I still think this is a trap. They knew about Pate and how he controls someone more powerful than Alice so they scheme to get him to leave Earth with his bodyguard and unwilling companions and once they've reached the habitat they'll do something to nullify their powers or quite possibly use a device that directs their vessel away from Earth.
I still think this is a trap. They knew about Pate and how he controls someone more powerful than Alice so they scheme to get him to leave Earth with his bodyguard and unwilling companions and once they've reached the habitat they'll do something to nullify their powers or quite possibly use a device that directs their vessel away from Earth.
I can't see the Praeses being able to know that much about Earth. If they were powerful enough to know all that, and sinister enough to make such bold and devious plans, they wouldn't have been content to hang around babysitting space humans for 5000 years.
The guy who did the Blink, now that thing is intelligent. But I think the Praeses are just babysitters.
They may well have been bored and curious, though. And then sent Ardent and Gavia along to find out more about Earth, which they otherwise can't observe in detail.
^ Yup! Church didn't move. He just arrived.
Pate implies that Alice and Mr Church aren't so greatly different in their capabilities, in that he suggests the two of them break open the bunker together. If Mr Church was so much more capable than Alice it would be pointless for her to help him. So it seems that although Mr Church may be in some ways superior to Alice, he is still the same class of being.
Sounds like Alice's brilliant plan to run away wouldn't have worked very well; how do you run from something capable of near-infinite speed?
Alice, as powerful as she is, has never struck me as particularly smart. She's going to have to outthink Pate/Church if she wants to get out of this. The key would have to be understanding whatever hold Pate has over Church. Mere force won't get you anywhere in this situation, and that's not a place Alice is familiar with.
One thing that was interesting was the threat that Pate chose to make. Did he suspect that Alice would rather die than help him, so a threat against one of her charges was the only way to intimidate her? Or is it possible that, unlike Sedna, Alice really is practically indestructible, even for a being of Mr Church's abilities?
I want rocks to fall on this bastard
I'm still curious about what control Pate has over Church.Maybe none. Maybe he just pays Church's salary, and they talk a lot, so Church knows what Pate needs.
Even Church must have limitations, otherwise there would be no story to tell.I know it won't happen. But, I would be very lit-geeked if it turns out that Church is the main, or most important, character.
When I first saw it I thought it was bonus Alice Grove strip until I read it. And why would I make that mistake? Because in a black and white sketch Roko resembles Alice which makes me think that she is the AI that will eventually evolve into Alice, not Bubbles.
I'm still curious about what control Pate has over Church. We've never seen him give an order so he may have some kind of telepathic control over Church. Consider what just happened when Alice went to kill Pate. Church grabbed her arm, but didn't crush it like he did Sedna's shoulder. Even if Pate would intricately explained every single detail of his plans to Church to prevent a misunderstanding this would still make improvising impossible when things don't go accordingly.
He harmed Sedna without being attacked, though.
I had a completely opposite hypothesis about Church: what if he's not really a separate being? What if he's a telepathic projection of Pate's? That would explain the instantaneous motion, and the lack of any need for communication. it would also explain his being indestructible.
I'm still curious about what control Pate has over Church. We've never seen him give an order so he may have some kind of telepathic control over Church. Consider what just happened when Alice went to kill Pate. Church grabbed her arm, but didn't crush it like he did Sedna's shoulder. Even if Pate would intricately explained every single detail of his plans to Church to prevent a misunderstanding this would still make improvising impossible when things don't go accordingly.
Assuming Church is under Pate's control, the simplest order set, expressed during or before the carriage ride, would be something like:
1.) Protect me.
2.) If possible, do not kill the other soldiers.
3.) Do not harm anyone else, unless you're attacked.
I suppose 2 and 3 could be reversed, but this gets you the behavior we've seen so far. Pate says to Alice, "You will do exactly as I say from now on, or I will allow Mr. Church to indulge himself further, at your personal expense." Church enjoys killing, but is restricted from doing so unless he's attacked or instructed. That's why you get the ear-to-ear grin (http://www.alicegrove.com/post/152175316869/bravery) when Ellie hits him with the pipe - he's literally thrilled that she did that, because now he's "under attack" and therefore permitted to indulge himself.
He harmed Sedna without being attacked, though.To a much more limited extent, and with a very different disposition. He dismembered Ellie with glee. With Sedna, he did the bare minimum to neutralize her as a threat, with perfectly flat affect.
That was a second-tier attempt to restrain her. She had ignored the clear warning when he put his hand on her shoulder (a first-tier attempt) and her continued violent behaviour released him to use... stronger measures to enforce the behaviour restrictions on her specified by his commander.What he said.
Besides, I think if it were possible for Church to 'port, I think Pate would have used him long ago to take him for his little chat with the Praeses
... Lurch ...
It's close enough and we all know what they mean, what's the issue?
... Lurch ...
Do you have any reason for calling Church "Lurch", or do you simply prefer not to use the name that his creator bestowed on him and which everyone else uses? (And does this relate to your appearing to query the name "Corpse Witch" in the other comic?)
... Lurch ...
Do you have any reason for calling Church "Lurch", or do you simply prefer not to use the name that his creator bestowed on him and which everyone else uses? (And does this relate to your appearing to query the name "Corpse Witch" in the other comic?)
It's .... a joke. You can feel quite free to block me so you can be spared any more of my attempts at humor.
And I don't understand your second question and feel like it's off topic here. You don't care for me or my posts, it seems. It's all good. The block button is a handy device.We're forgetting something.
The blink happened thousands of years ago. Just like Alice has been around all that time, Mr. Church has to have been too. And he certainly wasn't under Pate's control all that time.
This suggests two possibilities:
1.) Church has some limitation or throttling that compels him to either have a master or need to collaborate to accomplish what he wants to accomplish, and moves from partnership to partnership as the other parties age/die, or
2.) Pate came into possession of him somehow. For example, maybe he was deactivated and stored, and Pate discovered him, and was able to adjust his programming in some way before activating him.
I like possibility #2. It also fits well with Pate's archaeological endeavors. I'll bet he's found more than a couple interesting and useful curiosities.
I think it is almost certainly option #2. Without his glasses, Pate looks much younger than when he first appeared. Unless he really is an AI or an enhanced human, there's nothing much about him, physically, that seems to scream "Choose me as your leader!" Yet people follow him unquestioningly. If he inherited Lurch somehow, then that would be a huge motivator for people to obey him and for his man to stay at his side and do his bidding.
Possibility #2 sounds very likely. It may even be hinted at here (http://www.alicegrove.com/image/150545067644), where Mr. Church is shown looking at Pate as he talks about the power that may be obtained from those archeological endeavors.
Incidentally, unless I'm mistaken, Church has never spoken since he's arrived. If he is a revived AI or something from millennia ago, then that would make sense. If he's only recently been revived, he might not speak the language that everyone else there speaks. Languages change drastically over the course of thousands of years, particularly in this scenario where communication over long distances appears to be limited.
Pate has gone to some trouble to procure Alice's help, so I can only assume either that Church cannot in fact get through that barrier without repercussions or at least some degree of risk to himself, or that Pate needs Alice's help with whatever he expects to find down there.
I'm guessing Ellie's gruesome death must be general knowledge by now, meaning the crowd of bystanders at the top of the pit must know that Pate/Church did it. Given that Ellie was running the dig, she must have been an important person in this community. Wouldn't at least some local folks be upset at her outright murder? Is Pate so certain that there's nobody with a rifle and sight up there? True, they couldn't get Church. But if Pate is baseline, then a bullet will take him out, and Church hasn't shown he's fast enough to stop one.Remember that these people are technologically just about turn-of-last-century*. Alice is a witch, and Gavia and Church are demons. Doesn't mean there won't be a brave soul willing to take a shot at a demon-master, but it's probably not as clear cut an option as it would be to someone with a 2016 level of understanding.
I'm guessing Ellie's gruesome death must be general knowledge by now, meaning the crowd of bystanders at the top of the pit must know that Pate/Church did it. Given that Ellie was running the dig, she must have been an important person in this community. Wouldn't at least some local folks be upset at her outright murder? Is Pate so certain that there's nobody with a rifle and sight up there? True, they couldn't get Church. But if Pate is baseline, then a bullet will take him out, and Church hasn't shown he's fast enough to stop one.
Also, both Church and Pate have turned their backs to Alice, yet she makes no attempt to take advantage of that. She has, for now, given up.
She's biding her time whilst trying to work out a plan.
Also, both Church and Pate have turned their backs to Alice, yet she makes no attempt to take advantage of that. She has, for now, given up.
If Church were asked why he's working for Pate, I suspect that his response will be one word: 'Order'. Pate stands for a restoration of strong, intrusive and controlling government, something for which Church was made to protect. He may (if he is talkative) reproach Alice and Sedna for forgetting their 'directives' in this area.
Alice punching her way in may be just Jeph running with the joke. And probably also to show the locals who's the boss. It might also be an opportunity to size up Alice's abilities so that Mr Church has a better idea what he is up against this time (assuming Pate does not have perfect intelligence on Alice already).
Stepping back a bit, I have to ask - why is everyone assuming Pate is baseline?
As far as I have seen there is nothing pointing either yay or nay.
Even if a sociopath he either has 100% trust in churches abilities (doubtful) or knows that he was in no personal danger in the first place.
If he was then there would be a #3) Pate was Churches commander before the blink.
Officer types don't need the firepower of front line combat units, just the survival ability and much better strategic and tactical skills.
As for the counter question, but Alice didn't recognize him as a Church level threat. Maybe she didn't have much, if any interaction with the officer types, or they are very difficult to differentiate from baseline except under extreme circumstances like being shot in the face at point blank. (man that would sting)
Or to put it in the words of (the slightly altered) MST3K: "If you're wondering how they eat and breath And other science facts, Just repeat to yourself "It's just a comic, I should really just relax."I should really just relax, but I have a pedantic need to correct your "breath" (a noun, rhymes with death) to "breathe", (a verb, rhymes with "seethe"). Joel and the bots would point at me and laugh.
Pate was Churches commander before the blink.
Officer types don't need the firepower of front line combat units, just the survival ability and much better strategic and tactical skills.
As for the counter question, but Alice didn't recognize him as a Church level threat. Maybe she didn't have much, if any interaction with the officer types, or they are very difficult to differentiate from baseline except under extreme circumstances
Stepping back a bit, I have to ask - why is everyone assuming Pate is baseline?
There is no reason to assume Pate is anything other than a baseline human though, either.
I like the lack of a 'BAM', indicating the casual apathy of the action.
Stepping back a bit, I have to ask - why is everyone assuming Pate is baseline?
As far as I have seen there is nothing pointing either yay or nay.
Those could be part of a ruse to conceal whatever enhancements he has.
@BenRG, but wasn't Sideous confirmed as one of the most powerful Sith ever? Yeah, Vader was bad ass but he also couldn't exist outside the suit. Palps was weakened by the Force Lightning blast, but not as much as Anakin? I thought?
Still crossing my fingers that this doesn't turn into "Ardent Single-Handedly Saves The Day And Gets The Girl", though.
Ardent doesn't want to get "the girl" - he wants to get all the girls!
(Disclaimer - my avatar on my other main forum is currently Ardent from today's comic.)
Alice and Sedna are not nice people.
Sedna did not punch the carriage as hard as Alice punched the bunker. Why?She didn't have to.
Alice and Sedna are not nice people.
For reference:
(http://i67.tinypic.com/2gxfgr7.png)
Re Church "choosing" to kill Ellie from a fair is fair perspective we have to remember that Ellie was most definitely trying to kill Church and did not know he was an android. She hit him in the head with a thick metal bar so hard it bent. That blow would have easily fatally crushed the skull of any human being. And why was she trying to kill hiim? For stopping the violent destruction of his bosses property. Ellie was trying to *kill* him for doing his job.
There's more to the moral calculus here than "innocent Ellie got killed by the murder bot". If you are trying to eat the bear and the bear eats you that's what happens sometimes.
Also Sedna hardly seems to be a position to be pontificating about "choice". Recall that just a little bit ago she was peppering human bystanders to Alice with live ammo. If Gavia had not had a shield they would all be dead from bullet wounds.
New here, first post. Whee. I like this comic; it's grown on me a lot since it first started.
I did want to say, I'm glad to see Sedna not severely disabled forever, or incapacitated by feelings of failure. Church's presence has a bit of a Hollywood vibe, so it's nice to see the usual set of cliches not being followed exactly.
Still crossing my fingers that this doesn't turn into "Ardent Single-Handedly Saves The Day And Gets The Girl", though.
(And, err, not sure if this is the place for such comments. Hope I'm not goofing up already...)
In the third Terminator movieWhat are you talking about? Everyone knows there were only two.
It's more likely that she was looking for chemical contaminants.I was just thinking water and mud leaking in from outside.
I would think the radioactivity would diminish over the millennia, but this could be an advanced form of it or perhaps whatever is down there was buried under tons of concrete because it's just highly toxic waste. Pate isn't completely certain what's down there.Just a reminder on the subject of Radioactivity and it diminishing over time.
Or it's a code phrase and she wasn't talking to Pate at all, but signalling Sedna.
Also none of them wear glasses, Pate does. I think this would imply that being non-baseline carries with it a basic level of feature correction before whatever augmentation is added.In fact, Pate wears glowing glasses, which like Dale's I took to be a kind of computer display.
I will shout in rage if Alice ends up, battered and on her last reserves of strength, in front of a holographic avatar of the collective of the sentient AIs that informs her that the equation has changed; the simple fact of her existence has changed it forever. She can end this crisis but she must choose which method she uses:
- DESTROY - Annihilate all post-humans and all advanced technology, including herself, Sedna, Gavia and Ardent and leave the humans in peace to remake their civilisation on their own terms;
- CONTROL - Use nano-tech to become a controlling hub for all of humanity and its children, preventing war by being the single eternal and infinite mind underlying them all; 'Alice' would cease to exist but her hopes, fears, dreams and beliefs would be the framework around which the new order is created and organised;
- SYNTHESIS - Merge all humans and post-humans into a single homogenous group sharing eachother's characteristics and being interlinked together on a fundamental level; the war will end because there would be no more differences to fight over and, to a greater or lesser extent, all will be one.