Topic: V (Read 20788 times)

Leonidas · « **on:** 12 Mar 2006, 02:45 »

Set in a modern Britain (1997) where, after a nuclear war in America, Europe and Africa (bombs were not droped on the UK, but it was obviously affected) goverment fell and chaos and anarchy erupted. After a few years of disease, starvation, and feral gangs, a facist political party took control, and proceeded to stamp order on the country. However, in their political interests they rounded up all people of Asian and African decent, homosexuals, and people who they felt could be politically dangerous, and either killed them off or sent them to concentration camps to die/work/experiment on.

V is such a man. V also being the Roman numeral for the number 5, the room in which he was kept in his cell whilst being experimented on. He escaped the camp he was in, and he proceeds to kill off the people who were in control of the camp. Many of whom have risen to high political stature. In his "mission" he also intends to bring about freedom (anarchy?), and by doing so attacks the corrupt and totalitarian government directly, killing off it's members and attacking such institutions as the Old Bailey and Parliment it'self. On the 5th of November no less....

V is also a man who has kept in touch with a great deal of culture, most of which was destroyed and written out of the history books. Things such as popular music, movies, and literature. He wears a Guy Fawkes mask, and quotes Shakespere. It's clear he's not 100% sane, yet he is the anti-hero.

Portman (Evey) is a young orphan girl who was working in a factory making matches. She tried to take to prostitution in ored to make a little more cash, but on her first night was caught by the "police", who in marshall law were about to rape and kill her. She is rescued by V whilst on his way to a better viewpoint to which witness his demolision of Parliment, and the two strike up an uneasy friendship of sorts.

Personally I can't wait to see this movie adaption. I just hope it lives upto the brilliance of the comic.

People should not be afraid of their governments. Governments should be afraid of their people.

MilkmanDan · « **Reply #1 on:** 12 Mar 2006, 11:23 »

It won't.
Might still be an alright film (1. Natalie Portman, 2. Explosions), but I bet you big time it will disapoint compared to the original.

Leonidas · « **Reply #2 on:** 12 Mar 2006, 12:14 »

When you compare almost anything to an original piece of work, whatever the medium, it never really compares. However, if you simply compare movie adaptions to their original work then they are always a disappointment. It's hard to think of any movie adaptions which have been an improvement on the original work. It doesn't mean however that the movie itself will be poor. Accept it for what it is, not for what it isn't.

However, if it does suck I will be pissed. Personally I'll give it a chance before slaying it.

ozphactor · « **Reply #3 on:** 12 Mar 2006, 21:05 »

I kinda wanna see this. I usually don't get too excited over movies, but I really like the art direction I've seen in the movie stills as well as the promo materials. Maybe I just like the color red. I dunno.

Daniel · « **Reply #4 on:** 13 Mar 2006, 02:05 »

I have an irrationally optimistic feeling about this movie. I imagine this is mostly due to the fact that I've never actually read the comic - I'm going to wait until after I've seen the movie to minimize let-down.

patch · « **Reply #5 on:** 13 Mar 2006, 06:03 »

i am just so glad that it is actually set in britain. i hope 'they' dont euthanise it for american audiences like 'they' made the fat controller sir toppam hat.
but i really want to see this, especially as hugo weaving wouldnt be allowed to show his face in the movie...i think..

Leonidas · « **Reply #6 on:** 13 Mar 2006, 07:18 »

No. Just as in the comic book, V will not be unmasked to show some Tom Cruise lookalike.

What I am curious to see is how they approach Evey's detention in a concentration camp. Will they change the story, or (without wanting to spoil it for those who haven't read the comic) save the original reasoning behind her imprisonment.....?

guywithoutsocks · « **Reply #7 on:** 13 Mar 2006, 10:24 »

I am looking forward to this as well - I am curious to see how closely the movie follows the comic as well, though I have high hopes. I like the choice of Hugo Weaving as 'V' if nothing else.

Bastardous Bassist · « **Reply #8 on:** 13 Mar 2006, 11:08 »

Hopefully it will bring the Wachowski brothers back from the suck by not rehashing a tired concept and mixing it with philosophy 101 concepts.

zmeiat_joro · « **Reply #9 on:** 13 Mar 2006, 11:29 »

Quote from: Leonidas

No. Just as in the comic book, V will not be unmasked to show some Tom Cruise lookalike.

What I am curious to see is how they approach Evey's detention in a concentration camp. Will they change the story, or (without wanting to spoil it for those who haven't read the comic) save the original reasoning behind her imprisonment.....?

I haven't read the comic but I would guess she/he is homosexual?

Leonidas · « **Reply #10 on:** 13 Mar 2006, 11:35 »

Nope. Honestly, I can't tell you the story about her getting imprisoned and tortured/questioned. It really would spoil the movie for you. What I will do however, once the movie is out, and if it has been changed (which I suspect it probably has) then I'll tell you.

Ozymandias · « **Reply #11 on:** 13 Mar 2006, 16:09 »

It's getting mixed reviews, with a skew towards 'good' rather than 'bad'.

Though the reviews that have read the original novel seem to be overwhelmingly good.

Leonidas · « **Reply #12 on:** 14 Mar 2006, 03:43 »

From the review by Edward Douglas:

When Evey is captured and tortured, the film begins to follow Moore's story verbatim, including a particularly moving subplot some may expect to be cut from the movie, and it's sure to evoke emotion even more than the way it was handled originally.

It's been kept a little vauge deliberately, but I believe (hope) that this might mean that the reasoning behind Eveys capture/torture/interrogation has been kept the same as in the graphic novel.

Trollstormur · « **Reply #13 on:** 17 Mar 2006, 00:09 »

Having read the comic some time ago and forgotten a lot of details, I would wholeheartedly suggest this movie to anyone who's read V or not.

I felt it was a wonderful rendition of the story and everything happened how it should have, in my humble opinion.

Leonidas · « **Reply #14 on:** 17 Mar 2006, 10:55 »

I'm not long back from seeing this movie, and in terms of a review, this is my best shot...

As a fan of the comic book I am aware that I went into this movie with perhaps certain expectations. Expectations however I also knew were likely not to be met. As with all comic book adaptations there are certain parts and story lines which have to be removed or played with in order to keep the continuity of the movie. The important part is that if what has been played with and removed been replaced with suitable material. Material which will allow the characters to develop as they should, and will not take away from the story.

Essentially, anything which will try and "Hollywood" the movie is always a bad move in my eyes.

Now it's quite hard to write a full review without giving too much of the story away. Needless to say though that the movie itself does raise some very interesting points about the role of government and power. Not only the abuse of power, but also how governments are able to gain so much power in the first place. Not least through the use of fear. The fear of different religions, different races, different sexualites. Even fear of your neighbours.... And just how this fear can be bred and used against the people as an assault on their personal liberities.An interesting parallel between the movie and the current governemts of the US and the UK.

One part of the movie I was so glad was not sanitised or changed however was the imprisonment of Evey. Such a hard concept to grasp, the reasoning behind her imprisonment, yet one which does show a twisted sense of logic. I won't go into it any further than to say if it had been played with, then I would have disliked this movie intensely.

Hugo Weaving as V is superb, being able to express a whole range of emotions from behind a mask no less. As is his spoken work, which, with the way V can slip in and out of quoting Shakespere to speaking French is no mean feat. And despite various reviews I have read slating Portman for her performance and her English accent, I would have only good things to say about both. Especially the scene where she is set free. Above all this was the scene that I was most looking forward to.

So whilst I would have criticisims of the movie from a comic fanboy point of view (where's FATE? Where are Prothero's dolls? The change in sequence of the bombings), taken on it's own merits as a movie it is one I thought was fantastic. The fact I thought it could have been better is only the comic book fan in me speaking.

Sh8k3zu1a · « **Reply #15 on:** 17 Mar 2006, 14:22 »

Sorry to not contribute more to the conversation, but the movie Kicked ass it had a great story and action/gore

Ravenbomb · « **Reply #16 on:** 17 Mar 2006, 15:10 »

I thought this was gonna be about the mini-series with the lizard aliens

the movie looks interesting, but I'll probably wait until cable/DVD

Zaarin · « **Reply #17 on:** 17 Mar 2006, 19:05 »

I thought this thread was going to be about the Thomas Pynchon novel!

SeanBateman · « **Reply #18 on:** 17 Mar 2006, 22:14 »

Was Spectacular.

I am a huge comic fan boy, and I actually liked an adaptation, which very rarely happens. The ending left me flat from a fanboy perspective, but was great as a film ending. There were moments throughout that didn't necessarily capture the exact DETAIL of the comic, but got the feeling.

Hugo Weaving as V is the Darth Vader for our Generation.

They did the jail scene perfectly, Portman was amazing throughout, the actor playing Finch was great, and while there were flaws translation wise, overall the film did everything it needed to and more.

See it, read the comic again, see the movie again, read the comic again, and then buy the DvD.

Speeing · « **Reply #19 on:** 17 Mar 2006, 22:24 »

^^^ = Truth

An absolutely kickass film. Go see it twice.

Ravenbomb · « **Reply #20 on:** 17 Mar 2006, 22:51 »

I just thought it was funny that they got John Hurt of all people to play the totalitarian dictator

Trollstormur · « **Reply #21 on:** 17 Mar 2006, 23:38 »

well... if the shoe ain't broke, wear it.

KharBevNor · « **Reply #22 on:** 18 Mar 2006, 11:16 »

Quote from: Leonidas

So whilst I would have criticisims of the movie from a comic fanboy point of view (where's FATE? Where are Prothero's dolls? The change in sequence of the bombings), taken on it's own merits as a movie it is one I thought was fantastic. The fact I thought it could have been better is only the comic book fan in me speaking.

They took the detail out of all of the murders, possibly to make V seem less cruel, (He didn't do the poisoned communion wafer thing with Lilliman, at least not on screen: the dialogue suggests he poisoned him though. Deleted scene?), FATE would have been one sub-plot too many, I think, and a bit too 'sci-fi' for the feel they were giving the whole movie: the idea of moving Evey to be an employee of BTN was actually pretty neat, I thought, in view of making the plot more concise.

I think the major changes were the sanitation (V is slightly less malicious, Evey isn't a prostitute, Gordon isn't a petty criminal, Finch doesn't take LSD at Larkhill) which you'd expect but I think harm it, and also, mainly, the way they changed or largely damped down the political side: The V of the film is campaigning for Democracy, not anarchy. There's no mention, for example, of the Land of the Do as You Please.

Art direction and acting were great though. There were also some changes I like: for example, making it a possible future rather than an alternative future by updating the events, changing it from a nuclear war to a chemical war, and implicating Islamic extremism, which could have been much more clumsily done, though that bit about the Quran was an obvious stab for political relevance. I also liked the fact that they still managed to keep in little elements like Storm Saxon.

ozphactor · « **Reply #23 on:** 18 Mar 2006, 23:16 »

Did anyone else think they used the word "bollocks" a bit too much? I mean, I know it's England, but still. If it's just me, I'll shut up. (Seriously, though. Do Brits really say "bollocks" that much?)

Anyway. Having never read the comic, my general impression of the movie was that is was "pretty good." As has already been mentioned, the art direction and acting were superb. Things that could've been improved? Pacing I thought was a little off. They could've lost that cheesy overhead shot of the rain falling on Evey (and miss their special effects quota, I suppose). The final V fight scene was a fairly obvious concession to Matrix fans, but it wasn't as bad as it could've been, even with the crazy blood spurting stuff. So yeah.

Also, Cat Power and Antony and the Johnsons playing on the jukebox FTW.

Leonidas · « **Reply #24 on:** 19 Mar 2006, 02:58 »

I appreciate that bringing in Fate into the story would have been one sub-plot too many. I just feel however that it would have explained how V was able to use the government postal system to his advantage, and also how he was able to access the government speakers and cameras on every street corner. As it was the movie never made that clear.

Not an important issue in the grand scheme of things. Just the fanboy talking.

Jedit · « **Reply #25 on:** 19 Mar 2006, 14:12 »

Quote from: Leonidas

Where are Prothero's dolls?

On the shelves in his bathroom. Someone wasn't paying attention.

I also thought that Prothero's being driven mad by the destruction of his doll collection was a bit limp; this is a man who commanded an extermination camp and oversaw medical experiments with a 98% fatality rate without blinking, for God's sake. It was good theatre, but it doesn't stand up to even the most cursory analysis.

As for Fate: the idea of a human being providing a fake Voice for the computer that runs everything and V's taking him out undermining the people's confidence worked well in 1981. However, with Tom Baker having recently supplied his voice for a service that computer generates an audio version of text messages it would be stupid to hang a major plot device on the hook now. With that gone, it was easier to simply jettison the remainder of the Fate plot thread.

Kai · « **Reply #26 on:** 19 Mar 2006, 14:52 »

A friend of mine saw it and absolutely loved it. I'll probably check it out. And I should probably check out the comic then?

JJMitchell · « **Reply #27 on:** 20 Mar 2006, 07:41 »

I saw this on Saturday night and enjoyed it.
I haven't read the comics but I'll see if the library has a copy and start them now.

Must say that its not your everyday Hollywood movie since they did leave alot of the undertones in from what I've read.

Damned good movie all around.

KharBevNor · « **Reply #28 on:** 20 Mar 2006, 09:55 »

Quote from: Jedit

As for Fate: the idea of a human being providing a fake Voice for the computer that runs everything and V's taking him out undermining the people's confidence worked well in 1981. However, with Tom Baker having recently supplied his voice for a service that computer generates an audio version of text messages it would be stupid to hang a major plot device on the hook now. With that gone, it was easier to simply jettison the remainder of the Fate plot thread.

This is a good point actually: In the days of the internet, Fate is a bit of an anachronism (and they mention the net a lot. I think we're meant to assume that this ie how V does his magic nowadays). Probably the same reason they didn't concentrate on CCTV Cameras quite as much as the original: London now has more CCTV than anywhere else in the world anyway. For better or for worse, it's just not scary anymore.

Sean C · « **Reply #29 on:** 21 Mar 2006, 07:42 »

I'm not going to see it. Ever. From what I've heard so far, it's really not that good. I also read in the New York Times that Alan Moore, V's creator, not only hates the script so much, (he called it rubbish) he actually disowned the character, since he figures the movie V will be the one people remember. Moore hasn't had much luck with Hollywood. League of Extraordinary Gentlemen sucked, and the planned Watchmen movie is once again in the toilet, and it doesn't look like it's ever going to happen now. Too bad, but at least his most famous creation won't be wrecked by some self-righteous executives who would turn that story into an anti-Bush metaphor. Screw 'em all, folks. I want the original story the way it was originally written, and not the "relevent" updates in the theaters. I hate Bush, don't get me wrong, but there's just too damn much of these cinematic metaphors going around. Just do something where we can get lost in the fantasy.

Speeing · « **Reply #30 on:** 21 Mar 2006, 14:56 »

Quote from: Sean C

I'm not going to see it. Ever. From what I've heard so far, it's really not that good. I also read in the New York Times that Alan Moore, V's creator, not only hates the script so much, (he called it rubbish) he actually disowned the character, since he figures the movie V will be the one people remember. Moore hasn't had much luck with Hollywood. League of Extraordinary Gentlemen sucked, and the planned Watchmen movie is once again in the toilet, and it doesn't look like it's ever going to happen now. Too bad, but at least his most famous creation won't be wrecked by some self-righteous executives who would turn that story into an anti-Bush metaphor. Screw 'em all, folks. I want the original story the way it was originally written, and not the "relevent" updates in the theaters. I hate Bush, don't get me wrong, but there's just too damn much of these cinematic metaphors going around. Just do something where we can get lost in the fantasy.

You should keep in midn that Alan Moore is a crazy old fucker who wouldn't be satisfied with anything but a 100% comic-> film adaptation. Even the Co-Author So-and-so Lloyd(cant remember his first name) said the movie rocks, and appended that Moore is a crazy old fucker. Wiki it if you're curious.

The movie has much more in common with Hitler than Bush. Those who cry about the parallels between Bush and this movie had thier mind already made up before they entered the theatre.

I'm a fan of dystopian movies, stabbing, explosions, and Tchaikovsky. If you like any of these, you should definitely see it.

You've made up your mind about the movie, and I can't change that for you. I can, however, note that you're totally wrong.

Dead Head · « **Reply #31 on:** 21 Mar 2006, 20:57 »

I'm reading the comic right now and it's really good. It makes me excited to see the movie, but also afraid of how it'll line up.

Mnementh · « **Reply #32 on:** 21 Mar 2006, 21:54 »

Quote from: Speeing

The movie has much more in common with Hitler than Bush. Those who cry about the parallels between Bush and this movie had thier mind already made up before they entered the theatre.

Oddly enough, it is the right that has been crying out that this movie glorifies terrorism and is an attack on Bush. Takes one to know one I guess.

Anyway, I enjoyed this movie thoroughly. I plan to read the comic next and then see it again.

I've really stopped caring about adaptations not being perfect, what is important is that the movie as a standalone object does not suck.

torg · « **Reply #33 on:** 22 Mar 2006, 02:24 »

I haven't read the comic yet, but knowing other works of Moore and their adaptions to the screen (From Hell, The League...) I didn't expect the movie to absolutely stick to the comic version. I have to admit that I think that From Hell (the movie) was a really good one despite not sticking to the book. The League wasn't bad either, although I like the comics more.
So I went into the movie yesterday ... and it was absolutely f...ing great! I had low expectations because of the Wachowski brothers (I didn't like Matrix THAT much) but it turned out extraordinarily well. The actors were great , the visuals were amazing and I more than once had goosebumps (which hapens very rarely).
I wholeheartedly recommend this movie to all that haven't seen it yet.

Leonidas · « **Reply #34 on:** 22 Mar 2006, 02:33 »

I still can't get the 1812 Overture out of my head.....

Jedit · « **Reply #35 on:** 22 Mar 2006, 02:34 »

Quote from: Speeing

The movie has much more in common with Hitler than Bush. Those who cry about the parallels between Bush and this movie had thier mind already made up before they entered the theatre.

The more obvious parallels are with Hitler, but that people are seeing Bush in it only goes to show how much like Hitler Bush is.

Quote

You've made up your mind about the movie, and I can't change that for you. I can, however, note that you're totally wrong.

Why are you even bothering to address the opinion of someone who is avowedly arguing from a position of ignorance? Until Sean has seen the movie, his opinion on it isn't worth the paper it isn't printed on.

Leonidas · « **Reply #36 on:** 22 Mar 2006, 02:46 »

There are parallels with Hitler in terms of the rallies, the symbolism, the hatred of "inferior" peoples, and obviously the concentration camps. However, when you are dealing with the manipulation of the public through the media, the use of fear as a political tool, and the corruption at the highest level of government in order to gain more and more power, then the parralels are very much with Bush and Bliar.

Scandanavian War Machine · « **Reply #37 on:** 23 Mar 2006, 13:44 »

i just saw this movie last night and i didnt have very high expectations (i thought it would be okay but not great) and i'm glad i was wrong. this movie was absolutely great. i'm not going to touch the political controversies. instead, i'm just going to say that this movie was easily enjoyed by both people who had and hadnt read the comic: i had read some, the friend i went with had never even heard of it, and we both thoroughly enjoyed the movie. go see it.

p.s. POLITICS! OPINIONS! AHH

JJMitchell · « **Reply #38 on:** 24 Mar 2006, 06:56 »

Quote from: Speeing

The movie has much more in common with Hitler than Bush. Those who cry about the parallels between Bush and this movie had thier mind already made up before they entered the theatre.

This is so true. I have a co-worker who asked me if the leftish themes bothered me. Huh? What leftish themes? Homosexuals? Wtf?

Quote from: Speeing

You've made up your mind about the movie, and I can't change that for you. I can, however, note that you're totally wrong.

I agree. People need to just watch the movies and enjoy them. Over analysis of movies makes me want to hurt people. In a good way.

Scandanavian War Machine · « **Reply #39 on:** 24 Mar 2006, 16:03 »

Quote

. . .People need to just watch the movies and enjoy them. Over analysis of movies makes me want to hurt people. . .

quoted for truth

Blue Kitty · « **Reply #40 on:** 25 Mar 2006, 20:13 »

I just want to say that I rather enjoyed it, though I did expect more action in it from seeing the preview. The action that was in it was awesome though. I did notice the themes that people are talking about but really it did not seem to ruin the movie what so ever.

edscoble · « **Reply #41 on:** 26 Mar 2006, 04:06 »

my friend seen it and he actually wrote the whole insight of the politic aspect of V, you can see it here v

http://www.spymac.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=213049

it was very well written (he's a fellow Britons)

Kai · « **Reply #42 on:** 26 Mar 2006, 09:47 »

What a nerd.

I saw it Friday. It was pretty f'ing awesome. Go see it. I'm porbably going to see if I can pick up the comics whenever I get paid next, so yeah.

And people who over-analyze movies really need to shut up. Especially since the ones that are the most over analyzed are the ones that the writer/director really just made up as they went.

Chesire Cat · « **Reply #43 on:** 26 Mar 2006, 09:57 »

Quote from: Leonidas

There are parallels with Hitler in terms of the rallies, the symbolism, the hatred of "inferior" peoples, and obviously the concentration camps. However, when you are dealing with the manipulation of the public through the media, the use of fear as a political tool, and the corruption at the highest level of government in order to gain more and more power, then the parralels are very much with Bush and Bliar.

Kinda beat me too it. The Hitleresq things done in the movie(I havent read the book), were just things that happened, backstory if you will.

The gradual losses of small liberties, the 'for your safety' aspect of civilian watchers(Fingers?) and curfews. The use of popular media to spout hidden propaganda, by using the BTNs integrity as a venue to make it happen as opposed. The things that actually happened in the movie are much more Bush or Blair.

With the idea the war and fear of terrorism worked so well once. That it is the defacto method of getting the people behind the Grand Chancellor when the independant thought alarm goes off. Being a pretty good example.

Mnementh · « **Reply #44 on:** 26 Mar 2006, 11:04 »

It's really just human nature. Human beings, as societies, are generally willing to accept losses of civil liberties in exchange for more security. It is mob mentallity that savvy leaders seeking more power have always played.

Bastardous Bassist · « **Reply #45 on:** 26 Mar 2006, 11:16 »

I can best sum all of that up in one of my favorite quotes (which will also be mentioned in the quotes thread, because I was just reminded of it).

Quote from: Gustave Gilbert

"Why, of course, the people don't want war," Goering shrugged. "Why would some poor slob on a farm want to risk his life in a war when the best that he can get out of it is to come back to his farm in one piece. Naturally, the common people don't want war; neither in Russia nor in England nor in America, nor for that matter in Germany. That is understood. But, after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy or a fascist dictatorship or a Parliament or a Communist dictatorship."

"There is one difference," I pointed out. "In a democracy the people have some say in the matter through their elected representatives, and in the United States only Congress can declare wars."

"Oh, that is all well and good, but, voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country."

Kai · « **Reply #46 on:** 26 Mar 2006, 11:53 »

that's pretty awesome.

KharBevNor · « **Reply #47 on:** 26 Mar 2006, 15:35 »

Quote from: Chesire Cat

(Fingers?)

That bit doesn't make much sense in the film...in the book, the official police/detectives are the 'Nose', the people who watch the cameras are the 'Eye', the people who listen into phone conversations are the 'Ear', the broadcast media are the 'Voice', and, therefore, those who go out and 'feel things out' on the street and carry out the bidding of the party are 'Finger men'.

Chesire Cat · « **Reply #48 on:** 26 Mar 2006, 20:16 »

Ok so I pretty much had their idea pegged, if not why they were called that.

jariku · « **Reply #49 on:** 28 Mar 2006, 02:12 »

For the dissidents among you, here's a website about the anarchist ideas in V for Vendetta and how they're portrayed in the movie.

http://www.aforanarchy.com/

Nothing much content-wise yet, but hopefully there'll be regular updates now that the movie is out and about.

THESE FORUMS NOW CLOSED (read only)

Author Topic: V (Read 20788 times)

MilkmanDan

Daniel

patch

guywithoutsocks

Sh8k3zu1a

Ravenbomb

Zaarin

SeanBateman

Speeing

Ravenbomb

JJMitchell

Sean C

Speeing

Dead Head

Mnementh

torg

JJMitchell

edscoble

Mnementh

jariku