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Author Topic: John Gardner's "Grendel"  (Read 25932 times)

Jackie Blue

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John Gardner's "Grendel"
« on: 17 Dec 2007, 12:23 »

I think Grendel would make a way better film than Beowulf did.

Especially if they kept Crispin Glover in the title role.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #1 on: 17 Dec 2007, 13:00 »

*edit- Of course it does. Blah.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #2 on: 17 Dec 2007, 13:31 »

I think it would certainly be a good movie, but I think Beowulf has a lot more potential.  Say...Peter Jackson, or some dude like that filmed Beowulf LOTR-style.  I think that'd be good times.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #3 on: 17 Dec 2007, 15:32 »

 Maybe they should just leave both stories the fuck alone from now on.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #4 on: 17 Dec 2007, 15:35 »

They never will, you know that.
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Jackie Blue

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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #5 on: 17 Dec 2007, 15:43 »

But Grendel is actually a fleshed-out and philosophical story, whereas Beowulf is just a rather simplistic passed-down fable.

Srsly if Jim Jarmusch or someone did Grendel it would be epic.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #6 on: 17 Dec 2007, 16:07 »

There has already been at least one film version of 'Grendel'.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grendel_Grendel_Grendel

I wouldn't mind someone just not trying to be fucking clever and doing Beowulf straight, for once. The only straight telling I've ever seen was a pretty cheap animated version. Beowulf and Grendel has a story about as altered as the recent animated version (though with more skill), 13th Warrior is so re-done that most people don't realise it even IS Beowulf, and the Beowulf with Christopher Lambert is just fucking strange.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #7 on: 17 Dec 2007, 16:12 »

 Seriously, Beowulf And Grendel with Gerard Butler was the only really great one to me.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #8 on: 17 Dec 2007, 16:13 »

What the Hell, they made an animated aimed-at-children's movie out of Grendel?!

That's like... doing an anime version of The Stranger.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #9 on: 17 Dec 2007, 16:49 »

Seriously, Beowulf And Grendel with Gerard Butler was the only really great one to me.

I'm quite a fan of 13th Warrior, in a cultish sort of way, though the ridiculous historical anachronisms grate on me tremendously. Not a single fucking one of them is dressed, armed or armoured in any way that remotely resembles a dark ages warrior of any description. Not just in the stereotypical 'furry wellies and winged helmets' way either. I mean, one of them is dressed as a fucking conquistador, and another one is wearing a roman gladiators helmet and carrying a bastard sword. It's like they just raided some props department and picked up all the weapons and armour they could find and then handed them out completely at random. Not that this isn't normal, but considering the effort they go to to incorporate the Ibn Fadlan angle, and all the rigmarole with unsubtitled latin and norse dialogue you'd have thought they would have put in some sort of vague effort.

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That's like... doing an anime version of The Stranger.

I could see that. Actually, that would probably work better than a live action adaptation, if done right. There's two film versions of The Stranger, according to Wikipedia, but both look pretty obscure.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #10 on: 17 Dec 2007, 16:56 »

sci-fi channel made a Beowulf movie awhile back, if i'm not mistaken. i think i watched 10 minutes of it or so. it wasn't good.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #11 on: 17 Dec 2007, 17:36 »

Now I have this image in my head of The Stranger with Spike Spiegel as the lead character.

...and yeah, it does kind of work.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #12 on: 17 Dec 2007, 17:47 »

It just seems to me that anime, in particular, seemed a kind of strange choice of a bizarre genre, given things like the Evangelion films.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #13 on: 17 Dec 2007, 18:04 »

I would watch it, though. If it were a series, religiously.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #14 on: 17 Dec 2007, 18:20 »

Oh man, I love Neon Genesis Evangelion.

You can pretty much do anything with anime, and it have it work.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #15 on: 17 Dec 2007, 18:50 »

OT, but didn't they make a new Evangelion movie not long ago? NGE is a lot less mind-blowing to me now than it was in high school. The "you think you've seen nuts? This is nuts!" ending has worn me down as I've seen it happen over and over in anime. I just about gave up on the genre after being forced to watch Elfin Lied.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #16 on: 17 Dec 2007, 21:53 »

I hate people who don't realize that anime is as diverse an artform as regular cinema.  It's not all giant robots and magical schoolgirls.

Though, granted, sometimes it's really hard to find the good anime, especially since some of the best stuff hasn't been officially brought to the US.

And I don't care what anyone says, The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzimaya is great.  Though I cringe at its general fanbase.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #17 on: 17 Dec 2007, 23:09 »

I saw Paprika this year and it was utterly incredible.

Anyways, Grendel is a marvelous book, but I don't know how comfortable I'd be seeing it made into a proper film. Even as an arthouse flick I think it'd lose something, since half of the novel is just Gardner fucking around with literary convention.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #18 on: 18 Dec 2007, 08:19 »

I piss on Evangelion.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #19 on: 18 Dec 2007, 17:53 »

 Molested by nightmares.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #20 on: 18 Dec 2007, 18:30 »

A lot of people don't realize that the 13th Warrior, a book by Micheal Chricton before it was a film, is a Beowulf story mixed with the story of the historical figure Ibn Fadlan's journey to the north to see the barbarian savages.

And as far as Grendel as a movie, I'm glad I haven't seen any of this, that was my favorite book in the required readings for my high school, and I would hate to see it fucked up like Beowulf, which I admit, was a fucking horrible film.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #21 on: 18 Dec 2007, 19:54 »

I already went over the 13th Warrior thing.

And please, barbarian savages? Actually, that's an interesting little historical point on the vikings. Ibn Fadlans largely responsible for the idea that the Vikings had pure hygeine. He actually calls them unclean because they wash and eat with the same hand and share their wash basins. Bathing every morning was a pretty high standard of cleanliness in the 9th century.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #22 on: 18 Dec 2007, 22:19 »

I saw Paprika this year and it was utterly incredible.

Anyways, Grendel is a marvelous book, but I don't know how comfortable I'd be seeing it made into a proper film. Even as an arthouse flick I think it'd lose something, since half of the novel is just Gardner fucking around.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #23 on: 19 Dec 2007, 00:52 »

That better be meant as a compliment.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #24 on: 19 Dec 2007, 09:23 »

I read "Grendel" back in junior high. It was my introduction into non-normal literature; I thought it was about the coolest damned thing ever, writing Beowulf from the monster's point of view. I don't think a movie based on it could really work, but I still have a thing for that kind of writing. "Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are Dead" by Tom Stoppard is similar. Secondary or even tertiary characters given a chance to tell their side of the story.

I'd like to read something like "Lord of the Rings" from Pippin's point of view. What the fuck was he thinking half the time? Is he really that much of an idiot? Or maybe Legolas, revealing his thoughts on dealing with a bunch of human, dwarf, and hobbit losers, when he could just take a ship out of there with the rest of his people. And his epic struggle to keep his lust for Aragorn under control.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #25 on: 19 Dec 2007, 09:59 »

I read Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are Dead right at the same time as Grendel.  It is perfect.

And I can't stand people who say the film version of it sucked.  Other than omitting the part about seeing a unicorn, which is easily the best part of the play, the movie was great and superbly well-acted.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #26 on: 19 Dec 2007, 10:05 »

It does work much better on the stage than on film, though.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #27 on: 19 Dec 2007, 10:13 »

That better be meant as a compliment.

Gardner may have fucked around well enough to produce something of value, but at the heart of that book it's still just fucking around. And taking it seriously. I don't like that.

zerodrone, you shoudn't hate so many people. It can't be good for you.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #28 on: 19 Dec 2007, 11:38 »

jimbunny, you should figure out that my posting style is intentionally over-the-top and that I'm actually a really mellow person who just happens to like screaming my opinions from the rooftops like a rooster with Tourette's.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #29 on: 19 Dec 2007, 22:30 »

Understand that this is a difficult thing to do, considering that all I (will ever) see of you is your posting style.

I don't dislike your opinions; more often than not they're well-informed, and sometimes I even agree with you. But the way that you express them sometimes makes me want to dislike those opinions.  :| Just my reaction.
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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #30 on: 21 Dec 2007, 23:17 »

I already went over the 13th Warrior thing.

And please, barbarian savages? Actually, that's an interesting little historical point on the vikings. Ibn Fadlans largely responsible for the idea that the Vikings had pure hygeine. He actually calls them unclean because they wash and eat with the same hand and share their wash basins. Bathing every morning was a pretty high standard of cleanliness in the 9th century.

That was meant to be his point of view, should have put it in quotation marks. And you weren't really all too clear on saying that Ibn Fadlan was a historical figure, so I figured I would just make that a bit more crystal.
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Yeah, I mean, "I won't kill and eat you if you won't kill and eat me" is typically a ground rule for social groups.

saeedrah

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Re: John Gardner's "Grendel"
« Reply #31 on: 15 Jul 2013, 16:34 »

Hi dear fellow lovers of Grendel

I recently embarked on the difficult task of translating Grendel into my language, Persian. And I hoped some native speakers could help me with my issues and questions. For now, I've translated the first chapter of the book and I'm gonna go ahead and give a list of the parts I couldn't clearly understand. so here we go:

* . I shake my head, muttering darkly on shaded paths
can u paraphrase this, what does darkly mean here?

* I am aware in my chest of tuberstirrings in the blacksweet duff of the forest overhead
- does it mean black in color and sweet in taste? and duff, it's rotten vegetables, right?

* I swim up through the firesnakes, hot dark whalecocks prowling the luminous green of the mere
- firesnake is a fictional creature, right? can it be translated into "Fiery Snakes"? Also I don't get the whalecock part, does he really mean the cock of whales, like prowling for sth to fuck?

* Space hurls outward, falconswift, mounting like an irreversible injustice, a final disease.
- can you describe the scene here? I don't get it clearly.

* I stand there shaking from head to foot, moved to the deep-sea depths of my being, like a creature thrown into audience with thunder
- a description of this scene would also help

* mute birds, pulsating, thoughtless clay in hushed old trees, thick limbs interlocked to seal drab secrets in.
- I also can't get this imagery in it's wholeness, please describe it for me if u can

A few little lizard tongues, then healthy flames: lizard tongues? wtf? healthy?
my pale slightly glowing fat mother: she's like glowing, as a monsterish thing?
steaming grass: I'm almost sure about this, but it doesn't bother to ask. it's like steam is coming out of the grass, right?
wolfslopes: i translated it into the slope of wolves
I stand in the high wind balanced: does it mean the wind blown on high cliffs or what?
cackle: laugh? right?
turning like falcons at warplay: what can i translate warplay into? a playful war maybe? or a warlike game?

thx in adv dear fellow literature loves
« Last Edit: 15 Jul 2013, 17:53 by saeedrah »
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