered over by omen. I also shrink Carbonite in raids and instances and things like that.

It's clean, it's simple and when I level my druid as a resto, I'm going to end up using the same UI anyway I think, just with more adds.

http://img202.imageshack.us/img202/2360/screenshot20091030at113.png
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 29 Oct 2009, 19:55
And here I thought rogues were near extinct.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 29 Oct 2009, 21:02
I'm leveling my subtlety Rogue right now. I do so love my Rogue. My closest alt to 80 is my level 68 Death Knight, but I just enjoy playing my Rogue so much I'm considering just grinding him to eighty (He's 49 right now).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 30 Oct 2009, 09:00
My UI went from
(http://i114.photobucket.com/albums/n280/Danny_California/WoWScrnShot_061708_145557.jpg)

Too:
(http://i114.photobucket.com/albums/n280/Danny_California/WoWScrnShot_032609_225021.jpg)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 30 Oct 2009, 10:22
I'll jump on the bandwagon.

(http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w274/Yakob42/WoWScrnShot_103009_092424.jpg)

Here (http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w274/Yakob42/WoWScrnShot_100809_225923.jpg) is what it look like with my raid frames up. Instead of using Grid, Healbot or Vuhdoo I use Pitbull in conjunction with my own mouseover healing macros. I have a lot of empty space because I don't have my keybindings memorized on characters I'm still leveling up so I need that space to put the bars. That completely empty box on the left is where the tanks show up if they're assigned as such.

When I'm in combat I have a HUD running with Mik's Scrolling Battle Text coming off around it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 31 Oct 2009, 05:59
is this a UI thread naio?

(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3485/4060104063_755c12ede5_b.jpg)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 31 Oct 2009, 07:28
I downloaded VuhDo and I'm not sure I like it, but that could be because I'm kind of clueless as to how it works. I have some addons like Omen, a damage meter, Druid Announces, and Quest Helper, which will be up or down depending on what I'm doing. My UI is boring, but maybe if I start doing more instances I'll give VuhDo a shot and see how it works out for me.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: pilsner on 31 Oct 2009, 07:37
is this a UI thread naio?

If that UI were a person it would be this person:

(http://www.dvorak.org/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/amy_winehouse0423081_nc1.jpg)

QUESTHELPER WILL NOT HELP YOU IN A BOSS FIGHT
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 31 Oct 2009, 09:57
Yeah, I have to turn off Quest Helper when I raid because it annoys the shit out of me.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 31 Oct 2009, 19:13
You should try carbonite instead. You can set it to automatically hide when in a raid group.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 31 Oct 2009, 22:44
You can hide quest helper easily, but I usually turn it off because it won't slow my computer down. Also, when I'm turning it off, I turn Omen and other stuff on. My lappy is old, it doesn't like WoW very much as is, but too many addons at once cause lags, especially so in high traffic areas.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 01 Nov 2009, 09:42
For the record, Carbonite uses about a fourth the system resources of QH while also having so much epic cool shit like the warehouse (Always know what your alts have) and punks (A very nifty gank evasion feature) features.

I am seriously such a Carbonite fanboy.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 01 Nov 2009, 11:59
I got an addon that does all that shit anyways, is my bag one and titan does some other stuff, I never liked carbonite and the only reason that dropdown menu is there is because it hardly distracts me at all, way up there where I never look. I could click the little grey draggy box to hide it, but why bother?

Seriously I dunno why so many people have hate for my setup, what is it people find so offensive?

[edit]
Haha, jmrz's ui reminded me of whne I used spartan, good times. Then it stopped working and the guy stopped updating it Q_Q but I doubt I would go back to it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 01 Nov 2009, 12:26
I don't think anyone's "hating" your UI. It just seems a bit cluttered and messy.

In terms of Carbonite, it's just such a system efficient, effective catch-all. It does the work of about six add-ons that would add up to a good chunk of addon memory. I won't say it's anywhere close to necessary, but if you choose to use a questing addon at all, there's no good reason to choose QH over Carbonite at this point unless your system has very high specs (Even with the pretty good setup I have, I still notice a major FPS difference between the two). The only downside compared to QH I'd give it is that it's got a slightly steeper learning curve for the basics.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 02 Nov 2009, 10:28
Lots of people hate on my UI, my computer doesn't seem to struggle though either. Not even as if it is a new processor and ddr3, is like 2 years old by now or something.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 02 Nov 2009, 10:50
hey guys, guess who finally got to 70 last night?
(it's my horribly undergeared warrior! yay!)

also guess who has the rare aq 40 mount?
(it is also me  8-))

okay you all can carry on with your ui discussions now, which i have nothing to contribute to cause mine is boring and default.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 02 Nov 2009, 23:35
The AQ40 mount is kind of cute since it looks like something from StarShip troopers.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Beren on 03 Nov 2009, 02:25
hey guys, guess who finally got to 70 last night?
(it's my horribly undergeared warrior! yay!)

also guess who has the rare aq 40 mount?
(it is also me  8-))

okay you all can carry on with your ui discussions now, which i have nothing to contribute to cause mine is boring and default.

The black one? from the opening event? O_o
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 03 Nov 2009, 10:03
i didn't say the UBER rare one.
i meant the red one.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Beren on 03 Nov 2009, 11:42
Whew.

I almost stole your identity.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: torontoguy2k8 on 04 Nov 2009, 01:04
hey guys, guess who finally got to 70 last night?
(it's my horribly undergeared warrior! yay!)

also guess who has the rare aq 40 mount?
(it is also me  8-))

okay you all can carry on with your ui discussions now, which i have nothing to contribute to cause mine is boring and default.

The black one? from the opening event? O_o

Haha no. She didn't start til WAY after BC launched :P Although I HAVE see our server's "Scarab Lord" on several occasions.

And also SCREW YOU ANNA for winning that red mount instead of me QQ

And as for UI, Mine is only slightly modified. I use XPERL for my unitframes (Makes life way easier) and the standards like Questhelper, Recount, and DBM.
Oh, I use Healbot on my healer because I'm lazy :P Works well though.
Now it's time for Anna to get her Ugly Tier 6 set, because leveling in that gear makes Northrend pretty cake :P Hell you can raid Naxx10 in full Tier6/Sunwell gear competently if you know your class well.
Oh, Yeah. I'm Anna's Boyfriend/Heal bitch :P Name's Ray. My main is a hunter. My healer is level 74. (tree XD) and I also play on Argent Dawn.

Sup.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 04 Nov 2009, 07:03
Zero point in spending weeks getting t6 since crafted junk from the people grinding up tailoring/LW/BS will be enough, especially at the rate you replace them questing.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 04 Nov 2009, 09:52
I haven't posted because my UI is in a bit of a transition period atm, but I've finally come to accept that if I wait until I'm perfectly happy with it I'll never post it at all. Here's what it looks like right now at its busiest. The big things I need to change are my buff/debuff filtering and my combat text notifications; I just switched back to Elk's buffbars and Parrot right before the raid and normally I have those resized much smaller and filtered much more thoroughly. Normally the only buffs I want to see listed in combat are the ones that are either important raid events or are things I can actually do something about but don't activate myself. For example, it's good to know if I ran out of Windfury Totem range but frankly, things like the Envenom buff gained notification just isn't information I need to see. Of course I have the buff; I just pushed the damn button that gives it to me. Anyway, once I have all that stuff filtered and resized I'll be moving a lot of my DBM notifications to the right side where I'll have some more room, since ideally I'll have practically nothing but debuffs listed over there.


(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a207/Xyljin/WoWScrnShot_110309_191910.jpg)



Also, it really, really pisses me off that I apparently forgot to burn tricks of the trade during that Heroism. That's some horrible raiding right there.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 04 Nov 2009, 12:39
What are you using for a chat window addon? I just want to be able to move/shrink my window and Prat doesn't seem to be helping me.

ETA: Apparently, Blizzard are fans of instant karma. Upon hearing about the new Pandaren Monk vanity pet that's available in the Blizzard store with 50% of proceeds going to charity, I decided to snag one.

I log in to claim it and while doing so, notice my weekly Oracle egg has hatched. I open it to find, after months of nothing:

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v289/0bsessions/Random%20Forum%20Junk/WoW%20Images/WoWScrnShot_110409_161443.jpg)

Yay new mount!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 04 Nov 2009, 13:44
I'm using Chatter. Prat is really full featured and can probably do whatever it is that you want it to, but good luck finding out how to go about it; the author's admitted that he's added so many features that he can't be bothered to list them all now. I'm a less-is-more kind of guy anyway, and even Chatter is more than I really need.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 04 Nov 2009, 15:34
Well that screen shot and the article I just read on the eggs just made me want to go back to Sholazar and grind more rep there. Yep.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 04 Nov 2009, 17:33
It's really not a bad grind, either. Beats the shit out of the Wyrmrest Accord rep I had to do for my Resto helm enchant. There's three dailies that are all pretty easy to do in quick succession and you only have to go as far as Revered to get the egg.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 04 Nov 2009, 18:26
I've been doing dailies mostly in Storm Peaks, but farming herbs is just as good in both places and I've only really been doing dailies for gold anyways.

And I've been leveling up my DK since I've been bored with not having anything to do with the druid and soloing with it is pretty fun. Even though they can't heal themselves, DKs stand up to quite a bit.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 04 Nov 2009, 18:48
I leveled my Wyrmrest Accord rep so easy. Picked up a tabard and just had it on in every single instance ever. I did Kirin Tor and Ebon Blade the same way.

In other news, it looks like I'm now shopping for a new guild.

Basically, there is guild drama afoot and I'm pissed off. To start with, I'm an officer in the guild and had permission to start my own raid team. I did a bunch of recruiting and put together a few good people - it was hard trying to find everyone, so generally we pugged the rest of the spots and for a bunch of people who'd never been in Ulduar before, we downed the first three bosses rather easily. So far, we haven't got any further. The last run we did, my Guild Leader and her boyfriend (one of the other officers) came with us and she insisted on doing FL on hard mode. We'd been in there twice before, and it was mostly a PUG run, I was really unimpressed and we didn't get past it.

Now the other week, my Guild Leader told me that two of our guild members, who are USA based, would be joining my raid team. Now, I run raids at Aussie times, so it'd be in the middle of the night for these two people and it didn't make much sense to me, but I was excited and just went with it. The next day I log into WoW and ask them about it. They have absolutely no idea what I'm talking about. Turns out one of them asks the Guild Leader about it and she basically tells her that because I was having trouble putting my raids together and not getting organised, that she was looking at taking over and setting things right. At this point, I'd not spoken to my Guild Leader about this at all, so I'm furious because she hadn't even mentioned this to me either.

I found out all this information after this pally (who was one of the two people meant to be joining my raid team, the second being her boyfriend) left the guild and her boyfriend got gkicked. Why? Turns out the pally got talked into being a healadin by one of our other officers, he took her into H CoS (the daily for that day) and she's been 80 for a week and has one epic. She was trying her very best to heal the entire group but was really really really struggling and got yelled at and criticised for it greatly. Our officer KNEW she wasn't geared enough to support four fully geared party members in such a fast paced instance and still took her along and still bagged her out and complained about it. She logged off mid-instance in tears and logged on later and /gquit because she has no intention of staying in the guild with an officer who behaves like that (he has a bit of a god complex going on). Once she left, our Guild Leader booted her boyfriend and all their alts from the guild.

Now these two people are LOVELY. They are so nice and I really enjoyed playing with them and I was so annoyed and upset when I found out what had happened. This girl has helped a bunch of people in guild with their flyers and is always up for anything that she can do to help, and she gets walked over and treated like shit. On top of that, the way my Guild Leader has handled the situation shows that she does have favourites and that annoys me too.

Also, her taking over my raid team has also meant that one of my tanks has now been taken into her raid team, which is our 10man team one. No one said anything to me AT ALL.

I'm annoyed, angry, pissed off and generally not happy with my guild and the Guild Leader. Drama seems to follow her everywhere she goes, she has favourites and she's really rather selfish.

I've put in an application for one of the other guilds on my server that one of the other ex-officers from my guild has just moved to and I hope I can find somewhere I am happier in. I play the game for fun, I don't want to have to deal with shit like this.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Beren on 04 Nov 2009, 19:00
All of that is absolutely terrible. Being GL doesn't mean getting to act with impunity, or with stupidity.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 04 Nov 2009, 19:55
Chewing someone out 'till they cry over a 5 man is pretty low. Gear level shouldn't have anything to do with it; there's a right way and a wrong way to handle performance issues, period.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 04 Nov 2009, 20:48
This is the way I look at it: the more difficult the instance, the harsher you are allowed to be in criticism. Heroic CoS? This is about how harsh you should be:

"Dude it's cool you are learning a new spec and have almost no gear. We will just take it slow and forget about the mount run."

Now if this girl had been geared and running a hardmode ToC or something and couldn't keep her tank up it coulda gone something like this:

"You damn cunt rag, all you fucking have to do is fucking spam fucking flash of light! Jesus fucking christ you play a goddamn paladin!"

I am assuming that example number 2 was applied to situation number 1.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 04 Nov 2009, 21:03
Ummm... Its just a game?

Maybe Im not in the best position to cast judgement since Ive never really entered into high level play and havent logged on in the last month. But this all seems over the top for a game, which by definition should be fun.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 04 Nov 2009, 23:16
Pretty much. There's really no call for being rude. The only time someone got ripped on by my guild leader publicly was when an officer threw a great big sulk due to a bunch of the melee dps dying off. First off, the officer was out of line for being as big of a douche as he was being about it in the first place. Second of all, he was actually completely wrong about what happened, but he let the oft mistaken "DPS is always responsible for their own survival" concept override the need to actually, you know, be reasonable about what happened and observe what the actual problem was. But really, that's a minor point; if he had been using a modicum of civility in his initial rantings nobody would have minded having to correct him. As it was however, he deserved getting taken down a peg.


Also, I can't imagine actually criticizing a paladin for the inability to keep someone standing in Heroic Trial of the Crusader. The damned tank damage on Gormok is so fucking ridiculous that it's basically impossible to screw it up since the decision making has basically been taken out of your hands. Your GCDs are quite literally already all accounted for; you basically bomb the tank and pray on that fight.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 05 Nov 2009, 00:08
Horay for friendly guilds. And there's never any reason for expression nr 2. It only makes other people angry and they will perform worse.
ToGC 10 normal is geting quite easy. Yesterday we did it 3 times, first mains, then alt run nr 1, then alt run n2. And I got loot, some perdy boots from the bland and white ladies. To my priest. That I almost never playes. And is lowest on my priorities. But hey, it was fun.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 05 Nov 2009, 05:33
There is no reason whatsoever that you should yell at or make a guildie cry. It's a game! It's supposed to be fun! If you're making people you've probably never met before cry over a fucking computer game, you're an ass. If this is your guild, ask what's going wrong and encourage them to do better. If it's a pug, if someone spoke to me like that once, I'd leave. Don't waste your time getting pissed about it, because seriously at the end of the day, this game doesn't matter.

I don't think any of my guilds have ever yelled at anyone. The harshest I've ever heard directed at anyone was along the lines of, "Dude, WTF."
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: BeoPuppy on 05 Nov 2009, 06:04
This is the way I look at it: the more difficult the instance, the harsher you are allowed to be in criticism. Heroic CoS? This is about how harsh you should be:

"Dude it's cool you are learning a new spec and have almost no gear. We will just take it slow and forget about the mount run."

Now if this girl had been geared and running a hardmode ToC or something and couldn't keep her tank up it coulda gone something like this:

"You damn cunt rag, all you fucking have to do is fucking spam fucking flash of light! Jesus fucking christ you play a goddamn paladin!"

I am assuming that example number 2 was applied to situation number 1.

Option 2, applied to me, would earn you a 'F U C K you' and a 'Good luck finding a new healer and I'm off picking flowers.'
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 05 Nov 2009, 15:26
If someone is shit, there is no problem telling them so. It just depends on how you do it and why, if they insist on doing something, and they are shit at it, and it messes stuff up for people, I won't hesistate to drop a shit-ton of iron fist on a rogue who won't stay behind the tanks on pre Hodir trash mobs. I am not the raid leader or GM, but even if I wasn't a class leader/officer I would not hesitate to do the same.

It's one of the reasons I was accepted into the guild on their shortest trial ever, trialist for 3 days, member for 2 weeks and classleader since. I was told it was because I tanked "Beyond my gear level and class abilities" along with my vocal command over other raiders while a trialist, yeah I yelled at another warrior tonk trialist when he left me to break phear charge and interrupt on crazy cat lady, while I was the add tank and he wanted to prove his worth (1 warrior tank spot, 2 warrior tank trialists, 10 man ulduar). I got bossy and apparantly they liked it.

So as a srsface prick, I do get shouty on vent.

Commanding shout FTW.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 05 Nov 2009, 17:02
Well, it depends on the setting you are in. In a casual guild, or even a serious raiding guild with a low tolerance for verbal abuse, then no I wouldn't have said that. But a few of the actual decent and progressed guilds I have been in, everyone gets talked to like that, its just MO for a lot of progressive players. If you are gonna take it up the butt cause someone yelled at you over a video game, GTFO was their outlook on it.

Plus, when you have spent 4 hours on one boss and you are getting SO CLOSE everytime but can't quite get it, don't tell me that you DON'T want to just up and scream at someone. As raid leader, you get in a lot less trouble for it ; )
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 05 Nov 2009, 17:42
Maybe I've just been lucky in finding friendly guilds that really know their stuff and are willing to work with others. I have wanted to yell at people and I've told people to piss off for being rude and other reasons, but I've never flown off the handle. And nobody in the three guilds I've been in (the last being made up of all real life friends) has ever been that much of an ass to anyone. (Mostly when someone pisses us off, we let everyone die, laugh about it while jumping on their corpses, and then leave. One of my friends was notorious for that.)

But then again, I do solo quite a bit because I hate most people who play WoW. That might be part of the reason I think it's silly to be that much of an ass to people just because I rarely interact with other players anymore.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: torontoguy2k8 on 05 Nov 2009, 22:21
Zero point in spending weeks getting t6 since crafted junk from the people grinding up tailoring/LW/BS will be enough, especially at the rate you replace them questing.

Well see, the thing is, Tier 6 and sunwell level gear can and will last you until 80, without having to replace it at any point during that leveling curve. My hunter not only leveled straight to 80 in Tier 6, but was able to competently perform in a couple Naxx 10 runs. And my hunter is maxed out on enchanting and mining so getting the gear gemmed out in Rare LK gems and good enchants will pretty much guarantee that I will not have to replace a single piece until 80. So in my opinion it's totally worth the effort and time. Besides, there's a group on my server dedicated to doing old world content and they do BT, Hyjal, and Sunwell every week at midnight, so it's no skin off my back to tag along and get free loots :P

And it sucks to hear about that shitty guild drama. I've had to leave guilds because of officers playing favorites and acting like morons on power trips. People tend to lose sight of the fact that WoW is a game, and that you're supposed to have fun.
I'm happy with my new guild though. Very chill.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 06 Nov 2009, 04:16
Sorry, Leinad, but the word to describe you is wrong. Even if you're one of those types who treats raiding like a job, there's NO EXCUSE FOR THAT KIND OF BEHAVIOR EVER!

If you can't do it to your subordinates in the workplace, why would you do it there? Try to show some decorum instead of flexing your internet tough guy muscle.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 06 Nov 2009, 09:27
So in my opinion it's totally worth the effort and time.


Unless you actually like doing that content, no, it's really not, since quest greens and blues in Northrend will give you 90% of the benefit just for doing stuff that you already would be doing anyway, (unless you're some weirdo who doesn't quest at all while leveling). I ended up with around one or two items per slot from Borean Tundra alone, with virtually all of the quests required being easy. I walked out of there only having to fight one elite that I actually remember needing a friend for, which was fine by me since the fist weapon I got out of the deal outperforms any rogue mainhand in BC short of the Hand of the Deceiver or the Warglaives. There's literally at least 80 quests per zone in Northrend, and many of them give decent enough rewards that you'll likely want to do many of them just so you can disenchant things if nothing else. If you also do quests with the appropriate factions in mind, it's also quite easy to have the rep needed to pick up a few faction blues by the time you're 80 as well; I personally didn't have any problem hitting 80 and immediately tackling Naxx 10 with my shiny new Reaper of Dark Souls (http://www.wowwiki.com/Reaper_of_Dark_Souls)-Fang of Truth (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=44187) combo, which outright stomps BC gear. Honestly, bothering to do tier 6 content just means you'll be dusting a few greens earlier than others. There's nothing wrong with doing the things you enjoy, but if you were to look at things in terms of progression and opportunity costs it's hard to argue in favor of farming BC content at this time.

Of course, the above probably doesn't really matter since I don't get the impression that you really give a crap about getting your character into raid ready shape as quickly and efficiently as possible, which is fine. In my not so humble opinion, the best reason to get geared is so you can go see the content you want to explore, and if Black Temple and Sunwell are the content you want to see, then you're obviously making the right move.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 06 Nov 2009, 10:40
Guys, about the language thing:

Different guilds work different ways. Lets take Ensidia and Premonition for example. From what I have gathered from Ensidia, you can basically expect something along the lines of what I just said. They have been number 1 before, and I am sure will be again. Premonition, current number 1, has a low verbal abuse policy. Two different extremes. It just depends on who you feel comfortable raiding with. Your guilds might not work that way, and have you ever considered that THAT is why you are in them? Guilds I have been in work differently, and thats why I raid with them.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 06 Nov 2009, 10:48
Being an asshole can work out well, but it still makes you an asshole.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 06 Nov 2009, 11:05
Besides, there's a group on my server dedicated to doing old world content and they do BT, Hyjal, and Sunwell every week at midnight, so it's no skin off my back to tag along and get free loots :P

...loot YOU don't need because YOU are the one wearing tier 6/heirloom everything already. more for me then!!
<3 old world raiding with people who are mostly 80. even though i do feel like i'm being carried through it sometimes.  :|

alex, we were actually talking about my progression, not his. and i am not the sort of person who is going to see all the latest content anytime soon. i would like to, but i just don't have the time to devote to getting geared enough/leveling quickly, so i'm not going to get much further than bt/sunwell. but that's alright, since i'm still fairly new to raiding and would like to get better at it before i move to the harder stuff so that people don't yell at me and call me a fucking noob. i think this is sensible.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 06 Nov 2009, 11:50
I don't think many of you grasped what I was saying, I stated pretty clearly there is a way to say anything.

I don't yell at people like a prick for no reason or often, I tell them sternly what to do, what they are doing wrong etc. etc. because it works. If you DO get all butthurt, you are the kind of person who won't be dancing their way towards grand crusader any time soon, which is fine for casual/slacker people who still do naxx for raiding gear short of unique stuff for specific gear sets.

I'm not saying there is anything wrong with doing that, but don't get judgemental over how a guild who has done it to death, and moved on to current harder content operates whether it be how they talk on vent or treat members, you think non set 245's come easy? You tolerate people stepping out of line constantly thinking they know better while doing 2k dps and causing wipes? Go ahead, but be prepared to stay in welfares/badgegear for that much longer.

And getting close to the kill then wiping doesn't piss me off or make me rage, I see it as being close to success and when everyone is doing what they are supposed to, doing well giving 100% and failing just short it makes me smile becuse it is a challenge and the game is still a challenge.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 06 Nov 2009, 12:02
I think pretty much everyone was talking about things in general, not specifically to you. Some people agree, some disagree.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 06 Nov 2009, 12:51
You tolerate people stepping out of line constantly thinking they know better while doing 2k dps and causing wipes? Go ahead, but be prepared to stay in welfares/badgegear for that much longer.

There's a difference between letting people slack and being rude. I don't tolerate taking shit from other players nor do I invite people who can't do their jobs. I don't see why I should have to do either. If they have a suggestion, a fix, or can do better by bringing someone else other than me, fine. But the marine corps parody put up or shut up posturing and chest pounding present in many guilds is quite frankly ridiculous and does more harm than good. I think it's no coincidence that in my experience such an attitude is more commonly found in short lived second tier guilds than the ones that end up functioning well over the long haul. You should only break down someone's performance if you think you can build something with it. If you don't think you can do that without spewing a half gallon of bile perhaps it's just best to keep your mouth shut and part ways. Simple.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 06 Nov 2009, 13:06
Then again, maybe I'm the wrong person to ask about such things, since I've never really gotten any leverage out of being purposely harsh that my normal demeanor didn't already afford me. At my last job interview, they said they actually checked my references, which was a bit surprising, and my old boss said that yes he remembered me well and that I was "Professional but terrifying." Apparently this was meant affectionately? I got the job, so I guess people are okay with this.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 06 Nov 2009, 13:37
I do wonder what "Professional yet terrifying actually means"
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: torontoguy2k8 on 06 Nov 2009, 15:01
So in my opinion it's totally worth the effort and time.


Unless you actually like doing that content, no, it's really not, since quest greens and blues in Northrend will give you 90% of the benefit just for doing stuff that you already would be doing anyway, (unless you're some weirdo who doesn't quest at all while leveling). I ended up with around one or two items per slot from Borean Tundra alone, with virtually all of the quests required being easy. I walked out of there only having to fight one elite that I actually remember needing a friend for, which was fine by me since the fist weapon I got out of the deal outperforms any rogue mainhand in BC short of the Hand of the Deceiver or the Warglaives. There's literally at least 80 quests per zone in Northrend, and many of them give decent enough rewards that you'll likely want to do many of them just so you can disenchant things if nothing else. If you also do quests with the appropriate factions in mind, it's also quite easy to have the rep needed to pick up a few faction blues by the time you're 80 as well; I personally didn't have any problem hitting 80 and immediately tackling Naxx 10 with my shiny new Reaper of Dark Souls (http://www.wowwiki.com/Reaper_of_Dark_Souls)-Fang of Truth (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=44187) combo, which outright stomps BC gear. Honestly, bothering to do tier 6 content just means you'll be dusting a few greens earlier than others. There's nothing wrong with doing the things you enjoy, but if you were to look at things in terms of progression and opportunity costs it's hard to argue in favor of farming BC content at this time.

Of course, the above probably doesn't really matter since I don't get the impression that you really give a crap about getting your character into raid ready shape as quickly and efficiently as possible, which is fine. In my not so humble opinion, the best reason to get geared is so you can go see the content you want to explore, and if Black Temple and Sunwell are the content you want to see, then you're obviously making the right move.

I see where you're coming from yeah. But at the same time, Both me and Anna aren't the type who are all "OMG must progress and do L33T raidz" so for us taking out time and doing BC raid content while leveling isn't so bad. Also, Anna likes her achievements, so going through BC raid content at least once for her is on the to do list.
Like she said, I already have a character that raids. He's currently doing 10 man ToC and Ulduar. Only because my new guild is kinda small, but we get shit done :) I'd love to see Anna get that far (Hence inviting her into my guild) but at the same time if she wants to relax and experience other content, more power to her. Neither one of us is entirely fond of questing. It's kinda dull in my opinion, but it IS the most efficient leveling method.

Another benefit to leveling to 80 in the same set of gear, is that Wrath greens and blues awarded from quests sell for a decent amount of money, so that's one of the positive aspects of it. While I leveled Ulfgar to 80 in his tier 6 gear, I was NEVER broke (And I'm a hunter. We're an expensive class!) so it's not completely pointless. Besides, Tier 6 raids are fun as hell.

Oh and Anna, don't feel bad. Yeah you're pretty much getting carried through (basically anyone pre 80 is when you look at the 80s that run these things) but they're cool with that. They encourage people to come, even if you're horribly undergeared. And having a boyfriend that will give you free gems and enchants is always nice too.

And I totally agree that you REALLY have no right to treat people like utter garbage based on in game performance. The only time I have ever ripped someone a new one is when they were either being offensive/racist/prejudice, spamming like a moron solely to piss people off, or playing the Anal/Thunderfury/whatever spam games in trade chat.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 06 Nov 2009, 16:24
I do wonder what "Professional yet terrifying actually means"

Well, I did make a new EMT-B's eyes bulge damn near out of her head once when I responded to a question with "Only if he's not really interested in walking again." I don't think she could have backed away faster from the guy if I had came at her with the defibrillator. At least I'm not as bad as my uncle though; he got better, but when he first started working at the Mayo Clinic as a nurse he was told that he was very good but would be better off working with comatose patients. Kind of a mean way to put it, but it got the point across.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 07 Nov 2009, 06:18
I never said I treat people like shit on vent, you are still missing the point there is a way and reason to say things.

I don't swear, I don't namecall, I tell them what they are doing wrong and how to correct it in a stern but controlled way. I don't see the need to tiptoe around slackers, if someone is doing something wrong there is no reason to be vocal and heard on vent to tell them quickly and accurately what they are doing wrong, what they should be doing and what the result of each action is.

Sometimes you need to call them out on it, tell them what to do and get it sorted.

I have had RL's alot more verbal than me, but each time I got called out on something in this manner, you bet your trinkets I didn't do it again.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 08 Nov 2009, 11:44
But I got quoted... That is specifically me.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Aurjay on 08 Nov 2009, 12:03
Fishing Tournament... any pointers? This is the last achievement i need for my Salty title and im now going on 2nd week and im not even close to winning? 
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 08 Nov 2009, 12:18
Get people to help you via fishing at other holes with no intention of actually turning in their fish before you do. Everything else you can do is basically useless since the pools that spawn in the best locations will also attract the most traffic, negating any advantage.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Aurjay on 08 Nov 2009, 13:24
ya ive heard of doing that or having your guildies basically block their bobber making it hard for them to catch anything but that just seems wrong (prolly cuz it is). The only thing ive done is change my HS to BB so makes turning them in faster. im gonna try next week to find a place not so populated. thinking the east side of STV basically its mostly mountains making it harder for people to get there. Do that and get elixr of water walking and i might have a chance.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 08 Nov 2009, 23:16
Worst part about raiding is the ever chitter chatter betweens tries. People seem to have an ever growing need to repet what they just said and what everybody ells just said. 5 min try, 15 min nagging about failing. Another 5 min cus someone remembers they need to go to the bathroom just when were about to go.

Progressing Twin valkyria in ToGC 10 Heroic. But a few people fail like hell. Anoyes me as well, but what the. Let them lern by trying, not nagging. (They should be aware that they are failing since they are dead more than half the fight.)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 08 Nov 2009, 23:52
Heh, if your guildies are having trouble with the Val'kyr in ToGC10, wait until you do Anub'arak. He is simple yet unforgiving in ToTGC10; my guild groups routinely one shot him and I've only personally wiped to him twice, but the times we did wipe it was due to losing a single person due to bad frost placement/poor kiting. Once that happens he becomes rather tricky to kill in P3 since the easiest way to kill him is simply by letting the burrowers submerge and burning him down before they come back, a tactic that simply doesn't work out very well once you've lost someone.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 09 Nov 2009, 13:53
Or if you're not in full 25 + 25 heroic gear. 10 anub on heroic in 10 man gear is a serious pain in the dick, we're consistently dying at 10% or so. Hopefully killing him tonight.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 09 Nov 2009, 13:58
I can believe that. We don't actually have anyone with 25 man heroic gear in my guild yet, but we're quite kitted out in the standard 25 man crusader gear. And all modesty aside, I do a hell of a lot of damage; having one or two people who can consistently sustain 7.5k+ DPS during a single target burn phase makes that fight a lot easier.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 09 Nov 2009, 19:02
Did anyone have trouble installing today's patch?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 09 Nov 2009, 22:25
We downed the lovely ladies yesterday and started on Anub. About 25 tries. 25 wipes. Interesting fight tho. Our best attempt was 23% but then our healers couldn't coup with the tank and raid damage by then. We had some problem with the dps so I went dps as well. But I don't think this on 2 healers is doable tactics. Since we're mostly 10 man geared. Some people just have to step up to the challange and increase there dps.

Elemental shamys, is the Ulduar 25 gear better the the ToC10 gear? We have an ele shamy who haven't rolled on a single piece of gear since he thinks his old ulduar 25 (non hardmode) is better. But he's strugling to do 4k dps. Something most poeple do on a lazy sunday.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 09 Nov 2009, 22:45
Anub 10 is definitely 2-healable in 10 man gear, I do so pretty routinely on my shaman alt.

Also yeah, we killed 10 man heroic anub tonight. Kind of sucked b/c we had to sit our shadow priest who'd been there wiping and brought in an ele shammy who's a godawful player, but who can press heroism and drop totems. Kind of sad how broken and necessary heroism is for a lot of things.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 09 Nov 2009, 23:31
DPS is stupidly important on hard mode. Too much healing in there can lead to a vicious cycle rather quickly thanks to leeching swarm. Overhealing lets Anub'arak last longer, which makes it easier to run out of mana, which further leads to the often false impression that you need to ease the healing load somehow. Overall, my guild has found that if at all possible it's better to veer on the side of doing more damage. It gets adds down faster, which makes it easier for the healers to concentrate on doing just enough healing to keep the raid alive.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 10 Nov 2009, 07:14
10 man HC faction champs is where my guild stops progressing, not enough good players for TotGC25 but we have TotC10 and 25 on farm, is quite depressing tbh because I feel next to useless in the fight, DR kicks in so damn fast it's not funny.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Beren on 11 Nov 2009, 03:49
woo 3/5 bosses in ToGC25 down and I have long ago stopped caring about this instance oh god make it end.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 11 Nov 2009, 04:41
DR?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 11 Nov 2009, 05:01
Diminishing returns.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 11 Nov 2009, 07:53
Ah... Through good comunications we have got it to work. First time it took like 20 tryes to get them down but the second time was one wipe and then no problem. Everyone was doing their jobb with purge, CC and dispells. And somehow we manage to move around the CC so DR doesn't become a problem. But you have to have people ready to wipe a few times.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 11 Nov 2009, 10:29
It can be totally random depending on what comp you get, especially in 10. You can get rogue/dk/moonkin/warlock/paladin/priest and pretty much just play horribly and still win, then the next week get ret paladin/warrior/Rdruid/Rshaman/Hunter/Spriest, play amazingly and still get unmercifully RNGfucked.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 11 Nov 2009, 10:55
And somehow we manage to move around the CC so DR doesn't become a problem.

This is key. It's the very beginning of the fight that's the most viciously RNG prone, and not all classes have CC abilities that overlap with each other, so in some cases you can almost completely lock down a target until one of the other nasties is burned down. Once you've knocked down one or two of the most dangerous targets you can afford to be much less organized on the rest of the fight provided you haven't lost a key healer, so the communication and Diminishing Returns thing isn't really as big of a problem as you might think provided you've got a sound plan to begin with.

For example, if my raid gets a Holy Paladin and a Resto Druid, typically we'll burn the tree first since the hots are a pain to dispel and cannot be interrupted. Meanwhile I would team up with a druid to keep the Holy Paladin locked down at least until the tree is dead. Basically, the druid spams cyclone until immune at which point I peel off from the burn target and interrupt/stun/gouge them for the 15 seconds cyclone isn't a viable option. You don't have to be perfect on it; letting a few Flash of Lights through won't be the end of the world. You just need to have a partner whose CC you can't clip and keep the 15 second windows in mind.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 11 Nov 2009, 14:27
Our tactic goes somehting like...

"Mel you charge in and fearbomb, then lockdown the shaman while DPS tunnel the priest"

We kill the priest then wipe.

It is alot like arena, full penances through gagging order shield bashes, disarm not working before bladestorm, GCD's feeling like they are 8 minutes long...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 11 Nov 2009, 18:00
It is a lot like arena, in that your raid can't just stare at the boss until it dies. They actually have to be active in silencing/interrupting, ccing, and kiting. A lot of PvE players aren't used to it and can't do it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 11 Nov 2009, 18:25
That's really something of a myth though. There's too much going on at once for it to be like the arena.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 11 Nov 2009, 20:39
Granted, my point is that you can't stand stationary and 123333413333342333334 your way to victory.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 12 Nov 2009, 01:35
Actually, I'd argue quite the opposite. There's so much going on that you pretty much can do nothing but a fairly narrow set of tasks and try not to die. It's basically any other encounter except without an aggro table. Odds are, you will be CCed or interrupted by one of the bazillion mobs, so trying to get too fancy just screws everything up.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 12 Nov 2009, 08:52
I find that encounter to be one of the less inventive ones done by Blizz. I didn't like it that much, to be honest. Not cause it was hard, it just didn't feel epic at all.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 12 Nov 2009, 12:24
Let's face it, it's because you can't flameshock/skillcoil/cheapshot global someone. They just have to much hp.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 12 Nov 2009, 13:07
Lol, don't get my started on skillcoil.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 12 Nov 2009, 14:14
http://img696.imageshack.us/img696/3483/lolcloak.png

http://img41.imageshack.us/img41/7996/unparalulskilljpeg.jpg

Shameless steal from AJ ms paint thread.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 12 Nov 2009, 16:46
(http://img340.imageshack.us/img340/770/lolsap.jpg)

By far the best thing from that thread.

well, that and

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v336/Higurashi/unparalulskilljpeg.jpg)

In response to the original 'Lock one.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 13 Nov 2009, 09:27
Eh, warrior skillstorm ones > *
http://img196.imageshack.us/img196/8996/brostorm.png
http://img194.imageshack.us/img194/8908/bslol.png
http://i231.photobucket.com/albums/ee141/Zalazour/qweweqweqweqweqweq-1.jpg

I only did the lava burst/skillcoil one because it reminded me of why you cannot global people in faction champs.

Oh and this weeks wallpaper, http://img340.imageshack.us/img340/2998/tunnelvision.jpg
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 14 Nov 2009, 10:15
So, some sound files of Professor Putricide of Icecrown Citadel have been dug up, here's a few examples:

"Good news, everyone! I think I perfected a plague that will destroy all life on Azeroth!" (Aggro)

"Just an ordinary gas cloud. But watch out, because that's no ordinary gas cloud!" (Gas Explosion)

"Bad news, everyone! I don't think I'm going to make it." (Death)

I'm tempted to try my hand at PvE just for this fight.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 14 Nov 2009, 12:35
Oh man, I am questing out there right now. So going to have to find that.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 14 Nov 2009, 13:24
I think he's referring to a boss that's going to be in the upcoming Icecrown Citadel raid instance.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 14 Nov 2009, 13:51
That I am.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Beren on 14 Nov 2009, 14:43
Sindragosa testing today. woo
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 14 Nov 2009, 15:07
Meh. Well, that shit needs to hurry up. I'm glad they're adding more instances and all, but I kind of wish they'd stop doing them via patches. I mean, that zone pretty much was built around Icecrown Citadel, I kind of feel like that should have come out before things like ToC, etc. (Not that I'd be able to go there, but still.)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Beren on 14 Nov 2009, 15:13
I don't mind patches, it staggers the content in a decent way to get most of the raid group geared up, but goddamn they are too far apart. ToC has 5 bosses of content. Yes, ten man, 25, heroic, blah blah blah, no. 5 bosses. That's all we get. This does not sustain for months on end.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 14 Nov 2009, 16:17
It really sucks since ToC is short as hell AND obsoletes a lot of gear. It's basically killing my guild because many people are tired of Ulduar while the new faces we recruit could still use stuff from there. We've also had terrible luck with trinket drops, but nobody really wants to keep doing 10 man Ulduar just for a 6% chance at the Mjolnir Runestone each week. It's been a real rough transition phase for us, to be honest. We went from being on the cusp of clearing Heroic Northrend Beasts the first week we tried them to not really raiding at all since many of us would just rather be done with doing Uld entirely. It's just murdered attendance.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 14 Nov 2009, 16:24
Yup, my guild reached a point where people signed up for wed raids cuz that is when we normally did ToC25/ony25 then there would be no more signups all week for ulduar etc.

Disbanded due to officer inactivity and the GM giving 110% but getting shit alol back in return which is bawls, all officers/class leaders got shit out the GB, I got 6k payoff :/

Would rather have my guild tbh.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 14 Nov 2009, 17:31
Meh. Well, that shit needs to hurry up. I'm glad they're adding more instances and all, but I kind of wish they'd stop doing them via patches. I mean, that zone pretty much was built around Icecrown Citadel, I kind of feel like that should have come out before things like ToC, etc. (Not that I'd be able to go there, but still.)

Being able to fight the big bad of the expansion right from the get go seems kind of pointless to me. That's why they stagger raids across patches. If people could just access everything straight up, why would anyone stick around for the year and a half plus between expansions?

It's either that or Everquest II's style of releasing mini-expansions that cost you like $10 each time out. I much prefer Blizzard's way.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 14 Nov 2009, 17:49
Good point, but I just feel like they went out of order a little bit. Mainly with ToC and even Hrothgar's Landing. Like, the Chamber of Aspects only has one instance out of five open and Icecrown isn't around yet, though then again, that is pretty much the raiding peak for this expansion. But then again, I'm really slow anyways, so I don't really care all that much, but people aren't really taking their time with this game anymore and it's tough to find people to do anything but the daily heroic or the new raids.

/whining
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 14 Nov 2009, 18:21
the cross-server lfg thing in 3.3 is going to solve all your problems. and mine as well.
i am so excited for the opportunity to run 70-ish dungeons that aren't nexus, you have no idea.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 14 Nov 2009, 19:08
ICC is the lich kings house, if they did that before argent tournament you would have killed the lich king already, what is the point in that since he is the main bad guy from wotlk?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 14 Nov 2009, 19:54
That's why I said this:

though then again, that is pretty much the raiding peak for this expansion.

the cross-server lfg thing in 3.3 is going to solve all your problems.

Whut. Ohhhhh boy.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 15 Nov 2009, 16:43
Okay, so the guild I was complaining about earlier? The one I was an officer of and left?

Well I've joined another guild who suit me just perfectly and it's nice to be raiding again. They have raids on every night and if you make it you make it, if not, no big deal. It's awesome. I've not seen any of ToC10 yet or most of Uld10 but it's nice just to be raiding again and helping people out with the raids they've never been in before. I'm pretty much topping dps and am in the top three for damage done for everything we've done so far and I've managed to bring three other people from my old guild into the new one. I'm pretty sure the GM likes me, so I'm happy.

But in relation to my old guild. They've disbanded. Apparently one of the officers logged in and then the guild was disbanded. The GM is still currently guildless and I have no idea, nor do my other friends who are ex-members, have any idea why it happened.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 17 Nov 2009, 02:57
Mooooooooooooooo.

And  by that I mean I changed faction, I am a tauren now... wasn't being mean or anything  :|
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 17 Nov 2009, 21:36
Jesus Christ. Val'kyr didn't drop Death's Verdic. Again. We have one in the guild despite clearing the Twins every week they've been available. I have literally every other piece of 25 man 245 gear that I could possibly want except for the one that is hands down a truly meaningful upgrade. God damn it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Beren on 17 Nov 2009, 22:53
Yeah. We've only had one as well, in the same amount of time.

Same with the scarab off FC. We've seen two drop ever. Fuck trinkets.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 Nov 2009, 23:18
I have 488 hit rating right now and I'm -still- bumping up against the crit cap with my Mutilates. Quit boning my class blizz.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Beren on 19 Nov 2009, 12:30
IC is apparently staggered in an absurd fashion. Yay for 5 mans, I suppose.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: pen on 19 Nov 2009, 12:51
I hate that I'm considering coming  back.  My boss keeps asking me about stuff and how things work because he plays but isn't fully applied.  So much WoW talk between him and my boyfriend is kind of getting to me.  I'm starting to crack.  I deleted all of my characters (thank god) so I keep telling myself what a pain it will be to start over.  My boss says my return is inevitable.  I'm  hoping I'm stubborn enough to prove him wrong.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Chesire Cat on 19 Nov 2009, 15:09
Meh, I found it pretty easy to walk away. Then again I never had ties like a guild or raids/instances. My sub runs out in a week but its been probably a month since I played.

I did appreciate a game I could play in a window and walk in and out of as I pleased though. Playing dedicated FS games on my lappy doesnt really happen.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 20 Nov 2009, 00:13
True true, missing a weeks lockout on "progress" can leave you a bit gimped, I pugged ToC 10 2 times, ToC 25 once and ony/VoA 10/25 2 times when I never had a guild.

When you change faction/server it wipes all your raid ID's which is neat.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 23 Nov 2009, 22:28
GUYS!


Look what I got. (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=47113)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 23 Nov 2009, 22:30
I know that was blatant e-peening.


But it still felt good.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: BeoPuppy on 24 Nov 2009, 01:26
If it makes you happy, go for it.

Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 24 Nov 2009, 03:51
So, I'm guild leader of the my new guild. I guess they liked me! :D

Backstory: the previous guild leader only wanted to raid lead, so she passed it over to me. I'm happy.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jimor on 26 Nov 2009, 12:51
Somebody gave me a guild. I was starting an alt character in Northsire when somebody msg'd "You want a free guild?"

Not quite as impressive as it first sounded, as it had failed to get a bank tab, and there was only a little more than 2 gold in the bank. Checking the membership roster, most hadn't been on in at least 2 weeks, all but one were low level. I checked the money log to make sure nobody gave anything that I should refund, then kicked everybody out. Bought a tab, and now my plethora of characters on that server have lots of extra storage.  :-D
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: pilsner on 26 Nov 2009, 13:31
Getting handed a guild is a little like getting handed a job as a kindergarten teacher except no pay, more crying, and infinitely less socially acceptable.  If someone really hates you they will try to give you two guilds.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 26 Nov 2009, 17:04
Well, this guild is pretty well run. I've guild leaded before and well, I kind of ended up being "Aunty Ayniah" because well, everyone came to me for advice. Basically, I've walked into a guild and am now leader - we have 80ish level 80 members, a bunch of which have lvl80 alts, we have 3000gold sitting in the guild bank and four bank tabs I think. I'll be looking at buying another one in the next week or so once there is some more money in the bank to back us up.

Our members donate to the guild bank and I sell things out of the guildbank for half the AH price.

Things are organised and we have raids set up on the calendar and people do actually respond to them.

So far, I've not had much whinging, I still think most whinging gets directed at the raid leaders.

Speaking of raids, I pugged a few people for a second uld10 run this week and we did really well on easy mode (mainly because most of us haven't finished the whole thing yet). We did FL, XT, Razor and Kolo all one shotted. We got Cat Lady on the second go and then moved on to Hodir, which only a couple of people had done before. We got him to 26% on the first go and tried twice more but didn't get him down. Doesn't bother me so much, because at least now we've seen how the fight works. It was actually pretty fun, as far as boss fights go.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: pilsner on 26 Nov 2009, 17:20
Sounds relaxed and fun.  Things deteriorate when you start pushing progression in 25 mans.  There's nothing like 25 adults (or semi-adults) lose their shit after 4 hours of wiping on hard mode Beasts.  Oh wait there is.  And Picasso did a painting of it.

(http://getdagoss.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/guernica_pablo_picasso.jpg)

How are you doing loot?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 26 Nov 2009, 17:23
Hodir is my favorite encounter in this expansion. From a melee dps perspective, there are consequences for playing poorly, but for the most part they're not crazy, draconian consequences that instantly kill you or take out other players if you're positioned wrong; this makes it a bit easier for DPSers who are new to the encounter to "learn by doing" and recover from mistakes rather than cause a wipe instantly or get stuck doing nothing for 5 minutes after a silly death. But more than anything, I love all the movement and the way the fight really rewards you for being proactive and hunting down buffs. As a DPSer, you can always do a li'l better on Hodir, and I love that. I actually sort of miss killing him.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 26 Nov 2009, 17:34
Yeah, I had so much fun running around under the light beams and the sparkles and the fires. I was all "OMG THINGS THAT COME UP THAT I CAN ACTUALLY GO NEAR! AWESOME!".

Our loot system is pretty fair I think. Works like this:

Loot drops > main spec rolls > off spec rolls.

Main spec is the spec you walk into the raid with, off spec is anything else. If it's a BoE and you win it on mainspec, I must see you equip it to make it yours. If it's BoE and no one rolls mainspec, it goes straight to the guildbank. Most of us are only in Ulduar for a few bits and pieces, so this ensures that there is gear available for our other players.

If there is stuff to be DE'd we DE it for the guildbank. No DE? Vendored and gold goes to guildbank.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 26 Nov 2009, 18:06
I actually did hodir today, finally got that awesome survival shield and since A everyone is ToC25/TotGC25 geared I got it no questions which is nice as it is still a superb survival shield before you go onto heroic ToC 10/25.

Only shitty thing about new guilds is each guild has a different way to do things, some make sense more than others but if you try to tank Hodir on his frozen cache like you are used to then NOOO bad things etc.

Still 1shotted him, oh and both dps warriors in the guild go arms for boss fights, and that means the threat:DPS ratio is alot higher than that of a fury warrior which I am used to which sucks.

Oh, and fuck algalon eh? Wiped on him for an hour, mostly silly wipes 2 were my fault as it was my first time but seriously blizz, is a bit mean to make him depspawn for the rest of the raid lockout.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 26 Nov 2009, 20:10
Not really, it's an intentional move to keep people from just zerging the hard content until it finally dies. Same philosophy behind limiting ToGC encounters and some of the upcoming Icecrown limitations. I generally approve of the notion.

Also, my guild cleared ToCG 10 a two weeks ago. Got it in 44 attempts this past week, and gonna go for insanity this monday. Also, my warlock has gotten kind of absurdly well-geared. (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Greymane&n=Nurfbat)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 27 Nov 2009, 10:24
I know it makes sense but when something works against your favour you are allowed to bitch moan and whine, it's what the internet is for.

One of this weeks TotGC 10 man groups downed anub with 50 attempts left. How crazy is THAT?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 27 Nov 2009, 15:55
Just because something makes sense doesn't mean it's the right thing to do. It's not "zerging" to try something until you figure out how to do it properly; it's "zerging" to abuse things like rezzing and getting back into the zone until you beat the boss like you could back in AQ 20. Limiting people to a certain number of tries* or an hour is the kind of bullshit you put in when you're trying to milk people for quarters at the arcade or keep them subscribed for another week. It sort of makes sense for blizzard, but it's still a bit of a dick move. I mean, really, whose play experience was improved by this decision?



*I don't really count the TOGC chests as "Limited tries," per se. 50 attempts is an awful lot, for one thing, and it exists largely to reward people for doing it wipe-free, whereas with Algalon the hour limit is an obnoxious limitation that keeps you from discussing what you should be doing properly lest you don't have time to get in another good try.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 28 Nov 2009, 08:28
Icehowl died in the worst possible spot for us in ToC10 last night, and none of us were skinners.

(http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w274/Yakob42/WoWScrnShot_112709_221718.jpg)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Aurjay on 28 Nov 2009, 09:07
So ive been working on my gear for the last 2 weeks and I've finally gotten geared for ToC10 and some more 25's but my problem is my guild doesn't do 25 man raids and seems to be stuck just doing Naxx10. Now i love my guild and they helped me get a lot of the gear enchants and gems so i owe them a lot but i'm getting tired of waiting to progress. Is there any rules of leaving a guild. I don't wanna seem like i used them and want to remain friends. Also now im promoted to council so i can supposedly make guild decisions but so far have been voted down. Any suggestions/advice would be nice.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 29 Nov 2009, 23:33
You are still doing naxx 10? :-o
That is a crapy boring as hat raid. Start doing Ulduar for fun and ToC for progress.
Don't know the correct procedures, but try explaining that you need something more than Naxx10 to motivate playing this game and if they don't want that your not in the right guild. Make sure everyone knows this. Give it a week and you will most likely have your ulduar and ToC 10-man raid wether the other raid leaders likes this or not.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 30 Nov 2009, 02:28
There is no easy way to leave a guild without at least *some* hard feelings in my experience, especially if like in your case you feel like you are carrying them and they are keepingyou back because they all feel they need you.

Just get it over with, explain your feelings and move on, take experiences from it and keep good friends if at all possible, then start thinking about how you are going to apply/sell yourself to a new guild.

Hell, get some friends to look over your app before you submit it for some constructive criticism.

In other news, TotGC25 Twins is HARD and you will wipe the first time you try it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Beren on 01 Dec 2009, 00:30
HTwins sucks. We just managed it on sunday finally.

My guild has devolved into being disgustingly draconian. You now can't even change your guild note if you're not an officer, let alone the million other things you can't do (use the guild bank with the DE materials from raids, have any say in where we raid or what we do, etc, etc.). I think I've almost reached the breaking point. Our GL is one of those guys psychotically obsessed with the military and I've finally come to realize that's pretty much how he wants to run the guild.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: pilsner on 01 Dec 2009, 00:54
It was shocking to me at first how many soon-to-be-military and ex-military types play WoW obsessively.  After a little bit of time in a progression guild it made perfect sense though.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 01 Dec 2009, 01:12
It was shocking to me at first how many soon-to-be-military and ex-military types play WoW obsessively.  After a little bit of time in a progression guild it made perfect sense though.
This.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 01 Dec 2009, 15:49
Okay, so I need to rant about this somewhere that ISN'T to one of my super lovely guild members who bring this up.

Basically, I got handed a guild and the previous guild leader stepped down and her and her boyfriend are now my 2IC's. Now, she is a lovely girl, but extremely impulsive. She also sets up the raid calendar every week, which as of next week, I am going to tell her, I'm doing - because it's ridiculous.

This week on the raid calendar, we have one night for Uld10 (which we haven't got on full clear by any means), one night for ToC10, one night for naxx25, one night for EoE10, one night for Ony10 and one for OS.

Now, I understand why we are doing the old raids - we are a newish guild and would like to have all these raids ticked off on our progression or whatever, but seriously?! An entire fucking night for OS and Ony10?! SERIOUSLY?! We never full clear naxx25 in one night either, and people get pissed off that we don't finish it. Personally, we would be doing a lot better if we had two nights for Uld10, one for ToC (which we did apparently clear in one night last week), one night for OS, Ony10, EoE and one night where we can just run naxx for extra badges or something. We would be far better off if we spent more time in Uld10 and Uld25 than stuffing around with boring shit people only do for badges.

On top of that, last week, I could only attend one night of uld10 (which was set for thurs/fri) and I was raid leading one group. I told one of my tanks that he could raid lead for Friday and that was good with him. I log in Saturday to find out that my 2IC had decided to ditch the two 10man teams, and do Uld25 with about 10puggers. They downed FL and XT and there was heaps of mucking around and silliness and basically, set a bad image for our guild. I was pissed off.

Monday night we had Ony25 on the raid cal. We had one pugger (a friend of a guildie) in the raid, the rest were guild members. It took a good 45 minutes to get everyone there and organised then we wiped twice and I gave up, cracked the shits, told them I had things to do for tomorrow and logged off for the night. After I left, one of the tanks (the one I had put in charge of last week's uld group) got a few members together for an ony10. The 2IC also got a few members for the ony10. She then cracked the shits and was all "didn't know you were a raid leader blah blah" to the tank, so him and the OT joined her group. Instead of her then filling the group with guild members who were in the tank's original group, she pugged the rest. People bitched about it in gchat, the tank called her out on it, she cracked it and logged off and hasn't been logged in since. The guild members then continued to have a whinge about it.

Basically, I'm pissed off - the 2IC is about 19 I think? So she's a year younger than me, but she is incredibly impulsive and I am kind of glad she passed the guild leadership to me. I really think that this guild (we've got about 70 level 80's) would do really really well if the raid calendar was actually set up for raids people needed and want to finish and there wasn't so much damn drama with this girl. Argh.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: pilsner on 01 Dec 2009, 15:53
Getting handed a guild is a little like getting handed a job as a kindergarten teacher except no pay, more crying, and infinitely less socially acceptable.  If someone really hates you they will try to give you two guilds.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Aurjay on 01 Dec 2009, 16:34
It was shocking to me at first how many soon-to-be-military and ex-military types play WoW obsessively.  After a little bit of time in a progression guild it made perfect sense though.

I'm in the army and agree with you to an extent. I play wow to avoid everything military. I live in the barracks and have to be a soldier damn near 24 hrs a day, so a little escapism is nice. Also I'm stationed in the middle of the desert next to Mexico so the only other activities are going out and getting drunk and/or fighting. Now the agreeing part is that i've played with military before and they do seem to be overly organized and controlling. I think this has a little to do with our lives being pretty much the same way.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 02 Dec 2009, 13:32
I'm rocking two 258 daggers now.



Oh, god, I play this game way too much, when will it end?


[EDIT]

I somehow missed jmrz post.

The raid calendar.

I'm glad you see the problem with it and I strongly encourage you not to back down on changing it, particularly if she's just expecting people to show up every week and work from there. That setup your old guild leader was doing will never work for a guild that's even remotely casual or ever wants to come up with a consistent raiding roster. There's just too many good reasons not to do it that way. If you run 5 or 6 times a week, that's 5 or 6 times a week you'll need to get the raid setup. Even if by some miracle it only takes you 5 minutes to get set up per run that's a half hour per week you're blowing on preliminary organization alone. And that's assuming the attendance will actually manage to remain high enough to support such a schedule, something I don't see happening that many days a week. Just imagine the fallout that'd happen if someone shows up all 6 nights and ends up having to sit out 3 or 4 of the raids because the attendance just doesn't support it; I guarantee you someone would get pissed off, and justifiably so.

Plus, burnout can become an issue, and don't let anyone tell you otherwise. My guild has only 3 official raid nights in which we do 25 man progression content. Everything else is done "unofficially," but since many of us are hopeless wow addicts, that still comes out 3 quarters of the progression group raiding in some fashion 5-6 times a week. That's actually pretty sustainable since we don't really do 25mans other than the Coliseum anymore, but as it turns out, just barely. We temporarily added Monday to our raid schedule to try and down TOTGC 25 Anub and the wheels really came flying off on Tuesday. We wiped a few times to Jaraxxus last night due to silly mistakes, and he's a guy we one shot the first time we encountered him in TotGC.


Man, I ran at the mouth there and probably didn't say anything you didn't already know. Still, I thought it'd help to let you know that at least one person out there definitely doesn't think you're crazy for wanting to change this.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Beren on 02 Dec 2009, 13:56
It was shocking to me at first how many soon-to-be-military and ex-military types play WoW obsessively.  After a little bit of time in a progression guild it made perfect sense though.

I'm in the army and agree with you to an extent. I play wow to avoid everything military. I live in the barracks and have to be a soldier damn near 24 hrs a day, so a little escapism is nice. Also I'm stationed in the middle of the desert next to Mexico so the only other activities are going out and getting drunk and/or fighting. Now the agreeing part is that i've played with military before and they do seem to be overly organized and controlling. I think this has a little to do with our lives being pretty much the same way.

The guys actually in the military don't tend to be that bad. It's the guys who are obsessed with the military without actually having joined that are the crazies. The ones who work in an office as a programmer 13-hours a day with navy seal posters in their cubicle. This is my GL/RL.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 02 Dec 2009, 15:52
25 man anub hardmode without unhittable or block value gear is hard. I am working on it though...

First week in the guild and I tank 4/5 TotGC25 bosses.

Lol new pants too, I went from 25 man to 25 man HC leggings, now I have BiS legs woo. Still just a trialist though >.>

Also a nice new survival shield from Hodir 10 man hardmode (fucking finally).

And your guild drama, make a dragon night smooshing sarth,maly,ony into one night, and VoA if you have controll of WG. 4 raids you can do in under 1 hour before you move on to ToC which takes about 35-40 mins if you take your time and don't wipe.

2 nights of naxx sure, but not really advisable before you hit a brick wall in ulduar (then it becomes progression).

Oh, bottom line is - If you don't like how a guild is going and you cannot change it, find a guild that better suits you. Fuck feeling guilty for ditching people holding you back, is why I stayed in my old guild for so long then I went from strength to strength, landing in a progress guild with a bunch of RL mates.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 02 Dec 2009, 20:39
Only 40g away from epic flight form... Which I should definitely get from what I just dropped into the AH. And then in the middle of the month my subscription expires and then I'm moving on. I haven't been playing much, I don't really do anything except quest and farm (which isn't that much fun), and my friends have all quit, so I think I'll be taking a break until Cataclysm.

But I got my Ony 5th anniversary pet today in the mail and it is cuuuute. So is the little penguin from switching to battle.net. D'aww.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 02 Dec 2009, 20:52
TotGC 25 Anub'arak is a douche bag.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Aurjay on 02 Dec 2009, 22:17
Only 40g away from epic flight form... Which I should definitely get from what I just dropped into the AH. And then in the middle of the month my subscription expires and then I'm moving on. I haven't been playing much, I don't really do anything except quest and farm (which isn't that much fun), and my friends have all quit, so I think I'll be taking a break until Cataclysm.

But I got my Ony 5th anniversary pet today in the mail and it is cuuuute. So is the little penguin from switching to battle.net. D'aww.

I seriously hold a grudge against all druids that just get to buy their flight form. I had to spend the 5g and also do the boring ass 18 part quest. Granted i get a chance at the raptor mount but still annoys me they made it trainable.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: BeoPuppy on 03 Dec 2009, 01:28
... when I was your age we had to WORK for our flight forms, missy!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 03 Dec 2009, 05:48
I wouldn't have minded the quest chain, but seriously, it has taken me this long to make 5000g. Think about it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 03 Dec 2009, 06:06
TotGC 25 Anub'arak is a douche bag.
^^^^^^^^^^

I need to farm ulduar and naxx 25 for my unhittable set, how shit is that?

[Dragonslayer's Brace] or [Waistguard of the Tutor] [Inexorable Sabatons] [Wyrmguard Legplates] [Unbreakable Chestguard] [Handguards of the Enclave] [Bindings of the Hapless Prey]
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 03 Dec 2009, 15:05
The raid calendar.
I'm glad you see the problem with it and I strongly encourage you not to back down on changing it, particularly if she's just expecting people to show up every week and work from there. That setup your old guild leader was doing will never work for a guild that's even remotely casual or ever wants to come up with a consistent raiding roster. There's just too many good reasons not to do it that way. If you run 5 or 6 times a week, that's 5 or 6 times a week you'll need to get the raid setup. Even if by some miracle it only takes you 5 minutes to get set up per run that's a half hour per week you're blowing on preliminary organization alone. And that's assuming the attendance will actually manage to remain high enough to support such a schedule, something I don't see happening that many days a week. Just imagine the fallout that'd happen if someone shows up all 6 nights and ends up having to sit out 3 or 4 of the raids because the attendance just doesn't support it; I guarantee you someone would get pissed off, and justifiably so.

Man, I ran at the mouth there and probably didn't say anything you didn't already know. Still, I thought it'd help to let you know that at least one person out there definitely doesn't think you're crazy for wanting to change this.

It seriously helps knowing I'm not batshit insane for wanting to change it.

Burn out isn't necessarily an issue, I mean, we have one group which is basically a guy and his real life friends and whichever other guildies he picks doing "progression"  (i.e. TOC10) and our Ulduar night is our only other serious night. It's ridiculous. We spend ours just fucking about doing piss easy raids "because naxx25 ranks high in guild progression" and to be honest, I don't give a flying fuck about the progression charts. Sure, maybe if we were up there with the best guilds on the server, but we aren't and I don't think we will be. We are a bunch of people who play the game FOR FUN. We aren't hardcore raiders and never will be. I want my members in Ulduar two nights a week and having a dragon night seems like a good idea. Everything else can jump in the lake and they can pug it. It's seriously driving me up the wall. So much so that last night naxx25 was on the calendar and instead of staying home and logging on to raid lead like I was supposed to, I just went shopping for Christmas presents and plain didn't show up.

My officer, who fully agrees with me, has been playing the game since the vanilla WoW beta came out six years ago and is basically a crazy WoW kid - told everyone last night that I didn't want to run naxx25 anymore and that he wasn't ever going to tank it again because it's just ridiculous to even be there right now. Some people agreed with him (from what I heard) and then the ex-gleader logged on and had a whinge about the fact that no one had got the raid together and no one organised anything. I mean, really. It's naxx25, I could do it in my sleep and so could most of my members. If they want badges they'd be far more productive in endless heroics.

But yes, when it rolls around to Sunday and it comes time to post the raid cal for the week, I'm doing it. I will just do it before the ex-guild leader gets a chance to. And I will set it up so we have two nights for ulduar10, one night for toc10, one night for OS, EoE, Ony and then people can do whatever they hell they like on the other nights. I may even just throw in a oldschool raid night just for fun. When I logged in last night a group of them had decided to do Kara and ZA just for fun, so I jumped in with them, got a heap of gold, saw some old raids I'd never seen before and we had a blast.

I want it to be fun, I don't want people to be bored running raids that aren't helping them and I want them to be ready in at least some way so we can see some of this new content. Otherwise, they can go get stuffed, I'll dump guildleader back onto the ex-gleader and I'll find somewhere else (which is not the ideal plan, because I really like the guild as a whole and I like the people in it, but seriously, I'm gleader now, I should be making the decisions).

Speaking of making decisions as guild leader - one of my other officers was all "You should ask the members WHAT THEY WANT, because I know you are overgeared for naxx, but they may still want to do it and you have to do what is best for the guild members, not what you think is best". Oh really?! Ask the guild members?! Seriously?! I think as guild leader I would have a fair judgement on what people should be raiding, and it ain't naxx.

ARGH.

(sorry this is probably way longer than it needs to be and I've just kept blabbing, but ARGH).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Beren on 03 Dec 2009, 15:40
Quote
Speaking of making decisions as guild leader - one of my other officers was all "You should ask the members WHAT THEY WANT, because I know you are overgeared for naxx, but they may still want to do it and you have to do what is best for the guild members, not what you think is best". Oh really?! Ask the guild members?! Seriously?! I think as guild leader I would have a fair judgement on what people should be raiding, and it ain't naxx.

No, not really. But I have a feeling the majority of the guild members would agree with you. But it's not your decision without input from the other 24 people doing it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 03 Dec 2009, 16:08
To be honest, I asked. I asked guild chat what they thought. I got one response "I'm only there because I haven't done KT". The response from my officer was "I agree with you, I'm never tanking naxx again, get us into ulduar more".

No one else said anything. Which means they were all afk, didn't care or just plain didn't have an opinion.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 03 Dec 2009, 18:02
Grand crusader 10 man anub down with 39 tries left. 1 wipe on FC, 10 on Anub.

/wrists

No wipes were directly my fault as boss tank, and the add tank (my pally mate who solo'd Wyrn) was a beast as always. Sucks.

So now I am up to speed with the guild, grand crusader 10 5/5 and 25 4/5.

FUCKING BLOCK SET (I got bracers tonite in a naxx 25 pug though, and the leggings from badges so it is slowly coming together...)

Oh and 25 man normal shield dropped which was sweet, and my legs are now BiS.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 03 Dec 2009, 19:01
Epic flight formmmm. Zoom!

Also, they give you the option of completing the quest, even at 80.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Aurjay on 04 Dec 2009, 21:34
Epic flight formmmm. Zoom!

Also, they give you the option of completing the quest, even at 80.

I'd still do the quest line then cuz its gives you a moonstone that you can use in Seth Halls to summon the Raven Lord beat him enough times and his mount might drop.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 05 Dec 2009, 07:01
I dunno if I'll be able to before my subscription runs out, as I am rep grinding with the Oracles and farming, but I might when I come back. I took it and am keeping it in my quest log, just in case.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Tyler on 06 Dec 2009, 12:05
Poor Jens.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 06 Dec 2009, 18:42
At least they didn't leave you naked with nothing on an island in the middle of nowhere in addition to all of that.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: öde on 06 Dec 2009, 18:57
Reading this thread makes me glad I don't play WoW.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Aurjay on 06 Dec 2009, 22:02
So I finally switched guilds and as expected my previous guild wasnt too happy. I got a /w from the leader upset cuz i am the best geared healer and now they are kinda screwed. Felt bad so I offered to help them out on some 10man stuff cuz all I really want from this new guild was a chance to run 25man raids.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: beat mouse on 07 Dec 2009, 00:46
I am about 6 months clean now, and I feel great. I played from beta and earlier this year I was hacked by a rival guild due to ulduar progression kerfuffles, leading in my assisted quitting. A lot of good times, a lot of bad times, but more than anything it was most of my time. I applaud goes out to those who can keep it at a distance, getting to a near professional level of WoW is something I don't wish on anyone's soul :(
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: pilsner on 07 Dec 2009, 09:15
True that.  The more seriously you take it, the more of a time sink it becomes and the less fun you actually have during raiding.  Four hours of wiping on the same boss the week it came out is not so much fun.  How did you get hacked by a rival guild though?  Like did they just run a dictionary attack on your password?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: beat mouse on 07 Dec 2009, 16:40
I'm not entirely sure who or how, but I played L4D and COD4 with the same guild and they mentioned it was a /trade topic of conversation that I specifically was out of the equation. The rumor mill had circulated that it wasn't a chinabot that had done it, and I was a little notorious for being a facetious mage as it was. :(
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 08 Dec 2009, 14:28
Patch dropped this morning. Downloaded it, installed it and now... it takes forever to log in, sends me to the realm suggestion screen, I can get to my realm, the box comes up "Connected" and then "You have been disconnected from the server". Well screw you too.

Looks like I'm getting a mini Corehound pet! Apparently those people who use an authenticator (either the mobile or actual device version) get one.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: StreetSpirit on 08 Dec 2009, 15:21
I had similar problems when 3.3 went live today. A tiny corehound may make me a bit less sour about the whole affair, haha.

Kronnen (80 feral druid)/Naushika (80 shadow/holy priest) - Anetheron
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 08 Dec 2009, 15:39
Now it wont even get past the log in screen. I have such a love/hate relationship with Patch Week.

Tiny corehound looks rockin'.

http://www.wow.com/2009/12/08/corehound-pups-in-the-mail-with-patch-3-3/
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: StreetSpirit on 08 Dec 2009, 16:23
Same here, I am actually in the midst of re-installing the whole game to see if that yields any results O.o

That corehound DOES look awesome! It'll definitely help quell and negative emotions towards blizzard, haha.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 08 Dec 2009, 17:26
I doubt reinstalling will help, it was an issue on the Blizzard side of things with battle.net authentication I think.

I got in not long ago and oh wow the new LFG and LFR system is rockin'.

MINI COREHOUND FUCK YEAH.

(http://img269.imageshack.us/img269/347/screenshot20091209at120.png)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 08 Dec 2009, 18:21
I just wish you could run with specific people if you really wanted to. It'd be fun to run with a few of you guys sometime.


[EDIT]

Also my guild is alternately amused/horrified that Blizzard saw fit to buff my mutilate spec. It's pretty nice so far. I bet the devs feel slightly ashamed every time they look at the Murder talent now. 4% increased damage for 2 talent points. That's just an open admission that they just don't know what else to tinker with anymore.


[EDIT AGAIN]

I like how it's hit the point where the Subtlety tree is so pathetic for PvE that the modern raider should now have 0-2 points put into the tree, max.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 08 Dec 2009, 22:56
After the mutilate buffs, I do 10k deeps on a straight tank and spank. It's pretty sexy.


[EDIT]
Oh, and we downed everything in the Lower Spire but Saurfang already, and we didn't even try him because we only raid for 2 hours a night. WTB: Challenge.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Aurjay on 08 Dec 2009, 23:25
Patch so far has been a fail for me. No corehound to make me happy either. Main problem i have right now is not getting my Emblems of Frost after completing the Daily Random Heroic. Also the LFG thing is buggy as hell. Took me 3x's of locking up to finally get in a group and then once inside party chat went down so all we had left was /s. I know these things will be worked out in the next couple of days but im impatient  :x
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Beren on 09 Dec 2009, 05:14
The LFG group tool is probably the greatest thing ever. Free 13g and 2 extra emblems for using it every time after the initial daily? Um. Yes please. I may never sleep again.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 09 Dec 2009, 15:37
I'm not digging it so much, but mostly because I'm on the youngest/crappiest battle group. I have never seen so many 1k dps huntards in my life. I've come to the conclusion that it'd be faster to roll with 2 tanks, 2 healers and me. That way if people are AFK odds are we can still push forward.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 09 Dec 2009, 15:57
Also, it'd double the odds of getting a decent one of each!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 09 Dec 2009, 17:44
The LFG group tool is probably the greatest thing ever. Free 13g and 2 extra emblems for using it every time after the initial daily? Um. Yes please. I may never sleep again.
This.

I can also imagnie meeting up with some xrealm old buddies, might be akward or awesome.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: BeoPuppy on 10 Dec 2009, 01:31
I love it. This morning, at 6.30, I managed to get into a random dungeon (GunDrak). Before 3.3 at 6.30 I couldn't get another player to /wave at much less do anything constructive with.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 10 Dec 2009, 03:50
Yeah man, I moved to a lower pop server horde heavy as horde but I can find a group easier than I ever could on my high pop old server. The progression on this realm is miles ahead and I know people in all top guilds in RL and game.

Pretty much just boosted playing experiences by alot.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 10 Dec 2009, 10:37
Yeah, really, my big complaint is that I do 5-6k dps in heroics and a lot of pug tanks can't handle that. Not really Blizzard's fault; the implementation itself is great.

[EDIT]

I know that sounds harsh, and I know that it's perfectly possible to scale down one's dps, but I'm just a bit bitter because I keep running into sub-par warrior tanks who are both a li'l inexperienced and who also sink every point into protection and parry, without even glancing at some of the nice threat producers out there. I'm considering writing up a basic warrior threat guide and seeing if I can talk one of my warrior buddies into posting it on the wow forums. After all, prot warriors haven't been flavor of the month for ages now, so it's just sort of assumed that people know what to do with them, and a lot of the newer guys really seem to struggle at first because of it. Unless you already know to go to places like tankspot and EJ, warriors are a tough class to find info about. At the very least, I'd like to see more puggers running with at least Impale and Incite.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: pilsner on 10 Dec 2009, 13:35
Between Vigilance and Shockwave, a prot warrior who can't keep up with 5-6k snap dps is just shit.  Absolute poop.  On the other hand, heroics are so god damn boring sometimes it's fun to pull aggro.   I played feral, and to break up the monotony of heroic farming pre ToC would go in in dps gear and sometimes spend half my time in bear.

You've got to watch snap aggro for bear tanks though, especially poorly geared ones.  Swipe only does so much, and because taunts are so limited, if you are doing high multiple target damage it often makes sense to give a bear a 2-3 second aggro lead before you unleash the beast.  A lot of bears don't glyph maul because it's not optimal for most boss encounters.

Of course, this assumes things haven't changed since I stopped playing, which was a couple of weeks of ToGC was unlocked....
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 10 Dec 2009, 14:19
Yeah, half the problem is that it often takes some doing just to get the scrubby warrior to Vigilance me. On the one hand, I understand the reluctance. Rogues have good threat tools plus we have that nifty .7 threat modifier. Beyond that, we scale really well with buffs but are a li'l vanilla in 5 man settings. All else being equal, I could totally understand why someone would put Vigilance on a ret pally or fury warrior instead of me. But with that said, I have a 5500 gear score and a lot of people should be able to tell at a glance that I outgear your average weekend pugger. The good tanks I've ran with in Heroics take roughly a third of a second to recognize where the Vigilance should be going, whereas the bad ones have needed a nudge to use Vigilance on  anyone at all. I don't really expect everyone to necessarily immediately pick up on that, but when you combine such things with a lack of threat talents, I often end up overtaking the tank shortly after tricks of the trade wears off or when we move to the next target. It's not like this ever gets me killed or anything, since I have 38% dodge and about 26k health when buffed along with survivability cooldowns, but I'm not really fond of having to throttle down to the 3-4k dps range, particularly since a lot of the time the other dpsers are only putting out 1.5k-2k dps. I have things to do people!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: pilsner on 10 Dec 2009, 14:25
You do assist off the tank, right?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 10 Dec 2009, 14:31
My understanding is it matches you your gear level, and with tricks it's designed so you can burst as much threat for those few seconds.

Pulling aggro for any reason is being a prick, it will even make your tank quit. I left a group today after saying to press F or let me mark and stop attacking whatever target you want, I left on the mob before the first boss because he laughed, marked up (fury dps was leader) and attacked the mob he had not even marked up. It wasn't using lfg, he /w me when I was doing a daily saying "lf uber geared tank (new instance name HC) don't apply if you aren't good gear" so I should have known he was a prick, if is guildie wasn't the healer I would have told him to stop healinf him and just dropped aggro.

A tank deliberately dropping aggro so someone dies is just as bad as a dps deliberately pulling aggro, it makes the tank feel like he has failed.

If a dps want's to tell a tank how to tank, they can learn to do their own job and manage aggro to suit the situation (whatever the situation, even if it does mean not doing 6k dps). Failing that reroll a tank and see if you can keep up with what you would demand.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 10 Dec 2009, 14:47
You do assist off the tank, right?

No. I've played the game off and on exclusively for high end raiding guilds for 5 years without figuring that out yet.


Seriously though, I'm Tricksing the tank, waiting 3 seconds, attacking, sustaining dps and then somewhere around 30% of the mobs health left I pull aggro if I don't lay off. If it's the second mob in the pull and thus didn't get a full tricks build up I often end up throttling down and skip using Envenom not to pull threat real early. Usually, this is because the tanks are screwing up in rather elementary ways. Were I with anyone from my guild, this would be a complete non-issue, even the tanks that are just alts. Hell, if even the rest of the dps is worth a damn it's usually a non-issue because the mob dies too quick for it to be a problem.

As for being matched up by gear level, maybe it's just the pickings in my battle group, but I'm usually stuck waiting 10-15 minutes at best to get a PUG and then everyone is usually a few tiers of content lower than I am gear wise.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 10 Dec 2009, 14:51
Man, Alex, I know how you feel.

For some inexplicable reason, I'm outdpsing pretty much every other mage I have partied with lately. We had one in the guild who was in full t9 gear, and I was just wearing my conquest badge stuff. I kept equal or was over his dps EVERY FIGHT. We rolled the same spec and rotation so I have no idea what he was doing. Granted, I push my rotation way way way more than I should, but still. I pull a considerable amount of threat and I have the same problem with warriors, if I am with a warrior tank, I wait until we've cleared some trash and if I am high on threat I ask for vig. A lot of them don't put it anywhere near me at all but my threat is absolutely through the roof, even though I've spec'd into the threat reducing talents. Paladin tanks I have absolutely no problem threat wise with, bear tanks, it depends.


In other news, to keep you updated with guild drama:
- Member1 was being rude in guild chat on a daily basis to everyone, including guild officers. His wife/gf was also being rude to everyone (she's a druid healer and she was stacking int? Apparently that's not the best option? I'm not quite sure here, but she had her spec/stacking wrong and my friend was trying to help her)
- Officer1 comes to me and tells me about Member1, I give him permission to gkick him because his behaviour has been absolutely appalling.
- Officer2/RaidLeader comes online and has a whinge and asks why Member1 was kicked. We tell him. He gets the shits because he wasn't told about it.
- Argument between me, Officer1, Officer2 and ExGuildLeader ensues.
(at this point I am assuming they are all on vent, or at least Officer2 and ExGuildLeader are, and I am not)
- I crack the shits and tell them that "I am sick of people leaving the guild and coming back and leaving the guild and he's been kicked, deal with it, move on, my decision, I'm Guild Leader."
- ExGuildLeader then starts booting everyone's alts out of the guild and I am all ".... WHAT?!" in Ochat. In Gchat she is all "IF YOU HAVE ISSUES WITH OTHER MEMBERS PUT THEM ON IGNORE AND TALK TO ME. I AM SORTING OUT GUILD DRAMA RIGHT HERE AND NOW." At this point she continues booting everyone's alts out of the guild and then says "WE ARE A MAINS GUILD ONLY NOW. IF YOU DON'T LOG IN WITHIN 10DAYS WITHOUT AN EXPLAINATION, YOU WILL BE GKICKED."
- My response to this in OChat was "... are you serious?!" to which in Gchat she says "IF YOU HAVE ISSUES PAYING YOUR ACCOUNT OR ARE GOING ON HOLIDAYS LET ME KNOW AND I CAN PUT IN AN OFFICER NOTE."
- My response to this in Ochat was "well, good to see I was included in this grand plan of yours", Officer2 was all "It was talked about", "well, good to see your guild leader was included in this conversation, wooooooo".
- I tell the ExGuildLeader that she can have GLeader back and she ignores me, I tell her she "practically still runs this place anyway, just take it back" and her response is that she is just sorting out the guild drama because she wants the guild to be happy and raiding "like we were before".

After that I cracked the shits and logged off. I was so close to just giving her back GLeader and leaving then and there, but thought I would calm down and do it later.

Member1 and his GF have been invited back into the guild.

Officer2 took a raid group into ICC10 last night, including me. We cleared the trash, wiped on the first boss a bunch of times until he finally said "Maybe we're just not geared for this...". It took all I had to not say "Really?! Are you fucking sure?! Cause WE'VE NOT EVEN COMPLETED ULDUAR YOU IDIOT" ARGH.

Anyway, I've started a new guild on my alt, I've talked to my friends in guild and when we are all online and the ExGuildLeader is online we are going to do a mass walkout.

Definitely time to abandon ship.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: pilsner on 10 Dec 2009, 14:52
sweet jebus

I'm not going to even say I toldya so.  I'm so good to you.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 10 Dec 2009, 15:04
I forgot to mention, at one point in our argument I was all "To be completely honest, it feels like I'm running a fucking kindergarten" and Officer2 was all "lol". I could have raged so hard, but I would prefer to stay calm and peaceful and not earn myself a unjustified bad server rep.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jimor on 10 Dec 2009, 15:04
Sell the guild to the highest bidder in /trade.

I almost don't think I'm kidding.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 10 Dec 2009, 15:19
One of my other friends suggest that I say in GChat "JUST SORTING OUT SOME GUILD DRAMA GUYS" and boot the ExGuildLeader.

Oh man, trade. We've had an ExMember dissing the guild in trade too - "if you want to join a guild that doesn't finish runs and is a fail join <guildname>" after any of us posted a recruitment messasge. Granted, the guy left the guild twice and the second time was because "no one will run me through things".
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 10 Dec 2009, 22:12
Downed Saurfang. Feels good; wanted to do it yesterday but the stupid spawn bug slowed us.

[EDIT]

Man, I just got done with a beautiful pug with a warrior tank that made up for all my previous experiences. He was actually geared worse than a lot of the crappy tanks I grouped with, but it didn't matter; he was super aggressive, held threat like a champ and kept the group moving. I <3 good warriors.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 11 Dec 2009, 05:31
I completed 10 man icc cuz we were bored.

I never got loot though.

Guild killed boss number 1 without me when I was working though, we planned to do it day after patch but they did it patch day because they had people on Q_Q

As for jmrz guild drama, kick everyone, ninja GB, sell guild, jump realm to somewhere with less fucktards.

Oh, and in lfg I have never had to wait more than 6 CGD's before getting a group. And that was at 2AM on a weekday for a random dungeon. Tanks evidently have it easy.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: BeoPuppy on 11 Dec 2009, 05:39
I'll second the suggestion of taking all the money and run, vis-a-vis the guild drama. It's supposed to be a game. So, you know, fuck 'em if they can't take a joke.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 11 Dec 2009, 05:47
Run like the wind!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: philharmonic on 11 Dec 2009, 06:57
Like OMG newest patch (3.3.0 i think?!) with the map integrated into the quest log. WAHOOO who needs wowhead anymore!!!!!

Oh and DING 61 for my main (Penpen on Echo Iles) come gank me some time LOL

[edit] Oh and the new "random" dungeons looks cool... might try on the weekend if some other guildys are in.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Aurjay on 11 Dec 2009, 06:57
lil bit of my own guild drama going on as well. I recently moved to a progression guild and was looking forward to raiding with them. I signed up for ToC10 and was ready to go but instead they ran without me and then did ICC 10 w/o me. I asked the guy that recruited me as to why and he i guess said i was pissed(wasn't just confused) so they are kicking this girl out from the 2nd part of the run tonight. So ya she is pissed(rightfully so) and it makes me look bad. I just didn't know why i was skipped since i had signed up and was on at the right time. Fuck Drama. My old guild didnt have any but wasn't progressing at all so now not sure if i want to even stick this out or just go back to my old guild.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: BeoPuppy on 11 Dec 2009, 06:59
I'm getting the impression that guilds are either progressing and full of tension or relaxed and doing fuck all.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: philharmonic on 11 Dec 2009, 07:16
Relaxed and doing f all... ...thats where I'd wanna be. But more realistically the guild I'm in now to me is more of a political-geographical statement to me. Plus I'd imagine when I hit 70 then they might start to expect a little more from me. That and they seem like easy going mature bunch (which is good).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 11 Dec 2009, 07:57
My guild is a 1-3 night a week 10-man only guild, we're pretty relaxed and such, and we were farming ToGC10 (never going back ever, hate toc), and cleared everything in ICC10 in like, an hour and a half.

Being relaxed isn't so bad if you actually play with people you like.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 11 Dec 2009, 12:32
We all kinda realise we are gonna be at 4/5 TotGC25 forever now. Nobody wants to do anub.

I like progress, but still I dun wanna have to do that fight too much more :(
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: pilsner on 11 Dec 2009, 12:37
I'm getting the impression that guilds are either progressing and full of tension or relaxed and doing fuck all.

Yes.

Your best bet for getting a sense of accomplishment and having fun in game is joining a guild that goes into various battlegrounds once a week and beats everyone silly.  Unfortunately, there are not usually more than a few of those per server, and they tend to be filled with douchebags.  Also, not everyone loves pee vee pee.

Also: thank-you for everyone in this thread talking about guild drama for making me feel really, really good about quitting.  You guys are better than a sponsor.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 11 Dec 2009, 16:18
My guild is pretty awesome.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: beat mouse on 11 Dec 2009, 16:46
Yeah there's no such thing as a casual raiding guild that does top end content, things like SSC weed out the guilds who cant hack it and are more often than not guildbreakers due to half your crew knowing how to do it and trying to get people who dont care or are just not good enough to do it. Sad truth but raiding is an all or nothing (or all or introductory) goal, most of the time.

Also, pilsner nailed it on the head, quitting wow is really hard until you've had enough guilds collapse around you to drive you batshit nutty.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 11 Dec 2009, 18:03
Okay, I left the guild. Started up a new one with some friends from the guild we were just in. The ExGuildLeader hasn't said anything to me since. I promo'd her to GL and left without a word. Nothing has been said. I am now just going to kick about in this guild, pug whatever I want to raid when I can and just farm badges with endless random heroics for my gear. I play for fun and I'm going away for a month soon anyway, so I wont have WoW then so the idea of joining another raiding guild is just silly.

Am happy now.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 12 Dec 2009, 06:39
BOOO! Cowards route.

In other news I still hate pugs.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: pilsner on 12 Dec 2009, 09:03
(http://gigglehd.com/zbxe/bbs/files/attach/images/262/229/324/001/SadPug.jpg)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 12 Dec 2009, 18:17
Of course when I cancel my account, one of my friends starts playing again. And he's at about the same point as me in the game. AAAAAHHHHHHHH. WILL RESIST!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 12 Dec 2009, 19:26
I mean come on, no dog should have that many folds in it's face.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 13 Dec 2009, 08:26
(http://esrati.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/shar-pei-wrinkle.jpg)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 13 Dec 2009, 19:35
They arem't even fun to pet for fucks sake.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: JD on 13 Dec 2009, 19:48
You speak lies.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 13 Dec 2009, 20:20
Though I have never petted a wrinkly dog, I am sure any dog that is reasonably clean and doesn't want to eat you is pretty fun to pet. Especially puppies. How can one not like petting puppies? (Unless you're allergic, then I forgive you.)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: pilsner on 13 Dec 2009, 20:26
(http://www.dailypuppy.com/media/dogs/anonymous/pepper_pug.jpg)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: JD on 13 Dec 2009, 20:28
Adorable
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 14 Dec 2009, 00:37
Woho, great guild week.
Mondag: clear the first 4 bosses in ToGC 10.
Tuesday: Kill anub ToGC 10!! (first kill)
Wednesday: Patch, heroics, random lfg and ICC. The guild wipes all night on the first boss. I wasn't there.
Thursday: Down the three first bosses and after a few wipes at saurfang we call it a night (Healing is working great, god damn I love glyph of rapid rejuvenation).
Sunday: Saurfang is beaten to oblivion by one of the most beautiful kills in guild history. I came second on the damage done with almost 6k dps.

And the new tool is great. You get money, you get badges, you get teleportation and you don't have to sit around having a boring time while looking for a group.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 14 Dec 2009, 07:11
We are struggling on 25 man saurfang, the other bosses were all pretty painless (once you get the tactics, I missed first boss) but 10 man was stupidly easy.

25 man Saurfang is a cunt cuz as soon as 1 person dies everyone gets mad then more people die and before you know it bloodlust is off and the boss is back at 20%hp from 8% then he ends up at 40% and you call it a wipe. First night on him though, should down him tonight.

GZ on first gc anub 10 kill, how many tries left?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 14 Dec 2009, 08:02
Thank you. And I agree about the difficult level on ICC 10 man, although it's a bit harder for us since we only have 10 man gear. But everything except anub 10 man heroic have been on farm for quite a few weeks.
We finished with 26 tries so a nice spell power mace droped from the cash. Our healing shamy got it and promptly changed on thursday for a new mace that droped from the air ship encounter.
But for this patch we have decided to skip the ranking so might try to pug ICC 25.

Good luck with saurfang. In my opinion it's just about handling the adds and pushing the dps. Don't know if you can CC them in 25 but my root saved our hunter a few times.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 14 Dec 2009, 10:12
2shotted him on 10 man I believe, was not hard (first time nobody knew what to do) once we got an idea of the fight we downed him next try. 10 man HC mode and 25 normal geared I did GC10 with 41 attempts left I think, or maybe 39 I cannot remember, the fails were stupid things like the warrior not being arms for MS.

I just want the rep ring but I am not even friendly yet :/
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 15 Dec 2009, 15:53
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2574/4188270887_2570875d88_b.jpg)
Sup slackers.

(No ICC loot used either)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 15 Dec 2009, 16:09
Slackers? My guild's been doing that for weeks.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 15 Dec 2009, 17:18
Yeh... but you only got a tribute to skill.

Slacker.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 15 Dec 2009, 17:27
Of course. I don't actually do 10 mans with any regularity. I'm too busy clearing 25 Lower Spire first week.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 15 Dec 2009, 17:43
My guild got mad skill 2 weeks ago with 49 attempts, we all hate ToC though and are never going back, not even for insanity/immortality.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 15 Dec 2009, 17:54
Yeah, it's never really been any one particular boss that has ever kept my guild from getting Tribute to Insanity (although I guess the guys who bother get it routinely now). The first time we downed Anub 10 togc we actually had 44 out of 50 attempts left. The problem is that typically at some point in the raid someone's going to have a dumb moment or two, like not handling Jaraxxus' flames right, or someone forgetting something dumb on twin valks.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 15 Dec 2009, 18:03
Guild did 25 man, just I missed 2 bosses >.>

That shit is not hard, tributes to skill are what they sound like. It was my second GC10 run since I shifted servers a few weeks ago and yeh, alot of people in my guild have the mount/cloak/weapon from it because it is on farm for a few people but it was a big achievement for alot of people in the raid, if someone wasn't focused enough to get it they obviously don't deserve it and if you clear the first wing of icc 25, are you going to do no more raids for the week?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 15 Dec 2009, 18:08
Yeah, actually. We cleared what's there in ICC10 in about an hour and a half on Wednesday, then did nothing for the rest of the week. Just alt'd around and such.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 15 Dec 2009, 18:52
Each to their own I suppose, but if all I did this week was ICC10 I would be bored as shit, even if I had a 7 day work week I doubt I could settle for that.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 17 Dec 2009, 22:46
Man, the goofiest/dumbest thing I've seen in a while happened today. There's this new guy in my guild and we're doing a daily random together when a BoE blue drops. I want it for my newest alt and everyone is rolling Disenchant, so I say "Hey, guys, do a quick /roll and I'll toss the winner a Dream Shard-- I'm needing on that Necklace." For some reason, this really, really pisses the recruit off. Like, he went completely apeshit the second he saw the "need" despite me stating in group what I was going to do before hitting Need. This actually ended up spilling into trade chat, if you can believe that.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: pilsner on 17 Dec 2009, 22:49
Is he still on probation?  If so, have an officer toss him.  Guy sounds like a feeb, and if he reacts like that on a daily, he's going to pop a vein over real raid loot.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 17 Dec 2009, 23:04
He's actually just on as a "friend" rank (I posted recruit earlier out of dumb habit) because he knows a guy, so he's not going to be raiding, but overall, I still found it pretty amazing. There's no chance in hell he's going to be raiding with us after that though, despite his eventual apology.


I mean, really, it was over a Burning Skull Pendant! (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=37646#comments) My new pally has to get his defense rating from somewhere.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 18 Dec 2009, 00:20
I'm stunned that someone would nag about an item someone actually needs, even it's his tenth alt. He must have miss understood somehow... or is just plain stupid.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 18 Dec 2009, 08:37
I used that neck piece :) Up until about a year ago, but when it dropped along with the blue shoulders off the boss in gun'drak I was happy as a motherfucker.

Gear seemed so much more happy back then, now look :(

http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Boulderfist&n=Melville

Cold calculated numbers. How shit is that? At the end of naxx I was hit/expertise capped and had 30k hp UB with a good amount of avoidance, now look, well under hit cap.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 Dec 2009, 09:24
Yeah, I was honestly pretty happy when that thing dropped. Like I said, it's a fresh 80 so getting defense rating AND some shield block value in one piece is pretty nice. Honestly, at this point in content all I really care is not getting crushed and putting out halfway decent threat. Healers are generally geared enough these days that raw mitigation won't be too big of a deal for a heroic dungeon alt.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 18 Dec 2009, 13:29
I'd forgotten I'd gotten an egg from the Oracles, so I logged on today and this (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=39898) hatched. Aww. I bought another egg so I can have something fun waiting in my bags if I decide to come back after my account expires. (Which is in a few days.) Until then I think I might do a random dungeon or two, because the new LFG is pretty rad. So is the new map/quest log.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Aurjay on 21 Dec 2009, 21:27
So im kinda depressed. I joined this new guild and everything is going great except I suck at raiding. Not that my skills are lacking but my computer is a POS and lags out to 1fps on anything over a 10man and even then sometimes. The other druid healer has similar gear and is usually topping the heal meter yet im usually 3rd or below. I know a lot of that has to do with lag cuz i am definitely #1 when it comes to over-healing. I priced a new laptop that i want and it was close to 3k. It has to be a laptop cuz im in the military and travel a lot and just makes it easier for me. Also being in the military and low ranking at that means im broke as fuck and prolly cant afford a new laptop anyway which is why i am depressed. Just kinda wanted to rant a little sorry for taking up space but damn i'm annoyed right now.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Catfish_Man on 22 Dec 2009, 14:57
Get a lower spec laptop. WoW runs just fine on ones costing less than a third of that.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Aurjay on 22 Dec 2009, 18:07
possibly but im tired of always having a low end laptop/pc whatever. I want to get something that runs WOW and anything else that might be coming out smoothly and seamlessly.  On another note my guild is implementing a DKP system. For the record i hate these. Especially in my guild when they have a "core" group of raiders that they take every time leaving us new to the guild to only run the 25mans. This core group obviously is gonna get more DKP and get better gear, leaving us new people forever trying to catch up. it just seems like favoritism to me and ive always hated it
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 22 Dec 2009, 18:09
In both cases there it seems like you offer chicken feed and expect a phoenix.

Sometimes you need to settle if you can't shell out and dkp is fair because there is no reason someone who contributes more than you should not get more loot than you.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Aurjay on 22 Dec 2009, 22:32
If everyone had a chance to raid then ya i don't see a problem. I sign up and am on time consistently but if they choose another druid over me just cuz they are part of the core group that's been around for awhile then how am i suppose to get DKP.  It just doesn't seem fair. For instance they run 10man and i can never get in the group. They earn DKP all week long and when it comes time to do the 25man that i can actually get into I'm at a disadvantage over the loot. Whats even worse is im almost equally geared as the druid so their isn't even a gear difference. And yeah i know i need to settle but thats why i mentioned that i was just bitching to let off steam is all.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 22 Dec 2009, 23:08
Put together another "core" raidgroup for 10 man. You must have the people if can do 25 man as well.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Aurjay on 22 Dec 2009, 23:34
thats exactly what its gonna have to come to.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 05 Jan 2010, 09:14
Giving 25 man DKP in a 10 man is retarded. Find a new guild.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 05 Jan 2010, 23:07
I rolled a warrior named ProtWarrior today and I'm going to make a guild for him called Prosaic.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 05 Jan 2010, 23:09
Runner Up: Badtank, of the guild Nexus Wipe
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 06 Jan 2010, 00:47
Got a shaman calle Kíck and my DK tank is now an orc on boulderfist called Blamé.

Kick the shaman and blame the DK!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 07 Jan 2010, 20:30
Blizz plz quit nerfing, k thanx.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 07 Jan 2010, 20:43
Oh, btw, I don't mean that about the rogue nerf, I mean that about the boss nerfs. I just forgot to mention that I'm not upset about the rogue nerf since I'm quite aware that my damage is stupid as hell right now. Like, 11k+ or so on tank and spank kind of stupid.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 08 Jan 2010, 01:33
Well, the new bosses were hard as hell when 10 man geared. Or festerguard was. Rotface was buged when we tried him wednesday so the slimes didn't allways merge and people were tired as hell after silly wipes on bosses and trash.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 08 Jan 2010, 03:06
7% on festergut then enrage. Yet to try 10 man.

And rogues are getting nerfed yes (2 trees at least), locks are getting buffed, prot warriors are being getting less control in arena, Bryntroll's proc is getting "fixed" and s8 is just around the corner.

I like arena on my DK.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 08 Jan 2010, 09:51
The sad thing about the Festergut enrage is how people were mewling about how you need to stack rogues to do it in 25 man yet I'm the only raiding rogue in our guild but we still got it. Whatever.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 08 Jan 2010, 10:35
Melee deeps yes, but feral druids and fury warriors also do batshit loco dps in that fight.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 08 Jan 2010, 10:50
Meh, 2-shot festergut, killed rotface in 10 man. We're a 10 man strict guild, and when festergut fell over we were just kinda like.... wait really? That's it? Putricide looks like a pain in the dick OTOH, I doubt we'll kill him this week. Some of our people still fail to grasp the basics of the encounter, which is a problem.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 08 Jan 2010, 14:40
And rogues are getting nerfed yes (2 trees at least)

It's nearly impossible to nerf subtlety since it's honestly a dead tree from a pve perspective. The only thing it's good for is Preparation in PvP. My combat spec doesn't even have any points in Sub and my Mutilate spec has all of 2 points in it. If the talent those two points were invested in were suddenly removed, I wouldn't even blink; I'd just put the points into Quick Recovery and spit on Subtlety's worthless corpse. It is a dead end.

Also, nerfs aside, from a quality of life perspective, I really wish I was an Unholy DK right now. I wouldn't do as much overall dps as my rogue in most fights, but I would only need the 1 spec to be quite viable in all DPS environments and could still keep a decent tanking offspec. As it stands now, I need to maintain two PvE specs, 4 different weapons and use 3 different trinkets just to stay around 8k in all types of encounters. I realize that tanks often keep multiple pieces of gear around to optimize as well, but it kinda miffs me that being a pure dps class means we need to worry about two sets of stat weights and mutually exclusive weapons.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 09 Jan 2010, 13:15
Yeh I figured out in order to nor need to respec so much, I would need pvprot, deep wounds prot, unhittable prot, pvparms, pve fury and perhaps an OT build, but I cannot get that at the moment unfortunately.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 09 Jan 2010, 13:21
Yeah, really, the only consolation I see in your situation is that Warriors have the easiest time becoming unhittable in the first place-- for druids and DKs it's not really an option to begin with. But with that said, yeah, it is a pain in the ass to get a tank geared up with specialty gear. All the shuffling between specs that healers and tanks need to do just for Anub'arak is pretty annoying. Hell, I even swap around the glyphs and use my combat "offspec" for the Anub fight, despite the fact that we actually overgear it at this point. Every li'l bit helps, but it's a bummer that one or two people typically has to hearth and respec just for one fight.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 10 Jan 2010, 10:30
So what if it is apparantly easier for a warrior to get unhittable? Paladins still make better add tanks before the point where you have BiS unhittable gear. Even then a similarly geared paladin would have an easier job, is a pain in the ass.

PvProt with an arcane mage to rating enough for a nice 2h for end of season, still got arena points left over from pre server jump so should be good!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 10 Jan 2010, 19:27
God, I hate Rotface so much. He is easy. I haven't died to him without it ever being the ending stages of a full wipe-- I already feel as if I have mastered the encounter. Out of all my logs and all the attempts, I have 3 ticks of Slime Spray damage taken, out of both 25 man and 10 man attempts. We did him in 25 man easy. But not in 10 man. In 10 man, people keep being stupid and we somehow lose people early which sets us up for fail in the ending seconds of the fight as his casting speeds up. People can't stop being stupid. And it's not even like it's the tanks or healers screwing it up, so what's the damn problem?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 10 Jan 2010, 22:59
Professor putricide, we should have 5 attempts left but we had 2 separate ninja pulls.

Both offenders were kicked.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 11 Jan 2010, 00:19
People ninja pulling putricide makes me laugh!


My guild wen't a little new school old school and spent an hour wiping on algalon yesterday. Boring as hell fight imo. Today or tomorrow we will try Rotface and professor.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 11 Jan 2010, 01:04
I wanna go back to algalon.

Fight was batshit, no holds barred, "Right mel, for this you pop an indestructible pot before pulling, heroic throw then charge, shieldslam then stack sunders" I love crazy pulls like the sarth 3d zerg where I pull with shattering throw then heroic throw retaliation stancedance charge position shieldslam stack sunders then my normal rotation before first drake lands, taunt her wait 3 seconds then ZOMG CD CYCLE TIME OR I DIE.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 24 Jan 2010, 20:21
This threads not dying on my watch! It's the only one I ever post in, more or less.

I have an 80 rogue (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?cn=Kleptocracy&r=Bleeding+Hollow) now (well, "now" meaning since the last time I posted in here) on top of my priest (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bleeding+Hollow&cn=Starsnostars). So thats exciting. My rogue was actually my main for a while but then I left him at 73 for a year while I played my preist non-stop. I was so excited to remember how much I love playing him. So fun.

(P.S. the changes to Armory are pretty nifty.)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 25 Jan 2010, 05:13
Still playin waryur.

http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Boulderfist&n=Melville

LOLOL /FLEX

I need new head and shoulders, they so old and shit. Is nice how because all my TotGC25 junk is better than 10 man ICC stuff I can pass. Still want a new wep, either the sword/mace from TotGC10 or the mace from Marrowgar 10 or the sword from professor putricide 10. And TotGC25 shield just refuses to drop for me which sucks a little.
Progress on ICC25 is pretty slow, I don't always go but Putricide causes many many problems.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 25 Jan 2010, 16:06
Still a rogue. (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Grizzly+Hills&cn=Intruder)

I had to go Combat because the Arms warrior has been QQing about his personal dps and went fury despite everyone's protests, so that's why I have a sub 258 weapon and a shitty trinket atm.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 26 Jan 2010, 07:13
After halfway through ToC, gear level should mean he would perform better as fury. Alot better, and alot easier to pull retarded dps as the arms rotation is pretty sciency.

On sciency rotations, Druids rite?

Druid tanks have 3 skills, mangle, maul and swipe. Boomkins have 4 skills, moonfire, insect swarm, wrath and starfire. Resto druids have 4 skills, rejuv, regrowth, wild growth and healing touch.

Feral dps... seriously guys? You expect people to rely on an addon to not come bottom of dps then when they use the addon suddenly they are doing mage damage?

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3549/3525757995_8950e7c250_b.jpg
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 26 Jan 2010, 11:36
I know fury does more damage, but this forced me to switch to an inferior gear/talent combo, lose my run speed, regem EVERY slot and forced our feral onto mangle bot duty. So, really, it's a cascade failure situation, particularly since he tweaked his fury spec so it performs best on trash of all things. Congratulation, you can top the meter sometimes with your triple cleave. Have fun doing middling boss damage.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 26 Jan 2010, 11:36
I will now light myself on fire.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 26 Jan 2010, 12:42
Glyphing cleave is a good thing, your gems look like they always did (arp arp arp expertise crit).

Link the warriors armoury.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 26 Jan 2010, 14:23
Never mind; the aforementioned feral druid said the warrior was doing crap that he couldn't have been doing. The warrior's armory is fine, (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Grizzly+Hills&cn=Elsie) so maybe I'll have to bitch at the feral later. As a raid we've still lost dps though. I've lost enough dps alone for it to be a wash, and again, the feral is a manglebot now, which is a shame since hitting the kitty with hysteria was one of our go to dps maneuvers.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: beat mouse on 28 Jan 2010, 07:22
Upon cashing in my free week, and buying another gamecard (which hasnt even kicked in yet) I have replaced most of my lost items with new content and was about a GS of 4800.

I still haven't gotten my stuff back from the GMs based on the first time I was hacked, but it's okay since I'm replacing 213 with current items.

I got disconnected and hour ago to find that someone attached an authenticator to lock me out and hacked my shit again.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: torontoguy2k8 on 28 Jan 2010, 13:01
Man it seems like everyone is getting through ICC but me >.>
That's probably because my realm is terrible for raiding.
I've done ICC25 a few times, but every time we don't get past Lady Deathwhisper. Which is pretty pathetic. The last time I was there we didn't even get past Marrowgar. People couldn't grasp the concept of killing the spikes as quickly as possible. And I swear every caster in there thought that the blue fire gave mana. Kinda sad. I do NOT| recommend Argent Dawn for raiding. I can usually pull about 4-6k on Ulfgar (Although I suck on marrowgar because his hitbox is the size of a small whale) so I know I can clear content consistently. The main issue I face is I play casually and don't have the time to raid with the hardcores. So progression is a bit hard for me.
Here's my armory though for my druid and hunter if anyone is looking for a decent player for 10/25 T9/T10 content.
Ulfgar ---> http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Argent+Dawn&cn=Ulfgar
Thadorius --> http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Argent+Dawn&cn=Thadorius

Also, does anyone else think the Tier 10 hunter and druid armor look balls terrible?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 28 Jan 2010, 13:15
Who the fuck pugs 25 man ICC? My guild just apparantly downed Proff putricide according to guild chat, I wasn't there cuz current tank rotation depends on what loot you need from the boss combined with classes for the fight, since I was the only person who didn't need some druid tank gear or the tanking mace (cuz it's nasty) I stepped out.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: torontoguy2k8 on 28 Jan 2010, 13:25
You'd be surprised. I'll admit that while my realm is pretty fail for raiding for the most part, we manage to get some surprisingly good PUGs for current contemt. It's a little odd how that works.
I'm not too familiar with the loot tables, and people like bringing me because I'm not a complete loot whore. I mainly go to raids because I like the lore in them, oddly enough.

Anyone have any guesses on which guild will grab the world first Arthas 25 kill?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 28 Jan 2010, 14:11
It depends on what you consider a successful pug as well. It's probably not an option on my server, since it Grizzly Hills is one of the absolute worst servers in the game, (to say I'm ahead of the curve here is an understatement) but I'm sure the first wing of ICC25 is pretty doable on a few of the well-established servers, although Saurfang would probably need some trial and error for the ranged to get the adds down clean. The Plague wing would end up schooling people though, at least on my server. There's people who advertise doing 3k dps like it's a good thing here,  so Festergut is definitely out. Still, clearing the first wing is a pretty good haul for casuals.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 28 Jan 2010, 15:38
First 4 bosses would be shit, I would not wanna get saved for 4 bosses. Currently doing blood princes 10 man with a shit group for it (Fantastic group just bad comp for this fight), so the pally is tanking Keleseth and Taldaram since we don't have a lock or s-priest to tank it, boomkin ses no and mage kept dying while trying.

Wiped on 21% there so is defo doable.

1 shotted it 25 man but it's not easy on 10 man without a lock.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 28 Jan 2010, 15:44
Did it with 2 tanks, fuck yeah.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: torontoguy2k8 on 28 Jan 2010, 17:49
Did it with 2 tanks, fuck yeah.
Grats. And for me I wouldn't care so much if I got locked to four bosses, so long as I actually get to experience the fights that's cool for me.
I did a pug last night on my healer for ToC25 reg and we just flew through the place. cleared in around an hour. Our only trouble was anub. We almost slept through faction champs it felt that easy. But then again I was healing so everything seems less intense when you're healing. Still gotta work on my tank set though. It's pretty terrible.
So that same ToC pug is jumping into ICC25 on Monday and I definitely plan on joining, because apparently they consistently clear up to saurfang easily from what I've heard.
Guess I'll find out monday.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 28 Jan 2010, 18:04
Heh, I think how intense healing feels is somewhat a function of class/spec. Holy Paladins are wonderful tank healers even when somewhat undergeared, but I've seen even the good ones get pretty frazzled after a string of high movement fights. The best holy paladin I know swears that the only thing gear upgrades really do for him at this point is let him cope with movement better since he can skip a beat now more often and still be able to bomb the tank enough to keep 'em alive. In optimum conditions his throughput from a couple of patches ago would still be fine in modern content.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: torontoguy2k8 on 28 Jan 2010, 18:26
I suppose, but I've never played a holy palaldin.
I play a druid, which consists of:
HOT, HOT, HOT, HOT, HOT, Make a sandwich, HOT, HOT, HOT, Grab a drink, HOT, HOT, HOT, check the news, HOT, HOT, HOT, brows some forums, WIN.
Seriously, resto druid heals is pretty laid back, since I can just throw out four spells, sit back and just watch things unfold, and that's it.
I'm kinda looking forward to healing ICC25, if he's geared enough. IF anyone who regularly runs ICC could check him out (Thadorius linked in an earlier post of mine) and let me know just how horribly undergeared I am that would be cool XD
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 28 Jan 2010, 20:34
Doable but... it might get a little painful. Opt for raid healing of course, but stay on your toes. My friend, 10 man raid healer and the guilds resto druid - http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Boulderfist&cn=Tykoh is overgeared to fuck but sometimes it's as much on the raid as it is on you to keep people alive but then again I love tree + disc priest for 10 mans, then warrior and pala tanks is pretty much just sick.

Oh, almost forgot... HC juggs mofo so + skeleton key = 44.5khp UB on a warrior tank without missing a single socket bonus. If I was a paladin stam scaling would mean more like 49khp UB :/
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 29 Jan 2010, 05:28
This wednesday we did festergut with 2 healers. Me (resto druid) and a disc priest. This was a walk in the park last time cus then we had a paladin tank. But this time we had three warrior (two tanks and one furry) and no paladin.
When you have 2 healers on that fight and no judgement of light this fight is fucking intence, no time for snacks. I did around 7 hps and the disc priest did 4k and we kept wiping on silly things like when people were running back in to melee after delivering spores they got the sicknes and made veryone, inkluding healers to puke, or the boss just turned around and applied a tenth debuff on the tank even tho he was doing nothing, or lag, or messup in the oshit switching...
So just to eas it up we take in a retri pala (an alt to someone) and suddenly it's silly easy. So when the boss is at 600k hp my phone rings, my work phone, and I have to answer since I'm on call, and we promptly wipe.

But I'm so god damn tired of my server. Kazzak in missery. Any latensy under 200 is a miracle and a day without lag in raid is unheard of. Time to migrate away in my opinion.

My little hero: http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Kazzak&cn=St%C3%BCrm
He got a new helm that isn't gemed and enchanted yet though.


Oh and Warriors QQ about Paladins make me ^_^ .
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 29 Jan 2010, 06:23
Wasn't Q_Q I wouldn't give up being a warrior to reroll paladin or anything, the game needs paladin tanks I was just commenting on how people judge tanks by health pool.

If you are talking about 10 man, don't you always use 2 healers? depending on the fight sometimes our priest goes shadow for a resto druid to heal solo.

My first guild would do 25 mans with 8-9 healers and 10 mans with 3-4, it is stupid though but assuming from your gear you are in a solely 10 man guild, is it just 10 regulars or what?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 29 Jan 2010, 12:19
Paladins are pretty much objectively the best class in the game, really.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 29 Jan 2010, 12:22
We sometimes run with 7 of them. SEVEN.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 29 Jan 2010, 13:33
Sorry clockwork in that case.
How many healers depends on the fight mostly, and whos online.
You run with 7 paladins in one raid? O_o
We mostly don't run with any paladin.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 29 Jan 2010, 13:54
Not having any paladins is waaaaay crazier than having seven, although admittedly we usually run "only" 5. Basically, we have 2 full time tanks, 2 full time ret paladins, and a full time holy paladin. The other two are a guy who can go heals or dps and another guy who is our third tank for some fights and can also go ret if need be. All of them can respec and at least have the gear to anchor a ToGC group as their "off" spec as well. Seriously, the notion that being a hybrid doesn't have inherent advantages is complete BS at this point. We run 4 ICC-10 groups a week and without the pallies and druids being able to spec swap we'd be completely fucked from a raid comp standpoint. Pretty much everyone in the guild has created a paladin or druid alt these days. It's honestly kind of laughable how few pure classes you'll find here, and I suspect it's in part due to being a young server. Unless you've been attached to your "main" for a year or two, nobody really seems to see much reason to roll a pure over a hybrid. If nothing else you can at least pull off that cheesy bullshit where you sign up as being able to both tank or heal when getting into the heroic daily queue when in reality you're just hoping you can sleaze into a dps slot.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 29 Jan 2010, 18:14
Doing ulduar drake run, one guy came in with no achies and now we are on Yogg. Yeah paladins are sick, I would not raid without one. BoK is reason enough, it's the mose useful buff in the game, ever moreso than heroism/bloodlust.

[Edit] Woo! another insanity run and I got a neat axe for offspec/pvp fromt the chest, and also the wolf mount yaaaay!

[Edit] Woo! Yogg+1 down so 310% speed drakes for everyone!

[Edit] New patch... meh.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 05 Feb 2010, 05:33
I got my Quel'Delar, Lens of the Mind. I'm a happy mage.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 05 Feb 2010, 07:45
Sold mine battered hilt, made the rite choice.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 05 Feb 2010, 10:43
I have a few guildies that got hilts, used them for the achievement and then immediately trashed the blade, which is kinda funny. Personally, I'd sell the damn thing in a heartbeat.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 06 Feb 2010, 17:10
What's so bad about the sword?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 06 Feb 2010, 17:37
Nothing. Quel'Delar is very good for its item level; the dps sword version is actually ever so slightly better than the axe I currently use as a combat rogue due to its slow speed, although it has nothing on my daggers. I just find it funny that my guildies are rolling in 258+ gear to the point that they'd rather just have "The Sword in the Skull" achievement rather than just sell the damned thing or wield it.

Basically, me and Clockwork would rather be set for raid materials for ages than achieve whore to the tune of 10 points.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 06 Feb 2010, 17:53
Glyphing cleave is a good thing, your gems look like they always did (arp arp arp expertise crit).


Also, wait, whaaaaat? I know this was from ages ago, but remember that I went from mutilate to combat because the warrior forced us to get someone else to bring Savage Combat. Mutilate doesn't use armor penetration if there's an equal item level alternative that avoids hitting caps. As mutilate, poison damage beats out physical damage to the point that you can start putting your fastest weapon mainhand with deadly poisons and keep the slow weapon in your offhand so that you can get an extra deadly poison proc off of Envenom. I didn't even take the Opportunity talent (20% increased Mutilate damage) anymore because it wasn't worth having that instead of talents that can increase your total number of Envenoms. When I say I gemmed everything, I mean I gemmed everything. I changed 7 gear slots and went from using exclusively AP and Haste-AP gems to using a mix of ArPen, Exp-Hit, agi-hit and a couple of lonely slots that still used AP-Haste. Unfortunately for me, those lone spots were on new pieces of gear, so I had to get new gems anyway.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: philharmonic on 17 Feb 2010, 17:45
Hey Y'all.
Long time no post.

Perhaps i should go back and read this tread over again but because I'm feeling kinda slackerish imma do this instead.
I started a Drainai Shaman who i've called Samitehshami on Borean Tundra.
I was thinking of putting her talents into resto but elemental looks cool too. What to do?
Start farming the gold for dual talent?!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: BeoPuppy on 18 Feb 2010, 03:01
Hey, quick question: What do people here think of the world events such as Love Is In the Air and all those others?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: philharmonic on 18 Feb 2010, 06:47
I dont care much for the valentines schtick (love in the air) but so far I've enjoyed the Brewfest, Christmas and Lunar New Years stuff. Tell me you like my dress teehee.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: BeoPuppy on 18 Feb 2010, 07:30
I notice that some people find the whole achievement thing pressuring. And then it sort of becomes work ...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 18 Feb 2010, 08:25
so i have no idea what happened to my battle.net account.
 :|
not that i really have much time for wow, but hey it would be nice to do a raid or two here and there and continue to achievement whore.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 Feb 2010, 08:42
I killed that Direbrew guy once and never bothered to turn in the quest. Not really one for achievements. I kinda lay low during events because I'd rather not get hassled by people who need to finish them all the time. I kinda dislike them.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 18 Feb 2010, 15:38
I hate seasonal events.

In other news, I love the new arena season. Cracked 2200 on the shaman this week, and should get it on the warrior as well before tuesday.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 18 Feb 2010, 16:17
I love the seasonal events! It gives me something to do. When I'm not raiding I'm just stuffing about doing a whole lot of nothing and endlessly running random heroics for no good reason. The seasonal events are fun, and besides, I want the violet proto (I only need the rest of the Lunar ones, Noble Garden and Midsummer).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 19 Feb 2010, 01:11
My Violet proto drake might tell you what I think about seasonals :/ Just glad I never have to do any of them again (Will still be using rusted proto drake though, looks cooler).

Also I got a new sword to tank with that actually has defensive stats on it! This is the first ilv upgrade of tanking sword since I went from broken promise (naxx25) to Titanguard (Uld25) which was fucking ages ago since I got it second week of ulduar being released.

Ladies and gentlemen, the facelifter.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 19 Feb 2010, 07:55
wtf i just checked armory and all my toons are gone.
i am ANGRY. i had so many achievements and rare pets on my main even though i haven't reached 80. and the noble title. and some t5/t6 gear.
/headdesk
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 19 Feb 2010, 08:03
Why are they gone??
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 19 Feb 2010, 08:19
Hax?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 19 Feb 2010, 08:25
no, alex.
saying hax is giving this person too much credit because he is incompetent at everything other than wow and couldn't hack his way into anything he didn't have the password to. but hey i know a lady who actually works for blizzard. i will contact her, but she's probably way busy testing cata and cannot help me with my silly lack of achievements and amani bear mount.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 21 Feb 2010, 04:54
lol bryntroll.

Guess I gotta go arms in arena for 3's.

ATM since guild disbanded so we remade one but only really blast through 10 mans, I will just raid in the pvprot spec I use for 2's and 5's then go arms for 3's.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 28 Feb 2010, 12:28
omfg my account might getting restored soon.
sup lan parties with girls i knew back in middle school. yayyyyy!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 11 Mar 2010, 13:46
Finally got a guild going again, is compilation of 3 good guilds, currently wiping on Syndragosa 25 bleh.

Oh, and I am nicely geared. All 25 man ICC apart from heroic juggs, heroic toc25 chest, icc10 sword and heroic 10 man ToC shield :(

just over 46k hp unbuffed, hit capped expertise softcapped and crit immune. Just like at the end of Naxx/start of ulduar except 16k more hp :)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 11 Mar 2010, 14:33
Sindragosa is a douche bag.

I'm stoked because I finally got a Heroic Frost Giant's Cleaver after weeks of Saurfang refusing to drop god damn sword.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 11 Mar 2010, 15:06
Sindragosa is the worst fight in the game at the moment. Finally a fight I hate more than Zul'jin phase 3 and Tidewalker. ICC has been a major disappointment in my opinion. There are a few entertaining fights (Putricide, Dreamwalker, Rotface, BQL) but other than that it's just boring.

On the plus side, I do have 2400 3v3 teams on my warrior and shaman. Whoo.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 11 Mar 2010, 15:45
We downed Putricide last  night in 10man! Our guild has two 10man teams, and for my team, this is progression. We had him down to 3k before the tanks died and he healed, then we wiped. We got him down on our final try for the night. There was a lot of "FUCK YES" being shouted over vent. We did really good. We can get 6/7 bosses down in one three hour sitting, so we're going to try and do all of the ones we did this week, and whack at Sindragosa for three hours on our second raid night next week. Hopefully we can do it, we've been doing really well.

Picked up my 4set t10, two of which are Sanctified. My mage is now rather nicely geared and puts out some kick ass dps.

I will be so pleased when I get my t10 helm, it looks rockin'.

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Caelestrasz&cn=Ayniah
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 11 Mar 2010, 17:09
Sindragosa is the worst fight in the game at the moment.

I think I might hate the LK worse, but Sindragosa annoys me in such a similar manner that it's kind of a toss up. Arthas has the most mind numbingly long/boring Phase 1 I've seen in a while. The only people who might face a challenge in Phase 1 are the tanks and healers, but a couple pally tanks and a good Disc Priest largely trivializes even that. This is followed up by Phase 2, which is a pretty nasty stopper. So, basically, our early LK failures have generally looked like this:

1. Buffs/Preparation/finger pointing. This might take just short of forever.
2. Nearly a full minute of lore bullshit that will get REAL fucking old by the end of the night.
3. A few minutes of boring tank 'n' spank and light add management.
4. 1 minute of phase transition. You're probably still bored at this point, but hey, at least it means Phase 1 is over.
5. Phase 2! Life gets interesting... for about 20 seconds. That's because Defile has two settings: Harmless and Wiping The Raid Because Someone Tunnel Visioned. Go to step 1.

Sindragosa is pretty much the same way. Couple attrition phases, phase 3, wipe, wash, rinse repeat.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 11 Mar 2010, 17:40
Only problem with ICC is the amount I have not been able to raid it either due to not being in a guild or sitting out for another tank. Just glah I geared up relatively quickly.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 12 Mar 2010, 06:43
BETRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYYS YOU
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 12 Mar 2010, 09:34
I have to admit that's a potent argument.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 13 Mar 2010, 09:43
/jealous of people who have tried LK encounter.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 13 Mar 2010, 21:39
Don't be.

It's dull and disappointing.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 14 Mar 2010, 11:38
Yeh but I at least want a shot at it, this whole "not being able to get 10 friends on more than 1 night a week so 10 man progress is shit" is doing my tits in.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 14 Mar 2010, 22:35
BTW, when we downed LK in 10 man (server first), we only had 1 ranged DPS. We killed 10 man Heroic Blood Princes this way as well. Basically, we're idiots, but we're really, really fuckin' good idiots, all things considered.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 14 Mar 2010, 22:37
Of course, it does suck that there's no way we could actually get all the achievements with such a group. Bring the player not the class my fuckin' ass.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 14 Mar 2010, 23:05
I have no doubts the 10 of us that raid as a team could become kingslayers in a lockout, but getting us on more than 1 night a week is just not happening.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 14 Mar 2010, 23:09
Yeah, I'm certiain we could have gotten it earlier too but my motherboard kinda died and I was out of action for a few weeks.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 22 Mar 2010, 19:32
Also, more evidence that pallies are probably the best class right now: We roll with 4 of them in our 10 man and only scheduling has kept us from getting farther in heroic ICC10. Any synergy we lose by pally stacking in this case is easily made up by the ability to chain Divine Sacrifice in high damage phases and zerg everything to death with our melee heavy group.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 23 Mar 2010, 10:11
Still with a higher stam multiplier in 3.3.3 they Q_Q about warriors health.

Fuck that class.

Maybe because the dude who tanks with me is a pally tank and a shitcunt.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 23 Mar 2010, 17:00
The things I am most excited about with the new path? The new vanity pet from the toy shop in dal and that the engineering pets are no longer bind on pickup.

WOO!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 23 Mar 2010, 18:39
Maybe because the dude who tanks with me is a pally tank and a shitcunt.

That's too bad, most of the prot paladins I know are pretty open about their OP-ness. For example, our primary offtank (Flynn) passes on everything and wears tons of gear that is sub-optimal from a survivability standpoint, but it doesn't matter because he is probably the best overall WoW player I know and because his class is inherently rather broken atm. He often uses outdated block value gear with strength gems, dps trinkets and an agility DPS axe mainhand and it doesn't matter because he never dies while putting out a surprising amount of DPS (the fact that he mixes tier 9 and tier 10 setpiece bonuses also contributes here). For example, I don't even bother using tranq poisons during the 10 man LK encounter when he tanks the big adds because Flynn can just mitigate away an Enraged shockwave and even if two adds enrage on him he'll just stun one of them anyway. Tankspot says those guys are supposed to be able to nearly one shot people, but apparently Flynn never got the memo.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 23 Mar 2010, 21:40
Flyn is a mage name. Silly paladin.

The dude is someone I know in meatlife, he knows his class is OP but plays the class like he is still doing Ulduar, un-hitcapped, low dodge/block/parry, low armour and is a moron in raids.

Who would you rather have tanking?

http://eu.blizzard.com/maintenance.htm?r=Boulderfist&n=Melville
http://eu.blizzard.com/maintenance.htm?r=Boulderfist&n=Kuruado

Also with this patch I can honestly say...

FUCK ROGUES FUCK SHADOWPRIESTS FUCK HUNTERS FUCK OTHER WARRIORS.

Rogue/Shadowpriest will already beat any warrior comp in 2's and hunters kite like all the time with minimal effort. Why make counter comps counter even harder?

All these classes have at least 1 way already to negate a bladestorm, evasion/turn into a cloud/spinny pointy things round the hunter where you need to /cancelaura bladestorm then overpower spam the shit out of them because they keep dodging.

TSG will die.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 23 Mar 2010, 22:13
Ha, the funniest part is that his gear setup is like, the exact opposite of Flynn's gear style. Flynn is a hardcore avoidance and mitigation tank. He's got stuff in his bags for fights that favor raw health, but as long as he doesn't need to worry about going down in a GCD he stacks avoidance and relies on stacking as much armor as he can for his survivability.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 24 Mar 2010, 10:17
That's the thing, that was Kuru's reputation of stacking avoidance and mitigation. I do this along with staying hit and expertise (soft)capped but still have an asston of EH. Having a blockset or unhittable set is useless in ICC now anyways :( I just got unhittable at the end of TotGC too.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 24 Mar 2010, 11:52
Well, actually, he doesn't run with a single piece of block rating gear, so it's not like he's crazy enough to be using the Anub set for everything. He just has passed on several pieces of gear in favor of using things like the tier 9 helm and legs since they're a couple of weird pieces that happen to give block value with no block rating. So those two pieces alone net him 480 shield block value, 5% increased Hammer of the Righteous damage and nearly a third of his hit rating (he's a draenei so he can always factor the aura in. Besides, what kind of idiot wouldn't give the tank a draenei if they needed it?). If you're going to make a concession to threat and damage in your gear, that's a pretty decent place to do it. Plus, it was a bit disingenuous of me to say that he passes on everything considering that he was rolling in 258 gear even when we first entered ICC. He kinda takes the attitude that he outgears all current content short of 25 man heroic, and since I can't remember him ever causing a wipe, it's rather hard to argue the point.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 24 Mar 2010, 22:41
Only thing I needed from 10 man ICC when it came out was a mainhand. I was fully ToGC geared so I know how he feels, it's not fun shitting on every encounter knowing you won't get anything usable from it and it's gonna get DE'd.

Quit my guild, sick of arena, can't be fucked.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 24 Mar 2010, 23:04
I hear ya. I didn't bother using much ICC gear until I was stuck moving to combat to bring raid buffs. My current ICC set was actually a slight downgrade from my 258 mutilate set until very recently.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 25 Mar 2010, 20:46
Zomg, rupture is back.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 26 Mar 2010, 00:44
Along with pvprot.

I SHIT ON MELEE AND CLASSES WITH AUTOATTACKING PETS HAHAHAHAHA.

Revenge. lol.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: yellowfoliage on 26 Mar 2010, 06:45
The things I am most excited about with the new path? The new vanity pet from the toy shop in dal and that the engineering pets are no longer bind on pickup.

WOO!

Wait what? I can stop fucking running Gnomer and just buy my Bombling? Blizzard, you know just how to make me feel special!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: The extra letter on 27 Mar 2010, 02:48
I started playing WoW again after a year or so's absence in December.

It's the addiction I just can't kick.

Anyone else on Boulderfist?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 27 Mar 2010, 09:33
um, guys lan party? i has no cata but gotta rep the fury warriors.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 27 Mar 2010, 12:06
I love sunder bitches warriors.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 20 jazz funk greats on 27 Mar 2010, 12:17
and i love stackin' sunders and pwning the noobs.
sometimes i let them win so they don't have a hysterical qqfest about it and beg for rematches.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 28 Mar 2010, 10:59
Anyone else on Boulderfist?

Yes.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 28 Mar 2010, 19:25
I hate it when really nice people are really bad players. I always end up being the buffer in these situations.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 30 Mar 2010, 09:06
Two of my friends decided to start playing WoW, so I reactivated my account now that I have someone to play with. I think I may level up a class I haven't played yet. I like being a hybrid, so maybe I'll make a shaman, but a mage sounds good too. Hmm.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 30 Mar 2010, 17:33
Being a mage is ridiculously fun. So easy to level as frost and you can make your own water and food. Easy enough to gear and if you're good you can push out ridiculous amounts of dps at high end.

I love love love love my magey.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: BeoPuppy on 31 Mar 2010, 04:02
Maybe druid for versatility? Depending on your preference you can heal, tank and dps ...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 31 Mar 2010, 04:22
Hunter or shaman. Then you can does beastcleave fun in arena.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 31 Mar 2010, 05:49
Beastcleave is an abomination, speak not its name here.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 31 Mar 2010, 08:42
I already have a lvl 80 druid, which is why I'm used to being a hybrid, so I don't want/need another one. And I don't care much for PvP, so that doesn't matter too much to me. PvE is actually where I have the most fun, so I like being able to heal myself. But mages never have to buy food or water, which is awesome. And the dps is crazy good. But shaman aren't squishy. I don't know. I need to figure out what my friends are playing and base my choice off of that. I know one made a druid, but I don't know what his gf made. If she made a char that can heal or take a beating, I'm going with mage, otherwise I'll probably go with shaman.

Actually, if I end up liking this server, I'll probably just move my druid over there (unless it's PvP, then I can't). Only one person I know still plays on Feathermoon, so I don't really have any reason to stay on it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 31 Mar 2010, 15:11
Fair warning, I love my shaman to pvp with (they're very active in pvp, tons to do), but I get bored to tears with the class in pve. I've never had a mage so I can't speak to their pve fun level, but it seems like lots and lots of 2 button arcane blast/arcane missile rotations.

I'd get yourself a priest or a warlock.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 31 Mar 2010, 15:54
This criticism isn't really aimed at Dazed in particular, but I do think people should be a bit more careful about characterizing rogues and mages as two button classes. It's perhaps somewhat true of our rotations, but we have so many useful mobility tricks and get out of jail free cards that our rotations are actually a relatively small part of how one rogue/mage outperforms another. Played properly, rogues and mages use that simplicity to keep up on dps while using the stuff that makes our classes unique, like abusing vanish/Invisibility/ice block to immune special attacks or to sprint/blink/feint/cloak/killing spree through stuff the other classes have to dance around all day.

For example, once you factor in poisons, over 50% of my damage comes from auto attacks and their associated procs (note that this is somewhat misleading though due to how dependent rogues are upon maintaining Slice and Dice (http://www.wowwiki.com/Slice_and_Dice) through combo points). That doesn't however, mean that rogues will always beat out other melee classes due to raw simplicity. The fact that our damage is so tied to auto attacks means that we lose out on comparatively more dps than say, a ret paladin or a warrior does in situations with constant target switching and travel time. Fury warriors, for example, can keep pretty happy simply by being in position to whirlwind every cooldown. By contrast, my most powerful special attacks are effectively sinister strike and a self-buff that only aids my auto-attacks. This means that for rogues perhaps more than any other melee class, time on target> all. For example, sometimes I do things like keeping my Killing Spree available to use as a ghetto shadowstep as opposed to just burning it on cooldown like a spreadsheet might tell you to do. So, while newbs and mut rogues may keep up with me on say, Saurfang, I tend to absolutely destroy them in terms of total damage done on fights like Sindragosa, Lich King, Rotface, and Blood Princes Hard mode. AKA, the shit that's actually hard enough to matter.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 31 Mar 2010, 17:07
I've never seen a mage only use two attacks when fighting, but I don't remember many low level experiences with them, either. And I already have a priest alt that's ok, but I've never really been interested in playing a warlock. (Not hating on warlocks, I like playing with them.) I'm leveling up both a shaman and a mage, so I'll go with whichever one I'm having more fun with.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 31 Mar 2010, 17:49
At high end raiding, they honestly do get the vast majority of their damage out of AB and Abar since Arcane spec is real dominant with current gear and talents. Mages do other stuff to stay alive in the meantime, of course, since there's adds and raid damage flying around, but the ideal situation for an arc mage is admittedly pretty boring: Hunker down somewhere safe so your cast bar is no longer an impediment and stack cooldowns/pew pew until people asplode. That's a big reason why blizzard tries to keep fights where you can just spot up all the time somewhat rare. The game turns into the world's easiest guitar hero track otherwise, especially for mages and rogues. Like I said though, there's a lot of neat tricks you can pull in regards to movement that can keep life interesting.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 01 Apr 2010, 04:04
Doesn't really matter how many spells you use in arena/pvp. It's all about how you use them, and thats only like 30% of it, the other 70% is communication, LoS, knowing your opponents class, predicting what is gonna happen next.

Dragonslaying yeah, it's alot more linear. 112112112*proc*34112112*move from fire*112112112112*swap target*112112112112 /roll

Oh, and prepare to get tunneled to fuck if you arena as arcane even over the likes of priests as you are THE glass cannons of arena. But you do have alot of nice gib up your wizard sleeves, orange marmalade style.

Most people just go frost and kite people wearing them down but I assume you know this.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 03 Apr 2010, 07:13
I'd forgotten how much fun it is to just run around with friends and level up in this game! Totally different from what I had been doing. So our party has 4 people right now: a shaman (me), a mage, a druid, and a priest. I forget what our 5th friend started, but whatever it is, we've got a nicely rounded out group and I think it was accidental minus my choice. The only time anyone got past injured was when I jumped to my death in the Great Forge to amuse one of them. (They asked what happens if you jump down there, so I showed them.) So yay! And I think a 6th may join us if he lets me send him a scroll of resurrection.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jace on 04 Apr 2010, 17:21
Using a trial account to see if I can play WoW with the wireless network I am on, might start playing again, if it works. If not, oh well I guess I'll do other stuff instead.

Do you even play the game anymore, or just update it for hours on end?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 04 Apr 2010, 18:08
Yeah that's all it is now. And yet people still theorycraft to try to maximize their download rate.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jace on 04 Apr 2010, 18:28
Well, looks like I can't play because of the wireless after all. Oh well.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 05 Apr 2010, 23:16
Okay, as a raiding mage here's my opinion.

Typical arcane spec is usually a two button rotation, popping your cd's (Icy Veins, Mirror Image (oh boy t10 4set bonus is off the chain), Arcane Power (or whatever it's called)) at the start of the fight or depending when hero is popped, pop them then.

I stretch my rotation, Arcane Blastx5 (instead of 4, or until it procs), AM and then Arcane Barrage. My mage was sitting on 30k mana last night and it was NOT ENOUGH. If a druid has an innervate that is spare and not going to a healer, I'll take it. Mana management and popping mana gems/evocation and whatever the hell else I can to control it is a huge part of raiding as a mage. If you start wanding in a boss fight, there is a problem. It shouldn't happen. Ever.

Mages are not just a two button class. The rotation is easy, sure, but there's always other shit going on that you have to pay attention to and knowing the arcane spec and those rotations inside out makes it so much more fun than just spamming 111123111123111123 over and over and over *faceroll*.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 06 Apr 2010, 15:08
9.1k MS crit on a rogue in arena at 1700 rating.

FEELS GOOD MAN.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 06 Apr 2010, 16:00
I wish rogues could actually deal burst damage worth mentioning in arenas. I know our pressure is fine and all, but for the most part we're really just kinda brought along for our control options. It works out in our favor more often than not, I suppose, it just kinda bums me out because when I started playing WoW way back in the day it wasn't really the stuns and blind that I picked them for. Oh well.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 06 Apr 2010, 16:14
Well, basically, I'll sum up a giant post I made on the official pvp forums in a thread which apparently got deleted.

Rogues are a stupidly imbalanced class in PvP. When I say imbalanced, I don't mean overpowered, I mean they've been pretty much relegated to a zerg class because of the nature of their cooldowns. Every rogue in high-rated (2200+) arena pretty much runs the same style of comps and plays more or less the same way: they sap 1 guy, then blow every cooldown they have in the first 3 minutes of a match and try to zerg down/lock down one of the others as quickly as possible. And they're really really good at it, which is a problem. For my warrior's team, a rogue is untouchable until he's out of evasions and a cloak/vanish. So, when combined with other high-pressure/control teammates, rogues are stupidly powerful in the opening of a match.

And then once they're out of cooldowns, they die hilariously fast. Faster than anyone except a dispel-spammed mage, basically. There is no middleground for them, and it's stupid, and makes them a stupid, imbalanced class as far as pvp goes.

P.S. I killed a rogue at 2400 with a 10.5k revenge, sup.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 06 Apr 2010, 16:45
Preach.

Honestly, my rogue has two settings: Untouchable and dead.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 06 Apr 2010, 19:38
Jesus Christ, between the Lord Marrowgar weekly and the 10% Wrynn buff ICC general just turned into trade chat.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 06 Apr 2010, 19:44
Yeah, I'm hoping that I'll be in on one of the guild ICC runs this week and can get the weekly done. My boyfriend tried to PUG it yesterday and spent three hours with failed groups. It's not a hard fight, people just don't know what they are doing.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 06 Apr 2010, 22:19
I wish we had Marrowgar for the weekly. We've had non-stop Ulduar weeklies for at least the past month.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 06 Apr 2010, 22:23
My guild extended our lockout this week though, so fat lot of good it does me. On the upside, I just use emblems for easy money now anyway.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 07 Apr 2010, 08:13
imp revenge is dumb with enough arp, I just liked a few moments in 5's last nite where people with 4pt10 and wrathful offset got 6k heroic strike critted with a 7.5k MS crit in the first global then execute actually killing someone.

Shit when overpower procs and you try to UA a flash heal but it crits and kills them instead :( I rarely skillstorm a healer without ms and ua up and they are under half hp, it's just wasting a cd that could be used to eat a lock and an ele sham at the same time.
 
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 16 Apr 2010, 06:33
SPARKLEPONY!!

http://us.blizzard.com/store/details.xml?id=1100000942
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 16 Apr 2010, 07:49
Day it was released, Boulderfist, a REALLY low pop realm, 22:00 server time dalaran there is 11 people with this mount.

Seriously how much have blizz made on this, it's microtransactions bringing in the money the dwindling fewer subscriptions aren't bringing in.

It's easier to bring in a piece of easy to get loot that looks pretty for a sum of money than it is to encourage people to stick in at the game by bringing out tiers of new content and stuff to keep them interested.

Even recruit a friend, you seen the new rocket mount you get for that? I am gonna multibox a few 60's just to get it the same way I got the stripey horned horse except this time it's a 2 seater rocket I can ride as fast as my 310% drake.

Fuck winged sparkle ponies. Rocket inc.

Oh and as for rogues, 900 resilience on plate I get a 6k envenom crit? Fuck rogues. Fuck shadowpriests too.

Warrior pala vs spriest rogue it's an instant loss, a priest that takes that little damage, can shield and mana burn better than a disc priest while keeping up pressure from dots? And a rogue who can vanish of I don't switch to him every 20 seconds to refresh rend?

I did amuse my new partner when I bladestormed the rogue in a rdruid/rogue match by yelling "DON'T DISMANTLE YOU ARE TOO BAD YOU GONNA GET STORMED" while he ate 5 whirlwinds then died but somehow I got dismantled and he died from a rend tick so I punched his tree.

GOOD TIMES YO.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 16 Apr 2010, 14:59
Envenom ignores armor. Deal with it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 16 Apr 2010, 20:22
SPARKLEPONY!!

http://us.blizzard.com/store/details.xml?id=1100000942

I saw these today all over Stormwind, they're awesome! But I do not want to pay real money for it. Sigh.

I did my first random dungeon today and I visited Dalaran because I realized I had emblems and holy crap, why are there so many types of emblems? It makes things kind of annoying.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 16 Apr 2010, 21:01
Only ones you have to worry about now are Triumph, Frost and Heroism. Heroism because that's what you trade shit down to to get the BtA gear and gems and whatever. The rest you can kind of just ignore.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 17 Apr 2010, 06:25
I forget which two I had, but I converted them to one and spent them all on a trinket because I was too confused. But that is good to know, I'll keep that in mind. I haven't thought about badges since BC, so I'm going to have to read up on these.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Tyler on 17 Apr 2010, 07:52
So I am trying to get rid of my wow account(s) and figured I would check here if anyone knew potential buyers for accounts with lots and lots of achievements and mounts and other fun things, but no ICC gear. Unfortunately I quit the game in my offspec gear, so once I re-up the armory will look a bit better: http://www.mywowarmory.com/profile.php?id=195197.

Anyhow mounts include: Rusted, Ironbound, Violet, Red, Plagued Protos, Amani Warbear, Raven Lord, Rivendares Charger, Swift White Hawkstrider, Great Brewfest Kodo, Chopper, All non-black mammoths (Over 100 in total)
Over 80 pets as well. 33 titles including Celestial Defender, Starcaller, and Astral Walker. Over 9400 Achieve pts. Also has a Warrior, DK, and Priest 80s. Secondary acct on the battlenet also has an 80 druid.

Shoot me a msg on here or AIM (teresias216) if you know anyone interested
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 17 Apr 2010, 07:56
Tyler, I am glad you quit playing, because that shit is insane.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 17 Apr 2010, 08:38
Envenom ignores armor. Deal with it.
Resilience too? Wow.

Hh and it's 947res I had on at the time, I swap between a pve and wrathful cloak depending on whether I think I will need survuval or moar arp.

1k res is overkill for my rating atm >.>
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 17 Apr 2010, 11:16
You say that is if our other abilities hit super hard. Envenom is for all intents and purposes a point blank spell that requires 5 combo points and full poison stacks on the target in order to be worth a damn. If it didn't hit hard it would be an insult. Other than that though, you do have my sympathy. Hard counters suck. Anyway, if anything needs nerfing about arena rogues I wouldn't say its our damage. Our damage is really just the final insult on top of everything else we can do.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 17 Apr 2010, 16:31
Crippling poison makes a mockery of hamstring, wound poison makes MS a joke as it lasts 5 seconds longer.

I just don't like being hit that hard, it makes me butthurt.

Shadowpriest comp's in general tear me a new one and I do not like it, it makes me feel like I am shitter than I actually am.

Edit:
http://www.warcraftmovies.com/movieview.php?id=146009

Other names for sparklepony/trh/celestial steed - JTDH (Join the dots horse), TGH (The gay horse(Apparantly the universal name for it on Kazzak-EU)), My little pony, waste of money, that fucking horse.

Post more names you heard it called.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 17 Apr 2010, 22:39
I think I'll stick with sparklepony, personally.

Also, man, I wish people would quit using gearscore. I was one of the first people on my server with a GS over 6k (I only know this because people told me like a MILLION fucking times) and for a while people just would not leave me alone. Shit like that is why I quit tanking back in vanilla.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: BeoPuppy on 18 Apr 2010, 17:26
Gearscore is a plague. I hate it. Right now it doesn't matter if you can play your class as long as your GS is high enough. It's a pain to get into raids.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 Apr 2010, 18:04
Yeah, there simply isn't much real upside to it outside of epeen. Gearscore often results in people like me getting asked to do shit we don't want/need to do while people who could use the content are turned down despite often being pretty nicely geared. I understand the impetus behind it and I could see how a REALLY sad number might be a good cut off point, but frankly, I don't mind carrying people once in a while as long as they're hitting some approximation of their gear's maximum potential.


Well, unless you're in my guild. My guild really needs to quit sucking lately and I'm tired of carrying some people. I've taken over main assist duties and it's made the valks+defile phase of the Lich King fight go WAAAAAY smoother. This is both gratifying and REALLY annoying, since the LK fight is the sort of content where it should be blindingly obvious who you should be pew pewing.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 18 Apr 2010, 18:56
Everytime I load into a random heroic on my shaman and someone goes OMG LOL 6K GEARSCORE WOW it makes me sigh to myself.

My shaman has 1 piece of PvE gear, sanctified resto legs from VoA25. The rest is all Wrathful PvP gear, which is more than good enough to smash heroics to bits, but still. People start worshiping a number before even looking to see if my gear is at all suited for the task at hand.

EDIT: I also name/sex-changed my shaman because the name annoyed me and male draeni are hideous. Great success. And I got arena master today, finally bothered enough to grind out the 2s achievement, hunter/shaman is hell.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 18 Apr 2010, 22:18
I did a heroic with the gear I was putting together for dedicated insanity totgc10 so like, 5/5 t9.2 and the rest totgc10 gear, and a normal toc10 belt/wep etc. and the lock said "Nice tanking" I thought he was being facetious but he said he was impressed at my threat because he had not specc'ed for reduced threat.

I never get told that with 6100gs because people just assume you are gonna be a beast.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 18 Apr 2010, 22:31
I'm having that problem now. Getting into pug runs is not a problem with my GS (5.6K btw and I've never seen a mage at 6k on my server yet, but I am sure there must be some), but my friend (who is one of the top disc. priests on the server) is trying to get me into the guild he's in. This guild told me that they'd take me as a casual/friend member a few weeks ago. But to raid with them, they want to see a higher GS. I push out great dps, I'm raid aware and yet somehow me having a 6k GS is going to make me better.

Hopefully I can jump into one of their GKP runs and show them that I am as good as my friend keeps telling them I am.

I mean, I understand their requirements for highly geared people (they're the third best alliance guild on the server, and obviously want to continue their good performance), but it's not like I'm sitting here in bad gear and have no idea what's going on in raid fights. Blergh.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 Apr 2010, 23:44
They must be pretty stacked with raiders or something to be very worried about 5.6k; that's not exactly a slacker GS, at least not for a caster, at any rate, particularly with how weird your trinket options are.. Maghia's Misguided Quill (http://www.wowhead.com/item=50357) gives me headaches just looking at it. Now, I'm no expert on casters, but just how in the hell is someone supposed to gear around all that hit? It's kinda disheartening how many casters I see using "legacy" trinkets; apparently you really need to get Reign or Muradin's Spyglass to get up to genuine, honest to god upgrades, and those things don't have the best drop rates.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: BeoPuppy on 19 Apr 2010, 01:40
Hey , I use that trinket! ... and I 'm loving it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 19 Apr 2010, 04:15
Apparently they rotate their raiders out for progression nights to get the best team. Apparently they also have a few mages already, but my friend is still trying to get me in.

There is no way in the world I would use that trinket.

Hit was important for me.... back when I was gearing for naxx. Now? STACK HASTE MOAR HASTE GIVE ME MOAR. Hit should be at around 288 (I have way over that and it's on pretty much everything and I can't get rid of it), and haste needs to be at 800+. Reign and Muradin's Spyglass are BiS for mages. I have Muradin's, don't have Reign. I'm using some oldschool naxx haste trink instead, because everything else sucks ass.

The next upgrade I need is to get the offset t10 gloves (I lose about 60 hit and gain that back in haste), which will put me at haste threshold and drop some of my excess hit. After that, I can pretty much do whatever the hell I want as long as it doesn't involve dropping below 800 haste.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 19 Apr 2010, 10:23
Yeah, I just knew you had to have at least 1 kinda outdated trinket as a mage right now; Like I said, I know casters who are pretty geared yet still use stuff like Eye of the Broodmother, Illustration of the Dragon Soul or the Abyssal Rune because they're itemized well enough that they're competitive with their other options. ToC has really boned a lot of people as far as trinkets are concerned; a whole tiers' worth of gear crammed onto only 5 bosses. Sub-10% drop rates ftl. I never did get a Death's Verdict.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 19 Apr 2010, 11:16
Go do totgc and get some nice 258 gear, there are pugs on my server for the first 5 bosses quite regularly, and my realm is dead.

As for high gearscore, wrathful offset is available for honour, badge gloves/chest/cloak/belt are rockin' along with the craftable boots/pants and you are ez over 6k gs.

Just be swift in swapping gear sets. Or get good neck/bracers so you don't need to.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 19 Apr 2010, 12:03
Yeah, but it's not just a question of downing bosses, it's a question of RNG. Luck can be a brutal mistress and the difference between a 9% drop rate and the 14-20%+ drop rates you see in ICC ends up feeling like a lot wider of a gap in practice if the loot gods aren't smiling upon you.

Anyway though, gearscore is dumb sometimes; if it takes pvp gear or a badly itemized fool's gold trinket to get someone into thinking your PvE gear is up to date then that's a problem with the officers. I mean, Dazed and I both apparently have 6k gear scores but as he pointed out earlier you definitely want him on your arena team and me in your raids.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 19 Apr 2010, 12:37
Yeah I mean, my warrior pulls 9-10k dps in a 25 man, and has a higher gearscore in his pvp gear than pve gear.

Gearscore is awful and i want it to die blarggghhhh
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 19 Apr 2010, 14:01
Probably while wearing some leather pieces.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 19 Apr 2010, 14:08
Nah I don't wear any leather. I don't actually raid 25s with a guild, so all my gear access is from pugs. Pug raid leaders generally cave to rogue crying and are unable to understand complex arguments like "it doesn't matter that it's leather, the stat distribution makes it vastly superior to any obtainable plate."

Gearing is pretty hard to understand, herp derp.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 19 Apr 2010, 14:59
I blame arpen. It's not the arms warriors' fault that Blizz is all like "DPS plate stacks hit and expertise, ammirite?"

I mean, yeah, it sucks that I have to compete for Tossk's (http://www.wowhead.com/item=50670), but I totally understand why they give warriors a big ol' boner.

I just thank god that the Scarlet Onslaught cloak is badge gear; that move saved the wow community mass amounts of QQ.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 19 Apr 2010, 20:05
Well, really the problem is the stat distribution. Since leather usually has 5 stats (agil, stam, and ap, then 2 out of Exp, Arp, crit, hit) it has more stat points b/c of the way they weight itemization. DPS plate only ever has 4 stats (str, stam, 2 of exp, arp, crit, hit). So those stats become more expensive to budget the more of them are placed on the piece, resulting in far less stats overall than on a comparable piece of leather.

That and ARP. ARP ARP ARP ARP.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 19 Apr 2010, 20:37
Heh, agreed. The leather warriors thing has always been an issue in the past, but man, does ArPen ever throw a big ass spotlight on the issue.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 19 Apr 2010, 22:10
Okay, I've decided that whoever said that Sindragosa is the worst fight was right. We've got new people in the raid tonight and I went from no deaths to 3 deaths in 2 pulls. God, I hate that fucking dragon.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 19 Apr 2010, 22:59
That was me.


BETRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYS
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 20 Apr 2010, 22:28
Scarlet onslaught drape is my arena cloak.

Shit's da bomb yo.

And those bracers, arms warriors use em in arena if they cannot get polar bear claw bracers or don't need the hit from them.

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bonechewer&cn=Grillsmash

Even fucking int hunter mail

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Illidan&cn=Ararat


Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Ozymandias on 23 Apr 2010, 09:08
You have so many achievements.

I want to touch them.

I want to rub them.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 26 Apr 2010, 19:55
I have real mixed feelings about 10 and 25 man sharing a lockout thing. Real mixed. On the one hand, 10 mans are much easier to organize and where I have most of my fun. On the other hand, I really, really hate being a pure class in 10s. It's really an environment where having one class who just can't change how they operate is a fairly serious drawback.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 26 Apr 2010, 20:00
I'm thrilled about the change, honestly. Very, very happy. I'd been on the fence about buying cataclysm, but they got me now. They gots me.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 26 Apr 2010, 20:10
I just don't really want to reroll and that's going to be what happens if I'm doing 10s instead of 25s : (
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 27 Apr 2010, 16:44
Now that I've actually tried using dungeonfinder, I honestly hate what they did with it. I like the random thing, but what happened at seeing who was waiting to get into a dungeon? And wtf, why can't you use the LFG channel outside of cities. Is there something I'm missing or does it just suck like that?

Also, does anyone play a resto shammy? How do you like it? Also what are some good macros/addons/etc that are good for shaman? I'm playing a shammy and I'm still not sure how I like it. Maybe it's just because I'm a low level (21), but it feels so slow and not as effective as what I'm used to with my druid or even on par with the priest I'm leveling up, which is still level 10. I don't mind it as a dps, but the friends I'm playing with all made tank/dps classes, so I'm stuck with healing. (Which is ok, I don't mind healing. I just want to see how others feel about resto shammys as I've never even played with one.)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 27 Apr 2010, 18:17
I play a resto/ele shaman, but I mostly pvp with him. Resto is phenomenal for pvp healing, you have great single target and multi-target heals, albeit not as strong as a paladin's or druid's, respectively. That said, I do find resto pve to be boring as fuuuuuuuck, it largely amounts to either mashing healing waves and canceling them halfway through ( or not, this is wotlk, who actually ooms anymore) or mashing chain heal. I guess it's a bit more interactive than that in 5 mans/leveling, you can juggle totems/interrupt/assist dps or w.e, but once you hit raids it's dull.

That said I really do love shaman pvp. Love love luuuurve.

As far as addons, I like totemtimers, and I know some people swear by shaman friend, but I've never really needed it. Mousover macros are great for healing, and very simple to write. Just #showtooltip Healing Wave; /cast [target=mouseover] Healing Wave    etc etc etc.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 27 Apr 2010, 18:36
Yeah, and if you're really uncomfortable doing your own macros you can always use Clique, which is basically a li'l GUI thingy that lets you get a lot of the same sort of functionality when combined with a good raid frame setup, particularly since Shamans don't use that many different heals that terribly often-- much of the time smart shaman healing depends on the order you do things and what cds you have available as opposed to spamming tons of different spells, so it's not really that terribly hard to set most of your get your workhorse spells onto your mouse if you really want to. I personally used to use a combination of both on my druid. I find pure click casting to be a pain in the ass when spamming one target (or casting hots while on the move) and I found mouse over macros to be annoying while hotting up the raid.  Whether click casting or mouse over plus keybind macros are superior is kind of a personal taste and class question, so while I really recommend giving them each a try, I would aldo stress not letting people give you too much shit over which way you go in the end.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 27 Apr 2010, 20:55
I still have 245 bracers fml.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 27 Apr 2010, 21:57
I just always found mouseover/binding to be by far the most fluid and effective method of healing with my shaman.

Of course way back when I actually raid healed I was machine gunning brain heals at like 1.1 seconds to try to keep an entire raid alive, so flipping targets in a hurry was pretty essential.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 28 Apr 2010, 03:38
Riptide and healing wave on the tank if he take big hit then resume mashing chain heal.

wut?

BRING DA MUTHA FUCKING RUCKUS
http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Stormscale&cn=Daruckus

I moved to Stormscale and Melville was not available so I had to change my name.

Wu tang clan reference. Yeah. When I bladestorm I still do /train but instead of yelling "LOL CHOPPABLE" or "FUCK YOU WARLOCK" or "GET READY FOR SKILL" I yell "BRING DA MOTHA FUCK'N RUCKUS!" like a boss.

My DK is probs gonna be my main in WotLK, since the only thing Warriors have (MS) is gonna get changed alot so there will be very few viable comps with warriors in. :(

Also rolling a hunter. Might RaF a few hybrids too.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 28 Apr 2010, 13:30
I will have to check those out. Pretty much I'm leveling up as enhancement and healing when people need it. I doubt I'll stick with resto, because I'm leveling up a priest as well and also I've got my druid for when they get out to Northrend. My shaman has been great to solo with and does well in groups as dps, I just wasn't feeling the healing so much. But now I have the healing stream totem and another healing spell, so really, it's not as bad as it was before that. I'm just so used to HoTs (which are awesome).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 28 Apr 2010, 18:27
I just always found mouseover/binding to be by far the most fluid and effective method of healing with my shaman.

Of course way back when I actually raid healed I was machine gunning brain heals at like 1.1 seconds to try to keep an entire raid alive, so flipping targets in a hurry was pretty essential.

Yeah, like I said, I went with the hybrid approach on my druid since they use so many instant casts. I may not have keyboard turned with my druid, but I sure as hell did a lot of strafing and blindly running forward outta the fires, in which case I prefer to be able to at toss around rejuvs, lifebloom and wild growth without having to hit something on my keyboard, particularly if you have to pull off the ever annoying NS+HT/Regrowth while running outta the fire maneuver (Fuck firefighter, srsly). It helps that my mouse has 6 fairly easy to use buttons, so just casting by clicking directly on the raid frames isn't much of a drawback. Either way the game is still essentially whack-a-mole.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 28 Apr 2010, 20:23
Again, Sindragosa is such a bitch. Even her damned frost badge quest is a pain in the ass. Stupid dragon making me fly to wyrmrest.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 29 Apr 2010, 19:19
Clockwork... you is on mah servers. WTF.

Re-rolled to pally, Danibear. If I am ever online, hit me up.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 30 Apr 2010, 01:50
1,5 hour to clear 11 bosses this wednesday, with 2 wipes du to freac accidents. If we don't take LK with 15% buff now, I'm going to stop playing and start designing furniture instead.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 30 Apr 2010, 04:32
Soz spending almost all my time on tourney realm atm since I need to l2p warclock. Melee classes just are not viable when casters can get DFO and Muradin's Spyglass.

1k res? nm I got 5500sp so my dots tick for 4k.

Cy@~~
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 30 Apr 2010, 12:37
I really love how easy it is to level skinning. Only took me a few hours today to get through 200+ levels of skinning so I can be ok to skin out in Outland on my DK.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 01 May 2010, 16:56
I just thought I'd share one of my favorite things about WoW: The silly, over the top item names, and more specifically, the way my sister reacts to them (I never talked to her about the game before, really, but the South Park episode caused her to ask me if items really have names like that). So now I make it a point to tell her about any particularly egregious upgrades I get whenever we have lunch or talk on the phone, sort of like a conversational land mine-- I never say anything about the game beyond that one sentence, but every time it gets a reaction somewhere between amusement and revulsion. When I told her about how I have a spare Heaven's Fall, Kryss of a Thousand Lies, she got this look on her face like someone had managed to somehow punch her directly in the ovaries. If only I had a camera ready at the time.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 02 May 2010, 05:33
Tell her your mages are all looking for a dislodged foriegn object or some crap. Or say you spent 2 hours doing twins. So much to take ot of context.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 03 May 2010, 19:54
It's children's week! I took around an Oracles orphan and it was all d'aww. Human children are boring, draenei children are cute, Dalaran orphans are win. I'll have to do the SW and Shatt quests again on my druid so I can go after the pets I don't have.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 04 May 2010, 01:42
I did them for the pets again! I got the oracle (because I apparently didn't finish that off last year), Speedy and Peanut. I already have 'Matron' - the only event I have left until I get my violet proto is Midsummer.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 04 May 2010, 05:55
I got Egbert and Mr. Wiggles previously, so on my DK I got Speedy and Peanut and my druid got the Oracle. Later on I'll redo the other quests with my druid so I can get the rat (forget his name) and Willy. I'll have to wait until next year to get all of them on one character.

Also I just realized there's a pet store in Dalaran and you can play fetch with some of your pets. I know it's pointless, but it kind of makes non-combat pets more fun.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 04 May 2010, 10:58
I always just take the cash. I have a mimi head so it's not like I need another 310% speed mount anyway.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 06 May 2010, 20:56
Fuck, my account got hacked. There is a prompt for an authenticator code now, only I haven't bought one. All of my stuff is gone, isn't it? Blizzard's call center had like an hour long queue and I gave up after a while, took me 20 times to even get that. I emailed them, anyone have any idea how fast the turnaround is for this shit?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 06 May 2010, 22:55
Emails take like a day at the very least to get back. Your best bet is probably to stick on the phone line.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 07 May 2010, 06:03
Pretty sure you need to send them some ID too.

Authenticator ftw.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 07 May 2010, 09:32
I haven't been hacked, but I had bug issues that got resolved through email pretty quickly. But since that is a lot more major, definitely call them.

Hopefully your characters don't get deleted and just end up naked in the middle of nowhere.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 07 May 2010, 09:37
My guildmates who've been hacked didn't call in but rather used the other methods and they still typically got things sorted out in a week or two. The people I've talked to who went the phone route didn't seem to get things done appreciably faster.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 07 May 2010, 19:08
Fuck, my account got hacked. There is a prompt for an authenticator code now, only I haven't bought one. All of my stuff is gone, isn't it? Blizzard's call center had like an hour long queue and I gave up after a while, took me 20 times to even get that. I emailed them, anyone have any idea how fast the turnaround is for this shit?

This happened to my boyfriend. He rang them, they removed to authenticator and all his stuff was still there. We still have no idea exactly what happened, but they fixed it, he just called them and they reversed it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 08 May 2010, 11:26
Well, I finally got through yesterday, they removed the authenticator and I've upgraded my computer's security by quite a bit, changed all my passwords, and have access to the game again. I didn't have any 80s with items that could be sold for any huge amount, all of my characters still have their armor. My 64 mage had his inventory cleaned out but it wasn't a huge loss, and my 59 DK alt that I never play on also had his inventory wiped, is two levels higher and in Zangarmarsh with about 200 broken carapaces in his inventory, so I figure they were just using him to farm since I didn't have anything of real value to them.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Sorflakne on 10 May 2010, 00:11
Been playing since 2005, have never changed my password, and have never been hacked.

I is special?



On another note, I'm considering race-changing my warrior from human to draenei.  However, I like the armor models on humans better, and the bug that makes weapons increase in size for human females when drawn is cool too (weapons shrink when draenei draw them :-( ).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 10 May 2010, 06:07
If you are fury think long and hard about it, expertise from swords/maces or 1% hit that anyone else in your raid can bring. Also PvP if you wanna be squishy but hit like a truck stay hooman, you will just probs get tunneled a little more in arena due to having like 150 less resilience.

I would say stick hooman, spacegoats piss me off.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 10 May 2010, 13:00
Um, if you're hacked, does that affect your email? Because I can't log onto WoW and I can't log onto that email either.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 10 May 2010, 13:51
What I'm guessing happened to me was a keylogger, since I found something through my anti-malware resembling one, so I don't think it had anything to do with my email,. If they hacked your email account and got your information that way, who knows. Once I finally got a hold of their phone support it was a quick matter of them reversing everything, but if they've got your email I'd attach a different email account to your battle.net ASAP, assuming you can get through and get shit fixed by 'em.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 10 May 2010, 15:02
I sent them an email, the phone lines are really busy and have been for the past 2 hours. And I'm completely locked out of my hotmail now, so I'm going to have to switch it over to another email entirely.

And one of my friends logged on to see if my characters got on, and supposedly my druid is hanging out in the Storm Peaks and pops on and off. I told him to call the dude a douche, but he hasn't gotten any replies yet.

I am so buying an autheticator...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Sorflakne on 10 May 2010, 17:21
If you are fury think long and hard about it, expertise from swords/maces or 1% hit that anyone else in your raid can bring. Also PvP if you wanna be squishy but hit like a truck stay hooman, you will just probs get tunneled a little more in arena due to having like 150 less resilience.

I would say stick hooman, spacegoats piss me off.
I'm Arms, Prot offspec.  And I wouldn't be changing to help the char or the raid (seeing as I'm sort of a free agent/'mercenary' atm), it's more of an aesthetics thing.  And I haven't PvP'd in any serious form or way (other than for a couple of world event achievements) ever since they broke PvP by adding in resilience and arenas.

And draenei are win.  Don't even deny it :-P
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 10 May 2010, 18:03
Finally got through to tech support and had my account transferred to a new email and I made a new password. I then promptly canceled my account because shortly after I changed my password, it got changed again. So I changed it a third time. I'm not bothering with this game anymore until I feel my account is safe, which means I'm probably buying an authenticator. Unless you guys don't think highly of them?

Damn it. I've been having fun recently with this since I've been leveling up with friends. Why do people have to be stupid?

In better news, though, even though the bags on my druid and shaman were pretty much emptied, they are now full of herbs. Herbs that are good sellers. Also, I'm only missing about 200g and all my characters still have their armor. They didn't even touch my DK. So, I have stuff and money, just different stuff and only slightly less money. I still don't really know how this happened, though, so I deleted all my addons.

Still can't get into my hotmail, though. No matter though, as it no longer has anything from Blizzard and the rest is all newsletters, shopping ads and junk.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: beat mouse on 10 May 2010, 19:31
If your account is being compromised that quickly after security changes, a likely scenario is that you have a keylogger on your computer, allowing the foreign party immediate access to your new passwords/emails.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 10 May 2010, 20:10
I highly recommend an authenticator. Bought one as soon as I had my hacking ordeal. I basically had the same thing that happened to you, Linds, except they leveled my mining on my rogue all the way to 450 and had bags full of some awesome ore.


Also, are you by any chance using the Curse Client to download addons? I think that was a major way in for keyloggers, at least in my guild/server.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 11 May 2010, 01:06
I use the iPhone authenticator and cannot rate it highly enough. GET AN AUTHENTICATOR. Why anyone playing WoW on a windows machine doesn't have one yet is beyond me. They are good, they are fairly cheap and they protect your account - considering most of us spend stupid amounts of money on this game every year, it's a solid investment if you're at least halfway serious about the game.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 11 May 2010, 05:14
They've changed my password again. I don't know how to scan my computer for keyloggers. I have a Mac, what should I look for? I deleted the AddOns I had... should I completely delete the entire wow folder?

Edit: Nevermind. I found MacScan and found some tracking cookies, so those got deleted and my mom took my laptop to work so that the Mac savvy tech people there can take a look at it too.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 11 May 2010, 06:26
Change the password then BUY AN AUTHENTICATOR.

Dunno if anyone else has said it.

Oh w8.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 11 May 2010, 11:14
I refuse to buy an authenticator, even after getting hacked, because I feel like its stupid to have to buy an extra level of protection that becomes a liability if you don't have it because hackers can use Blizzard's own protection service against you, like what's already happened with me when they put the damn one on my account. So out of principle I'm saying fuck Blizzard on this one, I'll just have to stay vigilant with my own computer security from now on.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 11 May 2010, 12:25
I would download the app for the authenticator if I had a nifty phone, but I don't really want to buy one. I don't even really want to play anymore, mostly because I don't know where I got the damn keylogger/cookie from. Whatever. I'll probably log on one more time to see what damage was done overnight, but after that I think I'm done for a while.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 11 May 2010, 20:20
because hackers can use Blizzard's own protection service against you
Only if somehow they obtain your login details so it is entirely your fault for them to have it in the first place is it not? By not getting an authenticator you really are cutting off your nose to spite your face and it has little/no impact on blizz but could have a huge impact on your playing experience. You HAVE a way to stop a hacker putting an authenticator on your account (by putting your own one on it) but you choose not to because it can be exploited IF you do not do so? That's a little backwards.

I bought an authenticator before I had a cool phone, I like it as it's just a tiny little keyfob no bigger than my bike lock key. I really see no reason for someone to not use an authenticator, it costs very little and is a fantastic level of security.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 11 May 2010, 20:35
Maybe one day when I'm not so paranoid to use my credit card on my own computer. That day is not today.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 11 May 2010, 20:56
Seeing as you already have a keylogger on your computer (still active, apparently) I would NOT call that paranoia. I would call using your credit card to buy an authenticator completely moronic, actually.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 12 May 2010, 05:15
It's not active anymore. Or at least I guess it's not. I haven't received any emails about my password changing. I downloaded MacScan yesterday and it found some tracking cookies, which is a place a keylogger can hide, so I deleted them. It seems to have taken care of the problem. But as another measure, I went ahead and changed all my passwords from another computer. So I think it is more paranoia.

I don't know. I feel like having someone break into your computer is like someone breaking into your house.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Gemmwah on 17 May 2010, 04:12
I got hacked again so I changed my password and bought an authenticator, my account has been disabled for 24hours and the stupid bugger's put 30 days of playtime on my account, right before I buy my new computer and get playing properly again. HAH.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 17 May 2010, 16:10
Well, I just got an email from Blizzard telling me all the things I am getting back on my characters. Not only did I get back all that I originally had, but I got tons of stuff back that the dude had been selling as well. Which also means I got all the profits back, too. So in addition to ~6600g, I have stacks over a thousand of two types of herbs and 70 frost lotus. Well then. I can handle this.

I think when I start playing again I'll buy all my friends mounts. Yes.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: StreetSpirit on 17 May 2010, 16:15
Congratulations on not only securing all of your lost goods but getting a bonus for being patient and having to deal with the stresses of being hacked! That rocks! I like how your keen on sharing it with your friends, I am sure they will appreciate it!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 17 May 2010, 16:16
I had a friend who essentially made 15k g by being hacked.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 17 May 2010, 16:21
I'd already had about 800g more than I'd had originally, so I sent 600g to one of my friends since she doesn't farm as crazy as the others. Other than that, I may buy my druid some better armor/weapons and some enchants, but I don't really have the need for that much gold.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 17 May 2010, 21:51
Urgh, lich king and the tanks are pissing me off. During the transition phases the warrior keeps intervening our pally tank to get back into position after fetching a Raging Spirit and BAM, I pull agg. Damn my sexy deeps, damn it to hell.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jace on 18 May 2010, 00:48
Anyone wanna use a scroll of resurrection on my account? I'm thinking of starting to play again now that I got my network fixed. Need something to pass the time.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 18 May 2010, 05:46
Send me your email.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: LeeC on 18 May 2010, 07:54
so I quit WoW a year ago (exactly a year ago) and I just recently check my mail and I have been receiving email from the admins saying I keep harassing someone in game and my account has been banned for about a month. so, I guess since my retirement someone has stolen my account.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 18 May 2010, 08:00
Will be spam, hover over one of the links and see if it says http://wordlllofwacraft.cn/blah blah blha

Urgh, lich king and the tanks are pissing me off. During the transition phases the warrior keeps intervening our pally tank to get back into position after fetching a Raging Spirit and BAM, I pull agg. Damn my sexy deeps, damn it to hell.
Your fault. Watch omen and here's the important part "Wait before deeps-ing".

The number of putricide pulls where people start arcane blasting and lava bursting before I have done more than a heroic throw is sickening. If a tank isn't near the boss they will be generating no threat at that moment.

Stay below 85% threat on omen3, this leaves you the 15% intervene steals and the 10% to 110% before you steal aggro, plenty of wiggle room.

If aggro is that much of a problem in transition phases thought, it might be your tanks but I am assuming they are both expertise/hit capped from 4pt10 which makes little sense :/

A guy I know through LAN got hacked but when his account was returned to him he had 30 mechanohoggs and each day in the mail he would be getting stacks of crusader orbs (It was pre ICC) and gold in the mail I think at one point he had over 70k but he kept giving it away.

Blizz caught wind of it and confiscated it though.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 18 May 2010, 08:22
1 Intervene really shouldn't be a problem if your tanks are any good. We have our prot warrior spec safeguard for Soul reaper and intervene our DK tank (on arthas) almost every time it's up, and we never have threat issues.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 May 2010, 13:11
Your fault. Watch omen and here's the important part "Wait before deeps-ing".


I do watch omen. Targeting the tank with a threat dropper just for positioning (honestly, we're not going to lose tanks to raging spirits, so the damage reduction is like whatever) when there's a whole mess of people also in the same spot frankly hits me as rather dumb considering he knows damn well one of our tanks suck. That's why he never actually targeted the other tank just to get back onto position until last night and it started catching people by surprise. He's intervened and we've lost 3-4 to a raging spirit turning around before because of the iffy agg situation. I know you wear plate too but that doesn't mean you should have your head up your butt and routinely defend people doing things because it should work. Sometimes things should work but don't.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 18 May 2010, 13:18
Man, the TR being up is just killing live arena at higher levels. We had a really rough night on my shaman's team last week (bad play, sleepiness, general bleh) and just had 20 point loss after 20 point loss, down from 2500 to around 2370. Blargh. And once you fall that far you have to farm 3-7 point wins to get your MMR and team rating back anywhere respectable.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 May 2010, 13:20
Stay below 85% threat on omen3, this leaves you the 15% intervene steals and the 10% to 110% before you steal aggro, plenty of wiggle room.


We'd never down anything without getting a new offtank. Seriously.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jace on 18 May 2010, 14:57
Whenever I try to log in it tells me that it is Unable to connect and if it persists to contact technical support.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 18 May 2010, 15:31
so I quit WoW a year ago (exactly a year ago) and I just recently check my mail and I have been receiving email from the admins saying I keep harassing someone in game and my account has been banned for about a month. so, I guess since my retirement someone has stolen my account.

Well at least you weren't paying for it? I guess?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 18 May 2010, 19:31
So I've been doing some GKP runs (have I explained these in here before? You go, all loot that drops is bid on with ingame gold and the gold pot at the end is split between the raiders. Essentially you're getting paid to raid) of ICC25. The group I've been going with is run extremely well and downed 6 bosses last night. I bought the dagger off Marrowgar (the Frozen Bonespike) for 6k, got 3.7k for raiding and ended up with enough frost badges to pick up the Circle of Ossus. I caved in and got the Talisman of Resurgence, because damn, trinkets are hard to come by and this seems like a good option. I ran a few dps tests before shutdown and hit 10k self buffed with flask. Pretty happy with that, before it maxed out at around 9, so it's definitely an improvement, but I would like to see how it goes in raid.

Jumped guilds too, the guild I went back to was so full and didn't have any spots for me and I wasn't raiding with them. Swapped to another guild with a friend, and said friend has a fairly high influence in the guild, and he says that the raiding isn't exactly top notch, but it's a fun group of people and awesome guild. So I might get to run some 10mans with them.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 18 May 2010, 19:39
I love GDKP runs. They're really expensive if you're after a big-ticket item (I bought my DBW for 15k) but it's a guarantee if you bring enough money that you can get what you want. Luck is fickle, hooray money!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 18 May 2010, 20:18
Yeah, one of the warlocks paid 20k for the offhand off of Blood Princes. Everyone was pretty happy about that.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 18 May 2010, 21:33
Wow, usually only see trinkets and/or heroic gunship items going for that much. Sometimes a neck/ring/weapon I guess, but that's a ton just for an OH.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 May 2010, 21:57
Still, if you have the gold what else are you going to use it for? I'm sitting on 40k right now and I haven't done dailies in ages.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 18 May 2010, 22:05
Yeah, I mean, it's a BiS, but I didn't expect it to go THAT high.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 23 May 2010, 12:24
Welp, I apparently got hacked sometime last night. My warrior was transferred from Greymane to Vashj, my shaman may have been deleted since I didn't get a transfer notification, password changed, account suspended (which is a good thing I guess). Sent an e-mail to customer service, expecting to hear back in a few years. Le sighs. Not looking forward to getting PR back up on my arena teams (which thankfully still exist, I wasn't the captain for most of them). Grinding 2400-2500 PR sucks.

I guess I just hope I log back into something like this http://i553.photobucket.com/albums/jj392/Maniabe12/WoWScrnShot_123109_162105.jpg (http://i553.photobucket.com/albums/jj392/Maniabe12/WoWScrnShot_123109_162105.jpg)
 
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 23 May 2010, 13:13
Replace all those green things with Icethorn and that's what I came back to (the first time, I'm assuming they're still there). Hopefully you get everything (and more) back. :c I'd say call, but the phone wait is annoyingly long and I dunno if they'd be able to fix it.

I think I'll be buying an authenticator sometime this week and start playing again.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 23 May 2010, 14:19
Yeah I'll be authenticator-ing as soon as my account is actually mine again.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 23 May 2010, 21:53
So how are so many of you guys getting hacked?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 23 May 2010, 22:44
No idea. I'm probably one of 4 mac users in the world who actually regularly scans for malware, I don't get phished and I don't download silly things or visit suspicious sites. Came out of nowhere it seems.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 23 May 2010, 23:18
Weirdly, many of the people I know who've lost their accounts lately have been mac users. Of course, as Dazed hinted at, some neophyte mac users have a false sense of security and fall prey to things that don't really have much to do with how sound the OS is.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 23 May 2010, 23:35
It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten hacked by a grue.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 24 May 2010, 00:42
Well, I mostly meant stupid browser tricks, but grue work.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 24 May 2010, 03:12
My boy's account has been hacked again. He got yet another lecture about not having an authenticator and how buying gold is bad. Apparently his account was taken over and was suspended for chat spamming. My point has been proven. Maybe he'll listen to me this time.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 24 May 2010, 05:10
I honestly still don't know where I got that keylogger. (Possibly an addon?) But for whatever reason, I didn't have my firewall up, so I guess I deserved it. Also it led me to getting MacScan, so I don't think I'll be as lazy with my computer security anymore. In a way, I'm just glad it was WoW and not something like my bank account.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 27 May 2010, 10:37
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2010/05/photogalleries/100524-new-species-handfish-walk-science-pictures/?now=2010-05-24-00:01#new-handfish-species-pink_20881_600x450.jpg

Murlocs
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 27 May 2010, 13:11
Sweet! Hooray for newly discovered sea creatures.

Also bought an authenticator. Expecting it in the mail any day now...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 28 May 2010, 17:15
Looks like my jokes turned around and bit me in the ass because I was hacked.  Don't know how.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 28 May 2010, 19:09
What the crap is with all the hacks recently? Does anyone know how their accounts were compromised? All I can think of was maybe a bug in an addon, but even that's a stretch, because of how long I'd had the newest ones before I got hacked (at least 2 months).

Hope you get it sorted out and then end up with a nice bonus like I did at the end.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 28 May 2010, 20:39
Went all out with the scans and not a single keylogger found.  I really have no clue.  Changed my email and WoW passwords and now I'm just waiting on an email back from the technical support to remove the authenticator.  I should probably buy one for myself.

Getting stuff back should be fun at least.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 28 May 2010, 20:55
I really do have no clue how they got to me.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 30 May 2010, 10:53
Well I came back to nothing at all.  Guild Bank, inventory, even my trinkets and rings were gone.  Now I have to wait "7-9 days" to get everything back.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 30 May 2010, 12:54
Ouch.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 30 May 2010, 23:08
The boy got his account back. He got me to log into his account for him, and I lodged tickets for his gear, gold and bank that was missing.  So far, he has got all his gold back, all his main spec and offspec gear back and a good chunk of what was in the bank.

His priest was deleted (low level, but he was leveling with me), and we are waiting on that. His rogue is getting the 7-9 days treatment with it's stuff, so hopefully he gets that back too. I made him a new email on my domain, and we changed it all and his passwords AND he's getting an authenticator.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 30 May 2010, 23:59
Did you make a ticket on each character or just one?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 31 May 2010, 04:19
On each of them, just to be sure.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 01 Jun 2010, 13:39
Finally got my authenticator in the mail, so I'll be reinstalling the game tonight and hopefully will start playing again tomorrow. I think I may just avoid addons for the time being and only group up with people I know, since I still don't know how I was hacked.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 01 Jun 2010, 19:21
How long did it take you guys to get your stuff back?  I didn't have any characters transfered/recustomized and I'm still getting the 7-9 days treatment.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 01 Jun 2010, 19:36
Pretty certain that it's the volume of hacks that are going on at any given time that complicates things, with the nature of it being a relatively minor issue.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 01 Jun 2010, 20:17
It took a week, but as soon as it happens, they'll send you an email with all the things you're getting back. None of my characters lost any of the gear they were wearing or any talents and also none of them were deleted, either, so I'd just say wait it out.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 01 Jun 2010, 20:31
I was hacked on the 23rd and as yet have not had my restoration completed. Hopefully tomorrow or the day after I guess.

Oh well, been leveling my hunter. It's funnish!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 02 Jun 2010, 15:10
C'monnnnnn, finish downloading! It was around 33% this morning when I left and it's only at 74%, wtf.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 02 Jun 2010, 19:06
I want Halion to come out so I can get his damned trinket already. It'd like nice next to my HDBW.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 03 Jun 2010, 00:22
The boy just had all his Shaman's stuff restored a second time. Now he has doubles of everything.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Gemmwah on 03 Jun 2010, 09:49
My authenticator arrived yesterday morning and now i am haxproof yaaay!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 03 Jun 2010, 20:57
Took me about an hour, but I got everything Blizzard returned out of my mailbox and promptly put up over 1000ea of Lichbloom and Icethorn on the AH. (I kept some. And 80 frost lotuses. And some other herbs. :)) And I was selling them for super cheap, so most were sold before I logged off. So huzzah. Tomorrow I'm going to buy signatures so I can get my guild rolling and set up a bank and whatnot, seeing as how I can afford to do it myself.

Also the corepuppy is so cuuuute! He rolls around, chews a bone, and stands up like this!

(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b198/andthentherewaslindsey/corepuppy.jpg)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 04 Jun 2010, 12:17
I am struggling to connect to wows at home for some reason so I been raiding at LAN :/

Got like 3 good DPS pieces (one is a ilv 277chest) for my offspec and a BiS neck for tanking. Quite chuffed, they cost very little dkp.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 04 Jun 2010, 13:34
We use EPGP :(


I hate it and I hate my guild. For one thing, we have it set up so that there's minimal repercussions for not bothering to show up since the cost of acquiring gear vastly outpaces any other consideration. I haven't missed a raid since mid 2009, but I've lost out on 4 items in the last 3 weeks to people who miss at least a raid night a week.  We disenchant shit left and right and since rogues have no "offspec," we have this lovely situation in which we disenchant all daggers and stuff rather than just let people use 'em for pvp. Which, you know, wouldn't really bother me, except we have a cat druid that rolls on unwanted items (often only unwanted because people won't pay for anything that's not BIS at this point) for his bear "offspec," gets the items for free and then actually equips this shit and uses it while in cat spec. He literally never bids on things unless someone else bids on it first. He's an officer though, so nobody will do anything about it and he's always above me on EPGP because of it. Meanwhile, I'm still somehow expected to pay EPGP for a pair of Heaven's Fall daggers that I'd never use outside of weekend BG trolling, since I run with 2 combat specs for raid nights. Again, it wouldn't bother me at all if we didn't have people openly abusing the system in other ways.

I should probably just server transfer, but I doubt anyone's really interested in a pure DPSer who's merely just the cream of the crop on one of the worst 2 or 3 servers in WoW. Oh well, I'll always have my server first Mimiron's head.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 04 Jun 2010, 20:30
DKP is amongst the many many many reasons 25 man raiding is awful.

Also yeah I got my stuff back almost immediately after that last post, including some stuff I vendored ages ago. Waiting to see if I can hopefully get my PRs restored on my teams still.

I seriously never realized how much shit I acquired over the year's. Getting my original Zandalar Peacekeeper's chestpiece in the mail was a bit of a whoa moment. I still have almost all of my BWL/AQ40/20 gear, which makes me happy.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 04 Jun 2010, 20:54
I've been a primary raider, but never been an officer in a guild. Now I'm running one. Oh shit. It's made up of purely friends at the moment, but down the line I'd like to get more people, so hopefully I get the hang of this. But we've got a bank, so hey! Now it just needs stuff in it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 05 Jun 2010, 11:24
...And some dude I bought a signature from that I didn't immediately boot because he seemed so enthusiastic ran off with the few low level items I put in the tab 1 of the bank. Luckily I had the sense to deny gold withdraw for his rank and blocked his access to the other tab, which had things of actual value in it. So he got 20g and an oddball collection of stones and cloth, none of which were full stacks or are things that will sell for any decent amount.

I don't know why I bother with people I don't know in real life with this game. Most of them are douchebags.

But then again his name was Nigbeater. I should have just ignored him in the first place.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 05 Jun 2010, 16:55
Fucking love epgp when guilds follow the rules and use preset values of the addon and not some fucking "x=slot" rule.

dkp is shit since I still had to use dkp for OS shit I never even wanted, oh well suppose is better than a kick in the testicles.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 05 Jun 2010, 20:49
Just ran Occulus. Now I know why nobody ever wanted to run it. Also it didn't give me a bag at the end! >:(
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 05 Jun 2010, 21:36
You have to loot ze bag from the chest.

And Oculus is ok if you're with a competent group, it's just annoying mounting and unmounting the dragons constantly.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 05 Jun 2010, 23:38
Fucking love epgp when guilds follow the rules and use preset values of the addon and not some fucking "x=slot" rule.

dkp is shit since I still had to use dkp for OS shit I never even wanted, oh well suppose is better than a kick in the testicles.

Yeah, I think the bottom line here is that with enough determination, people can shit up any system.

My least favorite part of oculus is how every time you mount/remount your focus gets cleared. I like to use my focus for lazy mode tricks of the trade in 5 mans. I mean, it's obviously not hard to select a focus, but it still hits me as a pinch silly have to keep choosing again every time we dismount.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 06 Jun 2010, 06:10
The red and greens are the most fun drakes to use, the yellows just bore me. But then again you can just get a healer to stand on the platform with the chest and roll hots on the drakes, works pretty well too. You also only get the bag if you do a speed run which most runs  are these days, just funny how you can solo the fight as a greem drake but it takes like 1000 years, a bit like malygos when the rest of your raid wipes at ~15% and it's just you and a healer to 12% then the healer dies and you solo the last 12% and then everyone wants to suck your dick and have your babies and stuff then they give you the tanking shield for your collection even thought you have better and someone wants it for their offspec but nobody cares because you seem like the most awesome person EU.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 06 Jun 2010, 06:12
You have to loot ze bag from the chest.

There was no bag in the chest for me! Everyone else got one! I don't know why I didn't get one.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: axerton on 06 Jun 2010, 09:15
Did you wait till after everyone had de zoned- that happened to me, apparently if you're not in the group that finished it, theres no way of the game knowing you did it with the dungeon finder, so no bag.  I opened a ticket about it and was sent a bag a few days later - had a drake in it too.

man its been ages since I've played, or even felt like playing,  wow but I still check this thread for some reason.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 06 Jun 2010, 11:32
Two people had ditched the party before I could open the chest, so maybe that's it. Whatever. They all seemed to get twilight opals and gold.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 06 Jun 2010, 12:59
Just ordered an authenticator.  Can't wait to push a button every time I log in.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 06 Jun 2010, 16:09
Wait for your first random DC on progress and the ETERNITY those extra 3 seconds add to getting back in to find yourself 2% away from being overtaken on threat after having been healed while white hitting a dragon in the face.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 06 Jun 2010, 18:32
The worst is when you get DC'd during a farm fight that requires taunt or interrupt rotations to drop or avoid debuffs like General Vezax's Searing Bullshit or Gormok's Impale. The fact that it's such an otherwise easy to handle situation just adds insult to injury if it ends up resulting in a wipe.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 08 Jun 2010, 02:36
Blizzard haven't returned anything to me or the guild but they find it okay to email me saying I only have four days left before my subscription runs out.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 08 Jun 2010, 12:25
How long has it been? And did you open a ticket or call anyone? Sometimes you don't get things back, because a former guildmate didn't a while back.

I was exploring and running random heroics last night and I got my first penalty for leaving a party made in Dungeon Finder. Is it always a half an hour? That's kind of steep, but it was a half an hour put to better use exploring than listening to one of the members bicker with the tank over what gear they had. (Granted, dude was completely in blues, but still, it's more annoying to fight about it than actually letting him try.) Anywho, I'm halfway done exploring everything. Northrend and Kalimdor are completely done so now I just need to finish parts of Outland and a lot of the Eastern Kingdoms and I'll be Meabh the Explorer.

Also, I have to say, playing with a few people is so much more fun than playing by yourself, even if you're not doing things together. I like having a guild again.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 08 Jun 2010, 13:52
Today is the tenth day.  Three days ago I put in another ticket asking them about it and they told me they were working on it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 08 Jun 2010, 20:43
Saurfang finally dropped me an H-Bloodvenom blade. It's hawt.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 08 Jun 2010, 21:12
They seem overloaded with hacks right now, so be patient.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 08 Jun 2010, 21:30
Woo stuff!  They also seem to have taken away some emblem gear and refunded the emblems.  My helm is also gone.  Hope I am not being hacked again.

And then they send me stuff back that my pally had equipped the day after I buy it back.  Oh, frustration.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 14 Jun 2010, 21:52
I got my explorer title! Yay! And then since I didn't know what else to do, I went and soloed Scholomance, since I'd never been there before BC came out. It was pretty easy and therefore really fun. I love running into a room, dropping starfall, and watching mobs die within seconds.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 15 Jun 2010, 00:29
WotlK is dead. WoW resurection ETA [Cataclysm release date].
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 15 Jun 2010, 06:32

> Character Name: Díck
> Realm: Boulderfist
>
> Category of Violation: Inappropriate
>
> Greetings,
>
> We are writing to educate you on our policies with regards to character naming. Violation of this policy is something which is not in the spirit of the game, and is against our Terms of Use.
>
> We would like to make it clear that this kind of behavior is not welcome in our community, and should be avoided in the future. While we have determined that a warning was not necessary on this occasion, it is important that you are aware that should any further violations of our rules occur that this incident will be taken into consideration when determining the consequences for your account. This could include a warning or suspension of the account.
>
> When you next log-in with the character named above, you will be prompted to select a new name. Please review our Naming Policy before selecting this new name. This can be found at: http://www.wow-europe.com/en/policy/namingp1.html.
>
> You can find further information on the different levels of account penalty we can apply at: http://www.wow-europe.com/en/policy/accountpenalties.html
>
> Please do not reply to this email as you will receive an automated response. If you have any further enquiries regarding your account status, please send them to: [email protected].
>
> Regards,
>
> English Game Master Team
> Blizzard Europe
>
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Jezbosh
> Game Master
> Blizzard Entertainment


My reply...

Sup chief,

I was just wondering about my name change, I chose Díck as it is short for "Ritchard" which was taken in any variation with funny letters I could think of. I just wanted an undead warlock like the one in the comic "LFG" http://www.lfgcomic.com/page/3 and also once a GM helped me out with a pet name issue on that exact same toon, I thought if there was a problem he would have done something then as he called me by the character name. I have not played that toon in a long time, so when I recieved the alert on my phone I was worried someone had logged on my account, as I had my authenticator in my pocket I doubted it but still, cannot be too careful. Could you please tell me if someone logged onto my warlock on Boulderfist recently?

Thanks for reading this, I know you guys must be mega busy (I know what it's like answering the office emails at my work :/ )

-James

Re-reply

Greetings James,


First of all, I'd like to apologize for the time it took us to handle your email. While we try to reply to every email received as soon as possible, we do so in the order they come in and at times a queue can be formed.

Having checked your account, I can confirm that your Undead Warlock on Boulderfist has indeed not been logged into for a very long time. There are also no other indications that your account was compromised at all and having an authenticator is surely a great way of securing your account.

What caused your character's name to be flagged for name change, was a report regarding a similarly named character on another realm. An armory search then indicated that there were a few more characters with this name and they were forced to change name as well.
While I can understand that you had no ill intentions when naming your character this, it is a very well known name for male genitalia and will mainly be looked at this way by the community which makes it not suited for our gaming environment.

I hope this has shed some light on the situation. Don't hesitate to contact us again, either way by email or by sending in a ticket in-game.


Best of wishes,

Mary V.
Senior In-Game Representative Thalianei
 
tl;dr - LOL A GM SAID MALE GENITALIA HAHAHA.

This is superior to a gm joke so I decided to share.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 15 Jun 2010, 16:48
BAHA! But Dick is a legitimate name, it's not like your name was Penis or UltimateDicksucker. (Also Richard is the best, all warlocks should be named Richard.)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: scarred on 15 Jun 2010, 16:54
i had a warlock named succunuts

he didn't make it past level 5 though
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 15 Jun 2010, 17:21
At least his name wasn't Nigbeater.

Though I think he's gone, too.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 16 Jun 2010, 06:31
I didn't like my imps name "ababis" or summit so I had asked for a name change, now the imp is called... "Imp".

BAWLA.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 16 Jun 2010, 20:32
For whatever reason, I was flying through Wintergrasp and the time until the next battle was 2 min, so I was like, hey why not. It was fun! This was the most fun I've ever had doing pvp and actually I think this is only the 2nd time I've ever been in a battlegroup that won. Granted, Feathermoon was notorious for having crappy pvp players, but it was awesome! I think I have found a new thing to do.

And I went ahead and got this (http://www.wowwiki.com/The_Blessed_Hammer_of_Grace), which doesn't do much for my druid, but will be an upgrade for my shaman.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 16 Jun 2010, 23:03
Kinda sad how easy earth, wind, and fire is now with newer gear.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: BeoPuppy on 17 Jun 2010, 07:04
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_jLGa4X5H2c


?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 17 Jun 2010, 10:35
Most achievements are also pop culture references, yes.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 17 Jun 2010, 14:14
9/12 icc25hc.

BLEH.

Really starting to hate raiding at times, 5 hours+ when I get home from work.

Should just look harder for 3 boomkins and a resto shaman for 5's.

Or hpala dk for 3's.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 17 Jun 2010, 14:24
Within the first two weeks after we downed LK we cleared BQ, Marrowgar, Saurfang, Rotface, Dreamwalker, Lootship (duh), and Festergut on Heroic mode, but every time we work on the actually hard ones and start wiping we start running into attendance problems. Now a few people transferred away and we've regressed somewhat. The stupid thing is that we didn't even really wipe all that much, since it was really just working on Lady Deathwhisper that caused the wipes. People suck.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 17 Jun 2010, 14:35
Geathwhisper is my latest, seriously FUCK THAT FIGHT.

Ghosts, or dps don't look at omen.

Cunts.

Oh, and when top interrups goes DK>Warr tank>rogue>rogue... something is wrong.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 17 Jun 2010, 14:54
It just annoys me that so many of our players got all pissy because we wiped on H-DW a few times. It's not like that fight is known for being easy.


And yeah, we've been running with a scrubby combat rogue for a month or so now, and he's basically going to forever be relegated to "the new guy" status in my mind until we can get someone to replace him. He doesn't switch targets well and near as I can tell he doesn't interrupt unless you put him in some kinda rotation like on LDW. The target switching thing is the real biggy, and it's most glaringly obvious when we're doing H-Dreamwalker. I'll grant you that I outgear him a bit, but even if I get stuck running half way across the room constantly due to RNG my worst case scenario on that fight is usually in the high 8k DPS range with the same talent build. With Tricks and FoK+CD spam I can practically mop up the maggots single handedly while still auto-attacking something more important. Meanwhile this joker does around 5k-ish on a good day and the side he's meant to watchdog has Archmages cheerfully casting Frostbolt Volley all over the place. WTF.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 19 Jun 2010, 08:31
dps on DW is dumb when they overtake a tank on aggro, after 5 stacks tanks do nothign but get hit, do damage and interrupt, no tps. The whole point of the adds is so you can dps them when you are about to overtake on aggro and all your aggro dumps/MD's are on cd.

It's just idiots tha get killed it seems, or people that stand next to idiots.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 19 Jun 2010, 15:05
Depends a bit on the tank setup. We finally managed to recruit a couple of quality warrior tanks,* so they can handle most of the interrupting now, which lets me play it just like any other melee dps. But back when we had mostly paladin tanks it was a real pain in the ass handling the interrupts while still making sure some dipshit isn't going to train a ghost on my ass in the meantime. That's something of a special case though; rogues are well suited to working around the threat situation on that fight and handling the interrupts full time if the tanks aren't warriors. Between proper use of Tricks, Vanish, and the random Mind Controls we're kinda unique in our ability to actually just sit on Deathwhisper and do what we do. I much prefer just letting the tanks and the mutilate rogue handle it though. Things have smoothed up a lot now that I can go pummel crap out of things with my cooldowns a bit more freely. Well, right up until we wipe again anyway. Fuck LDW.

*I love having warrior tanks again. I can tricks+fok them so as far as I'm concerned they may as well be just as good at AoE tanking as a paladin in many situations, they bring sunders (our dps warriors are notorious slackers on the sunder front), and they can participate in kick rotations. Oh, and we don't wipe because the healers are dumb and were slow to dispel Silence off the tank so he can get the Raging Spirit.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 21 Jun 2010, 08:00
EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE :D I did all of Midsummer tonight (except for one of the acheivements I already had from last year) and it's completed my What A Long Strange Trip It's Been.

PEEEEEENK!

(http://img412.imageshack.us/img412/4324/screenshot20100622at125.th.png) (http://img412.imageshack.us/i/screenshot20100622at125.png/)

Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 21 Jun 2010, 11:10
I was pissed cuz I think I got mine less than a week after ulduar 310% speed mount, seemed like such an anti climax :( Use the 2 seater rokkit now FWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOSH!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: kemon on 21 Jun 2010, 15:24
nice, jmrz.  that's a long wait for a sweet looking ride.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 21 Jun 2010, 16:16
Sweeeeeeeeet. I may have to work on that tonight!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 21 Jun 2010, 16:52
nice, jmrz.  that's a long wait for a sweet looking ride.

It's taken me two years. TWO YEARS. I was so ridiculously excited when I finally completed it. Also mildly annoyed that WoW decided to crash the last three times I got an achievement.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 22 Jun 2010, 04:26
Anyone else having trouble with the patch?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 22 Jun 2010, 05:58
It feels slower for whatever reason. But if people are having a problem with it, there'll probably be another one soon.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 22 Jun 2010, 06:48
I am getting this error:

"The patch "enUS\DBFilesClient\Item.dbc" could not be applied. (Invalid source file size: expected 1475061, actual 1284756."

I searched the wow forum and followed various GM/Blue's instructions and nothing has worked.  Really don't want to reinstall.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 22 Jun 2010, 16:19
Could this be the pre 3.3.5 patch?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 22 Jun 2010, 16:41
Whatever it is, they're still doing something to the game...and we won't find out will what for a little bit longer.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 22 Jun 2010, 16:51
This is the 3.3.5 patch, for US anyway. Ruby sanctum isn't going into effect until next week though, because 3.3.5 isn't taking effect on EU until then.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 22 Jun 2010, 19:17
No more AVR. Boo.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 22 Jun 2010, 21:41
No more AVR. YAY!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 23 Jun 2010, 10:44
I don't know why you would dislike AVR. My guildmates are dumb enough as it is WITH the addon, much less without it. I don't really mind losing it that much on a personal level, since as a rogue I just feint or cloak through half the shit in the game anyway. But about a 1/3rd of my guildmates? They're going to die. A lot.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 23 Jun 2010, 14:09
Tell them to stop standing in fire?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 23 Jun 2010, 14:38
That's why I dislike it. I know it's silly for a fairly casual 10 man raider to be all up in arms about it, but if you're such a braindead tunnel visioner that you need giant colored circles painted all over the game telling you where to go or what to not stand in, you don't deserve to kill bosses and get purples. That's all there is to it in my opinion.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 23 Jun 2010, 14:51
Yeah, see, 10 mans are stupid easy and you can easily filter out the morons. With 25 people on one of the 2 or 3 worst servers? Not so much.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 23 Jun 2010, 14:54
I mean, really, we did 10 man hard mode princes and cleared it with a single warlock as ranged deeps. The game is easy. At this point, I really just want to get the gear because I already know how to do all of this shit and I'm tired of rotating in a new guy who has to learn everything every week because people don't show up.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 23 Jun 2010, 15:36
10 mans are stupid easy? Sometimes yes, sometimes no. I personally think 10 man LK/Sind are harder than 25, at least in terms of the gear you're supposed to have doing them (i.e. not 25 man hardmode raiders stomping all over 10 man content).

As to you having to deal with more morons, and just wanting the gear, well, that's what you signed up for doing 25 man raiding, and it's also one of the main arguments for equalizing gear across 10s and 25s (and why I prefer 10s). I don't think dumbing down the game even more is the right way to go, given how relatively easy (as you pointed out) it already is.

EDIT: by the way, I do understand your frustration. I was a 40-man raider for a long time before I was a 25-man raider for a long time before I was a 10-man raider. I hate carrying bad players in 25s, and constantly dealing the burnout of myself and my friends. I highly recommend finding a group of solid/friendly/drama-free dudes and ladies, and going off and playing casually/raiding 10s/pvping/fucking around in general until cat, and then on throughout. It's a lot more fun and less frustrating.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 23 Jun 2010, 15:57
I think that's why I never did many 25/40-man raids. I just think it's easier to fix a problem with a bad player in a 10 man because then you know exactly who it is that's messing up and you can either tell them how to fix it or just straight up replace them. But then again, I just get lost in the mob in 25-man raids. I know the gear is better, but I don't really care about the gear, I care about the experience of running the instance.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 23 Jun 2010, 22:25
I'm up to 1275 Armor Penetration now. That's a pretty damn nice number for a rogue, since unlike druids only 2 of our set pieces actually have ArPen and we don't get quite as much stats out of our weapons as fury warriors.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 24 Jun 2010, 12:03
Rogues can do decent dps with no arp, warriors need over 80% for it to be competative.

But then it just becomes fucking retarded numbers.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 24 Jun 2010, 12:23
Yeah, it wasn't meant as a complaint, but an explanation. 1275 isn't that impressive of a number for some classes, after all, so it was really just about putting it into context. Telling a Feral Druid "I have 80%" ArPen will probably just elicit a "What took you so long?" if they don't know much about other class's gear, after all. Even their 251 tier 10 sports (http://www.wowwiki.com/Lasherweave_Battlegear) nearly 400 armor penetration, although I don't really begrudge them for it, since they rather need it to keep up.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 24 Jun 2010, 22:07
I swear I'm going to poop down the neck of the next melee that screws up on Sindy. She's not even that hard as melee.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Covetous on 26 Jun 2010, 05:00
Hey, lot of nerd rage there Alex. "It is after all only a game".

And the argument for 25 vs 10 is usually:
-In 10-man, if one man screwed up it's 1/10 of the raid, takes three people to screw up that much in 25.
-It's easier to find r-tards to fill out a 25-man. Or rather, it's easier to find 10 good people than to find 25 good people.

And quite alot of people complaing about how easy 10-man is come and do it with 25-man gear. The usuall argument fromt he 25-man people in that case is "but I didn't have that much gear from ICC 25 back then". No but you most likely had 25-ToC or HToC gear.
This is why it will be better in CATA. Everyone have the same gear and we can really discuss if it's easier in 10 or 25. And in most cases Blizz will adjust it so that it will be equally hard if it's not before.

But then again, wow is almost dead to me. 31 days left till Starcraft II.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 26 Jun 2010, 07:19
Man that wasn't even close to nerd rage.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 26 Jun 2010, 07:24
Yeah, 'twas a joke, really.

Anyway, I was a strictly 10 man guy before I was recruited up to 25 man ulduar raiding. While stupid easy was a bit of an exaggeration, the lowered need to recruit filler thing was huge on my server. Again, I'm on one of the two or three worst servers in WoW. My old guild had a rough enough time with kick rotations on Vezax some nights, for god's sake. And with my current guild we still get RNG pwned by Sindy whenever the Frost Orbs targets some of our bads. Attendance is pretty much the hardest thing about 25 mans, to the point where I don't mind a few guys running around on training wheels if that's what it takes.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 26 Jun 2010, 09:41
I am still kind of pissed I've never been able to run any of the 10-mans in WotLK. And I can't do any of the high level ones, because I don't have good enough gear to do any of the ones that people still run. I still have things I can do, but I want Cataclysm to hurry up and come out so I can actually do things as they come out instead of trying to catch up to everyone else on the server.

So other than raiding (which I can't really do) and running random heroics (which I do quite a bit and haven't been able to find much gear), what's a good way to upgrade? Here's my character: http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Elune&cn=Meabh
I plan on checking out the Icecrown 5-mans, but I'm not sure if I'd do ok in those or not.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 26 Jun 2010, 11:27
Your best bet would be tier 9 and the other gear that you can buy from the triumph badges you get from doing 5mans.

Another thing that'll do a lot of good for you would maybe be fixing up your talent specs a bit. It's typically a general rule to not dump all/most of your points in one tree. WoW Popular (http://www.wowpopular.com/Talents/) is a really good place to find basic cookie-cutter-type builds and also gives good suggestions on glyphs and other stuff like that.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 26 Jun 2010, 13:30
Yeah, you should familiarize yourself with builds and tinker around with a reputable spreadsheet a bit if you have the time. For now though, I wouldn't worry about it too much. The top boomkin builds are as good as they are due to Intellect synergy and the sheer number of buffs you can get in a raid setting-- Intellect buffs, Kings, and Replenishment can team up together so well that a geared chicken doesn't have to worry much about mana anymore and Lunar Guidance makes 'em hit like a truck. It's been a long time since I touched my boomkin, but if I remember right a build like this (http://www.wowhead.com/talent#0xG0uiIscdIVhouZbxczb)* will definitely outperform your current one in a raid, but in a 5 man setting the advantage will be fairly marginal unless the group is composed just so. Ultimately it's stuff like Eclipse that makes or breaks a 5 man boomkin, and you already have that.


*I left a couple points loose there because the AoE talents aren't so hot if your mana regen sucks and you need to put points into Intensity. People mix and match those all the time.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 26 Jun 2010, 13:42
My mana regen is actually pretty decent. I almost never run out and lately I've been noticing I rarely go past half. And all of the points you spent in resto I think I will pick up, but I'd have to keep certain things you didn't take - such as typhoon, which I do use (I have a glyph that takes away the pushback).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 26 Jun 2010, 15:35
Yeah, the Typhoon glyph is pretty hot, and AoE is one of the prime reasons why I kept those 2 points loose. Hell, if you really wanted to you could make a case for swapping a point from Omen of Clarity to really max out your AoEs. It's really just a matter of context. For 5 mans, the difference between having a full suite of AoE talents and having a couple points in intensity wouldn't amount to much difference on your mana bar. But in a raid setting with your level of gear having Clarity and a couple of points of Intensity can let you keep casting for an extra minute or two, which is either awesome or useless depending on the length of the fight or whether or not you're expected to use Innervate on someone else. Eventually with enough gear you can just blow off even Moonglow and just ride Replenishment and your ridiculously huge mana pool. My guildmate Khaldei (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Grizzly+Hills&cn=Khaldei) just keeps casting. And casting. And casting. But then, it's sorta necessary considering how long some fights can take.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 27 Jun 2010, 07:31
You don't go oom because of the amount of spirit/mp5 you have.

Use your tree spec, run as many hc's as you possibly can (fast q's as healer yo) then buy all the ilv 245 badge gear you can.

Profit.

Chances are you will get an icc geared tank anyways who will skip any bosses that he can meaning faster runs, but you will still get more badgers per hour since you get 2 on completion of the run.

You can average 1 badge per 3 mins if you get good groups and go non stop. If you controll WG you also get shards which you can trade for honour and then for epic gems to use with your gear, that and an enchanter could mean lots of mats to ench your new gear. If not roll greed, sell it to a vendor to pay rep billz.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 27 Jun 2010, 11:25
Ok, I revamped both trees, so I hope that is a bit better. I didn't go exactly with what you had, because of the spells I don't use anymore and I can always do it again later if it doesn't work out.

Yeah, I have a lot of spirit/mp5, but I built it up because I burn through mana pretty fast when I don't. I don't think I've had to really take a mana break on my druid in a loooong time, which is something I have to do a lot with my shaman. (It's so annoying! But I'm only level 32, so that is also part of it, I think. Also I'm enhancement, so it's not TOO big of an issue.)

I will be running a lot of instances for the time being. On my druid to get gear and on my shaman because I can't stand Stranglethorn Vale (only because there is no other option for zones for a few levels). Also they are fun!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 28 Jun 2010, 10:54
mp5 is healer gear, dps should not roll on/use it.

Spirit... similar but different.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 28 Jun 2010, 12:16
What spec do you prefer running as, anyway? As currently constructed I like your gear better for trees than boomkin with all that spirit. If you're having no problems with Trial of the Champion normal you should definitely look into doing the heroic mode and the ICC 5 man normals since they drop Uld 10 grade loot. Between the 3 ICC instances there's 5 different weapons in there that would all be upgrades for you. You already have a healthy chunk of spellpower and Spirit for healing so the Unspeakable Secret (http://www.wowhead.com/item=49801) stands out as something that would work nicely for both your specs.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 28 Jun 2010, 12:40
Not all of my gear is up there, because I have a few healing oriented pieces in my bags. Mostly I run around as a boomkin, because PvE as a tree is silly. But like I said, I've had problems finding upgrades in general, so when a leather (or cloth) drops that will work and there's no priests, mages, or shaman around that want them, I take them. But generally I run heroics as whichever I get chosen for (mostly healing). Do I want two dedicated sets? Yes. Very much so. I use both specs equally compared to how much time I play.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 28 Jun 2010, 13:07
Just asking because really your most limiting factor will be how you spend your emblems, since that'll really be the only stuff you can choose the order you get things with.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 28 Jun 2010, 15:18
Also, that weapon looks pretty good! I forgot to mention that.

For emblems, I'll probably go with healer gear. Leather healing gear isn't the easiest thing to find, so I'll be starting out with that. I do decent enough damage with what I have as a boomkin, so questing and dpsing is still pretty easy, but my healing could be better in the higher end heroics.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 28 Jun 2010, 18:25
One of the nice things about Improved Moonkin Form is that you get 30% of your Spirit back as spell damage. So while a true healing gear set will never be top notch, it's plenty fine for doing solo dailies with an offset. The only stats that I would really consider truly mutually exclusive between the trees are hit rating and mp5.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 28 Jun 2010, 20:34
Bought this (http://www.wowarmory.com/item-info.xml?i=47733) and this (http://www.wowarmory.com/item-info.xml?i=42579) tonight. Didn't get anything good out of the randoms, but I'm saving frost emblems and hoping for a decent weapon drop.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 29 Jun 2010, 12:14
ToC 25 pug for trink for pvp, I tank but people agree to let me roll on the trink as it is all I need. After FC I did not change my gear back from a mix of dps and arena gear by accident and the after we pulled I realised my hp was only 41k buffed.

Did you know in a pug full of bads it's acceptable for a tank with some icc10/25 gear, NES and a welfare direbrew dps trink beat 17 other DPS in toc?

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4120/4740636234_98def4646a_b.jpg

I think not. But anyways the trink drops and 15 people roll on it and it goes to some scrub ret pala with an unenchanted ungemmed tyrannical beheader :D
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 29 Jun 2010, 13:40
Man, I know that fight favors cleave pretty heavily but that just ain't right. People should definitely be able to hit 10k+ on that one at this point. I was doing it ages ago in Heroic mode with a combat offspec.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 29 Jun 2010, 15:28
Fury warriors have cleave too... and whirlwind... and 2handers... and dps gear with stupid amounts of arp.

Never seen a bloodlust over 20k though, and I get over double that cleaved in 1 shot? With dots ticking and the cleave on top of revenge that must be ~100k in 1 gcd.

Buff prot I says.

lololololololol

[edit] napkin maths says if one swung at me that global, rend ticked on 1 and deep wounds ticked on both... I would be doing 105000 damage in 1.5 seconds so 70k dps gogogogogogo now am a mage lol.

Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 29 Jun 2010, 15:34
Hmm seems like they opened RS early for the US.

Or did EU patch today?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 29 Jun 2010, 15:57
EU patching NAIO. servers went down 1 hour ago.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 29 Jun 2010, 16:04
I can't play on my server today. It's kind of lame, but hey! Exciting things!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: KvP on 01 Jul 2010, 16:16
Blizz sez Wow could go F2P next MMO time (http://www.tomshardware.com/news/Warcraft-free-to-play-MMORPG-Diablo-Game,10776.html).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 01 Jul 2010, 18:54
That's great because f2p games are always so fun and have absolutely no problems.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 01 Jul 2010, 19:18
It's about time!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 02 Jul 2010, 07:35
"could possibly" two very vague words. I hope it still stays subscription based, micro transactions are not so awesome when all they do is milk them and bring out new content because they don't need to bother now that it is free.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 02 Jul 2010, 11:40
So man wow RS is a joke.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 02 Jul 2010, 11:55
Yeah, the trash was tougher than the boss, which is pretty sad since we didn't really have trouble with the trash.3 of the healers we took were trials though and we didn't have our usual main tanks with us that night, so we wiped once when we overestimated just how many mobs a given 2nd string tank could handle. A hibernate and a 3rd tank fixed that though no problem.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 02 Jul 2010, 12:00
Yeah I felt like the minibosses were tougher than Halion. The first one could gib a tank if every hit during the blade frenzy or whatever connects and a healer or two spaces out, and the stacking armor debuff on the last one seriously blows. I was taking 40k hits in 10 man at 100% less armor mark, that sucked.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 02 Jul 2010, 12:21
I will say one thing though: I hate dragonkin. On our first pull, I jumped in and attacked pretty early with Tricks and a Killing Spree, which puts you directly behind the mob's most central point. So our tank (who's a 3rd stringer under most circumstances) does a twitchy half step as the KS ends, but of course the damn mob's response was to do the Big Hit Box Shuffle, in which case it turned and scooted away from the tank a half step before turning back around and cleaving the shit out of me in the space of roughly half a second as I'm about to start moving back towards max melee range, as dictated by Murphy's Law. It'd bother me less, but I'm dumb and this needs to happen pretty much every time a new dragon lair is released before I remember why I hate dragonkin and start waiting a half beat to make sure any unfamiliar tanks don't have happy feet.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 03 Jul 2010, 05:30
They still have not fixed mob positioning since 3.3.2 for fucks sake.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 03 Jul 2010, 06:58
Yeah. Still, it's my own damn fault, really. You think after 5 years of getting cleaved I'd pick up on this.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 03 Jul 2010, 22:52
Considering I have never really played on a regular basis with a non-resto shaman, do enhancement shaman typically out-dps the usual top dps classes? (Mages, locks, etc.) Because holy crap does my shaman do a lot of damage. I haven't run with any rogues or other melee dps classes with my shaman yet (other than really bad cat druids*), so this is new to me.

*One in particular was ragging on a retadin (who was actually doing a good job) about what gear he had instead of fighting, so we all told the druid to just shut up and fight. They finally did, but instead of staying in cat form, they started casting but then ran up and just started hitting targets with their staff. Then they just stopped casting all together and just kept hitting things with they're staff. I had to have a few words with this person on how to properly play a druid, because that was all kinds of stupid to say shit about another player while not even playing their own character right.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 03 Jul 2010, 23:43
You have a lowbie shaman, right? Enhancement shaman are solid contributors, but they shouldn't be top dps at 80. Before then it's basically up for grabs though and will depend on the level range you're talking about and the player and gear more than anything else, particularly since heirloom weapons are so good. For example, in a situation where everyone's geared and tearing through things left and right I'd definitely take a lowbie warrior with glyphed cleave over a rogue, since we don't really have much AoE prior to 80. Some classes were simply designed more in mind for single target sustained dps back in the vanilla level ranges, so it doesn't always work so hot now that people just pull everything and tear through. Ultimately it's just leveling and everyone get the job done, so no biggie.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 04 Jul 2010, 00:02
Yeah they definitely don't outdps actual dpsers at 80, but whilst leveling enh shamans can crush just about anything.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 04 Jul 2010, 06:30
Ok, that's what I was thinking, but I'm ok with that because it makes leveling go so much faster. Hopefully soon I'll be level 40 and will get chainmail and shortly after that get dual wielding and crush even more things.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 04 Jul 2010, 07:26
Hybrid tax in raids, they boost raid dps but never top dps. Althought their personal dps is not anything special, they benefit the raid for haste & bl & totemz.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 04 Jul 2010, 22:27
Had my first chance at raid tanking tonight!  It went pretty well!  The guild is taking me into ICC10 tomorrow and it should be pretty fun.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 05 Jul 2010, 06:03
I don't know if people are better players than they used to be or they made classic dungeons easier, but we lost our tank about a third of the way through and since we didn't really want to wait around for who knows how long, I tanked with the warlock's pet and other than having to stop every now and then to get my mana back up, it went really well with just four of us. No one died, the pet and I kept the aggro off the squishies (the others were all cloth classes), and we went at a decent pace. But then luckily we got a tank for the last boss, which was right when a piece of my armor broke because I'd forgotten to repair before I started doing randoms. Oops.

Also I wish I would stop getting different versions of the same necklace, gloves, and shoulders. Only one of the shoulders has been leather, the rest are all mail (which I can't use yet!) and I'd like blues for other places.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 05 Jul 2010, 07:05
From the bags?  You only get certain slots at certain level ranges.  Here's a table from wowwwiki:

[Satchel of Helpful Goods (level 25)] Back / Waist
[Satchel of Helpful Goods (level 35)] Neck / Hands
[Satchel of Helpful Goods (level 45)] Shoulder / Finger
[Satchel of Helpful Goods (level 55)] Wrist / Feet
[Satchel of Helpful Goods (level 60)] Back / Waist
[Satchel of Helpful Goods (level 64)] Neck / Hands
[Satchel of Helpful Goods (level 70)] Shoulder / Finger
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 05 Jul 2010, 10:36
Ah ok, that explains it then.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 05 Jul 2010, 12:09
I don't know if people are better players than they used to be or they made classic dungeons easier, but we lost our tank about a third of the way through and since we didn't really want to wait around for who knows how long.

I think a huge part of it is the gear overhauls and the fact that more specs actually work as advertised now. Contributing as a hybrid was an uphill battle if you didn't go heals, after all.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 05 Jul 2010, 12:14
Heirloom gear+new talents and classes actually getting useful spells early on/general class overhaul+nerfed instances = Cakewalk dungeons.

Granted, every now and then people are still bad enough to make it hard, but there's no accounting for that much human error.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 05 Jul 2010, 20:38
You know, if I could just get the lootship offhand to drop and the Halion trinket, I'd be pretty satisfied with my gear (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Grizzly+Hills&cn=Intruder).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 05 Jul 2010, 20:46
Well you're much better off than (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bleeding+Hollow&cn=Kleptocracy) I (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bleeding+Hollow&cn=Shamois) am (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bleeding+Hollow&cn=Starsnostars)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Barmymoo on 06 Jul 2010, 04:16
Is this game as complex as it seems? I read this thread all the time and have no idea what's going on. If someone like me, who doesn't play games at all except for Urban Dead occasionally, were to start playing, would it be easy to figure out what to do?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 06 Jul 2010, 05:40
Yeah, I started playing about two years ago and had absolutely no idea what I was doing. You have 80 levels to figure this shit out and there is plenty of well explained information around on the web. It is a bit of a learning curve, but once you get the hang of things it all starts to click into place.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 06 Jul 2010, 05:56
It is rather easy to start out, but I think it's easier/more fun if you start out with people who already know what they're doing. Even if they aren't actually playing with you, but are around to answer questions. If not, wowwiki, wowhead, and thottbot are very useful sites to help get you rolling.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: BeoPuppy on 06 Jul 2010, 10:55
I always have the impression that there are two games called WoW out there. One for people who enjoy a good spreadsheet and a nice game and one for people who enjoy stories and a nice game. And it's sort of up to the player which game (or which mixture of the two) he/she wants to play.

Just start. And figure out which elements you enjoy. It's an easy game to get into.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Barmymoo on 06 Jul 2010, 14:45
Oh no, I am not going to start playing! I was just intrigued.

If I start playing I will fail my exams next year.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 06 Jul 2010, 21:07
Really?  Wiping on Marrowgar?  Come on.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 06 Jul 2010, 22:01
It happens.

Wait, nvm 25% buff.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 06 Jul 2010, 22:21
Fuckin' lootship just won't drop my damned axe or chestpiece.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 07 Jul 2010, 00:08
Got my new neck piece, got outbid on the BiS offhand for casters fffffffff.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 07 Jul 2010, 05:46
I found the worst healer ever last night. He (priest) burned through mana because he kept spamming his one AoE, the tank died once and then had to heal himself and I healed him a few times, he'd run away early in a fight and come back having pulled mobs, and he kept on doing this even after we told him to stop. Well, he stopped doing as much dps after I told him a healer should not be #2 on my damage chart, but he'd still randomly run away and still managed to out dps a warrior. I left soon after the tank, but luckily I got a jewelcrafting recipe before I did.

Did the same dungeon about half an hour later with almost the same group build (rogue instead of a warrior) and it was so much better and I leveled up. 2 more levels and I get mail, dual wield, and a faster mount, woot.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: BeoPuppy on 07 Jul 2010, 06:10
Ugh. I hate it when people refuse to play their chosen role in a dungeon. Been in dungeons where the 'tank' simply refused to tank but did pull mobs for others to tank.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 07 Jul 2010, 15:24
That's why I don't select healing on my shaman for randoms. I can heal and I'm sure I could heal ok if I had enough mana breaks, but I don't want to do it, therefore I don't select it. I don't care about the wait. If I care, I go heal on my druid.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 13 Jul 2010, 06:10
Level 40! Epic mount, mail, lots of new spells... Also I still have some gold left over from my hack, so I went ahead and dual spec'd resto. I don't plan on healing much for now, but later on it will be really useful and the friend in my guild who's healing currently is a shadow priest, so it might be a good thing to have it if he sticks with shadow and doesn't double spec as holy or disc later on when we're all the same level and doing things together. And I've got a few random pieces of gear that can be used for healing now if I decide I want to.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 13 Jul 2010, 09:27
shaman+spriest+mage=GTFO.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 13 Jul 2010, 19:02
Currently, my grouping for random dungeons that I do with my friends currently is warrior+shaman+mage+priest+random person. We clear things really fast.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 13 Jul 2010, 21:40
shaman+spriest+mage=GTFO.

What comp were you running, if I may ask?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 14 Jul 2010, 02:19
I was wld on atr, play warr/druid on live since the lock we had was unreliable to be on at all and not dc (mt in my guild's lock) and starting tsg with 2 guys from my guild (dk just got smourne) but we raiding 5 hours a night 3-4 days a week and after it nobody can be fucked to do any games.

So yeh my hate for bloodlusted spriests chasing ME round pillars (now I get why they like doing it) dotting me up then kiting comes from atr/being a warrior. If I see bloodlust over a caster icon I generally have a 45sec close relationship with the nearest LoS before I /train the priest or whatever. If it's RoV I go offensive and pray. Humans with hc muradins and dfo piss me off manz, the latter is not even fantastic for pvp but still it's obscene.

You ask the question as if you think wizards are balanced and you don't think haste is a bigger mistake than arp.

And for what it's worth, on atr I ran str/crit with about 1250 res, no arp and the only pve gear was polar bear bracers, frost badge belt and hc deaths verdict. Duelling shadows edge pve heroes with 850 res was a laugh and I honestly would do it on live if I had/could roll on hc DV or hc WFS but no, softcap and nes :(
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 14 Jul 2010, 02:51
You ask the question as if you think wizards are balanced and you don't think haste is a bigger mistake than arp.

 :roll:

I asked the question because I was going to help you with strategies. I actually play both a warrior and ele/resto shaman between 2400-2500 in 3s, and I played shatterplay to 2536 this season. If you can elaborate on specific problems, I can probably help you with solutions.

If you're running TSG and run into shatterplay, split dps with the DK shutting down the mage and you on the spriest. The mage should easily be forced defensive from the pressure of a 'mourne dk, even with lust up, and warriors can tear a spriest apart if the mage has to focus on peeling for himself rather than for his partners. Have your dk focus grip/MF/gnaw/strangulate the rshaman, if he gets a good grip and manages to spread diseases, you can also pretty much global the shaman when he gets below 75% with a grip into a strangulate/bladestorm.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 15 Jul 2010, 10:14
I would never have thought of splitting, woulda just been train the priest while keeping los from lock till dispersion then switch to lock till port then back to priest then lock then I dunno lol.

I dun like haste.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 15 Jul 2010, 10:34
Yeah, I share a shadow priest for arena purposes and Dazed's suggestion is a good one. Fending off a warrior without the benefit of peels is roughly as enjoyable as pissing glass.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 15 Jul 2010, 13:16
Wait, are you playing vs Shadowplay(lock/spriest/rsham) or Shatterplay(fmage/spriest/rsham)? Shadowplay should be a fairly easy game for you, depending on the map, just blow immunity effects, have your paladin hammer the spriest, and jump on the lock before he gets a port down (if RoV/dalaran/ruins). Only map I can see shadowplay being a challenge is Blade's edge, then I'd probably employ more or less the same strat as vs a shatter team, just have the dk lock down the warlock and keep him away from your paladin so no instant fears.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 15 Jul 2010, 17:35
I just don't like wizards. I got hc bryntroll today. Gonna try for some games with it soon when meatlife/raiding/work is not in the way.

Oh and on EU ATR 8 final teams are...

3 LSD's < Woo casters going apeshit damages because of the pve trinks
2 RMP's < same old
2 African turtles < Replaces beastcleave?
1 WLD(with hpala sub) < I am a Hoodrch fanboi.

so from this we take that in the hands of very good players and at a "balanced" gear level, prot is move viable than arms in these comps and also rmp is still good and bloodlust makes happy warlocks.

Oh and arguably one of the least cheese/gimmick comps needs a backup healer. I am glad to see no dispel cleave, probs not enough heroic ICC gear maybes? I dueled a good prot warr on atr a while ago, he tore me apart in literally seconds. I might not know how to play well against them but I felt humiliated. Maybe it's because you can get dps and tank 2pt10 bonuses, blood queen shield, some wrathful offset, 2 obscene dps trinks, 1p wrathful with neck/ring/1h and rock out 350 res and still shit on casters before they can get their trink to proc.

Opinions?

I like ATR sometimes because in live there are so many more deciding factors in rng loot and tier differences between players but I am not 100% sure this outcome in teams is not purely because these comps benefit most within the gear restrictions.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 15 Jul 2010, 18:08
Prot is pretty strong right now. I don't think it's stronger than arms, except in 1 comp, and in duels. Arms warriors have always lost duels to almost any equally skilled/geared opponent though, I don't see why that's an issue when they're so strong in group play.

Also, the US TR top 8 was

1. TSG 2. Beastcleave 3. LSD 4. MLD 5. Ele/Shadow/Rdruid 6. WLD 7. MLS 8. Hunter/Lock/Druid.

TSG actually had 2 teams in the top 8, but obviously they can only take up 1 spot at regionals. It looks like the #3 LSD and the #7 MLS probably won't go to regionals either, and will probably be replaced by an RLS and another beastcleave. So the top 8 was slightly caster heavy, although much more diverse than the EU top 8; and regionals will likely be actually fairly even, between melee teams (TSG, beastcleaves) and caster teams (MLD/Talbadar's team) and balanced teams (WLD, HLD, RLS).

That said, balancing pvp around what the very best players in the world are capable of when given the very best gear is a horrible design decision. The high end arena population is less than 1% of people who play the game.


Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 16 Jul 2010, 00:00
I'm raiding again! With a guild that does everything on 25 Heroic. Eeeee! I got the Heroic Frozen Bonespike because the other mage had it already. I was very excited. They were all great and explained everything for me because I'd only ever done Marrowgar and Lootship on heroic before.

In other news - my friend quit WoW. She gave me her account which has 4 80's on it, one of which is a resto druid with a tank offspec. My other friend has mentioned that perhaps the druid is geared wrong, but I don't really know what I'm looking at, but I'd love to be able to play this druid so I don't have to level my own. Maybe you guys could take a look and offer some advice? I'll be transferring the druid off the server it's on now to the one that my main is on so that they can be in the same guild.

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Moon+Guard&cn=Lianora
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 16 Jul 2010, 00:44
Killed heroic Sindragosa. It wasn't hard.

Just the man himself left on heroic now, anticipating that will be a bit more of a challenge.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: BeoPuppy on 16 Jul 2010, 01:05
Wouldn't it be funny if it turned out to be a dwarf on a footstool behind a curtain?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 16 Jul 2010, 15:52
Jmrz, all I can suggest is definitely to get the chest piece to complete the set, invest in better gems, and try to get more mp5 items. You've got a ton of spirit, which is great, but only a few pieces have mp5 which is important for healing. You've got a good balance of haste, crit, and sp, so get some more mp5 (which you could possibly get from gems?) and you should be ok.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 16 Jul 2010, 16:47
That druid rolls with double Solace. It doesn't need mana regen, trust me. If you're going OOM with that pairing, it's time to look at your playstyle first and foremost.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 16 Jul 2010, 17:44
That's the only thing I could find what might be "wrong" with it. Honestly, I don't think anything is wrong with it, but mp5 is the only thing I could think of that could possibly be lacking.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 16 Jul 2010, 19:01
It's honestly a pretty solid gear set. I'd like to see more haste (at the expense of crit, if possible) but that looks mostly like a symptom of having some old ToGC gear and an OK but not amazing cloth belt as opposed to "Ur doing it wrong." I'd take the Sundial (http://www.wowhead.com/item=50423) over that Chalice in a heartbeat, for example, but the Chalice was a hot item back in the day, and unless the Sundial drops that's a moot point. And please, for the love of god, don't give up Trauma for anything but a Heroic Trauma. That thing is ridiculous in the hands of a raid healing tree, so staves are right out.

As far as gemming goes, the general rule you'll hear at places like EJ and such is that trees shouldn't be trying to patch up holes in their gear with gemming at the high end. You just end up losing too much spell power and you won't even get enough haste/spirit/mp5/whatever to actually fix anything, particularly if you're skipping socket bonuses just to load up. So keep on gemming spell power and use whatever combo of SP+Haste/Int/Spir gems you have to in order to net good socket bonuses. If you really need to change your performance from fight to fight, you should try getting your hands on a few game changing trinkets and swap those babies around if you're having real issues. Frankly, that's why I'm a li'l jealous of you for getting that druid. You already have the two best overall mana regen trinkets in the game right now, with the Heroic one still being a BIS item, so you're already over halfway there. Just get yourself an Althor's Abacus and you'll be able switch up for anything.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 16 Jul 2010, 20:25
Thanks heaps!

Yeah, the gear it has doesn't look too bad. It does need a few hundred more haste, but I think that is definitely something that can be fixed with gear upgrades in spots. From everything I've heard is that druids don't stack mp5, but spirit instead? I have absolutely no mana issues and so far I've only run a couple of heroics. The mana regen from the trinkets is really nice. I respec'd a bit differently to put points into Celestial Focus and regem'd to put some more Reckless Ametrines (sp/haste) in.

I just need to change up my UI to something more healer specific and just try my hand at pugging some raids.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 17 Jul 2010, 13:37
I was gonna comment on tanking gear for it but it has always been in tree gear with those double solaces making me wish it was a human priest/hpala.

You could get a priest/lock draining you all day long and after 3gcd's of LoS have enough mana to heall your partner back up to full.

Solace is the first word in mana stability.

For tank gear, get rogue pieces with tasty stam and some hit/exp on it to get capped, agi/stam in helm if it's a red socket for the meta and then gem stam everywhere else and ench stam like a madman (18 stam patch thingy on gloves, 22 agi on cloak I think and I am pretty sure for druids 10 stats on chest is better than 275hp). It's all druids really have, the HC gunship chest is BiS for drood tanks which is good as it is ez to get and since it's all rogue gear threat should not be a problem.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 20 Jul 2010, 22:41
Are the frost resistance pieces still necessary for Sindragosa with the buff?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: beat mouse on 20 Jul 2010, 22:57
frost resist isn't really necessary without the buff, if your raid knows where to position, the most danger comes from arcane damage in phase 3.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 21 Jul 2010, 00:07
We never used FrR.

Also, nothing is necessary with the buff. Went into 25 on my warrior today and had 52k hp whilst dpsing. This is seriously over the top.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Jul 2010, 00:09
Yeah, I'm running around with about 47k these days and I'm a friggin' rogue.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 21 Jul 2010, 00:37
I use frost res still! Chest and ring only. Lets me be really lazy and not move while tanking even if I get to 7 stacks. Got the trink off her last nite so now both tanks have it I see no reason not to start trying it hc25.

tsg is taking some getting used to from playing wld (I get trained like a bitch) but doing more damage than a dbw smourne dk with hc skilltroll and nes spending half matches sword and board is gratifying :-D
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 21 Jul 2010, 20:06
Whoohoo.

(http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j145/tenkali/WoWScrnShot_072110_224546.jpg)

I'm on the far left  :-)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 22 Jul 2010, 17:13
GZ, need lk 30 stacks one, hc BP 10 and sindra all you can eat one. But I think those are the 3 hardest ones or something.

Tonight was the first attempts on sindra hc25, 5.3% was our best then we got cursed with people DC'ing or dying in p1. On the best try I honestly thought we had a kill as I looked at the 5.x% hp then realised the only people left standing were a DI'd shaman, a priest and me. Lots of grey all over grid is bad.

30% buff makes me feel like a bad tbh even if some raiders are fucking morons getting carried or thirdworlders DC'ing all the time from their Albanian dialup.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 22 Jul 2010, 17:55
Yeah, my 21k dps on H LDW (25) was a little ridiculous on the 30% buff. It levelled out to a solid 16k by the time we wiped (still ridiculous).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 22 Jul 2010, 18:05
I wouldn't be able to handle optimizing an arcane mage, particularly on H-LDW. I'm a perfectionist and an awful lot of being the best mage you can be is estimating just how far you have to stretch your mana bar. Lord knows I'd end up cutting it close only to have my guildies go "DERP" and get themselves blown up by ghosts, sending things into serious mana conservation territory. Annoying.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 22 Jul 2010, 18:18
I get lucky sometimes and the druids will throw me an innervate. Other than that, mana gems all the way, blow evocate every time it comes off CD or when it's definitely needed (I'll either blow it early so I have it back for when I hit 20%, or just wait it out and use mana gems to keep it up). I'll also only do two or three AB's if I need to save the mana.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 22 Jul 2010, 18:33
It's all manageable right up to the Innervates thing. Me playing a mage would end up in a long trail of burned bridges and angry druids.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 22 Jul 2010, 19:28
Heroic princes is really easy, and I didn't find the sind one hard either.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 22 Jul 2010, 20:52
Yeah, I never ask for innervates, because they tend to throw them at themselves or other healers in need. But if I'm standing there looking useless I do occasionally get one or the shammies throw their mana totems down.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 23 Jul 2010, 00:37
I never been in a raid where we had a good setup to do blood princes 10 hc so I never got a chance which sucks as 25man hc has been on farm since early 20% buff. As for the other 2 achies we just never tried em I dunno how hard they are, just thinking about it seems like sindra one is hard for tank swaps on only 4 stacks, a keyboard turning prot pala MT means I have been left holding the bag on three times as many stacks in the past. I can only guess the LK one is slow dps in p1 stretching it out for as long as possible?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 23 Jul 2010, 01:37
You just run the first disease out of the group and cleanse it away entirely, so enough mobs stack up that you don't run out of them. Then go as normal but with slow/no dps until the disease gets stacked up. Only danger is your tanks getting absolutely wrecked.

Do you try to do princes with a lock tank or with regular tanks? It's absurdly easy to lock tank.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 23 Jul 2010, 05:36
Unless I really need it, I try to use innervate on other casters, especially if I have pots and whatnot. On my shaman, I've been keeping up my mana totem, but that's because my mana regen right now is abysmal. I would invest in new gear, but what's the point when you're levelling up pretty fast and would only use new pieces for a week or two.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 24 Jul 2010, 06:07
I kind of hate the fact that I've only just now started raiding this late in the expansion.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: KharBevNor on 26 Jul 2010, 05:13
I've just started playing again. Just been having fun finishing up quests and getting cracking with the rep grinds. I'm gonna need to start on the whole endgame content train at some point, but my guild has disintegrated whilst I was away and I'm not quite at the def cap yet, though I'm fairly sure I can reach it easily by getting all my gear enchanted, and maybe some better rings and some rep gear. I think I'll just find some social levelling guild and wait to start running heroics with the other casuals. As always, I find myself drawn more towards secondary goals (getting a motorbike! fishing and cooking achievments! PETSSSSSS!) than hardkore 1337 raiding. What's the minimum unbuffed HP for a 5-man heroic tankadin?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 26 Jul 2010, 10:41
I think I had about 22k hp UB on my first successful naxx clear, that was after farming hc's for ilv 200 gear.

As for 10 man I got stuck on keleseth this week and we killed them pretty easy (lol 30%). Guild has 2 warlocks neither of whom do 10 mans, 25hcsindra dies tonite, then only hc lk on 10 and 25.

Also since not having dbw I ditched arp gear and I am going str/crit for pvp so I should have 1200ish resil and 5100ap and 38% crit which should be about 6kap and 40% crit tsg buffed, I figure this many wizards arp is kinda loose.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: beat mouse on 26 Jul 2010, 11:05
What's the minimum unbuffed HP for a 5-man heroic tankadin?

this is the wrong question, paladins have so many tricks and bubbles and there are some great trinkets (reg nerub and TOC) that will allow you to hit the heroic defense cap of 535, and after that you can farm heroics quite rapidly. Once I hit the heroic cap I was in 4/5 t9 after one day of farming, and within a week was tanking raids and doing hardmode achieves.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 26 Jul 2010, 12:09
Sindra 25 hc is easy as piss until 15% when it all goes tits up.

Fucking dragon.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 26 Jul 2010, 13:19
Khar if you have enough gold you can buy some crafted gear and that will put you up nicely.  You can also run the ICC5-mans on normal and they drop some nice tanking gear.

When I first started doing heroics on my tankadin there were druid healers that complained that there health was higher than mine.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: beat mouse on 26 Jul 2010, 13:45
I occasionally got complaints about low HP counts but they stopped when I was doing 8k DPS without dropping past 40%.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 26 Jul 2010, 15:11
I love pally tanks. Why I have not made one yet is beyond me, but I love running things with them. Maybe that'll be my next character after I finish leveling my shaman...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 26 Jul 2010, 16:31
I've just started playing again. Just been having fun finishing up quests and getting cracking with the rep grinds.

I wouldn't go out of your way to hit Exalted in reps unless you like doing the dailies for gold and fun anyway. The epic stuff is really, really easy to replace now that the ICC5 mans are in and a lot of them aren't really all that much better than the blues you can get for Honored and Revered. The Tabard system helps get the rep out of the way, but these days you'll usually be raking in new gear too fast too really care much about the rep stuff by the time you hit exalted. The only one I'd say that's really vital to get is Revered in the Argent Crusade. That'll let you get the 37 Stam/20 Defense rating helm enchant, which is basically irreplaceable and you'll also get access to the Special Issue Legplates, (http://www.wowhead.com/item=44240#comments) which are a nice stopgap until you have some badges and heroic gear under your belt. The other reputations are basically optional for tanks. The Sons of Hodir faction is nice if you want the Greater Inscription of the Pinnacle, (http://www.wowwiki.com/Greater_Inscription_of_the_Pinnacle) but it's not really necessary when you consider that many tanks prefer the PvP inscription (http://www.wowwiki.com/Greater_Inscription_of_the_Gladiator). 10k honor is really, really cheap these days. A little goofing around on a holiday weekend and you'll have enough for a couple enchants and some gems besides.

Most of all, don't worry about jumping into 5 mans too early as long as you hit the defense cap. At this point, it's really easy to overgear 5 mans even if the tank is a weak link. Me and a healer two manned Anub'Arak the other day in Azjol-Nerub, for example, and I'm just a rogue.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 26 Jul 2010, 16:59
Only LK to go hc on 10 or 25, can't be fucked going more than 11/12 hc 10/25. Don't see the point because I know it's gonna be more trouble than it could possibly be worth.

Also horn of winter and BoK don't stack so buffed and trink/ring/wep procced I got 7882ap minus 5% armour worth of 3/3 armoured to the teeth is 7860ap which sounds almost feral druidy. Burst to blow shit up is cool and so is not needing to worry about min-maxing of arp. Just need wrathful pants when we grind rating this week and I should have 1200 resil, is tough on 20 games one night a week :(
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: KharBevNor on 26 Jul 2010, 17:44
Quote from: Alex C link=topic=20726.msg9527
Most of all, don't worry about jumping into 5 mans too early as long as you hit the defense cap. At this point, it's really easy to overgear 5 mans even if the tank is a weak link. Me and a healer two manned Anub'Arak the other day in Azjol-Nerub, for example, and I'm just a rogue.

Thing is, I haven't really been in a dungeon full stop for about a year, plus WoW (or my server anyway) seems to have got completely unforgiving of the unexperienced. Gearscore, link achievments etc. I'm only really interested in gearing for endgame so I can be shit-hot for the release of Cataclysm. Although it will probably be personally fun for me to get the end-game dungeons and raids down first time, I think it'lll be much more fun to crack into new content when it's actually new.

In other news, 50 Pets. yussss.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 26 Jul 2010, 19:06
Yeah, people will dicks about some things, but well, fuck those guys. The important things is knowing the fights, really. Checking out some basic info about the instances you're heading into and doing most of 'em on normal once or twice first should get you up to speed. Once upon a time most every one but Sunwell/Black temple raiders was in your gearing situation, after all, so it's not like the content isn't doable. Still, I can see where you're coming from. It's supposed to be a game, not some thing you fire up so people can bitch at you for having only 22k health.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: KharBevNor on 28 Jul 2010, 07:38
If I have a def rating of 529, decreasing chance to be hit or critically hit by 5.16%, and 153 resilience (reducing chance to be critically hit by 1.62%), is that is good as being at the def cap through raw defence?

The resilience is off the super epic horde medallion, I had to spend the fucking honour points on something.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 28 Jul 2010, 13:26
For the purposes of being uncrittable, yes.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: KharBevNor on 28 Jul 2010, 16:56
Isn't that basically the point of the def cap as a benchmark though?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: kemon on 28 Jul 2010, 17:00
yes, but defense gives other benefits on top of the uncrittable.  going past the "defense cap" isn't bad per se.  you just get more benefit from pure dodge/parry after you're uncrittable. 
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 28 Jul 2010, 17:30
Yeah, it's technically more accurate to call it the defense soft cap* or "uncrittable," since defense never really loses all of its value in achievable gear. I just replied the way I did so some goober can't come in and start giving me shit for green lighting resilience as a tanking stat. Point for point, resilience reduces your chance to be critted more than anything else, actually. It just doesn't do much else as far as PvE is concerned, which is why people don't stack it.

Anyway, the PvP trinket actually isn't a bad band-aid solution at all. Unless your a jewelcrafter your trinket options before heroics and emblem gear really, REALLY suck. At least that trinket will let you just slap in higher item level gear without having to juggle as much defense rating just to stay uncrittable. You'll still obviously want to get the Corroded Skeleton Key and the Glyph of Indomitability when you can, but as far as immediate solutions go it's a good one.


*Nobody really does this.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: KharBevNor on 28 Jul 2010, 17:56
Yeah, I'm talking about the def cap as a bare minimum requirement for tanking heroics. Obviously I will eventually be looking to stack as much defence as I possibly can.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 30 Jul 2010, 12:35
Obviously I will eventually be looking to stack as much stamina as I possibly can once crit immune.
Fix'd.

Get 5.6% reduction of chance to be crit via defence and perhaps a little res, then you stack stam like a mad cunt.

At least until you have BiS and stuff then you can think about min/maxing.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 02 Aug 2010, 05:51
Fuck yeah 25man Kingslayer! :D
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 02 Aug 2010, 12:03
GZ, I remember my first lk 25 kill, was such an anticlimax cuz it seems so easy once you stop playing with cripples.

Also holy shit (http://www.mmo-champion.com/content/1893-LK-25-No-Buff-Kill-SSOTDs-Blue-Posts-L800ETC)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Yakob on 02 Aug 2010, 15:37
There should be an achievement for that shit.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 02 Aug 2010, 16:31
We'd been trying Sindy on Heroic for a couple of nights, closest that I saw us get to was 26%. We ended up doing it on normal last night just to finish the raid and it was such a cakewalk.

I had a bit of "WTF WHY ARE WE ALL DEAD! WE DIDN'T DO ANYTHING WRONG, EVERYONE WAS ALIVE" moment at the end of the LK fight because I hadn't watched any of the videos or anything, so I had no idea what was going on. Good thing common sense prevailed and I didn't release because Arthas was yapping.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 02 Aug 2010, 20:06
That part was idiot-proofed. If you try to release, soulstone rez, or ankh during the RP it won't let you because "The Lich King owns your soul."
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 05 Aug 2010, 06:07
After many a cracked egg full of cobra hatchlings and tickbirds, I finally got a proto-drake whelp pet. I feel like I'm getting closer to the green proto-drake...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 06 Aug 2010, 11:47
I am now an orc.

sup.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 06 Aug 2010, 13:06
Woo Horde.

Why the race change?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 07 Aug 2010, 06:15
Was dorf, then cow, then noem then orc.

My guild (Who I FC'd for in the first place after they contacted me when I was sitting guildless in dala) got 11/12 hc 25 then stopped raiding for summer so I switched back to play with friends.

It is good to be back.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Sorflakne on 11 Aug 2010, 22:58
Quote
plus WoW (or my server anyway) seems to have got completely unforgiving of the unexperienced. Gearscore, link achievments etc
This is why I'm starting to hate WoW.  My server too, you can't get a group for something unless you have either a 5.5k GS, the achievement(s), or both.  I've got 10/12 ICC experience, but only killed 7 of the bosses.  I count the other three bosses because I know the mechanics of their encounters and what to do for my role, groups I've been in just haven't killed them.  And it didn't help either that I went for a two month span where my Internet connection was absolute crap and I couldn't keep a stable connection even in Silithus (even there I was 10k-30k+ latency).

Doesn't fly with the achievement-tards though.  If the boss's name isn't green in your linked achievement, you obviously don't know how that fight works and just want to be carried for gear and suck at the game blah blah, all that crap.


Forgive my jadedness, but that's pretty much my experiences.  I'm almost tempted to just app to a guild again, but looking at my guild experiences over the last five years, I'd almost rather just be on my own and play 'mercenary' rather than deal with the politics and drama of a guild (even the best guilds have crap buried in them).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 11 Aug 2010, 23:26
Yeah, one of the fringe benefits of being in a current content guild is that frankly, I don't even know what my GS is exactly.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 12 Aug 2010, 06:06
I feel happy with my current guild. Yes it's new and very small, but everyone is someone I know and we're not die hard about the game. A few have done the hardcore raiding thing, but right now everyone is relaxed and happy doing their own thing. A few of us have 80s or are very close to being 80, so when that happens we're going to start doing a lot of heroics together so that we can start doing 10 mans. Right now I absolutely refuse to judge players by achievements, because some people (like me) just didn't happen to be around when everyone was doing the lower level raids and therefore got stuck. Achievements tell you nothing except that player happened to be there when a boss died, not how well they actually play their character and what their disposition is like. (Not that I really care about progression, but I want to be able to experience a lot of these places at least once and I'm not going to do it with elitists or people that are just asshats to everyone.) So at some point we'll all get there and I'll probably start recruiting people, but we're a very relaxed guild and I want to keep it that way.

But a fun thing that some of us are going to do are 70+ raids of MC before Cataclysm comes out. I think it'll be fun! I've done several of the classic 60 dungeons by myself, so we'll see how MC goes with a handful of 70-80 players.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 12 Aug 2010, 09:09
Rather put up with guild drama than PUG's and ninja lootaz.

And lv 60 raids get boring as shit, yeah I can solo most bosses with a bloodthirst/prot spec but all the mechanics make it impossible to do without some assistance on switches and doors or whatever the shit.

I am twinking a priest! I AM THE KING OF THE HELLFIRE PENINSULA FLAGS!

Priests are dumb, I beat a level 67 hunter and 59 DK at the same time and 1v2'd prot warrior(65) hunter(62) like 5 times one night. Or 3v1'ing a bunch of 59-62 DK's. Also shadowpriests, wtf they are so pathetic.

http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Hellscream&cn=Mel%C3%ADssa

I got the 81SP enchant on the hellfire citadel 2h staff but used the heirloom shoulders and staff because of the hit and resilience because I was killing higher lv's at the time and they are hard to hit.

You know you are doing something rite when someone logs their 80 shaman.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 12 Aug 2010, 12:08
And lv 60 raids get boring as shit, yeah I can solo most bosses with a bloodthirst/prot spec but all the mechanics make it impossible to do without some assistance on switches and doors or whatever the shit.

I don't think it'll be boring, but if it is, that means we just get to goof off more. I think it'll happen a few times and then maybe we'll move on to something else. A few people are new to WoW but have leveled quickly and a few are veterans but didn't get to do much classic end content, so it's something to do together and have fun before things get completely revamped.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 13 Aug 2010, 20:07
Question for those who maintain, have maintained, or frequently use their guild bank:

How are your tabs organized? I am not really sure how I should organize them in a way that makes sense according to rank, since everyone in my guild right now are friends and are therefore trustworthy. Any tips or just a list of what's in your guild's tabs would be helpful.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 13 Aug 2010, 20:42
We have consumables (flasks/foods/pots) in one tab, tradeskill items (enchanting mats, ores/bars etc) in another, old world nonsense (elementium, ingots, bijous/scarabs/idols) in another. That's really all we need, most of us (not me) have bank alts with their own guild banks and such.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 14 Aug 2010, 07:16
Bankalts ftw. Oh and as for vanilla content, it is awesome but do it as close to 60 as possible, it's still fun but take a 70 tank and a 70 healer just in case, I found a lv60-70 guild so I am stoked.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 14 Aug 2010, 08:46
I have a bank alt, but I forget to use it half the time and usually only use it when I'm selling stuff to make room in the guild bank. I was on last night clearing stuff out and decided we really needed a 4th tab, because we really need the room. There's a LOT of crafted items (gems, glyphs, enchants, pots) and a LOT of mats (cloth, herbs, dusts/shards, metals, uncut gems, etc), and several recipes, but that seems to be it right now because of lack of space. And though I currently trust everyone in my guild right now, I want to recruit and I don't trust new people, so I'm torn as to what to put in a tab that everyone could use. I guess a few consumables and low level things that are completely miscellaneous?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 14 Aug 2010, 09:05
One thing that I like in my guild is that we keep a bunch of Northrend uncommon quality gems in the public tab so people can grab a spare gem now and again when doing the JC dailies rather than have to make a trip to the AH just 'cuz they're short a single dark jade. We treat it as sort of a take a penny, leave a penny tray. Hardly a big deal, but it's convenient, particularly since on my server people really like to price gouge on single gems.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 14 Aug 2010, 09:14
That sounds like a good idea.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 14 Aug 2010, 14:45
I just trinked a bash to pummel a nourish and kill the druid in 2v2.

Kinda feel like God.

ITT bad's playing like good arena players for 5 GCD's.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 15 Aug 2010, 19:45
So MC is pretty fun and not too bad with 4 80s and 2 65s. We're going to go again later this week I think.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: beat mouse on 16 Aug 2010, 01:04
There was a time when there was a group of us that did BWL/MC for old tier loot that was my pally tank, a kitty druid, and a rogue, which was a lot of fun. It's hard to learn old fights at this stage in the game because of how different the game was then, and I had forgotten just how rough some of those nights fighting Chromaggus really were.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jimor on 18 Aug 2010, 20:18
My server was one of the ones down yesterday for 24-hour maintenance, so I thought I'd roll a Horde character on another server for the heck of it.

When I hit the start area (which was infested with new players, the spawns could barely keep up with demand), I got an invite to a guild called "My Server Is Down" that a guy started. There were so many people doing the same thing as me, by the time the day was over, this brand new guild had over 360 members. Of course, most will be gone today and never come back, but it was cool, and there is at least a core of us who are going to try to make a go of it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 20 Aug 2010, 11:51
Ptch, in my day all we had was lv 1 hogger raids with noems when our server went down.

Hogger killed entirely by heroic strike, sinister strike and fireball.

Most people never made it past the wolves.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 23 Aug 2010, 20:21
(http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs188.ash2/45148_765170959315_21400308_41598996_5124004_n.jpg)

Ragnaros is dead!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 23 Aug 2010, 21:02
That takes me back.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 24 Aug 2010, 21:25
VADER IS LUKE'S DAD.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 24 Aug 2010, 21:27
ORRRRRANGE HAMMMMMERRRRRR
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 25 Aug 2010, 04:50
So with a mix of 65s and 80s, we did rather well. So while we wait for the others to catch up to start end game stuff, we'll be doing weekly/bi-weekly classic raids just for the hell of it.

Does anyone run a guild website? Or are they even necessary?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 25 Aug 2010, 14:21
They're usually just glorified forums, but there's nothing wrong with that if you can get people on board and involved. It's nice to have place to put up links to specific boss strats that you want to follow, but they're not terribly necessary.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 25 Aug 2010, 17:42
Meh. I'll stick with my Facebook group for now.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 25 Aug 2010, 19:44
Hey, we got a few new healers and no legendary hammer in the raid this week!

You know what that means?


(http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a207/Xyljin/Beeeetraaaaays.png)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 25 Aug 2010, 20:21
9/12hc in new guild today.

As fury.

FUCK.

RAIDING.

Yeh one raid as DPS and already I wanna give up raiding.

Fury is shit.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 25 Aug 2010, 20:52
Sindragosa

haahahaa oh god I fucking hate sindragosa.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 26 Aug 2010, 01:23
Speaking of Sindragosa
(http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q107/Cire27/WoWScrnShot_082610_015051.jpg?t=1282810960)

I finally got into an alright guild and downed her for the first time.  Woo, go me.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 26 Aug 2010, 21:08
Might end up needing a new guild. I'm geared enough where it shouldn't be -too- hard, but I just don't really want to make the effort to find one. :(
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 27 Aug 2010, 01:53
I joined a t2 pvp guild.

I'm done fucking dragons, I don't want to put effort into LK HC attempts so there is nothing else raid wise I can hope to achieve this expansion.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 02 Sep 2010, 12:08
I have to say the nice thing about having nothing to do but do randoms during the day has paid off. Got this (http://www.wowarmory.com/item-info.xml?i=47712) and this (http://www.wowarmory.com/item-info.xml?i=47690) today as well as getting exalted with Wyrmrest Accord to get the red drake. I'm just happy to be over 4000gs now...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 03 Sep 2010, 10:01
Sucks when people without putri or sindra or blood queen rag on you because you don't have lots of ilv 277 gear. Yeh, I saw it drop, and I saw it go to the guy who constantly had loot prio because of the guild rank.

Scrubs with smourne bragging about it, you can get it without even a ks normal achie. It should req a hc LK25 kill tbh and if you ain't downed all end quarter bosses you ain't shit so don't rag on me for not being a loot whore.

/rant @ hc icc pugs.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 03 Sep 2010, 10:15
Got a phishing scam in my druid's mailbox today for a cataclysm beta test. Beware!

Also I finally got an epic weapon drop (from Oculus). Nothing extraordinary, but I bought a mace from Wyrmrest Accord yesterday to replace the mace I'd been carrying around for who knows how long. Yes, I know the rep weapons are bad, but it was an improvement, that's how bad that mace was. But hooray for a weapon I can actually use dropping! I needed that pretty bad. I only have to replace my cape and one trinket and then I'm finally away from superior items. Then I can work on getting t9 stuff and hopefully I can start raiding casually with my guild.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 08 Sep 2010, 17:42
I did the Cata lead up quest for Alliance last night! It's kind of fun! You get a gnome suit.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 08 Sep 2010, 21:05
I started to do the quests but there was a bug with the speeches, so I had to stop. Also everyone was standing on the quest givers, which was very annoying. But it's cool! A fleet of gnomes follows you from Ironforge!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 09 Sep 2010, 02:12
Trolls for us, worse pre-expansion event so far, all you get is a lousy cloak which vendors for a gold.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 10 Sep 2010, 05:38
And a GNOME SUIT! I am pretty amused by the gnome suit. Even though the event was short, I still found it entertaining enough.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 10 Sep 2010, 06:37
The gnome suit was definitely worth it! I did everything but the battle on my DK with a friend (we're both around lvl 60) and then I went off and tanked in that suit. It was cracking me up. I wish that it didn't have a 4 hour cooldown though.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: axerton on 11 Sep 2010, 05:33
I would assume this isn't going to be the last pre expansion event, given the zombie plauge last time only happened in the time between 3.02 being put out and the actually launch of wrath (I'm pretty sure anyway, I seem to remember varian fighting a frost wyrm in stormwind habour) I would assume another event is to come, probably something like *cataclysm hits, everythings burning people are dying do your bit to help out* which if they do it right could be pretty sweet.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 12 Sep 2010, 16:52
I got my Heroic Nightmare Ender! Huzzah! The DFO dropped as well, but I didn't have the gold to buy that. The wand cost me 10k and we got 10k from the GKP pot, so free wand! :D

I am back to GKP raiding now and we're doing 11/12 in a four hour stint. About half on heroic. It's pretty fun and it gets all my raiding over and done with in one day. AND I make money from it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 14 Sep 2010, 11:18
gdkp on my realm has 45 signups, I am one of them so regularly I end up not being picked and just pugging up to hc lootship for bracers/shoulders/1h axe and then asking to leave.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 19 Sep 2010, 08:05
Has anyone been having problems with playing a character, WoW shutting down, and then not being able to log onto that particular character without being immediately kicked off again? This has been happening the past few days, first on my druid and now on my horde alt. I've probably send Blizzard at least 10 error messages in the past two days. I deleted my addons and the files they always suggest deleting and still it's happening. I've also scanned for spyware and whatnot and nothing has popped up. I'm not sure if this is because of the patches or what, because it's certainly not my internet connection or diskspace on my computer. (And it's definitely fast enough, because it's less than a year old.)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 20 Sep 2010, 06:08
The only DC's I have had have been 1 in 25 man blood princes where fps lag got insane and I got DC'd and like 3 times in 2v2 once on Nagrand arena and then on Dalaran sewers.

Both were recent, what were you doing when you got DC'd?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 20 Sep 2010, 08:47
The first time, I entered a random (from somewhere in Icecrown) w/ my druid and was immediately booted. I tried logging back in on the same char, which failed every time. I tried my shaman and it worked fine. I deleted the Interface, WTF, and all AddOns and I could log back in my druid. My bank was booted a few times and she hangs out in IF. Now I can't log onto one of my alts at all, and she got booted when flying out of Orgrimmar. (Deleting folders didn't help w/ that at all.) So...yeah. I posted a thread on the mac support forums, but haven't heard anything.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 22 Sep 2010, 21:19
It's kinda funny/sad, but I did halls of reflection for the first time today. I just never really needed gear from there before so I hadn't bothered with it. But a friend asked for help so I finally did it. It's sorta too bad I've never tried it at proper gear levels though. I slouch my way to around 8-9k dps overall in 5s and I have more health than a lot of pugger tanks did at the time Halls was released, so obviously I'm not really in any position to say anything about its difficulty level given that I'm in 277.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: amandathehunter on 04 Oct 2010, 10:16
So Cataclysm was officially announced to have a Dec. 7 Release Date today.

Informed rumor states that the patch is either this tuesday (as in, tomorrow) or next tuesday.

What will you be doing with your two months?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 04 Oct 2010, 12:01
Doing what I have been doing - trying to do all the things that I want to do before things disappear forever.

My guild tried our first real raid last week. One of the guys was convinced we could do ToC10 with only 3 people with experience and 2 pug'd healers. Didn't go too well. (We found a tree who didn't use wild growth at all and barely touched his HoTs. WTF.) So next time we're doing something easier and I am going to be the primary healer. If one of our other guys can come, hopefully we'll have both healers filled and we'll only have to pug one or two dps spots.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 05 Oct 2010, 04:50
Patch cannot be this Tuesday, 2 weeks notice for arena at the end of last month means it finishes on the 12th, then 1 week to sort titles/mounts so the patch will be next Tuesday or Tuesday after.

If patch 4.0.1 went live BM hunter pets alone would claim r1 glad on every BG.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: amandathehunter on 06 Oct 2010, 10:46
If any of you guys want to get some raiding in, and happen to be on the Shadow Council server, look me up.

My main is Etoïle, GM of Chosen of the Morrigan. We're an ICC raiding guild with 2 10m groups and we're opening up a third on fridays and saturdays. I'd like to have some more QC fans around.

I only mention it because I totally get that people want to get some content done before Cata, and if you need help, well, we've got the means.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 11 Oct 2010, 19:39
Patch! I am kind of excited.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 12 Oct 2010, 07:01
last day of s8... longest season ever.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 13 Oct 2010, 06:52
After tinkering around with everything to respec and whatnot last night, I don't know if I like resto as much as I used to. Granted, I haven't healed yet, but I'm not sure how I feel about tree form being a cooldown now. That just seems weird, as none of the other forms are. (Hooray, ONE spec can now show off their armor all the time!) I'm going to run some randoms tonight and see how I feel about both resto and balance. Balance I am mildly excited about because of the mushrooms.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 13 Oct 2010, 07:17
Moonkins are insane right now. Insanity possibly only exceeded by mages and warlocks.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 13 Oct 2010, 12:27
It's about freaking time!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 13 Oct 2010, 15:12
I know it's not a big deal since we'll soon be up to our necks in quality green replacements, but holy shit does having all my ArP gems swapped over to crit gems suck. I mean, I was geared enough so that was practically every gem, after all.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 13 Oct 2010, 15:29
Yeah my 99.89% passive arp pre-patch warrior feels your pain. Fury is.... sad atm.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: jmrz on 13 Oct 2010, 17:12
The patch is still downloading oh god why is this taking so long I have a mage to respec and agh.

In other news, T11 mage armour looks fucking kick ass.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 13 Oct 2010, 17:18
Yeah my 99.89% passive arp pre-patch warrior feels your pain. Fury is.... sad atm.

It makes me glad I'm sitting on a small mountain of gold, too. Crit is pretty much my worst stat short of gemming Spirit, so it's not like I'll be keeping any of them.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 13 Oct 2010, 18:07
So I wonder how many people bought the scribe dust off of the AH instead of from the vendor.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 13 Oct 2010, 22:30
Yeah it's not worth it to me to regem at this point. I have 34k gold and could easily afford it, but why? I've killed all the raid bosses I'm going to kill, and I can dick around with other characters until cataclysm. Warrior damage is going to be garbage w/o collossus smash anyway.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 13 Oct 2010, 22:42
I don't see how you guys amass that amount of gold.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 14 Oct 2010, 01:39
Raiding makes it easy. I shit primordial saronites.

The thing about replacing gems is that I still do stuff occasionally and crit is awe-inspiringly bad for me. Normally I wouldn't even consider gemming with the expansion so close, but napkin math hints that blue agility gems would be a straight upgrade for me over the epic crit gems. Christ.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 14 Oct 2010, 05:18
Fury is.... sad atm.

One of my friends is having a lot of problems with her fury warrior. In other words, she basically said her warrior was a stranger now. She can't really figure out how to make it do the damage it used to.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 14 Oct 2010, 05:23
Levelling alts for cata.

Currently the best to worst order goes like

Locks>mages>ele shamans>boomkins>spriests>god>hunters pets>hunters>DK's>rogues>paladins>goldshire NPC's>warriors

and yeah, losing every red socket bonus because the gem went yellow sucks. I vendored so much gear that now has haste because I don't raid at all and never as fury.

My mage friend who was done raiding alot like me now wants to down LK hc because with a raid of 17 wizards 2 tanks 5 healers and a hunter it looks like it would last about 3 minutes.

30k crits and 27kdps self buffed on a target dummy is retarded. Go look at some logs from good raiding guilds, smourne fury warriors doing 7-8k dps with mages and locks doing over three times that.

85 had better race around, 54 days to level some wizards...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: amandathehunter on 14 Oct 2010, 09:02
Quote
Currently the best to worst order goes like

Locks>mages>ele shamans>boomkins>spriests>god>hunters pets>hunters>DK's>rogues>paladins>goldshire NPC's>warriors

This is true. They've balanced the dps specs around an ability we get at level 81, Colossus Smash. (http://cata.wowhead.com/spell=86346)

For warrior tanks, they've completely redone the way we generate rage, which, you know, we kind of need for a lot of our threat generating abillities. I've been talking to a number of other warrior tanks, and it seems the best way to alleviate this is to turn into a hard ass, insisting on good dps behavior. While I totally get that insisting that others l2p for cata is normal, With the culture created by the LFD tool, that means I'll be VTK'd a LOT. Those casters up there, who now make god look like a newb? They don't like being throttled. Being told to 'watch your threat' and 'target my target please' and 'give me a few seconds to get aggro' makes them whiney, insulting bitches. Everyone should remember John Gabriel's Greater Internet F*ckwad Theory here. Usually, when someone's from the same server, we're nice, cause we'll have to see them again. With the LFD tool, we're never going to see that guy from another server again, so the theory applies, turning them all into 4chan trolls.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 14 Oct 2010, 12:32
I'm mean to everyone.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 14 Oct 2010, 14:47
Raiding makes it easy. I shit primordial saronites.

I never did 25mans and always spent frost on gear, so primordials never rolled around for me.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 14 Oct 2010, 19:07
Being told to 'watch your threat' and 'target my target please' and 'give me a few seconds to get aggro' makes them whiney, insulting bitches.

Being both DPS and healer (and since boomkins didn't have much threat reduction before the patch), I know well enough to do all of those things. Also that's why threat meters are good things! Really, if DPSers have a problem with not being douches, tell them to shut up and stop being douche bags. If that doesn't work, well, let them die! That's what I do when people don't listen to the tank. (Unless the tank sucks and is a jerk and then I let him die and laugh over his corpse. Yes, I like to troll sometimes.)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 14 Oct 2010, 19:24
Hunters and mages in bg's are... fun.

Getting 1shot by rogues at the 40-49 bracket is not so much fun.

Good job they suck at 80!

My friend (arcane mage) was raiding icc25 today, they were wiping on farm bossed (HC deathwhisper) because the tanks (with INSANE health pools thanks to the new patch) were getting globalled, he is 6% off the hit cap from talents being removed and still he was doing 16-20k dps while a smourne fury warrior was doing 8-9k dps, no arp no deeps, I would drop them from the raid no matter how uber they are to be honest, but they burned marrowgar down in 1 bonestorm which I have only ever done on normal mode.

Tanks are the weak point in raids at the moment, the DK had 83k hp buffed and the palas had 75-77k but they were losing threat or getting gibbed, that is crazy as shit I mean deathwhisper HC is not the easiest fight but it's easy when you have farmed it for weeks on end.

Just makes me think their chances of survival on a hc 25 man soul reaper will be... low.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 17 Oct 2010, 16:07
Decided to give my warrior a shot after watching a holy priest with 2k resil tank 4 melee and a warlock... re-gemmed wrathful gear with full resil and tanking meta.

44k hp and 1700 resil.

With the change to resil it's pretty retarded along with the self healing, beating wizards in duels and stuff, pretty much anything that is not a healer.

Is brilliant when rogues and fire mages try to duel you and they cannot inspect you, they think "wars gut nerf" but then they get steamrolled.

CHOO CHOO... will never get any alts done at this rate.

Oh, and for people without t1 you now get it welfare, anything you can get from the 2v2 bracket you can get without rating.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 24 Oct 2010, 13:56
This is what happens when someone puts you in a bat costume as you are mounting a mammoth:

(http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs828.snc4/68809_788149410315_21400308_42182092_5176230_n.jpg)

Best bug I've ever had.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 15 Nov 2010, 07:34
This game sucks so much without arena. Not even scrims.

So bored I spent 3 hours and like 20g farming gear to look like an Orgrimmar Grunt so I can cruise Durotar on a turtle picking fights with people.

It's like they took out scrims so we have no idea how s9 is gonna turn out skill wise even with a tiny health pool.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 17 Nov 2010, 05:27
The guy from mmo-champions is predicting the 4.0.3a will be released next week.  Yay, The Shattering
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 17 Nov 2010, 06:03
Last night's patch was 4.0.1.13somthingblahblah#, so I don't think we'll be jumping to 4.0.3 just yet. I mean, Cata comes out in less than a month. I don't see why they'd want to rush that while all the world events are going on.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 17 Nov 2010, 06:20
Last night's patch was 4.03 I'm pretty sure?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 17 Nov 2010, 08:37
Apparently it was. There's a bagillion numbers on the actual patch as it's loading, so I probably read the wrong one.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 17 Nov 2010, 13:47
4.0.3 is out.  4.0.3a is The Shattering.

edit:  It will be like 4.0.3.13316 if you go by the PTR right now.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 23 Nov 2010, 17:25
THE SHATTERING! This is a new content overload right now...
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 24 Nov 2010, 03:22
Double loading screen bars  :psyduck:
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: ackblom12 on 24 Nov 2010, 08:51
So apparently my account was hacked and banned for "abusing the economic system" whatever that means. Since I haven't played in a year or so and was considering coming back for cataclysm, I sent them an email about it yesterday and it was already resolved when I checked my email this morning and all of my stuff (I think) was recovered. Jesus feckin' christ that was fast. I'm getting an authenticator now because I would rather them not get access to anything else on my batttle.net account but I was pleasantly surprised by such a ridiculously fast response.

So yeah, I may be back on Elune sometime with my Alliance Priest before going back to Horde because Horde is so much more awesome.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 24 Nov 2010, 08:53
They responded pretty fast when my account was hacked. The only part that took FOREVER was waiting on the phone for someone to answer.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: ackblom12 on 24 Nov 2010, 08:54
Yeah, I can't imagine their call center is ever not busy as fuck.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 25 Nov 2010, 04:16
Anyone who plays without an authenticator will more than likely get hacked at at some time.

Authenticators are not horribly expensive and they do their job really well in reducing the chance you will have your account compromised by a huge margin.

Buy an authenticator.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dimmukane on 25 Nov 2010, 08:02
Just bought BC + WoTL for 15$.  Strictly for research, you see.  Still haven't actually activated my account.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 25 Nov 2010, 08:42
One of my friends was pissed. She seriously bought WotLK like...2 weeks ago? And then the price dropped $20. She's not happy right now.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 26 Nov 2010, 07:23
Pretty sure in GBP it's 4+4+8 so 16 notes to EAT YOUR LIFE.

Any hunters been taming AQ raid bosses? I did the "Flying an azeroth" trick last nite for some fun.

Also trikes.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 04 Dec 2010, 11:10
So who is excited for Cataclysm?! I preordered, so I'll be able to play Tuesday night after my last exam and I am excited! I'll probably make my alts (worgen and goblin) and then explore the new zones with my druid. I think I'll end up going to Mt. Hyjal, because, you know, it's a shiny happy druid place.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 04 Dec 2010, 13:45
Gonna try and get a guildie 80-82 asap in dungeons, since levelling on a pvp server is gonna be brutal then maybe drop group and bodyguard him as he quests.

After my warrior is 85 gonna work on pvp gear and maybe a goblin DK for lv70 bracket arena gonna be called richardnixon and bind death coil to yell I'M NOT A CROOK or something.

Already got a tauren pala called Rétbúll I am levelling so when I pop wings I can macro a yell that says... yeh.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 04 Dec 2010, 14:03
I tried cleaning up my warrior's bags/bank today in preparation for leveling him, as he's going to be my first char to 85/my raiding toon. So, after completely removing any kind of consumable/mining/blacksmithing/enchanting mats from my warrior, leaving only gear and old-world nostalgia relics (T0.5 quest line stuff, Agent of Nozdormu badge etc etc.) I still have 146 items in my bank.

I have collected a vast and unreasonably large amount of shit over the years.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 04 Dec 2010, 14:37
Yeah, reorganizing my bank was easy, but took a while. It was nowhere near as bad as reorganizing the guild bank. We have 4 tabs, so now 1 tab is dedicated to each part (vanilla, BC, WotLK, and Cat) and tab 1 is pretty much full of things people will use on their new alts while the other three tabs are either empty or almost empty, since we sold all of the things that could sell and then trashed most everything else no one uses.

It took me about 2 hours to do all that. So. Much. CRAP.

Also, now that we've recruited meat life friends to the guild, it's time to start recruiting others. Oh dear.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 04 Dec 2010, 14:49
(http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m5/dazedandconfused-/Screenshot2010-12-04at54541PM.png?t=1291502850)

So much stuff... And I've vendored/destroyed basically all of my BC arena/tier sets.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 05 Dec 2010, 13:03
Caved and bought another month to try out the changed zones, can't update that OR have my friend install Diablo II for LAN play because the whole site seems to be completely down. lame.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: imagist42 on 06 Dec 2010, 08:32
Do... do we still have a forum guild or something, guys? I hate myself but I wanna play.

(Maybe that sentence should read "I hate myself so I wanna play.")
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 06 Dec 2010, 09:29
I don't think so, but if you happen to have an alliance character on Elune, you can join my guild (http://us.battle.net/wow/en/guild/elune/the%20company%20of%20rock/)!

That goes for anyone, really, we're actively trying to recruit people now so that we can do Cata raids and whatnot and start trying for guild achievements.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 06 Dec 2010, 10:16
That tears it, I'll make a character on there, expect to see a character named Felundyr walking around somewhere on Elune.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 06 Dec 2010, 12:03
Ok! I'm mostly playing on Meabh and Daría, so give me a pst if you see me online.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 06 Dec 2010, 14:15
Just finished filling up my quest log with completed but not turned in northrend daily quests so I can score some quick turn in XP tonight. I am such a nerd.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Gemmwah on 06 Dec 2010, 16:13
Collector's Edition yeahhhhhh. Waiting on the install now, then off to bed to flick through the art book.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 06 Dec 2010, 17:17
How come you get it early??? We have to wait until 3am! YOU SHOULD TOO!!!  :x :x :x

Edit: Unless you just have it and can't actually play it yet. Then never mind.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 06 Dec 2010, 21:07
My store didn't even do a midnight release for it, I had several unhappy nerds who came in today, a couple even cancelled their pre-orders to just go ahead and get it through digital download. Of course for every one I lost I got another person who went ahead and pre-ordered The Old Republic, several were the same people.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: imagist42 on 06 Dec 2010, 21:18
Dammit I really have a ton of other games I should be playing first instead of spending money to divide my attention but I really want to upgrade and resubscribe nowwww
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Odal on 07 Dec 2010, 02:09
Somehow I'm not really excited about it.  The only reason I even subscribe to this game anymore is to play my twinks.  With the promise of merged battlegroups, I came back.  All the expansion means is that I gotta play the chase-the-carrot game some more for BoAs that will possibly be the new BiS on the lowby toons. :\
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 07 Dec 2010, 06:23
The first 5 levels of the Worgen are interesting. I'll have to play more later after my finals and whatnot.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: axerton on 07 Dec 2010, 15:52
so it took just over 14 hours for the first person on my server to hit 85. I considered trying to quest but when I jumped on the boat to Vash'ir the sheer number of people meant that my computer had heart failure - so I gave it up as a bad job and choose instead to level Archaeology - so far I'm at 250 skill and have gotten a raptor skeleton mini pet and am working on a clockwork gnome pet.

its a weird proffession though, on one hand to avoid immusureable bordom you're praying for a rare artifact (one that actually has a use, rather than a 5s vendor trash) but because rares take about 3 times as much work as a common, but give the same skill ups, if you're actually trying to level it up you want the boring common items.

Other fun things, while I was playing, at one stage I lost the ability to directly attack mobs (luckily I was in old world working on archaeology so I could kill most things with arcane explosion) and then later I lost the ability to fly - I could still get on any of my flying mounts but they couldn't take off - the first was solved by closing wow so I'm hoping the same will fix the latter problem.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: ackblom12 on 07 Dec 2010, 15:59
Alright, got my Authenticator in the mail today and got all my Account Reactivation form emailed and hopefully will be playing soon.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Tom on 07 Dec 2010, 16:49
Dammit I really have a ton of other games I should be playing first instead of spending money to divide my attention but I really want to upgrade and resubscribe nowwww

If there was a forum guild, I consider giving this whole thing a go.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 07 Dec 2010, 16:57
The 85 in 14 hours thing kills me. Honestly, I'm just happy that I've made 83 while still keeping pretty normal hours.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 07 Dec 2010, 17:30
If there was a forum guild, I consider giving this whole thing a go.

if you happen to have an alliance character on Elune, you can join my guild (http://us.battle.net/wow/en/guild/elune/the%20company%20of%20rock/)!

Like, really. I am the GM. I will let you in!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Gemmwah on 08 Dec 2010, 05:36
WORGEN DRUIDS HAVE THE MOST AWESOME LOOKING CAT FORM OMG
(http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk92/_beatingheartsbaby/worgendruidcatform.png)
 :mrgreen:

Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 08 Dec 2010, 06:57
Kitty-wolf!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 08 Dec 2010, 10:25
Yeah, but

(http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y110/Wildkyn/cataclysm_druid_troll_cat_small.jpg)

Trolls look cooler.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Gemmwah on 08 Dec 2010, 10:43
pshooooooo no worgen's better
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: ackblom12 on 08 Dec 2010, 22:48
Ok, started back up, completely lost and ended up wandering and sorting things before spending a few minutes killing dudes.

Funny thing is whoever hacked my account leveled my main the last 15 or 16 levels up to 80 and did this without updating any of his equipment. Gotta replace his shitty shitty equipment and oh god this game has changed so much.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 09 Dec 2010, 11:24
Though I'm really loving the worgen model (especially when you /transform), the trolls really do get the best cat model but only because of the colors and stripes. The other cat forms are all in the same color range, so the trolls really stick out.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 09 Dec 2010, 12:38
Got to 85 but I took my time about it, I didn't play at all on wed cuz my dog got put down but 85 is kinda feeling lame till s9 starts on Tuesday.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 09 Dec 2010, 14:50
The quest in Hyjal where you chuck bear cubs out of a tree and on to a trampoline is hilarious. And then you get an achievement if you bounce on the trampoline, which I did not know until after I'd already been bouncing on it for fun.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 09 Dec 2010, 21:38
It's official, I still hate Blackrock Mountain.

Also definitely tired of tanks ditching instances because they forgot how to pay attention. I am seriously considering switching to feral, but I don't want to drop balance and if I drop resto, we won't have many healers in the guild. (Leveling as a healing class is teh dumb, anyways.) I don't know what to doooooo.

We just need more people in my guild. Steve joined!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: ackblom12 on 09 Dec 2010, 21:54
Yes I did! If I manage to hit lvl 85 I'll even respec to holy.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 10 Dec 2010, 00:15
If I ever level up my shaman I'll make sure to duel spec healer/enhance.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 10 Dec 2010, 14:30
Got to 85 but I took my time about it, I didn't play at all on wed cuz my dog got put down but 85 is kinda feeling lame till s9 starts on Tuesday.

Yeah, I hit 85 on Wednesday but haven't done heroics yet, although I'm now eligible. Life is a bit interesting again since CC is handy to have even if it is not strictly necessary. This means I get treated like royalty a lot of the time since I'm aggressive with applying Sap and it's actually very user friendly these days since you can reapply it at will provided you haven't initiated combat yet. I often hit sprint and scoot ahead to start sapping things before everyone else even gets there. On the other hand, I also have people getting all pissy at me because they set up the CC icons themselves and apparently expect me to Sap elementals.  :roll:
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 10 Dec 2010, 20:47
Well, getting to 85 doesn't make players less stupid. Which is too bad.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 11 Dec 2010, 15:56
I love when people try talking religion on trade chat. I wonder if even Glenn Beck could take my wow server in a non-sensical bullshit competition.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Beren on 11 Dec 2010, 18:12
I've been playing for a long, long time, and I've done every tier of content besides original naxx, but current heroics are too goddamn hard.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 11 Dec 2010, 18:42
Yeah, I'm enjoying them, but only when my guildies are online. Whenever they aren't logged on heroics are an exercise in futility and nerd rage. And even with my guild groups Karsh Steelbreaker seriously wrecked our shit today. It's not even a particularly complicated fight, he's just like "HEY GUISE! I HOPE YOU LIKE DAMAGE."
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 11 Dec 2010, 19:21
Okay, after double checking some things I think our healer was just being an idiot on him and we were being too ambitious about using the li'l adds. I guess Karsh isn't all that bad.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 11 Dec 2010, 22:03
Any other guild masters or officers out there who are in a guild that has set ranks to require an authenticator? Because I am having problems now that I've done this and I want to know if others are too.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 11 Dec 2010, 22:08
I'm interested to know, does the free authenticator thingy through your phone count as an authenticator to that?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 12 Dec 2010, 07:54
It should, but I'm having equal problems with both.

Basically what happened was I wanted to change all the ranks in my guild except the lowest one to require an authenticator. (Mostly this is to prevent bank theft.) My guild is relatively small, and minus a few I invited from here , all of them are meat life friends. I know all of them have authenticators, which is why I was ok with doing that. But now, I can't promote about half the characters in the guild. I can't even promote one of my own alts or I can promote one character of a person but not the rest of their alts. This is very annoying! Has anyone else had this problem? I tried to open a ticket yesterday and before anyone even helped me, a survey popped up and then my ticket disappeared. I'm trying again today, but still, that's stupid.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 12 Dec 2010, 10:47
Okay, well, I've been really hesitant to put an authenticator on my account for a couple reasons, but since the phone one is free, I might as well. The number one complaint I had is that the other authenticator costs like 10 bucks for extra protection from having the same exact thing being used against me (like what happened when I got keylogged and lost my account to someone in Beijing who then put an authenticator on my account), and I feel like it'll be slightly annoying to have to call a service every time I want to log in, but fuck, its free.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 12 Dec 2010, 11:03
There are more pros to having one than not. But, it's free so why not. Just don't ever accidentally remove it from your phone, lol.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Caleb on 12 Dec 2010, 18:06
(http://i516.photobucket.com/albums/u330/Dreamcastguy/20101204.jpg)

(Fanboys is updating again.)
http://www.fanboys-online.com/
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: imagist42 on 12 Dec 2010, 19:25
Accurate.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 12 Dec 2010, 20:53
I haven't had a quest that involves killing boars yet in Cata. In Elwyn and Westfall, boars, wolves, and bears (oh my) were slain, though.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 13 Dec 2010, 03:56
The number one complaint I had is that the other authenticator costs like 10 bucks for extra protection from having the same exact thing being used against me (like what happened when I got keylogged and lost my account to someone in Beijing who then put an authenticator on my account)

I won't use it because it can be used against me? It can only be used against you if you don't use it. Absurd logic is absurd, anyone without an authenticator should expect to have all their stuff stolen because chances are it is going to happen to you.

Doing hc's for a hc 2h wep but it's not going too good, not seen one drop and I am running SFK/DM/ToT daily because they all drop a 2h I want!

tank gear is looking okay thought, at least it will when I rep grind Ramkahen (7840/21000) for the epic bracers to replace my ICC25 hc ones and get 2 more transmutes to craft my epic shield!

bleh.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Gemmwah on 13 Dec 2010, 06:22
i spent yesterday running cata 80 quests and hc5mans and this new hear is bossssssss
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 13 Dec 2010, 08:30
The number one complaint I had is that the other authenticator costs like 10 bucks for extra protection from having the same exact thing being used against me (like what happened when I got keylogged and lost my account to someone in Beijing who then put an authenticator on my account)
I won't use it because it can be used against me? It can only be used against you if you don't use it. Absurd logic is absurd, anyone without an authenticator should expect to have all their stuff stolen because chances are it is going to happen to you.

If this is the case then they should include the authenticator with new copies of the game. Charging for an extra amount of protection like that just seems a bit, mafioso. Am I really the only one who gets bad vibes from this? Maybe its just because I think that it is absurd that an online game like this can have real world consequences in the forms of theft and such. And anyway, this is why I just signed up for the free one, which in my opinion should have been an available option from the start, rather than charging people who already pay a monthly fee another fee.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 13 Dec 2010, 11:43
Yes, but $10 get you protection, a keychain, and an in-game pet. Also you don't run the risk of accidentally deleting your authenticator off of your phone. (Two of my friends have done this now with Droid updates or something.) So you have the option of the free one for your phone or the keychain you pay for. I would rather pay the $10 than get another keylogger that locks me out of my email and potentially does more than steal my account.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 13 Dec 2010, 12:01
See, I'm just not feeling the mafiosi thing since it's not like Blizz is threatening your account nor does someone putting an authenticator on an account really make it unduly difficult to reclaim it. My account was compromised when I didn't have an authenticator and one was used against me but ultimately I still got all my issues sorted out within a week which is pretty well in line with the cases I'm aware of in which an account was compromised but no authenticator was used by the perpetrator. It really appears that the biggest factor in determining the speed of the process is sheer numbers-- accounts tend to get compromised in waves due to the windows of opportunity created by the tug of war between malware creators and countermeasure providers.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 13 Dec 2010, 23:40
It costs blizz money to make authenticators, blizzard is a company, companies are made to make money, giving it away free would result in a loss of money, why lose money when you can make money?

You need to see it from their point of view, it's like people who complain about how they pay £8 a month to play a game and they don't like something about it. You are not paying blizzard to make the game you want to play, you are paying blizzard to be allowed to play THEIR game. WoW seems to attract alot of people with an unwarranted sense of self entitlement and the logic about it is never sound.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Josefbugman on 14 Dec 2010, 01:38
Anyone else just decided that Cata was the last straw and stopped playing?

Because I've been looking over some of the stuff and just getting so terminally bored with WoW, I can't be bothered to kill 18 boars to pick up their arses. That and the fact that I can't be bothered with the whole "storyline" of the cataclysm. I am actually sure that 12 year olds could come up with better and more engrossing storylines than what blizzard is putting out atm.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: McTaggart on 14 Dec 2010, 02:31
On the other hand all I've read about Cataclysm has made me interested in Wow for pretty much the first time. I'm actually downloading the client right now.

The fact that I've been waiting about seven hours to get a reply to a petition I made in Warhammer Online might have motivated this a little.

Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 14 Dec 2010, 02:39
Josef you are saying the opposite of what everyone else is saying at the moment so I am thinking that it might be you?  Have you actually played/leveled since Cataclysm came out?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Josefbugman on 14 Dec 2010, 05:30
Nope, I stopped prior to it. Mainly because I had stopped playing for a couple of months and have just realised I found Wrath unsatisying as an experience. I mean I am sure it was cool, but I can never be bothered to download all the additionals you need to raid and rapidly got bored of all the various dailies. It seemed like I was acquiring gear, weapons and pets for no other reason than "they were there" and I just didn't think it was worth my time.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: imagist42 on 14 Dec 2010, 06:15
It costs blizz money to make authenticators, blizzard is a company, companies are made to make money, giving it away free would result in a loss of money, why lose money when you can make money?

You need to see it from their point of view, it's like people who complain about how they pay £8 a month to play a game and they don't like something about it. You are not paying blizzard to make the game you want to play, you are paying blizzard to be allowed to play THEIR game. WoW seems to attract alot of people with an unwarranted sense of self entitlement and the logic about it is never sound.

I can kind of see what they're saying, though. You are paying Blizzard to play their game, right? So shouldn't that cost include the ability to continue playing their game, no matter what? I.e., the tools to prevent your account from being stolen out from under your feet? This is kind of a moot point with the free phone application, but then again there may be people who (gasp) don't have cell phones. At least not ones that will actually accept that software. I'm really not sure how the logistics would work out, but perhaps there should be more free options to serve this function than "here, have a piece of code that, if you accidentally remove by updating your phone, will be a pain in the ass to work around."
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 14 Dec 2010, 09:39
Jesus I swear I'm not trying to act like a self-entitled prick, Christ. At least I'm not like pirating the game and playing it on one of those free servers that are incredibly easy to find. And really just the thing that i was complaining about is that the free version wasn't available from the start, only the 10 dollar keychain, and now that its free I'm of course using it, I just feel like they're already charging 15 dollars a month per person, I just sort of feel like as much security as they can manage at a cost effective solution for playing their program should've been part of that from the start, which is the dial-in authenticator now.

Part of this is that I'm being grumbly because of the amount of ways they just want people to pay. 15 dollars a month for access, 40 dollars per expansion pack, numerous optional services for transferring characters, changing names/factions etc., which yes I realize are entirely optional but these are hardly micro-transactions, 25 bucks per character move for instance. That all is fine, i just feel like account security shouldn't be an optional paid service like changing your orc to a goblin.

I realize that they are a business, but businesses also run off of things like customer service, which I suppose you could argue that Blizzard is large enough and has enough players to make one person's complaint meaningless, but I mean, I work for a large, soulless, retail company that sells video games and they actually do try and come up with better ways for taking care of the customer that we don't charge extra for, for instance recent improvements to tracking customers information in case of lost receipts, better ways for tracking individual employee customer experience ratings, improvements to our loyalty program (which for the most part are actual improvements).

And obviously Blizzard is doing this too, since there is now a free version of extra account security an option, which I was never complaining about. What I was complaining about was before, when you're only option was to pay an extra 10 dollars on top of what your were already paying to the service. Now that they have the free service they obviously saw it as something they could implement cheaply and effectively, and I respect as a company for doing it. But up until this point I just opted out of paying the extra money as a discerning customer, which was my choice.

Also Linds the phone I have is just a normal cell phone, not a smart phone, so at least i don't have to worry about an update deleting my information, its just the dial-in authenticator.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 14 Dec 2010, 10:00
I didn't think you had an entitlement issue, really. I just wanted to splash a li'l water on the "Authenticators are being used against us!" rhetoric that's getting pretty common in some quarters even if it isn't entirely fair.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: cyro on 15 Dec 2010, 03:36
Anyone else just decided that Cata was the last straw and stopped playing?

Because I've been looking over some of the stuff and just getting so terminally bored with WoW, I can't be bothered to kill 18 boars to pick up their arses. That and the fact that I can't be bothered with the whole "storyline" of the cataclysm. I am actually sure that 12 year olds could come up with better and more engrossing storylines than what blizzard is putting out atm.

Actually, I found most of the Cata stuff quite fun. That said Uldum is nothing but injokes, popculture references and lolnazis! (Some of which is actually kinda funny, they have a Katamari level with a giant fireball picking up Gnomes.)

So... yeah.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 15 Dec 2010, 07:52
I'm having quite a bit of fun with Cata. Even the revamps of the lower level zones are much, MUCH better. I am getting a kick out of having zones dedicated to adventures involving things like CSI: Miami (Westfall), Rambo (Redridge Mtns), Plants vs. Zombies (Hillsbrad) and Indiana Jones (Uldum). Also the new zones look amazing! The only thing I'm not so keen on is the overuse of phasing. Phasing is cool, but not after every other quest.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 15 Dec 2010, 08:11
Yeah, I have a bone to pick with phasing and its tendency to make mining nodes disappear.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Josefbugman on 15 Dec 2010, 09:29
I think I may have been spoiled, I've been playing a lot of either Bioware or completly plotless games atm, so I am not used to the fact that everything has now become a pop cultural shout out.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Ozymandias on 15 Dec 2010, 10:30
Enjoying the balls off of the Cata revamp of old zones. Completely awesome.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Odal on 16 Dec 2010, 01:46
How are the new starting areas for goblin and worgen?  I haven't had the chance to do them because my account is character-capped and I really don't want to delete any of the characters.

I haven't really seen much of the new content at all, really.  I got my main to 81 and just got bored.  Been having fun with other aspects of the game.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: cyro on 16 Dec 2010, 02:12
I think I may have been spoiled, I've been playing a lot of either Bioware or completly plotless games atm, so I am not used to the fact that everything has now become a pop cultural shout out.

It's kinda like having fine cuisine or a good sandwich. The sublime story telling of <insert Bioware game here> is wonderful in moderatation, but usually you just want a nice sandwich for lunch.

At least that's how I feel about it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Josefbugman on 16 Dec 2010, 05:34
Y'see I either prefer Good story (can be freely defined, I realise I am no arbiter of what is good and bad) or no story at all. I love LOVE games like Dynasty Warriors, where the only story is "Hit people till they die, make hammy speeches" because you are essentially striding around a battlefield like a living god, wrecking the hell out of people. I like games like Crusader Kings, which are plotless and require you to make up story's.

Heck I am even fine with the sheer amount of storyline shout outs that went into WC3. The problem is that I no longer think Blizzard knows or cares about making the story anything other than "kill things because we say so" and the grind is just not fun for me. The fact that there is a constant grind, that there is nowhere to feel especially awesome, or to have fun without needing to listen to the shrill of "Nerf [insert class here]" or "STFU".

TLDR: basically I just found WoW to be fundamentally unfullfilling and a boring, useless time and money sink that actually doesn't make me want to return the longer I look at it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Odal on 16 Dec 2010, 06:43
Yeah, vanilla didn't have nearly as many pop culture references in WoW does now.  Ever since TBC, I think they went a little overboard with that aspect.

I don't complain about it too much though, as my hopes of anything good storyline-wise has been destroyed just because of WoW, let alone the expansions.  Somehow I can't feel epic about a storyline when the LK gets killed by people named Lleeroy, Trowmoardawts, Xxlegolisxx, Mancatbearcow, Pimpy, Dimpy, and Limpy, etc.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Josefbugman on 16 Dec 2010, 07:43
Thats why I am looking forward to the new "old republic" mmo. If only because its actually got a plot for your character.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 16 Dec 2010, 07:50
The warcraft plotline was always bog standard fantasy shit. It's now just shitty with Joust themed quests.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Josefbugman on 16 Dec 2010, 08:00
It was pretty rubbish, but at least it was rubbish on a big scale, and I kind of like generic fantasy every so often.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: cyro on 16 Dec 2010, 09:00
I'm not gonna saw Cataclysm's an awesome story, 'cause it isn't. What is better though are the story telling devices throughout and the storytelling in general. I complete a quest line in Cataclysm and I feel like I've accomplished something (besides lootwhoring).

The End of Mount Hyjal has you solo fight a raid (with help from a few NPCs.) Vashj'ir's final quest is basically an Interactive Cinematic, Deepholm see's you protecting the Earthen Ring as the put the World Pillar back together.

It's pretty epic, in a cheesy Hammerfall kind of way.

Still, I get it's not for everyone and I think I'm done defending it when I much prefer Bioware game anyways.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 16 Dec 2010, 12:46
Just got back to my pc since patch day, 2p set for pvp so far time for honour grinds and rated BG's!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 16 Dec 2010, 12:49
It was pretty rubbish, but at least it was rubbish on a big scale, and I kind of like generic fantasy every so often.

This seems patently untrue to me. Vanilla WoW quests were uniformly small time shit until Naxx came about. It was the sort of game where you were supposed to be some big goddamn hero but mostly you spent your time wandering around doing unrelated shit like collecting booze for dwarves. Things like the Tirion Fordring quest line were the exception and not the norm whereas now 1 outta 3 quests is at least part of some overarching quest line that usually culminates in an event of some sort. I read what you say but all I end up hearing is "I'm burnt out on WoW. Totally, totally burnt out."
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Josefbugman on 16 Dec 2010, 15:00
I meant Warcraft 3, original WoW I found interesting because MMO's were so new to me. And yeah, WoW's original quests weren't inovative, but my God were they new for younger me! I had no idea games could be made like this, and all these people and other things!

Then TBC came out and I spent a lot of time basically enjoying feeling fairly good at what I did and occasionally going away for a week but thinking about WoW a fair amount. Then WoTLK happened and I was psyched... up until there was nothing added after the argent tournament that I could or wanted to do. All of the dungeons had been run a billion times, I didn't want to get any better gear because I wasn't going to use it to raid and finally, I just got sick of WoW's plot and WoW in general.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 16 Dec 2010, 16:40
Honestly the quests in Uldum weren't that great for plot, but I was all about Mt. Hyjal and helping all the gods out. And the last fight with Cenarius, Malfurion, and Hamuul Runetotem was awesome. I happened to really like that entire zone because of the druid-ness surrounding it. I haven't felt much real plot from the other zones (Deepholm yes, because of the Earthen Ring, but not as much).
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 16 Dec 2010, 19:26
I loved the hell out of Twilight Highlands.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: cyro on 17 Dec 2010, 01:23
I don't recall anyone mention Uldum with regards to plot, it's definately the just-for-fun zone.

I finished Loremaster of Cataclysm last night without even trying. May go back and try for some of the earlier ones at some point.

 :psyduck:
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 20 Dec 2010, 16:20
If you step back from raiding, switch on your brain and tank heroics with pugs you get the biggest most warranted God complex so fast.

Doing interrupts and mechanics that the DPS should be taking care of while tanking multiple mobs/adds/boss and topping dps (lol glyphed cleave) knowing you genuinely are carrying these people through instances.

Then listen to your friends in a raiding guild whine about how 3 tanks cannot co-ordinate themselves for BoT raging their tits off at a 96% wipe attempt after attempt.

Being this good has to be a curse because I know I cannot be bothered going back to raiding no matter how much I would shine.

/e-peening

Anyone got an idea on when/if they will reset the broken as fuck arena standings with challengers at 3100mmr?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 20 Dec 2010, 20:59
All rational thought is kinda wiped out about how happy I am to be packing a Cruel Barb again. They let it keep its 2.7 weapon speed!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 20 Dec 2010, 22:34
I was 4th in healing done in strand of the ancients as a rogue. And we won.  :psyduck:
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 21 Dec 2010, 01:08
I have an old twinked rogue that I haven't played in years and every time I go into Deadmines I have a nostalgia fit.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Odal on 21 Dec 2010, 02:21
19s are still active from what I understand.  Maybe not as active as pre-3.2, but they still get games.  Haven't played 19s since like '06 tho :P

29s are where my heart is at, but it's deader than a doornob.  Working on making a 70 because apparently that's where the shiz be.

85 looks like it sucks just like every other level cap did, so I'll probably not get my main passed 81 unless I need to for something specific in regards to my lowbies.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: axerton on 21 Dec 2010, 04:35
I have to say I'm really a tad dissapointed with cataclysm, the other day I finished the loremaster of cataclysm and have gotten all the achivements for completing zone quest chains, and that means in just under two weeks I have completed litterally every single 80 - 85 non repeatable quest that that shipped with the game. despite getting the loremaster achievment back in the old world, I really never felt like I had "finished" questing, and that if I wanted to I could go back and finish chains that I had missed or given up on. This has a lot to do with the new way they're designing the quests - every thing feels so linear, I really liked having random quests sending me out to various random places with no real connection to a massive plot. Other thing I dont like is the fact that blizzard seems to be trying to make a single player MMO in terms of questing, there are billions of people playing wow, thousands on each server, I can see all of them and I can and talk to them about questing, so it makes it seem rather stupid when all the quests talk about me being the only person who can possibly save the world. An MMO should feel like you're part of something, I want to feel like I'm a mercinary soldier of the aliance or horde, doing my bit as part of a war effort. If I want save the world 5 times in as many hours I'll play any number of single player games.

And just while I'm on things that irriate me. cutscenes. the majority of the gaming world has realised that cutscenes do not make for imersive gaming. why is it now that blizzard is treating them like the new cool thing. Uldum in particular - ther was a stage where I was getting a cutscene after every single quest I did and just pissed me off, because most of them were unnessisary. and blizzard has even done things in the past where they've avoided cutscenes. Remember back in Burning Crusade there was a quest where we had to listen to a conversation between Burning legion bosses by hiding under a box. that was a fine little scene and it didn't break the flow of game play - Cutscenes have their place, the wrathgate and the final of Vashj'ir can be counted amoungs them, but cutscenes whicch only server as a quick way to get me from one side of the map to the other, or show a brief dialogue, can not.

On the other hand did my first heroics yesterday in a pug, and the difficulty kept jumping backwards and forwards between soul crushing and just hard enough to be rewarding, but in the end it was possibly the most fun I've ever had playing wow.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: imagist42 on 21 Dec 2010, 07:46
On the one hand, I understand what you're saying. It really doesn't seem like a whole lot of new content, especially after two years. But on the other hand, you've got to take a look at what Blizzard has actually done with this new expansion. While still throwing the endgame a bone, they've completely turned their game on its head. Instead of making things about running the same goddamn dungeons over and over again in order to incrementally increase your character's performance through minor upgrades in gear, for the sole sake of running more of the same freakin' dungeons, they've shifted the focus of the game onto all the original content you never felt like you finished before. It seems to me the name of Blizzard's favorite game is now alt creation. They've opened up new possibilities so that you might actually find it fun to create a new character and play through the game all over again, and the trick here is there is so much content in Azeroth that, at least until you've hit the cap and decide to do everything for rep gains, you can play through that portion of the game with ten different characters without ever experiencing an identical selection of its content. And that, to me, is a much funner concept than incessant dungeon repetition. But then, I've always had the most fun with the game when I'm still leveling, exploring what the world has to offer and growing as a character at the same time. This new focus may not appeal to everyone, but I guess you'll just have to wait for more content patches.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 21 Dec 2010, 09:49
I was 4th in healing done in strand of the ancients as a rogue. And we won.  :psyduck:
nerf recoup.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Leinad on 21 Dec 2010, 10:33
Please, tell me how shitty this game is so I don't go back.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 21 Dec 2010, 11:10
It's broken as fuck atm.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Dec 2010, 12:59
It's kinda funny/sad how much better a mut rogue is at playing Battle Ground Hero these days. As assassination I can regen half my health over 30 seconds and have 10% damage reduction just from talents (16% with recup up). That doesn't sound all that hot on paper, but once you factor in all our cheap ass li'l stunts it's kinda sick and makes all the extra mobility from sub feel a li'l redundant. After all, in BGs people aren't really going to always be saving some peels for you, so it feels sort of abusive to be able to patch yourself up fairly easily from incidental damage.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 21 Dec 2010, 13:38
Has anyone else seen floating herbs? I have seen floating herbs. I'd like to think of it as a joke, but I know it's not.

And sorry, Leinad, but leveling is actually fun and not a pain, the new zones are pretty cool, and the dungeons are once again challenging enough to make some players realize how much they suck at their role. I like it. WASTE YOUR MONIES!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: imagist42 on 21 Dec 2010, 21:23
Please, tell me how shitty this game is so I don't go back.

I tried to do this once. This thread is not helpful in that endeavor, trust me.

For what it's worth, I don't have an active subscription at the moment because I'm going back to school in two weeks and don't want to risk compulsive distractions until I'm settled back into learning mode. Find something more worthwhile to do with your time and it might be easier to resist.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 21 Dec 2010, 22:23
Welp, replaced the cruel barb already. Fang of Twilight (http://www.wowhead.com/item=63533/fang-of-twilight#.) looks like a 2 hander.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 22 Dec 2010, 22:45
I've tried fighting it as much as I can, but I guess I'm back to using a 333 dagger and mut instead of an epic sword. Combat is just too broken.  :cry:
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: cyro on 23 Dec 2010, 06:16
It's broken as fuck atm.

Working as intended.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 23 Dec 2010, 07:41
Yeh, working as intended, so they reset all ratings to a max of 1500 and made it impossible to equipt T2 weps till 25th January or some shit, so people who did a bunch of transfers in order to reset points cap and buy weps to upgrade to T2 are fucked since they cannot use it lolz.

Might as well just casual it until I get back from my holiday, conveniently on the 22nd.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Ozymandias on 24 Dec 2010, 14:16
I am sort of very annoyed with Blizzard right now.  I'm leveling a friend's cooking/fishing from scratch and made it to the mid-200s only to find that the only two vendors that sold mid-200 recipes for Horde are dead in Cata. Just completely gone, fuck off, you're gonna have to do cooking dailies for a month to get through this shit.

WTF.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 24 Dec 2010, 16:24
What?? That is lame. Too bad you weren't around for the Thanksgiving holiday thing, because those cooking quests were how I finally leveled my cooking.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 24 Dec 2010, 22:52
Can't make bear burgers anymore?  Make clamlette! (http://www.wowhead.com/quest=6610)

Below 250?  Talk to this guy! (http://www.wowhead.com/npc=11187)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Ozymandias on 26 Dec 2010, 11:56
Yeah, Clamlette was gonna be my long and winding road to new things.

Also, I'm not getting generic Horde rep anymore for some reason, which is pretty annoying since I'm aiming for Ambassador out of boredom. Put in a ticket about it and waited for 6 hours, then gave up on it. Annoying.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 26 Dec 2010, 19:34
Well you can always get the tabards these days for the Horde factions.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 29 Dec 2010, 11:52
Today I renamed my feral druid Dealwithit. Once more nerfs come it'll be less apropos, but I can live with that.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 29 Dec 2010, 11:54
I saw a warrior the other day named Csmashderp. I chuckled.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 29 Dec 2010, 12:33
One of my friends has a shaman named Hereforhero, which makes me chuckle.

Archeology, while time consuming, is kind of interesting. Since I've pretty much finished all questing (minus Vash'jir, because I'm tired of questing) and I maxed out my professions, I thought I'd spend my time leveling this up.

Does anyone know how the epic gem transmutes are going to be handled? Will they be introduced later or are they going to be rep rewards or something?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: LeeC on 02 Jan 2011, 02:21
so despite that I quite WoW for the past 2 years, my parents got me all 4 packs for christmas, much to the dismay of my girlfriend.  I am no hardcore player so she has nothing to worry about.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Jimor on 02 Jan 2011, 10:36
If your life were a webcomic, the next scene would obviously be you trying to tear her away from a 54-hour WoW bender.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 06 Jan 2011, 21:41
If the warrior changes go ahead, warriors will no longer have to stancedance outside of zerking and turtling, they will no longer be able to switch, the skillcap will be pushed MUCH lower and all we will be able to do is train a single target with bad uptime and insane burst when we do connect.

Looks like dispel cleave is viable and might be back on the cards lads, TSG will be insane too.

edit: 2v2 with a druid vs pretty much any double dps comp is bunghole clenchingly annoying because it's gib or be gibbed which as a warrior means pop reck and hope you gond get disarmed or/then switched to.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 12 Jan 2011, 13:25
Guild IRC convo:

Fernand0: Why don't any of these guides say where the tank should be?
Me: Tank positioning can usually be inferred by raid positioning since the tank dictates boss facing. Usually where the tank is in the room doesn't matter provided people understand what their position relative to the tank should be.
Fernand0: STFU poindexter.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Cire27 on 12 Jan 2011, 15:20
Quote
In front of the boss.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 12 Jan 2011, 15:57
Whatever dude. The tank belongs behind the healer.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 13 Jan 2011, 06:05
If Atramedes cannot see me, HOW COME HE HITS ME AS MUCH AS ANY OTHER BOSS  :psyduck:

DK resto shaman is the new improved for 2v2 boring cleave.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: cyro on 25 Jan 2011, 04:07
I've quit again already. Nothing aainst Cataclysm, but it's still WoW and after 6 year (on and off) I'm bored of the damn thing.

Bring on SW:TOR. I will enjoy butchering Darth Pwnznoobs.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 25 Jan 2011, 09:05
Things like that last post make me sad. I don't really want to play a game by a company that's known for its writing with people named things like Darth Pwnznoobs. And you know it will happen.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: cyro on 25 Jan 2011, 09:59
I know, personally I'm hoping for RP servers or something. Not to actually "RP" as such, just so the immersion isn't utterly shattered all the time. Sometimes I'm cool with it, in PvP or raids I wouldn't care, just sometimes.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 25 Jan 2011, 10:33
Oh, it'll be shattered all the time. That's just how things roll. If I have learned anything from playing WoW (I too quit just recently from burnout) it's that familiarity breeds contempt. Blizzard's attempts to make things more cinematic would get lauded by a segment of the population the first time (Personally, I usually thought it was just kinda silly) and then ever after people would whine about the lack of skip the speech functions. People like the idea of fighting a big ass ice wyrm the first time around, but 2 pulls later you have people braying "BEEEEEETRAAAAAAAAAAAYS YOOOOOOOOOOOOOUUUU!!" over vent while the feral druid humps your corpse before starting with the rezzes.


Oh, and it's not exactly like the MMO community is known for keeping spoilers under wraps, either-- if anything, you're expected to know content before you do it in these games unless you're at the leading edge of the player population. So remember that we had this conversation the first time someone firebombs you with something like "HEY GUIZE, WHAT DO I DO AFTER I FIND OUT I'M REVAN!?" in the SWTOR equivalent of trade chat.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 25 Jan 2011, 11:38
I almost quit playing, but then I started leveling up my shaman again (I kind of stopped when I got to Northrend) and Northrend pugs are a lot funner than they used to be. Mostly because everyone knows what to do because they're making alts and so there's more room to goof off. It's a nice change from Cata pugs which are Serious Business and take forever because chances are you'll do the same dungeon with about 3 different tanks, healers, and maybe a few different dps people because people suck.

Most of the 85s, including me, in my guild are considering joining a larger guild just so we don't have to do pugs anymore. We have friends on the same server in a different guild, so I think we're applying to that one. Definitely keeping my guild running, though, as a backup. We put effort into our bank and whatnot, I don't really want to give it up now. Also it's good to have a backup in case something happens.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 26 Jan 2011, 12:56
Someone explain these to me:

Giant prairie dog with a helmet and dagger.

(http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/hs062.snc6/167238_825859728535_21400308_42985010_3620043_n.jpg)

Giant rabbit with an axe.

(http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash1/hs782.ash1/167238_825859733525_21400308_42985011_1646502_n.jpg)

These were on a plateau in the Barrens right next to the border to Mulgore. I saw them when I was flying around for the Elder stuff and was all WTF and had to take a screen shot because it looked to ridiculous to be real.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Gemmwah on 26 Jan 2011, 17:53
<3
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 17 Feb 2011, 08:49
I haven't burned out but I have been working these last 10 days and have not been near my computer, my sub ran out before last patch and I have no money for the next few days but I need to resub asap to finish levelling that warlock and that DK so I have something worth playing since the Juggernaught nerf.

:(

Anyone tell me if it is really that bad?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 17 Feb 2011, 15:28
No idea, I haven't actually played in weeks and my account expires today. Only reason I've logged on at all is to say goodbye to people and give away my 80k gold to the like 5-6 people who still play on my server who are cool.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: cyro on 18 Feb 2011, 02:08
I think my account expires on the 4th, I dunno. I shifted WoW onto my external and haven't really touched it in a month. Currently spending my time reading, writing, socialising and replaying DA:O/DA:OA for my DA2 imports.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 18 Feb 2011, 06:34
Lately, I've just been doing holiday achievements, Tol Barad dailies (dragon mount is so cool), and playing alts. The only reason I'm not canceling is because I got a 60 day game card. It's getting boring and I'm busy with school all the time anyways.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Boro_Bandito on 18 Feb 2011, 12:02
had to cancel my account today, so it ends at the end of the month, for once not because I want to, but because I'm just completely out of all money of any kind, plus some priorities that have managed to pick themselves up in the past couple weeks.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: axerton on 27 Feb 2011, 21:04
So I haven't been playing that much of late but a friend mentioned 4.1 so I went to mmo champion to check it out, and I fell in love.

(http://media.mmo-champion.com/images/news/2011/february/berylfirehawk_small.jpg) (http://media.mmo-champion.com/images/news/2011/february/berylfirehawk.jpg)

I must have it. at a guess I'd say its going to be the guild reward for taking down Ragnaros in the Firelands, which might actually be doable in my current guild as long as we all stay on target this time rather than all kind of wandering off and leveling alts like we did this time.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 28 Feb 2011, 08:31
Buh.

WANT.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: clockworkjames on 18 Apr 2011, 14:11
Anyone still enjoying this game or have you all given up? I am still playing off and on so as "Not to fall behind" or something :/
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Gemmwah on 18 Apr 2011, 14:52
I'm still playing because I got given a year's free play, but I've lost the desire to actually do anything, which bites because I used to really enjoy it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Dazed on 18 Apr 2011, 16:56
I quit some time ago. Starcraft 2 hoooooo!
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 18 Apr 2011, 17:31
Yeah, haven't even looked back.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 19 Apr 2011, 13:45
I've been leveling up an alt because I had a game card, but I'm about to call it quits. I am really bored with everything and don't see the point in doing randoms anymore, since you wait around for 30min and there's a chance the tank or healer will drop within the first 5 minutes.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Doctor Online on 20 Apr 2011, 13:37
Everyone, just like me is losing interest. My account expires next week.

In other news, if this has been posted before forgive me but WTF is this (http://www.gamepolitics.com/2011/04/14/fbi-raids-university-michigan-students039-apartment-over-wow-gold-farming)? I hate gold farmers, but uhm, I think it's just a tad bit extreme.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Spectreofwar on 03 May 2011, 10:26
I quit for the fifth and (most likely) final time several months ago. Cataclysm was neat and had a lot of new ideas, but I hit 80 VERY swiftly. The challenges went from easy (or nonexistent) to insane with heroics. Not so much because the heroics themselves were hard, mind you, but because they were designed where people actually had to pay attention and use all the abilities they were given and it seemed like NOBODY I grouped with for the relatively few I did was doing that.

Once I hit that wall, and I realise that I had actually done everything else I could do aside commit my life to a guild for raiding, I knew my time was finally at an end.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Honeyfeather on 03 May 2011, 15:09
Anyone still enjoying this game or have you all given up? I am still playing off and on so as "Not to fall behind" or something :/

I still enjoy it, and not just because I have to (it's my replacement addiction for smoking and drinking, so without WoW I'm a raging alcoholic with a smoker's cough again). I love getting achievements; it's an addiction that makes me feel like I'm awesome. Which is hard to find, so you know. *thumbs up*

I play off and on mostly because I'm fulltime in classes and it's hard to squeeze in, but once my summer break kicks in I have a feeling my boyfriend and I will just be on our accounts all the time. Maybe occasionally switching out for Civilization IV. Or sleep or food or something.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Josefbugman on 03 May 2011, 15:32
Given up and moved on to Shogun 2 and job applications.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 03 May 2011, 20:03
I forgot that I was only 3 holidays away from my Violet Proto Drake, so I haven't cancelled yet. I did the quest chain in STV for the 4.1 content and now I'm stuck because I don't have good enough gear for the Zandalari heroics. Yay...

Ok, so anyone with a drake out there...How did you get School of Hard Knocks (http://www.wowhead.com/achievement=1786/school-of-hard-knocks#comments) done? I've tried AV several times now and no one will cooperate with the towers, even those who are trying to do it. I haven't even tried EoS or WG yet, but got AB pretty easy. Any tips would be great as I'm not big on PvP and really can't stand most people who do BGs. (Sorry BG players, but sometimes you are assholes. Which is why I hate it.)

Why is it that players who aren't avid PvPers or raiders can't have nice things, too?
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Josefbugman on 04 May 2011, 00:22
Because those players might play OTHER games, and Blizzard needs all your time focussed on its game... or else.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Alex C on 04 May 2011, 12:22
Guild BGs. And tbh, if something was easy or fast in WoW, I wouldn't do it.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 04 May 2011, 13:27
I don't want fast and/or easy. That's boring. But this is seriously the only part of the holiday achievement that is really giving me problems and really it boils down to me not being in a PvP guild. Or an active guild in general.

I mean, I'm glad Cata isn't a cake walk like WotLK, but I never really liked the old battlegrounds except for Arathi Basin. I liked Wintergrasp and I like Tol Barad, but getting people you don't know to let you capture a flag or let you assault a tower is kind of a bitch. (Like, I begged some guy to let some Horde assault a tower so I could re-assault it and he wouldn't let me and proceeded to laugh and kill everything.)
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Odal on 06 May 2011, 06:28
My account ran out on the 2nd.  And good riddance.  You know the game has a problem when you have to dread a patch for the bugs it will bring.  On top of that, the "improvements" they make are beyond questionable... some of the stuff they do is just downright stupid.  I'm done trying to find enjoyment in a game that is seemingly trying to ruin itself.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: kemon on 07 May 2011, 21:45
i ran through the hard knocks achieve pretty early in the week.   i guess i got kinda lucky because 3 of the bg's i got into were filled with people wanting to get it done.  so wsg, each team had an enemy in their base who would grab and drop the flag so it could get returned.  i even ended up getting the frenzy one from returning it 5 times or something after everyone on my team had cycled through.  av had a bunker and tower filled with both factions just capping it back and forth.   there were those who couldn't look past the 'red you're dead' mentality.  but they were quickly stomped on while their allies stood by and watched.

later in the week trying to get it done on a lesser used alt, i ran into a lot more of what linds saw.  in an eots where our team had 3 bases and were clearly going to win the match running away, some warrior grabbed the flag and just held it the entire game.  i asked if i could get the achieve done, he told me he was here to win not to let some kid get achievements.   so naturally i gathered as many enemy players as i could find and led them in a little chase to where he was hiding with the flag.   i got that achievement done a short time later.  =P

anyways, i think i just got lucky.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: Lines on 08 May 2011, 07:05
I got AB and EoS done relatively fast, because it's easy for me to stealth up in cat form and wait for everyone to be too busy PVPing to notice someone clicking on a flag. I gave up trying to do WSG and AV, though. I couldn't get a group together by spamming trade and people weren't really willing to work together. If I'm still playing this summer, I'll finish the midsummer stuff and just try again for children's week next year. I feel like I would have had an easier time if I wasn't lvl 85 and competing with a bunch of people who do this all the time, but oh well.
Title: Re: World of Warcraft
Post by: 0bsessions on 14 Jul 2011, 15:47
Alright people who still post here and are also still on WoW:

They just released realID crossrealm five mans, anyone interested in getting all up in this bitch, so to speak while it's still free? I ain't putting my realID up on here for QC shippers to potentially use, but if you're interested, drop me a line and we'll get ID's exchanged and all that and go stomp on some trolls. I've only got Horde at a respectable level, so Alliance need not apply unless you're content to run with a level 41 or so wolf thing.