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Comic Discussion => QUESTIONABLE CONTENT => Topic started by: Gyrre on 03 Oct 2020, 00:57

Title: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Gyrre on 03 Oct 2020, 00:57
[Cut to Momo after May puts it on]
MOMO: "I thought we burned that one."

Yes, I'll be swapping the poll if it gets answered Monday.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Tova on 03 Oct 2020, 01:18
My guess is that it will refer to an anime so awful that May will love it unironically and start to wear it everywhere.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: pwhodges on 03 Oct 2020, 03:53
My guess is that it will refer to an anime so awful that May will love it unironically and start to wear it everywhere.

The trouble is, what are recognisable criteria for a bad anime?  Out of curiosity I looked at a few lists of "worst anime", and they either consisted of shows I've never even heard of (so not much scope for a joke there, I guess), or included shows I actually think are quite good (in one case that was half the list!).

And since QC is a family-friendly strip, Jeph surely won't go here:
(click to show/hide)

So I guess it has to be something not bad but totally out of character for May, like Sailor Moon.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Tova on 03 Oct 2020, 04:06
It'll be entirely fictional, so the criteria doesn't matter, as long as it's funny (https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/RuleOfFunny).

It'll be something like Ass Swordman Tetsuo (https://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=3425). Except it will be much better/worse because it won't spend six episodes explaining the physics of butt swords.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: pwhodges on 03 Oct 2020, 04:14
You're right, of course.  It is forever a fault of mine that I tend to take things too literally...
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: BenRG on 03 Oct 2020, 04:20
My personal prediction is that it won't be a t-shirt at all. Marigold knows May well enough to know that she can bare-face her way through almost anythong, no matter how tasteless (indeed, for May, the more tasteless the better)!

Instead, she gives May a pastel pink dress with embroidered flowers that she'd bought for a date many years ago but had chickened out of (because she's Marigold). On the taller May, it's almost a sun-dress but the point is pastel pink with embroidered flowers. It takes a lot of persuading to convince May to even leave the room she changed in. If anything, Jeph could stretch the argument out to the entire week with only a reaction shot on Friday and not finding out the 'new look' until the Monday afterwards.

Subvocally cursing Marigold's ancestors for the previous six generations, May goes out clothes shopping and runs into Sven, who looks like he's just been struck by a bolt from the blue... or maybe the pink, in this context. One thing leads to another and they end up having sex again, at the end of which he utters the dreaded 'L'-word. Jeph can then spend the next few weeks having May and Sven angsting to their friends about whether this is just a shallow response to the new chassis. Their friends (or Dora, in Sven's case) tell them that they're over-thinking things and "fuckin' go for it, buddy", or words to that effect.

So, yeah, I'm seeing this whole thing as a prologue to the next element of the Svey saga. In some ways, I think it would fit in with how I view Jeph's artistic motivations that the next hetero relationship he writes will be a cross-species one.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Case on 03 Oct 2020, 06:29
" ... heh heh heh heh Heeeeeh! ..."
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Dandi Andi on 03 Oct 2020, 06:31
It'll be something incredibly mundane. Perhaps Dragon Ball or Cowboy Bebop. Maybe Naruto. Something with mainstream appeal. The kind of thing that will get her made fun of by nerds for being a bandwagoner. May won't even be able to revel on how comically horrible it is.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Wingy on 03 Oct 2020, 14:44
I'm with BenRG: it'll be something incredibly girly; something Momo would swoon over.  Indeed, Momo may get the opportunity to see it and be annoyed with Marigold that she didn't give it to Momo (not that it would have fit)...
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Tova on 03 Oct 2020, 14:52
All these options are feasible... this'll be an interesting one.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Cheetaur on 03 Oct 2020, 14:59
I like May's new form, it works for me
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Gyrre on 03 Oct 2020, 15:43
All these options are feasible... this'll be an interesting one.

That was the goal.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: NemesisDancer on 03 Oct 2020, 16:25
I imagine it might be a cosplay of some sort, though I can't think which character would be most embarrassing for May to be dressed as.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Mr_Rose on 03 Oct 2020, 17:05
It’s the swan dress from Claire’s wedding outfit montage.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Gnabberwocky on 03 Oct 2020, 17:38
And since QC is a family-friendly strip...
It's not, like, X-rated, but it often takes me five or more tries to find strips that don't contain a swear word, sex scene, sexual reference, or dirty joke. I wouldn't call it family-friendly.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Tova on 03 Oct 2020, 18:26
All these options are feasible... this'll be an interesting one.

That was the goal.

It’s not often the goal. If it is, it’s rarely achieved.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: N.N. Marf on 03 Oct 2020, 19:11
(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: sitnspin on 03 Oct 2020, 23:02
And since QC is a family-friendly strip...
It's not, like, X-rated, but it often takes me five or more tries to find strips that don't contain a swear word, sex scene, sexual reference, or dirty joke. I wouldn't call it family-friendly.

Who's family? Cos all that is perfectly fine with my family.

I really hate that phrase.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Gnabberwocky on 03 Oct 2020, 23:18
It's fine with my family, too (otherwise I wouldn't be reading it); I agree that it's a phrase too open to interpretation.

I was trying to get at the point that it doesn't seem like Jeph holds back for fear of scarring anyone. I feel like while the phrase "family-friendly" can be open-ended, it usually refers to PG-13 or lighter. QC is much closer to R than PG-13.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: sitnspin on 04 Oct 2020, 00:21
QC is R just from language alone.

The problem with the phrase "family friendly" is that, often, even having queer characters at all, even if they are only doing "G rated" things, got things classified as not family friendly. YouTube, for example, is notorious for this.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Penquin47 on 04 Oct 2020, 16:23
I was just rereading the arc where we meet May last night.  If Marigold truly wants to horrify May, she should pull out an anime-esque maid costume.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Farideh on 04 Oct 2020, 18:04
Comic's up.

Back to Elliot and Clinton we go. Fingers crossed that Elliot doesn't get too distracted while he's working. It would be a shame if an annoying customer actually manages to knock him out.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: cesium133 on 04 Oct 2020, 18:07
Would be even more of a shame if that customer was Clinton.  :psyduck:
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: HeavyP on 04 Oct 2020, 18:51
Oh good, we're back to Elliot and Clinton!  I've been waiting for some more on this front - new pseudo-relationship hijinks and misunderstandings that ultimately resolve into something happy is a great balm for sometimes-crappy reality.  Bring on the blushing and awkward smiles!
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Gnabberwocky on 04 Oct 2020, 19:23
The problem with the phrase "family friendly" is that, often, even having queer characters at all, even if they are only doing "G rated" things, got things classified as not family friendly. YouTube, for example, is notorious for this.
I...did not know that. That is total BS and poorly disguised intolerance. Thanks for filling me in.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: beeawwb on 04 Oct 2020, 19:57
Elliot... Is the rocketship emoji really the one you were going for? What's the intention? "You're not dumb: phallic object."
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: cybersmurf on 04 Oct 2020, 20:16
Poor Elliot though. I've always hated those situations, emotional limbo. This is actually how I feel Purgatory would feel like.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Theta9 on 04 Oct 2020, 20:34
Elliot... Is the rocketship emoji really the one you were going for? What's the intention? "You're not dumb: phallic object."
At least it's not a 🍌  or 🍆
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: DaiJB on 04 Oct 2020, 21:02
My two choices are:
*horrified facial expression trying but unable to stammer out a response,
and (of course)
*other...

May holds up the offending garment (and it is truly horrible), stares at it for a moment then, gritting her teeth and putting it on, says "I said 'I can make anything look good on this bod' - and THAT'S what I'm gonna do..."
   :-D
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: questionablydiscontent on 04 Oct 2020, 23:22
Rockets are smart I guess...

Nah, he totally meant to send the heart. He just had a moment of panic about it. You could say...
a change of heart? :clairedoge:
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: BenRG on 05 Oct 2020, 00:01
Panel 4 means that Jeph has decided to start Clinton off with the moment that he's definitely going to have to face eventually, one way or another. Yes, Elliot is nice and Clinton finds him attractive. He's also an emotional mess and a bit of a train-wreck in terms of life-stability. Does one outweigh the other? Is it worth the risk getting close enough to find out?

Welcome to real adult relationships, Clinton!

As a former designated chin scratcher to two cats, I can confirm that even the diet isn't a complete explanation for Hercules's behaviour. It's just that Hercules knows that his human should only pay attention to him, not that thing with the glowy surfaces
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: shanejayell on 05 Oct 2020, 02:53
Good luck, Clinton and Elliot!  :-D
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Perfectly Reasonable on 05 Oct 2020, 09:10
Dammit! ( burns down patreon )

Something that would horrify me would delight May.
I think BenRG has the right idea. Something mind-bendingly girly that Marigold would buy in a fit of goofiness. In a pink that would clash horrendously with May's blue.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Oenone on 05 Oct 2020, 09:56
New head-canon: Elliot has an active Insta for Hercules
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: awkwardness on 05 Oct 2020, 13:23
I laughed at that joke...my cat just attacked my feet in retaliation.

Cats are mean.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: chris73 on 05 Oct 2020, 13:23
How old are these people?
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: alc40 on 05 Oct 2020, 13:55
I don't recall any age info for Elliot, but in comic 2281 (https://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2281) Clinton was 21.  He might be about 22 or 23 now I guess.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Gnabberwocky on 05 Oct 2020, 14:00
I don't recall any age info for Elliot, but in comic 2281 (https://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2281) Clinton was 21.  He might be about 22 now I guess.
QC runs on comic time, which essentially means that its universe keeps up with real-world technology and standards, but time passes and the characters age at the whim of the creator. This is why they have advanced smartphones even though it's been probably only a year of in-universe time since the first strip was drawn in 2003. I'd assume that unless otherwise mentioned (Hannelore's birthday, for example), the characters' ages are the same as they were when they were first introduced.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: hedgie on 05 Oct 2020, 14:17
The problem with the phrase "family friendly" is that, often, even having queer characters at all, even if they are only doing "G rated" things, got things classified as not family friendly. YouTube, for example, is notorious for this.
I...did not know that. That is total BS and poorly disguised intolerance. Thanks for filling me in.

The MPAA ratings board is full of the sorts of men who write condescending letters about "modern society" to the local paper on an hourly basis, and Stepford Wives who clutch their pearls and head for the fainting couch if anything doesn't conform to their world view.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Penquin47 on 05 Oct 2020, 15:32
I don't recall any age info for Elliot, but in comic 2281 (https://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2281) Clinton was 21.  He might be about 22 now I guess.
QC runs on comic time, which essentially means that its universe keeps up with real-world technology and standards, but time passes and the characters age at the whim of the creator. This is why they have advanced smartphones even though it's been probably only a year of in-universe time since the first strip was drawn in 2003. I'd assume that unless otherwise mentioned (Hannelore's birthday, for example), the characters' ages are the same as they were when they were first introduced.

It's been over a year, likely two and possibly even three.  Based on clothes changing with the seasons (I know there was at least one winter before Claire and Emily showed up as summer interns), and Claire would be bundled up a lot more if she had graduated mid-year instead of summer.  So we've had at least a year of knowing Claire.  I'd have to archive trawl through the pre-Claire era to see if there's one or two years there.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: chris73 on 05 Oct 2020, 15:33
I don't recall any age info for Elliot, but in comic 2281 (https://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2281) Clinton was 21.  He might be about 22 or 23 now I guess.

Be nice if the characters aged a little, acting like a kid (when you're an adult) gets tiring real quickly
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 05 Oct 2020, 17:59
As I see it the original characters have done a lot of growing up.

The Wiki has everything canonical about ages, and AprilArcus worked hard to develop a timeline from clues in the comic.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Farideh on 05 Oct 2020, 18:18
You're doing great Renee. Why are they at CoD rather than The Secret Bakery, though?

Also: hello Emily!
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: chris73 on 05 Oct 2020, 18:26
As I see it the original characters have done a lot of growing up.

Some, Hanners and Dora especially, but for the majority not so much
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: shanejayell on 05 Oct 2020, 18:32
Does Secret Bakery serve drinks? *shrug*

Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: hedgie on 05 Oct 2020, 18:40
Yes.  Marten started going there for coffee after he and Dora split.  And later on, Jim and Dora agreed to serve each others' baked goods and coffee.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: shanejayell on 05 Oct 2020, 18:49
WEll, she nmay not have wanted to chat up a guy at her place of work?

Wait, this is Renee. I dunno if she'd care.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Oenone on 05 Oct 2020, 18:51
You're doing great Renee. Why are they at CoD rather than The Secret Bakery, though?

Also: hello Emily!

Maybe Renee doesn’t want to be seen by her coworkers/her crush on not-a-date. I mean... it might get awkward.

Or, even worse, Elliot might not notice/care. It’s much safer emotionally to just go someplace else.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Tova on 05 Oct 2020, 19:13
If I were meeting someone socially, for any reason whatsoever, then of all the places I could choose, I doubt I would go for the place I already spend a third of my life, unless there were a specific reason to do so.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Mr Intrepid on 05 Oct 2020, 21:41
I think the hair is from Claire's graduation party.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Penquin47 on 05 Oct 2020, 21:54
I honestly could not tell whether that was Emily or Dora until I looked really hard.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: MacGyver on 05 Oct 2020, 22:21
Magic. I spent so much money on that in the mid 90's. I saved my cards for so long, too. I only sold them about 2 years ago. I didn't have much that was truly valuable, even from that time. Just some dual lands, mainly.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: BenRG on 06 Oct 2020, 00:59
Oh yeah, they're hitting off alright! Renee's every bit as nervous as I expected and is tripping over her tongue. Meanwhile, Dan is somewhat fitting in with my mental backstory of the two of them: At high school, Renee was a nerd too but I think that Dan, who was a social pariah, could only worship the mysterious, strong-willed goth girl from afar (a cliché, I know but clichés are clichés because they happen a lot). However, given that he's just proposed buying $200 of RPG game cards, I think that her wanting to play MtG with him is a dream come true!

Will they end up in a long-term relationship? Who knows but I do think that Renee may find herself coming to terms with some aspects of her High School life and maybe somewhat coming to terms with her past. However, I still wouldn't be surprised if we have a Veronica and Jim epilogue panel when he announces that he's moving to Northampton to be with her and Renee's reply is basically: 'Yes, please!'

You're doing great Renee. Why are they at CoD rather than The Secret Bakery, though?

Because going to her place of work would maximise the awkwardness of what is already an awkward situation for her. Elliot and Jim would be there; maybe Sam and Brun too. No doubt they would all want to 'help' her hit it off with her 'date' and she really can't handle that additional stress!
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: jesslc on 06 Oct 2020, 01:04
Yep, this is pretty much what I expected from Renee & Dan's coffee date... (at least on Renee's part). Luckily Dan seems to be pretty easy going. 
 :roll: :lol:

 
I honestly could not tell whether that was Emily or Dora until I looked really hard.
I've had a lot of difficulty telling Emily & Dora apart ever since Emily started working at Coffee of Doom. But this time I knew that was Emily straight away - not sure why. Maybe the t-shirt helped...? (It doesn't seem like something Dora would wear to me).
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Gyrre on 06 Oct 2020, 02:30
As I see it the original characters have done a lot of growing up.

Some, Hanners and Dora especially, but for the majority not so much

They act more mature than some of the railroaders I've worked with. Thirty, forty, and fifty-somethings who still act like they're somewhere between 13 and 18.

EDIT: avoiding double posting

Yep, this is pretty much what I expected from Renee & Dan's coffee date... (at least on Renee's part). Luckily Dan seems to be pretty easy going. 
 :roll: :lol:

 
I honestly could not tell whether that was Emily or Dora until I looked really hard.
I've had a lot of difficulty telling Emily & Dora apart ever since Emily started working at Coffee of Doom. But this time I knew that was Emily straight away - not sure why. Maybe the t-shirt helped...? (It doesn't seem like something Dora would wear to me).

It's her height and eye color. Her head is much further above the register than Dora's and Dora's irises are practically black while Emily's are brown.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Mr_Rose on 06 Oct 2020, 03:03
Also, Dora would never make that face without direct instigation.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Gyrre on 06 Oct 2020, 03:25
Also, Dora would never make that face without direct instigation.
This is also true.

'Demeanor' then?
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: ihaveavoice on 06 Oct 2020, 03:43
Elliot... Is the rocketship emoji really the one you were going for? What's the intention? "You're not dumb: phallic object."

I thought the same. Like...is that really what you want to say you were going for? After I was done with my initial "wait, I get that you're feeling unsure how you'll be read in general, but is it that weird for you to have put the heart there?" and considering that I'd never paid attention to how much less likely guys are to put hearts on stuff to signify comfort or really liking something. Is that actually something dudes do that much less even now that places like Facebook have a heart and a "care" react option?

And I don't see Clinton and Elliot as acting like kids just because they're awkward. Some people just are, and in a new situation with emotions running high, they'd be much more likely to show it.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: cybersmurf on 06 Oct 2020, 07:19

 
I honestly could not tell whether that was Emily or Dora until I looked really hard.
I've had a lot of difficulty telling Emily & Dora apart ever since Emily started working at Coffee of Doom. But this time I knew that was Emily straight away - not sure why. Maybe the t-shirt helped...? (It doesn't seem like something Dora would wear to me).

Clothing and hair styles always told me who of the two it was, and also Emily is taller (I think you can tell from the comics).
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Gnabberwocky on 06 Oct 2020, 08:30
My obsessive nerd brain immediately veered away from "ooh, new romantic possibility" to "BUT WHICH RELEASE WILL THEY PLAY?!"
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: theMarc on 06 Oct 2020, 10:35
Oh man, nobody get me started on the current state of Magic: the Gathering. Fair warning.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Pilchard123 on 06 Oct 2020, 12:08
/dons asbestos suit

So what's up with the current state of Magic: the Gathering?
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: N.N. Marf on 06 Oct 2020, 13:13
/dons asbestos suit
Is that a suit made of, or to protect against, asbestos?
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Tova on 06 Oct 2020, 13:50
So, I do not get the “old wounds” thing from Renee and get even less why no-one has remarked on it.
Title: Meta-podophagy? At least it's not recursive.. yet
Post by: N.N. Marf on 06 Oct 2020, 14:24
So, I do not get the “old wounds” thing from Renee and get even less why no-one has remarked on it.
Page 1 row 2 frame 1 (https://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=4358) shows Dan (is there another Dan I don't recall?) holding 3 cards that look like they might be Magic: The Gathering cards, and ``wanna play some Ma---,'' but Magic: The Gathering isn't necessarily bad.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Gnabberwocky on 06 Oct 2020, 14:29
So, I do not get the “old wounds” thing from Renee and get even less why no-one has remarked on it.
My guess is that both of them despised high school and the connections to who they were at that time (for Dan, that was MTG), and Renee recognizes that and realized too late that she shouldn't have brought it up (similar to the conversation with Elliot and Brun about not being who they were in high school (which I can't find)).
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Penquin47 on 06 Oct 2020, 18:40
Best guess is he got teased and/or bullied a lot, and Magic: the Gathering is part of how he ended up being Shitty Dan.  Jeph tends to be kind of rude about gamers (from all the way back when Marten showed Dora his high school yearbook about skipping prom to play D&D, said he outgrew it, and Faye "translated" that to "he didn't want to die a smelly virgin").
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Gnabberwocky on 06 Oct 2020, 18:56
Comic's up.

"I can tell."

Real subtle, Renee.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Farideh on 06 Oct 2020, 18:57
I used to play Magic: The Gathering. The amount of money I spent on cards... It would make my father quite angry at times. Then again, it was my money to spend how I wanted (half of what I earned with my after-school job went into a savings account, the other half was for fun), so he couldn't really forbid it. I still have my cards somewhere: I wonder if The-Person-Formerly-Known-As-Shitty-Dan wants them? They're vintage! (a.k.a. 'old')
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: shanejayell on 06 Oct 2020, 19:41
Not replica swords, but I DO own a lot of anime figurines.

So yeah, I get him. *lol*
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: hedgie on 06 Oct 2020, 19:48
I used to play Magic: The Gathering. The amount of money I spent on cards... It would make my father quite angry at times. Then again, it was my money to spend how I wanted (half of what I earned with my after-school job went into a savings account, the other half was for fun), so he couldn't really forbid it. I still have my cards somewhere: I wonder if The-Person-Formerly-Known-As-Shitty-Dan wants them? They're vintage! (a.k.a. 'old')

I did as well, and sold all my cards back in '98 or so when I thought that the game was dying to the local comic book store.  I just wish that I had waited.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Farideh on 06 Oct 2020, 20:09
I'd have to check, but I think my cards might be in Dutch.


EDIT:


Nope, they're in English.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Gyrre on 06 Oct 2020, 20:55
I didn't start playing D&D until a few years ago, half a decade after college. It was nice to be able to throw the fact that I didn't play in bullies' faces throughout school, but I missed out on some fun.

Honestly though, I'm glad I didn't start playing until after 5E came out. I know myself enough to know I'd likely have been an insufferable 3.5 elitist when 4th Ed came out if I had played in highschool.

EDIT: For the sake of clarity; I know plenty of people who prefer 3.5 to 4th and/or 5E. I'm specifically referring to the ones that are jerkoffs about it.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Oenone on 06 Oct 2020, 20:58
aAAAAAAA!!! I love Renee the listener! I really hope Dan is not a jerk.

Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: badbum61 on 06 Oct 2020, 21:00
Wait, was Shitty Dan one of "THE" Bros??

Wouldn't THAT be a twist?
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: theMarc on 06 Oct 2020, 21:07
/dons asbestos suit

So what's up with the current state of Magic: the Gathering?

That warning was also for my benefit. I've got a whole rant building in me that I'd rather not spend the hours typing out.

But the short version is, the company that owns MtG, Wizards of the Coast, has:
-failed to reprint cards that desperately need reprinting
-adopted predatory business practices that use FOMO to sell cards
-possibly racist hiring habits?
-completely ruined the game's balance with recent card releases
-ignored and brushed off fans' concerns about the above

And probably some other stuff I'm forgetting at the moment.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Sorflakne on 06 Oct 2020, 22:02
Wow, I really relate to Shitty Dan in a way (right down to the sword collection).  Though I started to realize I would rather be myself in senior year high school, and it slowly built from there until I reached about 30 and (mostly) ran out of fucks to give and do what I do and people are like, "Yep, that's Sorflakne over there, being his normal self."
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Timemaster on 06 Oct 2020, 22:32
Oh man,

I can relate so much to Dan. But I didn‘t give up my nerdy school-ways during university though. Today I’m 52 and I still play D&D with my old school buddys (who all have children by now) and some new friends. It‘s so much fun and I wouldn‘t give a s**t if someone would call me a nerd. But the thing is, nobody does.  :laugh:

I hope Jeph makes Dan a recurring character. I really would like that.

TM

EDIT: I own two replica swords.  :-D
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: cybersmurf on 07 Oct 2020, 00:15
Well, there'll be a moment when you'll feel old when one of the kids joins a session of D&D. Or, you just may feel rejuvenated. Maybe even both.

Well Dan, how many replica swords do you have? And do you know how to use them?
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Tova on 07 Oct 2020, 00:34
Is he not being himself when he goes to “the gym and parties and stuff?”
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: BenRG on 07 Oct 2020, 00:38
Oh dear, alert on panel 6, Renee is falling for Dan in a big way.

However, I don't think that this is the important point of this strip. The point is something a friend once explained to me that 'growing up does not mean having to grow old' and it doesn't mean having to give up the things that give us enjoyment and maybe even defined us in our childhoods and youths. Renee has moved along in lots of ways from who she was in High School but I'm wondering if this encounter will make her wonder if she's given up things that she enjoyed and gave her satisfaction in the belief that "I'm and adult now and adults don't do that stuff".

How might that manifest? Um... Well, she was a goth at High School. Maybe she'll decide that she doesn't have to 'pretend to be normal' and might start re-adopting little bits of the aesthetic that she still likes? Small things but trying not to fit into pigeonholes that reflect what she thinks others expect of her?

Is he not being himself when he goes to “the gym and parties and stuff?”

He's saying that he can and he is but he had to stop trying to fit into his idea of what others expected of him first.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: cybersmurf on 07 Oct 2020, 06:14
Growing old is mandatory, growing up is optional.

Well, I consider "grown up" just a matter of being more experienced in life, and being able to distinguish which setting needs what degree of acting adult.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: BenRG on 07 Oct 2020, 08:14
The revelation that Dan collects swords put an image in my mind. Sam, on one knee before him with her sword in a 'knightly vow' posture (tip in the ground in front of her with her holding the hilt with both hands) and she's saying: "Teach me your ways, Master."
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Gnabberwocky on 07 Oct 2020, 08:15
I've come to the realization multiple times that it doesn't matter what others think of me so long as I'm an okay human being. What usually ends up happening is something along the lines of, "I'm trying to be myself more often. Others' opinions of me don't really matter. By the way, does this shirt look good on me?"
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Timemaster on 07 Oct 2020, 08:17
xkcd: Grownups

(https://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/grownups.png)

https://xkcd.com/150/

This is exactly how I feel about this issue.

TM
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: hedgie on 07 Oct 2020, 09:11
And the followup comic:

(https://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/blanket_fort.png)
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Cheetaur on 07 Oct 2020, 12:47
When I'm more interested in what T shirt May is going to see, I think the strip has a problem.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: chris73 on 07 Oct 2020, 14:10
Quote
When I'm more interested in what T shirt May is going to see, I think the strip has a problem.

I think the author is running out of ideas. Gets stuck for an idea and suddenly, with no reasonable foreshadowing, Faye is now attracted to bubbles or why not make Clin-ton and Eliot hot for each other, again out of the blue (though to be fair that's probably fan service)

The strip has been going for a long time, maybe it's time to put it to bed and start something new
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Farideh on 07 Oct 2020, 14:55
When I'm more interested in what T shirt May is going to see, I think the strip has a problem.


Not necessarily. Being more interested in May's wardrobe than in Renee's/Elliot's romantic endeavors might just mean that you're more invested in May as a character. Or tired of rom-com storylines. Or heavily into nerd fashion. Or any of a dozen different other reasons. Saying: "the current arc doesn't catch my interest, thus the comic has a problem" is a bit short-sighted, IMO. You can't always be as invested in every story arc, that's just (web comic) life.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: beeawwb on 07 Oct 2020, 15:20
I used to play Magic: The Gathering. The amount of money I spent on cards... It would make my father quite angry at times. Then again, it was my money to spend how I wanted (half of what I earned with my after-school job went into a savings account, the other half was for fun), so he couldn't really forbid it. I still have my cards somewhere: I wonder if The-Person-Formerly-Known-As-Shitty-Dan wants them? They're vintage! (a.k.a. 'old')

Hi, my name is Bob and it's been 4 years since my last game of MTG. I sold all of my cards 8 years ago and thought I was out, but I relapsed and played a couple games using a friend's cards. "It'll be fine" they said. "You're just filling in" they said. I still felt the pull, the allure. Once an addict always an addict.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Farideh on 07 Oct 2020, 15:26
*waves*

"Hi, Bob".
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: sitnspin on 07 Oct 2020, 17:18
Claiming a piece of art has a problem because it doesn't interest you personally reeks of entitlement. Not everything has to cater to your individual tastes.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: shanejayell on 07 Oct 2020, 18:15
New strip.

My only issue is Dan reminds me of a more 'together' version of Marten.  :-P
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Farideh on 07 Oct 2020, 18:16
All hail Dan, a.k.a. 'The-Person-Formerly-Known-As-Shitty-Dan', a.k.a. 'Marten 2.0'.

The date IS going really well. Here's hoping that Renee doesn't cram her foot in her mouth (again).
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Gnabberwocky on 07 Oct 2020, 18:21
New strip.

My only issue is Dan reminds me of a more 'together' version of Marten.  :-P
I'm not seeing that comparison. What are you noticing that makes you say this?
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: DaiJB on 07 Oct 2020, 18:52
Poor Renee - she really does self-sabotage, doesn't she?  :-\

Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Is it cold in here? on 07 Oct 2020, 19:17
I've come to the realization multiple times that it doesn't matter what others think of me so long as I'm an okay human being. What usually ends up happening is something along the lines of, "I'm trying to be myself more often. Others' opinions of me don't really matter. By the way, does this shirt look good on me?"

Only one of those is even sort of under your control.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Gyrre on 07 Oct 2020, 20:45
Anyways,
One replica wakazashi (still sharp AF), one wooden sword-sheath combo for cosplay, and -my personal favorite- a bamboo bo staff.
If I could ever make it to another con or ren fair, I'd like to find a good axe.

Axes and polearms are my jam when it comes to melee.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Mordhaus on 07 Oct 2020, 22:16
This is going too well, give me a moment to bring us down a few notches. :laugh:
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Penquin47 on 07 Oct 2020, 23:06
New strip.

My only issue is Dan reminds me of a more 'together' version of Marten.  :-P
I'm not seeing that comparison. What are you noticing that makes you say this?

Giant nerds in high school (Marten skipping prom for D&D, Shitty Dan and his Magic: the Gathering habit)
Chilled out in college
Have a go-with-the-flow personality
Aren't ashamed of their current nerddoms (Marten with his music, Dan with his pipes)
And, of course, there's the old parallels with Renee being Secret Bakery Universe Faye.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Gyrre on 07 Oct 2020, 23:09
This is going too well, give me a moment to bring us down a few notches. :laugh:

"Everything will go wrong."
"The worst is already here."
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: BenRG on 08 Oct 2020, 00:47
I believe that Renee's problem here is what I've heard described as 'catastrophisation'. Basically, every time she realises things are going well, her imagination goes into overdrive looking for hidden flaws, faults and warning signs that are going to lead to the worst possible outcome. Really, it isn't healthy and I do think that we're being given a clue the number of times one of Renee's Tinder dates have turned into a crash-and-burn.

So... um... Am I the only one who sees the subtext in this strip as Jeph saying: "Shit... I'd better start fleshing out Renee's personality if I'm going to give her a major character arc!" This 'I like making things as good as I can get them' is the first real personality quirk that I've seen other than 'No Speech or Behavioural Filter'.

Panel 4 and 5: Now kiss! FWIW, I think that they both think that it is too early for that and are restraining the urge. They're both adults, after all, and can't fall deliriously in love at the first meeting in probably about 5-6 years and get into their forever-relationship! Can they? :wink:
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Boxer on 08 Oct 2020, 01:38
"Conspiracy theories... Ghosts and Aliens." 
I wish conspiracy theories nowadays were about ghosts and aliens and lizard men... cause holy $&@! the bullshit that flys nowadays makes me feel old, and that the world is getting dumber.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: BenRG on 08 Oct 2020, 04:33
So, here's a theory going forwards: What is the other shoe to drop?

We know that Elliot was peer-pressured and into joining in bullying at high school. Was Dan one of his victims? Maybe Dan still nurses a grievance over that. So, he goes to the Horrible Revelation tonight to congratulate himself on getting off of the starting blocks with Renee. Naturally, he sees who is door security and all those grievances come back to him. He also sees how Elliot is nervously flirting with Clinton but how Brun seems to be a third wheel - Clinton is attracted to her and Brun, being Brun isn't quite noticing. So, he decides to interfere and try to get Clinton and Brun together "because Khouri deserves that nice redheaded kid more than you do". This hits Elliot in his most vulnerable spot because, quite frankly, he doesn't know for sure that this is untrue.

More light-heartedly, maybe there will be a second date and Elliot will also bring Clinton to the same place. And Sven will bring May. And Brun will bring Millifeulle. There results many chaotic interactions through the night.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Mr_Rose on 08 Oct 2020, 04:45
Nah, what it is, is he’s in an open relationship so he just has to let his boyfriend know where he’ll be for the evening…
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Cattus on 08 Oct 2020, 07:19
I disagree that "Farts are poop ghosts", Jeph.  I think farts are poop doorbells.  When Nature calls, they may first ring the doorbell.  And you better answer the door or uncontrolled poopage may ensue.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Perfectly Reasonable on 08 Oct 2020, 07:37
I miss "Zombie Monkey wants your coffee".

Bubbles would really rock a tux.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Wingy on 08 Oct 2020, 10:26
Dan's only in town temporarily and Renee only has temporary relationships.  <sarcasm>What's not to like about that??!??</sarcasm>

Besides, it sounds like he travels a lot, so maybe this could work for both of them?
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Zebediah on 08 Oct 2020, 13:22
So, here's a theory going forwards: What is the other shoe to drop?

We know that Elliot was peer-pressured and into joining in bullying at high school. Was Dan one of his victims?

I don't think Elliot went to school with Brun, Renee, and Dan though. Brun and Renee are from Lawrence (although Jeph seems to have temporarily forgotten this.) And while we don't know for sure where Elliot went to high school, the conversation Brun and Renee had with him in the moving truck made it sound like they didn't know him in high school.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: hedgie on 08 Oct 2020, 13:40
Not necessarily. Being more interested in May's wardrobe than in Renee's/Elliot's romantic endeavors might just mean that you're more invested in May as a character. Or tired of rom-com storylines. Or heavily into nerd fashion. Or any of a dozen different other reasons.

At least as things now stand, May is a more interesting character, whether or not one can take her general attitude towards life.  Renee started out as a gag "Mirror Universe" Faye, and a bit of a punchline when Angus describes the breakup.  She hasn't really had enough time in-comic to really grow and develop. 
She's kinda "meh" for me now, but who knows what she'll be like in 1000 strips or so? 
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: N.N. Marf on 08 Oct 2020, 16:13
We know that Elliot was peer-pressured and into joining in bullying at high school. Was Dan one of his victims? Maybe Dan still nurses a grievance over that. So, he goes to the Horrible Revelation tonight to congratulate himself on getting off of the starting blocks with Renee. Naturally, he sees who is door security and all those grievances come back to him. He also sees how Elliot is nervously flirting with Clinton but how Brun seems to be a third wheel - Clinton is attracted to her and Brun, being Brun isn't quite noticing. So, he decides to interfere and try to get Clinton and Brun together "because Khouri deserves that nice redheaded kid more than you do". This hits Elliot in his most vulnerable spot because, quite frankly, he doesn't know for sure that this is untrue.
I vote the former, but bet the latter.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: shanejayell on 08 Oct 2020, 18:33
New strip up!

Yay, second date.

Boo, he's only in town for a week.

Fling? :D
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Farideh on 08 Oct 2020, 18:38
Hey, high Charisma rolls are useful! That's how I convinced a dragon not to attack us a couple of months ago during a D&D session.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: shanejayell on 08 Oct 2020, 19:12
Hey, high Charisma rolls are useful! That's how I convinced a dragon not to attack us a couple of months ago during a D&D session.

"You have seduced the dragon."

"WHAT."

"I'm sure you'll be happy together...."
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Farideh on 08 Oct 2020, 19:41
(https://64.media.tumblr.com/c41409858242ff7700fd1b797b3a659b/tumblr_nd06hxFwM01qkmj3ao1_500.png)
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Gnabberwocky on 08 Oct 2020, 19:42
"Oh, it's a date now?"

*rolls a natural 1*

"No, it CANNOT be a date. I had a horrible time and I never want to see you again. Leave me, vile human."
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Raptorofwar on 08 Oct 2020, 20:20
D&D reference? Keep him.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: hedgie on 08 Oct 2020, 20:50
"You have seduced the dragon."

"WHAT."

"I'm sure you'll be happy together...."

Heh.  I once had a character who was as close to a fighter/necromancer allowed under 2nd ed rules who ended up seducing (and entering a relationship with) a vampire warlord.  It was kinda nice to be able to get strike teams of spectres at my disposal for the threat that we were dealing with at the time, even if the goody two-shoes in the party didn't like it.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Gyrre on 08 Oct 2020, 21:39
"Conspiracy theories... Ghosts and Aliens." 
I wish conspiracy theories nowadays were about ghosts and aliens and lizard men... cause holy $&@! the bullshit that flys nowadays makes me feel old, and that the world is getting dumber.

The disinformation racket is big and there are more suckers than ever.

Everybody knows the government is corrupt, but if nobody knows what they're doing, they can't be called out. Hence why no matter the veracity, most of today's stuff has to do with the legal definition of conspiracy (conspiracy to commit fraud, conspiracy to kidnap, conspiracy to commit murder, etc).

That said, the Pentagon has done some really wild shit. Like trying to weaponize lone star ticks to spread lyme disease (https://www.rollcall.com/2019/07/15/house-orders-pentagon-to-say-if-it-weaponized-ticks-and-released-them/) for example. Then there's Project MKULTRA and all the insanity from the declassified documentation we have on that.

Other known conspiracy facts (i.e. declassified and reems of government documents) include the CIA shipping drugs for the Corsican mafia and various CIA-backed drug lords starting in the 40s up through the end of the Vietnam War.
In 1950 he US Navy conducted an experiment they code-named “Operation Sea-Spray,” in which they secretly sprayed the population of San Francisco Bay Area with Serratia marcescens (a human pathogen) to “determine the susceptibility of a big city like San Francisco to a bioweapon attack by terrorists. BTW, the US army has admitted to conducting 239 germ warfare tests in open air between 1949 and 1969 in major metropolitan areas.
And, of course, let's not forget the Panama Papers. Then there's the fact that the reporter who broke that story was killed with a car bomb.

EDIT: added some formatting.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: St.Clair on 08 Oct 2020, 22:14
Hey, high Charisma rolls are useful! That's how I convinced a dragon not to attack us a couple of months ago during a D&D session.

"You have seduced the dragon."

"WHAT."

"I'm sure you'll be happy together...."

In many fantasy settings, dragons are the closest thing among the mortal races to gods.  Many are also capable of taking on human form.
And what are humans, gods, and dragons all known for?
Hint: there's a lot of "half-_____"s and "_____-blooded" hybrids running around.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: SeattleCrochetWoman on 08 Oct 2020, 22:44
Is he not being himself when he goes to “the gym and parties and stuff?”

Yes and no. He might enjoys parties and working out. But when he meets people at the parties, he’d be very careful not to talk about anything he thinks might be construed as “nerdy”. Also if he had any mannerisms or ways of speaking that don’t sound like the way the other hot, successful  20-somethings talk or act, he doesn’t use them at the party or the gym. He’s himself, but an enhanced or more socially acceptable self.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: BenRG on 08 Oct 2020, 23:36
You know, Dan, you were doing so well there. Fortunately, Renee didn't seem too put off there and is still willing to have a formal date. Thinking about it, it will be interesting to see what happens after this week is over,  though. Just how settled is Dan in wherever he lives now? Certainly, an early sign that this isn't over yet will be Dan to become a regular correspondent and 'drops in' to Northhampton whenever he has an excuse to do so!

FWIW, I think that this scenario makes my suggestion about the multiple colliding dates more likely.

I obviously have not played the same d20 games as Jeph. To me, a CHR roll of 20 is an automatic catastrophic failure. If Dan had rolled 20 under that system, he would have become explosively incontinent, tripped over his own feet, face-planted in front of Renee and then panic-vomited all over her shoes. Don't speculate on what would happen if he'd failed his recovery roll!

Now, the roll where 20 is a good thing is in deciding combat damage. Most systems call that 'automatic kill' and a roll of 1 being 'somehow the weapon bounced off the foe's ludicrously-bemuscled body', as Farideh's meme above basically demonstrates.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Reaver on 09 Oct 2020, 00:04
Dan is doing perfectly fine, not sure how I feel about the implication that his nerdyness is only tollerated bc he’s hot though.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: cybersmurf on 09 Oct 2020, 00:41
I think neither Renée nor Dan are looking for something serious here. This coffee date was basically to catch up and get somewhat reacquainted. And the "OK, let's call it a date" event probably is something like "let's see how far we want to take this".
IMO Renée realised Dan still is somewhat of a dork, and that probably offsets her awkwardness in this situation.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Tova on 09 Oct 2020, 00:46
Dan is doing perfectly fine, not sure how I feel about the implication that his nerdyness is only tollerated bc he’s hot though.

Yes, of course he is doing fine. He is being himself.

He is only doing badly if you are watching through the ship lens.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: oddtail on 09 Oct 2020, 01:31
Renee... OK, she annoys me. I know it's just one comment, but way to be judgmental. She really clicks with someone, they have a great time, but he makes a reference to D&D, and suddenly he's a big nerd.

Plus, the reference is so obvious and basic that it's hardly super-nerdy. I've seen people make similar references whose eyes glaze over if anything remotely geeky gets discussed. It's not like RPG-like mechanics haven't entered board games and video games, some of which are very accessible and more mainstream than tabletop RPG ever were. What's next, Renee calling him a nerd because he references Star Wars? Because he's read a comic book in his life? Because he owns a computer?

Grow up, Renee.
[/rant]

@BenRG: "all high rolls are better" has been the default for the d20 system since 3rd Edition D&D, mostly because the inconsistency was inconvenient and confusing to newcomers. So, the last 20 years. With the comic's (apparently) sliding time scale, I don't think Dan would've played AD&D or earlier.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: chris73 on 09 Oct 2020, 02:06
Dan is doing perfectly fine, not sure how I feel about the implication that his nerdyness is only tollerated bc he’s hot though.

Its ok because its in reference to a guy
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: traroth on 09 Oct 2020, 02:26
Looks more like a charm check. I'm more of a CoC guy...
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Case on 09 Oct 2020, 02:28
What's the protocol on US dating wrt the bill - and what does a 'cheap date' mean? Split bill? Guy pays? Girl pays? Split bill for food, higher earner pays the wine?

Is it consider rude for the guy to offer to pay all? Or is it rude not to?
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: BenRG on 09 Oct 2020, 03:04
What's the protocol on US dating wrt the bill - and what does a 'cheap date' mean?

AFAIK, split bill is the default now, so Dan is promising to find somewhere nice but cheap.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: citizenfive on 09 Oct 2020, 03:18
While I don't like Renee's reaction to Dan's D&D reference (let the dude have his fun!), personally the joke fell a bit flat for me. There's so much amazing stuff to need out about in the D&D world (and TTRPGs in general!) but it feels forced here.

Almost completely unrelated, but I can't believe it took me this long to realize that @Gyrre's signature quote was from Aviators - Traveler's Song! Such a great band and I'm amazed it took me until only recently to discover them.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: hedgie on 09 Oct 2020, 04:45
What's the protocol on US dating wrt the bill - and what does a 'cheap date' mean? Split bill? Guy pays? Girl pays? Split bill for food, higher earner pays the wine?

Is it consider rude for the guy to offer to pay all? Or is it rude not to?

"Cheap date" can mean several things, and not just WRT who pays,[1] although, contextually, it could be relevant here.  My personal rule for who pays is that, barring some other agreement, the person who does the asking pays, or one covers the meal, the other drinks.

[1] It can also refer to one's lack of capacity for alcohol, and/or going for the cheap shit, so that the drinks bill is low.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Timemaster on 09 Oct 2020, 07:28
@BenRG: in the current D&D edition you get a modifier according to your ability score. For example you have CHA 13, you get a +1. For an ability check you roll D20, add your modifier and hope to exeed a value, which was set by the DM (Dungeon Master) or the scenario. The higher the roll the better. A natural 20 is an automatic success.

This goes really well. I hope there is no basic misunderstanding. Like Renee is looking for a relationship or maybe just a hookup and Dan is in a relationship and didn‘t tell her yet because he didn‘t think this could become something serious.

I like him. Can we keep him, Jeph? Pleeeeaase??? :-D

TM
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: snubnose on 09 Oct 2020, 07:37
Well ... the current version of D&D is 5.

The "the bonus is your stat minus 10 divided by 2" rule is used since D&D3.

AD&D (aka D&D2) still had very complicated tables that decided stat bonusses.



A natural 20 is an automatic success.
That is NOT true.

Rolling 1 or 20 on a skill or attribute check isnt handled differently than any other roll in between.

You can fail on a 20 and succeed with an 1, if the check is hard or easy enough, respectively.

It is true for attacks, for which a 1 will always miss, and a 20 always hit.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: oddtail on 09 Oct 2020, 07:42
@snubnouse: true, but "nat 20 on an Attribute check is a natural success" is a house rule I've seen often.

Plus, if the challenge rating of a roll is reasonable, and you roll a 20, you'll probably pass the check if you don't have some harsh penalties. So, "I rolled a 20" is an  understandable shorthand for "I succeeded".
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: BenRG on 09 Oct 2020, 07:57
@BenRG: in the current D&D edition you get a modifier according to your ability score. For example you have CHA 13, you get a +1. For an ability check you roll D20, add your modifier and hope to exeed a value, which was set by the DM (Dungeon Master) or the scenario. The higher the roll the better. A natural 20 is an automatic success.

Yes, the system I'm familiar with isn't D&D (which I've barely ever played) but was created by West End Games.

Basically, you have a attribute (in this case, Charisma, CHR) of, just for an example, 13. This is modified, mostly at GM discretion, based on the amount of preparation the character has, necessary tools and the disposition of the NPC. For example, -4 for spontaneous, +4 because you're wearing your best clothes and are freshly washed and groomed or x1/2 because you're dirty and the NPC doesn't like you anyway. You then roll a d20 and success requires that the amount be less than the modified attribute. A roll of 1 is always a critical success and a roll of 20 is always a critical failure.

The last revision of  this system takes away the damage roll. Instead you have a minimum and maximum damage limit and a margin of success modifier. For example, for a club, the damage rating is S5K. This means that a success (roll less than your primitive melee weapons skill number) always stuns the foe (no action for d20/4 moves). However, if your roll is more than 5 less than the skill number, you increase the damage caused by one step beyond the minimum margin requirement up to the maximum limit of 'kill'. So, my skill number is 10 and I roll 3, so I get two boosts, increasing the damage to 'Maimed'. This is modified by armour, stacking for multiple hits and armour-piercing qualities but I won't go into that to stop this post from turning into a tl;dr. I've always found the system fairly intuitive and easy to use without all the complex cross-checks that WotC's system typically requires.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: hedgie on 09 Oct 2020, 07:59
Basically like proficiency or psionics checks in 2nd ed.  Third+ cleaned up a lot of those awkward mechanics.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Gnabberwocky on 09 Oct 2020, 08:38
Is there a general DnD thread anywhere? I saw one in CLIKC, but I'm pretty sure that's for a specific version.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: sitnspin on 09 Oct 2020, 09:19
DnD is still probably the worst of all the many systems I have played. It does the thing it does passably well, but it is fairly limited.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: dutchrvl on 09 Oct 2020, 09:55
What's the protocol on US dating wrt the bill - and what does a 'cheap date' mean? Split bill? Guy pays? Girl pays? Split bill for food, higher earner pays the wine?

Is it consider rude for the guy to offer to pay all? Or is it rude not to?

I'd say it's a bit dependent, but if you agree to go on a date together I'd say how it tends to go most of the time is that the guy offers to pay, but if the girl offers to split there'll not be any insisting to not split it. For these situations it doesn't really matter who is the highest earner (if you even know at that point).
If one person invites the other to go on a date, with the former taking the initiative and deciding where they go and all that, it's a little different and generally expected for that person to pay, although if the latter offers to split that would be fine of course.

So, for example:
I like somebody and ask him/her out on a date and I take care of all logistics = I'd expect and be happy to pay
I connect with somebody on Match/eharmony or whatever and we agree to go on a first date, together discussing where to go and such = one of the two might offer to pay and that's fine for the other party to accept, but often split check. If either party in this situation simply expects the other person to pay and doesn't even offer to split, that's a bit of a turnoff. 
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Perfectly Reasonable on 09 Oct 2020, 10:35
Subtext? No, it's signtext.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Roborat on 09 Oct 2020, 11:12
I am liking the Marten clone, I hope he sticks around; and Renee deserves some good luck for a change and should get to have a boyfriend.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Gyrre on 09 Oct 2020, 19:48
@snubnouse: true, but "nat 20 on an Attribute check is a natural success" is a house rule I've seen often.

Plus, if the challenge rating of a roll is reasonable, and you roll a 20, you'll probably pass the check if you don't have some harsh penalties. So, "I rolled a 20" is an  understandable shorthand for "I succeeded".

But it's one that can get very messy very quickly.
Critical fails and critical successes are best left to saving throws and attack rolls in my experience. Otherwise there's no point in having a positive modifier on skills.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Gyrre on 09 Oct 2020, 19:52
Is there a general DnD thread anywhere? I saw one in CLIKC, but I'm pretty sure that's for a specific version.
As the author of that thread, I can confidently say it's intended for all D&D editions along with Pathfinder.
[I'm just a derp about thread titles sometimes.]
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: hedgie on 09 Oct 2020, 20:06
DnD is still probably the worst of all the many systems I have played. It does the thing it does passably well, but it is fairly limited.

I'm not experienced with new WoD, but I think that the old system was nice and elegant.  Thing is that things broke once you allowed PCs of different supernatural groups, especially if player combat is known to happen in the group.  And a mage just ruins everything unless that's the game you're running, in which case, any PC that is anything else is severely *underpowered* by comparison.  I'll pretend that Mummy isn't a thing right now.  The run AD&D had between the mutually compatible 1st and 2nd ed was obscenely long, and with the loads of official splatbooks accumulating from the late '70s until 2000 meant a fuckton of screwy mechanics and easy to cherry pick for abusing the system unless the GM strictly policed what sourcebooks were allowed.

I think that Wizards did the world a favour with 3.x, by cleaning things up quite a bit, and Pathfinder is a further refinement on that.

My limited experience with Shadowrun, Rifts,[1] and Rolemaster were all in the '90s, and they either were a nightmare in terms of actually running combat, or, at least in case of Rifts, was a nuclear arms race between players and GM.

Generally, I don't want to try a new system until it's at least three years or so into its lifecycle, so that there are enough options available.

[1] I'm pretty sure that the only long-time players of that system I knew were either power-gamers, liars, or SOs.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: sitnspin on 10 Oct 2020, 00:49
All of the WoD franchises were designed to be kept separate, they very much are not intended for cross play. They each have their own internal scaling. They are also each entire different in scope, theme, tone, and perspective. Nary the twain should meet. I mean, sure you can do it, but it definitely runs counter to the way the games are designed to be played.

Pathfinder has always been and continues to be bloated and inelegant, but some people are into that. It definitely isn't for me.

I am a bigger fan of smaller indie games like Monsterhearts, Apocalypse World, and similar simpler narrative focused, more thematically narrow games.

Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: hedgie on 10 Oct 2020, 03:25
Oh, yeah, they're fine internally, and the base system is nice and clean.  I also kinda want to try out the fan-made "Genius: The Transgression".  And yes, Pathfinder is, to both its benefit and detriment explicitly designed to give players as many options as possible, and even if a refinement on D&D 3.x in so many ways, inherits some of that system's flaws.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: oddtail on 10 Oct 2020, 05:30
D&D is not the best-designed game I've played by any stretch, but I kinda regard it as the game equivalent of a burger from a big franchise.

There are people who can't stand McDonald's (and I used to be one of those people, actually), but it does a lot of things passably well, is comfortably predictable, and if you want to go out with a bunch of friends, it's a safe option that you can reasonably hope most will agree to.

Great food that's for a more specific palate? Not always, not necessarily.

Are there much better burgers than McDonald's? Boy, are there. But it's McDonald's, y'know? It's popular, it's not that bad, and it's accessible. And if you ask a person who's not a burger afficionado if they've heard of McDonald's, they certainly have. D&D is exactly the same for tabletop gaming. You'd be hard-pressed to find a person who is vaguely aware tabletop games exist and hasn't heard of D&D. And almost every tabletop RPG player has played D&D, which is FAR from true for any other game, even the most popular ones.

(seriously, before the pandemic if I suggested to my RPG friends a new game, and it was D&D or Pathfinder? I always had more than enough people. I ran a frickin' four-year campaign in PF and even when some people dropped out, there was never a shortage of new players. When I try to run a different, more focused game? I'm lucky if I can get a team together in the first place)
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: hedgie on 10 Oct 2020, 05:34
And given at the rate that even groups that do successfully start end up exploding within a few months at the best of times, most people only are going to be willing to learn a couple of systems.  In that case, I'd say "run Paranoia, the players aren't supposed to know the rules anyway", but half the fun of that game is getting *away* with knowing the rules and exploiting them.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: oddtail on 10 Oct 2020, 05:38
And given at the rate that even groups that do successfully start end up exploding within a few months at the best of times, most people only are going to be willing to learn a couple of systems.  In that case, I'd say "run Paranoia, the players aren't supposed to know the rules anyway", but half the fun of that game is getting *away* with knowing the rules and exploiting them.

Plus, not everyone will dig Paranoia. It's a game that will not appeal to people with a certain gaming philosophy. And I think it'll turn off a lot of relatively casual RPG players.

(and not just casual ones - I'm *really* into RPG, been for 20+ years, and I *loathe* Paranoia. I'd rather play just about ANYthing else - I can think of only one professionally made game that I like even less.

And on GMing side, I think I'd rather run *no* game than a Paranoia game)
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: BenRG on 10 Oct 2020, 08:31
FWIW, the dev team behind the last released version of Paranoia (v.4 or 'XP') seems to have accepted a lot of the criticisms of the intrinsic problems of Paraoia, introducing the 'Paranoia but not' 'Straight' game form that encourages reduced lethality, greater player engagement, more complex game environments and allowing the running of campaigns with multiple different player classes including retail staff, vid stars, researchers and rescue workers, all in a complex sci-fi satire of modern media-dominated society.

Personally, it is a hobby of mine to attempt to adapt the extremely streamlined WEG d20 RPG system (intended to encourage rapid and easy play free of complex statistics and rule-juggling) to other environments. My current project is an attempt to adapt it to the Fallout and XCom universes.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: oddtail on 10 Oct 2020, 08:53
@BenRG: the version of Paranoia I primarily played *was* XP. It didn't win me over. I think I'm just not the target audience for the game.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: sitnspin on 10 Oct 2020, 09:12
Personally, most of the time, if the choice is between playing D&D and not playing anything, I'd rather not play anything. In general, it's just not a game that appeals to me on any level. Same with Pathfinder, which is basically the same thing.

I am fortunate to have a group of people to play with that like mixing it up with different systems.


Interesting side note: I've never actually eaten at McDonald's.

Oh, yeah, they're fine internally, and the base system is nice and clean.  I also kinda want to try out the fan-made "Genius: The Transgression".  And yes, Pathfinder is, to both its benefit and detriment explicitly designed to give players as many options as possible, and even if a refinement on D&D 3.x in so many ways, inherits some of that system's flaws.

From a design perspective, I find that if you want to maximise player options, your best course is to reduce the amount of rules rather than increase them. Streamline the system to as few types of rolls as possible and just flavour the narrative to fit what you want to do. PF tries to make a rule for every possible circumstance and it just makes the system a mess and bogs down play.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: hedgie on 10 Oct 2020, 11:07
A problem that comes out of the wargaming roots that D&D first started out with.  The first-end DMG was insanely thick, and had tables for everything, including matrices of modifiers for certain weapon types against certain armour types/AC values that were largely ignored by the people who didn't keep a dog-eared copy of the Necronomicon in their bag for casual reading.  Others were quite useful, especially in the pre-internet days for generating npcs/dungeons on the quick.

I'd say that out of anything I've played, "Mage" had fairly streamlined hard rules, and basically infinite possibility, but it was really hard to find a group that could do it properly. 

WRT to fast food, the closest I get even remotely sober is one of the local taquerias (not either of the good ones, but a chain with varying quality).
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Dock Braun on 10 Oct 2020, 13:59
to maximise player options, your best course is to reduce the amount of rules rather than increase them.
My favorite had the game-master laying out some simple principles, from which the rest are uniquely inferred, calling it CSARPN (read sharpen; I recall A, N meaning abstract nonsense and C meaning concrete, but RP not meaning role-playing). I'm drafting an outline for playing obsessions vying for their host mind's focus.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Gyrre on 10 Oct 2020, 21:20
And given at the rate that even groups that do successfully start end up exploding within a few months at the best of times, most people only are going to be willing to learn a couple of systems.  In that case, I'd say "run Paranoia, the players aren't supposed to know the rules anyway", but half the fun of that game is getting *away* with knowing the rules and exploiting them.

Plus, not everyone will dig Paranoia. It's a game that will not appeal to people with a certain gaming philosophy. And I think it'll turn off a lot of relatively casual RPG players.

(and not just casual ones - I'm *really* into RPG, been for 20+ years, and I *loathe* Paranoia. I'd rather play just about ANYthing else - I can think of only one professionally made game that I like even less.

And on GMing side, I think I'd rather run *no* game than a Paranoia game)

Honestly, I suspect a good portion of that is who exactly happens to be GMing Paranoia. I've had a blast with one GM in a 5 hour one-off. And it was a complete slog with a different GM for a 3 hour one-off.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: oddtail on 11 Oct 2020, 05:55
And given at the rate that even groups that do successfully start end up exploding within a few months at the best of times, most people only are going to be willing to learn a couple of systems.  In that case, I'd say "run Paranoia, the players aren't supposed to know the rules anyway", but half the fun of that game is getting *away* with knowing the rules and exploiting them.

Plus, not everyone will dig Paranoia. It's a game that will not appeal to people with a certain gaming philosophy. And I think it'll turn off a lot of relatively casual RPG players.

(and not just casual ones - I'm *really* into RPG, been for 20+ years, and I *loathe* Paranoia. I'd rather play just about ANYthing else - I can think of only one professionally made game that I like even less.

And on GMing side, I think I'd rather run *no* game than a Paranoia game)

Honestly, I suspect a good portion of that is who exactly happens to be GMing Paranoia. I've had a blast with one GM in a 5 hour one-off. And it was a complete slog with a different GM for a 3 hour one-off.

Possibly, but all the games I participated in were by a GM whose games I otherwise enjoy a lot. Maybe he wasn't a good fit for Paranoia, but given the range of games we've played together, I suspect the game is just not something for me.
Title: Re: WCDT strips 4366-4370 (Oct 5th to Oct 9th 2020)
Post by: Gyrre on 11 Oct 2020, 17:39
That's completely fair.

I need more roll play practice before properly returning to the decidedly non-combat-centric Call of Cthulhu.