THESE FORUMS NOW CLOSED (read only)
Comic Discussion => QUESTIONABLE CONTENT => Topic started by: BenRG on 25 Dec 2017, 01:00
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A nice, simple one for the end of the year. Which of the main cast (or secondary cast, if you prefer) do you think has impressed you the most over the past year. Be it by character growth, arcs in which they starred or by funnies that they delivered, which of Jeph's creations stuck out in your mind?
Personally, I had to think about this and, in the end, I'm selecting Bubbles, as unimaginative as that is. We've gone from her liberation to her being part of the Main Cast Apartment Extended Family very smoothly. Along the way, we've seen so much character growth in her that she is nearly unrecognisable to the traumatised slave that she was at the start of the year.
What do you think?
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I'm with Ben 100% on this one.
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Me too. Though I was a bit surprised that Tilly didn't get their own entry in the poll.
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Tilly hasn't been around for long enough to be part of a year-as-a-whole poll. Plus, I think he was trying to avoid more arguing about them.
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Comic’s up.
Or should that be: la bande dessinée est en place.
(Google translated, because I don’t speak French.)
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Bubbles.
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Me too, certainly Bubbles' progress was the most impressing.
TM
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I find myself wondering exactly what Jeph is saying with this strip. My best guess is that you really, really need to know the lingo to order the food. After all, otherwise there is no guarantee that you even know what you're ordering!
Also, that a relaxed bad attitude isn't a Coffee of Doom staple, it's a universal constant of the independent coffee shop barista! Customer's order doesn't make sense? Treat it as literally as you like; asking for clarification is, after all, just likely to be more work! :laugh:
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When placing an order, remember: Garbage In, Garbage Out.
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If you're placing an order Starbucks-style in a small French café, he's lucky 20 espresso was all he got.
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If you try to speak Starbucks (tall, grande, venti) in an independent coffeshop anywhere in the world, you're fucked.
:-D
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I find myself wondering exactly what Jeph is saying with this strip. My best guess is that you really, really need to know the lingo to order the food. After all, otherwise there is no guarantee that you even know what you're ordering!
H
Venti is Starbuckian for "20 fl oz Cup size". Since Café la Morte is (presumably) located in France, the resident Baristas don't understand Starbuckian, but can readily count to twenty in another romance-language (I've heard this quite often from French or Italian acquantances), so Francohanners assumes that Venti Coffee is supposed to mean 20 Espressos rather than one 592 ml cup of coffee.
A large part of the world uses English as lingua franca, however, this does not mean we all grew up in Flyspeck, AZ - and that's before accounting for English being the Cleptomanic amongst languages. Similarly, Germans will think think you're suffering an anxiety-attack if you tell them you're "angsting" (if they can process your mispronouncing "Angst", that is - the English "a" sounds rather like the German "ä" than the "a"), and might assume that your " Gestalt-experience" means that you encountered a sinister figure somewhere.
And most German barkeeps will be completely at a loss as to how they're supposed to get the beer you just ordered inside a rock (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beer_stein), or why anybody would want something like that in the first place.
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I find myself wondering exactly what Jeph is saying with this strip. My best guess is that you really, really need to know the lingo to order the food. After all, otherwise there is no guarantee that you even know what you're ordering!
Venti is Starbuckian for "20 fl oz Cup size". Since Café la Morte is (presumably) located in France, the resident Baristas don't understand Starbuckian, but can readily count to twenty in another romance-language (I've heard this quite often from French or Italian acquantances), so Francohanners assumes that Venti Coffee is supposed to mean 20 Espressos rather than one 592 ml cup of coffee.
A large part of the world uses English as lingua franca, however, this does not mean we all grew up in Flyspeck, AZ - and that's before accounting for English being the Cleptomanic amongst languages. Similarly, Germans will think think you're suffering an anxiety-attack if you tell them you're "angsting", and might assume that your " Gestalt-experience" means that you encountered a sinister figure somewhere.
A Brazilian professor that I've worked with would go into Starbucks when he was in the U.S. and would order a "grande," pronounced as if it were Brazilian Portuguese ("granjee"), and confuse the hell out of the cashier.
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When I was in NY a few days ago, I went to Starbucks and ordered a "tall caramell latte".
The woman at the cashier noticed I was from abroad and asked in reply: "So you want a small one?" :-D
Even the Starbuckians know that this tall/grande/venti-thing ist bullshit. Why don't they go for small/medium/large? Too uncool for hipsters?
Timemaster
EDIT: 25€ for twenty espressos? 1,25€ each? This must be the cheapest coffeeshop ever! :roll:
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Small/Medium/Large isn't trademarkable...
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I live in Brazil. "Grande" in portuguese means literally "big", but even here a "grande" coffee in Starbucks is the "medium" sized one. It's really,really amazingly dumb.
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Marketing - where stupid comes to breed and trademark / copyright every known and unknown term and thing in the universe.
We need to Orions to come over and vaporize each and every copyright and patent holder for theft from the public domain. :-D The centauri I don't trust as much for not pulling the same stunt.
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Marketing - where stupid comes to breed and trademark / copyright every known and unknown term and thing in the universe.
We need to Orions to come over and vaporize each and every copyright and patent holder for theft from the public domain. :-D The centauri I don't trust as much for not pulling the same stunt.
We've met the Ferengi and they are us.
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I live in Brazil. "Grande" in portuguese means literally "big", but even here a "grande" coffee in Starbucks is the "medium" sized one. It's really,really amazingly dumb.
Which part of Brazil? I've been to São Paulo state and Pernambuco. As the professor put it, my Portuguese was just good enough to not starve.
As for Starbucks, the story I've heard is that they originally had sizes called "Short" and "Tall" which sort of made sense. Then they introduced "Grande" to be larger than Tall (which made Tall's name stupid), and then they did the same thing again by introducing "Venti."
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Venti is Starbuckian for "20 fl oz Cup size". Since Café la Morte is (presumably) located in France, the resident Baristas don't understand Starbuckian, but can readily count to twenty in another romance-language (I've heard this quite often from French or Italian acquantances), so Francohanners assumes that Venti Coffee is supposed to mean 20 Espressos rather than one 592 ml cup of coffee.
An understandable mistake, no? I'd be more apt to believe that the customer is ordering for a lot of friends than the strange idea that they want to drink their coffee out of a bucket.
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Poll: Bubbles, with Hannelore as a close second. Major turning points for both of them. It'll be interesting to see how Hanners and Tilly carry on from here.
Comic: Fortunately, we don't have a Starbuck's in town. We do, however, have baristas who understand small, medium, and large.
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Every time I order a 'large' at Starbuck's, they put venti in it.
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Marketing - where stupid comes to breed and trademark / copyright every known and unknown term and thing in the universe.
We need to Orions to come over and vaporize each and every copyright and patent holder for theft from the public domain. :-D The centauri I don't trust as much for not pulling the same stunt.
We've met the Ferengi and they are us.
Well, I mean, you've seen Trump. He would probably be flattered by the comparison.
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Does that imply there are Coffee of Doom branches in EVERY country?
The Canadian Coffee of Doom would probably be more polite.... :-D
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Venti is Starbuckian for "20 fl oz Cup size". Since Café la Morte is (presumably) located in France, the resident Baristas don't understand Starbuckian, but can readily count to twenty in another romance-language (I've heard this quite often from French or Italian acquantances), so Francohanners assumes that Venti Coffee is supposed to mean 20 Espressos rather than one 592 ml cup of coffee.
An understandable mistake, no? I'd be more apt to believe that the customer is ordering for a lot of friends than the strange idea that they want to drink their coffee out of a bucket.
Obligatory European "Tsk, Americans."
Does that imply there are Coffee of Doom branches in EVERY country?
The Canadian Coffee of Doom would probably be more polite.... :-D
"Oh hey there, how ya doin'? Welcome to Coffee of Broom, can I get you some coffee, eh? We've got a special today where if you order some Machiatto, our barista Clay will mock you and our assistant manager Flora will apologise, eh. If you buy two coffees, you'll get a free curling broom."
(I profusely apologise to any Canadians whom I might have offended.)
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We've met the Ferengi and they are us.
Well, I mean, you've seen Trump. He would probably be flattered by the comparison.
He doesn't have the lobes.
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We've met the Ferengi and they are us.
Well, I mean, you've seen Trump. He would probably be flattered by the comparison.
He doesn't have the lobes.
To hear him say it, they're yuuuuge. The bigliest ever. Belive him.
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Marketing - where stupid comes to breed and trademark / copyright every known and unknown term and thing in the universe.
We need to Orions to come over and vaporize each and every copyright and patent holder for theft from the public domain. :-D The centauri I don't trust as much for not pulling the same stunt.
Centauri never struck me as coffee drinkers. There is jala, but I don't know what type of drink that is.
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When I was in NY, I visited the Trump Tower too. There's a Starbucks in it. I went there and looked, and they only sell the normal tall/grande/venti sizes.
I was dissapointed. I assumed there would be an extra Trump-size, like HUGE. Meaning one gallon of coffee or so. Sold in golden cups of cause.
They don't get the Trump spirit. I suppose the will be fired soon. :-D
TM
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I accidentally voted for Brun instead of Bubbles. :(
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If you are drinking the boiled rat turds that Starbucks sells, you probably deserve to be f****d with.
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New Comic Up!
Woohoo! Pizza Girl doth return! Based on her expression in panel 3, I suspect that she's already thinking up new and innovative ways to kill her boss for his idea of 'special theme weeks'!
So, what does everyone think? Is that Bubbles asking about her armour or Pintsize? I could come up with plausible stories for both.
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Given the height of the speech box, I'd say Pintsize.
That is some snazzy armour. Though before she explained, I thought it was probably just the costume for Pizza Girl 3: Revenge of the Calzone Clan, in which our hero needs to be beefed up before the franchise goes stale.
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Given the height of the speech box, I'd say Pintsize.
I would like to think that it's Bubbles. I shudder to think what Pintsize wants the armor for.
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I very much enjoyed QC en Francais, and today's comic it was nice to see Faye and Marten just hanging out. Feel like it's been a while.
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I sorta thought Bubbles, just because I could see her going 'Other people in armor? What?'
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Given the height of the speech box, I'd say Pintsize.
I would like to think that it's Bubbles. I shudder to think what Pintsize wants the armor for.
It looks like a Bubbles font. (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=3009) Compare the 'I's in particular.
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It’s s weird compositional choice, given that we didn’t see either Bubbles or Pintsize in any of the earlier panels to set up the joke. But I do think it’s Bubbles. Pintsize would never be so polite.
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It’s s weird compositional choice, given that we didn’t see either Bubbles or Pintsize in any of the earlier panels to set up the joke. But I do think it’s Bubbles. Pintsize would never be so polite.
For their sake I hope it was Bubbles who asked that question since it's just polite interest in armor. This is not a Pizza Girl who takes sass lightly. Something Faye might want to keep in mind if starts questioning her identity.
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Everyone else is going on about the "Starbuckian" language, and me, I'm astounded at the price. At current exchange from euro to USD, that's about $1.49 per espresso. Dude should have shut his mouth and left with his loot.
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It looks like a Bubbles font. (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=3009) Compare the 'I's in particular.
Good catch, Tova. I never noticed that before. It has to be Bubbles - Pintsize would, A) never be that polite, and B) never be so subtle as to express interest in the armor when what he's curious about is what's under the armor.
Another random discovery (at least I never noticed it before) - clicking forward from 3009, did Brun's friend Barry's brain come from robo-boxer Barry's head (https://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=3018), or vice versa? That might account for...certain characteristics.
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It looks like a Bubbles font. (http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=3009) Compare the 'I's in particular.
Good catch, Tova. I never noticed that before. It has to be Bubbles - Pintsize would, A) never be that polite....
That's pretty much what I was thinking....Pintsize would never say "please."
That's Bubbles all the way.
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New Comic Up!
Oh, it's not exactly a new comic for everyone. After asking on Patreon, Jeph is releasing bonus comics to the world at large for the holidays. I hope that everyone enjoys.
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New Comic Up!
Oh, it's not exactly a new comic for everyone. After asking on Patreon, Jeph is releasing bonus comics to the world at large for the holidays. I hope that everyone enjoys.
Well, in that case: Many thanks to Jeph & the Patrons!
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New Comic Up!
Oh, it's not exactly a new comic for everyone. After asking on Patreon, Jeph is releasing bonus comics to the world at large for the holidays. I hope that everyone enjoys.
I know the provenance of the strip, the point is that it's a new comic for me.
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I don't think Pintsize would have said "excuse me" or "please."
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Until you pointed it out, I had assumed Faye wanted to inspect PenPen's armor for design ideas.
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I find myself wondering exactly what Jeph is saying with this strip. My best guess is that you really, really need to know the lingo to order the food. After all, otherwise there is no guarantee that you even know what you're ordering!
H
Venti is Starbuckian for "20 fl oz Cup size". Since Café la Morte is (presumably) located in France, the resident Baristas don't understand Starbuckian, but can readily count to twenty in another romance-language (I've heard this quite often from French or Italian acquantances), so Francohanners assumes that Venti Coffee is supposed to mean 20 Espressos rather than one 592 ml cup of coffee.
A large part of the world uses English as lingua franca, however, this does not mean we all grew up in Flyspeck, AZ - and that's before accounting for English being the Cleptomanic amongst languages. Similarly, Germans will think think you're suffering an anxiety-attack if you tell them you're "angsting" (if they can process your mispronouncing "Angst", that is - the English "a" sounds rather like the German "ä" than the "a"), and might assume that your " Gestalt-experience" means that you encountered a sinister figure somewhere.
And most German barkeeps will be completely at a loss as to how they're supposed to get the beer you just ordered inside a rock (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beer_stein), or why anybody would want something like that in the first place.
Also, when in Germany, say "my temperature is warm", not "I'm hot".
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Today's Strip Up!
There are some jobs that are unique to humanform synthetics: Literally something that they and only they can do. In Melon's case that appears to be playing a dying person in a scorpion pit in a cheap 'Chamber of Horrors'-style tourist attraction somewhere. Melon will never get it but the meatsacks seem to find it interesting.
Arthur, meanwhile, is a freelance waste incinerator guy; he uses a domestic cooker to start the blaze. So far he hasn't worked out why the EPA guys keep on having nervous breakdowns when they meet him.
Eh, it's a living.
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Well....that’s disturbing.
And then there’s the comic.
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Do it to July?
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When I was in NY a few days ago, I went to Starbucks and ordered a "tall caramell latte".
The woman at the cashier noticed I was from abroad and asked in reply: "So you want a small one?" :-D
Even the Starbuckians know that this tall/grande/venti-thing ist bullshit. Why don't they go for small/medium/large? Too uncool for hipsters?
Timemaster
EDIT: 25€ for twenty espressos? 1,25€ each? This must be the cheapest coffeeshop ever! :roll:
There's another size as well which alters the small/medium/large thing so it doesn't quite line up. There's also the "short". Short/Tall/Grande/Venti. Since the "Short" is never featured on the board allowing the S/M/L thing to play out, does the "Short" then become and "Extra Small" since we can't go and rename them all to where the Tall becomes a Medium. The Grande a Large and the Venti an Extra Large.
And for those curious, a "short" for espresso drinks, contains the same amount of espresso shots as a "tall", but simply contains less milk.
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I was trying to interpret this strip symbolically rather than literally - that wasn’t what actually happened to Melon at work, it’s just what it felt like. (And I was guessing that she worked in a customer support call center or something equally horrific.)
Also, is her tie held on with cellophane tape?
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Also, is her tie held on with cellophane tape?
Yes, after all, she has nothing on to which to clip on a clip-on tie.
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Everyone else is going on about the "Starbuckian" language, and me, I'm astounded at the price. At current exchange from euro to USD, that's about $1.49 per espresso. Dude should have shut his mouth and left with his loot.
That seems like a normal price to me? Mind you, for here. I haven't been to France in ten years.
EDIT: my brother who was on a skiing vacation there last year tells me it's 2-3 euros. And also Jeph recently spent one summer in rural France, so he should know, and my brother was in a very touristy area.
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Everyone else is going on about the "Starbuckian" language, and me, I'm astounded at the price. At current exchange from euro to USD, that's about $1.49 per espresso. Dude should have shut his mouth and left with his loot.
I think he was assuming the price she said was for one espresso, not 20.
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Well THAT was a thing.
:-o
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No wonder her butt fell off.
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Umm...
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One of my favourite quirks of Jeph's art is the chipper smile that robot has.
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We haven't seen much symbolism in QC before this... leads me to believe this really is what Melon's job is.
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Everyone else is going on about the "Starbuckian" language, and me, I'm astounded at the price. At current exchange from euro to USD, that's about $1.49 per espresso. Dude should have shut his mouth and left with his loot.
I think he was assuming the price she said was for one espresso, not 20.
Yep, I did get that part, was just cracking about the price ;)
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The oven is on fire on the background XD XD
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The oven is on fire on the background XD XD
It took me four views of the strip to notice that. I love those little details that Jeph throws in. He is a master of the understated. :laugh:
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This is absurd. I love it! :-D
TM
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What is he cooking?
Why is he cooking?
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No wonder her butt fell off.
To be fair, that would scare the pants off me too. I'm not sure my butt would reach sub orbital heights though.
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I assumed it was for 20 espressos, although it did seem quite a bit low for France. Perfectly normal for Bulgaria, though. I went with my brother hiking yesterday and he had one for 0.75 euros at a hut. The equivalent of 1.49 US dollars, at the moment, would be how much an espresso costs in a medium-quality coffeeshop in Bulgaria currently in a small town.
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We haven't seen much symbolism in QC before this... leads me to believe this really is what Melon's job is.
An actor in VR horror movies...
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What is he cooking?
Why is he cooking?
Do not ask "why", rather ask, "why not".
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The French, always such sticklers for politeness...
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BbN9g5jCUAA94wM.jpg)
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(https://s15-us2.ixquick.com/cgi-bin/serveimage?url=https:%2F%2Fi.pinimg.com%2F564x%2F39%2F0c%2F47%2F390c475493d58a4026f2d0654525b60d--comment-memes-simpsons.jpg&sp=75c528cf4b8192e087e5fa4ebdf48778)
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Are those leeches on Melon's ankles in panel 3? What the Bloody Hell are leeches doing biting a 'bot?
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Getting really confused, I'd say.
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Are those leeches on Melon's ankles in panel 3? What the Bloody Hell are leeches doing biting a 'bot?
Robo leeches. They drink lubricants.
Actually I think they're part of the ankle joint. She has similarly colored ovals on her head as well.
I wanna know why she looks so creeped out as she's leaving.
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I work in customer service for a major satellite TV provider.
It's not all that different than what Melon does, really...
:psyduck: :psyduck: :psyduck:
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I was trying to interpret this strip symbolically rather than literally - that wasn’t what actually happened to Melon at work, it’s just what it felt like. (And I was guessing that she worked in a customer support call center or something equally horrific.)
Also, is her tie held on with cellophane tape?
Or the customer service desk.
I'm trying to figure which ones are the equivalent of the screeching harpy soccer-mom and which one is overly anger self entitled middle-aged male.
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Comic Up!
"Corrosive is just spicy for robots" <- Important world-building! :-D
Seriously, it's good to know that Pintsize isn't the only synthetic in this universe who actively enjoys eating things that are noxious and dangerous to their system integrity. It shouldn't surprise us; This is a 'bot who inserted an explosive into her butt and launched it into orbit, after all!
I'd suggest that Melon and Pintsize were a natural pair but it is clear that she is a career-bot and that she wants a house-husband, not a fellow divergent. Arthur clearly is everything she wants in a run-time partner!
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I haven't read QC for some days...
Et il y a un épisode en français !
Yeah, we got Starbucks here, now. But nobody in her right mind would enjoy what they call coffee. I sometimes buy something warm to drink at the Gare de l'Est in Paris when I'm waiting for my train to Strasbourg. And for sure, I never will give in their strange and nonsensical language. "Just give me the biggest/middle/smallest one". :D
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Yay, flying hats! And more stick-on ties! Can anyone read what's written on the tie?
TM
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Yay, flying hats! And more stick-on ties! Can anyone read what's written on the tie?
TM
I think it says "Business" but don't quote me on that. All I can make out for sure is "Busin"
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I'm heavily reminded of Tim Buckley's -- a friend of mine says the correct spelling is B^Uckley -- "Chef Brian" comics.
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Yay, flying hats! And more stick-on ties! Can anyone read what's written on the tie?
TM
I think it says "Business" but don't quote me on that. All I can make out for sure is "Busin"
Yeah - pretty sure it's 'Business...'
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(https://memegenerator.net/img/instances/54451464/what-is-this-bizarro-world.jpg)
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When dealing with Melon and Arthur, I believe that every day is Bizarro Day.
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Wondering whether we're going to call this Jeph's "surrealist phase" in retrospect ...
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Yummy.
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Also, is her tie held on with cellophane tape?
Yes, after all, she has nothing on to which to clip on a clip-on tie.
Actually, it would clip to her T-shirt collar just fine.
Hold up, I just realized Arthur is *only* wearing an apron in both these strips. Wonder if that's more a matter of getting comfy at home, or just keeping his clothes well away from fire and corrosive substances?
Yes.
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For me, it's gotta be Clinton. He went from totally unsure of who he is "nerdy-bad-with-women" type to "confidentally-bad-with-women-and-knows-his-identity" which is a helluva lot better than most guys, in my opinion. His rather candid answer to Brun about, "Yes, I'm attracted to you," really resonated with me because not too long ago, I also reached this enlightenment. A lot of guys, like myself, are really too shy/afraid of rejection and play the quiet game. Instead, hoping things happen rather than taking action or just, you know, being honest?
I'm glad with the direction that Jeph took Clinton.
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New Comic Up!
Oh, it's not exactly a new comic for everyone. After asking on Patreon, Jeph is releasing bonus comics to the world at large for the holidays. I hope that everyone enjoys.
I know the provenance of the strip, the point is that it's a new comic for me.
Apologies. I didn't know who knew what, and just piggybacked off your post to inform the fora at large of where they came from.
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I work in customer service for a major satellite TV provider.
It's not all that different than what Melon does, really...
:psyduck: :psyduck: :psyduck:
I'd imagine. Especially since a few of them dick over their employees as much as they dick over their customers. (I can think of 3 off-hand).
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Hmmm......
I'm wondering if Melon and Arthur might be actors in a (surrealist) show or if they're both part of some sort of psychological study.
EDIT: probably a web show. This sort of thing seems too niche for TV.
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Baked spray paint cans may explode. (Maybe that's why the oven was on fire?)
And I think Melon's job is testing pest repellents.
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Baked spray paint cans may explode. (Maybe that's why the oven was on fire?)
And I think Melon's job is testing pest repellents.
That actually makes sense. Now we have to figure out why she seems to be a spotlight.
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Obviously she's just that dramatic.
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I don't go to starbucks for their coffee, but I do love their seasonal flavors. So I usually get a steamed milk with syrup, which is honestly a lot more affordable than their coffee.
I don't find it terrible, but unless I'm actually in need of a pep, or a drink is so obnoxiously sweet that it needs a bitter balancer, I really stick to just steamed milk.
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I don't go to starbucks for their coffee, but I do love their seasonal flavors. So I usually get a steamed milk with syrup, which is honestly a lot more affordable than their coffee.
I don't find it terrible, but unless I'm actually in need of a pep, or a drink is so obnoxiously sweet that it needs a bitter balancer, I really stick to just steamed milk.
Arthur as a barista. [[[shudder]]]
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Comic Up!
I think that today's comic page really gives us an insight into Jeph's thinking about world-building in QC. There are a great many fascinating philosophical questions that arise because of how he writes his universe and his characters. There are many deep questions to answer and he knows perfectly well that his readers will ponder them. He's just warning us that, given a straight choice between addressing these issues and making a cheap pop culture joke, he'll always go for the joke! :-P
Specifically on the subject of the comic: I consider it the worst and most unforgivable discrimination that nuns are allowed to run around in skin-tight armoured robes and cutting the heads off of various fell monsters whilst priests are relegated to sitting in wooden boxes whilst listening to parishioners' problems and solving the occasional genteel murder mystery in the English countryside or suburban Chicago.
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*cough* sig *cough*
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I really liked today's issue. It's interesting to see what the church's stance is on AI's in the comic; do/can machines have souls? I'm not a christian myself, but I do like the idea that when humanity crafts something with dedication and love and then gives it life, they more or less "give" their creation a soul. If you create something that is self-aware, and can make conscious moral decisions about what they believe to be right and wrong, and can form their own opinions and world views, then, in essence, even if it was never the creators' intention, they evolve into something more. They develop their own subconscious. To quote one of my favorite lines from Mary Shelley's Frankenstein:
"And what of my soul? Do I have one? Or was that a part you left out?"
Also, the gag at the end had me in stitches. Also made me think of this:
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So that's the real reason conservative Catholics have such a hate for Vatican II. Understandable, in this case.
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You know, crossbows , when they first came to Europe, were banned for use against fellow christians.
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Specifically on the subject of the comic: I consider it the worst and most unforgivable discrimination that nuns are allowed to run around in skin-tight armoured robes and cutting the heads off of various fell monsters whilst priests are relegated to sitting in wooden boxes whilst listening to parishioners' problems and solving the occasional genteel murder mystery in the English countryside or suburban Chicago.
Um, unless I'm mistaken, there's nothing preventing the priests from running around in skin-tight armoured robes and bashing in the skulls of various monsters. They just can't use an edged weapon. Clerics I play in DnD tend to be partial to maces anyway. Less blood, so that's disappointing. But there's more bone crunching noises, so it all evens out.
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You know, crossbows , when they first came to Europe, were banned for use against fellow christians.
This is very true, but every weapon that was banned in Europe ended up in service anyway because they realized how fecking awesome it was. Like the German "Gute Nacht" variation of the morning star, which had two spiked balls on chains. One was slightly longer than the other, so the shorter one hooked the shield while the other whipped around the side and shattered the elbow. It was banned in 11 countries, and within two years 9 of the same countries were using them xD
Um, unless I'm mistaken, there's nothing preventing the priests from running around in skin-tight armoured robes and bashing in the skulls of various monsters. They just can't use an edged weapon. Clerics I play in DnD tend to be partial to maces anyway. Less blood, so that's disappointing. But there's more bone crunching noises, so it all evens out.
That actually became a thing because in the 12th century the Pope decreed that priests weren't allowed to hack bits off in battle, because the idea was that when you're resurrected on the day of judgement, you're raised whole in your body, but if you have bits missing, this couldn't happen and you were automatically damned (which is why traitors were always beheaded), so it was decided that by hacking bits off people, the priesthood were pre-determining god's will, which was a big no-no. That's why priests started using maces instead, because you can smash someone's head into their chest no problem, but it doesn't hack bits off, so its okay :P But also, if you look at the bottom end of priest's staves, they still have a flanged mace head at the opposite end.
Sorry, used to do medieval re-enactment, so my history nerd is coming out ^_^
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Another big beef people had with crossbows is that peasants now had weapons that were perfectly capable of killing a knight or lord, which went against the code of chivalry.
In fact, you know how Richard the Lionheart died? He was scouting a castle at dawn that his army were going to attack that day, and the castle cook saw a silhouette of one of the enemy force riding outside, so he just picked up his crossbow and stapled him to his saddle.
That's right, Richard the Lionheart didn't die in glorious combat or of ripe old age, he was shot by a cook with a crossbow.
And then, the cherry on the cake was that the cook was hanged, because he'd broken the code of chivalry! xD
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You're such a nerd and it's wonderful! I didn't know any of those things and now I can share them with my history nerd coworker.
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I do like me some Adepta Sororitas, the Sisters of Battle.
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I love the priest's dialogue. That is all from me.
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This could be a fun spinoff topic.
Jeph said "free will" applies to synthetics so they are not to be thought of as we usually think of machines.
They are created in a human-designed process. Even if you make the step from that to posit that they are created by humans, there are religious ideas that humans are one of God's tools for creating in which case Momo is a divine creation.
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This could be a fun spinoff topic.
Jeph said "free will" applies to synthetics so they are not to be thought of as we usually think of machines.
They are created in a human-designed process. Even if you make the step from that to posit that they are created by humans, there are religious ideas that humans are one of God's tools for creating in which case Momo is a divine creation.
If it's true that we have free will, then we cannot be God's tool for creation, as that would mean we were acting under God's will, and not our own.
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Speaking as a former Catholic, I have heard this kind of theological debate before. Based on the priest’s equivocating, I would guess that Rome has not yet issued a definitive ruling on this and that it is a topic of much argument among the Vatican’s army of theologians, but that this priest himself leans towards the “Yes they have souls” camp.
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I do like me some Adepta Sororitas, the Sisters of Battle.
Praise the Emperor and pass the promethium.
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This last comic makes me want an arc covering the Nun Wars that were mentioned long ago by Marten.
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Little known fact, the reason why nuns and priests carry rosaries around with them is to get past the Papal Laws forbidden the clergy from carrying weapons. They make for decent knuckle dusters and improvised whips/flails. Trust me, I'm a lapsed Catholic.
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I prefer "recovering Catholic." You're never quite rid of all of it.
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Its like the song Hotel California, you can check out any time you like, but you never leave.
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It’s been nice taking a break from controversy which may be why these bonus strips were chosen.
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That's right, Richard the Lionheart didn't die in glorious combat or of ripe old age, he was shot by a cook with a crossbow.
Other sources apparently say that he was shot by a young boy in revenge for killing his father and brothers, while laughing at the cook, and died of the injuries caused by his surgeon. He forgave and pardoned the boy, and ordered that he be given 100 shillings.
After Richard died, the boy was flayed and hanged anyway.
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I had no idea the connection between priests and maces (in D&D and things inspired by D&D) was based on actual history, thanks for this!
Trouble is there's history and history, especially in these days of click bait history pages and Wikipedia, although there is nothing new about 'historians' presenting us with the stories that most appeal to them, or think will most appeal to their audience, even 'interpreting' them a little. Herodotus, Titus Livius, they were all at it...
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The more colourful story has it that the Lionheart saw a boy with a crossbow, using a pan to shield himself from arrows, and was consequently shot by the boy, while he was laughing at so daft a sight.
Actually, at the time he was besieging the castle of Chalus-Chabrol, where his entrails are buried in what still remains of the castle's chapel. Nobody really can explain why he was walking the perimeter that morning, without his mail - a mistake, some claim, a seasoned warrior like himself should not have made. The motives of the bowman, likewise, remain obscure - though as a defender of the castle, I don't think we need look much further. As he was not a knight, the code of chivalry does not apply to him. However, as the bowman who killed the king, who was repressing a revolt, at the time, I think they simply decided he could not live. Treason, or some such. They didn't look very kindly on that.
I do doubt the connection between priests and maces, as expressed. The crozier has always been the shepherd's staff, quite distinct from the formal maces some dignitaries carry in processions. In fact, priests were decidedly non-combatants, and were only allowed non lethal weapons for self defence, when present as chaplain or confessor on the battlefield. Shedding blood disqualified one for priesthood, much like how a church where blood has been shed must be reconsecrated.
Edited for clarification. And I just thought of the parallel with churches.
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The real reason why crossbows were banned was because they were superior to the bows and longbows at the time, in England in particular.
Under English law, levies and retainers were required to spend several hours on a Sunday practising the use of the longbow, with many already serving as hunters for their lords or themselves. In fact, it was this reliance on the longbow that let the English win the Battle of Agincourt (what historians consider to be the peak of the longbow) and suffer a rout at the Battle of Patay. Every longbowman in English armies relied on their bows to provide for their families, thus necessitating a level of skill. Bows and longbows, while having a simple design, required a specialised method in their construction, so a well crafted bow might pass down from father to son. Not to mention the fact that a longbow took a great deal of strength to draw the string (current estimates put the draw of modern bows at about a third of the potential of English longbows), to the point where archaeologists can tell if someone used a bow by looking at the skeleton.
Conversely, the crossbow was a simple enough design to be mass produced; didn't require any great deal of training in their use, to the point where a crossbowman could be quite proficient within a week, compared to years with the bow. For a small outlay, you could quickly arm a large force of people with a weapon to could penetrate the armour of knights. Which the Vatican didn't like and declared them un-Christian and works of the devil. Which didn't stop most of Europe arming themselves with them very quickly.
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There are some advantages to the longbow, though, such as speed of firing, and the fact that it is easily r setting. Some sure that that is the major point that won Agincourt, as the rain had made the French crossbows useless, while the longbowmen had kept their bowstrings dry.
It seems that even then, there was no authority that could keep the evolution of arms at bay.
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The speed advantage came from being able to draw the bowstring, which if you wanted it to be effective required a good deal of upper body strength. To the point where the skeleton deformed slightly, particularly in the arms and shoulders. To be really effective with a longbow, you needed to be in (for the period) peak health.
Volume wasn't the best advantage, especially as armour evolved through the medieval period to the early Renaissance.
Meanwhile:
- Crossbows were easy to use, anyone could use them with only a little training.
- The quarrel fired along a flatter arc rather the arrow, allowing a lighter quarrel to travel faster.
- Easier to supply. Quarrels require less materials to make than an arrow, in less time too. Meaning you could make more for the same amount. And arrows need a spine that was flexible enough to allow it to move when it was released from the bowstring.
- Crossbows made siege warfare more dangerous. Where a bowman had to remain in the open to draw their shot and release, leaving them open to be fired upon, crossbowmen could remain behind a shield or pavise or battlement, reload, aim and fire. And in a siege, accuracy was valued over speed.
- Obviously, the crossbow's main advantage was the penetrative power. When an arrow was released, the potential energy stored was partially dissipated through the wave movement of its arc. A quarrel was less flexible but able to withstand far more force than the arrow, and was less likely to lose potential energy through its arc.
Bear in mind that the Battle of Agincourt was fought during the Hundred Years War, which the English eventually lost, the Battle of Patay being one the final nails in the coffin, due to the knights charging the English Longbowmen before they had even gotten into place.
I'm sorry if I seem to be harping on about this, its just that I'm from a historic town that has a strong connection to the longbow (we supplied most of the yew wood for their creation for several hundred years) and I'm something of a history buff.
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I do doubt the connection between priests and maces, as expressed. The crozier has always been the shepherd's staff, quite distinct from the formal maces some dignitaries carry in processions. In fact, priests were decidedly non-combatants, and were only allowed non lethal weapons for self defence, when present as chaplain or confessor on the battlefield. Shedding blood disqualified one for priesthood, much like how a church where blood has been shed must be reconsecrated.
Well before the 12th century law was passed, priests were just as capable at fighting as any soldier of the time. When they excavated Lindisfarne, they found two sets of graves from the 793 AD Viking raid, one inside the priory for the monks who fell, and one outside the priory for the Vikings who were killed. And all the skeletons they dug up all had similar gashes, breaks and holes from swords, axes and spears.
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I just wanted to say I think it's interesting that Melon seems to live in her own peculiar version of the universe.
And, looking at the weapons they had in the 12th century, and what kind of range they fired to and what kind of damage they did, if I'd been looking for a combat edge by developing a version that separated the powering-up from the aiming/launching procedure, I'd have been looking at the sling.
That rock-flinging device with the long flexy handles, which apparently took freakin' FOREVER to learn properly to aim and use, had a range very similar to the shortbow and landed these massive bonebreaking blows that crushed most kinds of protective gear and took people straight out of the fight. If somebody had done for that what the crossbow did for archery, we'd - oh, wait.
Guns.
Never mind.
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Souls? Dunno.
But robots definitely have buddha nature.
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I was approaching it from the same angle I took for the question of whether animals had souls or not.
I ultimately settled for the conclusion that they had the capacity to earn a soul. Which is very likely the notion behind the expression "all dogs go to heaven". Granted that saying isn't true as I'm certain I've met soulless dogs (which is a super weird vibe since my family has always had a dog or 2).
Being that the A.I. in QC are much more intelligent than most animals, they have a much greater capacity to earn a soul.
EDIT: fixing typos
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I prefer "recovering Catholic." You're never quite rid of all of it.
One mass is one too many.
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I think my first rumination on the topic, when I was 15 or so, resulted in the conclusion that no matter how smart a soulless creature was, it would not care whether or not it had a soul. (This conclusion rests on some assumptions about what a soul is and the idea that it makes spiritual issues *relevant* to a being).
And that the correct answer to "Do I have a soul", whether it comes from a robot or a biologically engineered animal or whatever else is, "The fact that it matters to you, means that you do."
I don't think I'd be quite so quick to simply assert those assumptions about a soul and its making spiritual issues relevant now as I was at age 15, but I still think it's a fairly reasonable approach to the issue.
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My answer, of course, would be "No, but neither do humans, so I wouldn't worry about it too much." 😁
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I prefer "recovering Catholic." You're never quite rid of all of it.
One mass is one too many.
I've been to Eastern Orthodox, Episcapalian services, is it really that different than those?
(BTW, I was raised Nazarene, so I can see why Protestantism really took off.)
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My answer, of course, would be "No, but neither do humans, so I wouldn't worry about it too much." 😁
Pretty sure that's a mixed bag answer. *side-eyes Congress*
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I've been to Eastern Orthodox, Episcapalian services, is it really that different than those?
(BTW, I was raised Nazarene, so I can see why Protestantism really took off.)
Anglican Communion (including Episcopalian) services are liturgically very familiar to Roman Catholics, and vice versa. Henry VIII considered himself a devout Catholic to his death - he just ditched the Roman part for English.
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Henry VIII just wanted to be pope in stead of the pope.
Eastern orthodox services do drag on. In some places, 5 hours is not an exception.
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I've been to Eastern Orthodox, Episcapalian services, is it really that different than those?
(BTW, I was raised Nazarene, so I can see why Protestantism really took off.)
It's more like the motto for some people who have quit drinking that "one drink is one too many".
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There are some advantages to the longbow, though, such as speed of firing, and the fact that it is easily r setting. Some sure that that is the major point that won Agincourt, as the rain had made the French crossbows useless, while the longbowmen had kept their bowstrings dry.
It seems that even then, there was no authority that could keep the evolution of arms at bay.
At the battle of Azincourt in 1415, in the middle of the Hundred Years War, 6000 to 9000 english bowmen (so commoners) with longbows defeated 12000 to 36000 french knights (so noblemens) in armor. It was the end of knighthood in it's literal meaning.
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There are some advantages to the longbow, though, such as speed of firing, and the fact that it is easily r setting. Some sure that that is the major point that won Agincourt, as the rain had made the French crossbows useless, while the longbowmen had kept their bowstrings dry.
It seems that even then, there was no authority that could keep the evolution of arms at bay.
At the battle of Azincourt in 1415, in the middle of the Hundred Years War, 6000 to 9000 english bowmen (so commoners) with longbows defeated 12000 to 36000 french knights (so noblemens) in armor. It was the end of knighthood in it's literal meaning.
To be fair, the Battle of Agincourt was won because the French lost the main advantage of their knights, that of speed and mobility, because the battlefield had turned into a mudbath due to heavy rain, allowing the English archers more time to pummel the knights with arrows.
In truth, if the battle had been fought days later or if it hadn't been raining, the battle should have been a rout of the English, or an outright massacre. In fact, the Battle of Patay 14 years later, was a victory for the French because they were able to charge the lines of English archers before they even finished getting into place.
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That, and the crossbowmen's strings were pretty much useless, again due to the rain.
When it comes to commoners against knights, may I offer the battle of the Golden Spurs, 1302? 9.500 Flemish citizens, and militia, of whom 9.000 foot soldiers, against an army of 8.000 French, with 2.700 mounted knights, and 1.000 crossbowmen. Again, the French were defeated mostly due to the terrain. It wasreported to the pope as the first battle where infantry defeated an army of knights. Though, to be fair, there was Bannockburn, and the old Swiss Confederation, before that.
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I've been to Eastern Orthodox, Episcapalian services, is it really that different than those?
(BTW, I was raised Nazarene, so I can see why Protestantism really took off.)
It's more like the motto for some people who have quit drinking that "one drink is one too many".
Generally, or are you singling out the really preachy, self-righteous ones?
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It's more like the motto for some people who have quit drinking that "one drink is one too many".
That's more than just a facile motto - it's an important recognition of the nature of addiction.
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It's more like the motto for some people who have quit drinking that "one drink is one too many".
Generally, or are you singling out the really preachy, self-righteous ones?
That one doesn't refer to others drinking. That's how they express their own personal capacity for drinking without getting out of control, and it's spoken with neither pride nor the intent of being taken as advice to others. It's not "preachy" in the slightest, it's an acknowledgement of weakness.
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It's more like the motto for some people who have quit drinking that "one drink is one too many".
Generally, or are you singling out the really preachy, self-righteous ones?
That one doesn't refer to others drinking. That's how they express their own personal capacity for drinking without getting out of control, and it's spoken with neither pride nor the intent of being taken as advice to others. It's not "preachy" in the slightest, it's an acknowledgement of weakness.
Apologies for the miscommunication.
Alcoholism runs on both sides of my family. Some of the former alcoholics simply refuse alcohol for themselves (as you stated in your reply), and some of them get really self-righteous and vocal about their newfound sobriety.