Post by: jwhouk on 15 Jan 2012, 06:28
However, this is the discussion thread for the next week. Enjoy the beginning of Volume 8.*
* - Yes, I'm a total geek about it, but if Jeph does continue on the 300-strips-per-volume pace, this would be the start of Volume 8 of the QC archives.
Post by: akronnick on 15 Jan 2012, 06:47
Post by: Kugai on 15 Jan 2012, 09:57
-Hannelore gets stuck at one of Tai's parties, gets roaring drunk and wakes up in bed with Tai and Dora after a drunken night of debauchery. She has an epiphany and -ends up in a threesome with them.
-Faye and Angus get married
-Marten and RAVEN get married and take over Coffee of Doom
-Pintsize is sent on a one way trip to Titan as the AI of a iNASA Probe
-Winslow accidentally finds the chassis that Hanners father sent her all that time ago, transfers himself into it and eventually winds um as Hanners Mom's Toyboy.
-Padma returns after a year as a Nun.
-Veronica Vance and Dora's Dad hook up after Dora's Mom, while in a stoned haze, has a weird vision and goes to India and joins an Ashram run by a famous Guru.
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 15 Jan 2012, 10:58
Marten moving on seems possible, given that it's about time and that there have been some threads of plot development pointing in that direction.
There's room for more exploration of Momo's new life, and that could be fun.
Post by: CrowFairy on 15 Jan 2012, 12:07
Post by: Carl-E on 15 Jan 2012, 12:18
-Hannelore gets stuck at one of Tai's parties, gets roaring drunk and wakes up in bed with Tai and Dora after a drunken night of debauchery. She has an epiphany and -ends up in a threesome with them.
I think you have this out of order... isn't "wakes up in bed with Tai and Dora after a drunken night of debauchery" the definition of a threesome?
:evil: :laugh: :angel: :psyduck: :mrgreen:
Post by: purple.platypus on 15 Jan 2012, 12:26
Depends. Did anything actually happen the night before, or does she just assume it did?-Hannelore gets stuck at one of Tai's parties, gets roaring drunk and wakes up in bed with Tai and Dora after a drunken night of debauchery. She has an epiphany and -ends up in a threesome with them.
I think you have this out of order... isn't "wakes up in bed with Tai and Dora after a drunken night of debauchery" the definition of a threesome?
(NOT endorsing this possibility as even remotely likely, but if the first part were to occur, there'd most likely be a perfectly innocent - yet hilarious - explanation.)
Post by: Sidhekin on 15 Jan 2012, 12:41
Nope. Not likely at all.
Enjoyable though. Definitely enjoyable.
Post by: Kugai on 15 Jan 2012, 12:44
In all likelihood, that's about as likely as Charlie Sheen becoming a Trapist Monk and taking a Vow of Silence.
Post by: pwhodges on 15 Jan 2012, 13:44
Post by: DSL on 15 Jan 2012, 15:38
Post by: ZBixby on 15 Jan 2012, 15:42
Post by: pwhodges on 15 Jan 2012, 15:50
There's a reason I don't read the forums anymore. Hanners.
Post by: AnAverageWriter on 15 Jan 2012, 15:53
Associating Hanners with anyone is reserved for Jeph, and forbidden here:There's a reason I don't read the forums anymore. Hanners.
Yeah, Jeph doesn't like people sailing Hannelore ships across the forum waters. Isn't that mentioned in one of the introduction topics or something?
Post by: ZBixby on 15 Jan 2012, 15:54
Post by: iduguphergrave on 15 Jan 2012, 15:54
http://gogetaroomie.chloe-art.com/2012/01/well-hello-there/
Nope. Not likely at all.
Enjoyable though. Definitely enjoyable.
Thanks for the inspiration for an impromptu archive binge. I was supposed to leave ten minutes ago! :-P :psyduck:
(that's an awesome comic though; can't wait to get caught up)
Post by: pwhodges on 15 Jan 2012, 15:56
.... Maybe I should have added the /sarcasm tag to the end, I thought we were giving out unlikely scenarios.
Probably prudent (http://forums.questionablecontent.net/index.php/topic,27770.msg1072657.html#msg1072657).
The worst bad things happened long before you joined the forum; however, we work to ensure that those times don't return.
Post by: ZBixby on 15 Jan 2012, 15:57
.... Maybe I should have added the /sarcasm tag to the end, I thought we were giving out unlikely scenarios.
Probably prudent (http://forums.questionablecontent.net/index.php/topic,27770.msg1072657.html#msg1072657).
The worst bad things happened long before you joined the forum; however, we work to ensure that those times don't return.
Fair enough, I'll do my best to watch what I say :D
Post by: jwhouk on 15 Jan 2012, 16:17
Post by: pwhodges on 15 Jan 2012, 16:21
Post by: jwhouk on 15 Jan 2012, 16:42
Post by: ZBixby on 15 Jan 2012, 16:51
Sorry. I'll remember the mantra - it's Jeph's comic, we're just here for the ride.
Bitching and Complaining the whole way?
Post by: Kugai on 15 Jan 2012, 18:35
Post by: akronnick on 15 Jan 2012, 20:17
Post by: Overkillengine on 15 Jan 2012, 21:29
Post by: Vista on 15 Jan 2012, 21:38
It's fair enough to say that if he had not been the "kind of guy" who would have tried as he did, he probably wouldn't have made the friends that he has. But to imply that he's not currently that "kind of guy" in most situations (which aren't a strict parallel to a prior even in which he failed to achieve a goal)?
Also, I wouldn't say that Marten's life is so great.
Post by: truestatic on 15 Jan 2012, 21:38
Post by: CompSarge on 15 Jan 2012, 21:39
Faye sure told HIM. :-o
Warning - while you were typing, someone else beat you to it. Better luck next time, stupid!
Post by: haikupoet on 15 Jan 2012, 21:40
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 15 Jan 2012, 21:42
Dora tried to lever him out of his rut: Faye has escalated to dynamite.
Post by: Tova on 15 Jan 2012, 21:50
Post by: iduguphergrave on 15 Jan 2012, 21:51
Noteworthy that Marten didn't play the hypocrisy card.
This isn't over yet; that could still be a rebuttal (if he isn't too destroyed, which he might be).
Marten's going to need a hug when this is over.
I could use one :-(
Post by: Tova on 15 Jan 2012, 21:55
*hug*
Post by: haikupoet on 15 Jan 2012, 22:01
Post by: CrowFairy on 15 Jan 2012, 22:12
Post by: iduguphergrave on 15 Jan 2012, 22:16
I've got a spare here.
*hug*
thank you :-)
Post by: Method of Madness on 15 Jan 2012, 22:23
Post by: Emperor Norton on 15 Jan 2012, 22:42
If Faye realised all the stuff she said in the first panel... why in god's name did she not tell him that back in 2095. or 2098?
It seems an oddly specific analysis if it just hit her right then. And if it did hit her right then, why would she have expected it to hit him earlier?
Post by: Armadillo on 15 Jan 2012, 22:50
Also, the multiple times he "tried" to contact Padma apparently weren't enough. In Faye's mind, does Padma bear ANY responsibility for this, or is it ALL MARTEN'S FAULT YET AGAIN GODDAMMIT?
Post by: Omega Entity on 15 Jan 2012, 22:56
Post by: FunkyTuba on 15 Jan 2012, 22:59
Post by: WAYF on 15 Jan 2012, 23:08
At least he has one thing going for him - Marten's ability to recognise the truth of what he was told (as blatant as it was) is a credit to him.
Automatically making him better than pretty much everyone on the internet. :P
Also, good on Faye. Marten needs her to tell it like it is to him.
Come to think of it, when Faye is down he generally does the same to her, although it's a lot less "get a hold on yourself" and more reassuring.
Post by: snubnose on 15 Jan 2012, 23:35
If I may summarize todays Comics: men are supposed to be able to read a womans mind, and if they dont, well, its the mans fault.
Aha.
-Marten and RAVEN get married and take over Coffee of DoomOuch. Raven + Marten, thats stuff of nightmares.
Post by: Toe on 15 Jan 2012, 23:46
Would be nice if Marten found a way to pick up the pieces.
Calling it: tomorrow's comic is Marten locking himself in his room, with Tool's Schism playing on repeat.
Post by: snubnose on 15 Jan 2012, 23:52
Also, I wouldn't say that Marten's life is so great.QFT
Would be interesting to see if we've really seen the last of Padma.... one can dream. Personally I find Padma as a black clone of Dora who is quite dim at times very annoying.
If Faye realised all the stuff she said in the first panel... why in god's name did she not tell him that back in 2095. or 2098?Good question, I have no clue whatsoever.
Post by: Delator on 15 Jan 2012, 23:57
His life?
...and when did that start? When he broke it off with some chick the other day? :roll:
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 16 Jan 2012, 00:06
Post by: pwhodges on 16 Jan 2012, 00:17
However, the logic is pretty screwed. Yes, his present life is consequent on his leaving California to follow Vicky; but that is, in scientific terms, the outcome of an uncontrolled experiment - there is no way to know how his life would have gone if he had stayed, or returned when she dumped him, or if he hadn't ogled Faye that day in the bar, or if she hadn't broken her glasses...
After all, for any of us, our present life is the result of the bad things that have happened to us, large and small, as well as the good ones - so in the end how can we even decide which were which? We are the result of the totality of our experience, not of any one or even a thousand parts of it, and Faye is correct in saying that the best thing we can do is value the result.
Post by: Blackjoker on 16 Jan 2012, 00:50
Faye deftly changed the subject before it could take root, but Marten's "I've tried before" might not necessarily have been a reference to Vicki.
True. Though I do think that there is also kind of another problem here. Waaay back around the time when his mother visited post breakup I observed that Marten might be as timid as he is in part because any time that he really does try to seize his destiny it seems to blow up in his face or at least fail. Marten talks himself up to quitting a job that was depressing him, he arrives to find out that he was fired and has no real options in terms of unemployment or pension. When Dora violated Martens privacy despite him all but falling to his knees to beg that she not do it, he calls her out on it and she insults him, storms out, and then breaks up with him deciding that it's better for her to be insecure and selfish than it is to pursue a mature relationship. When Martens mother browbeat, humiliated, lied to him, etc. when he was at a low point he finally had enough and told her off, only to have her tear viciously into him in front of friends, force HIM to apologize to her and to them, with neither of them standing up for him by the way (real nice friends there). Hell, Marten risked a lot to move across the country and it ended with head games and lonliness. Oh, and when Marten mentioned the idea of pursuing goals to a barber, the barber decided to give him the most creepy example of goal and fulfillment ever. I'm not saying that Marten bears no responsibility for the rut he's in. But I am saying that there is something to be said for being almost conditioned into inactivity and conflict avoidance when every time you DO stand up for yourself everyone else turns against you, even people who claim to be friends.
Faye does make a decent point, what Marten did was petty, understandable, but petty. The idea that he's wasting his life might be simply that he isn't trying to do anything new or interesting, he sees himself in a rut but doesn't seem willing to leave it. The issue I have though is that each time something like this happens Marten tends to be the injured party, if he is the bigger man it doesn't tend to help him much and when he isn't he gets yelled at.
Post by: Carl-E on 16 Jan 2012, 00:51
OK, so Faye has got Marten re-evaluating his actions, and his life, even, which is probably a good thing.
However, the logic is pretty screwed. Yes, his present life is consequent on his leaving California to follow Vicky; but that is, in scientific terms, the outcome of an uncontrolled experiment - there is no way to know how his life would have gone if he had stayed, or returned when she dumped him, or if he hadn't ogled Faye that day in the bar, or if she hadn't broken her glasses...
After all, for any of us, our present life is the result of the bad things that have happened to us, large and small, as well as the good ones - so in the end how can we even decide which were which? We are the result of the totality of our experience, not of any one or even a thousand parts of it, and Faye is correct in saying that the best thing we can do is value the result.
I agree, Faye's fallen victim to the fallacy of the popular notion of the butterfly effect, that one decision triggers a chain of events that lead into the future, rather than a whole branching tree of decisions and alternative outcomes. Who's to say that staying in CA wouldn't have led to a (completely different and) better life for him? Or that some other chain of events wouldn't have led him to where he is right now?
Dicey things, alternate realities.
Post by: PureLionHeart on 16 Jan 2012, 00:54
Anywho, hopefully no more Padma, or that whole crew of clones for that matter.
Post by: AnAverageWriter on 16 Jan 2012, 01:00
Marten tends to be the injured party, if he is the bigger man it doesn't tend to help him much and when he isn't he gets yelled at.
And then everyone in the forum starts congratulating whoever it is that yelled at him, saying things like "good for XXXX, Marten needed that kick in the pants".
And on and on and so forth.
Now I'm not saying that Marten couldn't use a good honest talking to. I just think that he really doesn't need all the "kicks in the pants" that he's been getting, is all.
Do we really need to start congratulating people for kicking the strip's Charlie Brown after he's already missed the football?
Post by: Soulsynger on 16 Jan 2012, 01:34
Jeph must be SO so much smarter than us. °O
Post by: Welu on 16 Jan 2012, 02:40
I don't really understand why this incident triggered Faye to full on blast Marten's life but I do think it would do him good to hear, "You could be doing so much more if you wanted to" again. If Marten was happy playing with the band once in a while, drinking coffee, hanging with friends and working in the library then that'd be grand. However so many times this has been said before that he's not fully satisfied.
Mini-note: My not-understanding of Faye's blasting is possibly just due to the last of Marten and Faye on screen hanging out lately. I love what the comic's been doing all the way through but I still miss them just hanging on the couch simply talking to each other.
There's a way to go about talking to people about big matters like this and I don't think this was the right way (if the goal is to not hurt feelings), although I can't say it's not effective.
Until the last panels I just read, "Boy was THAT waste!" as sarcasm, as in, "Yeah, trying is such a waste because it had such a huge impact on your life and got you to meet all your current friends and make your band."
As has been said though, life is a butterfly branching effect rather than a single chain so he could have ended up with a totally different or exactly the same life based on a lot of variables.
Also just because we were talking about it in the last thread, Faye's scar has a tiny appearance in panel 2B.
Post by: pwhodges on 16 Jan 2012, 03:00
This may have been addressed but what happened to Faye's scar?
It's still there, butI just forget to draw it sometime.it has faded and only shows prominently at certain lighting angles.
Post by: Tova on 16 Jan 2012, 03:00
I also think that some people are overreading (who'd have gussed) Faye's comment that things worked out OK for Marten after moving to be with a girl. Faye was implying nothing about what might have happened otherwise, nor that there was some kind of repeatable cause and effect in motion - just that the choice he made, as it happened, turned out OK (contrary to Marten's implication that it didn't) - that's all. No need to invoke the butterfly effect or assume that she was trying to make some kind of deeper statement.
And why are people getting obsessed with fault and blame again? Today's comic is about nothing of the kind. Blimey. :psyduck:
I find it amazing what other people get out of what is ostensibly the same comic. It does make the forums an interesting place to be, but wow.
One more thing before I hit the sack:
Do we really need to start congratulating people for kicking the strip's Charlie Brown after he's already missed the football?
He didn't miss the football - he didn't even bloody-well take a kick at it.
I'll resist the temptation to carry on and on now... :roll:
Post by: Border Reiver on 16 Jan 2012, 04:51
And why are people getting obsessed with fault and blame again? Today's comic is about nothing of the kind. Blimey. :psyduck:
It's what happens too often here and IRL.
Post by: Harlequin on 16 Jan 2012, 04:56
I understand the ideal, but again, when do other people need to start taking responsibility for their own emotions instead of just doing and expecting Marten to forgive them for it?
Post by: tjradcliffe on 16 Jan 2012, 05:06
He didn't miss the football - he didn't even bloody-well take a kick at it.
And that's a good thing, because the last time he "took a kick at it" he ended up flat on his back and feeling like a fool, alone on the far side of the country without his guitar. Romantic gestures rarely end well.
One of the tricks to a happy life is knowing when to take a risk and when to not. There was simply no upside for Marten in this case outside of the wildest romantic fantasies. Padma pulled away from him, then decided at the last minute she'd like to see him again before she left.
He decided he'd rather feel badly about not catering to her emotional needs than getting his own heart ripped up. Sounds like a sensible decision to me, and one I wish I'd been more apt to make at his age.
Post by: AnAverageWriter on 16 Jan 2012, 05:15
Why is it Marten's responsibility to be the "decent" one here and why is he being ragged on for not being good guy doormat Marten?
I understand the ideal, but again, when do other people need to start taking responsibility for their own emotions instead of just doing and expecting Marten to forgive them for it?
Because, at least in this strip, it seems all right for every single female character to beat up on Marten with no repercussions at all. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AbuseIsOkayWhenItIsFemaleOnMale) Of course, the lack of repercussions stems from the fact that Marten seems to never defend himself at all, instead choosing to just simply go along with anything being said about him (as we saw him respond to Faye's "owning" in the last strip). (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheReasonYouSuckSpeech)
Marten is a doormat. Poor guy.
Post by: Harlequin on 16 Jan 2012, 05:39
Because, at least in this strip, it seems all right for every single female character to beat up on Marten with no repercussions at all. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AbuseIsOkayWhenItIsFemaleOnMale) Of course, the lack of repercussions stems from the fact that Marten seems to never defend himself at all, instead choosing to just simply go along with anything being said about him (as we saw him respond to Faye's "owning" in the last strip). (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheReasonYouSuckSpeech)
Marten is a doormat. Poor guy.
I almost got lost in those links. Looks like a great website resource for anyone studying film :D
In any case, I don't remember every single comic done by Jeph, but I guess I'm feeling like no one goes to Marten and say something like "I understand, you have feelings too and it's ok to have them and to act on them." He just seems to constantly be held to this standard of sainthood which leaves him constantly getting dumped on.
Post by: SomeCanadianWeirdo on 16 Jan 2012, 06:18
After a mini-think, I guess this comic is a much more harsh version of the talk Dora had with Marten a while ago. (http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=1982)
I don't really understand why this incident triggered Faye to full on blast Marten's life
Perhaps Faye is talking to herself a bit a well. After all she freaked out when Angus said he loved her, and for a bit it almost seemed like she was going to run away from him.
Post by: jwhouk on 16 Jan 2012, 06:20
I almost got lost in those links. Looks like a great website resource for anyone studying film :D
Oh, you poor, misguided, young person. :-D
Post by: NotAwesomeAnymore on 16 Jan 2012, 06:21
Quote
Marten talks himself up to quitting a job that was depressing him, he arrives to find out that he was fired and has no real options in terms of unemployment or pension. When Dora violated Martens privacy despite him all but falling to his knees to beg that she not do it, he calls her out on it and she insults him, storms out, and then breaks up with him deciding that it's better for her to be insecure and selfish than it is to pursue a mature relationship. When Martens mother browbeat, humiliated, lied to him, etc. when he was at a low point he finally had enough and told her off, only to have her tear viciously into him in front of friends, force HIM to apologize to her and to them, with neither of them standing up for him by the way (real nice friends there). Hell, Marten risked a lot to move across the country and it ended with head games and lonliness. Oh, and when Marten mentioned the idea of pursuing goals to a barber, the barber decided to give him the most creepy example of goal and fulfillment ever
And the list just gets longer as time goes on!
Post by: Milesb on 16 Jan 2012, 06:37
She's had part of this chat before
http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2025
In today's strip I am seeing Faye calling him out for not going to Padma and trying to do... something.. regardless of the fact Padma is leaving - is she saying he should have gone with her? I don't think so. How could he have convinced Padma to stay? She's booked the tickets, she's packed her bags. She's going.
But Marten isn't. Why should he have went over and potentially allowed himself to be hurt? It was his decision to minimise his exposure - not the most gallant of choices but certainly within the bounds of reason.
Thirdly, a comment about wasting a life is like: daaang! I know Faye's got Angus now and she's been doing her sculpture and stuff, but daaang man, Marten helped paved the way for her to be able to do that with her life by being a good friend, I would have hoped she'd have tried to do it back.
To be honest I actually think Marten should stand up to Faye. I don't know if anyone here agrees, but I think Faye is actually quite detrimental to Marten's personal development.
There's an example of it in today's comic. As the conversation between Faye and Marten here shows, as long as Marten plays to the back foot Faye just does her usual berating, but in panel 4 when Marten throws some sarcasm in there, gives her some cheek back - she proceeds to shut him down.
I think the point I'm trying to make is that Faye is part of the problem. Marten is pretty lame at making choices, but part of that is experience. He rarely asserts himself and every time he does, there's a huge explosion in response. As I said: experience is part of learning. What has Marten learned? to be a doormat. He only ever ends up in these situations now because his emotions get the better of him.
I'm not blaming Faye for Marten's behaviour, however Faye is part of the process (as all behaviour is contextualised by those around us) and she's not helping.
I genuinely think going with Padma would probably have been better for Marten's mental well being, if rather destructive towards QC as a comic.
Post by: AnAverageWriter on 16 Jan 2012, 06:48
To be honest I actually think Marten should stand up to Faye. I don't know if anyone here agrees, but I think Faye is actually quite detrimental to Marten's personal development.
There's an example of it in today's comic. As the conversation between Faye and Marten here shows, as long as Marten plays to the back foot Faye just does her usual berating, but in panel 4 when Marten throws some sarcasm in there, gives her some cheek back - she proceeds to shut him down.
I agree with you here, and it just emphasizes Marten's doormattishness. And we see it happen, (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=1835) over and over again. (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=1797) Every single time that Marten stands up for himself, he is immediately squished and left miserable, hanging his head like a dog.
Post by: NotAwesomeAnymore on 16 Jan 2012, 07:00
Example: I had a "no ambition" problem last year. (I chose this because of Marten and his lack of goals.) My older sister was really passionate about going to an American university, so she went out of her way to research a million programs, write the SATs and, like, 11 essays for a bunch of schools - this process is completely different from the South African one. She got in and was really happy so the plan was for me to do the same. I consider myself pretty academically excited, but I friggin' hated it. I didn't want to research universities, or look at applications, or study for the SATs or even talk about it - it didn't matter what my family tried to make me more excited, I was a total bum about it. When I decided to go to a South African school instead, my attitude completely changed and I had the whole thing sorted out in about a day. I'm still not sure why - maybe I'm patriotic, maybe I'm more homebound, maybe I like certainty - but it just fit.
tl;dr There's a balance between a person's personal issues and their external environment, and sometimes it's really hard to tell the difference, and sometimes the answer is surprising!
EDIT: This isn't to say that Marten's current environment (i.e. his friends, etc.) need to change themselves, but that it would be interesting to see him in another environment.
Post by: El_Flesh on 16 Jan 2012, 07:07
I think he did entirely right in blowing PandaBear off - she asked for it.
I think he should have never allowed Faye to move in, or else moved out when it was clear she wasn't going to be with him after all.
Unless he's still got her on the back burner in his mind...
Post by: Carl-E on 16 Jan 2012, 07:23
If it's right, why the bitter acrimony? Why the self loathing? Why does he feel like he was being an asshole (his words, not Faye's)?
He should have seen Padma one last time, to talk. To say goodbye to a person who'd opened up to him. To ask what had happened that she decided to step back. I think her call to "hang out" was at least partly her wanting to talk, to explain, to seek some kind of resolution for/with this guy she'd inadvertantly hurt by her own bad choices. To understand a potential friend a little better.
It didn't need to be a roll in the hay, and maybe he wouldn't be feeling so much self loathing right now that he goes and gets Faye to metaphorically whack him upside the head (it really was self inflicted, if you think about it).
To carry the metaphor someone started, he didn't need to try kicking the football again, OR to ignore it. The football was never the issue. he needed to have a heart-to-heart with Lucy. It may not have worked out, but maybe he'd find out what the hell she was thinking, and not hate himself so much for his actions!
Post by: NotAwesomeAnymore on 16 Jan 2012, 07:30
Post by: Harlequin on 16 Jan 2012, 07:52
OK, here's a thought for all the "Marten did the right thing" folks.
If it's right, why the bitter acrimony? Why the self loathing? Why does he feel like he was being an asshole (his words, not Faye's)?
He should have seen Padma one last time, to talk. To say goodbye to a person who'd opened up to him. To ask what had happened that she decided to step back. I think her call to "hang out" was at least partly her wanting to talk, to explain, to seek some kind of resolution for/with this guy she'd inadvertantly hurt by her own bad choices. To understand a potential friend a little better.
It didn't need to be a roll in the hay, and maybe he wouldn't be feeling so much self loathing right now that he goes and gets Faye to metaphorically whack him upside the head (it really was self inflicted, if you think about it).
To carry the metaphor someone started, he didn't need to try kicking the football again, OR to ignore it. The football was never the issue. he needed to have a heart-to-heart with Lucy. It may not have worked out, but maybe he'd find out what the hell she was thinking, and not hate himself so much for his actions!
1. "Opened up?" How? If anything she closed herself off. She made her choices. Time to live with them. Her feelings and peace of mind aren't Marten's responsibility.
2. Lucy's on a plane leaving the state to never be heard from again (hopefully).
3. Who cares about Lucy's motivations? She does what she does. Lucy either doesn't know what she does to Chuck or doesn't care. The football isn't the issue. The issue is Lucy pulling the football away from him after setting him up for the kick. It's not Chuck's responsibility to initiate a heart-to-heart with Lucy. It's his responsibility to do what is best for him in the face of someone who is hurting him. Either way, it's not good for Chuck. Good riddance to Lucy.
4. Switch roles and Marten would be earning the ire that people are expressing for Pad... just more intensely. Yay for gendered expectations of men always being in the wrong.
Post by: quix0te on 16 Jan 2012, 09:14
Ok, so... just one question.That was Jeph doubling down on 'Marten's a jerk.'
If Faye realised all the stuff she said in the first panel... why in god's name did she not tell him that back in 2095. or 2098?
It seems an oddly specific analysis if it just hit her right then. And if it did hit her right then, why would she have expected it to hit him earlier?
He tried to put the jerk hat on Marten, but encountered two problems. The first is that it wasn't consistent with who Marten is, and the second is that it wasn't consistent with what he'd done. So he had to hammer home why Marten was a Bad Guy for leaving poor Padma sad and forlorn instead of... what, going to talk to her?
What would they have talked about? What are the odds this talk would have left them feeling better? Really.
Best case, he's the Best Guy In The World (tm) and she leaves feeling like he's a really sweet guy.
This is a good outcome? Would she feel worse leaving the Best Guy In The World (tm), or a guy who turned out to be, at the end, just a guy.
Worst case, he gets angry at being avoided for a week and then having her spring this on him last minutes. He's human and people get angry when they are hurt.
Both of them are hurting.
There is no possibility of the relationship continuing.
Should he drag it out?
Oh, and on that 'both of them are hurting' note. Both are hurting, but one of them has a 'friend' slapping him repeatedly when he already feels terrible.
Post by: Milesb on 16 Jan 2012, 09:16
OK, here's a thought for all the "Marten did the right thing" folks.
If it's right, why the bitter acrimony? Why the self loathing? Why does he feel like he was being an asshole (his words, not Faye's)?
Because sometimes the right thing isn't emotionally pleasing. Because sometimes, as much as I'm sure we all wish it wasn't, the right thing to do isn't always particularly nice.
There is almost always a better way to do things. He could have handled it better I entirely agree, but what he did doesn't seem out and out wrong to me.
My argument is that Faye is a environmental factor that only reinforces his current behaviour - She's not drawing out his reasoning and breaking it down in a constructive way, she's essentially pushing him until he gives in and bottles it up again.
And then, somewhere down the line it'll all come flooding out, and if Faye is there to facilitate it, he'll bottle it all up again.
She's not actually helping him at all. Nobody says she has to (although I think as his friend, we'd hope she would) - Faye is quite clearly capable of thinking situations through, as with her resolutions with Dora and her relationship issues with Angus - she just doesn't seem to want to extend that to Marten.
It sucks.
Edit/Quote:
tl;dr There's a balance between a person's personal issues and their external environment, and sometimes it's really hard to tell the difference, and sometimes the answer is surprising!
EDIT: This isn't to say that Marten's current environment (i.e. his friends, etc.) need to change themselves, but that it would be interesting to see him in another environment.
I completely agree man, and I don't see how Marten -can- develop in this circle of people without it turning into a blood bath. I think writing Marten out for a few months would be a breath of fresh air for character development (Marigold and Momo especially) and would give Marten the ability to come back with some peace of mind and some belief in himself under his belt.
But that'll never happen, yo!
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 16 Jan 2012, 10:03
Why is everyone acting like this was the last chance to set things right with Padma? I haven't checked this myself, but it seems likely that there is phone service in LA.
Post by: themacnut on 16 Jan 2012, 10:12
Still, Faye better be careful. Marten might decide, if moving one time worked out, to do it again. And Faye would NOT like that....
Post by: Marfo on 16 Jan 2012, 10:30
I suspect that a talk with Dora, Hanners, or Angus will allow her to see that she wasn't right in this case. Furthermore, it disturbs me how her and Dora feel the need to direct his love life... I suspect partially out of the guilt of their own rejection of him. Its one of those situations where friends feel the need to help out when they really cannot. Nobody's life choices warrant this version of a "pep talk".
Either way, Padma was hardly the last woman Marten will love. They had a connection, but how many of those do we all have in a lifetime? He's like 23 or something, he has time to find someone worth chasing... Or someone mature enough to not be chased.
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 16 Jan 2012, 10:44
Post by: Dr. ROFLPWN on 16 Jan 2012, 10:47
the beginnings of an entire week
of a forum echo chamber
on Marten's quality of life
because that has never been debated to death before
BONUS ROUND: comparisons to Charlie Brown, also new and unique
Score combo points by making the same argument someone made/rebutted two pages ago
Score SUPER COMBOs by making the case that Faye is somehow physically/mentally abusive or is toxic to him
Post by: Milesb on 16 Jan 2012, 11:06
Pinky: I think so Brain, but Marigold doesn't own a chimpanzee!
OR
Pinky: Gee, Brain, what do you want to do tonight?
Brain: The same thing we do every night, Pinky - argue about questionable content!
Pretty much sums up the WCDT =)
Post by: FrozenPeas on 16 Jan 2012, 11:11
Post by: Interlude on 16 Jan 2012, 11:13
I suspect that a talk with Dora, Hanners, or Angus will allow her to see that she wasn't right in this case.
The problem is that this will never happen. In my opinion, at least, Faye (almost) always gets to walk away thinking that she is in the right with everything she does or says. I'm not going to say that she is completely "toxic" to him, but I totally agree that we sometimes have people in our lives that pull us back or keep us down when we are trying to progress and/or break out of unhealthy behaviors. Usually this is not intentional. It doesn't make the other person a "bad person." It just means that what people need out of relationships/friendships change, but the people in our lives are not going to automatically change accordingly.
I do think Marten needs a kick in the pants, but I don't think that what Faye said was a HELPFUL kick in the pants. It was just hurtful and not really based on anything. Yes, he probably DOES feel like he is wasting his life. Is this all because of or related to Padma? No way! He was already feeling that way. His decision for how to handle things with Padma-- a relationship that never really took off and was confusing for him from the beginning-- was him trying to do something different. Learning and making mistakes is not a waste and will hopefully help him grow as an individual.
It will be harder for him to do that if every time he does make a decision one or another of his friends makes him feel horrible for it. Marten is a nice guy. It isn't fair to imply that he isn't decent because of this situation.
Post by: Dr. ROFLPWN on 16 Jan 2012, 11:23
"Have you ever been to the New York Legislature, Mr. Hancock? Everyone speaks very loud and very fast, and no one listens to anyone else, and so nothing ever gets done."
....I think you may understand what I was saying, sir, and I tip my metaphorical hat to you
OK, here's a thought for all the "Marten did the right thing" folks.
If it's right, why the bitter acrimony? Why the self loathing? Why does he feel like he was being an asshole (his words, not Faye's)?
He should have seen Padma one last time, to talk. To say goodbye to a person who'd opened up to him. To ask what had happened that she decided to step back. I think her call to "hang out" was at least partly her wanting to talk, to explain, to seek some kind of resolution for/with this guy she'd inadvertantly hurt by her own bad choices. To understand a potential friend a little better.
It didn't need to be a roll in the hay, and maybe he wouldn't be feeling so much self loathing right now that he goes and gets Faye to metaphorically whack him upside the head (it really was self inflicted, if you think about it).
To carry the metaphor someone started, he didn't need to try kicking the football again, OR to ignore it. The football was never the issue. he needed to have a heart-to-heart with Lucy. It may not have worked out, but maybe he'd find out what the hell she was thinking, and not hate himself so much for his actions!
Carl I'd like to offer you a metaphorical drink because what a fantastic post that is being roundly ignored for not fitting the all-important party line
Is it cold in here? I was remiss in the last thread in not congratulating you as well as Mr. Hodges for your tireless, thankless, constant moderation efforts; that was wrong of me and I do recognize your work :( I hope you will forgive my mistake, and I envy neither of you gentlemen, you keep this forum existing at all, I am fairly certain
Anyway, I'm taking up important time that could be used for echo chamber so I believe I bid you adieu!
Post by: TinPenguin on 16 Jan 2012, 11:29
I do think Marten needs a kick in the pants, but I don't think that what Faye said was a HELPFUL kick in the pants. It was just hurtful and not really based on anything.
I have this to say: she owned him pretty hard, but giving a supportive kick in the arse isn't about delivering ownage. The idea is that the kick should spur the friend into positive action, not knock the wind out of them and leave them deflated.
Post by: Omega Entity on 16 Jan 2012, 11:56
... one can dream. Personally I find Padma as a black clone of Dora who is quite dim at times very annoying.
Odd thing to fixate on, but I thought Padma was Indian? At least that's what the facial traits and name came off as to me. Plus, Indian culture is extremely family-centric, as well, even for many families living in other cultures.
Post by: Kugai on 16 Jan 2012, 12:00
Not that I'm saying Padma isn't without fault here, but I get the feeling that our little Indian Dora Clone has her own issues - probably just as bad as Dora - But Marten sometimes gets my goat as he acts like such a passive milquetoast sometimes. He really should have taken the high ground and confronted Padma about the whole thing rather than letting it fizzle like this. Sometimes I wonder if he squeaks and likes cheese the way he acts.
Post by: Milesb on 16 Jan 2012, 12:14
I definitely think Faye gave Marten the proverbial kick he needed at this stage.
Not that I'm saying Padma isn't without fault here, but I get the feeling that our little Indian Dora Clone has her own issues - probably just as bad as Dora - But Marten sometimes gets my goat as he acts like such a passive milquetoast sometimes. He really should have taken the high ground and confronted Padma about the whole thing rather than letting it fizzle like this. Sometimes I wonder if he squeaks and likes cheese the way he acts.
I personally think the fact that everyone kicks Marten regardless of if he's down or up is part of the reason he's so passive. And he'd still be getting a kicking for being a jerk to her if he had indeed taken the high ground. That's the point, quite often no matter what he does, he loses. I pity him.
Post by: themacnut on 16 Jan 2012, 12:18
Still, it would serve Faye right if Marten decided to shake things up and take a chance by following Padma back to CA. I highly doubt she'll take his calls now, he'll have to go out there if he really wants to talk to her.
I personally think the fact that everyone kicks Marten regardless of if he's down or up is part of the reason he's so passive. And he'd still be getting a kicking for being a jerk to her if he had indeed taken the high ground. That's the point, quite often no matter what he does, he loses. I pity him.
Yeah I'm starting to agree with you-looks like Jeph meant it when he said he was writing out any possibility of happiness for Marten in this comic. Which of course means any attempt of his to reach Padma will most likely also end in abject failure.
Post by: NotAwesomeAnymore on 16 Jan 2012, 12:28
Post by: Overkillengine on 16 Jan 2012, 12:32
I definitely think Faye gave Marten the proverbial kick he needed at this stage.
Not that I'm saying Padma isn't without fault here, but I get the feeling that our little Indian Dora Clone has her own issues - probably just as bad as Dora - But Marten sometimes gets my goat as he acts like such a passive milquetoast sometimes. He really should have taken the high ground and confronted Padma about the whole thing rather than letting it fizzle like this. Sometimes I wonder if he squeaks and likes cheese the way he acts.
I personally think the fact that everyone kicks Marten regardless of if he's down or up is part of the reason he's so passive. And he'd still be getting a kicking for being a jerk to her if he had indeed taken the high ground. That's the point, quite often no matter what he does, he loses. I pity him.
I'm not sure it isn't the other way around and the reason everyone kicks him is that he is so passive that they just trying to get him to do something.
Edit: I'd pity him more, but a good chunk of the disasters that hit him are formed of his own actions and inactions.
Post by: Milesb on 16 Jan 2012, 12:39
I'm not sure it isn't the other way around and the reason everyone kicks him is that he is so passive that they just trying to get him to do something.
Edit: I'd pity him more, but a good chunk of the disasters that hit him are formed of his own actions and inactions.
You have a good point, but at some point someone has to stop and ask themselves if their actions - kicking him, as we seem to have termed it - have ever actually helped him. Marten has no control over other's actions, so it's not down to him if they do it or not.
I also agree he's not very good at dealing with situations in his life. It comes back down to the fact he bottles things up, because every time he does try and do something, people kick him. He tends to only act in such situations when he's very emotionally wound up, because then he can't bottle it - that's definitely a recipe for disaster.
He actually kind of needs therapy.
Edit: Or one day he's going to snap.
Post by: Marfo on 16 Jan 2012, 12:41
Yeah I'm starting to agree with you-looks like Jeph meant it when he said he was writing out any possibility of happiness for Marten in this comic. Which of course means any attempt of his to reach Padma will most likely also end in abject failure.Jeph said that? I get that he is the god of the comic, but it seems odd to target a character like that. Even relatively unlucky people get a break sometimes, and while Marty is a manatee, he isn't evil enough to never deserve happiness.
Anyway, I guess we'll see how it plays out. If I were Marten, I'd take this as a "missed opportunity" and focus on enjoying singledom. He needs to work on himself and his interests more, the last few hundred comics have been far too focused on his relationships. I do get that a few comics of him playing around with music programs might not inspire readership, but I really could use a bit more lulz and happy beer sledding times, not one more current of OH NO DRAMA. It isn't my comic at all, so I'll just send my wishes of a more relaxed arc into the universe.
Post by: Emperor Norton on 16 Jan 2012, 12:42
Obliviousness is what caused everything with the way this broke down. Marten didn't realise she cared, she didn't realise Marten cared. If Faye was aware of what was going on... why didn't she tell him? Why did she let him think that she didn't want anything to do with him (or jokingly suggest she had the shits) rather than just say what she suspected.
The whole current comic comes off as though it came from a reader, someone who has the all seeing eye perspective to know whats going on, rather than a character whose only perspective is what Marten has told her, and when you look at it if she did have these insights... it really looks silly for her to be berating him.
All I know is if she had just dropped all of that bomb on me in a similar situation, my response wouldn't be "ow you owned me" it would be "Why didn't you tell me that?"
Post by: Armadillo on 16 Jan 2012, 12:47
*preferably one that doesn't end in a tweaked nipple.
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 16 Jan 2012, 12:48
Post by: pwhodges on 16 Jan 2012, 12:53
Yeah I'm starting to agree with you-looks like Jeph meant it when he said he was writing out any possibility of happiness for Marten in this comic.Jeph said that?
Yes, he did; but I presume it was not necessarily for all time, and was expressed to tease his readers. It's also worth remembering that Marten has been pretty happy (with a couple of brief upsets) for something like two thirds of the history of QC; it would not be out of scale for another 500 strips to pass before he sorts himself out and finds his next stable relationship.
All I know is if she had just dropped all of that bomb on me in a similar situation, my response wouldn't be "ow you owned me"
I think that response was to her reminder about wasting his present life, not the previous bit about working it out with Padma.
Post by: Overkillengine on 16 Jan 2012, 12:53
Marten needs to watch Anger Management and have that epiphany that suppressing until an explosion happens is not constructive.
Post by: Method of Madness on 16 Jan 2012, 12:55
Ok, am I right in thinking that since most people completely ignored my post... that no one else finds it odd that Faye has a near psychic understanding of why Padma did what she did, but didn't seem to think it was a good idea to tell Marten until after it was too late?Faye may have realized what Padma was thinking, but may have not realized that Marten didn't, which is probably why she was so surprised that Marten reacted the way he did.
Post by: Milesb on 16 Jan 2012, 13:00
Marten might have left with Padma, and Faye doesn't want that.
I'm not saying she did it deliberately, but she might have just felt that she had no real inclination to fix their relationship.
Post by: Method of Madness on 16 Jan 2012, 13:03
Post by: Armadillo on 16 Jan 2012, 13:12
I hope not. That's kind of horrible.
No lie, especially considering how much she just eviscerated him.
Post by: ZBixby on 16 Jan 2012, 13:54
I hope not. That's kind of horrible.
No lie, especially considering how much she just eviscerated him.
Although I do remember one comic a while back with Faye grabbing onto Marten telling him he couldn't move across country for a girl all over again. Just don't feel like archive binging to find it.
Post by: Milesb on 16 Jan 2012, 13:55
But then her going off on one at him makes no sense.
It's gotta be said, if it was so obvious to her you have to wonder why she didn't mention it to Marten. There's plenty of totally good reasons she might have not told him. But she did also have a vested interest which she clearly knew about...
Here's the link to the comic in question!
http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2025
All speculatory though.
Edit: Added link.
Post by: NotAwesomeAnymore on 16 Jan 2012, 13:58
Post by: Tova on 16 Jan 2012, 14:00
Why is it Marten's responsibility to be the "decent" one here and why is he being ragged on for not being good guy doormat Marten?
I understand the ideal, but again, when do other people need to start taking responsibility for their own emotions instead of just doing and expecting Marten to forgive them for it?
He's not being ragged on for not being a doormat - he is in fact being ragged on for not taking responsibility for his own emotions, and instead acting with a victim mentality. It's not about being the "decent" one, it's about taking care of himself.
And that's a good thing, because the last time he "took a kick at it" he ended up flat on his back and feeling like a fool, alone on the far side of the country without his guitar. Romantic gestures rarely end well.
This got addressed in the comic, read it again.
One of the tricks to a happy life is knowing when to take a risk and when to not. There was simply no upside for Marten in this case outside of the wildest romantic fantasies. Padma pulled away from him, then decided at the last minute she'd like to see him again before she left.
He decided he'd rather feel badly about not catering to her emotional needs than getting his own heart ripped up. Sounds like a sensible decision to me, and one I wish I'd been more apt to make at his age.
No-one is saying he should have taken a risk - he absolutely was ignoring his own emotional needs by doing what he did.
Because, at least in this strip, it seems all right for every single female character to beat up on Marten with no repercussions at all. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AbuseIsOkayWhenItIsFemaleOnMale)
What repercussions should there be for helping a friend? And please stop trying to turn this into a battle of the sexes yet again.
He just seems to constantly be held to this standard of sainthood which leaves him constantly getting dumped on.
He doesn't have to be a saint. Be serious.
In today's strip I am seeing Faye calling him out for not going to Padma and trying to do... something.. regardless of the fact Padma is leaving - is she saying he should have gone with her? I don't think so. How could he have convinced Padma to stay? She's booked the tickets, she's packed her bags. She's going.
Of course not.
Thirdly, a comment about wasting a life is like: daaang! I know Faye's got Angus now and she's been doing her sculpture and stuff, but daaang man, Marten helped paved the way for her to be able to do that with her life by being a good friend, I would have hoped she'd have tried to do it back.
To be honest I actually think Marten should stand up to Faye. I don't know if anyone here agrees, but I think Faye is actually quite detrimental to Marten's personal development.
He was standing up to her until he realised that she was in fact right. But by all means, cheer on his right to stubbornly argue against the bleeding obvious. It would clearly be better for his personal development.
He only ever ends up in these situations now because his emotions get the better of him.
At least this I agree with.
1. "Opened up?" How? If anything she closed herself off. She made her choices. Time to live with them. Her feelings and peace of mind aren't Marten's responsibility.
This has nothing to do with her feelings nor her peace of mind. It's ... hang on I'm copying and pasting this one.
It's not about being the "decent" one, it's about taking care of himself.
Ok, am I right in thinking that since most people completely ignored my post... that no one else finds it odd that Faye has a near psychic understanding of why Padma did what she did, but didn't seem to think it was a good idea to tell Marten until after it was too late?
I don't think it could have been all that clear to her what really happened until she learned that Padma made that final phone call.
I think that's all I can cope with for now. :roll:
Edit: Maybe just one more thing. >.>
I am kind of amazed that people are saying that Marten is a doormat for not "defending himself against Faye." And yet no-one has said anything about the defeatist and victim mentality that produced a statement like "I've tried before and look how THAT worked out for me." You know, you can cut up Faye's response to that in any way you like, but there is no defending a pathetic statement like that. It's exactly the victimhood mentality Marten needs to lose. Yet in spite of that, everyone is obsessed with Charlie bloody Brown and him being a doormat. I have been trying to ignore the whole sexism debacle, but I do wonder what the reaction would have been if Angus or Sven had told him exactly the same things. Seriously.
Post by: Milesb on 16 Jan 2012, 14:15
He was standing up to her until he realised that she was in fact right. But by all means, cheer on his right to stubbornly argue against the bleeding obvious. It would clearly be better for his personal development.
Well, I politely disagree that Faye was in fact right and question her right to berate him if it seemed clear to her but he didn't know, so the second and third sentences are rather moot to me.
I think she browbeat him into submission, and that's not helping the situation at all.
Post by: NightmarePhoenix on 16 Jan 2012, 14:21
Honestly, I am glad at the talk Faye had with Marten, because the truth is that Marten was wrong in how he handled that last call with Padma. Marten spent a good bit of time being down that she hadn't returned his calls, but didn't want to go over to the bakery to avoid being awkward, which in part is fair. He assumed that something was up and decided to just wait and find out what was going on later. However, when he does hear from her, he sort of goes into a clipped speech mode, ya know, when you respond with the shortest possible sentence to get your message across, mostly with one or two words. That way of talking that says that you don't want to talk. Why he did this is obvious, he was hurt/angry/upset because he felt like she wronged him, thats all true, but he didn't try to tell her any of this or ask why. He went with the petty "you avoided me and it hurt, so I'm going to do the same back to you." He did this knowing that this would probably be his last chance to see her before she left, and to top it off, instead of even giving her the chance to try to explain over the phone or anything, he cuts her off with "Have a safe trip.", like she's already gone in his mind. He immediately thought he was an asshole when he did it, he thought he was an asshole when he told Faye, and Faye spelled it out for him today.
Faye on the other hand was in the right. Heck, she was in the right at least three times over to the point of being sinister (sorry, my favorite pun <.<) . I've seen posts that Faye was too harsh on Marten, or her comments about him being a "pissy little bitch", or she was secretly hoping their relationship would fail so he didn't leave, or that she knew what was up but didn't tell him because she is in someway a bad influence on him or something. To sum up my response to all of those:
-_-.
Marten isn't a frail child and telling him when he screwed up sometimes means that there isn't any room for sugar-coating it, especially when Marten wants to be in self-denial of any wrongdoing. About Marten trying to follow Padma to LA, Marten hasn't considered leaving and Padma never suggested him come along with her to the point of wanting to stay longer herself instead, that wasn't something Faye would be worrying about, especially after actually telling Marten that it freaked her out. If anything, Marten going after Padma is more likely to happen now because Faye told him to get his head out of his ass, rather than if she didn't. As to her know what was up, Faye and Raven both told him that he should go and talk to her and stop being so passive, they tried to help before this and he didn't take their advice. Saying that Faye knew what was up but didn't tell him is kinda like trying to blame her for this situation because she didn't specifically tell Marten "She may like you and not want to leave."
Also, about Faye telling him that he was wasting his life in that way that kinda floored him. Instead of taking it literally, I feel like she was using something he said earlier to smack him upside the head for being stupid. Marten got all "Well trying is stupid, look where that got me" but in #2025, he was all "I met my friends because of trying soooo..." Her reason for being pissed is pretty legit, since he basically said in one sentence that everything he went through and everyone he met wasn't worth it, and I'm pretty sure if any of you heard a friend say that because they were upset, you'd try to own them into silence too.
As to him wasting his life? There is a girl he liked alot, missed, and wanted to see before she went away, but when the time came, he lied about being busy, without giving so much as a reason. That sounds like an opportunity wasted, and what is life besides a series of opportunities for us to take or let go. Marten is a very good guy, and he knows better than this and that's why he was so wrong here. I've made a similar mistake like this before, and I'm glad that Marten had a friend to set him straight on it like that. Hopefully he'll call Padma and try to patch things up, or maybe she hasn't actually left yet, who knows. We'll see in the next few days.
Post by: Armadillo on 16 Jan 2012, 14:21
I, and many others here, are jumping off on the constant abuse Marten takes at the hands of those who are supposed to be his loved ones. Yes, your friends and family are supposed to get you out of feeling sorry for yourself, but sometimes you just need a day or two to freakin' MOPE, ya know? With Marten though, there is NO TIME ALLOWED FOR MOPING, and instead of a goddamn HUG or "I'm sorry you're hurting. Want to talk about it," which is what most people get, he gets nailed with being called "an asshole" and "a pissy little bitch" in THE SAME CONVERSATION with someone who is supposedly HIS BEST FRIEND.
As has been pointed out, this was done ostensibly to get him to be more active in his destiny, but every single time he's done that, he's gotten belittled or punched in the face, or humiliated in front of his friends, and on and on and on. I agree that he needs to get himself out of this rut and establish more goals for his life, but you can only watch a guy get gang-jumped so many times before you start feeling well and truly sorry for him, fictional character or not.
Post by: celticgeek on 16 Jan 2012, 14:23
Post by: Tova on 16 Jan 2012, 14:27
Well, I politely disagree that Faye was in fact right and question her right to berate him if it seemed clear to her but he didn't know, so the second and third sentences are rather moot to me.
I think she browbeat him into submission, and that's not helping the situation at all.
I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on that.
Angus and Sven aren't Marten's "best friends," so you'd expect different reactions.
OK, let me rephrase that to "if Faye were male." And yes, I realise that you can't just make a change like that and keep the rest of the situation constant, so let me just spell it out - I think that the fierceness of the reaction against what Faye has done is largely the way it is because she is female. There. I've said it. Consequences be damned.
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I, and many others here, are jumping off on the constant abuse Marten takes at the hands of those who are supposed to be his loved ones. Yes, your friends and family are supposed to get you out of feeling sorry for yourself, but sometimes you just need a day or two to freakin' MOPE, ya know? With Marten though, there is NO TIME ALLOWED FOR MOPING, and instead of a goddamn HUG or "I'm sorry you're hurting. Want to talk about it," which is what most people get, he gets nailed with being called "an asshole" and "a pissy little bitch" in THE SAME CONVERSATION with someone who is supposedly HIS BEST FRIEND.
As has been pointed out, this was done ostensibly to get him to be more active in his destiny, but every single time he's done that, he's gotten belittled or punched in the face, or humiliated in front of his friends, and on and on and on. I agree that he needs to get himself out of this rut and establish more goals for his life, but you can only watch a guy get gang-jumped so many times before you start feeling well and truly sorry for him, fictional character or not.
He's not moping, he's being a victim and giving up. Big difference. He gets support when he needs it, and right now this is the support he needs.
Gang-jumped? Could you be any more dramatic? :psyduck:
Post by: NightmarePhoenix on 16 Jan 2012, 14:31
Angus and Sven aren't Marten's "best friends," so you'd expect different reactions.
I, and many others here, are jumping off on the constant abuse Marten takes at the hands of those who are supposed to be his loved ones. Yes, your friends and family are supposed to get you out of feeling sorry for yourself, but sometimes you just need a day or two to freakin' MOPE, ya know? With Marten though, there is NO TIME ALLOWED FOR MOPING, and instead of a goddamn HUG or "I'm sorry you're hurting. Want to talk about it," which is what most people get, he gets nailed with being called "an asshole" and "a pissy little bitch" in THE SAME CONVERSATION with someone who is supposedly HIS BEST FRIEND.
As has been pointed out, this was done ostensibly to get him to be more active in his destiny, but every single time he's done that, he's gotten belittled or punched in the face, or humiliated in front of his friends, and on and on and on. I agree that he needs to get himself out of this rut and establish more goals for his life, but you can only watch a guy get gang-jumped so many times before you start feeling well and truly sorry for him, fictional character or not.
You're forgetting that Marten kinda did mope for at least a week when Padma wasn't returning his calls, and right now him getting called out on it when Padma leaving is a time sensitive matter. Past that, Marten doesn't really get any serious abuse from his friends and loved ones, more of it is gentle ribbing at the fact that when things go well, his first response to is worry about how its going to go wrong, and he kinda does need to stop doing that. Recently, Steve has kinda been slightly more jerkish, but its still on the same line as above. The only other real time I can think of Marten taking abuse was when his Mom told him to get out of his room and stop moping... because he had been moping for a while by that point.
Post by: Vista on 16 Jan 2012, 14:33
(Wall of short responses to other posts.)
Too long but did read.
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He's not being ragged on for not being a doormat - he is in fact being ragged on for not taking responsibility for his own emotions, and instead acting with a victim mentality. It's not about being the "decent" one, it's about taking care of himself.
Actually, from what I've seen Marten generally doesn't act with a victim mentality; only when he's been run-around or antagonized to the point of depression.
Quote
He doesn't have to be a saint. Be serious.
It's true, he doesn't. The other characters treat him pretty well until those times he seems to be filled with self-hatred or passive-aggression. Of course, he has mostly treated them well even when they have the same issues, but they do not require him to.
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I think that's all I can cope with for now. :roll:
:roll:
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You know, you can cut up Faye's response to that in any way you like, but there is no defending a pathetic statement like that. It's exactly the victimhood mentality Marten needs to lose. Yet in spite of that, everyone is obsessed with Charlie bloody Brown and him being a doormat. I have been trying to ignore the whole sexism debacle, but I do wonder what the reaction would have been if Angus or Sven had told him exactly the same things. Seriously.
...
Wut?
No defending a pathetic statement, for a guy who's clearly in the dumps? It's certainly pessimistic, but you think he meant absolutely meant it? You think if he wasn't a doormat, a lot of his problems wouldn't go away?
And I think the reaction towards Angus or Sven might be worse, since they aren't really his friends. Most people here are just averring that Faye is factually wrong, bemoaning that he's surrounded by people (the women and Steve) who constantly judge him and think they know what's best for him, and think of Faye is a hypocrite (though I don't personally see how it matters).
Warning - while you were typing five new replies have been posted. You may wish to review your post.
Man, it took me like two minutes.
Post by: Armadillo on 16 Jan 2012, 14:34
Angus and Sven aren't Marten's "best friends," so you'd expect different reactions.
OK, let me rephrase that to "if Faye were male." And yes, I realise that you can't just make a change like that and keep the rest of the situation constant, so let me just spell it out - I think that the fierceness of the reaction against what Faye has done is largely the way it is because she is female. There. I've said it. Consequences be damned.
Oh, baloney. Nobody has said anything even resembling that. The "fierceness of the reaction" is because Faye's coming off like a heartless beast instead of a friend.
I, and many others here, are jumping off on the constant abuse Marten takes at the hands of those who are supposed to be his loved ones. Yes, your friends and family are supposed to get you out of feeling sorry for yourself, but sometimes you just need a day or two to freakin' MOPE, ya know? With Marten though, there is NO TIME ALLOWED FOR MOPING, and instead of a goddamn HUG or "I'm sorry you're hurting. Want to talk about it," which is what most people get, he gets nailed with being called "an asshole" and "a pissy little bitch" in THE SAME CONVERSATION with someone who is supposedly HIS BEST FRIEND.
As has been pointed out, this was done ostensibly to get him to be more active in his destiny, but every single time he's done that, he's gotten belittled or punched in the face, or humiliated in front of his friends, and on and on and on. I agree that he needs to get himself out of this rut and establish more goals for his life, but you can only watch a guy get gang-jumped so many times before you start feeling well and truly sorry for him, fictional character or not.
He's not moping, he's being a victim and giving up. Big difference. He gets support when he needs it, and right now this is the support he needs.
Gang-jumped? Could you be any more dramatic? :psyduck:
I certainly could have. How else would you describe no fewer than five people (Faye, Dora, Elliot, Ms. Reed, Steve) all coming down on him like a ton of bricks over the past year or so?
Post by: NightmarePhoenix on 16 Jan 2012, 14:35
I think that the fierceness of the reaction against what Faye has done is largely the way it is because she is female. There. I've said it. Consequences be damned.
You are a brave soul and I respect your commitment to your opinion.
Post by: pwhodges on 16 Jan 2012, 14:44
How else would you describe no fewer than five people (Faye, Dora, Elliot, Ms. Reed, Steve) all coming down on him like a ton of bricks over the past year or so?
It's a story; of course teh drama makes a disproportionate appearance. Each of those incidents probably lasted no more than a few minutes out of the couple of months that have passed.
Post by: Armadillo on 16 Jan 2012, 14:46
How else would you describe no fewer than five people (Faye, Dora, Elliot, Ms. Reed, Steve) all coming down on him like a ton of bricks over the past year or so?
It's a story; of course teh drama makes a disproportionate appearance. Each of those incidents probably lasted no more than a few minutes out of the couple of months that have passed.
You know, if you keep pointing out that this is a fictional story with fictional people in a fictional universe, you're REALLY going to suck the fun out of this place. :-D
Post by: Tova on 16 Jan 2012, 14:49
You are a brave soul and I respect your commitment to your opinion.
Ha ha yes I am shooting for Mr. Popularity this month. :-D
And to be honest I am not totally proud of my wall of short responses, and didn't give that post the time it really needed. My only defense is that there were so many posts I wanted to respond to!
So seeing as I don't really have the time to continue to commit as much time as I would like, I'll bail. Except I will just part by saying that Faye really isn't being a "heartless beast". Truely. It may come across that way to some, but I do believe that not only does she have Marten's best interests at heart, but as well as that, Marten will very quickly appreciate what Faye has done for him. It's tough love - cliche, but there it is. He's not going to come to resent her approach in the same way as he does his mother's.
Even if you don't believe that her approach was ideal (maybe it wasn't) but her heart was definitely in the right place. She is trying to help him, not to "kick" him or be malicious.
Now I'd better close this browser window and get some real work done.
Post by: pwhodges on 16 Jan 2012, 14:50
You know, if you keep pointing out that this is a fictional story with fictional people in a fictional universe, you're REALLY going to suck the fun out of this place. :-D
In a week like this, I sometimes look at the forum on my screen and say to myself: "it's all just electrons - none of it is real".
Post by: Milesb on 16 Jan 2012, 15:01
You could literally replace Faye with Steve in the last two strips and I'd think he was being unduly harsh and a pretty lame friend, as I think Faye was. For me at least it's not gender specific.
It doesn't help that Steve is one of the other characters who I feel contributes to Marten's environment of browbeating.
If it was Hanners, Penelope, Tai or Angus handing out this kind of smack down, I would stop and go "Aw jeez! they really must know something about this, or Marten must be acting like a dick!" - because these people do not habitually harass and browbeat Marten. See what I'm getting at?
Post by: Armadillo on 16 Jan 2012, 15:11
You know, if you keep pointing out that this is a fictional story with fictional people in a fictional universe, you're REALLY going to suck the fun out of this place. :-D
In a week like this, I sometimes look at the forum on my screen and say to myself: "it's all just electrons - none of it is real".
Oh GREAT, now we're going to get existential. Jesus Huggy Bear Christ, I'd better get a beer.
Post by: Method of Madness on 16 Jan 2012, 15:18
"It's like the squirt bottle we use for the cat."
Post by: NightmarePhoenix on 16 Jan 2012, 15:23
Hmm, I'd like to clarify for my own sake at least that my opinion of Faye's actions is not based upon her gender.
You could literally replace Faye with Steve in the last two strips and I'd think he was being unduly harsh and a pretty lame friend, as I think Faye was. For me at least it's not gender specific.
It doesn't help that Steve is one of the other characters who I feel contributes to Marten's environment of browbeating.
If it was Hanners, Penelope, Tai or Angus handing out this kind of smack down, I would stop and go "Aw jeez! they really must know something about this, or Marten must be acting like a dick!" - because these people do not habitually harass and browbeat Marten. See what I'm getting at?
So wait, because you feel like Faye 'picks' on Marten, what she said is harsh and makes her a lame friend, but the same words coming from someone else means that Marten has to be acting like a dick? That's a little unfair towards her. Faye has always been sorta a rough person, its how she is and there are several times when she comes out and says "hey, I'm kinda an ass, sorry about that." but she doesn't needlessly browbeat him or harass him past playing around. And messing around with him like that doesn't mean when, for some reason, someone needs to smack him around that if Faye says it, she's just being mean.
Post by: Emperor Norton on 16 Jan 2012, 15:30
Faye may have realized what Padma was thinking, but may have not realized that Marten didn't, which is probably why she was so surprised that Marten reacted the way he did.
Then she should be kicking herself as well. There was plenty of indication in the previous comics that he DIDN'T realise. If she somehow missed that he didn't know she's as oblivious if not more so than Marten was.
Honestly this comic is the only time in my memory that Jeph has written something that broke me out of the narrative. She just seems to have magical knowledge of what happened, that she didn't previously have (because if she did have it, I really can't understand why she didn't tell Marten).
Post by: pwhodges on 16 Jan 2012, 15:37
Oh GREAT, now we're going to get existential.
I'll go to bed now - I'm sure it'll all be better in the morning (see sig)!
Post by: Overkillengine on 16 Jan 2012, 15:39
In the market for a bridge? I know a guy who knows a guy....
Post by: Emperor Norton on 16 Jan 2012, 15:41
OK, let me rephrase that to "if Faye were male." And yes, I realise that you can't just make a change like that and keep the rest of the situation constant, so let me just spell it out - I think that the fierceness of the reaction against what Faye has done is largely the way it is because she is female. There. I've said it. Consequences be damned.
This would make more sense if it wasn't for the fact that the forum drops on Steve like a brick shithouse every time he does something remotely rude.
Do we really need to pull the sexism card out so often? Its like you want to invalidate everyone's opinions based on assumption rather than the actual argument. "If you don't like what Faye did, you are being sexist." Do you realise how hard it is for people to have discussions in good faith when you are preemptively accusing people of sexism?
Post by: carg1 on 16 Jan 2012, 15:44
You know something? No. Hell no. She chews him out for doing the same thing she did, but because she runs from her feelings while he protects his, he's in the wrong? And with ALL that said, she expected him to go chase after her for the sake of being able to have said "he tried"? He's supposed to just get up and run over to her because it's her last night in town after dodging dude for a week. Heh, SURE. "Be decent", she says. No, Faye. No. Personally, I was proud of him when he said he was busy, since I knew it was as close as he'd come to saying "It sucks that you dodged me all week and now you wanna see me just as you're leaving. No." Normally I'm behind Faye when she gets indignantly angry like that, but not this time.
Post by: Tova on 16 Jan 2012, 15:48
The rest of my posts still stand. :angel:
Post by: Emperor Norton on 16 Jan 2012, 15:52
Marten is acting like a mopey victim. I think Faye could be a bit nicer to him, but his reaction kind of sucks too.
Honestly the only problem I have with her reaction is that she seems to assume he should know something and is basing her opinion of the situation on the idea it was stupid for him not to know.
Post by: NightmarePhoenix on 16 Jan 2012, 15:54
*Disclaimer* The following rant is made with full knowledge that this is a comic and thus fictional and scripted:
You know something? No. Hell no. She chews him out for doing the same thing she did, but because she runs from her feelings while he protects his, he's in the wrong? And with ALL that said, she expected him to go chase after her for the sake of being able to have said "he tried"? He's supposed to just get up and run over to her because it's her last night in town after dodging dude for a week. Heh, SURE. "Be decent", she says. No, Faye. No. Personally, I was proud of him when he said he was busy, since I knew it was as close as he'd come to saying "It sucks that you dodged me all week and now you wanna see me just as you're leaving. No." Normally I'm behind Faye when she gets indignantly angry like that, but not this time.
Padma = Wrong for dodging Marten.
Marten = Wrong for lying to Padma about being busy instead of coming out and saying "I'm kinda hurt you spent a week dodging me, what was that about? If you'll explain that to me, yeah sure, we can hang out."
Wrong + Wrong =/= Right. Saying he was busy was small, beneath him and petty. He's better than that. And when exactly did Faye do the same thing?
Post by: ZBixby on 16 Jan 2012, 15:56
The fact is they are good friends and she's doing what probably should have been done when he was in the coffee shop earlier that week when they said he was being aggressively passive.
Post by: Milesb on 16 Jan 2012, 16:03
So wait, because you feel like Faye 'picks' on Marten, what she said is harsh and makes her a lame friend, but the same words coming from someone else means that Marten has to be acting like a dick? That's a little unfair towards her. Faye has always been sorta a rough person, its how she is and there are several times when she comes out and says "hey, I'm kinda an ass, sorry about that." but she doesn't needlessly browbeat him or harass him past playing around. And messing around with him like that doesn't mean when, for some reason, someone needs to smack him around that if Faye says it, she's just being mean.
What I meant, if not what I said in regards to my difference in reading the situation is this:
In a comic, despite the text and the facial expressions, it can be hard to intuit the tone and meaning of a character's dialogue, and for this reason the relative nature of the characters has to come into play when we fill in the gaps in our heads.
When Faye, who has a long history of physical and verbal abuse towards Marten - When she berates Marten, I don't assume it's necessarily justified by Marten's actions because it is in Faye's character to act abusively on occasion.
When for example Hanners has ever snapped at Marten, it has had a much greater implication of genuine justification based on Marten's actions because Hanners does not have a long history of physical and verbal abuse towards him.
it's almost "little boy who cried wolf" - Between Faye, Steve and Dora's general attitude of browbeating, the times when Marten may have deserved it have got lost.
My point is that when a character who does not usually ever harass Marten gets angry at him and tells him he's wrong, I'm more likely to take it seriously than when a character who harasses him regularly gets angry and tells him he's wrong.
Is that bad of me?
I mean, doesn't everyone do this?
Edit: Also, I wasn't talking about Faye specifically in my original post, I was talking about Faye, Steve or Dora, as they are the three that use Marten as their punchbag the most often.
Post by: NightmarePhoenix on 16 Jan 2012, 16:34
Edit: Also, I wasn't talking about Faye specifically in my original post, I was talking about Faye, Steve or Dora, as they are the three that use Marten as their punchbag the most often.
I'll agree with Steve, lately he's been kind of a jerk but I feel like its generally because he keeps hearing Marten complain about things going well. Dora.... her and Marten had their falling out, she's probably had maybe like one episode of being dickish towards Marten in the last couple hundred pages. Faye... Faye has been way better than earlier in the comic. She's been there for Marten when he needs it alot, defensive of him even while drunk, and has even had near out of character moments of wisdom for Marten(#1951). I mean, yeah she used to really mess with him alot, but she hasn't in a while...like a long while. Unless you count the petnames of 'buttpoop' and such, what has she done to Marten that makes her so mean? Why does it sound like everyone thinks Faye is a bully, who's barely his friend?
Post by: NotAwesomeAnymore on 16 Jan 2012, 17:01
Post by: Omega Entity on 16 Jan 2012, 17:16
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 16 Jan 2012, 18:04
I don't think that's unfair, Milesb, no. Faye is a pretty awful person. I can't remember the exact words, but didn't Mr. Jacques himself once say that if Faye existed in real life he wouldn't want anything to do with her?
I'm probably in the minority in here, because I'm enjoying the heck out of recent events. I don't like Marten :mrgreen:
http://jephjacques.com/post/4598863468/if-your-characters-were-real-people-who-would-you-get
Post by: AnAverageWriter on 16 Jan 2012, 18:21
Oh, baloney. Nobody has said anything even resembling that. The "fierceness of the reaction" is because Faye's coming off like a heartless beast instead of a friend.
Nicely stated. +1.
Post by: Tova on 16 Jan 2012, 18:39
Post by: AnAverageWriter on 16 Jan 2012, 18:52
I'll just reiterate that the idea that Faye is coming off "like a heartless beast" is certainly a matter of opinion.
As are your tiresome attempts at painting Faye as some sort of saint, or her abuse as some sort of touching, poignant friendship effort.
I have to point out that the entire sum of the echo chamber here has been the stirring of a huge pot of "matters of opinions". Yours or mine are no greater or lesser than any others here; one muppet's voice carries the same weight as any others.
Post by: Tova on 16 Jan 2012, 18:57
Post by: jwhouk on 16 Jan 2012, 19:34
Marten moves on! - 5 (7.1%)
Deathmole! - 5 (7.1%)
Coffee of Doom Shenanigans! - 6 (8.6%)
Marigold Character Development! - 9 (12.9%)
More AI Interaction! - 0 (0%)
Hannelore Improves Herself! - 4 (5.7%)
Minor Character Breakout! - 5 (7.1%)
Steve and Cosette! - 0 (0%)
Tai and Player to be Named Later! - 1 (1.4%)
Raven! - 2 (2.9%)
The parents horn in! - 2 (2.9%)
TSB: Life after Padma! - 3 (4.3%)
Waffles. It always goes back to waffles. - 10 (14.3%)
Something COMPLETELY different! - 18 (25.7%)
Total Voters: 70
Post by: Method of Madness on 16 Jan 2012, 19:40
Post by: quix0te on 16 Jan 2012, 19:50
Padma- began having strong feelings for Marten. Started avoiding him without explanation. Called at the last minute before leaving town for good. To talk about.. their impossible relationship?
Marten- had strong feelings for Padma, but thought it was a short term thing. Was hurt and confused when she started avoiding him. Chose not to have a last talk with her about... whatever.
Faye-when her friend was trying to process through the end of his relationship, took the opportunity to tell him what he'd done wrong, in the harshest possible terms.
There is an asshole in this equation.
I'm pretty sure its not Marten.
Post by: Tova on 16 Jan 2012, 19:58
But just for the record, I don't think any of them are assholes.
edit: that poll was a tougher choice than usual.
Post by: DSL on 16 Jan 2012, 20:01
But whatever. Fix the blame, not the problem.
Post by: Tova on 16 Jan 2012, 20:16
I still don't see why it's necessary for there to be a designated asshole.
Well, maybe they should have one of those alongside the designated driver next time they head down to the bar. :lol:
Post by: dj_soo on 16 Jan 2012, 20:20
Petty game playing like what marten did seems to happen a lot more when you're younger whereas when (some) people get a little older, they start to realize that life's too short to be playing stupid games like that.
Anyway, great writing as usual - seems to have hit a nerve with a lot of people...
Definitely can sympathize with marten as I've done similar, stupid shit when I was around that age - of course, now I realize how stupid and petty I was when I was younger and definitely regret some of the connections I could have made - sexy-times or otherwise - due to all that emotional immaturity...
Post by: Blackjoker on 16 Jan 2012, 20:22
OK, here's a thought for all the "Marten did the right thing" folks.
If it's right, why the bitter acrimony? Why the self loathing? Why does he feel like he was being an asshole (his words, not Faye's)?
He should have seen Padma one last time, to talk. To say goodbye to a person who'd opened up to him. To ask what had happened that she decided to step back. I think her call to "hang out" was at least partly her wanting to talk, to explain, to seek some kind of resolution for/with this guy she'd inadvertantly hurt by her own bad choices. To understand a potential friend a little better.
It didn't need to be a roll in the hay, and maybe he wouldn't be feeling so much self loathing right now that he goes and gets Faye to metaphorically whack him upside the head (it really was self inflicted, if you think about it).
To carry the metaphor someone started, he didn't need to try kicking the football again, OR to ignore it. The football was never the issue. he needed to have a heart-to-heart with Lucy. It may not have worked out, but maybe he'd find out what the hell she was thinking, and not hate himself so much for his actions!
The self loathing and bitter acrimony could just be him internalizing the voices he's heard most of his life. I say this as a person who repeatedly hears "You're a failure" and "your family would be happier if you were hit by a bus" in his head on a semi constant basis. Healthy, no, but I know that such things do exist in my mind and Marten may also be someone who holds himself to very high personal standards. Please note that I am also not saying that Marten was in the right for what he did, I can understand why he did it, but it really wasn't a constructive setup. I said earlier that Marten was kind of in the land of 'no good outcomes' with that because no matter what happened unless he could avoid bringing up what was obviously a problem for him then things were likely to go badly. He might have tried to 'kick the football' again but what would it have accomplished? He might have been able to end things well, but being human he'd also point out that she left him in the lurch and was avoiding him. Then, given what's already happened to Marten, we'd likely see him yelled at by her, saying that she's already got enough stress with her grandmother, Marten apologizing out of guilt, and the same problem, and again Faye and Dora yelling at him.
I'm not claiming Marten is a saint, but I am saying that post breakup the universe of QC seems to have turned against Marten in a few ways. As a reader it seems like Marten is frequently in no-win situations, when he finds happiness it gets taken rather viciously, when he does stand up to someone he gets yelled at. This doesn't absolve Marten of jerkish behavior. What he did to Padma was passive aggressive and jerkish, when he got drunk he deserved the Faye attack. But he has also endured a lot of abuse from people that are supposed to be his friends, friends that show a lot more sympathy and mutual aid when someone else in their group is hit similarly. Note that when Steve was in a bad place Marten went to help him and try to get him through it, Steve just berates Marten.
As to the idea of Marten needing to take repsonsibility for his own feelings and the like, let's say that instead of 'I am busy' he had instead said something more direct, like challenging Padma on allegedly being so busy packing that she couldn't return a call. She was apparently looking at leaving early anyway (or at least earlier than her plan of 'stay extra week') so what was the purpose of the call. Maybe he could have said "That depends, is this you trying to get rid of any guilt you might feel about leaving me in the lurch or are you going to actually tell me what had you avoiding me?" Had he done that, he still probably would have felt guilty and get called out on it. And if she was pissed due to his statement of what trying got him, let's consider what he actually meant, and what Faye would probably realize he meant (and before you claim that I'm demanding Faye be a mind reader, I'm not, this is more from what she has heard and seen from interactions with Marten) he lost his guitar, had someone he truly loved basically ditch him, and was nearly broke. We don't know how long he'd been in town but from what it looks like his only friend before Faye was Steve, and unless Steve really devolved I honestly can say that Marten might have some reasons to regret that trip. Even if a good thing did come out of it, it was more due to blind luck than that actual attempt. And as I pointed out, times he did try or assert himself, it tended to fail or backfire. If every time I stand up I get kicked in the shins eventually either my legs will break or I'll decide it isn't worth the trouble to get up again.
(and sorry for the big wall of text)
Post by: Blackjoker on 16 Jan 2012, 20:25
How else would you describe no fewer than five people (Faye, Dora, Elliot, Ms. Reed, Steve) all coming down on him like a ton of bricks over the past year or so?
It's a story; of course teh drama makes a disproportionate appearance. Each of those incidents probably lasted no more than a few minutes out of the couple of months that have passed.
Pattern recognition, in each time it occurred when Marten was at a low point and that was when the most vicious reactions against him occurred. And these were also from people who KNEW he was in a bad place. As for timetables, I admit the point but comic time is strange. a day can take 5 months to pass and a year can pass in a day.
Post by: Armadillo on 16 Jan 2012, 20:32
I would be curious to plot out whether there's a correlation between age range and those supporting marten for his actions and those against.
Petty game playing like what marten did seems to happen a lot more when you're younger whereas when (some) people get a little older, they start to realize that life's too short to be playing stupid games like that.
Anyway, great writing as usual - seems to have hit a nerve with a lot of people...
Definitely can sympathize with marten as I've done similar, stupid shit when I was around that age - of course, now I realize how stupid and petty I was when I was younger and definitely regret some of the connections I could have made - sexy-times or otherwise - due to all that emotional immaturity...
Well, I'm 33 and married 10 years, so I don't know what that says about me.
I can't call what Marten did here "game playing." To me, that's what a person does in order to test another person. Marten honestly tried to contact Padma, and did so in good faith. When she finally called back and revealed that she was leaving the next day, he blew her off. That's not really a game, is it?
As for designating an asshole, you can both care deeply for someone and be a complete asshat at the same time.
Post by: Carl-E on 16 Jan 2012, 21:49
So I get back a little while ago, and there's my message, unsent. Just for a laugh, I hit send again...
67 new mwssages.
Seriously, guys. Two pages. About nothing - round and round, the same arguments and postures.
I'm joining Paul in waiting until tomorrow's comic. Won't be long now...
Post by: RyanPm40 on 16 Jan 2012, 22:05
Post by: truestatic on 16 Jan 2012, 22:16
Quote
And that just about wraps up the Marten/Padma story, for now at least.
FORBODE
FORBODE
Post by: ZBixby on 16 Jan 2012, 22:31
Nice to see Marten and Faye having a constructive talk. I still disagree about who was at fault, but that's irrelevant now. What matters is that he keeps strumming that guitar. Or something. That said...QuoteAnd that just about wraps up the Marten/Padma story, for now at least.
FORBODE
FORBODE
Well Padma will be back then, who cares for now. ONWARD TO SILLY THINGS!
Post by: haikupoet on 16 Jan 2012, 22:41
I also hope that Marten gets a chance to smooth things over with Padma eventually -- if not as a couple, than at least long-distance friends.
Post by: Near Lurker on 16 Jan 2012, 22:42
"MARTEN YOU CAN FUCKING DO THAT IN THE MORNING!!!!!"
Post by: akronnick on 16 Jan 2012, 22:48
Oh.
My.
God.
Are people still obsessing over who is in the wrong vis-a-vis Marten and Padma?
Let me tell you a secret: The reason this argument isn't going anywhere is because everyone's right and everyone's wrong.
At the same time.
Marten was right.
And Marten was wrong.
Padma was right.
And Padma was wrong.
Sometimes, in relationships as well as in life, people making perfectly rational decisions, but those decisions lead to less than optimal outcomes.
A perfectly balanced system never changes. As the song says "...it's a fool who plays it cool by making his world a little colder.*"
Neither Marten nor Padma, for perfectly logical reasons, was willing to take the chance and make their relationship mean more than just a brief fling, and because of that, they are paying the price.
It's over.
Learn.
Grow.
MOVE ON!!!!!
*Da da da da da, da da da da
Post by: truestatic on 16 Jan 2012, 22:50
:psyduck:Not so much. Like i said, it's irrelevant. It's just odd that it's a topic the forums are so divided on, but according to the comics, it appears there will be one conclusive answer. It's Marten's fault.
Oh.
My.
God.
Post by: idontunderstand on 16 Jan 2012, 22:58
Post by: Tova on 16 Jan 2012, 22:58
And that is all I am saying... the conversation is starting up again, but I am staying out of it this time. :angel:
Post by: Aegir on 16 Jan 2012, 23:03
Post by: Carl-E on 16 Jan 2012, 23:04
:psyduck:Not so much. Like i said, it's irrelevant. It's just odd that it's a topic the forums are so divided on, but according to the comics, it appears there will be one conclusive answer. It's Marten's fault.
Oh.
My.
God.
The only part addressed in the comic is what Marten did (or didn't) do. That's the only thing Faye was yelling about, that's the only part they're talking about, that's what's frustrating him.
And yes, that was his fault. No question. Padma didn't make him do it, it was his own petty free will.
Post by: Method of Madness on 16 Jan 2012, 23:06
why is Marten wearing a different shirt in this comic as compared to the previous one?Faye owned him so hard the shirt changed colours.
Post by: Akima on 16 Jan 2012, 23:08
After all, for any of us, our present life is the result of the bad things that have happened to us, large and small, as well as the good ones - so in the end how can we even decide which were which? We are the result of the totality of our experience, not of any one or even a thousand parts of it, and Faye is correct in saying that the best thing we can do is value the result.So very, very true... And many things that happen are both good and bad at the same time...
OK, here's a thought for all the "Marten did the right thing" folks. If it's right, why the bitter acrimony? Why the self loathing? Why does he feel like he was being an asshole (his words, not Faye's)?Yes... Karma is a bitch. That moment of petty spite came with a heft price-tag. They always do, unless you're a complete prick, which Marten is not.
Post by: iduguphergrave on 16 Jan 2012, 23:09
why is Marten wearing a different shirt in this comic as compared to the previous one?
He did all these comics in advance and accidentally changed the shirt color, and he can't fix it from New Zealand. Yesterday's had him in the wrong shirt color too at first; a friend fixed it for him.
Marten's using his older guitar. Interesting.
Post by: truestatic on 16 Jan 2012, 23:12
I still don't see how she owned him. What exactly is he wasting. Is he having a generally bad time in this life? Nope. Did he just trash a promising relationship? Nuh uh. I think just about the only thing he's wasting is his evening. FOR SHAME.why is Marten wearing a different shirt in this comic as compared to the previous one?Faye owned him so hard the shirt changed colours.
And yes, that was his fault. No question. Padma didn't make him do it, it was his own petty free will.That's what I'm saying though. Yes, one part of the forums, likely the majority, agrees with you. Marten screwed everything up and deserved a real kick in the pants, and he's lucky he has a friend like Faye to tell him he's bad and he should feel bad about it. But I'm hardly the only one who disagreed with this assessment. Granted, Faye's the only one who weighed in on the matter, I just feel like we're all going to move on and it's going to be a foregone conclusion that It's All His Fault,™ which feels weird.
Regardless, agree to disagree. Tova's got the right idea, I think.
Post by: jasononline on 16 Jan 2012, 23:29
What the Hell is a Quokka?
:-P
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 16 Jan 2012, 23:31
Post by: pwhodges on 16 Jan 2012, 23:50
As the song says "...it's a fool who plays it cool by making his world a little colder."
Those speculating about a split of views along age lines might note that this song was written by a man only a couple of years older than Marten.
Post by: snubnose on 16 Jan 2012, 23:51
YAY !!!
Poll is irrelevant - but I guess Hanners would go with Astrophysics.
And shouldnt Jeph be depressed about every romance he writes ? He always ends them ... he's a real Joss Whedon about that.
I'm fairly sure that "Hey Jude" was one of the last Beatles-songs. John and Paul havent been THAT young anymore at this point.As the song says "...it's a fool who plays it cool by making his world a little colder."
Those speculating about a split of views along age lines might note that this song was written by a young man.
Post by: Near Lurker on 17 Jan 2012, 00:01
The Beatles' whole mainstream career ran only about seven years. Compare to the bands today releasing an album every two or three...
Post by: Kugai on 17 Jan 2012, 00:10
TOMORROW ON QC........
Post by: litthefilter on 17 Jan 2012, 00:28
30 minutes later:
"MARTEN YOU CAN FUCKING DO THAT IN THE MORNING!!!!!"
:-D
Post by: AnAverageWriter on 17 Jan 2012, 00:29
The Beatles' whole mainstream career ran only about seven years. Compare to the bands today releasing an album every two or three...
Yeah, a lot of music legends have had tragically short lives. Hendrix, Joplin, Morrison... all under 30.
Post by: Vurogj on 17 Jan 2012, 00:32
The reason I'm sad she's gone is that this whole arc has shown some outstanding writing from Jeph. I've praised his art before, but I don't recall praising his writing. I am now, as he really does do a range of believeable, understandable and above all, human characters brilliantly. Bravo.
Warning - while you were typing 2 new replies have been posted. You may wish to review your post. Or at least plead for "under 30" to be changed to "27, the magic number"
Post by: Blackjoker on 17 Jan 2012, 00:54
Post by: DannicaJ on 17 Jan 2012, 01:07
He should go visit (or at least call) his parents. Say what you will, parents are people you can count on for support when feeling down.
Post by: Binary on 17 Jan 2012, 01:32
:psyduck:
Post by: pwhodges on 17 Jan 2012, 01:37
26
It was written in June 1968, the month of Paul's 26th birthday (18th June 68); I can't find whether before or after.
Post by: NotAwesomeAnymore on 17 Jan 2012, 02:23
What's the difference between the old guitar and the new guitar?
For that matter, what's Faye done that's so impressive since breaking the ice with Marten 2 years ago? Seduce Sven? Wow, that worked out well for everyone.
Hey, do you read this comic called Questionable Content?
Post by: Dr. ROFLPWN on 17 Jan 2012, 02:45
Post by: iduguphergrave on 17 Jan 2012, 02:45
Just kidding. Jeph said somewhere, I can't remember where, that he'd never written a fight where one person was totally right and the other was totally wrong. Just throwing that out there (sorry if it's been said already. Tl;dr and all that)
Post by: Mustakyy on 17 Jan 2012, 02:51
*Fade to black, Marten playing*
TOMORROW ON QC........
Hmm, I know you probably didn't mean this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nu4wvvoA9-s), but damn that was fitting (especially the comic's/songs atmosphere), the mental of Marten playing (yea, somehow I also have serious doubts Marten playing that song..). Kinda exaggerated, but hey, what's a discussion without proper hyperbole.
(edited to fix typos, seems that I'm incapable to write properly. D'oh!)
Post by: TinPenguin on 17 Jan 2012, 04:10
I think we are all missing the real issue here and that is:
What the Hell is a Quokka?
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-0pj6sXzUk38/TleNNV2OsjI/AAAAAAAAFfc/W5-bexD9GUc/s400/quokka.jpg)
Post by: AnAverageWriter on 17 Jan 2012, 04:25
I think we are all missing the real issue here and that is:
What the Hell is a Quokka?
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-0pj6sXzUk38/TleNNV2OsjI/AAAAAAAAFfc/W5-bexD9GUc/s400/quokka.jpg)
D'AWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW ITS SO CUTE AND FUZZY!!!
Post by: Border Reiver on 17 Jan 2012, 04:49
That and I was wondering if Marten's playing Robert Johnson or John Lee Hooker?
Post by: pwhodges on 17 Jan 2012, 04:53
D'AWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW ITS SO CUTE AND FUZZY!!!
It's Australian; that means it probably bites.
Post by: TinPenguin on 17 Jan 2012, 05:01
Wonder how it tastes?
With its tongue, silly!
Post by: AnAverageWriter on 17 Jan 2012, 05:06
D'AWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW ITS SO CUTE AND FUZZY!!!
It's Australian; that means it probably bites.
I noticed that down under gets two kinds of things-
You got your Koalas and Wallabies and other things that are just so fuzzy you could hug em...
And you get things like this-
(click to show/hide)
There is no middle ground in Australia. It's either cuddly or it'll kill you while stabbing you with razor sharp fangs and deadly venom.
Of note- that place is one of the few that has a shark that actually *likes* the taste of people.
Post by: Milesb on 17 Jan 2012, 05:46
Anyone else think Faye's comments today clearly failed to inspire Marten? She gives him a pretty big out-a-textbook spiel then bails out for bed while he's looking pretty depressed and actually just about ready to talk about the problem.
nice one.
also that depressed look on Marten's face in the last panel.
Post by: SomeCanadianWeirdo on 17 Jan 2012, 06:11
Wonder how it tastes?
That and I was wondering if Marten's playing Robert Johnson or John Lee Hooker?
Seems to me "Roxanne" is more likely to be in Marten's mental list of "old, sad" songs than the blues.(And no, I am not implying anything about Padma by that song choice.) Of course Marty might surprise us and be playing "Dust in the Wind."(Funny how none of today's whiny bands have covered that one. You'd think it would be right up their alley.)
Post by: truestatic on 17 Jan 2012, 06:13
And it's bite is lethal in 30 seconds or less. And don't even get them started on the dropbears.D'AWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW ITS SO CUTE AND FUZZY!!!
It's Australian; that means it probably bites.
Post by: kent_eh on 17 Jan 2012, 06:20
Actually, when your emotions are freshly bruised is often a very good time to write some music.
In addition to the possibility of a powerful song coming out, just sitting down and making some music is extremely enjoyable and cathartic.
Post by: Harlequin on 17 Jan 2012, 06:56
Y'all are too much.
Post by: tjradcliffe on 17 Jan 2012, 06:59
I don't even see how "going along with Padma's wish to let the relationship drift to a close at a time of her choosing" would count as DOING stuff more than "deciding to break it off in a fit of pique" does.
Yeah, I saw this as Faye completely contradicting herself in that cute way people have when they're telling you how you should live you life: for good or ill Marten actually experimented with different behaviour by not acceding passively to Padma's emotional needs at the expense of his own, Faye beat him up over it, and now she's telling him he should experiment with different behaviour. At least he had the good sense to pull out his guitar. The music will always love you back.
Post by: jwhouk on 17 Jan 2012, 07:06
why is Marten wearing a different shirt in this comic as compared to the previous one?I'll take this one.
Jeph apparently failed to change Marten's shirt from 2099 to 2100 to 2101. He mentioned it in a tweet, if memory serves.
EDIT: Grrrr.
Anyways - I'm betting he's just playing a basic blues riff. And I can TOTALLY see Faye doing a "DO THAT IN THE MORNING PLEASE" scream from her bedroom.
Post by: Welu on 17 Jan 2012, 07:10
Faye is one of Marten's closest friends and they've seen each other through their very low points. This is another one of those low points where hopefully regardless of how we're interpreting Faye's words and Marten's response, that the characters will go on to better themselves, whatever that means.
I said something basically like this already and so have others a lot but there's nothing horrible about how Marten's living his life, he's got friends and a steady decent income and hobby he's passionate about, but he's still not happy and he's done nothing actively (not the same as actively done nothing) to change that. He can't just wait for the happy to fall on his lap, he's got to out and grab the happy!
Post by: Milesb on 17 Jan 2012, 07:28
I think Marten has a mix of positives and negatives in his life, and sure - you can always do more to increase the impact of the positives!
But I think getting rid of the negatives is often much more difficult for people, and that's Marten's issue.
I personally believe that Marten's methods of interacting with some of his closest friends is one of his biggest negatives. Because he's generally quite meek, people project his opinion onto him when they know him well and when he deviates from that, he's wrong.
A great example of some of Marten asserting himself in a positive light would be a lot of his interactions with Hanners, helping her to be less OCD and more social, the drum kit thing, etc.
A great example of Marten being stomped on for deviating from being a door mat would be the starting scenes of the breakup with Dora (specifically the "Don't look at my porn.. you looked at my porn! I told you not to!")
Edit: I guess my point is that Marten does try and be assertive at times, and often the reaction that follows (positive or negative) is pretty much down to who he's being assertive towards. Some of his friends definitely seem to have peg holed Marten, and don't react particularly well when he fails to follow through on their expectations.
Post by: lepetitfromage on 17 Jan 2012, 07:34
grab the happy!
I read everything else you said (and definitely agree) but I just needed to share how much I love this phrase. haha
Post by: pwhodges on 17 Jan 2012, 07:55
A forum exists, people post their ideas, their likes and dislikes... and then these efforts are made to silence *everyone* by the people participating.
The thing is, people want their views to prevail, and on the Internet they don't get so much of the feedback that gets them to back down, either by agreeing to differ, or by accepting a modification of their views. This is a well-known phenomenon, and is the reason that forums like this have moderators to try to control things. We have worked hard here to try to remove the rudeness that was common not much more than a year ago; these days people are (mostly) reasonably polite about disagreeing - but disagree they will, and some still try to get their view over by sheer weight of posts.
There is a well-known cartoon about this, on XKCD (http://xkcd.com/386/.) (note the hover text):
Post by: Milesb on 17 Jan 2012, 08:03
Perhaps making up for lurking for so long, I decided to post and I've got a bit carried away.
:psyduck:
Post by: ecstaticjoy on 17 Jan 2012, 08:04
Post by: gprimr1 on 17 Jan 2012, 08:42
Fall head over heels in love with her and be destroyed when she left?
Fall head over heels in love with her, and totally uproot his entire life to go be with a woman he's known maybe 2-3 months?
I don't think either option thrills me.
The whole thing was just wrong place wrong time. My only complaint was Martin should have enjoyed what he did have.
Post by: iduguphergrave on 17 Jan 2012, 09:13
grab the happy!
I read everything else you said (and definitely agree) but I just needed to share how much I love this phrase. haha
Last time I tried to grab the happy I nearly wound up in jail.
Post by: Vista on 17 Jan 2012, 11:23
...but disagree they will, and some still try to get their view over by sheer weight of posts.
I feel like that's disingenuous. Having reread the threads of the last two weeks, I'm pretty sure it's mostly different people piping up for short series of responses, not the same people over and over again across more than two pages (with a few exceptions).
The bulk of the useless (read: posts that aren't from a fresh face weighing in) response posts have had more to do with whining about other peoples' responses. Calling out their uselessness or aggressiveness or accusing of sexism or bemoaning how oh gosh it's still happening. Like this post of mine so far.
Something completely different:
Marten in the last panels reminded me of a newly popular song. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8UVNT4wvIGY)
Post by: Throg on 17 Jan 2012, 12:00
you need to have your heart BROKEN in order to play the BLUES
...like that movie with Ralph Macchio. And Stevie Vai as the DEVIL, man! That shit was DEEP!
o/~ PAD-ma, got me on my knees! PAD-ma, beggin' darlin' please! o/~
:psyduck:
Post by: Wagimawr on 17 Jan 2012, 13:28
on the Internet
I like how Tycho put it in a Penny Arcade newspost last week (http://penny-arcade.com/2012/01/13):
Quote
There are certainly people with whom dialogue is not possible, or desirable; . . . There are also people who merely disagree. We are losing the ability to tell which is which.
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 17 Jan 2012, 14:10
The case against is that she's restarted her sculpting. The case in favor is that Dora had to push her hard to make that happen.
In any case, though, good advice is still good advice even if it comes from a hypocrite.
Post by: pwhodges on 17 Jan 2012, 14:29
Post by: truestatic on 17 Jan 2012, 14:47
We have worked hard here to try to remove the rudeness that was common not much more than a year ago; these days people are (mostly) reasonably polite about disagreeing - but disagree they will, and some still try to get their view over by sheer weight of posts.My bad.
Post by: Milesb on 17 Jan 2012, 14:56
If you give someone advice you can't follow yourself, shouldn't you be in a good position to know how difficult that advice is to follow (if the person has a similar issue or problem as your own) and change the advice?
More a "Well I tried to do x and it was hard, but what about y."
I only say this because I'm quite patently bad at taking my own advice and I acknowledge my hypocrisy openly in an attempt to either force myself into taking my own advice or really stopping to consider whether my advice is valid if I can't follow it myself.
Post by: pwhodges on 17 Jan 2012, 15:08
If you give someone advice you can't follow yourself, shouldn't you be in a good position to know how difficult that advice is to follow (if the person has a similar issue or problem as your own)?
If you are trying, but failing, you are not being hypocritical; if you are not trying (even if because you think it will be too hard) then you are. I can see that cases can be contrived to show that the boundary is not as clear-cut as that sounds.
Post by: Milesb on 17 Jan 2012, 15:20
If you are trying, but failing, you are not being hypocritical; if you are not trying (even if because you think it will be too hard) then you are. I can see that cases can be contrived to show that the boundary is not as clear-cut as that sounds.
I concede that point, very well put. (with agreement on the fact that the boundaries could be difficult to define)
I think without really realizing it I was questioning the wider validity of advice given which you can't follow yourself (in the trying and failing sense) - I think it's a question of how achievable actions based on advice may be, and whether it's sometimes very easy to state an obvious solution without considering the required steps in between which actually allow the advice to be followed.
Post by: Blackjoker on 17 Jan 2012, 16:53
"But nature or not, you're never gonna be happy if you go through life just letting things happen to you" - like, say, letting Faye approach you and become a close friend, or letting Dora pounce on you and become your girlfriend?
"You gotta DO stuff" - like, say, standing up to your girlfriend when you think she's behaved objectionally, and thus ending the relationship, or standing up to your mother when she's being obnoxious, and being made to look stupid in front of your friends? Or chasing another girlfriend across the country and getting your heart broken and winding up in a dead-end job?
I don't even see how "going along with Padma's wish to let the relationship drift to a close at a time of her choosing" would count as DOING stuff more than "deciding to break it off in a fit of pique" does.
For that matter, what's Faye done that's so impressive since breaking the ice with Marten 2 years ago? Seduce Sven? Wow, that worked out well for everyone.
tl;dr - Faye's spiel today reads (to me) annoyingly like one of those glib morals you used to get at the end of US sitcom episodes, and one which isn't remotely borne out by the previous 2100 strips.
Yes, there have been times where his assertiveness didn't work. However, those problems had more to do with who he was assertive to than the assertiveness itself. I don't deny the basic point, as mentioned before Marten being assertive has had some trouble in the past. The problem is though that his passivity isn't going to make things any better either. I don't know what Marten could have done in the Padma situation that would have worked but as it is he either needs to be able to stand up and do it enough that he can do it consistently or he has to reevaluate himself. Marten has had a lot of bad shit happen to him but that doesn't absolve him of needing to try to improve himself or things in his life. The universe doesn't hand out rewards after you've been dragged through that sort of thing just because, otherwise the third world wouldn't be.
Post by: Tova on 17 Jan 2012, 17:37
I agree (although it didn't occur to me at the time) that Faye's spiel does read a bit like a glib moral at the end of a US sitcom episode. Easier said than done, even - especially for someone who is passive by nature. Still, I'm not sure that anyone here is going to argue that it would be bad for Marten to become a little less passive in his life.
Still, he's tried before and been kicked, right? That's going to make it harder for him. True, and I've got a couple of observations about that.
First of all, Marten becoming less passive is really going to be a process of focussing less on simply pleasing those around him and more on his own needs and goals. Well, it stands to reason that his first attempts at doing so are going to involve people being ... well ... less than pleased with him. But that doesn't mean he shouldn't persevere! It's a matter of learning his personal boundaries - balancing his own needs and desires against those of the people around him.
"You gotta DO stuff" - like, say, standing up to your girlfriend when you think she's behaved objectionally, and thus ending the relationship, or standing up to your mother when she's being obnoxious, and being made to look stupid in front of your friends? Or chasing another girlfriend across the country and getting your heart broken and winding up in a dead-end job?
The burned hand teaches best, but hopefully it should teach the right lesson. Let's look at those examples one by one.
"standing up to your girlfriend when you think she's behaved objectionally"
(hoo boy my archive-fu skills are lacking)
http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=1797
When did this really go off the rails? It wasn't when he stood up to her - if he'd simply insisted that she crossed a line and he was angry about it, I think this episode would have ended fine (this time at least). Where it really went wrong was where Marten made a snipey, bitter statement that indicated that he was carrying around anger about Dora's past mistakes as well. Now, I don't want to get into a massive revisiting of the whole breakup topic - I just want to say that they didn't break up purely because he stood up to her. It's more complex than that.
"standing up to your mother when she's being obnoxious"
http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=1835
This is actually pretty much the same issue - instead of resolving the issue at the time, he carries it around with him, then it comes out in a totally snarky, inappropriate manner when all his mother is doing is asking what everyone would like to do next. That wasn't standing up to her when she was being obnoxious, it was being passive aggressive when she wasn't. Before you start on me - I am not placing fault, nor am I saying that Marten's mother dealt with the situation perfectly or even close to it. All I am saying is that had he been properly assertive instead of just rude, then he would not have had to be embarrased.
"chasing another girlfriend across the country and getting your heart broken and winding up in a dead-end job"
(no particular comic for this one - phew)
That's a fair comment - the immediate outcome wasn't what he wanted. But again, I hope he would learn that right lesson from this. I won't try and discuss what the right lesson is, because that's yet another can of worms. But I would like to the think that the lesson is NOT "stop trying, you'll only get hurt."
Well, it still ended up too long, but hopefully it's a bit better than yesterdays efforts. :-)
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 17 Jan 2012, 17:45
The characters who believed in not interfering with the natural flow of events had to learn to take action: the characters from the Western mindset had to learn not to meddle and to let things happen in their own time.
Andy147 makes a great point that Marten has gotten good things by just letting them happen, but sometimes you just have to go out and get the soup.
Post by: Overkillengine on 17 Jan 2012, 18:26
However, those problems had more to do with who he was assertive to than the assertiveness itself.
And how he was trying to be assertive, as well.
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 17 Jan 2012, 19:23
Post by: iduguphergrave on 17 Jan 2012, 21:08
Welp, just wanted to leave a comment before I join the blackout. I was gonna say "before I black myself out," but that doesn't sound quite right does it? Anyway, fuck SOPA.
G'night folks.
Post by: MamiyaOtaru on 17 Jan 2012, 21:30
Post by:
Post by: Yarin on 17 Jan 2012, 21:35
Post by: Wagimawr on 17 Jan 2012, 21:55
Wait, I thought Pintsize was deactivated some strips back. How did he get turned back on?
Clearly it was magic because if we don't see it in the strip it couldn't possibly happen, right?
Post by: FunkyTuba on 17 Jan 2012, 22:06
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 17 Jan 2012, 22:24
Post by: DrPhibes on 18 Jan 2012, 00:06
Post by: Delator on 18 Jan 2012, 00:13
Fun comic but meh punchline/last panel
I blame Pedro...
...don't get me wrong, I like GWS quite a bit. Pedro, however, is possibly the most un-funny gimmick character since Scrappy Doo.
Post by:
Wait, I thought Pintsize was deactivated some strips back. How did he get turned back on?
Clearly it was magic because if we don't see it in the strip it couldn't possibly happen, right?
Then I wanna see some huge sneezes that cause mass panty shots!!
Post by: TinPenguin on 18 Jan 2012, 03:28
Post by: WAYF on 18 Jan 2012, 04:45
Post by: Border Reiver on 18 Jan 2012, 04:47
Fuck them both with a rusty chainsword.
(I will bet money they, or something like them, get passed, sooner or later. Just one more year and I can move to Canada or beyond @_@ )
Probably for the best Winslow didn't go along. Poor little fella'd get swallowed by a rattler and Pintsize would just laugh.
You do realize that it affects US based SERVERS right and that moving to the Great White North isn't going to unblock it right?
But if you want to come on up anyway.
Post by: gopher on 18 Jan 2012, 04:53
Fun comic but meh punchline/last panel
I blame Pedro...
...don't get me wrong, I like GWS quite a bit. Pedro, however, is possibly the most un-funny gimmick character since Scrappy Doo.
Good lord, that is bringing out the big guns. Is it that awful?
Post by: SomeCanadianWeirdo on 18 Jan 2012, 06:19
Post by: jwhouk on 18 Jan 2012, 07:03
Post by: jwhouk on 18 Jan 2012, 07:04
Dies. - 11 (15.1%)
Grumbles. - 2 (2.7%)
Moves to Australia. - 2 (2.7%)
Moves on with their lives. - 8 (11%)
Joins a band. - 3 (4.1%)
Studies Astrophysics. - 6 (8.2%)
Chases after their non-girlfriend/boyfriend. - 2 (2.7%)
Complains on an internet forum. - 14 (19.2%)
Tweets about it. - 2 (2.7%)
Gets an AnthroPC. - 1 (1.4%)
makes Waffles! - 7 (9.6%)
Goes to visit the 'rents. - 2 (2.7%)
Keep your arms and legs inside the ride at all times. - 7 (9.6%)
waits for the next strip. - 6 (8.2%)
Total Voters: 73
Post by: ecstaticjoy on 18 Jan 2012, 08:51
Screw sopa and pipa
Srsly. I've never called my senators in my entire life and I called them today. AND I e-mailed. Just in case that secretary doesn't pass along the message. Everyone else is calling to oppose, too, right? PIPA won't pass, right??
Post by: ecstaticjoy on 18 Jan 2012, 08:53
Post by: pwhodges on 18 Jan 2012, 08:58
Post by: Delator on 18 Jan 2012, 09:56
Good lord, that is bringing out the big guns. Is it that awful?
Nothing is THAT awful. :wink:
Srsly. I've never called my senators in my entire life and I called them today. AND I e-mailed. Just in case that secretary doesn't pass along the message. Everyone else is calling to oppose, too, right? PIPA won't pass, right??
I haven't called or emailed, but that's because I already didn't plan on voting for them anyways.
Didn't seem right to me to issue a threat that my Congresspeople couldn't rectify even if they changed their stance on the bill. Disingenuous somehow.
I did sign every petition online that I ran across though. So there's that.
Post by: pwhodges on 18 Jan 2012, 11:03
I haven't called or emailed, but that's because I already didn't plan on voting for them anyways.
Your representative represents you, whether you voted for them or not. They are duty bound (ha!) to take note of what you say...
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 18 Jan 2012, 13:44
Post by: Overkillengine on 18 Jan 2012, 14:00
That shit is a positively Orwellian nightmare waiting to happen.
Post by: Kugai on 18 Jan 2012, 14:36
But considering the kind of reactionary lunacy that is going on there at the moment, I shudder to think
Grud, I really do hope Heinlein wasn't right.
Post by: pwhodges on 18 Jan 2012, 14:45
Post by: Armadillo on 18 Jan 2012, 14:51
Did I mention that Dodd is chairman and CEO of the Motion Picture Association of America? What a Champ.
http://www.unitedliberty.org/articles/9410-chris-dodd-thinks-anti-sopapipa-websites-are-abusing-their-power?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 18 Jan 2012, 14:55
Post by: jwhouk on 18 Jan 2012, 17:11
Regular poll tomorrow AM (US CST).
Post by:
The real quesztion is whether Pintsize actually did go to Mexico, or was his trip a hallucination? Virtual peyote may be easy to acquire.(For all I know the real thing may not be that hard to acquire. I'm not a drugs guy.)
Computer virus. Named Happyfuntimenow.exe.
Post by: Overkillengine on 18 Jan 2012, 20:11
Meanwhile, Chris Dodd (formerly D-CT) has accused sites such as Wikipedia and Google of "abusing their power" by blacking out.
Did I mention that Dodd is chairman and CEO of the Motion Picture Association of America? What a Champ.
http://www.unitedliberty.org/articles/9410-chris-dodd-thinks-anti-sopapipa-websites-are-abusing-their-power?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
Like the Pro-SOPA corporations won't abuse the heck out of this to stifle competition or anything. :roll:
People are rightfully leery of any law where we only have vague reassurances that it won't be abused.
Post by: gprimr1 on 18 Jan 2012, 20:58
Post by: Method of Madness on 18 Jan 2012, 21:37
My apologies about the poll, but every little bit helps.Wait, you mean it wasn't a clever bit about SOPA?
Post by: jwhouk on 18 Jan 2012, 21:55
My apologies about the poll, but every little bit helps.Wait, you mean it wasn't a clever bit about SOPA?
Well, yeah, but still. ;)
Post by: Akima on 18 Jan 2012, 22:25
Those of us who can do nothing and yet will be affected by the result thank you who do what you can!Very much so.
Next Pintsize sees a small bird run past squarking "BEEP! BEEP!", pursued by Wile E Pyote...
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 18 Jan 2012, 22:57
EDIT:
Hannerdad! Woo!
I wonder if there are secret robots or whether that's only a concern when Hannerdad is off his medication.
Post by: akronnick on 19 Jan 2012, 00:42
Are we about to meet Hannerdad?!
Are Marten and Marigold about to to take a trip?
Is the next story arc for QC about to take place...
IN SPACE!?!?!?!
Post by: sitnspin on 19 Jan 2012, 00:52
Awww, Marten is (one of) her best friend(s). He really is, too. If there is one area in which Marten has actually been active, it has been in helping Hanners grow. As someone who has a history of mental illness and only got through it because I was helped by a dear friend, I appreciate that about him, even if much of his personality irks me.
Post by: CompSarge on 19 Jan 2012, 00:52
So THAT'S why Hanners took that sample a few months ago (http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=1607)...
Edit: Dammit, ninja'd! Stupid rusty archive diving skills...
Edit part duex: Interesting that Jeph used the original picture of Marigold for Hannelore's thought bubble. Kinda cool to see how his style's changed in a little under two years.
Post by: pwhodges on 19 Jan 2012, 00:58
Post by: DSL on 19 Jan 2012, 01:01
Post by: CompSarge on 19 Jan 2012, 01:03
So all of the strips AnPC "owners" are potential guests at Hannerdad's party. Here's hoping Jeph pulls out ALL the stops.
I...totally did not make that connection. :-o This could be potentially epic! :mrgreen:
Post by: raoullefere on 19 Jan 2012, 01:06
On the other hand, I admit I can't account for the acne. Yet.
Post by: iduguphergrave on 19 Jan 2012, 01:15
Post by: Skewbrow on 19 Jan 2012, 01:31
- moar Hanners & Marigold
- learn the purpose of the samples
- meet Hannerdad
- butts in space?
That's fanservice (in the non-bear-hatted sense of the word).
Post by: Skaltura on 19 Jan 2012, 02:00
Post by: zmeiat_joro on 19 Jan 2012, 02:09
Post by: WAYF on 19 Jan 2012, 02:47
Awesome.
Post by: Soulsynger on 19 Jan 2012, 02:54
First by SOPA and PIPA and the realization that foreign (USA) governments are just as idiotic, incompetent and ignorant as Germany's...
... and second by the possibility of seeing Hannerdad. I am trembling under the stress of holding back a more than misplaced Barney-Stinson-routine here...
Third will be when I actually survive a 3 hour car drive across Germany's most kaputt autobahns (freeways) tomorrow.
Post by: Tova on 19 Jan 2012, 03:22
Post by: Manix on 19 Jan 2012, 03:31
This week my mind just continues to be blown.
First by SOPA and PIPA and the realization that foreign (USA) governments are just as idiotic, incompetent and ignorant as Germany's...
... and second by the possibility of seeing Hannerdad. I am trembling under the stress of holding back a more than misplaced Barney-Stinson-routine here...
Third will be when I actually survive a 3 hour car drive across Germany's most kaputt autobahns (freeways) tomorrow.
From where I stand, all governments serve a very simple purpose. It can be personified in a quote by P.J. O'rourke. He was actually referring to the US senate, but it pretty much stands for all governments.
"The founding fathers, in their infinite wisdom, created a means for us to take 99 of our most prominent numbskulls, and get them out of the private sector where they might do actual harm."
Post by: ZBixby on 19 Jan 2012, 03:33
I have a good feeling about this upcoming arc.
I am right there with you, I've been wanting Hanners to have a story driven arc for a while now, silliness awaits, no drama for a little bit please and thank you! :D
Post by: jwhouk on 19 Jan 2012, 04:10
. (https://www.google.com/landing/takeaction/) - 7 (24.1%)
. (https://www.google.com/landing/takeaction/) - 22 (75.9%)
Total Voters: 29
Post by: AnAverageWriter on 19 Jan 2012, 04:16
I have a good feeling about this upcoming arc.
I am right there with you, I've been wanting Hanners to have a story driven arc for a while now, silliness awaits, no drama for a little bit please and thank you! :D
Right on!
Let's have some funny for a while.
Post by: jwhouk on 19 Jan 2012, 04:21
It's gonna be HILARIOUS!
Post by: Sorflakne on 19 Jan 2012, 05:01
Post by: Milesb on 19 Jan 2012, 05:03
Post by: jwhouk on 19 Jan 2012, 05:15
Not that I think it's gonna matter, of course.
Post by: mike837go on 19 Jan 2012, 05:20
But I am also hoping Jeph does something mysterious. Like the character Wilson for Tim Allen's Home Improvement series.
Post by: Harlequin on 19 Jan 2012, 05:43
Post by: lepetitfromage on 19 Jan 2012, 06:06
I am trembling under the stress of holding back a more than misplaced Barney-Stinson-routine here...
ha! +1 for you. this made me ridiculously happy.
Post by: Carl-E on 19 Jan 2012, 06:18
?
. (https://www.google.com/landing/takeaction/) - 7 (24.1%)
. (https://www.google.com/landing/takeaction/) - 22 (75.9%)
Total Voters: 29
That's amazingly one-sided.
Post by: Welu on 19 Jan 2012, 06:29
Post by: DSL on 19 Jan 2012, 07:18
Has anyone else ever speculated on the real life version of Hanners' haircut?
There's a fan art digital painting (http://harpo-exe.deviantart.com/art/Hannelore-Ellicott-Chatham-182599692) that just has it kind of uncombed-looking. Me, I imagine it poofy and static-y from too much antibacterial shampooing. Or maybe like she changed her mind halfway through a bad perm.
Post by: mike837go on 19 Jan 2012, 07:59
There's been too much story time passed for it to be anything other than deliberate. Hanners and her mom have the same kind of hair. (Honey blonde, cut fairly short) But when Beatrice got out of the limo, every folicle was in it's proper place.Has anyone else ever speculated on the real life version of Hanners' haircut?
There's a fan art digital painting (http://harpo-exe.deviantart.com/art/Hannelore-Ellicott-Chatham-182599692) that just has it kind of uncombed-looking. Me, I imagine it poofy and static-y from too much antibacterial shampooing. Or maybe like she changed her mind halfway through a bad perm.
Hanners keeps her hair unkempt-looking as part of her rebel persona.
Post by: Welu on 19 Jan 2012, 08:18
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 19 Jan 2012, 08:47
Post by: ChaosWolf on 19 Jan 2012, 09:37
- butts in space?
SPACEBUTTS SPACEBUTTS SPACEBUTTS SPACEBUTTS
To quote the wisdom of Crow T. Robot: "...turns out it's not funny at all when you fart in a spacesuit..."
Post by: Omega Entity on 19 Jan 2012, 09:57
Hanner's hair has always been naturally poofy. I can't find it but I'm sure there's a comic she just brushed her hair or took off a hat and it poofs back up in the next panel.
I just came across that one the other day. Dora had been brushing it into a semblance of order while Hanners was talking to Marten, andDora was holding it in place with her hands. Once she let go, however - poof! Jeph had also made a comment about how unmanageable it was in the accompanying newspost.
EDIT: Found it! http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=942 . I got it a little backwards - it went poof when Dora covered her ears after it was brushed. I imagine that Hanner's hair is just really thick. Mine is really thick, and I know that when I have it short, it takes a -lot- of effort and product to keep it under control. It can be done, but I usually just don't bother.
Post by: Earin on 19 Jan 2012, 10:58
Are Marten and Marigold about to to take a trip?
Space-shipping!
Post by: Welu on 19 Jan 2012, 11:12
Hanner's hair has always been naturally poofy. I can't find it but I'm sure there's a comic she just brushed her hair or took off a hat and it poofs back up in the next panel.
I just came across that one the other day. Dora had been brushing it into a semblance of order while Hanners was talking to Marten, andDora was holding it in place with her hands. Once she let go, however - poof! Jeph had also made a comment about how unmanageable it was in the accompanying newspost.
EDIT: Found it! http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=942 . I got it a little backwards - it went poof when Dora covered her ears after it was brushed. I imagine that Hanner's hair is just really thick. Mine is really thick, and I know that when I have it short, it takes a -lot- of effort and product to keep it under control. It can be done, but I usually just don't bother.
Cheers for finding it! I was looking past the 1000 count so would have never found it. Jeph says below it "Her hair sure is stubborn!" so yeah, probably is just really thick.
Post by: raoullefere on 19 Jan 2012, 12:23
I do hope we see Hannerdad too.Given his paranoia, I'm wondering if Hannelore's father will go further simply put in a 'Charlie' - type appearance (a speaker). For that matter, he could interact through some sort of AnthroPC substitute (like Momo's new chassis or the BFbot), and Marten, Marigold (and us) only learn of this after the fact. That would also be much simpler than hauling people up to his space station or coming down to earth (something I'd say he could no longer do if Hanners didn't seem to be free of physical maladies from growing up in low-g).
But I am also hoping Jeph does something mysterious. Like the character Wilson for Tim Allen's Home Improvement series.
Post by: ecstaticjoy on 19 Jan 2012, 16:25
Post by: carg1 on 19 Jan 2012, 16:30
Post by: carg1 on 19 Jan 2012, 16:33
SWEET!
Premature post...this usually doesn't happen, I swear...Anyway, I was hoping it'd go to Hanners. And I now want "What A Fool Believes" to be my ringtone. Seriously.
Post by: SomeCanadianWeirdo on 19 Jan 2012, 18:28
Post by: Carl-E on 19 Jan 2012, 19:11
When I used to go skiing in high school, they had doobie brothers albums on what seemed to be an endless loop at the lifts... I can't hear any of their stuff without thinking of lots of deep snow.
Post by: jwhouk on 19 Jan 2012, 19:56
Post by: Salad_Is_Murder on 19 Jan 2012, 20:24
Post by: WAYF on 19 Jan 2012, 20:47
Post by: celticgeek on 19 Jan 2012, 20:48
Post by: jwhouk on 19 Jan 2012, 20:50
I would have reacted in exactly the same way. ;D
x100,000.
Post by:
Post by: jwhouk on 19 Jan 2012, 20:55
This is QC "growing the beard".
Post by: iduguphergrave on 19 Jan 2012, 20:56
Quote from: Jeph
Marten wants to go to space to escape his FEELINGS.
No, Jeph, Marten wants to go to space because it's fucking SPACE.
/space
Post by: akronnick on 19 Jan 2012, 20:58
ON A SPACE STATION!!!!!
...is your girlfriend moving to California really that big of a deal breaker?
I mean, people have long-distance relationship even in our non-accessible space travel real world, and they make it work...
I'm just sayin'.
Post by: truestatic on 19 Jan 2012, 21:06
Hm, a trip to space you don't say. I don't know, sounds awfully sketchy, and you know my schedule is just booked right up.
HONESTLY HANNERS, ITS FUCKING SPACE. WHAT DO YOU THINK.
Post by: Near Lurker on 19 Jan 2012, 21:14
OK, so, in a world where your upstairs neighbor can just casually invite you to her father's birthday party...
ON A SPACE STATION!!!!!
...is your girlfriend moving to California really that big of a deal breaker?
I mean, people have long-distance relationship even in our non-accessible space travel real world, and they make it work...
I'm just sayin'.
I get the feeling it's not a thing he could do every day, even if it's a bit easier than in reality. (There is not a chance in hell a weed like Marten or someone as overweight as Marigold would get into space in our world...)
Post by: RyanW1019 on 19 Jan 2012, 21:17
/nerdsquee
Also I love how Hannelore looks now.
Post by: Sorflakne on 19 Jan 2012, 21:23
It makes one wonder if some of the bustier female astronauts wear sports bras on the ISS to hold back the new-found freedom...
Post by: akronnick on 19 Jan 2012, 21:40
I get the feeling it's not a thing he could do every day, even if it's a bit easier than in reality. (There is not a chance in hell a weed like Marten or someone as overweight as Marigold would get into space in our world...)
Do you have any idea how much harder it is to get to space than it is to get to California?
Post by: jwhouk on 19 Jan 2012, 22:03
Unless, of course, Hannerdad has a space elevator located somewhere nearby.
Post by: Method of Madness on 19 Jan 2012, 22:07
Post by: musicalsoul on 19 Jan 2012, 22:09
I get the feeling it's not a thing he could do every day, even if it's a bit easier than in reality. (There is not a chance in hell a weed like Marten or someone as overweight as Marigold would get into space in our world...)
You think Marigold is overweight? I mean... she's not super skinny like Dora, but I wouldn't call her overweight. Curvy maybe.
Post by: ChaosWolf on 19 Jan 2012, 22:30
Large boobs free of the restraining bonds of gravity...
GLORIOUS.
Post by: Carl-E on 19 Jan 2012, 22:33
Post by: The Seldom Killer on 19 Jan 2012, 22:39
I'll just nip this in the bud right now - this is NOT QC "jumping the shark."
This is QC "growing the beard".
(http://dorkshelf.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/bearded-shark.jpg)
Post by: Tova on 19 Jan 2012, 22:56
Post by: ZBixby on 19 Jan 2012, 23:21
I'll just nip this in the bud right now - this is NOT QC "jumping the shark."
This is QC "growing the beard".
(http://dorkshelf.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/bearded-shark.jpg)
Jumping the bearded shark is 10 types of awesome.
Post by: akronnick on 19 Jan 2012, 23:29
Post by: WAYF on 19 Jan 2012, 23:30
I'll just nip this in the bud right now - this is NOT QC "jumping the shark."
This is QC "growing the beard".
BOOOOOOOOO. SOMETHING THAT WE WANTED TO HAPPEN IS HAPPENING. THIS IS VERY BAD FOR SOME UNSPECIFIED REASON. I AM NEVER COMING BACK HERE AGAIN BECAUSE QC DOING WHAT I WANTED IT TO HAS MADE IT LOSE ALL ITS COOLNESS SOMEHOW.
Nah, I mean, Jeph has got keeping us on our toes down to a fine art, but when it comes down to it, he has delivered on many of our predictions expectations, like Padma and Marten getting together (even for those who predicted it would be ill-fated), and Faye managing to get over her insecurities with Angus.
The fact that this particular prediction involves space just makes it cool, not shark-jumpy. After all, nobody really seems to complain about Hanners (and her dad) living or having lived in space. Therefore, complaining about it now that it looks like we're going to be visiting him is more like complaining that the comic jumped the shark when Faye went to visit her family in Savannah.
Post by: Blackjoker on 19 Jan 2012, 23:31
Post by: Dr. ROFLPWN on 19 Jan 2012, 23:40
Your attempt is a resounding failure. No one appreciates Portal 2 quotes. What is wrong with you, everyone has already played that goddamn game. If you quote the Space Core even one more time--
Marigold: Put the (boob gravity) system on trial...IN SPACE.
God. Damnit. That's it. We're cancelling QC. Look what your careless hands have wrought.
Post by: pwhodges on 20 Jan 2012, 00:11
I suspect that Jeph will skate over the practicalities of the journey and the fundamentals of the station anyway to concentrate on views and weirdness.
As for jumping the shark - a few people on this forum accused Jeph of that years ago. It's no more than a stupid way of saying they don't like something:
Quote from: Jeph Jacques (twitter)
Eagerly looking forward to more idiotic "QC has jumped the shark" comments on this next story
Post by: iduguphergrave on 20 Jan 2012, 00:12
(http://i.imgur.com/9PN5W.png) (http://imgur.com/9PN5W)
FORESHADOWING??
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 20 Jan 2012, 00:45
As a direct result he's going into space.
Post by: AnAverageWriter on 20 Jan 2012, 01:02
Star Wars reference.
D'Oh.
Post by: Exar_Kun on 20 Jan 2012, 01:06
HOLY CRAP YOU GUYS
FORESHADOWING??
I'm calling it right now, Marten wins a Grammy.
Post by: steveh11 on 20 Jan 2012, 01:33
Also, I'd fiorgotten that great shot of Marten in the space suit... ;)
Post by: jwhouk on 20 Jan 2012, 02:15
Just as I planned (mu-wah-ha-HAAAA) - 6 (10%)
But... how are they gonna get UP there? - 10 (16.7%)
...and why the blood sample? - 1 (1.7%)
You KNOW Clinton's gonna try to horn in on this. - 18 (30%)
And Momo. - 3 (5%)
And Pintsize. (shudder) - 1 (1.7%)
Does this mean we see the Robot Hamster? - 1 (1.7%)
Truth: he's actually living in a retirement home in Bermuda. - 5 (8.3%)
Or is that Australia? - 1 (1.7%)
So THAT'S whose Space Shuttle Sweet Tits stole. - 12 (20%)
Waffles for everyone! Yay! - 2 (3.3%)
Total Voters: 60
Post by: pwhodges on 20 Jan 2012, 02:50
PS: Slide rules are there, too!
Post by: WAYF on 20 Jan 2012, 03:08
I don't live in the U.S, but seeing so many websites show their protestations like this was oddly heartwarming.
Post by: TinPenguin on 20 Jan 2012, 03:36
Well, if you want to get to space, you generally have to get to either Florida (Kennedy SC), New Mexico (NM Space Facility) or California (Edwards AFB).
Maybe they will fly from California and on the way back Marten will think "Hey, why don't I go see Padma?" and she'll be all "Woah, what are you doing here?" and he'll be all "Hey, sorry I couldn't come round on that last night, I was too busy GOING TO SPACE" which would technically be a lie but who cares it would sound pretty cool.
Post by: jwhouk on 20 Jan 2012, 05:27
Post by: Border Reiver on 20 Jan 2012, 05:38
Then I read Jeph's comment; "Marten wants to go to space to escape his FEELINGS. Marigold wants to go to space to escape BOOB GRAVITY. "
then I thought, "and you say that like its a bad thing.."
Jeph - take me away! The rest of the forum and a few others might want to come along though.
Post by: AnAverageWriter on 20 Jan 2012, 05:39
In ours, when a breakup happens, we just end up moping for a week and possibly get very, very drunk.
In the QCVerse, we get to GO TO SPACE.
Rather envious of this fact, am I. Jeph has created quite a world for his characters to live in.
Post by: SomeCanadianWeirdo on 20 Jan 2012, 06:03
Now that I've buzzkilled everyone, i have to say that I like the fact Marigold is apparently eatiing Cookie Master cookies. How cool is that name? If they're called Cookie Master they must be really good. Or bottom of the barrel generic cookies, which sometimes you want.
Post by: AnAverageWriter on 20 Jan 2012, 06:30
Just watch. The big 50 % of fandom disappointing plot development will be that the "space station" is actually in an abandoned amusement park in New Jersey, and what Hannelore thought was her childhood in space was all a clever VR creation.
"Sure, we're almost to the launch site, we just have to make one little stopoff first, kids!" (http://silenthill.wikia.com/wiki/Lakeside_Amusement_Park)
Hey, it would explain Hanner's familiarity with Eldritch horrors...
Post by: mike837go on 20 Jan 2012, 06:33
... i have to say that I like the fact Marigold is apparently eatiing Cookie Master cookies. How cool is that name? If they're called Cookie Master they must be really good. Or bottom of the barrel generic cookies, which sometimes you want.
After the homemade cookie fiasco, http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2092 (http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2092) I think she's gonna stay with store-bought.
Post by: Milesb on 20 Jan 2012, 06:36
I'm just looking forward to seeing the obligatory "Let's look out the window at Earth" moment. =)
This could be some pretty cool perspective based character development. Very clichéd but the old "Looking down on Earth, I realized..." moments would be outside of anything we've seen a QC character experience.
If this is does turn out as a character development arc then I'm glad it's in a new setting and splits up the old status quo Marten/Faye/Dora/Steve drama supergroup. Now for something completely different.
Also: Clinton Clinton Clinton. He's gonna have managed to weasel his way into it somehow.
Post by: Mad Cat on 20 Jan 2012, 06:49
Post by: Welu on 20 Jan 2012, 06:52
Post by: Milesb on 20 Jan 2012, 07:41
Post by: Kugai on 20 Jan 2012, 10:48
Marten and Marigold are going to meet the Vorlons :-D
Or is it a case of "Open the Pod Bay Doors please Pintsize."?
Post by: Loki on 20 Jan 2012, 12:09
I do hope we see Hannerdad too.I would like him to greet them the Matrix Architect style (http://www.matrix-architekt.de/bilder/desktop/derarchitekt.jpg).
But I am also hoping Jeph does something mysterious. Like the character Wilson for Tim Allen's Home Improvement series.
Edit:
Quote
and everybody is throwing him a big party up at the stationHuh. I wonder who "everybody" is. Hannerdad doesn't sound like a guy with a tremendous amount of friends.
I am also intrigued by the perspective that this is the first time we are going to see Hanners in an environment which she knows incredibly much more about in regards of norms, proper behavior etc than her "normal" friends (unless you count her mastery of ending messes. (http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20090831192333/questionablecontent/images/b/b8/Qc-messes-print.jpg))
Post by: TinPenguin on 20 Jan 2012, 13:16
Quoteand everybody is throwing him a big party up at the stationHuh. I wonder who "everybody" is.
The toaster, the washing machine and the air-conditioning system.
Post by: specter177 on 20 Jan 2012, 13:18
Post by: SomeCanadianWeirdo on 20 Jan 2012, 13:50
Post by: Milesb on 20 Jan 2012, 14:07
Post by: StevenC on 20 Jan 2012, 14:10
So, we're finally gonna get to see Hannerdad on the Hannerstation.
Tune in next week, same Hannerstime, same Hannerschannel!
Post by: gprimr1 on 20 Jan 2012, 16:41
Post by: Sorflakne on 20 Jan 2012, 16:44
Post by: Smiling Hobo on 20 Jan 2012, 17:31
Definitely happening.
Maybe.
OK, probably not.
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 20 Jan 2012, 19:38
Post by: jwhouk on 20 Jan 2012, 20:04
Faye points out the obvious: you both had feelings for each other. - 0 (0%)
What was I supposed to do? (Oh, I dunno, BE DECENT about it?) - 0 (0%)
She was leaving. (You could have at LEAST said you tried.) - 0 (0%)
Yeah, all that got you was your entire current life. - 2 (4%)
It IS a waste, because you're WASTING it. - 3 (6%)
You just owned me there... - 1 (2%)
Being passive is his nature. - 0 (0%)
You gotta DO Stuff. - 1 (2%)
...break out the guitar. - 0 (0%)
SOPA SUCKS. - 7 (14%)
Pintsize apologizes. - 1 (2%)
Pintsize was in MEXICO! - 0 (0%)
McPedro and Choo-Choo Bear! - 0 (0%)
Hannerdad's havin' a birthday! - 3 (6%)
Can I bring Marten & Marigold? - 3 (6%)
I KNOW Marten's safe. - 0 (0%)
Marigold.... (FRRRRT) - 4 (8%)
I'm PRETTY SURE she's not a secret robot. - 4 (8%)
I have a question for you guys... - 0 (0%)
See, it's my dad's birthday next week... - 0 (0%)
Dad also said I could bring some friends with me... - 0 (0%)
YES - 21 (42%)
Total Voters: 50
Post by: Akima on 20 Jan 2012, 20:12
Well, if you want to get to space, you generally have to get to either Florida (Kennedy SC), New Mexico (NM Space Facility) or California (Edwards AFB).These days, you'll have more luck at Baikonur (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baikonur_Cosmodrome) or Jiǔquán (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jiuquan_Satellite_Launch_Center) :-D but who wouldn't jump at the chance to get into space? But Marigold will need to stop spraying crumbs around.
I am also intrigued by the perspective that this is the first time we are going to see Hanners in an environment which she knows incredibly much more about in regards of norms, proper behavior etc than her "normal" friends (unless you count her mastery of ending messes. (http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20090831192333/questionablecontent/images/b/b8/Qc-messes-print.jpg))I speculated about that in the fanart thread some time ago (http://forums.questionablecontent.net/index.php/topic,4954.msg1038485.html#msg1038485), so I won't post the image again here. This may make me the first to put a QC cast-member IN SPACE!!!
Post by: Wreck Smurfy on 20 Jan 2012, 20:54
Tune in next week, same Hannerstime, same Hannerschannel!
I'd like to say that never gets old, until I remember I watched the original broadcast. :-(
But hey, sign me up for a TRIP TO LOW EARTH ORBIT! Marten will be within about 300 miles of his latest sweetie every 90 minutes or so.
Post by: akronnick on 20 Jan 2012, 21:24
An object in orbit around the Earth stays in the same plane relative to the distant stars, but the Earth continues to rotate on its axis, so a spacecraft in low Earth orbit only passes over a fixed point on the Earths surface twice a day.
Post by: Skewbrow on 20 Jan 2012, 22:06
Hmm. For example, the orbit could be in Earth's equatorial plane. In that case you actually would see the same parts of Earth's surface every 90 minutes, because the spacecraft would always be above the equator.
If the plane of the orbit is at a non-zero angle with respect to the equatorial plane, then that angle also equals the maximum latitude [edit]North and South[/edit] of the locations you are gonna pass over. Akronnick is correct in pointing out that the longitudes of the most Northern point along the orbit would vary due to Earth's rotation.
</math_teacher>
Post by: idontunderstand on 21 Jan 2012, 01:44
Post by: iduguphergrave on 21 Jan 2012, 02:56
Post by: Milesb on 21 Jan 2012, 03:02
I always thought puppies were playful.
Post by: jwhouk on 21 Jan 2012, 03:27
Post by: steveb on 21 Jan 2012, 08:39
In my humble opinion, I think this is a great idea as Jeph needs to experiment and fool around for a while. The arc these last weeks has, to me, had a slightly predestined feeling, like it was something he had thought out beforehand, got bored with and in the end just kind of... needed to get out of the way. I mean, it hasn't been as playful as usual. Just a feeling.
I know what you mean but I also think the arc was important from a story point of view.
Marten now has some history between himself and the Dora relationship which takes some of the emotional energy out of the way so he is no longer avoiding CoD. He has made some debatable decisions in the process which helps to show him a realistically flawed character as well as an unlucky one. In the process he has become motivated to take a look at his life and how he might want it to change. All of this bodes well for the future.
Post by: Carl-E on 21 Jan 2012, 12:35
Thanks!
Post by: DSL on 21 Jan 2012, 15:38
I'll just nip this in the bud right now - this is NOT QC "jumping the shark."
This is QC "growing the beard".
(http://dorkshelf.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/bearded-shark.jpg)
Jumping the bearded shark is 10 types of awesome.
Afraid to ask ... who do the remoras signify?
Post by: Overkillengine on 21 Jan 2012, 15:52
I'll just nip this in the bud right now - this is NOT QC "jumping the shark."
This is QC "growing the beard".
(http://dorkshelf.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/bearded-shark.jpg)
Jumping the bearded shark is 10 types of awesome.
Afraid to ask ... who do the remoras signify?
Shippers. :roll:
Post by: Kugai on 21 Jan 2012, 15:58
I'll just nip this in the bud right now - this is NOT QC "jumping the shark."
This is QC "growing the beard".
(http://dorkshelf.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/bearded-shark.jpg)
Jumping the bearded shark is 10 types of awesome.
Afraid to ask ... who do the remoras signify?
Shippers. :roll:
:-P
Post by: idontunderstand on 22 Jan 2012, 01:54
In my humble opinion, I think this is a great idea as Jeph needs to experiment and fool around for a while. The arc these last weeks has, to me, had a slightly predestined feeling, like it was something he had thought out beforehand, got bored with and in the end just kind of... needed to get out of the way. I mean, it hasn't been as playful as usual. Just a feeling.
I know what you mean but I also think the arc was important from a story point of view.
Marten now has some history between himself and the Dora relationship which takes some of the emotional energy out of the way so he is no longer avoiding CoD. He has made some debatable decisions in the process which helps to show him a realistically flawed character as well as an unlucky one. In the process he has become motivated to take a look at his life and how he might want it to change. All of this bodes well for the future.
Completely agreed. Maybe it was just me who got bored with it in the end.. :-D