Well, I'm guessing that Hannelore's appearance is going to be a precursor to her attending another birthday party on the space station. Maybe she's going to try to explain Station and Tilly's relationship to her father or maybe she's going to want to talk to her dad about how she can handle her mother (or whether she should even try or just let failed relationships be)? The reason why I mention this is that Jeph has been researching obscure mathematics and physics, you know the sort of stuff the denizens of the space station would think classifies as 'party small talk'Dunno, but if it happens the one thing for certain is the consumption of vast quantities of spathe ham.
Is that Bailey?When did Bailey appear? I don't remember her.
...I guess Bailey probably doesn't like men, but I don't think we were ever actually told that, and "he's cute" doesn't necessarily mean this girl does...
http://questionablecontent.wikia.com/wiki/BaileyIs that Bailey?When did Bailey appear? I don't remember her.
...I guess Bailey probably doesn't like men, but I don't think we were ever actually told that, and "he's cute" doesn't necessarily mean this girl does...
In some ways, Marigold's intense neurosis that she's not good enough for Dale and he will leave her the very moment a 'better offer' comes along is tragic but it does give us a very good insight into her mindset and, maybe, just how bad her early life must have been to create this neurotic certainty that she will eventually be abandoned.
In some ways, Marigold's intense neurosis that she's not good enough for Dale and he will leave her the very moment a 'better offer' comes along is tragic but it does give us a very good insight into her mindset and, maybe, just how bad her early life must have been to create this neurotic certainty that she will eventually be abandoned.
Though she has mentioned bullying in the past, I feel compelled to point out that her early life doesn't actually have to have been bad for her to feel like this. There isn't always a simple "oh that's why" reason for a person's problems, and it seems... I don't know... dismissive to assume otherwise. Worse, it encourages a "well get over it" attitude towards those who can't point to a clear reason for their emotional disorders.
pardon my being dense, but... pants kept falling down? Dance belt? :? :?Look up "Dance belt" like I just did. It doesn't hold the pants up. That is not its function.
Indeed. Not the pants.pardon my being dense, but... pants kept falling down? Dance belt? :? :?Look up "Dance belt" like I just did. It doesn't hold the pants up. That is not its function.
pardon my being dense, but... pants kept falling down? Dance belt? :? :?
Using deep learning and collected user data, Google could probably offer a "searches you will probably be interested in" feature. I mean a feature that would hit the nail on the head most of the time...I would be happy with just a Hammer that could do that.
I used to have a Hammer that would hit the nail on my thumb with unerring accuracy.Using deep learning and collected user data, Google could probably offer a "searches you will probably be interested in" feature. I mean a feature that would hit the nail on the head most of the time...I would be happy with just a Hammer that could do that.
Comic! Well done, Marbear.It would have to be the latter. It's a name her friends gave her and a rif on her given name, so it would keep the original first syllable. Only someone who had seen her name only in print and never heard it pronounced would use the former.
Wait, is Marbear pronounced marr-bear or Mare-bear? I've been pronouncing it the first way.
Using deep learning and collected user data, Google could probably offer a "searches you will probably be interested in" feature. I mean a feature that would hit the nail on the head most of the time...
What's in a Lorentz Factor? 16 ounces of espresso?
The backward-in-time effect has already been demonstrated by Target (https://www.forbes.com/sites/kashmirhill/2012/02/16/how-target-figured-out-a-teen-girl-was-pregnant-before-her-father-did/#1b2fef096668).:-o
Using deep learning and collected user data, Google could probably offer a "searches you will probably be interested in" feature. I mean a feature that would hit the nail on the head most of the time...Ja, but being made by Google, it'd have backdoors for and reporting to the CIA and other assorted alphabet soup agencies.
I feel like I'm probably missing something obvious... but can anyone explain why Jeph would say he's both so happy and so angry with this comic?
I see it now: Coffee of Doom becomes Coffee of Physics.Same same.
Comic! Well done, Marbear.It would have to be the latter. It's a name her friends gave her and a rif on her given name, so it would keep the original first syllable. Only someone who had seen her name only in print and never heard it pronounced would use the former.
Wait, is Marbear pronounced marr-bear or Mare-bear? I've been pronouncing it the first way.
I feel like I'm probably missing something obvious... but can anyone explain why Jeph would say he's both so happy and so angry with this comic?
Comic! Well done, Marbear.It would have to be the latter. It's a name her friends gave her and a rif on her given name, so it would keep the original first syllable. Only someone who had seen her name only in print and never heard it pronounced would use the former.
Wait, is Marbear pronounced marr-bear or Mare-bear? I've been pronouncing it the first way.
I see it now: Coffee of Doom becomes Coffee of Physics.It's better than the other alternative, Physics of Doom. Though they're probably working on that up on Station.
For comic #3933... (https://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=3933)
1. "Um... four fifty?" ~ As usual, I love Dora's business sense. Even when confounded, she still has the presence of mind to not let a money opportunity pass by. ;$
2. Makes me wonder what components / ingredients would go into a "Lorentz factor" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lorentz_factor) coffee drink?
3. It is always good to be in a job that you feel is very satisfying. Gods know there are far too many that are not... :-(
4. I also get the feeling that if we ever met Emily's family, they would be surprised to see Emily holding down her barista job for so long (hired back in #3106 (https://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=3106)). From what we know of Emily, her family is likely quite wealthy to the point that Emily does not "have" to work for a living.
Dropping out of lurking mode to ask - is the bald guy with a mustache supposed to be a famous historical mathematician or physicist? He's wearing kinda an old-fashioned suit, so that was my first thought.
Maybe it's supposed to be Max Planck? He has the bald head, the mustache, usually wore bow ties for pictures, and was German after all.
Dropping out of lurking mode to ask - is the bald guy with a mustache supposed to be a famous historical mathematician or physicist? He's wearing kinda an old-fashioned suit, so that was my first thought.
Maybe it's supposed to be Max Planck? He has the bald head, the mustache, usually wore bow ties for pictures, and was German after all.
???
But the first syllable of Marigold IS Marr... not Mare.
Well, Brun is back... :-DAnd Renee is back to being an asshole. (She's jealous over a guy whose name she can't remember.) Her consistent kindness to Brun is the only credible evidence that she has any redeeming social value.
???
But the first syllable of Marigold IS Marr... not Mare.
Eh? So in your neck of the woods they call the flowers "marr-i-golds," not "mare-i-golds?" Perhaps this is still another example of USAians and Brits being two peoples separated by a common language, but the latter is how it comes out on this side of the pond where the story is set.
The given name Mary is sometimes reduced by dropping the final Y so it comes out sounding like "Mare" (a she-horse). It doesn't shift to "Marr." It may sound different closer to the Prime Meridian.
New comic... I have to admit that I at first thought Philip Patrick Paul Peterson was a shrunken Elliot.
Yeah, quite the heteronormative perspective on nudity that Renee has there.
Also she has no ties to this guy. He is literally described as her internet hookup.
And Renee is back to being an asshole. (She's jealous over a guy whose name she can't remember.) Her consistent kindness to Brun is the only credible evidence that she has any redeeming social value.
So there (probably) was a period when you'd hear a lot of German on US physics campuses
I didn't know anyone pronounced it anything other than mare-i-gold. Ya'll weird.
Is...is...sticking someone else's...toothbrush...in your mouth...a common enough thing, even as a jerkwad move, that you wouldn't automatically assume he brought his own? O_o
All the hate on Renee for being jealous. I think it's more trying to be protective of Brun as she always had. She's in her underwear next to an internet hookup who's making a joke or possibly hitting on her. They might not know what type of guy Pavlov is, so while Brun in her underwear seems in her mind like another Thursday, depending on the situation he could see it as a little more than that maybe. I mean, I would think there's some basic vetting going on through IM's between Renee and her hookups, but even then it's hard to do online.
That's the whole point: Renée has no problem with having fun herself, but is protective with Brun to the point most people would feel belittled.The two have nothing to do with each other. Renee isn't stopping Brun from hooking up, she's never even suggested that Brun can't do so if she chooses. This isn't Brun pursuing a sexual relationship and Renee getting in the way. This is Renee stopping a dude from creeping on her friend.
That's the whole point: Renée has no problem with having fun herself, but is protective with Brun to the point most people would feel belittled.The two have nothing to do with each other. Renee isn't stopping Brun from hooking up, she's never even suggested that Brun can't do so if she chooses. This isn't Brun pursuing a sexual relationship and Renee getting in the way. This is Renee stopping a dude from creeping on her friend.
Is...is...sticking someone else's...toothbrush...in your mouth...a common enough thing, even as a jerkwad move, that you wouldn't automatically assume he brought his own? O_o
Why would anyone arrange an internet hookup and not have a spare toothbrush on hand?
I didn't know anyone pronounced it anything other than mare-i-gold. Ya'll weird. Though I've been reading the nickname as marr-bear since there's no vowel to make the a long, and the other way sounds too close to "care bear".Give the time-line, it probably is a rif on "care-bear."
Is...is...sticking someone else's...toothbrush...in your mouth...a common enough thing, even as a jerkwad move, that you wouldn't automatically assume he brought his own? O_o
Just a hint: don't watch Nisemonogatari, as I think it would shock you...
Actually... whose toothbrush is Peter using? That's a bit of an imposition there (unless he actually brought an overnight bag just in case he 'struck lucky' or something). Using others' hygiene tools without so much as a by-your-leave is a bit of an asshole move, IMO at least.
Why would anyone arrange an internet hookup and not have a spare toothbrush on hand?
Is...is...sticking someone else's...toothbrush...in your mouth...a common enough thing, even as a jerkwad move, that you wouldn't automatically assume he brought his own? O_oWhy would anyone arrange an internet hookup and not have a spare toothbrush on hand?
I never really saw occasional toothbrush sharing as that big of a deal. I mean, it's safe to assume that they've been swapping far more spit (and probably other bodily fluids) by more direct means...
Why would anyone arrange an internet hookup and not have a spare toothbrush on hand?
Well in fairness face-mashing sounds pretty gross to me too, especially if it's someone that you don't even know off the internet. Grosser even than putting "other body parts" in your mouth, especially since those are actually stimulating. Not sure why you'd even engage in tonsil-jousting with someone you weren't emotionally connected to at all, but ehhhh.Sounds like you're never fallen in lust.
"Not gonna make space in my head to remember that..." :laugh: I do like Brun...As bad as it sounds, that's pretty much my approach to new temps. I'll bother learning their name after a month or if they're a chronic problem causer.
[SNIP]
Let's see, a large influx of pre-Queens English Brits, Dutch, Germans, Irish, assorted Hispanic and Latino groups, plus a fair amount of Native American and French. Not to mention the assorted African languages that came here through disreputable means.???
But the first syllable of Marigold IS Marr... not Mare.
Eh? So in your neck of the woods they call the flowers "marr-i-golds," not "mare-i-golds?" Perhaps this is still another example of USAians and Brits being two peoples separated by a common language, but the latter is how it comes out on this side of the pond where the story is set.
The given name Mary is sometimes reduced by dropping the final Y so it comes out sounding like "Mare" (a she-horse). It doesn't shift to "Marr." It may sound different closer to the Prime Meridian.
I'm STUNNED at this...
(No, seriously...) I can't say I've ever heard any of my USer-type friends say the name Marigold, but your description above seems so un-natural to me to be almost unbelievable!
BUT I will also say I've never heard them say Mary in the way you describe either... an that's my mum's name, so that I have heard!
You guys need to choose an accent! :)
(Says the Scot!)
Okay, everyone take back everything bad they said about Renee after the last comic.
Okay, everyone take back everything bad they said about Renee after the last comic.Nope. It's all still true. And she hooks up with jerks, too boot.
"Not gonna make space in my head to remember that..." :laugh: I do like Brun...As bad as it sounds, that's pretty much my approach to new temps. I'll bother learning their name after a month or if they're a chronic problem causer.
[SNIP]
Okay, everyone take back everything bad they said about Renee after the last comic.Nope. It's all still true. And she hooks up with jerks, too boot.
But, we do know a little more about Brun now.
Just to save others from my confusion:Yes, but which one?
1. Yes, the above post refers to a new comic.
2. Lawrence is a place.
I'm not ace, but I'm careful to contain my impulses, so I suppose I'm out of my depth here. Guess I should bow out of this part of the conversation and leave it to the people who know what they're talking about ;)Well in fairness face-mashing sounds pretty gross to me too, especially if it's someone that you don't even know off the internet. Grosser even than putting "other body parts" in your mouth, especially since those are actually stimulating. Not sure why you'd even engage in tonsil-jousting with someone you weren't emotionally connected to at all, but ehhhh.Sounds like you're never fallen in lust.
OK, question from a confused non-american:Not an American, but taking a guess from what I can infer: America has a history of racism. Such comments can imply that they do not view those of a different ethnicity as "True" Americanstm. There's also likely a privacy violation component, with your family history being your business, not others, and so inquiring is like inquiring into a persons sex life, something not to be done outside specific circumstances. Asking is therefore inappropriate, and likely indicates a racist motivation.
Leaving aside Pierre's obvious continued flirting with Brun, which was pretty douchey, why was it an issue that he asked Brun where she was ethnically from?
From this forum topic it sounds like it's a bit of a taboo to do so in the states, if i'm reading this correctly. In earnestness i ask: why? It's a country with firm melting-pot status with many many people tracing their lineage to immigrant forebears in living memory, or relatively few generations. You'd think it'd be a more common topic of discussion, of people getting to know eachother.
What am i missing?
Leaving aside Pierre's obvious continued flirting with Brun, which was pretty douchey, why was it an issue that he asked Brun where she was ethnically from?
Basically, Brun's ethnicity shouldn't matter. He's defining her by her racial background and, at the very least, that is a bit dehumanising.
Pretty much this. White American douchebros view this country as "their house" (a phrase that's part of our political language) and "everyone else" as guests to be entertained or evicted at pleasure. Asking the ethnicity of people you aren't friends with or who have otherwise signaled they're comfortable talking about it is an "othering" act. And especially in THIS context, he's reducing Brun to a slab of meat with a brand on it. So, pretty forwardly racist.OK, question from a confused non-american:Not an American, but taking a guess from what I can infer: America has a history of racism. Such comments can imply that they do not view those of a different ethnicity as "True" Americanstm. There's also likely a privacy violation component, with your family history being your business, not others, and so inquiring is like inquiring into a persons sex life, something not to be done outside specific circumstances. Asking is therefore inappropriate, and likely indicates a racist motivation.
Leaving aside Pierre's obvious continued flirting with Brun, which was pretty douchey, why was it an issue that he asked Brun where she was ethnically from?
From this forum topic it sounds like it's a bit of a taboo to do so in the states, if i'm reading this correctly. In earnestness i ask: why? It's a country with firm melting-pot status with many many people tracing their lineage to immigrant forebears in living memory, or relatively few generations. You'd think it'd be a more common topic of discussion, of people getting to know eachother.
What am i missing?
Basically, Brun's ethnicity shouldn't matter. He's defining her by her racial background and, at the very least, that is a bit dehumanising.
I get where you're coming from, but that makes quite a few assumptions about the asker's motivations. Sure Paco here is just interested because he thinks her perceived exoticness is sexy (which is blargh of him), but what about someone who asks out of simple curiosity, or just honest desire to know more about the other person?
Is it fair to suspect racism, dismissal, or even such strong a word as dehumanization, just from that kind of question?
Just to save others from my confusion:Yes, but which one?
1. Yes, the above post refers to a new comic.
2. Lawrence is a place.
I'm guessing Lawrence, Massachusetts and not Lawrence, Kansas based on location. But, it'd be interesting if she were a Kansan.
Basically, Brun's ethnicity shouldn't matter. He's defining her by her racial background and, at the very least, that is a bit dehumanising.
I get where you're coming from, but that makes quite a few assumptions about the asker's motivations. Sure Paco here is just interested because he thinks her perceived exoticness is sexy (which is blargh of him), but what about someone who asks out of simple curiosity, or just honest desire to know more about the other person?
Is it fair to suspect racism, dismissal, or even such strong a word as dehumanization, just from that kind of question?
Or if you're white, have you been to a country for a prolonged period where you are a minority?
This is why i doubt the question alone qualifies as racism, context matters a lot.
This is why i doubt the question alone qualifies as racism, context matters a lot.
But that's the thing. The speaker doesn't get to claim a certain context. The questions you ask and the things you say have cultural context you might not intend. Questions about race in America have certain connotations whether you (claim to) know it or not. See my post above.
it following that there are ways in which it's proper to ask about ethnicity, if you mind common courtesy, basic empathy, and your relationship to the person you're conversing with.
Questions about race in America have certain connotations whether you (claim to) know it or not. See my post above.
Questions about race in America have certain connotations whether you (claim to) know it or not. See my post above.
As a non-American, this is utterly bizarre to me. Where I'm from, the question "where are you from?" is most oft answered with an eagerness to impart ethnic/cultural background. I guess culture-sharing isn't really a thing in the states.
it following that there are ways in which it's proper to ask about ethnicity, if you mind common courtesy, basic empathy, and your relationship to the person you're conversing with.
Yes. "I barely know you, but I'm curious" is arguably not among those ways. Which is the case in the comic, the dude's casually sexual exoticising notwithstanding.
Questions about race in America have certain connotations whether you (claim to) know it or not. See my post above.
As a non-American, this is utterly bizarre to me. Where I'm from, the question "where are you from?" is most oft answered with an eagerness to impart ethnic/cultural background. I guess culture-sharing isn't really a thing in the states.
Not when there's a good chance that an unsatisfactory response will prompt ICE to show up in body armor, throw your kids in prison, lose your identification, and drop you off on the other side of the world.Questions about race in America have certain connotations whether you (claim to) know it or not. See my post above.
As a non-American, this is utterly bizarre to me. Where I'm from, the question "where are you from?" is most oft answered with an eagerness to impart ethnic/cultural background. I guess culture-sharing isn't really a thing in the states.
(...) if i do get someone who does that, i'd at worst assume they don't know how to deal with boundaries very well. I don't jump to racism as an explanation unless i get other signs of it as well.
(...) if i do get someone who does that, i'd at worst assume they don't know how to deal with boundaries very well. I don't jump to racism as an explanation unless i get other signs of it as well.
Unconscious racism is still racism, though. Racism is not (just) about intent. It's about power structures and power relations. A person blissfully unaware that what they said has troubling racist connotations is still being racist, even if they have the best of intentions.
I think it's harmful to frame racism in overly individualistic terms. Racism is not about this person hating black people or that person being prejudiced against people from East Asia. Racism is about systemic problems. A person not being aware of the problems is not proof racism is not at play. If anything, I'd argue such ignorance usually reinforces the idea that racism is doing well.
TL;DR - racism can exist in absence of conscious, malevolent intent. It usually is the case.
(...) if i do get someone who does that, i'd at worst assume they don't know how to deal with boundaries very well. I don't jump to racism as an explanation unless i get other signs of it as well.
Unconscious racism is still racism, though. Racism is not (just) about intent. It's about power structures and power relations. A person blissfully unaware that what they said has troubling racist connotations is still being racist, even if they have the best of intentions.
I think it's harmful to frame racism in overly individualistic terms. Racism is not about this person hating black people or that person being prejudiced against people from East Asia. Racism is about systemic problems. A person not being aware of the problems is not proof racism is not at play. If anything, I'd argue such ignorance usually reinforces the idea that racism is doing well.
TL;DR - racism can exist in absence of conscious, malevolent intent. It usually is the case.
Yeah that's an entirely different can of worms that is a lot more disturbing. There's a double standard there from what i've seen. I've heard the argument that racism is not neccesarily intentional, but at the same time even this unintended racism is treated as if it was, with people "guilty" of ignorance or at most insensitivity treated the same way as those who practice willful hatred of the "other"; i.e. in practice the same level of malice is assumed, and they get rebuked just as harshly. I've even encountered cases where that hostility has bred true racism over time. It's a hot mess.
To use an analogy: if you step on my foot, I don't really care, in the moment, whether you meant to or not. I expect you to get off my foot.
I think harsh reactions to benign racism are for the exact same reason. The person harmed is often expected to emphatise and educate and understand and stuff like that, and they have more pressing concerns. Their foot is currently hurting, metaphorically. And it has been stepped on dozens if not hundreds of times in the past.
Plus, plenty of actively racist people claim ignorance as a tactic to derail accusations aimed at them, so "he doesn't know any better" itself might be suspicious.
To use an analogy: if you step on my foot, I don't really care, in the moment, whether you meant to or not. I expect you to get off my foot.
I think harsh reactions to benign racism are for the exact same reason. The person harmed is often expected to emphatise and educate and understand and stuff like that, and they have more pressing concerns. Their foot is currently hurting, metaphorically. And it has been stepped on dozens if not hundreds of times in the past.
Plus, plenty of actively racist people claim ignorance as a tactic to derail accusations aimed at them, so "he doesn't know any better" itself might be suspicious.
I understand where they're coming from, and i empathize with the reason, but i still don't think it's right. If someone steps on my foot in a crowd i'm not going to come swinging at them as if they intentionally hit me. And the more people who do lash out like that, the more aggression and distrust that breeds, and the harder it's gonna be to heal those wounds in the long term.
I feel like Renee got offended a panel too early. Papalymo overstepped his bounds after that for sure, but just asking where someone is from as casually as that seems a little early to get combative without any context.
He's still a massive dick, I just don't get why Renee was already exclaiming with boldface emphasis type before he actually showed his hand.
Lebanese? With a name like Brunhilde? Wouldn't have picked that!
Guess it explains the eyebrows, though...
I'm a little confused by all this talk of "othering" people. Ethnic backgrounds differ. Countries with similar ethnic backgrounds differ, even if not identifiably (as in people from two countries might look similar, but their countries are very different from each other culturally). Why is noticing that someone is different immediately make you a racist asshole? Isn't the whole beauty of human existence the fact that we're all so different, but have so many threads linking us at the same time? Why is pretending that everyone is exactly the same helpful?
So the default behavior is to treat everyone as a grey blob? Still seems strange to me, but I'll accept it's just something that I can't understand since I'm white, and move on.
So the default behavior is to treat everyone as a grey blob? Still seems strange to me, but I'll accept it's just something that I can't understand since I'm white, and move on.
You just got two different responses to this the last time you said it, and neither of them was "treat everyone as a grey blob."
At this point I have to conclude you're making these statements in bad faith rather than out of ignorance.
I just don't "get it" beyond the general idea of "don't bring up anything about a person that could be viewed as making them different, even with positive intention".
Lebanese? With a name like Brunhilde? Wouldn't have picked that!
Guess it explains the eyebrows, though...
I'm a little confused by all this talk of "othering" people. Ethnic backgrounds differ. Countries with similar ethnic backgrounds differ, even if not identifiably (as in people from two countries might look similar, but their countries are very different from each other culturally). Why is noticing that someone is different immediately make you a racist asshole? Isn't the whole beauty of human existence the fact that we're all so different, but have so many threads linking us at the same time? Why is pretending that everyone is exactly the same helpful?It sounds like you come from a demographic group that will never be seriously targeted for its differences wherever you are and so get the privilege of not really having to care.
So the default behavior is to treat everyone as a grey blob? Still seems strange to me, but I'll accept it's just something that I can't understand since I'm white, and move on.
I'm a little confused by all this talk of "othering" people. Ethnic backgrounds differ. Countries with similar ethnic backgrounds differ, even if not identifiably (as in people from two countries might look similar, but their countries are very different from each other culturally). Why is noticing that someone is different immediately make you a racist asshole?Basically, because history. Lots of very bad history. The noticing of difference has far, far more often had malign consequences than good ones, so blurting out a comment on it, especially on very short acquaintance, is not generally a good idea.
What I ask now, I don't ask sarcastically, but genuinely: I'm an expat in my country; up until now, should I have been assuming that anyone asking me where I was from didn't think I should be here? Because that genuinely didn't occur to me. I was always happy to answer because I assumed it was out of curiosity, but now I'm a little unsure what to think :/Being asked where you're from is different as a white person than a person of color, at least in America. I'm white and currently living, like, ten miles from where I was born, and I get asked where I'm from all the time because I have a speech impediment that sounds to some people like an accent. When I'm asked, it's with a tone of excitement, while when my friends who are people of color are asked, it's less excitement and more, "So, you're different." It's hard to explain the difference, but I've found it noticeable. It also happens on top of a mountain of additional othering.
So, here's a little bit of trivia obtained through Google and Wikipedia (so, blame them if I'm getting this wrong :-P). Lawrence, Massachusetts appears to have a past strongly linked to Germanic immigrants. So, if Brun was born there, a given name of 'Brunhilde' is not entirely unthinkable.
This is one of the strips that makes me love Brun a little more. She really has the most healthy attitude about ethnicity. She's not Lebanese-American, she's Brun from Lawrence whose family, when she thinks about it, are Lebanese (FWIW, I wouldn't be surprised if they came to the US as refugees in the 1980s when Lebanon was a lawless war-zone). Everything about her ethnic background is just set-dressing for her because who she is as a person defines her.
This is one of the strips that makes me love Brun a little more. She really has the most healthy attitude about ethnicity. She's not Lebanese-American, she's Brun from Lawrence whose family, when she thinks about it, are Lebanese (FWIW, I wouldn't be surprised if they came to the US as refugees in the 1980s when Lebanon was a lawless war-zone). Everything about her ethnic background is just set-dressing for her because who she is as a person defines her.
Lawrence MA has a Lebanese community IRL, which dates back to around 1900. Almost all Lebanese Christians, FWIW, so it's very unlikely Brun is Muslim.
I'm honestly a bit surprised Brun got this question though. Most Lebanese people I've known IRL (I've known a bunch) are pretty much physically indistinguishable from Italians or Greeks, and are basically given white privilege in the U.S.
+1 for representing Arab characters and being casual about it without making their religion a huge deal. Growing up I was never able to see Arabs represented in popular fiction other than as villains or at best victims.
I get why Renee was annoyed now. I bet he thought he was fucking someone “exotic” and expressed surprise Renee is a regular ol black person.
Keep in mind that Tomi Lauren just tweeted something about how the votes of Americans with 4 grandparents born in the US are more significant than the votes of others, in a way where she was using lineage as a synecdoche for race. I’m someone with a stereotypically nonwhite surname, with all 4 grandparents US citizens. I’m way more likely to have my “right” to American identity questioned than Lahrens and I’m not the voter she imagines when she tweets stuff like that.She was also pretty obviously invoking Grandfather Clauses because you can't spell "overton window" without "black people aren't really americans and should in fact be slaves"
I get why Renee was annoyed now. I bet he thought he was fucking someone “exotic” and expressed surprise Renee is a regular ol black person.
As an aside, Jeph has gotten much, much better at drawing black people. When he first introduced Renee to the comic years ago, I thought she was South Asian like Padma, because of how she was drawn. This was a good retcon.Yeah, I'd say Dale looks more South Indian to me, though perhaps you should just try asking Dale where he's from.
Though Dale still doesn't really look black to me.
So, here's a little bit of trivia obtained through Google and Wikipedia (so, blame them if I'm getting this wrong :-P). Lawrence, Massachusetts appears to have a past strongly linked to Germanic immigrants. So, if Brun was born there, a given name of 'Brunhilde' is not entirely unthinkable.
Add in that Germany and Lebanon have been quite friendly diplomatic wise since the late 1700's - 1800's. It was considered the "Switzerland of the Middle East" and was a prime location for many German businessmen and a popular vacation spot. Many hotels in Lebanon were opened and run by German business men who brought in other's for cultural exchanges and tourism, and co-partnered teams of Lebanese and German archaeologists excavated the ancient sites of Baalbek, Anjar, Tell el-Burak and Kamid el-Loz. Germany also provided support to rebuild after the Lebanese Civil War.
An even quicker search tells me that there are 50,000 Lebanese people living Germany. So its quite likely Brun's parents lived in Germany or were from Germany before moving to the States.
Interesting history though, Case =)
Lebanese? With a name like Brunhilde? Wouldn't have picked that!
Guess it explains the eyebrows, though...
It would be an easy mistake for a decent person to make. On the train, white strangers will ask each other where they are from. Same words but not really the same question.
Also, it’s othering because white Americans don’t ask other white Americans where they are from. It’s a question that implies you aren’t yourself American.
Now for you half and half of mixed girls
I know what the battle be
Every time you go out it's "whats your nationality?"
Everybody always wanna dig up in ya background
You don't look, now how does that sound?
I couldn't tell you were, oh is that right?
Do you take it as a compliment or start up a fight?
Venezuelan and Indian, 'Rican and Dominican
Japanese or Portuguese, Quarter of Brazilian
White and Korean, Black and Pinay
I could find out later
It don't matter, ya fly
It don't really matter to most of us guys
We just need an excuse to get close or say "hi"
I know they call you stuck up
Ya think you're too pretty
Spread rumors about you all throughout the city
So much attention, so many haters
But don't be bitter, you'll be better for it later
The last time I visited a city of any size, I smiled to myself in delight as I left the store next to my hotel, thinking of the counter clerk of Southeast Asian appearance but with a name tag bearing a very French name, conversing in fluent Spanish with the customer ahead of me, and how different that sight would have been at a store of the same chain in my hometown.
I see now what a monster I was.
What I ask now, I don't ask sarcastically, but genuinely: I'm an expat in my country; up until now, should I have been assuming that anyone asking me where I was from didn't think I should be here? Because that genuinely didn't occur to me. I was always happy to answer because I assumed it was out of curiosity, but now I'm a little unsure what to think :/
Seeing as how Jeph deemed this dude a dick there’s nothing to dispute...
Seeing as how Jeph deemed this dude a dick there’s nothing to dispute...
Not that I wish to dispute Jeph's value judgement on this occasion - I happen to agree with it. But. In general, I disagree with the notion that any value judgement decreed by Jeph is beyond dispute.
Let's put it this way (and it is a good summation of how I view the 'word of god' argument): As the writer, Jeph knows what the characters are meant to be. So, if he says a character is meant to be an asshole, then they are an asshole, even if he doesn't quite nail portraying them like that.
Seeing as how Jeph deemed this dude a dick there’s nothing to dispute...
Not that I wish to dispute Jeph's value judgement on this occasion - I happen to agree with it. But. In general, I disagree with the notion that any value judgement decreed by Jeph is beyond dispute.
On a separate note, I find it interesting that the common thread between at least three characters disliked by forumites is that this dislike has been expressed, in each of these three cases, by deliberately mangling their name.
Given the importance normally placed on getting names right, it makes sense that this is an expression of resentment here.
Seeing as how Jeph deemed this dude a dick there’s nothing to dispute...
Not that I wish to dispute Jeph's value judgement on this occasion - I happen to agree with it. But. In general, I disagree with the notion that any value judgement decreed by Jeph is beyond dispute.
Seeing as how Jeph deemed this dude a dick there’s nothing to dispute...
Not that I wish to dispute Jeph's value judgement on this occasion - I happen to agree with it. But. In general, I disagree with the notion that any value judgement decreed by Jeph is beyond dispute.
That's the thing, we can discuss anything in the comic until the cows come home, but at the end of the day, the comic is not an interactive medium. It is not a forum for discussion, but a podium where Jeph ultimately shares his opinions regarding different topics. He is by no means as opinionated or as preachy as some other comics that the least said, the better, but Jeph is the writer and the artist. He has the last say on a particular topic or character. All we can do is discuss it on the forum, after the fact.
Depends on how you look at it. In one instance, the misnaming of a character was only done until they actually said that they didn't like it and then immediately stopped.
But considering how odious Peter has turned out to be and how disgusting his interactions are, not to mention that he's meant to be a disposable lay, forgotten in the morning, his misnaming is more of a running gag. And of course, that takes power away from a guy like him. In essence, everyone is saying that he isn't worth a second thought, let alone remembering his name.
He has the last say on a particular topic or character. All we can do is discuss it on the forum, after the fact.
When Delilah misremembered Marten's name as Mark, some people in the forums ran with that for a bit.
Feel free to call Peter a dick, a philanderer, call him out for othering - whatever you like. But even though it's impossible to hurt a finctional character's feelings, the day will come when someone who identifies strongly with the character you are poking fun at will decide this is not the community for them (less likely for someone like Peter, more likely for someone like Tilly). They will turn away from this place because they will see us as the dicks.
And you know what? They will probably have a point.
Seriously, mate, how long did you sweat over a notepad to compose that?
Seriously, mate, how long did you sweat over a notepad to compose that?
Dunno, mate. I didn't time it. I just typed it straight into the edit box.
Why do you ask? Not out of admiration, I imagine.
Seriously, mate, how long did you sweat over a notepad to compose that?No sweat and not long at all. I'm worthless at constructing rhymes, but alliteration just rolls out of my skull.
Also, it’s othering because white Americans don’t ask other white Americans where they are from. It’s a question that implies you aren’t yourself American.
Seriously, mate, how long did you sweat over a notepad to compose that?No sweat and not long at all. I'm worthless at constructing rhymes, but alliteration just rolls out of my skull.
Also, it’s othering because white Americans don’t ask other white Americans where they are from. It’s a question that implies you aren’t yourself American.
I get asked at least once a week where I am from, and I am as white as can be (have been in the US for >10 yrs now). I have always assumed the question was merely out of interest and been happy to talk about my background. There is still such a thing as genuine interest in people's stories....
To presume the same question to my non-white fellow expats is always coming from a bad place goes a bit far. My gf certainly doesn't presume that (ethnic Thai but in US for >20 years now, also gets asked regularly), should she?
I don't disagree with the premise that for those with non-white ethnical backgrounds, the reason for being asked "where are you from" may more often be negative (and perhaps sometimes racist, yes), but depending on context/situation the question in fact may often be simply curiosity/interest in your story....
One of my friends (who is, like @Akima, ethnic Han, grew up in Canada and the USA) has been living in the Netherlands for a couple of years now.
For her, she took issue with the question where she is from the first year or so after moving to the Netherlands, for similar reasons as many have pointed out above. For her, it took about a year before she realized that the vast majority of people asking where simply doing so because they were interested in her and her personal story, not because they thought she wasn't a true Dutch citizen or didn't belong there. For her she said it had to a lot with her growing up and having had some bad experiences with being 'othered' back in Canada and to some degree the US though.
Okay, I express this as an exasperated human, not a mod.
But you would not believe how easy I found it to treat people with more respect when my response to people with colour or anyone who has a characteristic I do not share was to just listen and enact what they ask.
My experience, as a white, cis, queer male, is not the same as that of people of colour, women, transpeople, non-binary people, and arguably straight men although I moved comfortable in those circles for decades so I definitely got a pretty strong experience of it.
These experiences simply are not comparable, even as a white person in a country where that makes you a minority.
Life got so much easier when I stopped white person responding and just started listening and enacting. It's not like I am saying there is no room for discussion, and I am not singling anyone out.
Nobody is calling anyone a monster, or an asshole, or racist or even 'a racist.' They are telling you their experience, and it also shouldn't be their job to do that anyway, so frankly I am just eternally grateful whenever I get to hear these experiences and thoughts.
This is WAY more strawman than this thread deserves, but I have been thinking about this a lot lately and the more I realise how much my own behaviour can be both charmed and damaging the more I wonder how some minority folk aren't just screaming endlessly into a pillow whenever they have to interact with others.
... I never could figure out a narrative purpose for Hannelore mangling Tilly's name, unless it was to show us how much Hannelore resented her as a symbol of Beatrice's meddling in her life.You misinterpret. Hannelore was calling Tilly "Taffy" because that's the name she heard from her mother, and she simply didn't hear the multiple corrections. When she finally did, she was properly contrite about it.