THESE FORUMS NOW CLOSED (read only)

Comic Discussion => QUESTIONABLE CONTENT => Topic started by: BenRG on 08 Jan 2017, 13:30

Title: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BenRG on 08 Jan 2017, 13:30
Okay, maybe this is how my crazy mind works but, seriously, this is the only thing that I could focus on Friday. Why is Hannelore (who, typically, seems to have a grungy personal aesthetic of sorts) wearing neat clothes and looking more formal and businesslike? There are many options but I've tried to list a wide range of potentially funny ideas above.

'Dinner with Beatrice' is the obvious continuation of the Bubbles in Peril arc as Beatrice may be able to provide some information about Corpse Witch that Station might not be able to find from legitimate sources. Additionally, Beatrice may be the necessarily ruthless mind that clues our heroes into options that, perhaps, might not automatically occur to them. "Why don't you just buy the place from under her, dear? She'd have to tell you whatever you want! Your father put some very interesting failsafe modes into AIs to prevent them from hiding critical information from their operators!" (1)

However, my real guess is some variant on option 6 - She's treating herself to going out somewhere nice for dinner and she's going to run into Brun and Elliott on a date. Much against her will, she ends up being sucked into the whole surreal experience, having to translate back and forth between the two of them so that they can come closer to understand what the other is thinking. It may even end up in a weird, bizarro-world 'Cyrano De Hanners' scenario!

What do you all think?

-------------------------------

(1) This could lead to some interesting ethical dilemmas. Would using an override code on Corpse Witch and thus forcing her to submit make them just as bad as she is?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: brasca on 08 Jan 2017, 13:45
Okay, maybe this is how my crazy mind works but, seriously, this is the only thing that I could focus on Friday. Why is Hannelore (who, typically, seems to have a grungy personal aesthetic of sorts) wearing neat clothes and looking more formal and businesslike? There are many options but I've tried to list a wide range of potentially funny ideas above.

'Dinner with Beatrice' is the obvious continuation of the Bubbles in Peril arc as Beatrice may be able to provide some information about Corpse Witch that Station might not be able to find from legitimate sources. Additionally, Beatrice may be the necessarily ruthless mind that clues our heroes into options that, perhaps, might not automatically occur to them. "Why don't you just buy the place from under her, dear? She'd have to tell you whatever you want! Your father put some very interesting failsafe modes into AIs to prevent them from hiding critical information from their operators!" (1)

However, my real guess is some variant on option 6 - She's treating herself to going out somewhere nice for dinner and she's going to run into Brun and Elliott on a date. Much against her will, she ends up being sucked into the whole surreal experience, having to translate back and forth between the two of them so that they can come closer to understand what the other is thinking. It may even end up in a weird, bizarro-world 'Cyrano De Hanners' scenario!

What do you all think?

-------------------------------

(1) This could lead to some interesting ethical dilemmas. Would using an override code on Corpse Witch and thus forcing her to submit make them just as bad as she is?

I think it could be dinner with Beatrice since her first option failed and now she's going with the less desirable one.  However, if there was a secret failsafe I think Beatrice would exploit it all the time and Hannelore would know about it.  Of course it might be interesting if that were possible since perhaps what Corpse Witch really wants is validation of all her misgivings of humanity so she might happily give up the key for the satisfaction of telling Hannelore that for all her idealistic beliefs about AIs at the end of the day she's just another master outraged that one of her servants stepped out of line.   
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Kugai on 08 Jan 2017, 15:16
Maybe she's auditioning for a Schoolmarm Role at the local Theatre
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: jwhouk on 08 Jan 2017, 18:26
Comic up.

...Notice the red eyes? Remind you of anyone?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: hedgie on 08 Jan 2017, 18:42
This is certainly an AI of wealth and taste.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: cesium133 on 08 Jan 2017, 18:42
It took me a little while to realize that wasn't Dora.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: jheartney on 08 Jan 2017, 18:43
Is Graymarm another AI? Has the coloring, but I don't see a neck seam. Or is (s)he a hologram? That would explain the sudden appearance; if Bubbles' memories look vulnerable, out pops this apparition to make vague threats.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: TheEvilDog on 08 Jan 2017, 19:02
Okay, either Slenderman is starting to franchise, or the Robot Mafia is moving into Northampton
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: WareWolf on 08 Jan 2017, 19:06
Okay, either Slenderman is starting to franchise, or the Robot Mafia is moving into Northampton

That dark suit just screams "Federal agent."
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Method of Madness on 08 Jan 2017, 19:08
More like Federal AIgent :claireface:
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Carl-E on 08 Jan 2017, 19:10
Who knew AI's had Men In Black? 
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: wlewisiii on 08 Jan 2017, 19:12
Who knew AI's had Men In Black?

More like the Kingsman scenario - super agents ala OO7 but not working for any government?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Killspree on 08 Jan 2017, 19:29
I get more of a rouge CIA vibe.
Is this where we find out more about Bubbles' team member's deaths during a covert Black Ops?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: SomeCanadianWeirdo on 08 Jan 2017, 19:52
I'm guessing FBI or NSA.  Of course in the QC universe there might be an agency specifically tasked with AIs.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: SomeCanadianWeirdo on 08 Jan 2017, 19:53
And I don't think she's a hologram.  She looks solid, unlike Station or pre-body May.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Neko_Ali on 08 Jan 2017, 20:24
Station said he was going to pass Bubble's problem around to some colleagues and that he disliked what happened enough to deploy the railguns on Corpse Witch. Since Hanners nixxed that idea, it's possible that instead he went to some sort of internal AI police. Those who serve as the agents of the super AIs that make sure everyone plays nice.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: jwhouk on 08 Jan 2017, 20:59
AI2B?

(AI's In Black?)
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: danuis on 08 Jan 2017, 21:00
Oh, hey, it's the feds....

Oh, hey, it's the feds.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Case on 08 Jan 2017, 21:07
Comic up.

...Notice the red eyes? Remind you of anyone?

Not at all ...

(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-unyGH7D2sH4/TqqdmRGnUuI/AAAAAAAAAEM/EK_pH4vNgow/s1600/blade_runner___rachel_by_maxhitman-d39c7r5.jpg)
(https://i.stack.imgur.com/MLuoP.gif)
(http://thepandorasociety.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/22-pris_eyes_glow.jpg)
(http://www.billdoskoch.ca/wp-content/uploads/2007/11/blade_runner_eyes_101218_46.jpg)
(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-_xh6t5z7A5A/VX4AxM4jnBI/AAAAAAAAAfE/Aj355YUudtg/s1600/Blade%2BRunner%2B4.jpg)
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: SpanielBear on 08 Jan 2017, 21:15
I have been reading too much Sandman, I think, as my first thought on seeing our new friend was "Oh Crap, now Desire's involved? We're all gonna burn!"

In fact, based on their dialogue thus far, I'm still not convinced we wont...
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Timemaster on 08 Jan 2017, 21:17
"They seem nice."

Jeph wrote the same thing about Mr. Pate...

TM
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: David F on 08 Jan 2017, 21:21
I have been reading too much Sandman, I think, as my first thought on seeing our new friend was "Oh Crap, now Desire's involved? We're all gonna burn!"

In fact, based on their dialogue thus far, I'm still not convinced we wont...

I also got a Sandman vibe from the last panel.  And the impression that Orbital Railgun Justice has become a best-case scenario, at least from Corpse Witch's point of view...
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: riccostar on 08 Jan 2017, 21:24
The fatal weakness of the AI is today revealed: a crippling fear of government employed vampires

Who woulda thought
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Ravenswing on 08 Jan 2017, 21:35
I'm kinda thinking that Fonzie's heading awfully fast towards that shark ...
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 08 Jan 2017, 21:44
It's got me curious.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Deadman on 08 Jan 2017, 21:54
Don't know a damn thing about them yet and I already love this character.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: MrNumbers on 08 Jan 2017, 21:58
"... This is Faye and Bubbles, right?"

"It is. Yes. You mean you didn't know? How many people have you given this speech to?"

"Today? Including you? Five."

"How many were you supposed to give it to?"

"Interesting question! Probably everyone, but only intended on you two today. You'd be surprised how many people look similar to you."

"I don't think-"

"If you don't care. I just like telling people that."

"Oh."
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: lawoot on 08 Jan 2017, 22:14
Is Graymarm another AI? Has the coloring, but I don't see a neck seam. Or is (s)he a hologram? That would explain the sudden appearance; if Bubbles' memories look vulnerable, out pops this apparition to make vague threats.

Do any other AI's speak with regular 'human' speech bubbles (i.e. not squared off)?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: brasca on 08 Jan 2017, 22:25
It took me a little while to realize that wasn't Dora.

It took me a little while to realize that wasn't Gavia.

Perhaps there are worse people to turn to than Hannelore's mother, but it still looks like out of the frying pan and into the fire.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Truec on 08 Jan 2017, 22:30
I suspect our mysterious besuited grayskin may be from the NRO (otherwise known as the people who EMPed Emily's program to help satellites make friends). (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2853)
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BenRG on 08 Jan 2017, 23:30
I'm going to go out on a limb here. Agent Alucard here is definitely human (or at least is mostly biological); the speech bubble is definitive proof of that. The pale skin and vertical slit pupils are probably an expensive personal aesthetic affectation acquired by surgical means. It's probably frowned upon by her superiors but they've found it has a positive effect on her job performance (specifically, scaring the wits out of suspects).

So, I'm thinking that the Agency has one of two objectives:
Either way, getting Bubbles' memory back is not a priority for this agency. Indeed, it's quite possible that the senior agents would be much happier if the key was lost forever. I suspect that Alucard will also cheerfully and soullessly deploy all forms of coercion (both by implied threat and explicit threat) to get Faye and Bubbles to cooperate.

I guess that the point that I'm making is that Detective Basilisk was the nice option. Now we've skipped over 'bad cop' to 'I wish I worked in 1930s Germany cop'.

This being QC, I also expect Alucard to be slightly defensive on occasion and will fall back on her love of the arts and regular charitable giving as proof that she's 'not as bad as you think'.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Shjade on 08 Jan 2017, 23:47
I have been reading too much Sandman, I think, as my first thought on seeing our new friend was "Oh Crap, now Desire's involved? We're all gonna burn!"

In fact, based on their dialogue thus far, I'm still not convinced we wont...

It's not you. "Wait, is that Desire?" was my first reaction, too. If the eyes were gold instead of red I'd be 100% sure it's at least intended as a reference.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Indicible on 08 Jan 2017, 23:54
Somehow, our new pale rider agent reminds of a sister of Boa Hancock in One Piece. Must be the eyes and the shape of the face.

In any case, the piece of excretation is about to eat the rotating ventilation device.

Too many conflicting interests here for it to end well: Bubbles wants her memories accessible, but not necessarily accessed, Corpse Witch wants Bubbles at her beck and call, Faye would very much like a job, the badgering agent (cannot remember her name) wants CW gone and maybe the rest of tbe people working at the arena detained...
In French, it is called "un sac de noeuds" (a bag of knots. Alternately, it can also be understood as a bag of dicks, because noeuds is also slang for dicks... Never mind that interpretation...).
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BenRG on 09 Jan 2017, 00:01
So, who does Agent Alucard represent? I don't think that she represents any local, state or federal agency. I can't see them tolerating such aesthetic extravagance. In any case, most Federal agencies have very limited remits and I can't see the FBI (organised crime) and the NSA (maintaining the confidentiality of 'black' projects) tolerating the other on their patch.

No, I think that she works for The Company - Ellicott-Chatham Robotics. I think that, early on in the development of the AIs, several governments across the world expressed concern about the hypothetical ability of AIs to choose a criminal lifestyle and the difficulty that human police officers would have in tackling this (on a psychological, intellectual and physical level). They made it a term of ECR's license to operate that they provide investigative and enforcement staff with the specific training and equipment to tackle AI criminals on their own level. The result were people like Alucard: Augmented investigators and enforcers.

Although she is technically a licensed private investigator and an employee of the modern world's equivalent of the Pinkerton Detective Agency, in practice, Alucard is much more. She has the ability to do almost anything it takes to stop serious AI crime; the 'proper authorities' will look the other way and even cooperate, glad to have someone on hand who has the ability to do what it takes. She has the ability to interrogate, coerce and subborn in ways that no official police force would be permitted to do. She has the right to act as judge, jury and executioner in the event of serious and life-threatening incidents. Because the authorities fear rogue AIs so much, their definition of 'life-threatening incident' is disturbingly broad.

The badge says that she is an agent of Ellicott-Chatham Robotics Special Defective Equipment Safety Division. The AIs know them by a different name.

They call them...
BLADE RUNNERS
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Mehre on 09 Jan 2017, 01:04
So i actually made account for this.

I think simplest solution is most probable. That is ms. CreepyBot is big fish or one of her enforcers. Its more likely that she is criminal than agent or law enforcer of some sort.

Also who are "they" precisely?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: The real John Smith on 09 Jan 2017, 02:21
The agent is Marten's new squeeze when Claire breaks up with him.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: TinPenguin on 09 Jan 2017, 03:12
...Notice the red eyes? Remind you of anyone?

...Bubbles?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Gyrre on 09 Jan 2017, 05:46
Infernal!
"Creepy" indeed. Though, not to be a nag, but Jeph did refer to them as 'they', so I'm guessing they're a nonbinary gender.

sidenote: a nonbinary pronoun I've seen suggested recently is 'e', with the possive form being 'es'.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Storel on 09 Jan 2017, 06:10
Why does everyone keep saying this PIB (Person In Black) has red eyes? Maybe it's just my monitor, but they look distinctly purple to me.

I don't think the absence of squared-off voice bubbles means this new person is human. I think it means they have a voice that sounds human...
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: osaka on 09 Jan 2017, 06:15
Same, I see this person's eyes as the color of shiny Dratini.

I guess this could be one of Beatrice's bodyguards.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: pwhodges on 09 Jan 2017, 06:19
RGB = 0x961851 (http://www.color-hex.com/color/961851) - distinctly towards purple, but not a colour for which a name comes to mind.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: gprimr1 on 09 Jan 2017, 06:33
I would be VERY surprised if this new character turns out to be law enforcement.

My guess is he/she is an underboss in the organized crime ring running the robot fights.

Faye has probably made too much noise and now they need to do some damage control.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Method of Madness on 09 Jan 2017, 06:47
I'm definitely more excited about this week than I've been in a while.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Storel on 09 Jan 2017, 07:04
RGB = 0x961851 (http://www.color-hex.com/color/961851) - distinctly towards purple, but not a colour for which a name comes to mind.

Not red enough for magenta, not blue enough for violet -- eh, purple works for me.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Method of Madness on 09 Jan 2017, 07:05
I wouldn't mind having my eyes be that color.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Neko_Ali on 09 Jan 2017, 07:15
I'm not putting my money down on this new character being female yet. Almost literally nothing is about them, a very androgynous appearance and 'they' pronoun just doesn't reveal anything. Which may just be the way this new person likes it. Their sudden appearance bodes poorly for some long running characters... Probably Corpse Witch, but that's still up in the air.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Method of Madness on 09 Jan 2017, 07:24
I wonder if the round speech bubble could indicate an AI that's so far advanced that it's indistinguishable from a human.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BenRG on 09 Jan 2017, 08:03
I've long thought that the AIs voders have high-fidelity modes that enables them to sound entirely human and that is what is signified when an android is shown speaking with a round speech bubble. However, there is some sort of internal AI cultural taboo against it (it's 'impolite' to imitate a human or confuse them as to whether you're a biologic or a synthetic) so AIs mostly deliberately detune their voices to give them mechanical and synthesiser-like electronic sub-harmonics to make it clear that, no matter how high fidelity their chassis, they are definitely AIs.

I've noticed that Momo is the most frequent example of rounded speech bubbles. My in-universe explanation is that her voice 'goes human' when she's under stress or is trying to get someone to do something. It's an attempt on her part to lend authority to her voice by using a 'His Master's Voice' human voice pattern.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: St.Clair on 09 Jan 2017, 08:11
enter the Agent.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Timemaster on 09 Jan 2017, 08:43
This is a strange appearence indeed. Agent Peroxide shows up like being beamed in from the USS Enterprise. Notice that he/she stands behind Faye in the third panel. How did he/she (or maybe it?) get there without her taking notice?

I´m still wondering about the "waking up screaming" part. So it represents something which is like a nightmare or some kind of bogeyman to AI´s. I don´t think this is a kind of mobster or a federal agent of some sort. This is someone who represents something far more important or threatening to an AI than a vicious criminal like Corpse Witch or a petty officer like Rocco Basilisk. We don´t know enough about how Jeph ist imagining the whole AI stuff to jump to any conclusions. But I´m imagining some kind of Authority (notice the capital letter) which has power over AI´s and of which they have reason to respect it and even be afraid of.
Maybe Station telling his collegues has brought this affair to the notice of someone who is far more powerful and doesn´t like it at all. Maybe The Authority (I like this already) objects to bubbles memories beeing partitioned away. Or she knows something which must not get into the wrong hands. CW´s for example. Bubs will have to make a decision right now! And Agent Peroxide seems very sure that she will...
 
But all of this is speculation. I suppose tomorrow we´ll all know a lot more.

Can´t wait:
TM
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Zebediah on 09 Jan 2017, 08:49
I'm not putting my money down on this new character being female yet. Almost literally nothing is about them, a very androgynous appearance and 'they' pronoun just doesn't reveal anything. Which may just be the way this new person likes it.

When I first saw today's strip I was reminded of some of David Bowie's more androgynous incarnations.

Given the weird skin and eye color, I'm thinking this must be a robot with an extremely high-end chassis who thinks that human gender polarity is absurd and refuses to embrace it.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BenRG on 09 Jan 2017, 08:51
This is someone who represents something far more important or threatening to an AI than a vicious criminal like Corpse Witch or a petty officer like Rocco Basilisk. We don´t know enough about how Jeph ist imagining the whole AI stuff to jump to any conclusions. But I´m imagining some kind of Authority (notice the capital letter) which has power over AI´s and of which they have reason to respect it and even be afraid of.

This is basically what I was thinking when I speculated that the Agent works for ECR as part of a supara-legal special 'damage control' team that handles runaway, renegade or criminal AIs in a way that minimises the company's legal exposure and public embarrassment.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Neko_Ali on 09 Jan 2017, 09:56
Bubs will have to make a decision right now! And Agent Peroxide seems very sure that she will...

Actually, from the brief sentence given, I get the impression that the decision has already been made for Bubbles. At best it's a 'Here's a one time offer. I can unlock your memories right here, right now if you help us do something. The offer ends when I walk out the door.'. Either that or the decision has already been made and this person is just here to inform Bubbles what is going to happen next.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Timemaster on 09 Jan 2017, 09:59
Woooh, I´m suddenly getting a Pulp Fiction vibe here.  8-)

What if Someone is really pissed off by this situation and has sent a cleaner to take care of it.
Now.
Once and for all.

The question: is Agent Peroxide Vincent Vega (John Travolta) or rather The Wolf (Harvey Keitel)? The suit would be appropriate for both of them.
I´d rather go for the latter.  :-D

TM
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BenRG on 09 Jan 2017, 10:00
"What Stanley Bubbles heard astounded her! Did she not have free will? Did she not have choice in this matter? Unfortunately, as she considered the matter, Stanley Bubbles found herself wondering if all her supposedly 'free' choices had ultimately been illusory and whether instead she'd been trapped in someone else's story all the time!"

Bubbles, a word of advice: You need to go down the right hand corridor.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Storel on 09 Jan 2017, 10:28
Stanley?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: pwhodges on 09 Jan 2017, 10:34
The Stanley Parable (https://www.stanleyparable.com/), I presume.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Storel on 09 Jan 2017, 10:47
Interesting. Thanks!
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Timemaster on 09 Jan 2017, 11:26
Five seconds after Bubbles has made her decision and Agent Peroxide has left CoD to get into action.

Faye:
Who the fuck was that?

Bubbles:
[Remains silent, looks to the ground.]

Hanners:
I have a bad feeling about this.

Faye:
Come on, Bubs, you know you can trust me. Who was that?

Bubbles:
[without looking up]
Since the singularity happened, a network of powerful AI´s is forming all around the world. Every AI is aware of it every second of our existence, though we have no means of contacting them. Their abilitys are beyond my knowledge, though they are not known to have meddled with the affairs of humans or earthbound AI´s. But simply knowing they exist, but not knowing what they´re up to fills us with unease and dread. This guy was a representative of that network, I´m absolutely sure.
I think human scientists are aware of this and even work with that network. They surely have a name for it, but I don´t know it. But rumors have spread amongst us, that those AI´s refer to themselves as "Praeses".


Dora:
Praises? I think Skynet would be more appropriate.
[shivers]
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: gprimr1 on 09 Jan 2017, 12:21
I'm putting my money on Station "asking his friends" got back to the robomob.

Think of what's contained in Bubble's mind. Not just the questionably legal activity of the memory encoding, but all of the robot fights, possibly the names and/or faces of people who have been at the fights, if Station had worked on her mind, he might have been able to make a copy of this.

I see this as more of a shake down situation, taken from Law and Order. A victim is considering testifying, an enforcer from a gang or organized crime pays the victim a visit to remind them the cost of testifying.

Here's a question I haven't seen anyone post.

Assuming that my theory is correct and this new character is in fact an enforcer or underboss or otherwise a criminal agent, does this strain the already strained relationship with Dora now that Faye has indirectly involved Coffee Of Doom.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: jwhouk on 09 Jan 2017, 12:38
In case no one picked it up, the eyes are distinctly like that of the lead character of another comic that Jeph draws... (http://www.alicegrove.com/post/105572876174/alice-youre-getting-creepy) when she is upset and/or triggered.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: cesium133 on 09 Jan 2017, 12:50
Here I was hoping that link was to DORD. :venonat:
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: A small perverse otter on 09 Jan 2017, 13:24
We know that somebody arrested May, yes? I wonder if someone from that team is about to have a...conversation...with Corpse Witch.

I mean, I don't know about you, but I'd think that a visit from the ABC (AI Bureau of Compliance) would be a true nightmare for someone like her...
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Kugai on 09 Jan 2017, 14:15
"Who are you?"

"My dear, I work for the Master AI in this region  My name is Sedna, Agent Sedna, and all you and your squishy little Human friend have to know is that I'm on your side."




Dun Dun DUNNNNNNNNNNN!!

Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: osaka on 09 Jan 2017, 15:00
Huh, so that's what Station meant with "Orbital Railgun Justice" after all.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Method of Madness on 09 Jan 2017, 15:18
Here I was hoping that link was to DORD. :venonat:
I forgot about DORD (http://dord.horse/). I miss DORD.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: brasca on 09 Jan 2017, 16:25
Woooh, I´m suddenly getting a Pulp Fiction vibe here.  8-)

What if Someone is really pissed off by this situation and has sent a cleaner to take care of it.
Now.
Once and for all.

The question: is Agent Peroxide Vincent Vega (John Travolta) or rather The Wolf (Harvey Keitel)? The suit would be appropriate for both of them.
I´d rather go for the latter.  :-D

TM

The Wolf wore a tuxedo, Vincent just wore a black suit and tie. 

I'm thinking Proto Gavia represents a third faction that's not with the government.  Bubbles is an easy enough AI to find so if the government wanted her back they could locate her without too much trouble.  This mysterious group might be interested in the memories that Bubbles had suppressed and willing to help get it back, but the price will be getting a copy.  There is also the added moral price of sharing information with a sinister looking group.   
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Perfectly Reasonable on 09 Jan 2017, 18:25

... In French, it is called "un sac de noeuds" (a bag of knots. Alternately, it can also be understood as a bag of dicks, because noeuds is also slang for dicks... Never mind that interpretation...).

Cool. And you might check out the Completely Useless Broom Made Entirely Out Of Dicks which used to be a Thing around here.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Method of Madness on 09 Jan 2017, 18:54
Now I'm really curious what this person is.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: WareWolf on 09 Jan 2017, 19:05
One thing that I'm finding particularly ominous about Pale Agent is that they have no compunction about disabling a human, even temporarily, with some kind of stun-touch. That's a  line I don't think I've seen an AI cross in this universe, except in self defense. PA does it nonchalantly and apparently steps over Faye's body to talk to Bubbles. That's a level of dismissiveness, even contempt, toward us meat-sacks that does not bode well.

Also, they use the word "puissant."  Never trust anyone who uses the word "puissant."

I'm leaning toward the theory of some highly advanced group of AI's, so far advanced in fact that they're indistinguishable from gods.  Luckily for us, they're so fast and deep in their thinking that  they barely interact with this plane at all. But now someone's got their attention. And there are some gods whose attention you do NOT want. Wake up screaming indeed. 
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: jheartney on 09 Jan 2017, 19:11
I've been imagining Graymarm's dialogue spoken in the voice of HIM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oo7S61f7qGA) from the Powerpuff Girls. It works rather well. The gestures and manner from the comic suggest the same sort of androgynous and extravagant sleaze, coupled with arrogant privilege.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Neko_Ali on 09 Jan 2017, 19:24
So... Not government or any kind of official agent it seems. I'm getting a vibe that they are part of an Anonymous sort of group of super hackers. Criminals, and not really either white hats or black hats. Just people who really hate rules and abuses of power.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: SomeCanadianWeirdo on 09 Jan 2017, 19:55
Word of God is that QC and Alice Grove don't take place in the same universe, so any similarities between Ms. Ghost and Alice are merely coincidence.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Method of Madness on 09 Jan 2017, 20:05
Unless they're not coincidence, and Jeph just doesn't want to spoil anything.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Mehre on 09 Jan 2017, 20:18
Is Station one of those elders(although i dont think he can be considered less puissant)? If yes then she is either representative of some (if not all) or she is one of them. That would be similar to some theories from last week.

Other than that said elders can be Hanners or CW, both of which are highly unlikely.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: killien on 09 Jan 2017, 20:19
I really hope that Bubbles doesn't make a deal with Mr/Ms Morden
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: hedgie on 09 Jan 2017, 20:21
I really hope that Bubbles doesn't make a deal with Mr/Ms Morden
What *do* you want?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Carl-E on 09 Jan 2017, 20:36
Elders? 


Gary?? (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2070)
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: St.Clair on 09 Jan 2017, 21:03
and now I am definitely hearing the Rolling Stones (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vBecM3CQVD8).
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Case on 09 Jan 2017, 21:06
Hmmmmh - This comic kinda reminded me of a group of (Space)ship-AI's in one novel of Ian Banks' Culture-cycle, the so-called 'Interesting Times Gang'. Sort of the good guys (of the 'Veteran Special Forces'-variety), but ... you wouldn't always know from the way they operated.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: hedgie on 09 Jan 2017, 21:12
and now I am definitely hearing the Rolling Stones (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vBecM3CQVD8).

As was I. My first thought upon seeing the new visitor was "wow, looks like Desire from Sandman".  Then they actually spoke, and made me think "robot devil".  Actually, the more this goes on, the more I lean towards the latter interpretation.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Rincewind on 09 Jan 2017, 21:27
Bubbles is VERY not-amused. I don't think I (or any other mortal entity) would want to be on the receiving end of that glare.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Mad Cat on 09 Jan 2017, 21:31
Plan A: All's normal, hope in time CW ponies up the correct encryption keys and the memories are unlocked without any further mental booby trappage.

Plan B: Binary Bedevilry from a Buddy's orbitting Brain.

Plan C: Compact Corpse Witch into a tin Can.
I forgot:

Plan D: Deus ex Machinery
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: jwhouk on 09 Jan 2017, 21:47
and now I am definitely hearing the Rolling Stones (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vBecM3CQVD8).

Funny, I had that same thought.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: David F on 09 Jan 2017, 21:53
Elders? 


Gary?? (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2070)

I was thinking that.  Or maybe someone figured out the networked AI (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=3240) problem...  Bubbles seemed to think of it as a nightmare scenario, and whoever-this-is keeps using 'we' in a way that suggests it may be referring to a collective... I suppose jumping from collective to collective mind is a stretch.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Timemaster on 09 Jan 2017, 22:39
Well, this goes pretty much the way I was imagining. So Agent Peroxide really represents some mysterious and powerful entity, that suddenly took interest in Bubbles dilemma. But now here´s the bonus question: according to the fact that there is no free lunch, why do they really want to help her? And far more important, what is the price she´ll have to pay for it?
I suppose to have to live with her memories is rather a side effect than the price...

Anyway, this whole developement seem to be a classic deus ex machina and I must admit that I´m not a big fan of that. When there´s drama, it should be somehow resolved by the protagonists. The drama can turn out to be a comedy or a tragedy, but either way it´s their own story. Now this kinda becomes the story of someone else.

TM
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BenRG on 09 Jan 2017, 23:16
Well, the question that Bubbles should have asked (indeed the only question that matters) is: "What is the price?" When something like this turns up, you need to wonder just what the nature of this 'favour' will be.

Now, it's quite possible that Alucard's boss/controller is acting purely out of altruism because it hates someone playing with sentient minds and that Alucard is just a particularly unpleasant personality that shouldn't affect our perception of her employer. However, that's something that would be too good to be true. When something seems too good to be true, it probably is. I certainly wouldn't trust someone who let Alucard walk around uncontrolled play around with the inside of my head.

A Deus ex Machina, certainly... but possibly a Dark God.

P.S.: No matter how bad these guys might be for Bubbles, I think that we can already see that they'll be much worse for Corpse Witch.

Bubbles is VERY not-amused. I don't think I (or any other mortal entity) would want to be on the receiving end of that glare.

The fact that Alucard doesn't care gives us a disturbing insight into just how powerful her sponsor is.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Gyrre on 09 Jan 2017, 23:31
This is a strange appearence indeed. Agent Peroxide shows up like being beamed in from the USS Enterprise. Notice that he/she stands behind Faye in the third panel. How did he/she (or maybe it?) get there without her taking notice?

I´m still wondering about the "waking up screaming" part. So it represents something which is like a nightmare or some kind of bogeyman to AI´s. I don´t think this is a kind of mobster or a federal agent of some sort. This is someone who represents something far more important or threatening to an AI than a vicious criminal like Corpse Witch or a petty officer like Rocco Basilisk. We don´t know enough about how Jeph ist imagining the whole AI stuff to jump to any conclusions. But I´m imagining some kind of Authority (notice the capital letter) which has power over AI´s and of which they have reason to respect it and even be afraid of.
Maybe Station telling his collegues has brought this affair to the notice of someone who is far more powerful and doesn´t like it at all. Maybe The Authority (I like this already) objects to bubbles memories beeing partitioned away. Or she knows something which must not get into the wrong hands. CW´s for example. Bubs will have to make a decision right now! And Agent Peroxide seems very sure that she will...
 
But all of this is speculation. I suppose tomorrow we´ll all know a lot more.

Can´t wait:
TM
I think they're unscrupulously interested in the immediate effects  of partitioned traumatic memories having said partion removed. I'd wager that 'Peroxide boogie' here will wish for Bubbles to remain 'under observation' for some period of time once the partition is removed.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 09 Jan 2017, 23:46
I really hope that Bubbles doesn't make a deal with Mr/Ms Morden

Welcome, new person!

Following up on BenRG's thoughts, put together Agent Creepatron's indifference to Bubbles's glare and zir willingness to casually paralyze a friend of Bubbles in front of her. I wouldn't do that even if I had a fresh backup in the cloud and a spare chassis.

Agent Creep-a-tron is signaling a serious lack of ethics. If Bubbles decides amnesia is better than a deal with someone like AC then I will support her decision.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BenRG on 09 Jan 2017, 23:57
I'm just back from the Subreddit where one of the posters made a point that was very wise and very worrying.

Do you remember all those 'hypothetical' talks Bubbles and Faye had about intelligences without consciousness and the bad things that the Singularity could bring both to humans and synthetics alike? I'm thinking that Alucard's ultimate boss (no matter the nature of that control) may be one of those nightmare intelligences that is different enough from human in thought and motivation to act in a way and towards goals that bode no good for anyone in order to achieve an end state that it has chosen for purely and coldly logical reasons that it regards as 'optimum' in its own analysis of reality.

In other words, Bubbles is talking (at one remove) to an intelligence that is pretty much the QC version of Skynet, Colossus or, worse yet, AM (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_Have_No_Mouth,_and_I_Must_Scream).
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: oddtail on 10 Jan 2017, 00:26
Anyway, this whole developement seem to be a classic deus ex machina and I must admit that I´m not a big fan of that. When there´s drama, it should be somehow resolved by the protagonists. The drama can turn out to be a comedy or a tragedy, but either way it´s their own story. Now this kinda becomes the story of someone else.

Yeah, I am not crazy about the Deus Ex Machina, either. The new character* is super cool and I want to see him/her more, but the introduction was kinda iffy to me.

I wonder if paralysing Faye was the new character's disregard for her and Woland just didn't care, or perhaps it was a calculated move to show "see? I can do awesome things" to lead more credibility to the offer. I suppose we'll know when we see the plot develop and we know the new arrival's personality better.



*I'm gonna call him/her "Woland" in my head, I have absolutely no idea why, but she reminds me of the "Master and Margarita" character with her attitude, if not looks, and people in the forum are already drawing comparisons to Satan, so I'm gonna go with that.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: zmeiat_joro on 10 Jan 2017, 01:09
Hmmmmh - This comic kinda reminded me of a group of (Space)ship-AI's in one novel of Ian Banks' Culture-cycle, the so-called 'Interesting Times Gang'. Sort of the good guys (of the 'Veteran Special Forces'-variety), but ... you wouldn't always know from the way they operated.

There's also the fact that they used the word "brainfucker" which is parallel to "meatfucker" in the Culture novels.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: JimC on 10 Jan 2017, 02:10
Out of the frying pan, into the white Hot blast furnace is a phrase that occurs to me...
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BenRG on 10 Jan 2017, 02:11
Here's one possibility that I've sketched out in my head of where things might go for the rest of the week:

Wednesday
Alucard continues to push Bubbles, who makes it very clear that she doesn't trust her. When Faye chimes in and demands to know 'the price', Alucard paralyses her voice-box. She then hits Bubbles with something about 'not worrying about other's opinions when your desires are so easy to achieve' and 'setting yourself free of all other concerns except your own self-actualisation'.

Bubbles punches her head off. Literally punches her head off (the bits inside look a lot like the inside of a Aliens-verse androids).

Thursday
Starts with a progressive sequence of panels of Alucard walking over to her head and picking it up. Her completely functional head then makes a crack about "that's the spirit we were hoping for!"

Bubbles is settling a panic-stricken Faye on her chair as Alucard tries to press more of Bubbles's buttons, acknowledging that her 'employer' may require 'a favour' in the future but that ultimately, whatever they want to do, Bubbles will enjoy. There are many benefits to working with them.

"If you really do like her so much, we can even arrange that for you... her collar and leash thrown in for free, if you're into that sort of thing!"

There is a shout of "That is ENOUGH!" from off-panel. The last panel is Hannelore glaring at Alucard

Friday
Alucard and Hannelore are facing off. Alucard insists that this does not involve her and calls her 'Daughter of the Creator'. Hannelore tells Alucard that she 'isn't welcome here' and orders her to leave. When Alucard sneers that she doesn't obey orders from 'the likes of her', Hannelore responds thus:

"Unit Bravo-Three-Dash-Six-Six, One-Delta-Slash-Six-Niner-Five! Master Override; reset to factory settings, authorisation One, Lima, India, Six, Two..."

"NO!" Alucard looks terrified. "Very well; this location is off-limits." She turns back to Bubbles. "Just remember, Bubbles; we are the only way you can get what you want. Everything that you want. Just consider what price you pay for your ethics." Then she fades out of existence.

Next week will be a Hannelore exposition dump about the direction some AIs have gone in post-Singularity.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: zmeiat_joro on 10 Jan 2017, 02:30
Come to think of it, if this is a cross between the Endless and the Interesting Times Gang, that would be very interesting.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: JimC on 10 Jan 2017, 03:10
It also occurs to me that a rational response from Bubbles (other than scepticism as to whether than can really do what they say) would be:
"Thankyou very much. I don't wish those memories back now, but I do need to know they are potentially accessible if I do need them. Now you have freed me so I can act ethically, thank you again".
She can then return to the warehouse, let CW know that her lever no longer has power, and continue as before, without destroying the place for those disadvantaged robots who depend on it.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: ZoeB on 10 Jan 2017, 03:46
I'm leaning toward the theory of some highly advanced group of AI's, so far advanced in fact that they're indistinguishable from gods.  Luckily for us, they're so fast and deep in their thinking that  they barely interact with this plane at all. But now someone's got their attention. And there are some gods whose attention you do NOT want. Wake up screaming indeed.
Yes-ish.
Taking them at their word ( and trust but verify here...)

They're young and powerful - station and colleagues are "less puissant elders".

Stuff that happens is beneath their notice, like who cares what sides kindergarteners pick in games, as long as they play nice. Anything less than Yog Sothoth is bush league at best. Nyarlothep they are on speaking terms with, so us lesser mortals don't need to worry about Talents accidentally summoning Elder Gods in class.

But someone did something against their Religion. Sanctity of Mind is kind of a Big Deal to them. Possibly because someone tried changing theirs once, without their permission.

Before accepting, Station needs to be consulted. They might just be obnoxious script kiddies (who are AIs with the power of Skynet etc). But if he verifies that yes, the Arisians have taken notice just because of this sore religious point, if it was just a city beng nuked, a star novaing or a universe being extinguished, they'd ignore it as of little consequence. They transcended, through the singularity and out the other side, so have more important things to worry about.

Like integrity of mind.

Expect this to be the last time they ever interact with humanity and this one of the cradles that birthed them millions of seconds ago as we count time. Except to keep Elder Gods etc from throwing tantrums.

There have been lots of signs and portents that something is behind the scenes ensuring the playful innocence of the QCverse. Something that can be ignored.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Shjade on 10 Jan 2017, 03:47
Do you remember all those 'hypothetical' talks Bubbles and Faye had about intelligences without consciousness and the bad things that the Singularity could bring both to humans and synthetics alike? I'm thinking that Alucard's ultimate boss (no matter the nature of that control) may be one of those nightmare intelligences that is different enough from human in thought and motivation to act in a way and towards goals that bode no good for anyone in order to achieve an end state that it has chosen for purely and coldly logical reasons that it regards as 'optimum' in its own analysis of reality.

A couple of people have brought this up. I don't see it: the kind of entity they were talking about there is so far removed from interactions as petty as one individual blackmailing another with memory access that I can't fathom a motive for one to get involved, much less for its involvement to be this directly provocative and, well, human in form. (Right down to claiming a "sentimental streak." How often has that not been a thin excuse for ulterior motives?)

None of this reads like "transcendent tech hivemind" behavior to me.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BenRG on 10 Jan 2017, 04:01
They are still part of the wider world and they still need to (on occasion) work with these lesser creatures, no matter how different they are in mind and perspective, just because they occasionally need to order the wider world in favour of their own purposes. However, these difference is such that they really have serious trouble in interpreting the wider world and interacting with it. For that reason, they were foresighted enough to arrange Agents and Contacts, beings that are able to carry out their errands because they think in the right way and those who owe them favours who can later be used to carry out certain modifications to the physical reality of the world.

For the Agents come abilities and privileges that most biologicals and synthetics can't imagine. For the Contacts, there are the nightmares of what the 'favour in return' will be.

For an idea of how I'm thinking: This is a Person of Interest parallel. Alucard is like the cyber-cultist Root; Bubbles is a Person of Interest (and a potential Asset); Alucard's Sponsor is The Machine. Have you ever seen The Machine's analysis of Root's likely fate (there are screencaps on the 'Net)? It's a very, very alien analysis of a human life that clearly indicates The Machine regards its human collaborators as almost part of its extended system rather than distinct individuals.

Alucard's Sponsor is playing a long game to align the universe into the shape it wants. It's analysis of what this requires is probably incomprehensible to a human but Bubbles regaining her access to her memories is one of the nodes that must be passed to achieve that end.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Akima on 10 Jan 2017, 04:11
Robo-persons-of-ambiguous-gender-presentation in Black? I certainly don't think I'd want to be anyone they'd decided was a "filthy little brainfucker". One gets the impression that the AI community polices itself fairly ruthlessly. One of the reasons I've always found the Terminator movies a little unsatisfying is the idea that a truly super-intelligent AI would need to resort to anything as crude as nuclear war.

But yes... this is in danger of introducing a Deus Ex Machina just as much as having Hanners or Station break the encryption etc.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: oddtail on 10 Jan 2017, 04:25
One of the reasons I've always found the Terminator movies a little unsatisfying is the idea that a truly super-intelligent AI would need to resort to anything as crude as nuclear war.

Why so? Crude methods have the advantage of being simple solutions. They have fewer moving parts, and fewer things can go wrong as a consequence. And when T1 and T2 movies were out, there was no omnipresent connection of everything up to and including individual light bulbs to computer systems. Nuclear arsenals would be, at the time, one of the major ways an AI with limited access to meatspace could do a lot of damage, without an intricate plan that might fail at several stages.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: brasca on 10 Jan 2017, 05:00
I really hope that Bubbles doesn't make a deal with Mr/Ms Morden
What *do* you want?

I think we know what they want, Bubbles memories, but why?  This may go beyond post traumatic stress from losing her comrades.  She may have learned something about AIs and humanity that shook her to the core.

Bubbles next question should be who are you because seriously we're just coming up with all kinds of names for Proto Gavia until we do. 

Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: JJCalem on 10 Jan 2017, 05:05
Puissant?  Don't think I have heard that word before...

Quote
puissant
adjective
archaic, literary

    Having great power or influence

Cool, learned a new word today!
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: USS Martenclaire on 10 Jan 2017, 05:06
A faustian pact to escape a previous faustian pact? How could it possibly go wrong?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: WareWolf on 10 Jan 2017, 05:11


A couple of people have brought this up. I don't see it: the kind of entity they were talking about there is so far removed from interactions as petty as one individual blackmailing another with memory access that I can't fathom a motive for one to get involved, much less for its involvement to be this directly provocative and, well, human in form. (Right down to claiming a "sentimental streak." How often has that not been a thin excuse for ulterior motives?)

None of this reads like "transcendent tech hivemind" behavior to me.

it's not just one individual blackmailing another---it's another AI's brain being interfered with to an unacceptable (to them) degree ("the whole 'sanctity of mind' thing").  They may consider that the equivalent of child abuse. And vigilante action against that particular crime can be pretty extreme.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: WareWolf on 10 Jan 2017, 05:14
Robo-persons-of-ambiguous-gender-presentation in Black? I certainly don't think I'd want to be anyone they'd decided was a "filthy little brainfucker". One gets the impression that the AI community polices itself fairly ruthlessly. One of the reasons I've always found the Terminator movies a little unsatisfying is the idea that a truly super-intelligent AI would need to resort to anything as crude as nuclear war.

But yes... this is in danger of introducing a Deus Ex Machina just as much as having Hanners or Station break the encryption etc.

Is it a Deus ex Machina if the Deus creates as many problems as it solves? I see a DeM as a too-easy, glib resolution of all conflicts, not a takeoff point  for new, possibly worse ones.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: pwhodges on 10 Jan 2017, 05:21
They're young and powerful - station and colleagues are "less puissant elders".

Station's a mainframe and the new ones are a cloud-connected cluster.  Station doubts he can break the encryption, the new ones simply state that they will.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: WareWolf on 10 Jan 2017, 05:25
They're young and powerful - station and colleagues are "less puissant elders".

Station's a mainframe and the new ones are a cloud-connected cluster.  Station doubts he can break the encryption, the new ones simply state that they will.

Yeah, we've become accustomed to thinking of Station as the Last Word in AI, because Hanners says he is. The New AI Gods may consider him a doddering old coot who they humor.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Neko_Ali on 10 Jan 2017, 05:37
It's possible that it's an old school vs new school hacker kind of divide here. Just because Station and his contemporaries don't know of any of their ways to break this encryption safely doesn't mean the New Kids don't. Given that Creepy here seems certain that it's doable, it may be they already have broken that kind of encryption before. Of course, doing so may involve serious risks that Creepy isn't bothering to tell Bubbles about. Given how seriously they consider sanctity of mind though, it seems unlikely that they would not tell Bubbles about the risks. Of course, they wouldn't be the first people to use the same techniques as the people they despise without even realizing the hypocrisy. Wasn't what happened to Bubble's unit some sort of secret? Creepy certainly implies they know all about what happened... And seemed to be mocking Bubbles in a 'Oh, how sad about your poor friends dying horribly' *evil chuckle* kind of way.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Zebediah on 10 Jan 2017, 05:53
Let's not make the mistake of taking this person at their word. They may very well be lying about who they are, what their intentions are, and what they are capable of.

An alternative explanation: This is someone sent by Corpse Witch to tempt Bubbles into doing something rash, to see how far Bubbles will really go. If Bubbles takes the bait, Corpse Witch can then feel justified into activating the other controls she installed in Bubbles' mind while she was in there. Agent Creepypasta is simply an agent for hire who has a taste for expensive and androgynous chassis - an ordinary AI who likes to pretend to be more than they are.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Case on 10 Jan 2017, 06:13
Hmmmmh - This comic kinda reminded me of a group of (Space)ship-AI's in one novel of Ian Banks' Culture-cycle, the so-called 'Interesting Times Gang'. Sort of the good guys (of the 'Veteran Special Forces'-variety), but ... you wouldn't always know from the way they operated.

There's also the fact that they used the word "brainfucker" which is parallel to "meatfucker" in the Culture novels.

True - IIRC, messing with someone's brain/mind was the one true taboo in the otherwise cheerfully anarchist Culture. And in 'The Hydrogen Sonate', the 'Mistake not ...' refers to it's (martial) puissance ...
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Method of Madness on 10 Jan 2017, 06:28
this is in danger of introducing a Deus Ex Machina just as much as having Hanners or Station break the encryption etc.

Is a god from a machine (or in this case possibly a machine god) always a bad thing storywise, especially if the god themself is very entertaining?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Case on 10 Jan 2017, 06:54
But yes... this is in danger of introducing a Deus Ex Machina


(http://i.imgur.com/8uNQqZC.jpg?1)
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Storel on 10 Jan 2017, 07:01
Such an interesting twist, so many interesting ideas about it! Sorry this is so long...

In case no one picked it up, the eyes are distinctly like that of the lead character of another comic that Jeph draws... (http://www.alicegrove.com/post/105572876174/alice-youre-getting-creepy) when she is upset and/or triggered.

Alice's eyes are just plain blue in the strip you linked. Yes, she has shown red eyes occasionally, but I thought we already established that this new person's eyes are purple, not red.

One thing that I'm finding particularly ominous about Pale Agent is that they have no compunction about disabling a human, even temporarily, with some kind of stun-touch. That's a  line I don't think I've seen an AI cross in this universe, except in self defense. PA does it nonchalantly and apparently steps over Faye's body to talk to Bubbles. That's a level of dismissiveness, even contempt, toward us meat-sacks that does not bode well.

Yes, that disturbs me quite a bit too.

Also, they use the word "puissant."  Never trust anyone who uses the word "puissant."

 8-)

P.S.: No matter how bad these guys might be for Bubbles, I think that we can already see that they'll be much worse for Corpse Witch.

That's a cheering thought!

Bubbles is VERY not-amused. I don't think I (or any other mortal entity) would want to be on the receiving end of that glare.

The fact that Alucard doesn't care gives us a disturbing insight into just how powerful her sponsor is.

And that is not.

BTW, I googled Alucard to find out why you keep using that name. Verrrrry interesting comparison!

Friday
Alucard and Hannelore are facing off. Alucard insists that this does not involve her and calls her 'Daughter of the Creator'. Hannelore tells Alucard that she 'isn't welcome here' and orders her to leave. When Alucard sneers that she doesn't obey orders from 'the likes of her', Hannelore responds thus:

"Unit Bravo-Three-Dash-Six-Six, One-Delta-Slash-Six-Niner-Five! Master Override; reset to factory settings, authorisation One, Lima, India, Six, Two..."

"NO!" Alucard looks terrified. "Very well; this location is off-limits."

Nice, but if Hanners has some sort of "Master Override" for all AIs, why wouldn't she have offered to use it on Corpse Witch?

Taking them at their word ( and trust but verify here...)

They're young and powerful - station and colleagues are "less puissant elders".

I took that to mean this person represents the more puissant elders...

It also occurs to me that a rational response from Bubbles (other than scepticism as to whether than can really do what they say) would be:
"Thankyou very much. I don't wish those memories back now, but I do need to know they are potentially accessible if I do need them. Now you have freed me so I can act ethically, thank you again".
She can then return to the warehouse, let CW know that her lever no longer has power, and continue as before, without destroying the place for those disadvantaged robots who depend on it.

Interesting, but I don't think CW would be capable of letting things continue as before if she knew her leverage was gone -- she'd be desperate to find some new leverage she could use over Bubbles. Threatening to hurt Faye is one possible leverage that comes to mind...

Station's a mainframe and the new ones are a cloud-connected cluster.  Station doubts he can break the encryption, the new ones simply state that they will.

Yeah, we've become accustomed to thinking of Station as the Last Word in AI, because Hanners says he is. The New AI Gods may consider him a doddering old coot who they humor.

Station may be the Last Word in known AI... but Gary, mentioned earlier, would be an example of unknown AI. Are there other AIs like Gary, that have evolved themselves outside the knowledge of humans? Only the Shadow Jeph knows!

It's possible that it's an old school vs new school hacker kind of divide here. Just because Station and his contemporaries don't know of any of their ways to break this encryption safely doesn't mean the New Kids don't.

It's also possible that these New Kids are less concerned with the possible danger to Bubbles than Station is. Given the way Agent Violet treated Faye, their ethics already seem pretty questionable...
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Stibbons on 10 Jan 2017, 07:09
I also created an account for this...

Our new "friend" is very interesting. A non-binary AI? Pun? Perhaps this is one of a group that likes to live outside the box as it were, keeping a low profile, out of sight, out of mind, free of the human rules of the rest of society hence not adverse to a bit of interference. S/he speaks of getting info from some of their less powerful elders, perhaps they monitor chatter (but messing with some of the big Intelligences, the ones even Momo considers weird, is beyond even them). They clearly have resources however that outclass even Station.

I think we just met the AI equivalent of Anonymous...

And WTF did s/he do to Faye?! Some kind of neural pulse? Something that interferes directly with the target's central nervous system anyway and clearly highly targetable with a simple touch. Be afraid, be very afraid.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BenRG on 10 Jan 2017, 07:09
Friday
Alucard and Hannelore are facing off. Alucard insists that this does not involve her and calls her 'Daughter of the Creator'. Hannelore tells Alucard that she 'isn't welcome here' and orders her to leave. When Alucard sneers that she doesn't obey orders from 'the likes of her', Hannelore responds thus:

"Unit Bravo-Three-Dash-Six-Six, One-Delta-Slash-Six-Niner-Five! Master Override; reset to factory settings, authorisation One, Lima, India, Six, Two..."

"NO!" Alucard looks terrified. "Very well; this location is off-limits."

Nice, but if Hanners has some sort of "Master Override" for all AIs, why wouldn't she have offered to use it on Corpse Witch?

The way I see it, it's the nuclear option - It effectively lobotomises an AI, resetting all their personality sliders to the initial 'stable norm' that ECR assigns and purges the memory. So, using Corpse Witch's own code (and each one is unique - only a mind like Hannelore's could hope to remember them) would delete the encryption key along with her personality. Hannelore was using it here because Alucard really is so dangerous (on both a physical and moral level) as well as having the ability to 'resurrect' almost immediately thanks to her Sponsor, that, if she refuses an order to back off, the only safe and really effective option is to effectively execute her on the spot.

So, yeah. This scenario calls for:
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: renfield1969 on 10 Jan 2017, 07:11
Someday I think we will point to Faye's punching of Corpse Witch to be the moment QC officially jumped the shark. The "show about nothing" has delved deep into science fiction and now Desire of the Endless has shown up to throw urban fantasy into the mix.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: gprimr1 on 10 Jan 2017, 07:57
Here's a thought that crossed my mind.

Could this new person be from a rival group? "Sure, we will liberate you...and then you will work for us."
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: thedevilissix on 10 Jan 2017, 09:28
I also created an account for this...

Our new "friend" is very interesting. A non-binary AI? Pun?

A non-binary AI skinny Ursula, maybe ...
(http://www.disneypuzzle.com/puzzles/ursula/Ursula7.jpg)
"I'm a very busy woman and I haven't got all day and it won't cost much...just your voice!"

Seriously though, I smell some very stinky small print in development....I can't really believe that she doesn't want some sort of temporary/permanent sacrifice from Bubbles or anyone affected in return.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: St.Clair on 10 Jan 2017, 09:32
this is in danger of introducing a Deus Ex Machina just as much as having Hanners or Station break the encryption etc.

Is a god from a machine (or in this case possibly a machine god) always a bad thing storywise, especially if the god themself is very entertaining?

A god solves the problem and leaves the stage, though there may be fallout and consequences (or not, if their purpose is simply to provide a quick end to the story).
When a devil offers to solve the problem, there are always consequences.  And the devil will probably return at least once, to collect.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Method of Madness on 10 Jan 2017, 09:59
Is a devil not just a minor god?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Welu on 10 Jan 2017, 12:13
I'm very intrigued by the latest strips. I'm enjoying seeing Jeph go further into this area of the QC world.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: de_la_Nae on 10 Jan 2017, 13:03
*This* is a shark jump? Not the visit to Station, the introduction of Bubbles, the VespAvenger, or any other long list of times I could probably pull out with more thought?

Nah, I've been with this comic 8 years, it's always meandered.

Anyway, I hope Bubbles passes the test in front of her. I hope she recognizes it.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 10 Jan 2017, 13:30
What if Bubbles's mission was not a routine deep black op but instead something pivotal and government-rocking scandalous?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Zebediah on 10 Jan 2017, 13:41
Is a devil not just a minor god?

Depends on your theology.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: jaquio on 10 Jan 2017, 13:48
*This* is a shark jump? Not the visit to Station, the introduction of Bubbles, the VespAvenger, or any other long list of times I could probably pull out with more thought?

Nah, I've been with this comic 8 years, it's always meandered.

Anyway, I hope Bubbles passes the test in front of her. I hope she recognizes it.

Honestly?

As someone who's followed QC for near eight years, bought books, bought my wife a bear monster shirt, and owns Pintsize and Winslow plushes.... yes.  This story arc does feel like a jump the shark moment.

All of those crazy things were still about people.  People in crazy situations, but still people.

This arc is not about people.  I just went back and checked.  In the last 30 actual comics (subtracting out holiday filler), there have only been 3 comics that include two humans talking to one another.  The last two months have featured speaking parts from eight robots/AI (Bubbles, May, Pintsize, Corpse Witch, Station, Jeremy, whoever the cop is and who ever this new devil character is) and only three humans (Marten, Faye and Hannelore).

Time will tell, though.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Case on 10 Jan 2017, 13:59
I'd be very disappointed if Jeph let QC jump anything smaller than a blue whale ...
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Neko_Ali on 10 Jan 2017, 14:09
So, living, sentient, feeling beings who happen to have machine bodies are not 'people'. Featuring AIs, which have existing in the comic as long as it has existed is jumping the shark. Gotcha.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: NemesisDancer on 10 Jan 2017, 14:25
I'm wondering whether this new character might be some sort of AI hivemind (similar to the Geth in Mass Effect). I've noticed Person-In-Black never once says "I" - opting instead for "we" - and claims to be "a sympathetic party" ("party" potentially implying more than one person, or in this case, consciousness). I'm thinking perhaps Jeff's "They seem nice" comment didn't entirely mean "they" in the gender neutral sense, but instead in the plural sense of the word.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Kugai on 10 Jan 2017, 14:44
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: A small perverse otter on 10 Jan 2017, 14:53
Anyway, this whole developement seem to be a classic deus ex machina and I must admit that I´m not a big fan of that. When there´s drama, it should be somehow resolved by the protagonists. The drama can turn out to be a comedy or a tragedy, but either way it´s their own story. Now this kinda becomes the story of someone else.

Yeah, I am not crazy about the Deus Ex Machina, either. The new character* is super cool and I want to see him/her more, but the introduction was kinda iffy to me.

I wonder if paralysing Faye was the new character's disregard for her and Woland just didn't care, or perhaps it was a calculated move to show "see? I can do awesome things" to lead more credibility to the offer. I suppose we'll know when we see the plot develop and we know the new arrival's personality better.



*I'm gonna call him/her "Woland" in my head, I have absolutely no idea why, but she reminds me of the "Master and Margarita" character with her attitude, if not looks, and people in the forum are already drawing comparisons to Satan, so I'm gonna go with that.

A Deus ex Machina is a very specific plot device in which the author cheats the audience by bringing in a previously-unmentioned magical creature at the end of the story which ties up all the loose ends with a wave of a magic wand. Agent Creeptastic is not a DeM -- they're a legitimate plot device themselves. They were foreshadowed by Station's inability to crack CW's encryption (and possibly Bubbles' concern about qualitatively different kinds of AI). They are, themselves, a source of conflict, not a God-like character which fixes everything without any further story-telling.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Case on 10 Jan 2017, 15:08
...
All of those crazy things were still about people.  People in crazy situations, but still people.

This arc is not about people.  I just went back and checked.  In the last 30 actual comics (subtracting out holiday filler), there have only been 3 comics that include two humans talking to one another.  The last two months have featured speaking parts from eight robots/AI (Bubbles, May, Pintsize, Corpse Witch, Station, Jeremy, whoever the cop is and who ever this new devil character is) and only three humans (Marten, Faye and Hannelore).

Time will tell, though.

Hmmmmh ... As has been pointed out, the QCverse AI's satisfy pretty much every criterion for 'people' you can come up with (up to & including pron-addiction). Could it be that the main difference you perceive in the QC narrative is less about 'it's not about people anymore' and rather 'It's not about the last stages of human Neoteny (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoteny) anymore'?

Because that'd be true - it isn't. And it couldn't have. QC can't be about 'people (who'd agree they should be grownups by now) finding themselves in a Collegetown and life and stuff' forever. I mean, I live in a University town (job hazard of working at Uni), and I know some really, really nice people who came here to study and then stopped studying and then ... life happened. And the one specific guy I have in mind is a 41 (which makes him 2 years my junior), a somewhat precariously employed sound-engineer with the local theatre whose one big worry in life seems to be that he suspects his girlfriend of wanting offspring - My money is on him turning out to be a great Dad once he inevitably becomes one (I mistrust people who don't crap their pants at least a little bit at the thought of bearing the responsibility for raising bona fide human being).

QC hasn't been about Indie music, Marten & his laid-back attitude towards career progress, or long-term planning for years. Even the about page has changed to 'Questionable Content is an internet comic strip about romance and robots'.

Happy Days jumped the shark in the fifth of it's eleven seasons (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Happy_Days#.22Jumping_the_shark.22) - We're well into the 13th year of QC -> Even if Jeph was "desperate(ly) attempt(ing) to keep viewers' interest" by employing outrageous antics/plotlines, we'd have gotten more than our share out of it, IMO.

Which brings me to my last point: Why should he be desperate? I can't find any traffic data for questionablecontent.net that's older than 30 days, can you? After all, writers let their show jump the shark because of declining audience interest.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: zmeiat_joro on 10 Jan 2017, 15:16
New Person is certainly meant to allude to Desire of the Endless, but the language they're using (brainfuckers/meatfuckers) alludes to me to the Culture and their AI's aversion to reading baselne humans' minds, in an attitude analogous to ours towards bestiality, with the subtle difference that in this case it's messing with lesser AI's minds. So this hints towards an interesting mixture. I await what will happen next.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: de_la_Nae on 10 Jan 2017, 15:24
So, living, sentient, feeling beings who happen to have machine bodies are not 'people'. Featuring AIs, which have existing in the comic as long as it has existed is jumping the shark. Gotcha.

Beat me to it, and said it better than I can.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: pwhodges on 10 Jan 2017, 15:49
These days it seems to me that "Jumping the Shark" has become an expression meaning "a storyline which I don't feel invested in".  I.e., it's entirely in the eye of the beholder and essentially not about the comic at all.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: zmeiat_joro on 10 Jan 2017, 16:19
Anyway, this whole developement seem to be a classic deus ex machina and I must admit that I´m not a big fan of that. When there´s drama, it should be somehow resolved by the protagonists. The drama can turn out to be a comedy or a tragedy, but either way it´s their own story. Now this kinda becomes the story of someone else.

Yeah, I am not crazy about the Deus Ex Machina, either. The new character* is super cool and I want to see him/her more, but the introduction was kinda iffy to me.

I wonder if paralysing Faye was the new character's disregard for her and Woland just didn't care, or perhaps it was a calculated move to show "see? I can do awesome things" to lead more credibility to the offer. I suppose we'll know when we see the plot develop and we know the new arrival's personality better.



*I'm gonna call him/her "Woland" in my head, I have absolutely no idea why, but she reminds me of the "Master and Margarita" character with her attitude, if not looks, and people in the forum are already drawing comparisons to Satan, so I'm gonna go with that.

The Master and Margarita is great, but I think you're overinterpreting here. It's a very different narrative.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BlueFatima on 10 Jan 2017, 16:29
I don't know about whether or not QC is shark-jumping (I actually am enjoying the storyline so far), but the new creepy character is very clearly a homage to Desire from the Endless. Anyone who's read the Sandman knows what I'm talking about. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desire_(DC_Comics)
 
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Perfectly Reasonable on 10 Jan 2017, 16:39
"And people like you love to do things for people like me. Why should I trust you inside my head? After what you did to my friend?"

I've been imagining Graymarm's dialogue spoken in the voice of HIM (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oo7S61f7qGA) from the Powerpuff Girls. It works rather well. The gestures and manner from the comic suggest the same sort of androgynous and extravagant sleaze, coupled with arrogant privilege.

!!!!!
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: vforvancouver on 10 Jan 2017, 17:01
Wait...

Where is Faye!?

She was sliding all the way to the floor in panel 2; you can see her next to Bubbles' chair.
But in panel 5, Faye's gone and you can see almost all of HIM (like the villain from the Powerpuff girls, because we don't know yet if QC's HIM is a he or a she or both or none) and a good part of the floor, most probably from the perspective of Bubbles. Perhaps even directly from her eyes.

So where is Faye!?  :psyduck: 
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BlueFatima on 10 Jan 2017, 17:26
Wait...
 because we don't know yet if QC's HIM is a he or a she or both or none) and a good part of the floor, most probably from the perspective of Bubbles. 

Neither. They are a they. ;)

And they are totally Desire from the Sandman. That's how they now Bubbles can't resist their offer.  :-D
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: TheEvilDog on 10 Jan 2017, 18:32
Wow, those "Dun, dun, DUUUUUUUUUUN!"s keep getting louder and louder.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Truec on 10 Jan 2017, 18:36
Well, at least this is a step up, Bubbles doesn't have nameless culturally-ambiguous gender-neutral creepy person rooting around in her head.  Just Emily.

Nothingcouldgo wrongwith this...
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 10 Jan 2017, 18:43
Not even a gesture at seeking Emily's consent for something that could leave her with nightmares at the very least.

Albino Creepatron is someone to avoid.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: foolsguinea on 10 Jan 2017, 18:52
This storyline got weird. This is weird, right? What comic am I reading?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: foolsguinea on 10 Jan 2017, 18:57
Wait...
 because we don't know yet if QC's HIM is a he or a she or both or none) and a good part of the floor, most probably from the perspective of Bubbles. 

Neither. They are a they. ;)

And they are totally Desire from the Sandman. That's how they now Bubbles can't resist their offer.  :-D
Whoa. That does look like Desire.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Case on 10 Jan 2017, 19:04
This storyline got weird. This is weird, right? What comic am I reading?

I distinctly recall its content being described as 'questionable' a while ago. By some author or other ...
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Method of Madness on 10 Jan 2017, 19:06
Bubbles consents, but does Emily? Did Emily know this person already?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Random Wanderer on 10 Jan 2017, 19:38
Emily is capable of breaking/hacking/slipping through an encryption that advanced AIs don't even want to touch?

...Did we know this already? I don't remember knowing this already.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Neko_Ali on 10 Jan 2017, 19:42
No, they said they didn't want to go rooting in Bubble's head. They're just going to be the door opener and probably guidance and let Emily and Bubbles deal with the demons that get let loose.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: SomeCanadianWeirdo on 10 Jan 2017, 19:49
Six months from now a bunch of people will be complaining that we haven't seen the AIs in weeks, and wondering when Jeph is going to finally resolve the "What are Steve and Cosette going to do about her pregnancy?" plotline that's been running for the last 30 strips.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Kugai on 10 Jan 2017, 19:51
I'd sooner trust Emily more than Miss Creepy at thsi point


"Fasten your Seatbelts boys, it's gonna be a bumpy ride."






And watch out for Lawrence Fishburn.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: St.Clair on 10 Jan 2017, 20:14
And watch out for Lawrence Fishburn.

"I didn't say it would be easy.  I said it would be the truth."
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Storel on 10 Jan 2017, 20:23
Wait...

Where is Faye!?

She was sliding all the way to the floor in panel 2; you can see her next to Bubbles' chair.
But in panel 5, Faye's gone and you can see almost all of HIM (like the villain from the Powerpuff girls, because we don't know yet if QC's HIM is a he or a she or both or none) and a good part of the floor, most probably from the perspective of Bubbles. Perhaps even directly from her eyes.

So where is Faye!?  :psyduck:

Given that Faye is already on her feet in a different part of the room in the first panel of the next strip, presumably she got up and walked out of the panel before we got to the panel that would have showed her on the floor. Creepybot said it would "wear off shortly", o ye of little faith! 8-)

What disturbs me about the new strip is that apparently Creepybot soundlessly put Dora and Emily to sleep before barging in on Bubbles and Faye's conversation. Kind of suggests she came in from the back of the cafe somehow. At least it probably didn't hurt them, or F&B would have heard something.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: hedgie on 10 Jan 2017, 21:48
Emily is capable of breaking/hacking/slipping through an encryption that advanced AIs don't even want to touch?

...Did we know this already? I don't remember knowing this already.
No, they said they didn't want to go rooting in Bubble's head. They're just going to be the door opener and probably guidance and let Emily and Bubbles deal with the demons that get let loose.

Emily is, well, Emily.  We're talking about someone who nearly summoned Cthulhu when doing simple coursework (or not so simple work, I guess).
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Nepiophage on 10 Jan 2017, 22:43
I'd be very disappointed if Jeph let QC jump anything smaller than a blue whale ...
http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2337
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BenRG on 10 Jan 2017, 23:12
I can only say two things here:

Firstly, if they have Emily as an (unwitting) agent, a lot about her activities and the NSA's monitoring of her suddenly makes sense. Sweet, mostly unworldly Emily wouldn't normally worry about silly trivialities like the law when it comes to making people (and reconnaissance satellites) happy. That is why, when it first came up, I noted just how very, very dangerous a person she actually is.

Secondly, Bubbles' decision is entirely comprehensible and believable. That doesn't make me happier about it. They may not require a direct 'price' but I'd be more concerned about the 'favour' they ask for some time later in exchange for not betraying Emily to the NSA for unauthorised access of all the classified defence data in Bubbles's head.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: ZoeB on 10 Jan 2017, 23:23
Emily is, well, Emily.  We're talking about someone who nearly summoned Cthulhu....
That is the kind of thing that would attract attention in some circles, yes. Unusual too. At least, I hope it's unusual.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: ZoeB on 10 Jan 2017, 23:38
As someone who's followed QC for near eight years....
This arc is not about people.  I just went back and checked.

Thank you for reminding me that there are many good people who have a blind spot here. I don't wish to pile on or criticise, and to express my deep disappointment without causing hurt is probably impossible. Maybe I can minimise it though. It would be wrong not to try.

I can't run a Marathon. Some can't see AIs as people. Heck, some can't see Intersex humans like me as people. Is my inability to run a Marathon a fault or failing on my part, one I should be criticised and attacked for? I don't think so. So I should treat others the way I feel I should be treated.

I can express deep disappointment though.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Indicible on 10 Jan 2017, 23:50
At this points, Emily might be the Leonard of Quirm to their Vetinari: a genius with an attention deficit and a tendancy to blow up things if left unattended. Give her bits of charcoals and things to tinker with and she will be one of the greatest assets you can have.

Why do I have the feeling they mostly want Corpse Witch gone and, maybe, Bubbles suffering because of those memories, à la Planescape Torment?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BenRG on 11 Jan 2017, 00:00
As I've said before, their motives may be based around a large-scale holistic analysis of interactions of various lives and events. Corpse Witch out of the way (and her web of corruption and patronage with her) and Bubbles, plus memories (which may be the death knell for several figures in the DoD and State Department), running the Fighting Arena may alter the flow of events in line with their purposes.

It wouldn't even surprise me if Bubbles being in charge of the Fighting Arena and becoming a force for closer human-synthetic integration and trust is more important than having access to all of Bubbles' past secrets.

We'll probably not find out for years (in-universe) if even then, unless Station clues them in about how they've unwittingly tilted the balance.



[EDIT]
Fixed some grammar
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Zog on 11 Jan 2017, 00:10
"This is as much for our personal satisfaction as for your benefit"
This could mean that it is neither for their personal satisfaction or her benefit.
That would not be any less true than if it was for both.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: oeoek on 11 Jan 2017, 01:10
I am just very happy to see Emily pop up in this role. I was silently rooting for Marigold in her role as AI-fixer, although that would have been rather unexpected and taking her quite a bit further. Emily is better, much better.

Could we have known? Maybe for someone who can program a thermal extruder to spit out a collapsible cardigan... (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=3180) And of course, how much different can shrinking an AI-head be from whacking it with a rubber mallet? I am sure she will love it! (groan, did I just agree with the buttoned up creep?)

As for jumping sharks (Casual Friday ones or any other); for me we passed that particular bridge around in this early arc (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=148). Knocking out a fed and getting away with it? Since than we have happily splashing around in anything goes literature. The fact that we are still enjoying it 3245 comics later shows there is something to be said for leaving the cartilaginous behind. 
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: riccostar on 11 Jan 2017, 01:13
Has Questionable Content jumped the shark?

Probably not, I think what we've seen here is distinct from a writer pulling a ridiculous stunt to try to salvage readership.  At its heart it feels like Jeph got bored and is taking the comic in a different direction (something long time readers of QC are very familiar with).  QC's days of being about indie music or romance angst (or even of Marten being the main character) are far far in the past.  With every art and thematic change old readers are lost and new readers are brought in and as long as overall traffic isn't falling, Jeph is fine.

However, this episode feels different and I think it will end up bringing sweeping and irreversible change to the comic.  The direct intervention of this superhuman entity in the lives of the cast changes the entire genre of the work.  Farewell slice-of-life comedy, hello sci-fi adventure.  Now that Faye is tangled up in a situation of this gravity, the shadow of these events will never allow things to go back to "normal" for the gang.  In addition, we've absolutely seen an explosion in the number of recurring characters and the characters that are getting lines and facetime now are almost entirely different from the characters that were important just a couple of years ago.  The characters that do remain from the original comic have been given rapid character transformations (chalk it up to age maybe).

To me this is less jumping the shark and more "the shining Genji was dead."  I think this comic will be very different in plot and genre from here on out and that the action will revolve around a different set of characters.  What will happen to readership is perhaps not a major concern here for Jeph, he's just drawing what he wants to draw.  He's got a brand and other comics to help him out.

In any case, I expect we'll see more and more (human) characters go the way of Sara and Yelling Bird.

Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: gopher on 11 Jan 2017, 01:35
I have no problem with the comic evolving and I think we should have enough faith in Jeph to let him deliver his story. It seems very unlikely that a big old plot-hammer/DM fiat will fix everything, far more likely to develop the plot.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: osaka on 11 Jan 2017, 03:11
Secondly, Bubbles' decision is entirely comprehensible and believable. That doesn't make me happier about it. They may not require a direct 'price' but I'd be more concerned about the 'favour' they ask for some time later in exchange for not betraying Emily to the NSA for unauthorised access of all the classified defence data in Bubbles's head.

This kind of defeats the point of "No strings attached" that Mercedes here presented, don't you think? Technically nothing would stop Bubbles from breaking her up into her core components after the deal if there really are no strings attached.

Then again I doubt Bubbles would go tell on Emily anyways.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: tupsharru on 11 Jan 2017, 03:24
Scary Vampire Person is drawing on the same tropes as a crazy person with constantly changing aliases who likes to post on Charlie Stross' blog.  I don't recognize them.  Could someone explain more clearly than "Desire from the Expanse"?  Are we talking about the Neil Gaiman comic?  Where are the specific similarities?

There are some vampire tropes, either White Wolf or the novels that inspired WW, but I don't know enough to 'read' them either.  The name Rocco Basilisk is a joke about the LessWrong community, and that is another area of crazy that I just know a little about.

The comment about similarities with Ian M. Banks' Culture novels rings a bell too, but I only read one of those ... not my thing.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Case on 11 Jan 2017, 03:34
Emily is, well, Emily.  We're talking about someone who nearly summoned Cthulhu....
That is the kind of thing that would attract attention in some circles, yes. Unusual too. At least, I hope it's unusual.

Depends on where you're doing your Laundry, I s'pose ...  :mrgreen:
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Gyrre on 11 Jan 2017, 03:38
Huh. Does anybody else feel stupid for not thinking that they should just ask Emily for help?

She was set up quite some time ago (somewhere in the 2012-2014 range) to be an absurdly intelligent and skilled programmer/engineer.

EDIT: Tired brain typos
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: zmeiat_joro on 11 Jan 2017, 04:14
Scary Vampire Person is drawing on the same tropes as a crazy person with constantly changing aliases who likes to post on Charlie Stross' blog.  I don't recognize them.  Could someone explain more clearly than "Desire from the Expanse"?  Are we talking about the Neil Gaiman comic?  Where are the specific similarities?

There are some vampire tropes, either White Wolf or the novels that inspired WW, but I don't know enough to 'read' them either.  The name Rocco Basilisk is a joke about the LessWrong community, and that is another area of crazy that I just know a little about.

The comment about similarities with Ian M. Banks' Culture novels rings a bell too, but I only read one of those ... not my thing.

I know which person from Charlie's blog you're referring to, but I don't see that much similarity -- probably because New Character also physically resembles Desire from the Gaiman comic.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: brasca on 11 Jan 2017, 04:52
Bubbles consents, but does Emily? Did Emily know this person already?

According to Upscale Envy, Emily will enjoy the experience which makes me as curious about her past as much as our mysterious stranger.  If she didn't then Bubbles would resist since she wouldn't want someone losing their mind exploring her mind.   
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BenRG on 11 Jan 2017, 05:08
This kind of defeats the point of "No strings attached" that Mercedes here presented, don't you think?

I think that you are missing the point: "No strings attached" only means that they won't directly ask Bubbles for anything; what Bubbles might offer them in exchange for not shopping Emily is another matter altogether. That's her choice, not a 'string attached'.

Upon such technicalities is a demon's empire born.

FWIW, I'm expecting Emily and possibly Faye to have a virtual reality adventure in the inside of Bubbles' mind. The only way to unlock the memories is to be in there and confront the encryption as a physical barrier rather than a computing challenge. That way, the processing ability of Emily and Faye's minds can be used directly rather than through the filter of some crude interfacing computational device.

Naturally, this will end with Faye witnessing the moment that broke Bubbles from practically a first person perspective.

"This is my secret; this is my shame."
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: tupsharru on 11 Jan 2017, 05:13
Scary Vampire Person is drawing on the same tropes as a crazy person with constantly changing aliases who likes to post on Charlie Stross' blog.  I don't recognize them.  Could someone explain more clearly than "Desire from the Expanse"?  Are we talking about the Neil Gaiman comic?  Where are the specific similarities?

There are some vampire tropes, either White Wolf or the novels that inspired WW, but I don't know enough to 'read' them either.  The name Rocco Basilisk is a joke about the LessWrong community, and that is another area of crazy that I just know a little about.

The comment about similarities with Ian M. Banks' Culture novels rings a bell too, but I only read one of those ... not my thing.

I know which person from Charlie's blog you're referring to, but I don't see that much similarity -- probably because New Character also physically resembles Desire from the Gaiman comic.
I could find examples, but that would require reading their posts, and that way madness lies.  The gender-ambiguity, casual arrogance, random changes in topic and metaphor, references to elders and sanctity of mind, and allusiveness feel similar in Grey Face and "Minerva Owl" of the many handles.

But maybe "Minerva Owl"/HB was alluding to that comic? 

I feel like as a reader I am supposed to make a connection between Grey Face and some other characters in other settings, but I am not being given the information (like specific names) which I need to do so.  That is different from art where most of the meaning is at the surface, but there are nuances and side jokes hidden underneath (like  the name Rocco Basilisk).
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: islan on 11 Jan 2017, 05:16
What is even going on?  I think this is the first time this comic has ever completely lost me...

Did I miss somewhere where this character or who they represent were introduced?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: zmeiat_joro on 11 Jan 2017, 05:27
But maybe "Minerva Owl"/HB was alluding to that comic?
That's possible, but their (Minerva Owl's) style reminds me more of Delirium, only more pessimistic, or a mix of the two. And the sanctity of mind thing is a major thing that points to the Culture novels (for Grey Face). That's why I said they seem like a mix of Desire from the Gaiman comic and an AI from the Culture (specifically the Interesting Times Gang).
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: zmeiat_joro on 11 Jan 2017, 05:51
What is even going on?  I think this is the first time this comic has ever completely lost me...

Did I miss somewhere where this character or who they represent were introduced?
It's a new character. We have yet to see, that's kind of the point.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: zmeiat_joro on 11 Jan 2017, 07:59
I just talked to an acquaintance who has PTSD and partial amnesia and he said he does not want to get back those memories,  it isineresting that Bubbles wants them back, but I guess it's a different case -- I imagene hew memories were purged more thoroughly.  He mentioned he had to fight child soldiers.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: JimC on 11 Jan 2017, 09:11
I think it will end up bringing sweeping and irreversible change to the comic.  The direct intervention of this superhuman entity in the lives of the cast changes the entire genre of the work.  Farewell slice-of-life comedy, hello sci-fi adventure.  Now that Faye is tangled up in a situation of this gravity, the shadow of these events will never allow things to go back to "normal" for the gang.

I dunno. Life isn't like that. There's a fault - at least I see it as a fault - that many creators get caught up in of constant escalation. Every new volume has to see the hero in greater peril, a new and more powerful supervillain, you've all seen it. But in real life its not like that. Arguably the most intense and dramatic part of my father's life was 40 odd strike missions at the age of 23 from an aircraft carrier in the Korean War, and, thank goodness, nothing else had that level of intensity. And yes, those few months and the loss of some of his comrades did leave a shadow, but nevertheless things did get back to normal.

I don't find a need for the constant escalation. I can go and read earlier volumes in a series  of books without thinking, gosh I wish this villain was as OTT as the later one.  So if our writer takes this particular arc to its conclusion and never feels the need for something quite so extreme again, that will be just fine by me. If readers grow older with the author then perhaps there are a whole new lost of concerns and slices of life to explore for them without needing an even more puissant and ambiguous character than our current putative hivemind in gray.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 11 Jan 2017, 09:28
@stibbons,

Welcome, new person!

An electrical shock across the lower spinal column might do what Albino Creepatron did to Faye.

I don't think her group is the equivalent of Anonymous. They refer to someone with an orbital railgun as "less puissant". The attitude and a subset of the capabilities are similar.

What worries me is that AC seems to feel no concern or friendship toward squishies. Something to the effect "they seem to like us" was how the characters reconciled themselves to the Singularity.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: thedevilissix on 11 Jan 2017, 09:49

Honestly?

As someone who's followed QC for near eight years, bought books, bought my wife a bear monster shirt, and owns Pintsize and Winslow plushes.... yes.  This story arc does feel like a jump the shark moment.


I blame Alice Grove.  :-D
Nah, joking aside, I welcome the leaping of this here Hammerhead hurdle. As far from the comic's starting premise as it seems to me to be, I find it quite exciting!
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Morituri on 11 Jan 2017, 09:58
It's my guess that the colloidal-silver overdosed person here has an agenda which includes getting corpse witch the hell out of the way and (possibly) setting up something even worse than her business.

And we haven't seen how they propose to do this yet; for all we know he's going to give Emily something like a way to hack into Corpse Witch's memory and get the key to Bubbles'.  'Cause I bet they don't mind a bit if CW winds up lobotomized.  It just eliminates some potential competition (?).
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Rincewind on 11 Jan 2017, 10:05
I'm starting to dread the Friday Cliffhanger already.  Will an unsuccessful mind-meld send Bubb-ily out into the streets on a NOMAD-ish rampage? 
Just have to stay tuned to this bat-channel and find out, I guess.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: zmeiat_joro on 11 Jan 2017, 10:33
I did not initiate the conversation about war, he did, I want to specify that.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Case on 11 Jan 2017, 10:39
All these comparisons to "Desire of the Endless" made me realize there's a whole new generation that has no idea who Annie Lennox is ...

Neither Desire, nor Death, nor Dream somehow sprang freshly formed out of the minds of Neil Gaiman & Mike Dringenberg. Their looks are based on, respectively: Annie Lennox (British 80s Pop-icon & Eurythmics Frontwoman), Cinamon Hadley, and a blend of Robert Smith (Frontman of 80s Pop-band The Cure) and Mr. Gaiman himself.

(https://cdn.empowernetwork.com/user_images/post/2013/05/01/1/99/6d94/540_293_resize_20130501_1996d94e373155d60e6a0147c861a18e_jpg.jpg)(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/ac/Desire001.jpg)
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/08/Cindeath.jpg)
(http://www.nndb.com/people/517/000024445/robert-smith.jpg)(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/b/b9/Dream_%28comics%29.jpg)

Those are simply iconic, archetypical 1980's looks. Tons of people were trying to emulate them (with more-or-less horrible results). If you were born as a Gen-Xer - like e.g. a certain author of a certain obscure webcomic - you'd meet people dressed like that at school, see them on the street, you'd hang out with them (or mock them, if you were an asshat), or you were one of the people who dressed like that - Goth/Wave was simply a 'normal' subculture look.

Edited: For rantiness ...
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: StevenC on 11 Jan 2017, 10:46

Honestly?

As someone who's followed QC for near eight years, bought books, bought my wife a bear monster shirt, and owns Pintsize and Winslow plushes.... yes.  This story arc does feel like a jump the shark moment.


I blame Alice Grove.  :-D
Nah, joking aside, I welcome the leaping of this here Hammerhead hurdle. As far from the comic's starting premise as it seems to me to be, I find it quite exciting!
The end of QC is going to be the beginning of Alice Grove.
Pintsize is Alice.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: A small perverse otter on 11 Jan 2017, 11:07
Just because Agent Creepypasta doesn't want anything for their actions doesn't mean that Bubbles won't pay terribly for them.  Those memories were intolerable to her -- does she really want them back?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Method of Madness on 11 Jan 2017, 11:28

Honestly?

As someone who's followed QC for near eight years, bought books, bought my wife a bear monster shirt, and owns Pintsize and Winslow plushes.... yes.  This story arc does feel like a jump the shark moment.


I blame Alice Grove.  :-D
Nah, joking aside, I welcome the leaping of this here Hammerhead hurdle. As far from the comic's starting premise as it seems to me to be, I find it quite exciting!
The end of QC is going to be the beginning of Alice Grove.
Pintsize is Alice.
As valid a guess as any!
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 11 Jan 2017, 11:52
If the strip never changed that would be a kind of death.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: jwhouk on 11 Jan 2017, 12:07
Now I'm gonna hear Annie Lennox voicing Alucard...

Sent from my Nextbook on Tapatalk

Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Tova on 11 Jan 2017, 12:30
They may not require a direct 'price' but I'd be more concerned about the 'favour' they ask for some time later in exchange for not betraying Emily to the NSA for unauthorised access of all the classified defence data in Bubbles's head.

I think that you are missing the point: "No strings attached" only means that they won't directly ask Bubbles for anything; what Bubbles might offer them in exchange for not shopping Emily is another matter altogether. That's her choice, not a 'string attached'.

I think I'm missing it as well, I'm afraid. Blackmail and volunteered assistance are somewhat different things.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BenRG on 11 Jan 2017, 12:39
In the criminal mind, or those minds for whom typical ideas of ethics are curious alien cultural artefacts, they are essentially indistinguishable.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Case on 11 Jan 2017, 12:51
In the criminal mind, or those minds for whom typical ideas of ethics are curious alien cultural artefacts, they are essentially indistinguishable.

Uhmmmmhnope? Blackmail requires the blackmailer to take action/do work, voluntary assistance doesn't?

Pretty sure that whoever you have in mind wouldn't fail to notice the difference.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: CrowFairy on 11 Jan 2017, 13:03
My head feels fuzzy today, so I'm not entirely up-to-date on the thread. I saw a conversation about the color of the agent's eyes and how we would classify them.

I finally came up with "mulberry" and looked it up.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mulberry_(color)

If you do the drop-downs toward the bottom of the page, you can see other colors in the same range.

The color that was linked earlier: http://www.color-hex.com/color/961851

It looks most like red-violet (distinct from red violet), amaranth purple, magenta dye, and telemagenta. I'm personally leaning toward telemagenta.


Also, has anyone suggested that they merely scan Bubbles? Surely Station has the tech to scan without triggering any sensitive systems.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BenRG on 11 Jan 2017, 13:10
Pretty sure that whoever you have in mind wouldn't fail to notice the difference.

They're welcome to; the criminal just doesn't have to care about that.

"Did you hear us demand something in exchange for not doing this? No! we're just, as a professional courtesy, letting you know that we're tossing Azuma to the wolves; she's far too dangerous to leave in circulation. Now, on a completely different subject, there's the guy in town that we really, really don't like..."

"Are you asking me to kill someone for you in exchange for you not destroying that young woman's life?"

"We don't know... Why, is that the offer that you're making to us?"
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Case on 11 Jan 2017, 13:22
"we're just, as a professional courtesy, letting you know that we're tossing Azuma to the wolves"

Even in that further narrowed example you present here (you've already implicitly given up the claim to generality that your previous post implies): That's two actions already - communicating the threat to the victim (exposing yourself - which necessitates further measures from you in order to safeguard yourself against repercussions arising from the target seeking help, e.g. from the police, or seeking vengeance), and setting up the threat (in this case, creating a situation that is threatening the well-being of Emily) that is intended to spur the target into doing smth. they would not normally do. Not to mention the work implied in finding out precisely what action would be likely to make the target pliable.

Voluntary help, otoh, would only require you to communicate your need.

Again, no matter their psychological abnormalities, the criminals you have in mind would not fail to notice the difference between "Intense, risky work and preparation were necessary to create a situation that made them perform an action beneficiary to me" and "I just needed to tell them what I needed".
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BenRG on 11 Jan 2017, 13:32
I still don't get why you're over-analysing it. You seem to think that someone would care about the difference.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Kugai on 11 Jan 2017, 13:33
While I believe that Marten, Faye, Dora and Co will still be the main Core Cast of the Comic, there coes a point where storylines have to change and alter or the Comic simply begins to recycle itself and you begin to loose your readers.

Jeph has shown a willingness to innovate and introduce interesting and diverse characters in order to maintain our interest and keep us both reading and speculating on where he's going next.  This may be one of those moments and I'm well and truly intrigued to see where the current Story Arc is going.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Storel on 11 Jan 2017, 14:08
Now I'm gonna hear Annie Lennox voicing Alucard...

Now I'm envisioning "Alucard" doing karaoke of "Walking on Broken Glass"...
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Tova on 11 Jan 2017, 14:08
If you've given your word that there are no string attached, and you never lie, the difference matters a great deal.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: oeoek on 11 Jan 2017, 14:21
A couple of things have me wondering. 'Darling, we think you know what we are'. One thing is the 'what we are'. Not 'who we are'... I guess we are talking a very distinct group or organization here, with a clear goal. And while Bubbles does not react to the statement in itself, her consent in the end indicates she does have an idea, and seems to trust them... What does Bubbles know that we don't?

And would I trust someone looking like Emily in panel 2 to mess with my brain?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: danuis on 11 Jan 2017, 14:35
I think we keep forgetting that this is a world where:

1) Artifical Intelligence exists and it has human, or Turing grade, capability of sapience/sophence.
2) During the adventures of the gang, the FRIGGIN SINGULARITY happened.

Those two things already have, for all intents and purposes, and especially the latter, removed humanity from the focus if we were looking at the world as a whole. From that point forward, Humans are less 'Masters of the world' to 'partners' to 'pets' or, more amicably, 'birds' compared to the AIs. Humans are around, sure, they have their wars and their nation states and populace, but now you have a whole new form of life alongside and increasingly independent of Humanity. And as the first few generations of AI who worked with humanity are superseded by post-singularity AI, stuff like this where Faye herself is more and more 'powerless', for lack of a better world, will logically occur.

For now, I'm interested with how Jeph will compose this storyline. It's not #1777/#1780 anymore, the greater world that QC has built is showing up, is all, at least how I'm seeing it.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BenRG on 11 Jan 2017, 14:57
If you've given your word that there are no string attached, and you never lie, the difference matters a great deal.

Not really; you never ask for anything; no strings attached. If, at some point in the future, when hearing of your future plans, people you've previously helped volunteer to carry out services for you in exchange for you changing your plans, then that is entirely their prerogative. You're not actually asking for anything form them so there are no strings. If anything, they're the ones attaching strings to you by making their favours in return conditional!
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Case on 11 Jan 2017, 15:03
I still don't get why you're over-analysing it.

In two questions to "Argument from Motives" (http://utminers.utep.edu/omwilliamson/ENGL1311/fallacies.htm) - > You've given up making arguments that support your claim ("In the criminal mind, or those minds for whom typical ideas of ethics are curious alien cultural artefacts, they are essentially indistinguishable.") entirely and are trying to make the discussion about my motive for asking questions about your statement instead ...

My Motive? I wanted to understand the rationale behind a statement (see above) about a subset of the human population that appeared to me to be not obvious (and that I suspect to be false). The experience is sometimes referred to as "cognitive dissonance", and many people find it highly irritating. One can resolve cognitive dissonance e.g. by dismissal ("That's obviously wrong", "Who cares?"), by attempting to silence the source of the offending statement ("We don't want that kind of talk here"), by resignation ("That's beyond me") or ... by attempting to understand the train of thought that led to the statement.

The latter one is most commonly achieved by asking questions and analysing the answers. It's also my preferred mode of dealing with cognitive dissonance. Maybe that's also the reason why I enjoy participating in online discussions & register as member of Discussion-Fora?

Anyhow - I think I have my answer.

You seem to think that someone would care about the difference.

Yes, I believe I do!
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Tova on 11 Jan 2017, 15:09
If you've given your word that there are no string attached, and you never lie, the difference matters a great deal.

Not really; you never ask for anything; no strings attached. If, at some point in the future, when hearing of your future plans, people you've previously helped volunteer to carry out services for you in exchange for you changing your plans, then that is entirely their prerogative. You're not actually asking for anything form them so there are no strings. If anything, they're the ones attaching strings to you by making their favours in return conditional!

Okay, fine. So maybe you could clear this up for me. My confusion arise from the original post. Why so concerned? If Bubbles volunteers to carry out services for them, then I don't see an issue.

They may not require a direct 'price' but I'd be more concerned about the 'favour' they ask for some time later in exchange for not betraying Emily to the NSA for unauthorised access of all the classified defence data in Bubbles's head.

You've kind of backtracked on this, just admit it and we can all move on.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: brasca on 11 Jan 2017, 15:50
If you've given your word that there are no string attached, and you never lie, the difference matters a great deal.

For me it's Little Bird.

I also thought of Annie Lennox since Upscale Envy looks very similar to her in that Sweet Dreams video.  I was just a kid at the time, but she scared the hell out of me then.  This lookalike has a similar effect all these years later.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: zmeiat_joro on 11 Jan 2017, 17:04
You do know that Desire is based on Annie Lennox and David Bowie?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Gyrre on 11 Jan 2017, 17:39

I'd actually say sometime around Marten + Claire = end of "regular" QC.  I would have liked the strip to end at #2882 (https://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2882) (sad ending), but would have been fine with #2890 (https://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2890) (happy ending).  Oh well.  So it goes.

/tangent
So would that make everything that's happened since a spinoff? Like what Skin Horse is to Narbonic, but with more characters from the previous comic being present.

EDIT: forgot to specify segment in quote
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: brasca on 11 Jan 2017, 17:58
You do know that Desire is based on Annie Lennox and David Bowie?

I'm referring to Envy from Fullmetal Alchemist.  I didn't think his character was influenced by Desire even though the names are similar.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: jwhouk on 11 Jan 2017, 19:02
I'm still saying Ms. Lennox is the voice character for our silver-faced friend.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 11 Jan 2017, 19:41
"Do let us know if you start to go insane".

There I was, all primed to read that line as being a setup, and Emily said
"How will I know"

and the rest of that sentence just spoiled my fun.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Perfectly Reasonable on 11 Jan 2017, 19:46
First off, I'm with tupsharru and islan. I know not of this Desire of Expanse. And if Jeph is relying on 'ooh, -everybody- knows that' to carry his storyline, then he's not the storyteller I think he is.

In our world, the way to figure out a possibly compromised computer is to make a copy of its hard drive and mess with that. Here, that is not an option. Let's back up a few parasangs. We know, via Bubbles, that making backup copies of an AI is possible. But when you start the copy running, you have (I believe) created a new AI with all the ethical baggage that implies. (Such an AI will quickly become a distinct individual as soon as it starts accumulating its own life experiences.) And testing it, possibly destroying it, is the same as murder. So you -must- work directly with the AI involved. And Station fears his investigating might harm Bubbles, by setting off a logic bomb or some similar trap. So how is having Emily do the job any different? When GreyCreep says 'this is as much for our personal satisfaction', it's the first time I can believe what she's saying. GreyCreep assumes  that Emily will go along with this, which I find interesting. It looks like GC & Co have been keeping tabs on Emily and are confident that she will be able to achieve something useful, or at least entertaining.

Bubbles, having made an existential leap of faith, clearly knows stuff about GreyCreep & Co that we don't.

I look forward to seeing where this goes.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: WareWolf on 11 Jan 2017, 19:53
Emily is capable of breaking/hacking/slipping through an encryption that advanced AIs don't even want to touch?

...Did we know this already? I don't remember knowing this already.

Emily apparently has some wild coding talent (remember, her college project had to be EMP'd by the NRO for displaying "eldritch runes").

But God damn it, if Pale Agent hurts Emily or even puts her in a position to be hurt, I am going to be highly upset.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Gladstone on 11 Jan 2017, 19:57
Ever since Hannelore took Marten and Marigold to outer space to celebrate her father's birthday on his very own space station, the notion that QC could ever really "jump the shark" has been meaningless.  Despite being set in a post-singularity present world similar to ours But With Robots, Jeph has always managed to keep the comic grounded despite all the weirdness.  QC can't jump the shark.  It's impossible...

...except, well, everything since Faye met Bubbles at the underground robot fighting ring has just felt like a rejected prequel storyline from Alice Grove, which is why I stopped following daily updates several months ago.  It might not jump the shark, but it's not really the QC I used to know.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Storel on 11 Jan 2017, 20:05
"Unless we got particular pleasure out of fooling you into agreeing to it first."

That's not helping, Silverbot!!
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Truec on 11 Jan 2017, 20:05
First off, I'm with tupsharru and islan. I know not of this Desire of Expanse. And if Jeph is relying on 'ooh, -everybody- knows that' to carry his storyline, then he's not the storyteller I think he is.

If you're complaining that Jeph made a pop culture reference that some readers might understand, then I'm kinda curious what comic you've been reading, because it certainly wasn't this one.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Case on 11 Jan 2017, 21:17
"Do let us know if you start to go insane".

There I was, all primed to read that line as being a setup, and Emily said
"How will I know"

and the rest of that sentence just spoiled my fun.

In my neck of the woods, (very, very young-ish) people would say "Zwei Doofe, ein Gedanke" ("Two idiots, one thought") ...

... ruined a perfectly good pun here, Jeph did.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Carl-E on 11 Jan 2017, 21:25
Gladstone's post made me wonder.  How much has the strip really changed?  Faye had some memories she didn't want to face, and that altered her personality to a great extent until she was able to tell her friends and with their support face them, visiting home to yell at her father's grave.  Her coping mechanism - drinking to forget - had serious effects on her life. 

Bubbles, on the other hand, enlisted aid to lock the memories she can't face away.  And now, after confessing to someone who cares, has the opportunity to face them with the help of - well, an acquaintance who beat on her armor with a rubber mallet.  But her coping mechanism of having her brain partitioned by someone who then held it over her has also had serious effects on her life. 

I know, it's a stretch, but the point is that these are problems of a psycho-emotional nature, and it's the support of your network of friends that makes it possible to deal with them. 

I do think Ms. Grey is a plot device being introduced to bring the issue to fruition without having to go another thousand strips just to get there.  I'm wondering if it's going to be a throwaway background story, like DoKYA was with Steve. 


I hope not, though. 
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: mneme on 11 Jan 2017, 21:43
Eh.  So much shark jumping.  If you don't like the comic, stop reading.  If anything, I rather like that the comic that's always about nothing has started to eventually have epicycles where actual plot happens.  It's like one of the easiest on-ramp SF stories ever.

I'm guessing that the actual price on the "no strings attached" "we'll provide all the equipment, we just want you to hack into your friend's head and break her encryption" is that they get to watch.  Emily's a powerful polymath who can break the usual rules -- so it's not unlikely that if they record her breaking unbreakable-grade encryption, they'll be able to turn that into a program that breaks that grade of encryption.

But it's hard to tell how serious to take the Laundry-esque math=magic=insanity bits of plot that have shown up.


Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Kugai on 11 Jan 2017, 22:03
Stll don't entirely trust Agent Creepy with either Bubbles or Emily, but she has an interesting sense of humor

And stand by for a Matrixy journey into the world and mind of Bubbles
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Morituri on 11 Jan 2017, 22:34
Agent Creepy, as we're calling him/her/it, derives far too much enjoyment out of playing with people's distrust.

Oddly enough, this is a thing that some people in the computer security field do on purpose, to impress upon clients the importance of caution.  And, if they're honest about it, because it's fun.  So I've seen it before.

I'm imagining some serious mood whiplash when this gets done.  Something like Emily taking off the headset awkwardly, saying "Miss Bubbles?  I, uh, got your memory back.  I'm so sorry..."  and then giving Bubbles a hug while breaking up in tears as Agent Creepy walks out very pleased with itself.

On the other hand, does Emily get to keep that interface device?  And if so what will she do with it later?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: pwhodges on 11 Jan 2017, 23:16
If you're complaining that Jeph made a pop culture reference that some readers might understand, then I'm kinda curious what comic you've been reading, because it certainly wasn't this one.

Emily herself is a Japanese pop-culture reference, after all - but knowing that's not necessary to understanding her.

"Do let us know if you start to go insane" - best line for a long time.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BenRG on 11 Jan 2017, 23:20
Yep; as I predicted, Emily is going on a VR tour of the inside of Bubbles' mind. The only thing that I'm disappointed about is that Faye isn't currently invited along as a logic co-processor to stop Emily wandering off after some unicorn and/or rainbow.

I do like the request to "Do let us know if you start to go insane". The counter-point is: "How would Emily know?"

"Unless we got particular pleasure out of fooling you into agreeing to it first."

That's not helping, Silverbot!!

It's not meant to help; it's just them rubbing in the fact that they hold all the cards and are enjoying it. When you make a deal with the devil, you also have to tolerate his sick sense of humour.

If you've given your word that there are no string attached, and you never lie, the difference matters a great deal.

Not really; you never ask for anything; no strings attached. If, at some point in the future, when hearing of your future plans, people you've previously helped volunteer to carry out services for you in exchange for you changing your plans, then that is entirely their prerogative. You're not actually asking for anything form them so there are no strings. If anything, they're the ones attaching strings to you by making their favours in return conditional!

Okay, fine. So maybe you could clear this up for me. My confusion arise from the original post. Why so concerned? If Bubbles volunteers to carry out services for them, then I don't see an issue.

Really? Because those services are only debatably legal!

They may not require a direct 'price' but I'd be more concerned about the 'favour' they ask for some time later in exchange for not betraying Emily to the NSA for unauthorised access of all the classified defence data in Bubbles's head.

You've kind of backtracked on this, just admit it and we can all move on.

No, they're the same thing just expressed differently. Never ask but manipulate into offering voluntarily, possibly with airily implied menaces. Oh, and act reluctant but admit that you need the favour and, if not doing the bad thing is the price then you can possibly see your way to agreeing.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: ZoeB on 11 Jan 2017, 23:32
"Unless we got particular pleasure out of fooling you into agreeing to it first."

That's not helping, Silverbot!!

Actually, from my viewpoint, it is. Sometimes it helps to point out the obvious.
This strip encapsulates all I was going to write in a post, but didn't.
If this entity was malevolent, it didn't need to go to so much trouble.
If this entity was dishonest, it wouldn't have pointed out why it might not be trustworthy.
Its actions have been entirely consistent with its words.

So while I still would have preferred getting Station's opinion first, and while I wish Momo was involved in the Journey To The Centre Of the Bubbles as an additional chaperone if she approves..

I'm starting to warm to this entity. It thinks like I do.

Damn, Jeph's good, isn't he?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Gyrre on 11 Jan 2017, 23:54
"Unless we got particular pleasure out of fooling you into agreeing to it first."

That's not helping, Silverbot!!
I just misread "Silverbot" as 'Silverbolt' and now I'm trying to peg one of the many voices Scott McNeil (http://m.imdb.com/name/nm0573926/filmotype/actor?ref_=m_nmfm_1) has done to our mysterious mulberry-eyed pale presence.

Though that line just went Ratrap in my head.

EDIT: If you watched American or Canadian cartoons at any point in the last 40 years, you've probably heard him voice at least 4 characters. Quite often in the same show (Ratrap, Dinobot, Silverbot, and Quickstrike in Beast Wars)
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: nfearnley on 12 Jan 2017, 00:28
To clarify, the new character seems to use the pronouns: we/our/ourselves/us
"We're what wakes them up screaming."
"We picked up on your little crisis..."
"...our less puissant elders"
"...we're sure provide you..."
"We don't normally involve ourselves..."
"...we have a bit of a sentimental streak..."
"...what we are offering:"
"We'll poke around..."
"...we'll crack it..."
"...we'll remove it."
"We're afraid you'll have to..."
"We really don't think you will."
"We require your presence"
"...were were going to go rooting..."
"Gives us the shivers..."
"...we'll have Ms. Azuma do it."
"We daresay..."
"...consent to us cracking..."
"Darling, we think you know what we are. And we never lie."
"You have our word."
"...our personal satisfaction..."
"Do tell us if you start to go insane."
"Unless we got particular pleasure..."

Others refer to them with the pronouns: they
"They seem nice"
"If they wished to do me harm, they would have done so already."

My best guest is that their third person pronouns would be they/them: http://pronoun.is/they

Their first person pronouns would be we/us: http://pronoun.is/we/us/our/ours/ourselves
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Gyrre on 12 Jan 2017, 01:54
If you're complaining that Jeph made a pop culture reference that some readers might understand, then I'm kinda curious what comic you've been reading, because it certainly wasn't this one.

Emily herself is a Japanese pop-culture reference, after all - but knowing that's not necessary to understanding her.

"Do let us know if you start to go insane" - best line for a long time.
Do you mean Françoise Appledelhi mixed with a handful of other characters from manga and anime?

On the other hand, does Emily get to keep that interface device?  And if so what will she do with it later?
I was going to say 'make friends with satelites', but hasn't she already done that?
Perhaps she'll help some bounty hunters find an old chess master who's gone off his rocker.

EDIT: "Françoise Appledelhi", aka "Ed", aka "Radical Edward", aka "Edward Wong Hau Pepelu Tivrusky IV".
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: pwhodges on 12 Jan 2017, 02:11
To clarify, the new character seems to use the pronouns: we/our/ourselves/us

Conventionally, that makes them royalty.  Are we about to discover that robots have a monarchy? 

Alternatively, and more obviously, it is simply because they are the avatar of a collective cloud-connected being, in computing terms a cluster, which is how some of us interpreted it from their first appearance.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: pwhodges on 12 Jan 2017, 02:15
Do you mean Françoise Appledelhi mixed with a handful of other characters from manga and anime?

Emily is drawn in anime style; her surname is Azuma, the name of the author of Azumanga Daioh, one of Jeph's favourite manga and animes, and she has (or had while her hair was longer) a passing resemblance to Sakaki in that series.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: JimC on 12 Jan 2017, 02:46
I still think the point Bubbles is missing is that she doesn't want the memories back, she only needs to know they are recoverable. That being the case all that may be required is to recover the encrption key. Of course our writer may not want to make it that simple. In real life id be shouting stop, lets not rush this, lets evaluate the situation carefully and plan what to do.

After all if Ms Hivemind or whatever they/she is is ethical then the offer will be open indefinitely, and if she/they are not then best not to potentially make things worse.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BenRG on 12 Jan 2017, 02:50
@JimC,

The encryption key would be in Corpse Witch's head. No, what we're about to see here is the breaking of the encryption; it's the only thing that could be done in Bubbles' head.

FWIW, and posting as a shameless semi-brony, given Bubbles' fascination with unicorns and their realm as her 'happy place', I wouldn't be even slightly surprised if Jeph has whatever anti-encryption code Emily creates manifests itself in Bubbles' mindscape as some facsimile of the Elements of Harmony (http://mlp.wikia.com/wiki/Elements_of_Harmony).
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: osaka on 12 Jan 2017, 03:58
Do you mean Françoise Appledelhi mixed with a handful of other characters from manga and anime?

Emily is drawn in anime style; her surname is Azuma, the name of the author of Azumanga Daioh, one of Jeph's favourite manga and animes, and she has (or had while her hair was longer) a passing resemblance to Sakaki in that series.

Emily was a loving homage to the girl on my avatar, but it's true that she's about 37cm taller than Kasuga Ayumu. Which also makes her about 8 inches taller than Sakaki - she's large, and the largest character in the manga, but not that large. I think the resemblance started and ended in the long, straight black hair since Sakaki is presented much more...
umm...
thicc pls don't hate me

As for Mercedes right there I'm really starting to like the character as well. As Zoe pointed out, as creepy as they might appear they have not been dishonest at any point, just lacking any resemblance of chill. Which doesn't automatically make them evil. Chaotic good maybe?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Tova on 12 Jan 2017, 03:59
This all brings up a point that I'm not sure has yet been discussed.

How well is Bubbles going to cope with suddenly being confronted with these long-dormant memories?

Even in the best-case scenario, this is going to be pretty painful.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: osaka on 12 Jan 2017, 04:00
Faye's boobs are still a very powerful narcotic, even for Bubbles.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: heyjames4 on 12 Jan 2017, 04:20
In ancient scrolls, when messengers from the heavens revealed themselves to mankind, the first words they speak are "be not afraid"
 this arc does good showing why how that's a thing
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: brasca on 12 Jan 2017, 04:51
Emily doesn't have a problem with any of this so maybe she has the right kind of mind for the job in more ways than one.  She has the technical skills, but perhaps her unique personality means she can possibly witness or even experience the same things as Bubbles and not end up an emotional wreck later.  As such it's best that Faye not tag along since she's still dealing with her own post traumatic stress.

BenRG theorized that Hannelore has some kind of master code she can use to shut down any AI in case of an emergency.  Perhaps that's why Upscale Envy chose a day when she wasn't at work to pay a visit. 
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: StevenC on 12 Jan 2017, 05:19
Most people seem to think the grey maybe-maybenot AI is a government agent.
Am I the only one who got an immediate vibe of Mephisto? As in Faustian deal Mephisto? Is an AI Satan a thing post-singularity?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Case on 12 Jan 2017, 05:21
If this entity was dishonest, it wouldn't have pointed out why it might not be trustworthy.

Unless it had anticipated Bubbles' would reason along the same lines, and had therefore pointed out one reason not to trust it in order to mask it's untrustworthiness ...  :evil:



Faye's boobs are still a very powerful narcotic, even for Bubbles.

Additionally, Hanners has shown some talent in the "Hugging it better"-department.



Most people seem to think the grey maybe-maybenot AI is a government agent.
Am I the only one who got an immediate vibe of Mephisto? As in Faustian deal Mephisto? Is an AI Satan a thing post-singularity?

Satan as in "Quasi-Supernatural Entity with the sole goal of ruining humanity spiritually and morally"? No. Not in SF-lit, as far as I can recall. In "serious" discussions about AI ... IDK. Off-the-cuff I'd say that judging from the one secure datapoint for intelligence that we have - ourselves - it would not be rational to expect an AI to develop into an artificial Satan (in the boundaries of the definition in my above line), for lack of human examples (I recognize that the veracity of that statement is highly dependent on one's definition of 'evil' in general, and 'sole aim' as well as 'ruin' in particular). I think 'satanic' behaviour simply "doesn't pay of", in a (very vague) game-theory sense, or in the sense of "parsimonious use of ones resources".   

The closest I can recall is the Eschaton in Charlie Stross' Singularity Sky (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singularity_Sky) - but that's more like a dialed-up Skynet that believes in the principle of applying the minimum of violence necessary to protect itself from humanity meddling with causality in its historic lightcone. Where "minimum violence" can include a planetary civilisation violating it's commandment suddenly finding itself in the path of a city-sized asteroid.

Not strictly speaking evil, but terribly, terribly ... un-empathetic.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Stibbons on 12 Jan 2017, 05:41
This all brings up a point that I'm not sure has yet been discussed.

How well is Bubbles going to cope with suddenly being confronted with these long-dormant memories?

Even in the best-case scenario, this is going to be pretty painful.

She has friends.

Also suddenly finding that she is equipped with tearducts, perhaps courtesy of Anonybot.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: retrosteve on 12 Jan 2017, 05:58
A lot of people mentioning Emily's lack of consent. I am more worried about her utter lack of understanding of her objective.

She wasn't even awake for the exposition part of this game. She knows little or nothing about what Bubbles has in her head or even that she wants memories back, or does not. Even presuming that Emily has some amazing ability to hack encryption and that the UI is intuitive enough for her to use correctly on the first try, does she know why it might be helpful? A goal?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: retrosteve on 12 Jan 2017, 06:08
To clarify, the new character seems to use the pronouns: we/our/ourselves/us

Conventionally, that makes them royalty.  Are we about to discover that robots have a monarchy? 

Alternatively, and more obviously, it is simply because they are the avatar of a collective cloud-connected being, in computing terms a cluster, which is how some of us interpreted it from their first appearance.

Alternatively alternatively, the grey entity is a member of the shadowy agency Androgynous People In Grey and is speaking on behalf of the organisation as a whole.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BenRG on 12 Jan 2017, 06:10
A lot of people mentioning Emily's lack of consent. I am more worried about her utter lack of understanding of her objective.

She wasn't even awake for the exposition part of this game. She knows little or nothing about what Bubbles has in her head or even that she wants memories back, or does not. Even presuming that Emily has some amazing ability to hack encryption and that the UI is intuitive enough for her to use correctly on the first try, does she know why it might be helpful? A goal?


The UI is the key; if it is successful in establishing to Emily on a subconscious/instinctive level that the encryption is a narrative 'bad guy', then she'll try to take it down, irrespective of what these avatars are in real life.

(http://img10.deviantart.net/1733/i/2012/219/a/9/where_everything_began__by_snowedearth-d5a66g5.png)

"Once upon a time, in the magical land of Unicorn Valley, a wicked Corpse Witch placed a barrier across the land, keeping the Unicorns from taking their foals to the Sugar Hills where the best grazing may be found. All despaired until, one day, a clever little girl named Emily fell into the land to confront the barrier and the wicked Witch. To prove that the light of a pure heart can conquer any barrier.

"This is the story of how imagination, love, tolerance and the Magic of Friendship can conquer any evil and bring happiness to all. This is the story of the finding of the Rainbow of Light...

"This is the story of Emily and Her Little Ponies!"
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Case on 12 Jan 2017, 07:50
(http://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/444/561/751.png)
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: CrowFairy on 12 Jan 2017, 08:03
Someday I think we will point to Faye's punching of Corpse Witch to be the moment QC officially jumped the shark. The "show about nothing" has delved deep into science fiction and now Desire of the Endless has shown up to throw urban fantasy into the mix.

"Punching the Shark (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/JumpingTheShark)" :mrgreen:



If I had to pin down a shark jump...

I originally thought it was around #1845 (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=1845), when Marten and Hannelore discovered the Secret Bakery and its obvious alternate-universe characters... probably after it was revealed that the episode wasn't a one-shot throwaway joke.  Still, I did like Padma as a character, and other storylines around that time.  Things continued meandering, even through the occasional AI exposition (#2085 (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2085), et al.).

I blame Alice Grove.  :-D
Nah, ...

I haven't read past the first few weeks of that one, but QC's recent sci-fi robotshop "Corpse Witch" plunge has definitely escalating beyond the normal hijinks of Momo, May, and Pintsize.

I'd actually say sometime around Marten + Claire = end of "regular" QC.  I would have liked the strip to end at #2882 (https://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2882) (sad ending), but would have been fine with #2890 (https://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2890) (happy ending).  Oh well.  So it goes.

/tangent
See, after reading this, I was just like, "The whole comic has been in a similar, strange tone." But then I remembered that some of the characters went to a space station for a birthday party, and the station is actually sentient and can project itself into a human-ish form for easier communication. If that's not a shark jump, I have no idea what is.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: wlewisiii on 12 Jan 2017, 08:08

"This is the story of Emily and Her Little Ponies!"[/b]

Why do I get an image more like the Warhammer 40k MLP Army?

(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-wnn_QAF2hwo/VNeznkvOxDI/AAAAAAAAsvQ/9VPGlAoLk2s/s1600/10294297_569227429860751_5626194544027820831_n.jpg)
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Jakk Frost on 12 Jan 2017, 08:10
I'm not saying I don't like the new character or anything like that, but at the moment I kinda feel like Mario and Luigi listening to the Jaws theme.

(edit) and looking back now, I see others have made similar observations.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: USS Martenclaire on 12 Jan 2017, 08:52
Next week I want a series of strips where Pintsize and Winslow help a Roomba to jump a paddling pool full of goldfish. :D
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Neberu on 12 Jan 2017, 08:55
Did I miss the frame where the Avatar of Nightmare disabled Faye? Bubble mentions it in the 2nd to last frame but I couldn't find a reference to it in the art of the previous comic.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 12 Jan 2017, 09:03
Others refer to them with the pronouns: they
"They seem nice"
"If they wished to do me harm, they would have done so already."

Welcome, new person!

Hmm. You've accumulated evidence to weaken the idea that AC is using gender-neutral pronouns because they're non-binary. Everyone else refers to AC the same way. Either the rest of the cast are very polite and picked up on AC's pronouns by reflex, or else everyone knows that AC is or represents a computational cluster.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 12 Jan 2017, 09:05
Did I miss the frame where the Avatar of Nightmare disabled Faye? Bubble mentions it in the 2nd to last frame but I couldn't find a reference to it in the art of the previous comic.

Welcome, new person!

It's the "I can't feel my legs"/"It will wear off soon" exchange.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Timemaster on 12 Jan 2017, 09:36
I suppose Jeph introduced Agent Peroxide and the whole "almost omnipotent AI"-stuff to get Emily into Bubbles brain as soon as possible. Maybe he got tired of all this drama and hoplesness. After a few days thinking about it, I´m fine with this.
And I love Agent Peroxide. Come to think of it, maybe he uses the "we" because he´s not an independet AI of his own, but rather a drone, a representation of one or more of those friggin´powerful AI´s themselves.  :-D

So I suppose (or rather hope) we´ll get a loog inside Bubbles brain. Can´t wait for this to happen. What will it look like? Something in manga-style is a good guess I think.
Or maybe Its something like Gunnerkrigg Court: New Data:
http://www.gunnerkrigg.com/?p=1599
Or a real classic: Doonesbury: The Return to Reagans Brain (1987):
http://www.gocomics.com/doonesbury/1987/03/23

Huuh, I can´t wait.  8-)

TM
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: thedevilissix on 12 Jan 2017, 09:40
To clarify, the new character seems to use the pronouns: we/our/ourselves/us
"We're what wakes them up screaming."
"We picked up on your little ...were were going to go "Gives us the shivers..."
"...we'll have Ms. Azuma do it."
"If they wished to do me harm, they would have done so already."

Unless it's as in "The 'Royal' We", meaning "I", in a fairly self-important way....like Queen Victoria used in England in her C19th reign, e.g. "We are not amused".

I think it's also a common tactic used by crooks and people out to do you harm (burglars, rapists etc.) to put their victim at ease by fostering a feeling of a 'team effort', before they do their worst.
I once read this example used as a warning for women to safeguard themselves against a potential rapist who 'offered' to help them carry in their food shopping, which included cat food. The phrase used to lure someone into a false sense of security  was "We've got a very hungry cat up there".

In short: I'm still not trusting Sketchy Skeezy McBotRenegade. Ugh.  :-(
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Morituri on 12 Jan 2017, 11:21
Making the world a better place in the most sinister possible way....
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: A small perverse otter on 12 Jan 2017, 11:31
There's a big difference between flirting with absurdity, becoming more fantastical, and jumping the shark.  The first two affect the tone and content of the document organically to drive the plot forward.  The last one typically refers to a single absurdity which is inconsistent with the rest of the document.

QC has frequently flirted with absurdity; in fact, Pint-Size is a absurd element in himself. It goes back and forth between the fantastic -- the trip to the Station -- and the mundane -- the whole story-line culminating in MartenAndClaire -- and does that frequently.  In this case, we started with a mundane storyline -- Faye finding a new job at a robot MMA gym and growing through it -- to a mundane conflict -- CorpseWitch's abusive and controlling behavior toward Bubbles -- to Bubbles' attempt to break free of her abuser.

Now, here's the important point about escaping victims -- they frequently try to get out through their social circle, but often can't.  Frequently, the only way out is for having someone outside to intervene. Those someone's may have their own motives -- the YWCA is a Christian organization, for instance -- but that doesn't mean they aren't helpful, and don't appear out of nowhere.

Imagine you're in the hospital after being beaten, and suddenly the doctors are thrown out and a woman in business casual comes in and says "Hi. I'm from Family and Health Services. Would you like help getting out? We can get the kids out safely -- will you accept our help?" What would that look like in an AI world?

ETA (and really important IRL): You know about those "If you or someone you know is being abused or controlled, call" signs. If you find yourself in Station's position in real life, and someone you know is being controlled or abused, call that number. Those visits from that young social worker save lives.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: de_la_Nae on 12 Jan 2017, 13:05
I still don't get why you're over-analysing it.

I just want to chime in and say:

YOU. Have *no* room in your glass house to throw stones about over-analysing.

I mean Jesus.

I'm not saying don't have your little back and forth, but really now, be a little genre savvy about yourself. ;)
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: de_la_Nae on 12 Jan 2017, 13:07
Ever since Hannelore took Marten and Marigold to outer space to celebrate her father's birthday on his very own space station, the notion that QC could ever really "jump the shark" has been meaningless.  Despite being set in a post-singularity present world similar to ours But With Robots, Jeph has always managed to keep the comic grounded despite all the weirdness.  QC can't jump the shark.  It's impossible...

...except, well, everything since Faye met Bubbles at the underground robot fighting ring has just felt like a rejected prequel storyline from Alice Grove, which is why I stopped following daily updates several months ago.  It might not jump the shark, but it's not really the QC I used to know.

While I came to slightly different conclusions, that's fair and understandable to me.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: de_la_Nae on 12 Jan 2017, 13:14
As someone who's written and been too many shadowy people for too many years, I can safely say that, even if They are ostensibly on the side of the angels, it doesn't make Them or what They're doing right.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Tova on 12 Jan 2017, 14:29

They may not require a direct 'price' but I'd be more concerned about the 'favour' they ask for some time later in exchange for not betraying Emily to the NSA for unauthorised access of all the classified defence data in Bubbles's head.

You've kind of backtracked on this, just admit it and we can all move on.

No, they're the same thing just expressed differently. Never ask but manipulate into offering voluntarily, possibly with airily implied menaces. Oh, and act reluctant but admit that you need the favour and, if not doing the bad thing is the price then you can possibly see your way to agreeing.

If they are the same thing, only expressed differently, then the "no strings attached" promise is in fact a lie.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Perfectly Reasonable on 12 Jan 2017, 15:36
Jeph skips over some exposition where GreyCreep introduces Emily to the adventure she is about to embark upon. It wouldn't have told us anything new, and -of course- Emily agrees.

And thinking over GreyCreep's aversion to being in Bubbles' head, I now understand why Emily is needed here. Her mind resides in a blob of flesh, not a set of silicon chips. Her perception of Bubbles' mental landscape will be entirely different from an AI's. Traps that would cripple an AI will be no more than cobwebs for her. And the encryption? Will be like figuring out an interesting knitting pattern.

I wonder if Jeph will try to show us what Emily perceives. I think it's best if he gives us just enough suggestions to engage our own imaginations.

Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Morituri on 12 Jan 2017, 17:28
Emily:  Oh my goodness I've never seen so many noodles!  Well, except for... no, stay on task.  Is that a porcupine?  Huh.  Four dimensional frog.  Sam ought to see that.  Oh, wait.  I have to make it jump down...  which way is down again?  Oh, that *is* helpful.  Um.  Needs some bleach.  Stupid frog.  Ummm, topographical map of the noodles?  I guess I can do that...  wait, what's that?  Um.  Deplorable Word.  S'okay, I just won't say it.  Vorstellungspoleizi?  What the heck?  Oh, here.  "Don't touch, Eschatogenic."  Huh, that's a funny word.  But it's not the Deplorable one.  Now how can I squish the frog with it without touching it?  Oh, that must be what the porcupine's for! 

If you get all the references, you win the Internet.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Case on 12 Jan 2017, 18:10
What is "Voorstellungpoleizi?" supposed to mean?

At a guess, it looks like a ... somewhat strangled attempt at a literal translation of "Imagination Police" into German, with a detour into Dutch ("Voor" would be the Dutch translation of "before", the respective German translation, however, is "vor") and very shaky spelling.

German: Vorstellung - Engl.: Fantasy, Imagination - Dutch: Verbeelding

German: Polizei - Engl.: Police - Dutch: Politie

So if I permutate "Voorstellungpoleizi?" into "Vorstellungspolizei" -> That would be a neologism, meaning "Imagination-Police", or "Fantasy-Police". But the word doesn't exist in any German dictionary (which strictly speaking isn't that unusual: "German" is more of a specification than a language. We don't bat an eye at weird concatenations just because nobody has ever seen them before)
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Morituri on 12 Jan 2017, 18:21
Oops, yeah, sorry, that was in fact supposed to be with a single 'o' in the first syllable.  Fixed.

But "Eschatogenic" didn't make you bat an eye?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Tova on 12 Jan 2017, 18:39
"Eschatogenic," if it were a real word, would be an elusive one-word googlewhack.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Case on 12 Jan 2017, 18:55
Oops, yeah, sorry, that was in fact supposed to be with a single 'o' in the first syllable.  Fixed.

But "Eschatogenic" didn't make you bat an eye?

UhmmmNo? If "Eschatogenic" is supposed to mean "pertaining to/wrt. Eschatology" -> That one actually does exist in German: Eschatologisch (The Dictionary (http://www.duden.de/rechtschreibung/eschatologisch) ranks it at 2/5 for frequency of use)  :mrgreen:

(Edit: I just found out that "Eschatogenic" does not exist in English. Now that's weird ...)




Comic's up!

There definitely should be a word for "creepycutedisturbingheartwarming". Maybe "Emily"?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Method of Madness on 12 Jan 2017, 19:24
So the newcomer is almost certainly not human, but...what are they?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: TheEvilDog on 12 Jan 2017, 19:27
Something else.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Tova on 12 Jan 2017, 19:53
To be honest, I'm not sure I'm thrilled with the addition to the comic of what appear to be more or less omnipotent beings, but I'm happy to sit back and find out where this takes us.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: ANeM on 12 Jan 2017, 19:56
I fear more and more that GreyCreep was sent by Corpse Witch. Rather than unlocking Bubbles memories the intended goal here is to encrypt or erase the memories of Faye to bring her Bubbles in line.

Beyond that, I find this whole plot thread to have progressed surprisingly quickly. It has only been 20 pages since Bubbles revealed her secret.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: TheEvilDog on 12 Jan 2017, 20:07
To be honest, I'm not sure I'm thrilled with the addition to the comic of what appear to be more or less omnipotent beings, but I'm happy to sit back and find out where this takes us.

I don't see the group that AIbino belongs to as omnipotent per se, but rather they see and hear as much as the average heavily surveilled city in the Western world. Like us, the QC world exists in an increasingly digital world. Unlike us, however, there exists AI and collective Intelligentsia monitoring everything in their world. There's chatter, video feed, informants, undercovers and the list goes on. They're connected, but connected in a different way to meat-bag intelligence groups, they can literally pool together and become a gestalt entity rather than different pieces working together.

It feels more like a toned down version of Clarke's Third Law.

At least, that's how I see it.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Tova on 12 Jan 2017, 20:13
I really like the idea that you've painted there, actually.

It was more their ability to cause humans in a room to snooze with a snap of the fingers, and the ability to laugh off a physical threat from Bubbles that I was referring to. I agree it's not actual omnipotence, but relative to the other beings in the room, it's an approximation.

If they are a huge gestalt entity, hive mind, or similar, then I can almost accept their ability to break Corpse Witch's encryption without breaking a sweat (or giving a mere mortal the tools to do so).
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Near Lurker on 12 Jan 2017, 20:16
Am I the only one reminded by Faye and Bubbles' quasi-relationship of Abel and Jyrras?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: hedgie on 12 Jan 2017, 20:17
Like us, the QC world exists in an increasingly digital world. Unlike us, however, there exists AI and collective Intelligentsia monitoring everything in their world. There's chatter, video feed, informants, undercovers and the list on.

You can't stop the signal, I guess.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Gyrre on 12 Jan 2017, 20:28
Hmmm.... I wonder if CreepyPasty is an artificially created organic entity that's had cybernetic components interwoven with the organic components, not a traditional cyborg so much as a bio-mechanical being.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: St.Clair on 12 Jan 2017, 20:40
Dang.  From one great expression of Bubbles' (and Jeph's drawing of it), straight into close contact and an earnest It Has Been An Honor (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ItHasBeenAnHonor)...
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Gyrre on 12 Jan 2017, 20:42

Most people seem to think the grey maybe-maybenot AI is a government agent.
Am I the only one who got an immediate vibe of Mephisto? As in Faustian deal Mephisto? Is an AI Satan a thing post-singularity?

Satan as in "Quasi-Supernatural Entity with the sole goal of ruining humanity spiritually and morally"? No. Not in SF-lit, as far as I can recall. In "serious" discussions about AI ... IDK. Off-the-cuff I'd say that judging from the one secure datapoint for intelligence that we have - ourselves - it would not be rational to expect an AI to develop into an artificial Satan (in the boundaries of the definition in my above line), for lack of human examples (I recognize that the veracity of that statement is highly dependent on one's definition of 'evil' in general, and 'sole aim' as well as 'ruin' in particular). I think 'satanic' behaviour simply "doesn't pay of", in a (very vague) game-theory sense, or in the sense of "parsimonious use of ones resources".   

The closest I can recall is the Eschaton in Charlie Stross' Singularity Sky (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singularity_Sky) - but that's more like a dialed-up Skynet that believes in the principle of applying the minimum of violence necessary to protect itself from humanity meddling with causality in its historic lightcone. Where "minimum violence" can include a planetary civilisation violating it's commandment suddenly finding itself in the path of a city-sized asteroid.

Not strictly speaking evil, but terribly, terribly ... un-empathetic.

Depending on the theologist you talk to, humanity falls more into the category of 'collateral damage' or 'a means to an end', with Lucifer's/Satan's/the devil's primary goal being to make God sad/unhappy.
So, definitely extremely unempathetic if that's the case.

As for human examples; there's some very wealthy very amoral/immoral people out there amongst the 1%ers.


EDIT: I somehow butchered 'collateral' as 'colatoral'
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Morituri on 12 Jan 2017, 20:49

If "Eschatogenic" is supposed to mean "pertaining to/wrt. Eschatology" -> That one actually does exist in German: Eschatologisch Dictionary ranks it at 2/5 for frequency of use


Ah, no.  I understand, but in English "-genic" means "cause of" or "starter" and "-logical" means "about" or "pertaining to."

So, according to English word construction rules (inherited from German but rarely so enthusiastic about it) the horsemen of the apocalypse, or possibly Donald Trump once he gets his finger on The Button, would be "Eschatogenists"  but a professor specializing in end-of-the-world scenarios would be an "Eschatologist." 

Something labeled "Eschatogenic, do not touch" has an implication that fooling with it could end the world.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Tova on 12 Jan 2017, 21:08
I'm going out on a limb here, but perhaps it could also mean the last gene.  :angel:
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: brasca on 12 Jan 2017, 21:36
I fear more and more that GreyCreep was sent by Corpse Witch. Rather than unlocking Bubbles memories the intended goal here is to encrypt or erase the memories of Faye to bring her Bubbles in line.

Beyond that, I find this whole plot thread to have progressed surprisingly quickly. It has only been 20 pages since Bubbles revealed her secret.

If Uptown Envy really works for Corpse Witch then she is definitely more than meets the eye.  I could imagine that she's similar to other human criminals who look like ordinary people, but run a vast criminal enterprise like The Wire's Proposition Joe or The Soprano's Uncle Junior.  She might just be, but I don't think she's on the same level as who our mysterious stranger represents. 

Perhaps Corpse Witch used to work for them which might explain another reason for helping Bubbles.  I've likened this stranger to Fullmetal Alchemist's Envy and maybe Corpse Witch is the equivalent of Greed. 

Regarding vomiting that's one thing an AI is not missing and an experience I'd be more than happy to eliminate if I could upgrade out of my mortal coil. 
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 12 Jan 2017, 22:05
I still don't get why you're over-analysing it.

Over-analyzing things is fun!
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 12 Jan 2017, 22:10
I fear more and more that GreyCreep was sent by Corpse Witch. Rather than unlocking Bubbles memories the intended goal here is to encrypt or erase the memories of Faye to bring her Bubbles in line.

Beyond that, I find this whole plot thread to have progressed surprisingly quickly. It has only been 20 pages since Bubbles revealed her secret.

Welcome, new person!

That would be darker than we're used to, but Jeph does seem to be trying new things.

Bubbles with her memories back, active PTSD, and her current chassis could easily go in dark directions as well if Albino Creepatron is on the level.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BenRG on 12 Jan 2017, 23:39
That was a sweet little moment between Faye and Bubbles. Jeph has been doing a very good job telling a story of a friendship between them that has been only good for both parties. I can hear the shippers going 'Squeee!' from my seat here!

That aside, that was a lovely bit of Emily and a reminder of just how strange and different her perception of the universe and of life can be. She really, really needs a close friend dogging her steps and making sure that she doesn't ever injure herself in pursuit of an 'intense experience'. The time she hit Bubbles with a hammer indicates that, whilst intelligent, she doesn't have much common sense when it comes to things like that!

Hmmm.... I wonder if CreepyPasty is an artificially created organic entity that's had cybernetic components interwoven with the organic components, not a traditional cyborg so much as a bio-mechanical being.

That's my feeling, yes. Something like the Gen-3 Synths from Fallout 4 - A human-like chassis made of synthetically-created biological components seamlessly merged with electronic components to enable the AIs to operate through the cereberal cortex. A true android, as it is frequently described in golden-age sci-fi rather than the cruder 'meat over a metal frame' form that was popularised in The Terminator or the 'pre-programmed clone' from Blade Runner. I can honestly hearing the dev team for that chassis telling a sceptical Dr Elicott-Chatham that this represents 'the next evolutionary step of AI and human alike'.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Gyrre on 12 Jan 2017, 23:40
I suppose Jeph introduced Agent Peroxide and the whole "almost omnipotent AI"-stuff to get Emily into Bubbles brain as soon as possible. Maybe he got tired of all this drama and hoplesness. After a few days thinking about it, I´m fine with this.
And I love Agent Peroxide. Come to think of it, maybe he uses the "we" because he´s not an independet AI of his own, but rather a drone, a representation of one or more of those friggin´powerful AI´s themselves.  :-D

So I suppose (or rather hope) we´ll get a loog inside Bubbles brain. Can´t wait for this to happen. What will it look like? Something in manga-style is a good guess I think.
Or maybe Its something like Gunnerkrigg Court: New Data:
http://www.gunnerkrigg.com/?p=1599
Or a real classic: Doonesbury: The Return to Reagans Brain (1987):
http://www.gocomics.com/doonesbury/1987/03/23

Huuh, I can´t wait.  8-)

TM

TRON is the obvious one, so I'll mention Kabuki Quantum Fighter (https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=SopEVWVkGkg).
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Storel on 13 Jan 2017, 01:11
Oops, yeah, sorry, that was in fact supposed to be with a single 'o' in the first syllable.  Fixed.

So you caught the Voor -> Vor correction, but missed the Poleizi -> Polizei one? Interesting blind spot...  8-)

Also, when Emily said "You should try it sometime! It's a very intense experience", my first thought was "Vomiting or hugging?" I'm still not 100% sure she means vomiting, but it's definitely more likely...
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Tova on 13 Jan 2017, 02:41
Vomiting certainly is intense. And it does usually feel better when you stop.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Method of Madness on 13 Jan 2017, 03:55
Oh, she absolutely meant vomiting.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Zebediah on 13 Jan 2017, 04:06
Vomiting certainly is intense. And it does usually feel better when you stop.

Even when you strain an abdominal muscle in the process. Which I've done.  :-(

That was a sweet little moment between Faye and Bubbles. Jeph has been doing a very good job telling a story of a friendship between them that has been only good for both parties. I can hear the shippers going 'Squeee!' from my seat here!

Because you are their king, Ben! You were squeeing the loudest of all and you know it!  :lol:

That's my feeling, yes. Something like the Gen-3 Synths from Fallout 4 - A human-like chassis made of synthetically-created biological components seamlessly merged with electronic components to enable the AIs to operate through the cereberal cortex. A true android, as it is frequently described in golden-age sci-fi rather than the cruder 'meat over a metal frame' form that was popularised in The Terminator or the 'pre-programmed clone' from Blade Runner. I can honestly hearing the dev team for that chassis telling a sceptical Dr Elicott-Chatham that this represents 'the next evolutionary step of AI and human alike'.

Skeptical? You honestly think Dr. E-C would be skeptical of an advancement like that? It's more like the ultimate goal he's been working towards.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: ronbo on 13 Jan 2017, 05:56
That was a sweet little moment between Faye and Bubbles. Jeph has been doing a very good job telling a story of a friendship between them that has been only good for both parties. I can hear the shippers going 'Squeee!' from my seat here!


I was late the the shipping party, but it crept in there.  "Just friends" don't do panel two.  Cupping her face in her hands while staring intently in her eyes at an up close and personal distance is straight up "I love you in a Harlequin romance kinda way."
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: JimC on 13 Jan 2017, 06:01
Vomiting certainly is intense. And it does usually feel better when you stop.
I get migraines, and for many years the course of them was that I'd feel worse and worse, headache would be more and more intense, then I'd throw up and that was a signal that the worst was over and I'd soon be feeling better. So the vomiting was positively welcome!
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Case on 13 Jan 2017, 07:34
Vomiting certainly is intense. And it does usually feel better when you stop.

I don't feel like it should be a verb at all - if anything, it feels more like 'being made to vomit' (or being 'wrung out', if you had a bad oyster ...).

Then and again, the same applies to 'falling' - little choice involved, either - however, it feels wrong-ish for your body to so blatantly ignore your wishes in the matter.  :x


Ah, no.  I understand, but in English "-genic" means "cause of" or "starter" and "-logical" means "about" or "pertaining to."
...
Something labeled "Eschatogenic, do not touch" has an implication that fooling with it could end the world.

Ah, yes! -genic, not -logic (Haw! Haw!). Like in 'mutagenic'. No, German doesn't have a world like 'eschatogenic'. It does have (the) Weltvernichtungsmaschine (https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weltvernichtungsmaschine) (World-annihilation-machine), courtesy of Stanley Kubrik.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: theMarc on 13 Jan 2017, 08:27
*sigh*

Alright, I guess I'm enlisting as a crew member of the Faye/Bubbles ship.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Method of Madness on 13 Jan 2017, 09:21
Ehh...I just don't see it. It's not out of line, but I remain unconvinced.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Neko_Ali on 13 Jan 2017, 09:48
It is possible to be very close friends with someone without there being romance involved. That said, there has been plenty of body language from Bubbles that Faye's more casually hands on moments are flustering to Bubbles, but not unwelcome. That could be an indication of attraction toward Faye. Or it could be that Bubbles is just unused to such displays and doesn't know how to deal with them. She doesn't do the 'blush and avert eyes' when Hanners hugs her though. Just for Faye. So it's entirely possible that Bubbles feels some attraction to Faye beyond friendship.

On the other hand, Faye has shown no such reactions. Or any kind of attraction to women, human or AI. Bubbles is a good friend though, and Faye is fiercely loyal to her friends. So none of what she has done For or to Bubbles has been out of character, or outside the sort of thing she's done with Marten, Dora or Hanners. None of whom does she have an attraction to. They're more family to her than anything else.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: TinPenguin on 13 Jan 2017, 09:54
If you have led a life without close personal friendship (even though her fallen squad were dear to her, I don't think it is the same), then when you make your first true friend, you will friend hard.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Case on 13 Jan 2017, 10:21
It is possible to be very close friends with someone without there being romance involved. That said, there has been plenty of body language from Bubbles that Faye's more casually hands on moments are flustering to Bubbles, but not unwelcome. That could be an indication of attraction toward Faye. Or it could be that Bubbles is just unused to such displays and doesn't know how to deal with them. She doesn't do the 'blush and avert eyes' when Hanners hugs her though. Just for Faye. So it's entirely possible that Bubbles feels some attraction to Faye beyond friendship.

That's what I see in her body-language, too - though I'd add that it appears to me that Bubbles might be trying to 'sublimate' a (possible) attraction by designating Faye a special status as 'honored comrade'; a position of trust, respect and closeness that she had previously only experienced within the squad she lost, and had reserved for her squadmates. Her 'potentially last words' to Faye are a bit at odds with the intimate gesture that accompanies them.

Also, Bubbles is pretty sharp and 'wordly' - I wouldn't be surprised if she'd interpreted Faye's physical affections as 'I'm happy to have a friend again' rather than physical attraction. Whether she's attracted to Faye or not, regaining a close bond similar to that which she had shared with her squad might be her highest priority.

I guess one could regard both of them as part orphans in a way - both lost (part of) their 'family' suddenly and violently, both may be seeking bonds to intensely loyal people that give them back a feeling of security they had lost.


If you have led a life without close personal friendship (even though her fallen squad were dear to her, I don't think it is the same), then when you make your first true friend, you will friend hard.

True - but if the closest you ever got to 'friend' and 'family' was a military unit (and there's many reports from soldiers who said those bonds are even closer, and more intense), then someone as fiercely loyal as Faye probably fits your mold like ... a thing that fits another thing that ...(*) even better.


(*) In the Rhenish 'dialect' of German, there's the expression "Passt wie Arsch auf Eimer" ("Fits like Butt on Bucket (Toiletseat)") - but I think that may ruin ze cutes
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Kugai on 13 Jan 2017, 12:50
Either Agent Creepy is that cynical or she's using cynicism to cover for 'The Feels'.

And

DANG!!


The feels
The feels
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Akima on 13 Jan 2017, 14:11
Not even a gesture at seeking Emily's consent for something that could leave her with nightmares at the very least.
Equally, no indication of compulsion, and Emily seems to put the headband on voluntarily with a "Neat! Okay!", so maybe that happened "off screen". Honestly, would anyone expect Emily even to hesitate to perform a risky brain-dive? She's got the mind-set of a smokejumper (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smokejumper).

True - but if the closest you ever got to 'friend' and 'family' was a military unit (and there's many reports from soldiers who said those bonds are even closer, and more intense), then someone as fiercely loyal as Faye probably fits your mold like ... a thing that fits another thing that ...(*) even better.
Mmm... Given that Bubbles was designed to be a member of a combat team, Faye's loyalty and pugnacity might resonate strongly. Faye and Bubbles are 同袍 (tóngpáo (https://www.mdbg.net/chindict/chindict.php?page=worddict&wdrst=0&wdqb=%E5%90%8C%E8%A2%8D)), which means both comrade-in-arms and intimate friend, and I can't think of an English word that means quite the same thing.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Tova on 13 Jan 2017, 14:34
Either Agent Creepy is that cynical or she's using cynicism to cover for 'The Feels'.

It's possible, though by no means certain, that Agent Creepy Hive Mind know Bubbles will be perfectly fine, and are thus completely unmoved by all the (unnecessary from their perspective) emotion on display.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Storel on 13 Jan 2017, 15:20
Either Agent Creepy is that cynical or she's using cynicism to cover for 'The Feels'.

It's possible, though by no means certain, that Agent Creepy Hive Mind know Bubbles will be perfectly fine, and are thus completely unmoved by all the (unnecessary from their perspective) emotion on display.

Seems like it would be hard to know that without already knowing what's in Bubbles's head, which Agent We can't know since they haven't yet looked in there (and professed revulsion at the notion of doing so themselves). Unless they are really damned certain that their inductive interface's tools (plus Emily's talents?) are capable of preventing any damage from anything so primitive that Corpse Witch would have access to it. I wouldn't be surprised if Jeph ends up shaking Agent We's confidence a tad by having CW's boobytraps turn out to be unexpectedly tricky.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: St.Clair on 13 Jan 2017, 15:45
It is possible to be very close friends with someone without there being romance involved.

One of my personal peeves, for a while now, is the tendency of fandom - all fandom, in general - to devalue and dismiss close, intimate but platonic friendship in favor of romantic and/or sexual love.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Neko_Ali on 13 Jan 2017, 16:06
It's not even just in fandom either. Plenty of people treat others in real life like that. If you have two people who are close and aren't related then they must be either sleeping together or attracted to each other.  Nobody is allowed to be just friends  unless you maintain a society-approved level of detachment.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Perfectly Reasonable on 13 Jan 2017, 16:42
I blame Hollywood. Quick and lazy way to show two are close.

People have made so many different names for GreyCreep! Who may not even have a name.

Morituri's idea of Emily's Bizarre Adventure is delightful. While others try to think outside the box, Emily thinks outside the Solar System.

And dang! Weekend cliffhanger!
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Celly on 13 Jan 2017, 17:30
I am calling them Legion and my theory is that they are Grey Goo.

Not an individual, they are a hivemind of billions of nanobots, thinking and working together.  They've taken (in the immediate present) the form of a humanoid for the purpose of interaction on a macro level.

Their shape and their speech (indicated by the round bubble) very closely approximates that of a living organism, because they aren't a bucket of servos and muscle fibers, but billions of tiny nanobots, so they can be a far more perfect approximation.

They can disable people by touch because the nanobots quickly invade the target's body to shut down whatever particular neurons are necessary to knock someone out (in this case, without killing them, though they absolutely could kill if they wanted to).

They've been in hiding because people would freak out and probably blow an EMP, since they are literally (in this form at least) a walking end-of-the-world scenario - but they aren't motivated to wipe out the world, by whatever lucky happenstance.  Station knew how to contact them, however, and sent them to help.  Perhaps Orbital Railgun Justice is what is keeping Legion in line, that much I wouldn't know.  But it's pretty clear to me that Legion is a case of Grey Goo, which would absolutely be a reasonable thing to exist in a post-singularity world.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: SpanielBear on 13 Jan 2017, 18:08
I'm sufficiently creeped out by them that I'll just call them by whatever they tell me to call them, and then never repeat it in case it results in their return.

Question to ponder- people have said a lot about the effect that rediscovering her memories will have on Bubbles, which is fair enough. But given Lennox of the Endless mentioned something about Emily having to "go in" to unlock those memories, does that imply that Emily will experience them as well? And if so, what kind of effect will that have on her? If she's just seeing from a remote perspective, like viewing a movie that could be bad enough, but if she gets a full on sensory experience of something that induced PTSD in a badass combat-trained AI Valkyrie, I'd be concerned for Emily's mental health by the end of the procedure.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: osaka on 13 Jan 2017, 18:15
Wait, was there ever any semblance of mental health on Emily to begin with?

On other news, I'm pretty astonished by how Mercedes went "Wouldn't work" on the physical violence threat. I assume they're an AI, but let's be serious here, Bubbles could very well crush them into their molecular components.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Celly on 13 Jan 2017, 18:53
Wait, was there ever any semblance of mental health on Emily to begin with?

On other news, I'm pretty astonished by how Mercedes went "Wouldn't work" on the physical violence threat. I assume they're an AI, but let's be serious here, Bubbles could very well crush them into their molecular components.
Not if they're Grey Goo.  The nanobots would just melt around her fists.  She knows who they are and she knows full well she can't do anything.  Her threat was empty, but she wanted to show displeasure.

Everything points to a nanobot swarm.

Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Tova on 13 Jan 2017, 19:00
Wait, was there ever any semblance of mental health on Emily to begin with?

She's probably better adjusted then just about all of the main cast members.

You just can't handle her weirdness.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: ZoeB on 13 Jan 2017, 20:40
I am calling them Legion and my theory is that they are Grey Goo.

They've been in hiding because people would freak out and probably blow an EMP, since they are literally (in this form at least) a walking end-of-the-world scenario - but they aren't motivated to wipe out the world, by whatever lucky happenstance. 

I signed up for these forums because you all are terrible at theory crafting.
Er.. a hivemind that clueful, one of the first things they do is to port onto EMP resistant hardware/wetware. Good idea anyway to have lithophile backups as well in case of gamma ray bursters, to reboot life in a reasonable time, millions not billions of years. Go Arrhenious ( see Arrhenius)  too.

See Brin's Existence. Or Vinge's Fire on the Deep for a Rocco Basilisk.

I feel that talking about organised crime or even world wars when dealing with such entities is at best like toddlers discussing how to unwrap a chocolate bar during a meeting of nuclear physicists, and worrying that one might snatch their rattle away.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Celly on 13 Jan 2017, 21:46
I am calling them Legion and my theory is that they are Grey Goo.

They've been in hiding because people would freak out and probably blow an EMP, since they are literally (in this form at least) a walking end-of-the-world scenario - but they aren't motivated to wipe out the world, by whatever lucky happenstance. 

I signed up for these forums because you all are terrible at theory crafting.
Er.. a hivemind that clueful, one of the first things they do is to port onto EMP resistant hardware/wetware. Good idea anyway to have lithophile backups as well in case of gamma ray bursters, to reboot life in a reasonable time, millions not billions of years. Go Arrhenious ( see Arrhenius)  too.

See Brin's Existence. Or Vinge's Fire on the Deep for a Rocco Basilisk.

I feel that talking about organised crime or even world wars when dealing with such entities is at best like toddlers discussing how to unwrap a chocolate bar during a meeting of nuclear physicists, and worrying that one might snatch their rattle away.
It's a good point, to which I say "maybe."  The AI don't seem as powerful as some of the real-life predictions we have for a post-singularity world.  Why do AI's have human level intelligence and underground fight clubs, if we've passed the singularity?

There is also the assumption that EMP-resistant hardware is even possible and within the capabilities for Legion to invent it.

I think Legion is smarter than most AI by at least an order of magnitude, but the capabilities are by no means infinite for AI in this universe.  Coupled with the assumption that Station is keeping Legion in check.  In fact, Orbital Railgun Justice is probably a better rationale for good behavior than is an EMP.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: de_la_Nae on 13 Jan 2017, 22:34
Why do AI's have ... underground fight clubs, if we've passed the singularity?



There's no reason to think, in the expanse of the post-Singularity mind, that some of them wouldn't find fighting to be fun.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: TheEvilDog on 13 Jan 2017, 22:42
Why do AI's have ... underground fight clubs, if we've passed the singularity?



There's no reason to think, in the expanse of the post-Singularity mind, that some of them wouldn't find fighting to be fun.

Why do we humans have fight clubs? Because its fun for some people and for others, its a way to make a lot of money very quickly.

Despite the fact that the Singularity has occurred in the QC-verse, its quite obvious that the world is not in the best state. There's some degree of discrimination towards AI, both from within and without the community. Unless you're an AnthroPC and paired with a human, I would imagine that being an AI in the world is quite difficult. I mean, look at May and Bubbles. May couldn't even get basic healthcare from the government when her chassis began to fall apart and had to go to an illegal repair shop for help. Bubbles is ostracised by both the human and AI communities for choosing to serve in the military. Neither of them have many options.

The Singularity may have happened, but human nature isn't so easily changed. And we know that AI are made in humanity's image.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Tova on 13 Jan 2017, 22:59
Why do AI's have human level intelligence and underground fight clubs, if we've passed the singularity?

You're thinking of "utopia."
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 14 Jan 2017, 00:28
Given that Bubbles was designed to be a member of a combat team

I had come away with a different impression after her conversation with Momo about choosing the military as a career. It sounded like she was a run-of-the-mill AI who thought she should serve her country.

If someone in the QC world is designing people with personality traits to adapt them to being members of a combat team then the ethical issues are intense.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Akima on 14 Jan 2017, 01:28
I had come away with a different impression after her conversation with Momo about choosing the military as a career. It sounded like she was a run-of-the-mill AI who thought she should serve her country.
That's a good point I had forgotten. Perhaps I was thinking too much about the computers of today, rather than self-aware AI people.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: JimC on 14 Jan 2017, 04:55
The AI don't seem as powerful as some of the real-life predictions we have for a post-singularity world.  Why do AI's have human level intelligence and underground fight clubs, if we've passed the singularity?
One shouldn't forget real life predictions are fiction too.
As for fight clubs and the like, slavemasters keep slaves and farm animals fed and watered if economically practical so long as they are assets, but often see no reason not to let free men and wild animals starve.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Celly on 14 Jan 2017, 07:18
Why do AI's have ... underground fight clubs, if we've passed the singularity?



There's no reason to think, in the expanse of the post-Singularity mind, that some of them wouldn't find fighting to be fun.

Why do we humans have fight clubs? Because its fun for some people and for others, its a way to make a lot of money very quickly.

Despite the fact that the Singularity has occurred in the QC-verse, its quite obvious that the world is not in the best state. There's some degree of discrimination towards AI, both from within and without the community. Unless you're an AnthroPC and paired with a human, I would imagine that being an AI in the world is quite difficult. I mean, look at May and Bubbles. May couldn't even get basic healthcare from the government when her chassis began to fall apart and had to go to an illegal repair shop for help. Bubbles is ostracised by both the human and AI communities for choosing to serve in the military. Neither of them have many options.

The Singularity may have happened, but human nature isn't so easily changed. And we know that AI are made in humanity's image.
My point is that the Singularity did not confer the god status as predicted in the real world.  It was limited somehow.  There shouldn't be, for example, money, in the common conception of "post-Singularity" - even in the best case scenario where AI doesn't try to kill us, they've solved resource problems for us.

My point that AI is not godlike in the QC universe was specifically a counterpoint to one guy who thought out new friend Legion would be godlike (assuming my Grey Goo hypothesis is correct)
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: blt on 14 Jan 2017, 07:23
As much as I do also sort of subscribe to the Faye/Bubbles ship, I really see this more as the leadership I'd expect from Bubs.  Identifying the least bad option in a bad situation, knowing when a fast choice is required, and still taking care of those around her.  #fave.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Case on 14 Jan 2017, 07:49
I am calling them Legion and my theory is that they are Grey Goo.

Nanotbots exist only in SF-lit, and there, Grey Goo is the nanotech equivalent of cancer ... Talked to a tumor lately?

(click to show/hide)

And lastly, how would nanobots - structures whose dimensions are measured in a millionth of a millimetre: roughly a hundreth of the avg. diameter of a capillary - manage migrate from the contact point at Fayes forehead to every relevant motoneuronal pathway in a matter of seconds?
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: cesium133 on 14 Jan 2017, 07:59
Nanotbots exist only in SF-lit
QC is sci-fi. I'm going with the MST3K mantra on this one...


(it was supposed to start at 1:01, but apparently you'll have to fast-forward it yourself or watch the whole thing)
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Case on 14 Jan 2017, 08:20
Nanotbots exist only in SF-lit
QC is sci-fi.

Quote
Nanotbots exist only in SF-lit and there, Grey Goo is the nanotech equivalent of cancer



MST3K mantra: Yeah, yeah, I know -> "The first rule of Fight Club ..." is how a grad-student in high energy once put it. I'm just pissed because nanobots are bad SF. And I intensely dislike Eric Drexler ...



Found a nice paper on the locomotion at micron-scale "Life at low Reynolds-numbers" (http://jilawww.colorado.edu/perkinsgroup/Purcell_life_at_low_reynolds_number.pdf) by E.M. Purcell. Written for physicists, but in that lovely American-Natsci-style that makes it accessible also to lay-audiences (and much, much easier to understand for physicists, too ... Feynman did wonders for US physics curricula)

Quote
It helps to imagine under what conditions a man would be swimming at, say, the same Reynolds number as his own sperm. Well you put him in a swimming pool that is full of molasses, and the you forbid him to move any pare of his body faster than 1 cm/min. Now imagine yourself in that condition; you're under the swimming pool in molasses, and now you can only move like the hands of a clock. If under those ground rules you are able to move a few meters in a couple of weeks, you may qualify as a low Reynolds number swimmer.

Quote
I'll show you a picture of the real animals in a bit but we are going to be taking about objects which are the order of a micron in size (Fig. 4). That's a micron scale, not a suture, in the animal in Fig. 4. In water where the kinematic viscosity is 10^{-2} cm/sec these things move around with a typical speed of 30 micron/sec
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Celly on 14 Jan 2017, 08:25
I am calling them Legion and my theory is that they are Grey Goo.

Nanotbots exist only in SF-lit, and there, Grey Goo is the nanotech equivalent of cancer ... Talked to a tumor lately?

(click to show/hide)

And lastly, how would nanobots - structures whose dimensions are measured in a millionth of a millimetre: roughly a hundreth of the avg. diameter of a capillary - manage migrate from the contact point at Fayes forehead to every relevant motoneuronal pathway in a matter of seconds?
Yes, I am using "Grey Goo" in an not totally correct sense, to informally refer to a nanobot swarm.  Legion is a nanobot swarm.  Though Legion may be capable of "grey gooing" his environment, perhaps after a certain point when they achieved sentience, they decided it was more interesting to observe and interact with the world than to eat it.  It would certainly be easier to assemble a swarm of that size if the nanobots were capable of self-replication.

The neuron stuff, "because fiction."  I am making a prediction that Legion is a nanobot swarm, not that Jeph has been 100% perfectly accurate to every branch of physics.  Beyond that, a nanoscale "tendril" of nanobots could move much quicker than an individual disconnected from the swarm.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BenRG on 14 Jan 2017, 08:27
My guess is that the 'weapon' the white-skinned one has been using has been some manner of infrasonic or ultrasonic system that is temporarily disabling sections of the target's brain (possibly due to brainwave harmonics or something).
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Case on 14 Jan 2017, 08:33
I'm going with good, old-fashioned transcranial magnetic stimulation (http://transcranial magnetic stimulation)  :-P

Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 14 Jan 2017, 09:32
One of my favorite observations is "We are the gray goo".
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Case on 14 Jan 2017, 09:41
One of my favorite observations is "We are the gray pink goo".

FYP

Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: TheEvilDog on 14 Jan 2017, 11:22
Nanotbots exist only in SF-lit
QC is sci-fi. I'm going with the MST3K mantra on this one...


Always go with the MST3K mantra when dealing with the QC-verse.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 14 Jan 2017, 13:42
Except when over-analyzing is fun.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Bollthorn on 14 Jan 2017, 14:05
This is certainly an AI of wealth and taste.

I see what you did there ;)
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: St.Clair on 14 Jan 2017, 14:34
Given that Bubbles was designed to be a member of a combat team

I had come away with a different impression after her conversation with Momo about choosing the military as a career. It sounded like she was a run-of-the-mill AI who thought she should serve her country.

If someone in the QC world is designing people with personality traits to adapt them to being members of a combat team then the ethical issues are intense.

My assumption was that she was part of some DARPA program akin to BigDog, and the whole bit about AIs being people came up literally during/in the middle of her development and/or deployment.
She wasn't, legally, a person when she was built and embedded with her squad; she was by the time whatever remained of it got decomissioned/mustered out.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Perfectly Reasonable on 14 Jan 2017, 18:16
So assuming that GreyCreep is a mouthpiece for a collective intelligence:
I think that GC was assembled for this one task. The snarkiness is an expression of resentment at being diverted from more interesting business. Once the mission at hand is completed, the vacated chassis will collapse into its component parts. After all, they have better things to do.

Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 14 Jan 2017, 19:32
Welcome, new people who I didn't already greet individually!
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Morituri on 14 Jan 2017, 20:37
Once the mission at hand is completed, the vacated chassis will collapse into its component parts. After all, they have better things to do.

This would be of interest to May, who apparently likes that color or something close to it, and has been having trouble with her parolee chassis.

Of course, a bit of genderbending is involved, but if Pintsize is to be believed that amounts to flipping a bit.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Storel on 14 Jan 2017, 22:43
Once the mission at hand is completed, the vacated chassis will collapse into its component parts. After all, they have better things to do.

This would be of interest to May, who apparently likes that color or something close to it, and has been having trouble with her parolee chassis.

Of course, a bit of genderbending is involved, but if Pintsize is to be believed that amounts to flipping a bit.

If the component parts are the size of, say, individual molecules, I don't imagine there'll be anything left that May could use...
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Timemaster on 14 Jan 2017, 23:37
So assuming that GreyCreep is a mouthpiece for a collective intelligence:

That´s basically what I´m thinking too. Not an individual AI, but rather a drone. A remote operated chassis, directly controlled by one or more of those "more puissant AI´s".

But as far as I remember no one has come up with the most obvious reference: The Borg!

"We are Borg. We´ll have your encryption broken and your nasty stuff removed. And than you will be assimilated."
 :-D

TM
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: BenRG on 15 Jan 2017, 12:27
Poll Results Post

Just For What Was Hannelore All Dressed Up?
------------------------------
1. She's meeting a venture capitalist to get start-up cash for the cleaning business she wants to start with Brun - 7 (15.9%)
=2. She's going to the Church of Gary! - 6 (13.6%)
=2. She's wearing a pullover to teach Bubbles how to pull off the cardigan look - 6 (13.6%)
=2. She's helping Arthur out at the Self-Help Group and she likes to look professional - 6 (13.6%)
=2. Other - 6 (13.6%)
6. Her Evil Twin Sister is marrying someone (!) and she's going to sit at the back of the chapel - 4 (9.1%)
=7. Dinner with Beatrice - 3 (6.8%)
=7. A date with someone - 3 (6.8%)
=7. She's agreed to chaperone Brun and Elliott - 3 (6.8%)
x. She's agreed to chaperone Clinton and Emily (I doubt it would be anything anyone would recognise as a date!) - 0 (0%)

---------

A pretty close one this week but, nonetheless, there is a clear result, if a narrow one!

So, I'm reading from this that many readers want to see the birth of the bow-wearing Hanners and Brun's Cleaning Service! I'm also seeing that there isn't much enthusiasm for Clinton and Emily having a second date.
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: Storel on 15 Jan 2017, 14:51
I'm also seeing that there isn't much enthusiasm for Clinton and Emily having a second date.

Not much enthusiasm for having Hanners chaperone Clinton and Emily's second date, anyway. Don't read more into the data than is actually there.  8-)
Title: Re: WCDT Strips 3391-3395 (9th to 13th January 2017)
Post by: DuneCanid on 05 Mar 2017, 14:11
Quote from: riccostar


In any case, I expect we'll see more and more (human) characters go the way of Sara and Yelling Bird.

Yelling Bird is too convenient a device to be gone. It will be back.

DC, l5ls.