Topic: The politics of the indie rock scene (Read 10730 times)

Jackie Blue · « **on:** 21 Feb 2007, 11:26 »

I've been more or less in the indie rock scene in the same town for about 9 years now. It's not the only scene I have friends in, but it is the one where I attend the most social gatherings and since I am an indie rock musician by default I have to spend a lot of effort not stepping too far out of the scene boundaries for established guidelines because then people you don't even know start deciding not to come to your shows because of something somebody said at some party sometime, you know?

Right, so the question here, since I've been limited to this one city's scene for so long, what's it like in other places? The scene party line here seems to basically be "There is no scene. And you're not in it, anyway." It's a kind of wearying combination of total cliqueishness combined with the absolute, resolute denial of being cliqueish.

ALoveSupreme · « **Reply #1 on:** 21 Feb 2007, 12:21 »

That first paragraph confuses me... are you saying you can't really go to shows that are of a different "scene" for fear of being shunned? If that's the case, that seems pretty weak. I always just took "indie" rock in the most idealistic way possible, being the all inclusive, "as long as you don't go to shows at the local ampitheater (and why would you want to anyways), and you're supporting independant musicianship, you're good".

Most of my friends wouldn't go to half the shows I would, but who gives a damn. And if they did have a problem with it and stop going to shows for the band I'm in, to hell with them.

Jackie Blue · « **Reply #2 on:** 21 Feb 2007, 12:43 »

Quote from: tommydski on 21 Feb 2007, 12:20

You have friends?
You have friends that like music?
You have friends that like music that you also like?
You have friends that like music that you also like, who play music?
You have friends that like music that you also like, who play music and will go and see bands with you?

Can you send me a postcard please?
I've always wanted to see what a postcard from Heaven looks like.

Where do you live? Hell, I don't even live anywhere very big - just a large college town in the Bible Belt of America, and even here there is a sizable scene of people who either like and play really great music or pretend to.

Quote

That first paragraph confuses me... are you saying you can't really go to shows that are of a different "scene" for fear of being shunned?

No, that has nothing to do with it. In fact the only scene that has bands play out that are worth seeing at all is the indie scene (which really encompasses a lot of different kinds of bands, but you know what I mean). The goth scene just has dance nights, no bands. There isn't really any kind of metal scene. There are the "normal" people, which come in two flavors, Redneck and Vanilla. That's pretty much it, aside from, you know, the 16-19 year olds who go to all ages shows, but those are never any good.

Gryff · « **Reply #3 on:** 21 Feb 2007, 13:17 »

I'd have thought that any "scene" anywhere has people who like each other and people who don't like each other, people who are decent are people who are jerks. I don't know, maybe your town just has a high asshole concentration?

Gryff · « **Reply #4 on:** 21 Feb 2007, 13:26 »

Quote from: Gryff on 21 Feb 2007, 13:17

maybe your town just has a high asshole concentration?

Would you go see a band called Asshole Concentration?

KharBevNor · « **Reply #5 on:** 21 Feb 2007, 13:40 »

Maybe.

If they were called 'Ultimate Lubcricator and the Asshole Concentration' then almost certainly.

Hat · « **Reply #6 on:** 21 Feb 2007, 14:04 »

I know there hypothetically be a scene somewhere in my city. I mean, I know musicians, and I know their friends, and we hang out at gigs, but I never found a unifying scene between all the bands that would fit into the "indie" category implied here. It's more like theres several smaller scenes all trying to co-exist without getting in each others way, with fluid boundaries, and perhaps some kind of colourful topological diagram representing the proportionate tightness of pants in some way.

I just find it easier to hang out with the metal scene anyway. I mean, theres somewhat of a distinction between the power/prog metalheads, and the thrash/black/death metalheads, but everyone is pretty cool and likes to get drunk and there is a dude with glow in the dark fur pants who is the most frightening-looking human being I have ever met, and also happens to be a totally awesome guy.

Tyler · « **Reply #7 on:** 21 Feb 2007, 15:07 »

There really is no scene where I live with any sense of exclusivity. People just tend to show up to what they like, and often this includes quite the array.

Kai · « **Reply #8 on:** 21 Feb 2007, 15:14 »

Scene?

Kansas is still struggling to get past the Get Up Kid phase. There's a couple of great acts but not many.

And I would totally see Asshole Concentration.

BillAdama · « **Reply #9 on:** 21 Feb 2007, 15:34 »

I've only been into indie for like two years, (And I was in a semi-rural college up until early 2005), so I really have no idea how to meet other people who are into indie music.

I live right around Boston so I'm certain there exist indie hangouts. I just don't know where any of them are.

denialgene · « **Reply #10 on:** 21 Feb 2007, 15:38 »

Quote from: KharBevNor on 21 Feb 2007, 13:40

If they were called 'Ultimate Lubcricator and the Asshole Concentration' then almost certainly.

Would you mind if I borrowed that name for my next solo project?

Jackie Blue · « **Reply #11 on:** 21 Feb 2007, 15:55 »

Quote from: BillAdama on 21 Feb 2007, 15:34

I live right around Boston so I'm certain there exist indie hangouts. I just don't know where any of them are.

1. Find a bar that serves Pabst Blue Ribbon.
2. ???
3. Profit.

Tyler · « **Reply #12 on:** 21 Feb 2007, 16:32 »

The Pill is a fun indie spot around Boston, aside from the usual clubs and such (Paradise Club, t.t. the bears, Middle East)

ScrambledGregs · « **Reply #13 on:** 21 Feb 2007, 16:38 »

I thought this thread was about the political views of the indie rock scene.

Lines · « **Reply #14 on:** 21 Feb 2007, 16:56 »

that could get interesting.

i don't pay attention to the "scene" around here. i just go to shows and there's always a variety of people there.

Ernest · « **Reply #15 on:** 21 Feb 2007, 19:43 »

Quote from: zerodrone on 21 Feb 2007, 12:43

Where do you live?

It is common knowledge that Tommy lives in a cottage on the moor and in his shed is the most whiskey you could ever wish to have.

Scytale · « **Reply #16 on:** 22 Feb 2007, 00:00 »

Who cares what people think about your band, are you there to play music or are you there to attract fans. May as well just stamped sellout on your forehead.

If I were you I'd rather be doing whatever the fuck I wanted to and be playing in empty halls then try to suck the metaphorical indie cock...

Seriously I don't see why you give a fuck, most "scenes" are just full of narrow minded elitist idiots anyway.

mer · « **Reply #17 on:** 22 Feb 2007, 00:08 »

I was sort of rejected by my local "scene." But I love my non-scene friends dearly, it just gets sad when they tease me for being an indie kid. I find it kind of funny though, at school I dont get along with our scene kids, but I go to colorado for 5 days and manage to meet a hipster from Brooklyn at a bar.

Johnny C · « **Reply #18 on:** 22 Feb 2007, 00:13 »

I have friends who listen to the same music that I do and play music. In fact one will be helping me on Sunday. Heaven, incidentally, is pretty nice, but it looks a lot like SoCal and a lot less like where I live.

mer · « **Reply #19 on:** 22 Feb 2007, 00:16 »

I find it kind of sad how musical tastes can fail to transfer to people close to you. One of my really close friends was Warren Zevon's cousin, and yet she listens to bands liek godsmack.... its sad really.

Jackie Blue · « **Reply #20 on:** 22 Feb 2007, 08:28 »

Quote from: Scytale on 22 Feb 2007, 00:00

Who cares what people think about your band, are you there to play music or are you there to attract fans. May as well just stamped sellout on your forehead.

That is a very cute punk rock attitude, but I live in the real world.

Lines · « **Reply #21 on:** 22 Feb 2007, 08:48 »

i've met John Mellancamp's nephew and his band is pretty much de-pop punk and i don't care for it much, but that's his thing. i don't think being related to a person that plays a certain kind of music means you have to listen to it or play it.

Spinless · « **Reply #22 on:** 22 Feb 2007, 10:30 »

The majority of britain has basically no indie rock scene. In the places that do have it, you have to basically hire a detective to find them.

BillAdama · « **Reply #23 on:** 22 Feb 2007, 11:53 »

When you're not totally antisocial, listening to music with your friends can be a positive social experience, not to mention if they like the same music as you, they might have heard of bands you'd like that you haven't heard of.

One of my friends has good musical taste but insanely high standards for anything recorded after 1975, and the rest pretty much don't care about music. Hence, it'd be nice to have some indie friends.

But, any indie kids who are going to think less of me because I listen to a few mainstream bands too, can of course suck my ass.

Madness Hero · « **Reply #24 on:** 22 Feb 2007, 12:33 »

I'm the closest thing to the Indie fan in my little social group, despite being kinda new to indie music. I would probably get devoured alive in any indie scene areas, but that doesn't matter. I have a great group of friends who happen to be music fans, and that's good enough for me. They aren't as open minded with music as I have become lately (They enjoy hard rock, metal, ect., while I've been enjoying Modest Mouse, Broken Social Scene, Pavement, etc.), but that's ok. Music can bring people together, but it can't keep people together on it's own. I'd rather have friends than a scene any day.

imapiratearg · « **Reply #25 on:** 22 Feb 2007, 14:42 »

I'm going to make it very clear that the State of Vermont, is scene hell. There are few scenes. The ones i know of are the local band scene, which ranges from punky dudes, to really really preppy people who go there for apprearances and to look cool. The bands, aure usually some form of punk or pop punk, with the exception of a few that are actually decent rock bands. Then there's the bars, that are filled with drunken hicks and bad country/classic rock bands. In the "cities" you can find some mainstream and indie bands playing at what i believe is the largest venue in the state, Higher Ground. Sonic Youth played there a few weeks ago actually, anywho. There's a de-pop sort of scene, i guess, the capital has a "gutter punk" scene thing, and i'm pretty good friends with one. I guess the best "scene" is around a cafe in the capital. They usually have something going on and the musicians that play there come from a pretty large variety, and the people are really cool.

Holm · « **Reply #26 on:** 22 Feb 2007, 16:02 »

man none of my friends listen to the kind of music i listen to. it would be nice, but at the same time i get to feel very elite when i'm around them

Thrillho · « **Reply #27 on:** 22 Feb 2007, 16:24 »

I listen to so mcuh music that ALL of my firends listen to something I listen to.

Jackie Blue · « **Reply #28 on:** 22 Feb 2007, 19:14 »

Same here. No matter how wretched someone's taste in music is, I can always find a few bands we agree are good.

Scytale · « **Reply #29 on:** 22 Feb 2007, 23:13 »

Quote from: zerodrone on 22 Feb 2007, 08:28

Quote from: Scytale on 22 Feb 2007, 00:00
Who cares what people think about your band, are you there to play music or are you there to attract fans. May as well just stamped sellout on your forehead.

That is a very cute punk rock attitude, but I live in the real world.

Funny since I don't listen to punk at all, the way I figure it you either make music for yourself or you make music for others, I know which I prefer...

Ernest · « **Reply #30 on:** 23 Feb 2007, 09:01 »

Scytale, I think he's just implying that your post sounded a bit idealistic.

Jackie Blue · « **Reply #31 on:** 23 Feb 2007, 09:11 »

Quote from: Scytale on 22 Feb 2007, 23:13

Funny since I don't listen to punk at all, the way I figure it you either make music for yourself or you make music for others

Do you know many musicians? Every musician - good ones, bad ones, great ones - on some level wants their music to be HEARD - otherwise they would just play in their living rooms and garages. It is not an "either/or" situation.

I WRITE and RECORD exactly the music I want to. But my decisions to play out, decisions about WHERE I play out, and how often, and what I do with my recordings - those are influenced by my (normal and healthy) desire to have my art out there for people to see instead of falling deaf ears.

BrittanyMarie · « **Reply #32 on:** 23 Feb 2007, 12:23 »

Maybe I'm being idealistic as well, as I've never lived anywhere else but ND, but Fargo has a really big independent music scene. There are all kinds of local bands, from the post-rockers to hip-hoppers to popsters to metal kids to punk kids and there's an emerging funk scene. They all end up playing together- there are only so many cheap venues so locals have to really work together.

I know a lot of people here who listen to similar music, you just have to go to a show or just hang out anywhere downtown. I'll see the same people at a POS show as I would at Of Montreal as I did when I saw Calvin Johnson.

Scytale · « **Reply #33 on:** 23 Feb 2007, 15:28 »

I know a few musicians, a good friend of mine has a distribution deal with a half decent label (independent). He got that through mail demo's to people, had nothing to do with playing live, he's band's played live a whole 3 times I think and 2 of those times they were fucking terrible.

I also record music myself, but thats digressing a bit.

I know of a lot of successful bands who have never played live, I don't think it's really intrinsc to the enjoyment of your music. But then I have the opposite opinion to you, for me my music is a very cathartic thing, what I record is done for myself, a lot of stuff I haven't given out unless people have asked for it. I guess we just have different approaches to music.

What I was trying to get at in my post is that most scenes are very limiting I know the Black Metal scene is full of fucking morons to put it politely and after last night, I'm pretty sure the punk scene is exactly the same. It's fine to have friends and things but I still think you be trying to distance your music from it as much as possible if you want it to be taken seriously.

Jackie Blue · « **Reply #34 on:** 24 Feb 2007, 00:30 »

Quote from: Scytale on 23 Feb 2007, 15:28

I guess we just have different approaches to music.

Yes. I make music in order to communicate something to others; you apparently do not.

Brian Majestic · « **Reply #35 on:** 24 Feb 2007, 00:31 »

while I know little of chicago's indie scene, there's something (promoters/circle of friends thing I think) called The New Indie Mafia.

MadassAlex · « **Reply #36 on:** 24 Feb 2007, 00:33 »

Quote from: Scytale on 23 Feb 2007, 15:28

I know the Black Metal scene is full of fucking morons to put it politely

Try being a bit more polite.

But seriously I cannot see how this can be true, Black Metal is far too hilarious to have too many tr00 kvly assholes, 75% of them AT LEAST have to be putting it on.

Scytale · « **Reply #37 on:** 24 Feb 2007, 00:59 »

haha yeah I wish that was true.

KharBevNor · « **Reply #38 on:** 24 Feb 2007, 03:13 »

To be fair to black metal, ALL scenes, and indeed most of life, is full of small-minded arseholes. It's just that the half-arsed regurgitation of poorly understood and decontextualised black metal aesthetics, ethics and philosophy creates a particularly repellent brand of small-minded arsehole.

McTaggart · « **Reply #39 on:** 24 Feb 2007, 03:20 »

Quote from: DynamiteKid on 22 Feb 2007, 16:24

I listen to so mcuh music that ALL of my firends listen to something I listen to.

Yeah, I'll go along to anything my friends want to see, the problem is finding friends to see who I want to with.

BillAdama · « **Reply #40 on:** 24 Feb 2007, 15:06 »

Only two of my friends are remotely into music.

For one, the intersection of our tastes are pretty much Bob Dylan, Primal Scream, and anything good recorded between Bringing It All Back Home and Horses.

For one, the intersection of our tastes is Abbey Road.

It'd be nice to have a few good friends I could get to listen to Of Montreal and Field Music and then discuss them with.

Coonstar · « **Reply #41 on:** 24 Feb 2007, 16:17 »

Hahah man, the folk who say they don't have enough friends who listen to music... I really cannot relate at all. I guess I lucked in out having a good amount friends who have musically diverse taste. And I can safely say, I am probably the least musically knowledgable amongst 'em. We have tonnes of common ground and we go to shows together all the time, big shows, local shows... but it's harder finding people for metal.

Kai · « **Reply #42 on:** 24 Feb 2007, 16:43 »

Quote from: Brian Majestic on 24 Feb 2007, 00:31

while I know little of chicago's indie scene, there's something (promoters/circle of friends thing I think) called The New Indie Mafia.

I would not see a band called the New Indie Mafia

Skibas_clavicle · « **Reply #43 on:** 24 Feb 2007, 18:30 »

Toronto's full of hipsters but many of them are either poseurs or douchebags.

Lee's Palace and Sneaky Dee's are fun places though (well, when they're not being filled with lame suburbanites with an affinity for Vans slip-ons and the latest IT band Pitchfork throws at them). I'm totally not bitter, heh

Ã¶de · « **Reply #44 on:** 25 Feb 2007, 01:26 »

Everyone around me likes Fall Out Boy and whatever's in the top 10 at the moment. Oh, and obscure bands like Reel Big Fish.

blaha 41 · « **Reply #45 on:** 01 Mar 2007, 14:58 »

Quote from: BillAdama on 21 Feb 2007, 15:34

I've only been into indie for like two years, (And I was in a semi-rural college up until early 2005), so I really have no idea how to meet other people who are into indie music.

I live right around Boston so I'm certain there exist indie hangouts. I just don't know where any of them are.

I was in cambridge/boston for a few years. All the indie kids herded towards Bukowski's in Inman Sq., TT the bears in Central square, and any random berklee house party you could find. there's some coolness around davis square at coffee shops like diesel, but generally no real bars around there. Also, sometimes you get great stuff at Great Scott in allston. Hard to meet people in boston; it's the biggest small town in the world since a ton of people are only friends with people they knew from childhood. I loved it though. oh and hit up the otherside cafe (on mass ave. across from newbury st.)- i heard them rocking funeral before it caught on blog fire.

In nyc, there are multiple scenes. There's the sidewalk cafe scene, the ludlow st. scene., and the the matchless/bar 4 one as the major places. If there were a "we don't have time for a scene" scene, i'd join up with that

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Author Topic: The politics of the indie rock scene (Read 10730 times)

BillAdama

denialgene

ScrambledGregs

Scytale

mer

mer

Spinless

BillAdama

Holm

Scytale

Scytale

Scytale

BillAdama

Coonstar