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Author Topic: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)  (Read 15287 times)

Storm Rider

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OK, so if you've finished the game, talk about the story stuff here.

About the speech with Sovereign on Virmire. Did anyone else get the implication that synthetic life actually preceded organic life? If that's true, that's completely insane. It's more likely that Sovereign was just refusing to acknowledge the origin of the Reapers, but that totally blew my mind when I first heard it.

Also, I'm curious about who died in everyone else's game on Virmire. Did anybody not have enough Charm/Intimidate to avoid killing Wrex? And who did you let die between Kaiden and Ashley? I let Kaiden die because I thought he was kind of a tool. Maybe next playthrough I'll change it, but probably not.

And the part where you can talk Saren into shooting himself in the fucking head? Insane.

I almost forgot, but the true mark of how much this game engrossed me was how for the 40 seconds after Sovereign was destroyed where I thought the debris had killed Shepard I felt like somebody had punched me in the gut. I didn't want the character I had created and brought so far to be taken away from me just so I'd have to start over in the next game. Also, choosing Captain Anderson over Ambassador Udina for humanity's spot on the Council gave me serious amounts of glee. Serves him right for being a giant dick the whole game.
« Last Edit: 29 Nov 2007, 19:28 by Storm Rider »
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jeph

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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #1 on: 29 Nov 2007, 19:33 »

Yeah talking Saren into offin' himself was INTENSE. I let Ashley die, I'm probably pickin' Kaidan to die next playthrough as he IS kind of a tool.

I almost hope they never go into full detail explaining the Reapers' origins. They're more menacing as this big unknowable entity than they would be if it turns out that Ancient Galactic Civilization X made them Y million years ago. I kind of hope the writers pull a Frank Herbert on us and it turns out the Reapers are hiding out in our neck of the universe because they're hiding from an even bigger, weirder threat. I can't really imagine why else such an advanced machine intelligence would be essentially parasitising younger civilisations.

It would be really cool to get to know the non-Reaper controlled Geth better in the next game. A Geth squad-member would be AWESOME.

The council better be fucking throwing me whores and battleships next game after I elected to save their bitch asses in this one.

Who wants to bet we meet some surviving Proteans next game? All the talk about stasis chambers on Ilos makes me think there are probably some on ice somewhere.
« Last Edit: 29 Nov 2007, 19:35 by jeph »
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Storm Rider

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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #2 on: 29 Nov 2007, 19:48 »

I wouldn't be surprised at all if there were living Protheans you met at some point in the next game.

What I did like is that they never explained WHY the Reavers had this elaborate cycle of exterminating organic life. It leaves them something to develop later on, plus it fits in with the whole concept of alien (in both the extraterrestrial and incomprehensible sense) perspectives that sort of runs throughout the whole dynamic of the game.
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ackblom12

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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #3 on: 30 Nov 2007, 09:55 »

I was not expecting Saren to blow his own goddamn brains out at all during that bit. Surprised the shit out of me when it happened.

I let Kaiden die, then shattered Liara's hopes and dreams and got booty call from Ashley. It was strangely satisfying to be the first creature to toss her heart/thing into a blender. Next play through Ashley's god-fearing ass is taking the fall.

I'm very curious how they are going to continue the series. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if we don't play as Shephard in the next game, but I hope to god they have a save transfer for the sequels. Not enough games (Damn you Quest for Glory for spoiling me) have the option of transferring characters and game choices through games and that's a goddamned crime.

This only the first of a 3 part series and it's already easily one of my favorite games of all times. I just hope EA's purchase doesn't affect Bioware's development practices much.
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Scandanavian War Machine

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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #4 on: 30 Nov 2007, 10:23 »

i'm pretty sure i read somewhere that you will be able to load your game onto the next one. that way, the actual galaxy will be different for everyone instead of just your character. i.e. kaiden/ashley dead, wrex dead/alive, council dead/alive, who you chose for human coucilor etc.
there will be some sort of "default" story for starting a new character or if you didn't play the first one but i believe you'll be able to continue from you left off.

I kind of hope the writers pull a Frank Herbert on us and it turns out the Reapers are hiding out in our neck of the universe because they're hiding from an even bigger, weirder threat.

that was my first thought when  they explained the reapers. i was like "wait a minute. the reapers are gnarly as fuck. what the hell are they doing camping out, killing us off over and over again?"

oh, the possibilities!
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Storm Rider

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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #5 on: 30 Nov 2007, 10:47 »

It wouldn't surprise me in the least if we don't play as Shephard in the next game

That's why I was so horrified when the ending first kicked in and the piece of Sovereign falls in and crushes part of the Citadel Tower. I was like 'Oh fuck no, they killed Shepard so they can reboot the player character for the next game'.

To be honest, I would be kind of surprised if all of the stuff you did carried over into the next game, because there would be just so many contingencies they'd have to alter and it would take a ton of work. I think it's more likely that they'll just pick one outcome as the 'canon' and move on from there.

Maybe next playthrough I'll let the council die just to see what happens.
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Scandanavian War Machine

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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #6 on: 30 Nov 2007, 10:54 »

that's the thing; i think if you chose to let them die they will still live but just barely...and they will hate you. i don't know?

it seems like a cheap way to make us feel like we have choices when we really don't. but i wouldn't know.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #7 on: 30 Nov 2007, 13:48 »

ME's game mechanics seem well-suited, or at least better suited than most systems, to carrying over into the epic levels above 60 (which is as far as I'm aware the upper limit in the game) so I wouldn't rule out Shepard being in the second game. It would just require some retooling and rebalancing. But we're not dealing with D&D ridiculousness.

I'm hoping for a substantial expansion pack with a self-contained plotline in the meantime, although Bioware hasn't made an xpac since NWN. There will definitely be galactic exploration add-ons, though it remains to be seen how in-depth the new sidequests will be.

If I were to wager a guess, I'd say that the next game (or xpac) will deal with either A) The "Cerberus" wetworks conspirators B) the Batarians or C) the Geth, on their home turf. All three were skirted around enough in the storyline to count as being "foreshadowed".

Quote from: Scandinavian War Machine
i'm pretty sure i read somewhere that you will be able to load your game onto the next one. that way, the actual galaxy will be different for everyone instead of just your character. i.e. kaiden/ashley dead, wrex dead/alive, council dead/alive, who you chose for human coucilor etc.
there will be some sort of "default" story for starting a new character or if you didn't play the first one but i believe you'll be able to continue from you left off.
I heard that as well, but that's a colossal amount of content to work in. If they were to do that, I'd expect them to take 2 full years of dev time (minus QA) at the least, and they're working on a tighter timeframe than that. I envision something like KOTOR2, where at the beginning of the game you're asked questions about events in the first game and the story adapts to more or less what you'd expect from a sequel to the particular game you played.

Quote from: Storm Rider
About the speech with Sovereign on Virmire. Did anyone else get the implication that synthetic life actually preceded organic life? If that's true, that's completely insane. It's more likely that Sovereign was just refusing to acknowledge the origin of the Reapers, but that totally blew my mind when I first heard it.
Well, they seemed to be going a Lovecraftian direction with the Reapers. Sovereign was "beyond human comprehension" and didn't really acknowledge Shepard at all. So the most likely answer is that Sovereign either didn't know what created him or wasn't telling, probably the latter. You can bet your sweet ass somewhere down the road it will turn out that the only way to know how to defeat the Reapers will come from the things that created them. I will bet you real money defeating the Reapers will involve ancient creator artifacts of some sort. The Reapers obviously aren't organic, and all synthetic life forms have to be created, that's what "synthetic" means. It's also worth considering that the Reapers may have been organic at some point but became robotic.

Quote from: Storm Rider
Also, I'm curious about who died in everyone else's game on Virmire. Did anybody not have enough Charm/Intimidate to avoid killing Wrex? And who did you let die between Kaiden and Ashley? I let Kaiden die because I thought he was kind of a tool. Maybe next playthrough I'll change it, but probably not.
Kaidan, both times I played. For one, I was a male character and because you can't romance Kaidan when you'r male they make a number of character-building conversations unavailable, something they didn't do with Ashley, for whatever reason. Kaidan was just sort of there, and I used Ashley more.

Quote from: Storm Rider
And the part where you can talk Saren into shooting himself in the fucking head? Insane.
What I want to know is if you actually have the option to fight Saren apart from when he's resurrected by Sovereign. The fact that I could convince him to shoot himself was diminished somewhat by the knowledge that Bioware wouldn't allow it to really end that way. The only game I've ever played that allowed you to talk your way past the very last boss is Planescape:Torment, which was nice, because combat in that game was boring.

Quote from: Storm Rider
I almost forgot, but the true mark of how much this game engrossed me was how for the 40 seconds after Sovereign was destroyed where I thought the debris had killed Shepard I felt like somebody had punched me in the gut. I didn't want the character I had created and brought so far to be taken away from me just so I'd have to start over in the next game. Also, choosing Captain Anderson over Ambassador Udina for humanity's spot on the Council gave me serious amounts of glee. Serves him right for being a giant dick the whole game.
You need to watch more action movies / play more action games ;) Hell, did they really kill the Chief in Halo?

Quote from: Jeph
It would be really cool to get to know the non-Reaper controlled Geth better in the next game. A Geth squad-member would be AWESOME.
Eh. The Geth aren't really that compelling as villains. There wasn't a single Geth character, I doubt there will be in the coming games. The entire race serves as evil cannon fodder to be sent to die by Shepard's hands. That's what you get when you make your villains mute and universally hostile. They might as well have been goblins.

Quote from: jeph
Who wants to bet we meet some surviving Proteans next game? All the talk about stasis chambers on Ilos makes me think there are probably some on ice somewhere.
But the big twist was that for the most part, the Protheans weren't nearly as important or all-powerful as everybody believed them to be. They were just another tool of the Reapers (God, that name will always be hokey). I'd guess that Bioware is moving on to bigger and better things, so to speak.

It looks like I'm alone in that I wasn't terribly impressed with the Reapers. For one, the whole 50,000 year cycle / prophecy thing seemed more at home in a fantasy game than a sci-fi game. My eyes just about rolled back into my head when I ran across the mad doomsayer at the beginning of the game. Unlike Star Wars and its ilk, ME puts in a good faith effort to explain just about everything and tries not to rely on invisible magic or mysticism, which makes the weird stuff stick out like a sore thumb. That serves as further proof to me that everything will be revealed in due time and the Reapers will not remain mysterious. And I felt like Saren, a perfectly adequate villain who himself was barely in the game, was tossed aside in favor of an even more vaguely sketched sentient ship that the PC has no connection to.

Maybe I went wrong in expecting KOTOR "oh shit" twists.
« Last Edit: 30 Nov 2007, 14:55 by Kid van Pervert »
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Storm Rider

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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #8 on: 30 Nov 2007, 15:03 »

You do, in fact, fight Saren twice if you do not choose to talk him into breaking free of Sovereign. I checked.

Also, as far as storylines that they'll probably put into the next games, I'm betting a big one is dealing with the Shadow Broker. He's mentioned, and his vast amount of control over the underworld is alluded to, but you never specifically deal with him (or her, or them). So, I'm betting they tie up that particular loose end in one of the next two games.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #9 on: 30 Nov 2007, 15:16 »

There's a lot of stuff that could be explored and used a lot more in the sequels. For example, the Elcor, the best thing about Mass Effect. I counted 4 Elcor total in the entire game. There are the 2 diplomats, the ambassador, and the merchant on Noveria. They must exploit this resource in the future.
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jeph

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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #10 on: 30 Nov 2007, 19:32 »

In an interview for Game Informer, Greg from Bioware says "I can be definitive in saying that we are definitely going to use the save file that [Mass Effect 1] created."

 :-D - Woo!
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #11 on: 30 Nov 2007, 20:18 »

In an interview for Game Informer, Greg from Bioware says "I can be definitive in saying that we are definitely going to use the save file that [Mass Effect 1] created."

 :-D - Woo!
Excerrent.
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ackblom12

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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #12 on: 01 Dec 2007, 12:06 »

I feel something wet in my pants....
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #13 on: 01 Dec 2007, 14:31 »

I fail to see Kaiden's toolitude, but I let him die. Being a vangaurd and all I didnt really need him.

Though I should've cutt Ashley off, That bitch killed Wrex!
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ackblom12

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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #14 on: 01 Dec 2007, 14:54 »

To be fair, she only did it cause you failed at being a good commander.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #15 on: 02 Dec 2007, 04:01 »

You do, in fact, fight Saren twice if you do not choose to talk him into breaking free of Sovereign. I checked.

Also, as far as storylines that they'll probably put into the next games, I'm betting a big one is dealing with the Shadow Broker. He's mentioned, and his vast amount of control over the underworld is alluded to, but you never specifically deal with him (or her, or them). So, I'm betting they tie up that particular loose end in one of the next two games.

I would be willing to bet real money that the "shadow broker" is in fact that whore Sha'ira. I'm sorry but from everything thats going on its just too obvious to me that its her.
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AngelofShadows

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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #16 on: 02 Dec 2007, 08:30 »

I rarely went renegade, and I actually enjoyed talking to Kaiden, but I never used him in missions, unlike Ashley, who I used to help back me with firepower, so when I couldn't save them both, I felt, well, horrible, to be honest.

Thing they need to do with the next game.....better auto save feature. I thought they dropped the ball with it, cause it pissed me off more to have to retrace such a large amount because I didn't save on my own and got jacked by heavy rocket turrets and rocket geth. In fact, fuck rockets. Fuck them to hell.

I also saved the council, but they didn't have the talking choice I wanted.....where Shepard walked up to thier faces and just screamed, "I TOLDZ YOU BITCHES! I FUCKIN TOLD YOU! BUT NOOOOOOOOO!" Or a "Raise your hands if you knew all of this was coming? *raise hand* me? Wow. Ok. Now, raise your hands if you warned everyone about it too" *keeps hand raised* Oh snap, look at that.

Also, I object to being "renagade" by shooting a black mailing xenophobic (I feel good for using that word in proper context) gang member in the face.

I want to know what biotics they'll introduce next game too.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #17 on: 02 Dec 2007, 21:48 »

Loved it. I picked Kaidan because I wanted to finish the romantic subplot. Next time through I'll probably keep him alive because I though he was a badass. He's kinda like "I'm not awesome, but I've got your back."

Saved Wrex.

Felt bad for Saren. Kinda glad he shot himself....
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #18 on: 02 Dec 2007, 22:15 »

On my second playthrough, when the admiral came to the docking bay and demanded to inspect my ship, I told him to go fuck himself.

I can't remember the last time a video game gave me such satisfaction.

in other news i am apparently fourteen and hate authority
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #19 on: 03 Dec 2007, 06:03 »

Wait, commander shepard ACTUALLY said, "Go fuck yourself!"?
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #20 on: 04 Dec 2007, 06:48 »

second playthrough, now I'm just cruising around doing side quests with my tech support.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #21 on: 08 Dec 2007, 09:37 »

Well, stayed up until 2:30 last night to beat it.  It was quite possibly the most epic thing I've ever seen.  I want to learn more about Ilos.  That place just looked so cool. 

Also: MOAR ZERO GRAVITY.  Lifting a geth Juggernaut off the spindle and pushing him down towards one of the citadel arms is hella awesome.

And I wanna see what the Citadel looks like when it goes off.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #22 on: 08 Dec 2007, 11:54 »

yeah, why the hell haven't game designers realized yet that zero-gravity is what everyone wants.
i want a game where i can mob along in my space suit, disengage my magnetic boots, jump straight up, do half a flip, reingage my magnetic boots and land on the ceiling/wall/whatever. is that so much to ask?
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #23 on: 08 Dec 2007, 12:29 »

Probably, yes.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #24 on: 08 Dec 2007, 12:35 »

Asking a currently nigh impossible deed from a developer is perfectly reasonable I think.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #25 on: 08 Dec 2007, 13:31 »

i thought so too
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #26 on: 08 Dec 2007, 15:59 »

Now you guys are thinking like gamers. The kind of gamers that inhabit the codex, anyway.

Damned gamers.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #27 on: 08 Dec 2007, 21:46 »

I can kinda visualize how they'd pull it off...the problem wouldn't be turning physics on and off, it's movement in the zero gravity and making it a controllable thing that'd be a problem.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #28 on: 28 Dec 2007, 00:22 »

Sort of late to the party, I just bought it a week ago and finished it tonight.  Definitely the best storytelling and cinematics in a video game ever.  Shame the sidequests were so repetitive.

I was pretty convinced during the whole convo with Vigil that Sovereign or some other Reaper communicating from dark space was the Shadow Broker.  Think about it . . . Vigil said that the Reapers used the info collated on the central planet to organize their extermination of all organic life.  So it would make sense for Sovereign to pose through intermediaries as an information broker . . . .  Actually this sounded a lot more plausible an hour ago.

Also, I'd be surprised if they didn't bring the Arachni back no matter whether you chose to release the Queen or not.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #29 on: 28 Dec 2007, 11:31 »

The funny thing about the rachni queen is that I've finished Noveria on both my paragon and renegade playthroughs and the Council finds a way to be pissed at you no matter which choice you make.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #30 on: 07 Jan 2008, 05:54 »

I'm halfway through my renegade playthrough.  Now that I know that you're supposed to talk to everyone on your ship after every main plot mission, certain side quests are much more straightforward.  It's interesting how the Salarian on the council likes you a lot more when you eradicate the thorian controlled colonists.  Good design and an excellent example of merging game design (allowing for paragon and renegade playthroughs) with game mythos (if you read the codex, Salarians are very short-lived so it makes sense that they would be all for killing quasi-innocents if it made sense in the long run).

I think for many people the superficial flaws in Mass Effect detracted overly from the really, really clever and well thought through bits of design.  It's definitely part of a new trend where the game designers appear to be hiring boiler rooms of graduate students to right a library worth of accessible in game mythos (hurray!)
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #31 on: 13 Jan 2008, 19:25 »

Well that was largely unexpected.

I punched the air when Shepard made it out from the rubble though. Then I picked Anderson and told Udina he could shove it.

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It looks like I'm alone in that I wasn't terribly impressed with the Reapers. For one, the whole 50,000 year cycle / prophecy thing seemed more at home in a fantasy game than a sci-fi game.

Man so what if it seems like more of a fantasy convention? The two genres aren't that far separated.
« Last Edit: 13 Jan 2008, 19:35 by Johnny C »
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #32 on: 13 Jan 2008, 19:52 »

Like I said, Star Wars this ain't. It feels boring, is all. I'm not saying I played ME to get away from the silliness of KOTOR, but I'd like to think that ME at least wants to be "hard sci-fi", when it clearly isn't. Part of it is my annoyance at not really having much of a central villain. You get maybe 20 minutes of in-game Saren time. It's not enough, and when they throw Sovereign at you it was less of a revelation than one bit actor stepping in for another. I barely cared about Saren, I didn't care at all about Sovereign. The other part of it is that it's the first game in a trilogy, and as much as it couldn't be helped, I kept feeling like they're saving their best stuff for a later date. At least, I hope that's the case. As much as I like ME, they'd better top it next time.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #33 on: 13 Jan 2008, 20:35 »

The volume of sidequest vs. game proper didn't really help that, but I dunno. I still felt there was a lot of Saren/Sovereign even in the side missions - all of the stuff with Cerebrus, for example, which I hope gets explored more in later games. Seriously, the first time I ran into Thorians or Rachni were on Cerebrus missions, before they were even brought into the main story. When I found out how important both of those species wound up being to the game proper I realized that I hope they actually deal with Cerebrus more in the future.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #34 on: 13 Jan 2008, 20:55 »

Yeah, that's my hope. It'd be nice to have a human villain, and you'd have more varied opportunities, combat-wise, than if it was a geth-centric group of enemies. You might even get to interact with them outside of combat. They might actually be characters.

That's one of the bigger things that annoyed me about ME. Aside from Benezia, all of Saren's underlings were pretty much faceless, be they geth or krogan. It's a little much to ask, I suppose, but maybe multiple villains are in order. Cerberus is a conspiracy, and conspiracies generally aren't the work of one guy and his subordinates. They're usually a group of influential people.

But that would be hard to do, what with the Reapers having been revealed as the big setting baddies. All evil plots would have to relate to them in some manner, lest the focus be lost.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #35 on: 13 Jan 2008, 22:23 »

After playing Crackdown, actually, the villains in this game seemed remarkably well-developed. Probably just clouded judgement on my part.

And the thing is, I think Cerebrus are related to the Reapers somehow. Besides the fact that everything they did related to Reaper-initiated events in the main plotline, Vigil also suggested that Saren was not the only pawn used by the Reapers in this cycle. It's likely that Vigil was suggesting that the events of the game had been in motion for years, but I don't think it's too far-fetched to think that Sovereign had its claw-bits dipped in multiple pies across the galaxy at the same time.
« Last Edit: 13 Jan 2008, 22:31 by Johnny C »
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #36 on: 13 Jan 2008, 22:41 »

The Shadow Broker.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #37 on: 13 Jan 2008, 23:11 »

Hey guys, how will the whole "pick up where you left off" sequel work with two playthroughs? I'm going to do a renegade run next but let's be honest, I'd really like to keep going in the series as the noble, selfless defender of the galaxy.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #38 on: 14 Jan 2008, 01:09 »

I'd assume your karma axes will be reset to 0, as they were when you started your second playthrough. The only way to get around your renegade playthrough influencing the events of the second game, however, would be if they had a KOTOR2-esque questionnaire at the beginning. You might want to take a break and replay as paragon again, if possible. Or play with another character.
« Last Edit: 14 Jan 2008, 01:12 by Kid van Pervert »
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #39 on: 14 Jan 2008, 08:37 »

Dangit!

Maybe I'll just start a new playthrough and do my renegade run as a maxed-out female character. I got pretty attached to ol' Dom Shepard.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #40 on: 14 Jan 2008, 10:39 »

Well, presumably you'll tell the game which of your playthroughs to use the save data from. I would be surprised if you did otherwise, so you should be able to have a renegade character without problems.

Of course, that's just my guess. I can't pretend to know how Bioware will implement it.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #41 on: 17 Jan 2008, 11:47 »

I have no intentions of playing this game as I do not have, and do not want a 360, and Bioware's stubborn refusal to port the game to PC (which is a whole other discussion of why exclusivity should die).  So despite the excellent KOTOR being avalible on my primary gaming platform, ME will (as it stands) not be so. 

But I'm still curious about it, and so I read this thread.

Am I wrong in thinking that the "Reapers" that you guys talk about sound like Necron from Warhammer 40k?  Sentient machine beings (check) awake after long slumber (check) to wipe out all life (check).  Created by some other being (maybe check).

Given that Sci-Fi is a pretty small circle, and anyone writing it is probably at least aware of, if not fully versed in, the staples of the genre, but still.  In the little you guys have talked about them, they seem highly derivative of Necrons (or even the ReaVers of Firefly/Serenity).  In the same way that Warcraft feels derivative of Warhammer Fantasy (although theres a reason that happened).

Feel free to point out ways they aren't, I'm only going off what is written in this thread.

Also, a short lived race?  Tau much?

It's definitely part of a new trend where the game designers appear to be hiring boiler rooms of graduate students to right a library worth of accessible in game mythos (hurray!)
Which might be why it sounds so very derivative.

Definitely the best storytelling and cinematics in a video game ever.  Shame the sidequests were so repetitive.
I also find this hard to believe.  It sounds like it may be the "fluffiest" in recent times, but certainly not the best.

Again, feel free to correct my thinking. 
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #42 on: 17 Jan 2008, 13:24 »

It's derivative intentionally. The entire point of this game is to be an interactive homage to the epic 80s sci-fi films. That's why you can put an old-school film filter on the game, for crying out loud. And is all that is required for a game to ripoff 40k to have an alien race that doesn't live for a long time? I don't know anything about the mythos of 40k, so I don't know if the Reapers really are anything like the Necron, but I can say that the fiction in Mass Effect is universally (if you'll pardon the pun) excellent, especially by the standards of the video game medium.

Basically, Mass Effect is everything KOTOR accomplished only made even more ambitious. And Mass Effect isn't on PC because A) PC gaming is dying and everybody knows it and B) because Microsoft financed this game and they wanted to use it to push 360s. It's MGS's call, not Bioware's.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #43 on: 17 Jan 2008, 13:46 »

Again, as I dont have a 360, I wouldnt know about the film filter.  I am not super universal on the 40k mythos, but again, how they reapers were talked about in this thread made them seem like they were a direct lift off of the Necros (as I said, ancient race of organic machines bent on exterminating all life, blah blah, wiki them if you want more).

I would disagree with your point of PC gaming dying.  As the biggest games in existance exist soley on PC (CS on original XBox doesnt count), and last I checked, the most likely next biggest game from Blizzard is going to exist only on PC.  Honestly, you may be a smart person, but any time someone says "PC Gaming is dying/dead," I want to punch them in the throat.

In reference to the second point, it seems silly that they wouldnt release ME on PC months later, once its a budget / greatest, sorry PLATINUM hits title on 360.  Given the facts of what I have read about developing for Xbox it seems like it wouldnt be hard to even put out a half assed port in a couple months to PC.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #44 on: 17 Jan 2008, 14:32 »

Have you played that Starcraft game? HUGE 40k rip off. HUGE.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #45 on: 17 Jan 2008, 14:43 »

So having Counterstrike, Starcraft and nothing else means the PC market is doing swimmingly? The most ambitious PC-only games in years, World in Conflict and Crysis, both bombed horribly sales wise. Piracy and the inherent costs of the PC platform means that fewer and fewer games are coming to PC, and the ones that do are rarely significantly better than the console versions.

Another reason Bioware is probably reluctant to make a PC port of Mass effect is because Bioware has stated repeatedly that they want to finish the full Mass Effect trilogy within the lifespan of the 360, and dividing up their development team to make a PC version would likely make it much more difficult for them to release the sequels in the time period they're projecting.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #46 on: 17 Jan 2008, 15:08 »

Counter Strike, Half Life, World of Warcraft, Starcraft, The Sims, Warcraft, Guild Wars; I could keep going, but I think you might see where this is going.  Yes, it probably costs more to dev on PC, but you also show that you dont know how ports are made.  Most ports are done by a DIFFERENT dev studio (as CS was for XBox).  Piracy is not as big an issue as the PUBLISHERS would have you believe.

Starcraft is the reason why Relic wont put Tyranid into Dawn of War, which is both ironic and annoying.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #47 on: 17 Jan 2008, 16:20 »

There was a recent blog post by a CoD4 dev about how shocked he was at how many people were playing online with the same code/lack of one.  Piracy is pretty bad, at least for the popular games out there.  CoD4 and Crysis have been downloaded at least 100,000 times each (checking the latest scrape at a torrent site).  That's a huge amount of sales that the publishers aren't getting.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #48 on: 17 Jan 2008, 16:29 »

Dudes don't feed the PC-only trolls.
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Re: Mass Effect Plot Discussion (There Will Be Spoilers)
« Reply #49 on: 17 Jan 2008, 16:52 »

And when people think blockbuster video games I'm sure the first title that springs to mind is Guild Wars.

In fact, you've indirectly shown one of the many problems with modern PC gaming: the newest game on your list is over 2 years old. Are people who have been playing Counterstrike and Starcraft for 10 years and the Sims for 8 or spending 30 hours a week playing WoW going to buy new games? No, they do not, so what incentive is there to develop new games for it? Even if they do decide to spend the money and time to make a PC port, it always sells far, far less than the console counterpoints, so at some point they just won't even bother anymore. The only games that are commercially viable on PC anymore are MMOs, which is why the MMO market is glutted with tons of knockoffs trying to catch the next lightning in a bottle and become the new blockbuster after WoW loses steam.
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