THESE FORUMS NOW CLOSED (read only)

Fun Stuff => CLIKC => Topic started by: Cartilage Head on 25 Sep 2010, 02:28

Title: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Cartilage Head on 25 Sep 2010, 02:28
 It looks amazing. Here are some videos.

Trailer. (http://www.gamesradar.com/f/bioshock-infinite-trailer-analysis-we-dissect-it-frame-by-frame/a-2010081218410828029)

"Gameplay footage". (http://www.gamesradar.com/xbox360/bioshock-infinite/news/see-10-amazing-minutes-of-bioshock-infinite-gameplay/a-201009211174463004/g-20100812105534267003)

That is pretty much it. Thoughts?

Edit: Oh shit. I didn't know that Dovey already made a thread about it (probably avoided it like AIDS because of the title). Feel free to delete or combine this, mods.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Johnny C on 26 Sep 2010, 03:19
i'll let the invisible hand of the market decide actually
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Cartilage Head on 26 Sep 2010, 04:11
Hear hear!
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 21 Oct 2012, 13:50
thread is ancient, but it already exist, so here we go.

New trailer (http://www.destructoid.com/bioshock-infinite-s-brand-new-beast-of-america-trailer-237162.phtml) was released today.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: LTK on 21 Oct 2012, 13:53
How funny, I was just wondering about this game today. Still slated for Feb 2013?

Won't watch the trailer though. Too tantalizing. I've decided not to watch any more footage for games that I know I'm going to want to play.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 21 Oct 2012, 13:56
Yup, which is amazing. I've been pretty convinced they'd push it back to late 2013 for months now, just due to the reality of the development process on games like this.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: snalin on 21 Oct 2012, 13:57
26th of February according to the trailer. Looks sweet!
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 10 Dec 2012, 07:02
The game has been pushed back to March 26th, but I don't care.

Here is Destructoid's take on it. (http://www.destructoid.com/bioshock-infinite-goes-beyond-our-sky-high-expectations-240079.phtml)

I want this game very very badly, but they can put it off as long as they feel they need to.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Thrillho on 10 Dec 2012, 13:16
I cannot wait for this game. And I am avoiding all info, screenshots, teasers or trailers. I knew absolutely nothing about the first two and so the shock and awe of them was majestic.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 11 Dec 2012, 07:26
The only thing I'll spoil is that the one complaint that review had is that the combat is too good.

Just, let that sink in for a bit.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: riccostar on 11 Dec 2012, 18:50
Wow...

I am overcome with do want
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Bev on 18 Dec 2012, 03:35
Just saw the latest preview and this really looks more like call of duty than bioshock. Seriously the main character just grenades the shit out of EVERYONE and never gets hit, it's rediculous. I really hope this isn't representative of the entire game because if so, it looks damn cool as an action game, but NOTHING like a Bioshock game.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 28 Jan 2013, 22:58
This is the newest trailer for Bioshock: Infinite. I fucking love these guys.

Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 29 Jan 2013, 04:43
Fuck, but I hope my tax clears through, I don't wanna have to be making choices between all these games I want coming up next month.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: snalin on 29 Jan 2013, 06:47
This game. This game. Oh man.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 29 Jan 2013, 10:31
Just saw the latest preview and this really looks more like call of duty than bioshock. Seriously the main character just grenades the shit out of EVERYONE and never gets hit, it's rediculous. I really hope this isn't representative of the entire game because if so, it looks damn cool as an action game, but NOTHING like a Bioshock game.

I'm guessing it's console codes for the most part. Though as I mentioned before, one of the only faults one review I posted had was that the combat was "too good". Mainly in the sense that while the game encouraged him to play it as a Bioshock title, aka explore and drink in the environment, which tells as much of a story as the actual narrative,  the combat was just so much fun that it was sometimes hard to make himself avoid it.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: LeeC on 01 Feb 2013, 07:45
saw this trailer
http://cheezburger.com/47155969 (http://cheezburger.com/47155969)

looks like a good movie trailer but its for the game.  I was not engaged by the previous bioshock game, but this one intrigues me.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 15 Feb 2013, 12:43
Yesssss, Truth From Legend trailer Pt. 2!

Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 17 Feb 2013, 15:20
Fuck yeah this advertising is awesome.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Blue Kitty on 18 Feb 2013, 14:32
(http://cdn.fearnet.com/sites/default/files/images/News/bio_shock_infinite.jpg)
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: snalin on 19 Feb 2013, 16:41
new trailer!

Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 19 Feb 2013, 18:13
UNF
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 19 Feb 2013, 20:52
That just made me VERY excited.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 22 Feb 2013, 12:19
since Infinite just went up for pre-order on Steam with unlocks available, I just wanted to remind everyone how much I fucking love the Beast of America trailer

Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 18 Mar 2013, 14:44
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 21 Mar 2013, 17:24
Bioshock: Infinite apparently cost about $200 million to make. (http://www.destructoid.com/bioshock-infinite-among-most-expensive-games-of-all-time-249310.phtml) Bioshock cost them $80 million and it doubles the $100 mil development of GTAIV.

Holy shit
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 21 Mar 2013, 17:26
Wow. You'd really want this game to go gangbusters then if it cost you that fucking much.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 21 Mar 2013, 17:27
I'm 100% certain, barring some kind of act of God, that I'm going to love this game to bits. But dear lord is this a good example of why the industry is bumbling it's way to the edge of another industry collapse.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 21 Mar 2013, 17:33
Honestly where does all that money GO?! I don't know much about making a game but geez, I don't think a decent game should cost that much. I mean, how much did Skyrim cost? Or say Mass Effect 3?

And yeah, this game probably will set the standard for a while.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 21 Mar 2013, 17:44
Well, Capcom has talked about before how every single character in Street Fighter IV costs at least $1 million to make and release. This isn't even going into other aspects of the game, just developing the movesets and animations. I know the developers of Skullgirls, an indy fighter title, released their development costs for a IndiGogo campaign to raise money for an expansion DLC and it was around $200k per character even for them.

Something like Mass Effect might be a little skewed due to sharing of assets between games too, but I'm pretty sure Bioware has never shared development costs before. I don't think Bethesda has ever released any of their development costs for their projects either, but I assume it was pretty ridiculous, if not anywhere near as close to this, as well. Though clearly none of that money goes into their writing team.

Edit: I'm seeing rumors of $60 mil for Skyrim, but nothing that confirms it. Can't find a damn thing for the ME series. I mean, there are also MMOs that blow $200 mil out of the water, but I don't think they're a fair thing to use in comparison considering how much of a different beast AAA MMO development is.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 21 Mar 2013, 19:25
Yeah, I don't think constant development would really factor. Otherwise the top spot would go to WoW.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: snalin on 21 Mar 2013, 20:24
If you consider wages, administration, hardware, software, and other workplace costs, I'd not be surprised if a single person on a development team costs ~$200k a year, so the costs of a game goes up quickly.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 21 Mar 2013, 20:30
Oh definitely. As I'm sure you're aware considering some of your recent postings, it depends a hell of a lot on experience, but apparently starting pay for a fresh to the market developer (in the US) is about $46k, and it apparently averages out to about $86k a year per person for developer salaries alone.

Edit: Also, if I recall correctly, didn't they start development almost immediately after Bioshock was released? If so, that makes it almost 6 years in development, I know it was at least 5.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 21 Mar 2013, 21:04
6 yea. . . I swear to god that if this turns out like Colonial Marines I will personally tar and feather them. ALL OF THEM.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Blyss on 22 Mar 2013, 10:47
For that to happen, they would have to have given the game to someone else about a 3rd of the way through, then THEY would have had to have outsourced it to someone ELSE, and then everyone would have twiddled their thumbs for a few years, and then pretended to be shocked when the final product was a thumb-twiddled piece of shit.

Pretty sure that's not what we'll get with this product.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 22 Mar 2013, 15:28
And now Levine is denying that Infinite cost anywhere near that much. I'd actually love for developers and publishers to be a bit more transparent about this.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 23 Mar 2013, 03:11
Could be arguing semantics, i.e: The game didn't cost that much.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 25 Mar 2013, 05:08
Destructoid's review is up. There's mild spoiler's, mainly just character names, though nothing that surprised me since I've been following the development. No story spoils or anything.

Destructoid's Bioshock: Inifnite Score - 10/10 (http://www.destructoid.com/review-bioshock-infinite-249341.phtml)
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 25 Mar 2013, 06:18
Oh, if only tomorrow was today. . .
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Method of Madness on 25 Mar 2013, 09:54
I haven't played the first two but heard this game isn't connected storywise. I do plan on playing the first two but would it be bad if I played this first?
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 25 Mar 2013, 09:58
Not at all. Some things will not be immediately familiar to you, but that's not a big deal. The only thing they really share other than some gameplay mechanics and features is the theme of critically analyzing political beliefs.

I do highly recommend going back and playing through the first Bioshock at some point though. Andrew Ryan is one of the best villians in video games and his death scene is one of the best video game moments in history, period.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Method of Madness on 25 Mar 2013, 11:22
Cool. I'll acquire Infinite as soon as I am able to, then.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: LTK on 25 Mar 2013, 12:25
I got it from GetGamesGo.com, which gives you XCOM, Bioshock and a third game of your choice (Civ V/Spec Ops: The Line/Mafia II) if you get it before it releases 3-ish hours from now. GreenManGaming.com offers the same deal but it also offers The Darkness II or Bioshock 2 as a third option, and is €1,50 cheaper. I went with Spec Ops, myself.

Free market competition is the greatest thing to happen to PC gaming.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: snalin on 25 Mar 2013, 19:30
Steam is still your best bet if you're into hats, though.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Method of Madness on 25 Mar 2013, 19:57
Hats?
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: snalin on 25 Mar 2013, 20:49
http://www.pcgamesn.com/tf2/tf2-trading-guide-getting-started-valves-hat-based-economy (http://www.pcgamesn.com/tf2/tf2-trading-guide-getting-started-valves-hat-based-economy)
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Method of Madness on 26 Mar 2013, 12:47
I mean aren't hats just a TF2 thing?
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: LTK on 26 Mar 2013, 13:21
And guess what Steam's pre-order bonus for Bioshock Infinite is?

By the way, I've signed up for that pre-order flash game thingy (https://www.finkmanufacturing.com/). It's a puzzle game, and it starts off a bit slow but gradually gets more difficult. Apparently there's a reward at the end that differs whether you've been choosing for one faction or the other. Might be interesting.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 26 Mar 2013, 21:20
I. . . I just finished it.

Holy crap.

HOLY CRAP.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Method of Madness on 26 Mar 2013, 21:22
Already? I don't even have it yet :\
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 26 Mar 2013, 21:28
I'm kind of a powergamer. Anyway. . .

Holy.

CRAP.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: blanktom on 27 Mar 2013, 03:22
I got it yesterday, have played for about 6 hours or so. The mos noticeable thing is how much more chaotic combat is, but I really like the tear system, which really gives you a sense of control over the bigger, more spread out battles.

The only thing I don't like is the fact you can only carry 2 guns at once. I wouldn't mind if we were all about the realism, but...it's Bioshock. Although, that is the ONLY thing I don't lke. Game is so damn good.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 27 Mar 2013, 04:26
Eh, I'll admit it can be a little frustrating to have just dropped a useful weapon for something that looked kinda cool only to be screaming bloody murder for it ten minutes later, but it's really a complete non-issue. I did feel the combat got a little spammy at times, but yeah, again a non-issue. Kinda likeable actually. Haven't felt that frustrated by a game in a good way in ages.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: LTK on 27 Mar 2013, 09:05
The only thing I don't like is the fact you can only carry 2 guns at once. I wouldn't mind if we were all about the realism, but...it's Bioshock. Although, that is the ONLY thing I don't lke. Game is so damn good.
A 2 weapon limit?! Christ, what happened to Levine that he would do this to Bioshock?
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Masterpiece on 27 Mar 2013, 11:17
I've been told by many people that this game is great. I was still convinced that Irrational could not pull off the action that the game had portrayed in the previous trailers.

Thank god I was proven wrong.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 28 Mar 2013, 00:49
Just beat the game.

Holy shit...

Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 28 Mar 2013, 03:15
I know, right?
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Masterpiece on 28 Mar 2013, 03:27
no spoilers! This is the only game in YEARS (since Portal 1) that I'm playing completely unspoilered!
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 28 Mar 2013, 04:16
No worries, I'm going to put off talking details for a few more days I think. That or shit loads of spoiler tags.

I will say that the ending is perfect.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Method of Madness on 28 Mar 2013, 04:25
Note to self: don't look at this thread in Tapatalk (spoiler tags don't work there).
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 28 Mar 2013, 05:26
Don't worry, I don't think anyone would want to spoil this.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: LTK on 28 Mar 2013, 05:41
Think again. Apparently when the game got leaked shortly before release, people didn't really like the ending. One particular jerk went and spammed comment threads full with copy-pasted messages of the twist in bold. So I read enough to know the general concept before having the presence of mind to wrench my eyes away.

Also: Without manual saves, 1999 mode is bullshit.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: snalin on 28 Mar 2013, 08:05
Yeah, I'm really missing manual saves right now. Walking by a police barrier by mistake and having to reload 5 minutes back is a pretty big hassle.

I'm torn on the two guns thing - they've probably thought that it adds tactical depth, but to me, I really miss being able to select the right gun for the situation. Going to a new area with long sight lines, and then being stuck on hand cannon and mortar is kind of a bitch.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: LTK on 28 Mar 2013, 08:29
You know what I liked best about the previous weapon system? The creativity and variety that went into the weapons. Bioshock 1 and 2 had things like electric, phosphorous and exploding buckshot, proximity grenades, liquid nitrogen, trap rivets, and rocket spears. There's nothing of the sort in Infinite; it's all just bullets or explosives.

I feel a bit like I'm being all "Change is ba-a-a-ad, games should always stay the sa-a-a-ame" but I really think this was what set the gunplay in Bioshock apart from all the other shooters, so I'm sad it's gone. On the other hand, I haven't gotten to the point where the skyrails start getting involved in the combat, so I don't have a complete picture yet.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: snalin on 28 Mar 2013, 09:39
The thing is, they don't ever limit what vigors you can bring into combat, and all are trapable, so you get some of that depth back. But yeah, I do miss the different kinds of ammo. With more enemies and more and cheaper ammo, you get to shoot your guns much more, which is a lot of fun. The gunplay is all in all an entirely different beast, and I'm not sure which I like better - seems like I have to go back to Bioshock once I'm done.

One thing that's cool about the weapons is that they all look really gorgeous. Even the standard machine gun has a lot of character.

Has anyone figured out how to actually get behind the mechanized patriots? Shocking them stuns them for a bit, but usually not for long enough to make the entire trip around them, and possessing somebody to work as a decoy works for a bit, but the patriots seems to be smart enough to turn towards you once you start pumping out damage.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Masterpiece on 28 Mar 2013, 10:32
Regarding the Patriots, they get stunned for much longer once you buy the update. Before that... I improvised.

I must say I finished the game now and I am thoroughly confused.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Masterpiece on 28 Mar 2013, 13:04
Also, you don't have to get exactly behind them, just shooting the gears from the side works as well.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 28 Mar 2013, 14:16
Yeah, but they're pretty quick even for that. Still, they are the best for possession though, I think.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Masterpiece on 28 Mar 2013, 14:17
I never thought of possessing them, I'd have thought that wouldn't work -
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 28 Mar 2013, 14:22
Oh no. It works. Just don't shoot them while you're at it, it gives you that 'shooting Allies' crap.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Masterpiece on 28 Mar 2013, 14:25
I just thought that was a cheap pop-up that had no further ramifications whatsoever.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 28 Mar 2013, 14:31
Maybe, but I ain't taking no chances.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Masterpiece on 28 Mar 2013, 15:49
Neither did I   :-D
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: snalin on 28 Mar 2013, 17:04
To my fellow pc gamers, I found this very helpful: ini tweaks (http://www.pcgamer.com/2013/03/27/bioshock-infinite-tweaks-let-you-skip-intro-videos-increase-fov-and-adjust-sensitivity/). You can get the FOV as far as you want (the usual preferences are 90 on a pc-monitor you are sitting near, and 75, the default maximum, for tv-screens a metre or two away), remove the damn hour of intro videos, and adjust the mouse settings (I did not find that necessary, as you can turn off mouse acceleration in the in-game menu). There will probably pop up more ini-goodies as time goes on.

I think we also need a spoiler thread to discuss that ending. Gonna make it tomorrow if nobody has.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 28 Mar 2013, 17:34
But. . . why would you want to?
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 29 Mar 2013, 01:51
Bioshock Infinite: The Siege of Columbia board game (http://www.plaidhatgames.com/news/226)

Well that looks interesting. I'm waiting for the rules to be released before I decide, but it sounds rather promising and Plaid Hat has a pretty great track record.

I'd also like to go on record saying that Handymen are fucking assholes.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Masterpiece on 29 Mar 2013, 03:38
remove the damn hour of intro videos
Have you tried clicking? That works just as well, without altering ini settings.
Also FOV is adjustable ingame.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: snalin on 29 Mar 2013, 06:50
... I couldn't click away most of the intro movies. And 75 is as much as you get the FOV up to without twiddling.

The handymen... I think on shows up 3 times (maybe 4) throughout the game, and it's a pretty big challenge every time. If you're not hitting their heart, they can eat an entire crank gun clip. Every time it came down to shooting them a lot, shocking them when they got close, and jumping to the nearest skyline to get the hell out. Fun times.


Okay, if people are okay with it, I'm going to spoiler tag spoiler things. Ender spoilers under spoiler tags, you are warned:

(click to show/hide)

Also replaying Bioshock 1, and the would you kindly thing is really obvious now. Even in the five seconds you are sitting in the plane at the beginning, you see a package in your lap, and a note on the package starting with "would you kindly". I'd like to see if that kind of core plot details are possible to spot early on in Infinite.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Masterpiece on 29 Mar 2013, 06:58
which movie didn't work? Aside from the actual loadscreen (which will always appear, as it loads the environment the menu is in), all videos were skippable.

(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 29 Mar 2013, 07:12
There's definitely a lot that's telegraphed early on, though I'll have to do my replay to confirm more specific examples.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 29 Mar 2013, 07:13
(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: snalin on 29 Mar 2013, 07:22
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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 29 Mar 2013, 07:30
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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 29 Mar 2013, 07:33
(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 29 Mar 2013, 07:42
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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 29 Mar 2013, 07:45
(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 29 Mar 2013, 07:49
(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 29 Mar 2013, 07:53
(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 29 Mar 2013, 07:56
(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Masterpiece on 29 Mar 2013, 08:03
(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 29 Mar 2013, 08:08
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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: LTK on 29 Mar 2013, 17:26
These checkpoints must BURN in the DEEPEST pits of HELL.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Masterpiece on 30 Mar 2013, 06:06
IMHO, this is worth the price of admission alone:
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Blue Kitty on 30 Mar 2013, 07:14
(http://art.penny-arcade.com/photos/i-BbWGCJg/0/950x10000/i-BbWGCJg-950x10000.jpg)
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: snalin on 30 Mar 2013, 07:22
IMHO, this is worth the price of admission alone:
'will the circle be unbroken'

(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: LTK on 30 Mar 2013, 18:41
Well, I just finished it. Everything makes sense. Except, not.

Also replaying Bioshock 1, and the would you kindly thing is really obvious now. Even in the five seconds you are sitting in the plane at the beginning, you see a package in your lap, and a note on the package starting with "would you kindly". I'd like to see if that kind of core plot details are possible to spot early on in Infinite.
It's not as glaringly obvious in hindsight as it was in Bioshock 1. Even if you notice the things that point towards what really happened, it's easy to find an alternative explanation. I went in knowing the big twist, and it didn't became conclusive until Comstock's last voxophone recording said what he meant by...

(click to show/hide)

Gonna read the rest of those spoilers now.

(click to show/hide)
Totally saw that coming.

(click to show/hide)
(click to show/hide)

Now, there's only one thing left that I really don't understand. How the hell does Comstock actually tell the future?
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: snalin on 30 Mar 2013, 19:30
Now, there's only one thing left that I really don't understand. How the hell does Comstock actually tell the future?

(click to show/hide)

(click to show/hide)

(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 30 Mar 2013, 19:38
(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: LTK on 30 Mar 2013, 20:02
(click to show/hide)
Ahh, I get it now. I did listen to that voxophone where Lutece explains this, so I just forgot.

The timeline is thus:

(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Method of Madness on 30 Mar 2013, 23:28
(click to show/hide)
Great game, though. And after listening to that, I think I might have to acquire the soundtrack.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 30 Mar 2013, 23:36
So, when you die in 1999 Mode you lose a shit load of money.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Masterpiece on 31 Mar 2013, 04:39
(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 31 Mar 2013, 04:56
(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: LTK on 31 Mar 2013, 05:20
Derp, fixed.

(click to show/hide)
There are an infinite number.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 31 Mar 2013, 05:24
I see what you did there.

*Hands over the mop*

Make sure you get all of it.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Thrillho on 31 Mar 2013, 14:21
So I'd call this game about a 7.5/10, how 'bout everyone else?

I had a love/hate relationship with the gameplay. The art design and story was probably the best thing I've ever seen.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 31 Mar 2013, 15:44
One thing, is 1999 mode like a genuine new game mode? Like, you keep all the stuff you've collect and everything? IS there a proper new game mode?
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Masterpiece on 31 Mar 2013, 16:25
what bothers me a bit is that it feels like this game is really hampered by being a first-person-shooter. You can't really expand on the genre that much.

Having said that, seeing as this is in my opinion a truly different first person shooter that isn't a simple firing lane, but actually expects you to think encounters through and plan and use your environment to your advantage, it's a pretty good first person shooter. And gameplay wise, the addition of Elizabeth as your ally during firefights has not been matched by other studios. It has an incredible setting, something that truly sets it apart. The story is without doubt first class.

The only true quarrel I have with this game is that it ends. I can't see myself playing this through again, just as I had trouble playing through Bioshock 1 & 2 twice.

But I can't see how I could give this game a score lesser than 10. In an industry so plagued by rip-offs and mediocre sequels and rehashes, something that stands out so beautifully deserves to be applauded.
(can't beat Tomb Raider though.)
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: LTK on 31 Mar 2013, 16:37
One thing, is 1999 mode like a genuine new game mode? Like, you keep all the stuff you've collect and everything? IS there a proper new game mode?
Haha, nope. It's just a new game, but more punishing, and the containers contain much less resources. It's an absolute goddamned travesty, if you ask me.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Method of Madness on 31 Mar 2013, 16:38
So it's just an ultra-hard mode? As someone who just finished it on easy, I'll pass, I think.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Thrillho on 31 Mar 2013, 17:00
what bothers me a bit is that it feels like this game is really hampered by being a first-person-shooter. You can't really expand on the genre that much.

Having said that, seeing as this is in my opinion a truly different first person shooter that isn't a simple firing lane, but actually expects you to think encounters through and plan and use your environment to your advantage, it's a pretty good first person shooter. And gameplay wise, the addition of Elizabeth as your ally during firefights has not been matched by other studios. It has an incredible setting, something that truly sets it apart. The story is without doubt first class.

The only true quarrel I have with this game is that it ends. I can't see myself playing this through again, just as I had trouble playing through Bioshock 1 & 2 twice.

But I can't see how I could give this game a score lesser than 10. In an industry so plagued by rip-offs and mediocre sequels and rehashes, something that stands out so beautifully deserves to be applauded.
(can't beat Tomb Raider though.)

Because most of the gameplay sucks, only having two weapons is bullshit, and the guns are so strong that using the vigors is basically pointless.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Method of Madness on 31 Mar 2013, 17:28
The only vigors I used were Possession and Force Lightning.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Masterpiece on 31 Mar 2013, 17:47
Which difficulty did you two play on? My guns were DEFINITELY underpowered. Or maybe I just used the wrong ones (Vox MP and Vox Burstgun, mostly. Hated the cannons)
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Method of Madness on 31 Mar 2013, 17:53
I played it on easy. Judge if you must.  I was able to get through the game mostly with the pistol/machine gun. It helped that I upgraded my salts to the maximum (I got enough health from Elizabeth/pickups and the punishment for dying was minimal anyway). Oh, editing to add...how has nobody mentioned the songs being played a good half century or more before they came out? I remember hearing an instrumental version of what sounded like "Girls Just Want to Have Fun" and thought "no, that can't be. No way." And then later I heard another song (I don't remember which one), but then later in the game there was definitely someone sitting on a wall singing "Fortunate Son". So...yeah, that was a nice touch.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Masterpiece on 31 Mar 2013, 18:06
Well I tried finishing on hard, but had to switch to medium when
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And yes, I noticed the Girls Just Wanna Have Fun thing, I was like WHAT IN GODS NAME, but it's explained pretty well in the game:
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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Method of Madness on 31 Mar 2013, 18:15
I don't recall hearing that, but honestly, I'm disappointed they did explain it. Seems like one of those things that would just be better if they weren't explained.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: snalin on 31 Mar 2013, 19:18
It's mentioned here and there. You find the voxophone that goes most into depth about it in a house that's a bit outside the beaten path - you have to, at one point, turn around and look backwards to see the entrance, as far as I remember.

The barbershop quartet early on singing God Only Knows is the best thing, though:

Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Method of Madness on 31 Mar 2013, 19:32
Ah! Right, that was the other song! And ahh, I honestly didn't even look and see that, I just heard it and kept going, so I didn't see the sign that had the name of the song with "Albert Fink presents", and I guess I never went into that house so I never got that voxaphone. But yeah, loved it.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: snalin on 31 Mar 2013, 19:45
Oh, about the weapons and the vigors... I had a lot of fun with the upgraded crows and a shotgun. Crow someone, shoot them, they become a crow-trap, watch someone walk into it, shoot them, lovely. Other than that, the guns seemed quite okay. I never quite managed to figure out how the hellfire worked, but other than that (and the boring-ass pistol), I kept spinning though the other guns just because I couldn't decide on which to use, which was a cool element.

There were some fun combos you could do - combining the equipment that gave you longer melee range with the one that gave you hitpoints for meelee kills, and suddenly the rather lackluster charge and water...whatever vigors becomes interesting. The return to sender (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PU5xxh5UX4U) was really cute. Possesion was all over just amazingly good.

Playing at medium, the normal dudes were not really a challenge unless they came in very big numbers, but handymen, those fireslinger-dudes, patriots, and all the other "big" enemies made the fights more difficult. If you could get through on easy with only a pistol and a machine gun, it looks like the easy/medium/hard spectrum is actually working as intended, which is nice.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Method of Madness on 31 Mar 2013, 20:07
Oh yeah, I was definitely not complaining about that, I enjoyed myself and enjoyed the scenery and the story. There was a bit of a challenge, but just enough to make me feel like I'd earned the ending.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 31 Mar 2013, 20:33
I would definitely need some more context on why vigors are pointless from Gareth. Playing on Normal, I found the special units and particularly large crowds made vigors absolutely necessary in multiple situations. On the harder difficulties, even normal enemies demand regular Vigor usage.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Thrillho on 01 Apr 2013, 04:20
They just didn't really do anything for me. On Bioshock, I had many different pre-arranged systems for how I used the plasmids. If they were standing in water, I shocked them, otherwise I set them on fire so that they would be constantly taking damage. If I was also standing in the water, I'd use the bugs.

On this one you had shock jock, which was okayish but barely stopped a patriot in its tracks (uh, aren't they robots?), the fire one which worked like a grenade launcher and I hate those, return to sender never seemed to work for me, the crows did no damage they just distracted people which I could never be bothered with (I'm a very offensive player. I was the same in Pokemon, if a move didn't take damage off the opponent I didn't use it).

I used the one that hypnotised them to be on your side quite a lot, although I felt it didn't last long enough.

Also the vigor upgrades cost so much that I saw no reason to bother upgrading them because it flat out costs too much and I do better just shooting the guys.

Also, the Vox guns suck. By the end of the game I was using the hand cannon and the carbine almost exclusively with dabbles of the shotgun.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: LTK on 01 Apr 2013, 04:50
Return to Sender was tricky. All the Vigors (as well as some of the weapons) work differently depending on how long you hold the fire button. With Return to Sender, clicking gives you a temporary shield and holding lets you collect projectiles that are being shot at you, which you can throw back at people. It consumes Salts continuously while you're holding it, though, so it's not especially useful as an offensive power, but can save your life when you're being shot at from all directions.

Other Vigors were kind of disappointing, yes. Laying traps was almost completely useless because no one ever got near them. I never had any reason to use Bucking Bronco or Undertow, I wasn't prone to using Murder of Crows either, and Shock Jockey only became really useful once I got the chain shocking upgrade. I really liked Charge though, especially once I upgraded it to recharge my shields. If everyone was shooting at me I'd just charge into the first enemy I saw, which not only got me out of the crossfire but also restored my shields. Win-win. I got really good at zipping around the battlefield, Charging into someone and then shotgunning them, then if they were still standing, do a melee execution that had a chance to restore health. Plus, I also had that gear item which had a chance to Possess enemies when hit by a melee attack, and Charge counts as melee!

I started to feel bad for using executions very soon because Elizabeth got so upset by them. I can almost forgive them for changing everything that was good about the earlier Bioshocks since they did such an amazing job of characterising Elizabeth. This is what multi-million dollar video game budgets should be used for.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Thrillho on 01 Apr 2013, 04:54
Also, I thought the handymen were a bit OP. You just couldn't fight them. With Big Daddies you eventually could figure out a system, or you got powerful enough that you could just fight them head on, but that just didn't happen with handymen. You just had to keep dying until you wore them down.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: LTK on 01 Apr 2013, 05:06
You may be doing it wrong. You need to run. My usual tactic was to shock them repeatedly while shooting half a clip of whatever I was holding, before turning tail and running to a safer place. Possessing an enemy to serve as a distraction works well too.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Masterpiece on 01 Apr 2013, 05:18
How do you execute? I've got a feeling I missed out on that COMPLETELY.

I used a mix of Bucking Bronco and Charge. My charges were pretty powerful, as in one charge and one melee hit usually killed an enemy. I'd use bucking bronco to disable the rest and shoot them in the air, which takes less shots than being on the ground.

Against patriots, I'd use Shock Jockey and Grenades, although at the end I used bucking bronco instead of grenades as well. Shock Jockey really doesn't do much against patriots unless you upgrade its duration, after that, Patriots are pretty easy to deal with.

Against the fire guys I'd use (who guessed it?) the water vigor, because quite frankly, the water vigor pushed them away and disabled them for a short while, which was exactly what you want to do with a fireman.

I still have no idea how to kill a handyman without jumping on the freight rails.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: LTK on 01 Apr 2013, 06:48
When regular enemies are low on health, they get a skull icon near their health bar and you can hold V for an especially gory kill. I'm pretty sure that a regular melee hit will kill them just as well at that point, so doing executions is useless until you find some gear that gives you health for doing them.

Did you ever get caught on the skyline when a Handyman was electrocuting them? That was a dick move. I never spent much time on skylines anyway, I preferred to fight on foot. I saw that there's a lock-on option to shoot enemies while on a skyline, but that just feels like cheating.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 01 Apr 2013, 06:56
Eh, skylines are always good for hit and running, I find. Drop in and pimpslap someone, swap a clip or two with whoever is about, then just back of to restore and revive. Rinse and repeat.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: snalin on 01 Apr 2013, 07:06
Yeah, fighting Handymen heads on was never a good idea. Zap 'em and skyline out of there. Tears with turrets and such worked pretty well against them as well, if you managed to trick them into staying in the general area

Did anyone figure out the tesla coils? They were around here and there, but I couldn't get them to do anything special.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: LTK on 01 Apr 2013, 07:14
I activated a Tesla Coil in one of the great halls in Emporia, and they basically serve to stun anyone who comes near. I kept hearing one Vox guy screaming as he was being electrocuted, while I was busy dealing with a motorised patriot. I still had to shoot the guy afterwards, so I don't think it did much damage, if any. Not terribly useful, those things.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Masterpiece on 01 Apr 2013, 07:20
oooooh you had to HOLD v!! I was like "WELL I PRESSED V AND NOTHING HAPPENED" all the time!

I got shocked ONCE, never again.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 01 Apr 2013, 07:23
Most of the shocking I did was of Elizabeth.

With the brutality of my murders.

Honestly I executed every chance I got.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Method of Madness on 01 Apr 2013, 07:46
oooooh you had to HOLD v!! I was like "WELL I PRESSED V AND NOTHING HAPPENED" all the time!

I got shocked ONCE, never again.
Haha, same. Re: skyline, I had a gear that jumping from a skyline did guaranteed fire area damage, so that was useful against crowds and even helped a good bit on patriots if I struck them directly.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Thrillho on 01 Apr 2013, 10:05
I excuted as often as possible, because the animations were impossibly brutal. I was laughing with childlike glee as I did them every time.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 08 Apr 2013, 14:35
So, are people up for doing a bit more critical analysis talk about the game yet? I've got lots of things I wanna discuss, namely in the areas I feel like the game failed, especially in comparison to the original.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Method of Madness on 08 Apr 2013, 14:37
Well...yes and no. I'd be more than happy to discuss the game, but not if it's comparing to the original, since I haven't played that and don't want it spoiled.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 08 Apr 2013, 14:38
I don't think in detail comparisons would be needed for most of it and it wouldn't be the majority of the discussion I don't think.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: snalin on 08 Apr 2013, 15:54
I'd be interested.

To start it off, there's a lot of aspects that really cannot be compared. The combat mechanics are apples and oranges. The first game had slow paced, tactical engagements which was all about figuring out how to stay out of harms way and use the environment to your advantage. Big fights with big daddies (and sistahs if you count 2) was done best by laying down mines, drawing them into turret fire, and choosing the right ammo.

The combat in Infinite is much more about getting an overview of the larger area. You use the lines and the tears to get to high ground and behind cover, you use speed and superior firepower (and vigourpower) to distract, flank and destroy large groups of enemies. You are, to a much larger degree, able to soak up some bullets, especially late in the game with the bulletblocking vigour. You do not have time to carefully plan - when something big comes up, you have to think on your feet, run away, and do chip damage until it's brought down. The goals are different, the tools are different, the pace is different. You can discuss which is better, but that would be more about if survival gameplay is more fun than fast-paced shooting gameplay.

Not to spoil anything, but both have largely unnecessary and not very interesting end bosses. The fight towards the end of Infinite is really fun, but not really something I felt was appropriate to end the game with. The bullet sponge you shoot at for two minutes until it dies at the ending of the first was neither really that fun, but it was a more necessary part of the story. What was the end fight for Bioshock 2? 2 big sisters at once? Creativity!



You'll probably be interested in talking about the story too, and I'll let someone else start off there, but an interesting note; you know how there's a big binary choice throughout the entire first game (harvest vs save) which leads to one of two different endings? And you don't have the same kind of split ending in Infinite? This is a quote about the first game from Ken Levine, the lead designer, I shamelessly stole from wikipedia: "it was never my intention to do two endings for the game. It sort of came very late and it was something that was requested by somebody up the food chain from me."

It's kinda funny how "choice" has become a selling point that's ticked off on a list of "things to make the game sell".
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 08 Apr 2013, 16:26
Yeah, the combat is largely down to preference really. Either way, I basically play them in spite of the gameplay, not because of it. I feel like the Shooter trappings actually hinder the games more than anything.

Mostly I feel like they're Adventure/RPG games trapped in an FPS.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Parkour Lewis on 10 Apr 2013, 15:52
It's mentioned here and there. You find the voxophone that goes most into depth about it in a house that's a bit outside the beaten path - you have to, at one point, turn around and look backwards to see the entrance, as far as I remember.

The barbershop quartet early on singing God Only Knows is the best thing, though:


^^^THIS

That was probably still one of my favorite moments in the game.  I'm almost kind-of a maybe music buff, and when I heard them singing my ears perked up and I thought to myself, ".....I know this song...." and when I finally recognized the lyrics and remembered the time period I went into "holy shit" mode and decided this game was going to be great, regardless of gameplay or story, just for that moment alone if nothing else.  This feeling was doubled when I heard the negro spiritual of "Fortunate Son", one of my favorite songs ever, sung in one of my favorite genres, ever.

The gameplay?  At first I had doubts about the two-weapon system, but it made the pacing faster and allowed for a more by-the-seat-of-my-pants gameplay style, which I liked in the end.  The first two games probably let you get more into the character, but this playstyle lets you get more into the story, so it's really just a different flavor, and not a bad one at that.

The story left me stymied.  I understood the greatest part of it, except for
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  I enjoyed it a lot though.

Definintely at least a 9 in my book, reaching for a 10.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: GarandMarine on 10 Apr 2013, 23:33
....holy hera that's a lot of spoiler tags... between you guys and my little brother I might go redbox this one. I was gonna wait for the price to come down a little... but damn I might just marathon it this weekend.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: KingOfIreland on 11 Apr 2013, 02:30
It's mentioned here and there. You find the voxophone that goes most into depth about it in a house that's a bit outside the beaten path - you have to, at one point, turn around and look backwards to see the entrance, as far as I remember.

The barbershop quartet early on singing God Only Knows is the best thing, though:


Yeah, I immediately noticed that and basically listened out for everything and anything like that :D
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Thrillho on 11 Apr 2013, 10:36
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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 11 Apr 2013, 11:38
Alright, I think this blogger critique of the game is a good start to get the talk about the failure of the game mechanics and story. Comparisons to the first game are made somewhat, but I don't think anything is spoiled.

Bioshock Inifnite: Now is the Time (http://sexyvideogameland.blogspot.com/2013/04/bioshock-infinite-now-is-best-time.html)

Also while reading, keep in mind the last paragraph.

Quote
Phew. Okay. That was the violin-note. My last thought is to emphasize that I think a thorough critique is the highest compliment I can pay to any work. This vision deserves it. And I'd rather have a hundred imperfect games aching with the hollow voices of their strained creators than the loveliest cover shooter ever made. This is a crucial moment in our canon, and I honor it.

I don't agree with everything stated, but I'll come back later to give some of my thoughts.

Also, I'd probably give the game a 85 - 90.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: LTK on 11 Apr 2013, 11:57
In the same vein of criticality, I found myself agreeing with pretty much everything that TotalBiscuit talks about in his video.


Except when he talks about Elizabeth. He seems to have had a few jarring experiences regarding her behaviour during plot-heavy moments that break the suspension of disbelief, so he seems to think that her usual cheerfulness was never toned down in favour of her mood at the time. I know this is not true, though, because at the point where Elizabeth was stunned and horrified by first witnessing Booker using violence, I directed her to a locked door immediately after that conversation. She didn't say a word when she picked that lock, so it was clear that her usual cheerful dialog was suspended in that moment when she was really upset.

I also don't understand why it's a problem that Elizabeth doesn't actually pick up items from the environment to toss you, and instead they just materialise when necessary. TB says "So you use a lot of vigors and deplete your salts, and look! Elizabeth found some salts. What a coincidence." Well, of course it is. You wouldn't expect her to toss you a health kit if your hit points are full, would you? It would severely diminish her usefulness as a companion if she was just picking up the things you could have picked up as well, and it avoids the problem of having picked the environment clean after a prolonged fight and being stuck without resources. So her help in this case is a form of cheating, like a contextual use of the /give command, but I think the game isn't worse for it because it diminishes the occasional frustration that mid-combat resource hunting brings with it.

Although it did become a bit too obvious how often she'd toss you money after having used a vending machine, I wouldn't mind if that was a bit more subtle.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 11 Apr 2013, 16:36
Just finished watching it and I find myself agreeing with him more than not as well. I have the reversed preference for games than he does (I value story over mechanics almost without fail, hence so many of my favorite games being extremely broken like Arcanum and Fallout 2) but because of how he does his reviews, he didn't cover some of what I have a problem with. The main thing being that, while this may be more a problem of my expectations than the game's, I think it handled the political analysis that Bioshock is famous for really, poorly in comparison.

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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: GarandMarine on 11 Apr 2013, 22:58
Winning review? Yahtzee liked it.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: LTK on 12 Apr 2013, 04:03
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I agree about the racism. The game's attitude was generally "Look, these people are also racist!" but the commentary basically ended there. I think that maybe they didn't want to make the game about racism because everyone already knows that racism is a Bad Thing - or at least that the 'black people are inferior' type of overt racism is. So I was surprised when TB said that the game made him empathise with the racists, because I didn't get that feeling at all. Sure, you can empathise with the people in spite of their racist tendencies, but there's no real reason for them to be racist other than 'everybody just is'.

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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Parkour Lewis on 12 Apr 2013, 07:05
I probably shouldn't say this but I was talking about BI with a friend yesterday and realized a few things that I hadn't before regarding the twins and Booker.  I probably should've turned around and played it through again instead of sending it back to gamefly, but
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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: LTK on 12 Apr 2013, 07:26
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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 12 Apr 2013, 09:57
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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: snalin on 12 Apr 2013, 10:16
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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 12 Apr 2013, 10:36
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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Parkour Lewis on 12 Apr 2013, 10:39
Here's a question I never quite figured out the answer to, maybe there was a Vox that I missed or maybe I just imagined the idea in my head, but
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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 12 Apr 2013, 10:45
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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: LTK on 12 Apr 2013, 11:21
I just remembered that I still don't know who the dead guy in the lighthouse is.

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Who?

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Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat?
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 12 Apr 2013, 12:01
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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Method of Madness on 12 Apr 2013, 12:06
You're thinking of Joseph Smith.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: GarandMarine on 12 Apr 2013, 12:14
Okay, I just rented Infinite, we'll see if it holds up to the tongue baths you lot have been giving it.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Method of Madness on 12 Apr 2013, 12:16
Honestly, I enjoyed it.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 12 Apr 2013, 12:18
You're thinking of Joseph Smith.

DERP
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: GarandMarine on 12 Apr 2013, 16:40
Okay so I'm a bit of the way in, not sure if it's a buy yet, but I'm having fun that's certain. Agreeing with TB on many of his points, especially the combat which is functional at least. I knew the race stuff was there but MAN this is freakin blatant, I'm not surprised some folks were uncomfortable...

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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: LTK on 12 Apr 2013, 16:47
That's kind of the point of them, isn't it?

Also, I'd still like to see the whole intra-uterine cannibalism theory explained.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 12 Apr 2013, 16:57
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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Parkour Lewis on 12 Apr 2013, 18:43
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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 12 Apr 2013, 18:54
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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: GarandMarine on 12 Apr 2013, 21:00
This is awesome. Like holy crap, I agree with TB more and more as the game goes on, but Elizabeth's story arc and status as "Least annoying AI support character ever" alone make it worth it.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Parkour Lewis on 12 Apr 2013, 21:07
This is awesome. Like holy crap, I agree with TB more and more as the game goes on, but Elizabeth's story arc and status as "Least annoying AI support character ever" alone make it worth it.

I had my doubts about her too, and was surprised how well they pulled that bit off.  Sit around sometime during a normal non-combat city sequence and watch her interact with the world.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: GarandMarine on 13 Apr 2013, 00:03
So I just marathoned the hell out of this game. That I did a marathon speaks volumes for me because I haven't sat down for a solid block of gaming in this quantity since I was in high school (not counting the mass effect franchise) so some points.

It's good. Really freaking good. Like holy crap throw the designers some roses and stand for applause cause this was genuinely GOOD. The story and characters in particular made this game golden. The twins are awesome, Booker himself is interesting and Elizabeth is easily the best AI Support Character I've ever had forced on me, even if her item and cash spawn gimmick was almost too convenient at times.Not that I was complaining I really needed it here and there. Gorgeous environments, powerful score, I could give this game a tongue bath for a few hours on the above points alone. Especially Elizabeth's game play functions. Holy freaking HELL it only took how long to make an AI partner not suck? I really can't say enough for the story too.

Now let's talk gakkyness. Not that there's much to talk about, I pretty much agreed with a lot of what Total Biscuit was saying in his "WTF" review for Infinite. The combat and gunplay could still stand some more tweaking, the guns weren't anything new or exciting, even if I still very much enjoyed the hand cannon, because field artillery. In your hand. That's always awesome.

Spoiler time! Cause the rest of my issue lays in the realm of story, which I was just praising seconds ago you'll have noticed.
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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Masterpiece on 13 Apr 2013, 04:04
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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: LTK on 13 Apr 2013, 05:57
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Overthinking, woo!
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Method of Madness on 13 Apr 2013, 07:24
Overthinking
No such thing.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 13 Apr 2013, 07:49
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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: LTK on 13 Apr 2013, 13:49
Eurogamer's explanation of the ending, along with some other things. (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-04-04-bioshock-infinite-ending-explained)

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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: snalin on 13 Apr 2013, 14:19
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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 15 Apr 2013, 10:40
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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: GarandMarine on 15 Apr 2013, 15:30
Good vid Ackblom!
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 07 May 2013, 05:25
This is another good talk on the Ludonarrative Dissonance of some games, including Bioshock: Infinite and the new Tomb Raider


Edit: I would like to point out that I disagree with him on quite a few things in this video, but I figured it was good for what it is.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: satsugaikaze on 11 May 2013, 19:33
So after my brother had a gander at the game (twice), I decided I was going to kick him off the couch and sink a few hours into the game myself.

My thoughts at the moment are that I'm not really seeing the magic right now. I'm sure as time goes on things will change; to me the game feels like a real marathon, the subject material seems simple enough, but I find myself unable to play it for hours like I did for Tomb Raider. I can appreciate many things about Infinite - the sound direction and music is phenomenal and the setting warms my cockles a lot more than Rapture did all those years back. Elizabeth, as many people have said time and time again, is a shining example of great character design and expression. She matches the cartoonish and outlandish world of Columbia excellently with her Pixar-like facial expression and slightly exaggerated physical expression, conveys emotions excellently with an excellent voice actor to back it all up. For me her A.I is indeed great, she doesn't get in the way, gives health and salt regen and ammunition on occasion, etc., but I attribute that less to the developers being brilliant masterminds and more to them being not stupid. So the game warps her behind me most of the time whenever combat happens and doesn't put her in my way when I'm trying to aim down the sights? That's cool, I guess. Okay.
In other words, I enjoy it but I'm not sufficiently wowed by it to gush as much as other people have. Which I suppose could summarise most of my feelings about the game!

I don't care much for Booker. Throughout the whole thing there feels like a whole lot of cryptic bullshit being thrown at me without any explanation for exactly what or why my player character is being accused of everything. Some of it can be easily attributed to the gobbledygook religious extremism of Columbia, others pertain specifically to Booker's backstory that either he conveniently forgets (Huh? A.D? I SUDDENLY NOTICED THIS THING ON MY HAND WHAT THUH.) or the game just won't tell us (at times where many characters involved seem to already know) for the purposes of structured narrative expression. I don't mind the intent behind the mystery, per se - a lot of it does help to drive me on to continue playing the game - but just once I would appreciate having the game straight up explain a point of backstory to me when some plot point is addressed, without having to slog through several hours of heavily prosaic conversation. You know, just for a change in pace.  :mrgreen:
tl;dr, I had a lot of "what the fuck are you talking about? What the fuck do you mean? Does anyone in this fucking place give a straight answer to anything?"

As an aside, there were some voxophones here and there that I feel would have been better used incorporated directly into the story, but I'm not enough of an expert on game design to say how exactly that could be implemented. Just opinions (as is most of this post, for that matter)

The backtracking and exploration of Infinite's world is much more enjoyable than most other games that do it, but I still think that Infinite has some gosh-darn pacing issues. There's a sense of wonderment going between A to B but personally there are some sections (especially early on in the game) where I felt like skipping most of the world and just reaching my objective. But then given this game's habit of dumping fairly important enlightening plot details in miscellaneous bits located in innocuous corners of the level I go nuts just wasting ages walking around and looking in corners to figure out what exactly the fuck is going on in this place. So it's partially to do with me being a dum dum, but also partly due to there just being long stretches of empty space from A to B probably designed to hold just the right amount of distance for Booker and Elizabeth to have a conversation starting from A and finishing just at the end of B. And then there's just sections of walking around and establishing the world (and its corresponding dimensions). Maybe Irrational just had so much they were really, really enthusiastic on showing to the player so they just had to fit it in somehow, and I enjoy the tangible sense of bigness that some other open-ish games (Deus Ex: HR especially comes to mind) might be lacking in, but I felt that for such a linear game as Infinite the amount of embellishment and the "look at this! Over there, clouds! and those political and religious undertones!" was a tad too self-indulgent for my tastes.

Not much to say about the combat for me, it was alright but (especially compared to the original Bioshock's) nothing exceptional as a first-person shooter.

I don't like being a grump with petty gripes and I hate to be a debbie downer on the thread, but you know. I wanted to get as hype as other people and I just didn't, unfortunately. It's still a great game, though.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Method of Madness on 11 May 2013, 19:56
Agreed about the Voxophones, it kind of pissed me off a little when someone would mention a plot point I didn't get, then find out they knew because they found a Voxophone I'd apparently missed. Voxophones for a little extra something are fine, but don't hide the actual plot in them.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: satsugaikaze on 12 May 2013, 04:41
The thing is using the voxophones isn't inherently a bad idea per se, because I think collectibles in games are a great way to add plot or exposition without having to put some infodump into a cutscene or have someone blurt it out in say, a flashback or whatever. But they need to be implemented/placed in such a way as more important ones are more easily found and less out-of-the-way than, say, some easter egg or random tidbit on racism.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: TheEvilDog on 03 Jun 2013, 21:05
Finished playing Bioshock on Saturday night, downloaded 2 last night so I'm playing that at the moment. So far, I'm enjoying the series. (I've just left Grace Holloway, so that will give you an idea where I am. My only gripes with 2 at the moment is the really small number of first aid kits and Eve hypos you can carry, that and the fact that you can't manually top up your Eve, having to use it up so that it automatically refills is annoying, especially in the middle of protecting a Little Sister).
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: de_la_Nae on 04 Jun 2013, 10:19
Just gonna go ahead and Spoiler most of this, just in case.

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Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Edguy on 04 Jun 2013, 12:51
Generally, if one has to break the downsides of Bioshock Infinite down to one thing, it's that it is too ambitious.
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There's also a large building in the large area before you enter Comstock's house, that you can enter, but that there's nothing but a broken elevator shaft and a locked door inside. They had clearly intended to do something with it.

I believe it's said that the plot and ending of the game didn't really come together until mere months before the original release. That is really a problem ken Levine has; he seems to be a little too ambitious. That's a rare attribute in today's gaming industry.. Anyways, I really hope they don't try to out-do themselves with their next game, and instead try to find that fine line between too simple/generic/predictable and overambitious/over-complicated/messy. (which I think that Infinite got at times, especially regarding the mechanics of the dimensional travel.)
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: de_la_Nae on 04 Jun 2013, 20:02
One thing I meant to comment on earlier, some gameplay mechanics examinations I read earlier posit that vigor traps do a greater base damage or effect, generally, than just launching them. I wish I'd realized that, I might have been tempted to use them more (since I pretty never used them ever ever ever)

EDIT: Disclosure's sake, I'm also probably pretty bad at this game.
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: ackblom12 on 13 Jun 2013, 00:29
Ok, this is probably my last share for Infinite, but this Extra Credits does a good job of explaining not only why the problems with Infinite were problems, but also why sequels in general tend to suffer from it.

Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: LTK on 30 Jul 2013, 05:25
Rapture DLC! (http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2013/07/30/bioshock-dlc-announced-some-out-today/) DO WANT
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: Masterpiece on 30 Jul 2013, 05:52
Not a valid youtube URL
auughllbllrllb
Title: Re: Bioshock: Infinite
Post by: RedWolf4 on 30 Jul 2013, 05:59
Yup, gonna get it.