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[MC]

seriously whats the deal..... everyone knew she was gonna be upset..... but this? I hope Marten and Dora's relationship can survive this because if it was me? I'd honestly consider dumping her over this. She is acting nuts....

[Surgoshan]

Well, I dunno about dumping her... she might be great in bed.

[Scruffy]

People will go nuts, especially people in relationships.  Just think of it as another momentary laps in reasoning.  In my opinion though, that last look before she spoke to Penelope speaks volumes.

[skaps]

I don't know why everyone thinks that look may be her saving grace...I've gotten that look from my friend's girlfriend after I witness fights and it hasn't meant she's all done and sorry. It usually means she doesn't like looking bad in front of company and is trying to look like the non-bitchy person in the situation.

Girls can make their eyes all big and soft and crazy...and Pen-pen is stuck with Dora for the rest of the work day, so she's using humor to diffuse the situation. I have a feeling she isn't really at all comfortable with how Dora is acting. If she is ok with it, then Pen-pen really must hate Faye D:

[WriterofAllWrongs]

Eh, there's a certain amount of irrationality in relationships, it was bound to show its face eventually.  Plus, Dora and Marten have been WAY too peaceful up to this point.  They had small tiffs, but they always turned out with Marten being Mr. Sensitive and giving Dora a reassuring "Oh, honey, you're so silly.  It'll be okay."  You can't really have a good plot where that's all that happens.

[Boom]

Remember everyone, we (the reader) have seen both sides of the story and the back story for every character. Dora has not had that luxury, try forgetting what you've seen up to this point and reread the last 3-4 comics, it might help a little. 

[bunnyThor]

Based on the clues that Jeph has dropped on us so far, this almost certainly has something to do with a fear of abandonment that Dora has regarding former friends that Sven has slept with, and it would seem to be a much bigger issue than it first appeared as in this strip.

My guess is that Dora is going to have to have a real talk to Sven about this--a talk that wasn't possible to have while Sven was still being a total smarmosaur. My hope is that it is coming soon, as the writing of all this drama seems to be as hard on Jeph as the reading of all this drama is on the rest of us. 

[Surgoshan]

She's worried about Faye getting hurt, she's worried about Sven getting hurt, she's worried about Marten getting hurt, and she's worried she'll get hurt.  She's spiraling into a bottomless pit of crazy and the only way to get out is...

I dunno, get drunk?

[Amadeus]

My theory? It's just a lot for her to swallow at once. Just give her a sec to calm down, and she'll probably be alright.

I'm guessing she's had some serious relationship problems in the past.

[Hadrian Emrys]

MC: An extreme reaction to an extreme reaction. THAT'D make things right. 

Surgo: Ha. Also, I'm pretty sure at least one of the cast is going to have a drink in them before too long.

Scruffy: I agree. These scuffs are commonplace in relationships. Nothing a little calm dialogue can't patch up.

skaps: *shrug* The true nature of things has yet to be seen. Given the nature of the relationship as it has been expressed thus far, it is completely reasonable for the Dora character to feel as she does. People have baggage through which they view the world and Dora's experiences lead her to believe that a serious hurt is coming from all this.

Write: -is absolutely, er, right.

Boom: Again, the voice of reason.

bunny: (love the name) Reason springs eternal.

Amad: -as the bunny has stated. There is history here that is a while in coming to a head and being resolved.


As far as I am concerned, the way this is shaping up is very true to life. It's good storytelling.

[blaha 41]

Dora is just acting like a normal girl. She's ultra-cool, but she's still just a normal, twentysomething who freaks out about things that are small potatoes in the long run- probalby because she's starting to feel old, which in turn makes her feel like everything that happens has long term implications, so she's taking everything way too seriously.

it happens to most of us.

[MC]

Dora is just acting like a normal girl. She's ultra-cool, but she's still just a normal, twentysomething who freaks out about things that are small potatoes in the long run- probalby because she's starting to feel old, which in turn makes her feel like everything that happens has long term implications, so she's taking everything way too seriously.

it happens to most of us.

meh if I would be completely honest, it's happened to me before. I'd be one hell of a hypocrite by dumping her  

[Alphalpha]

And Dora woke up and it was all a dream.

Or was it!!!

[Uber Ritter]

Downward spiral?  Hardly.  In the past she's generally been pretty quick to mellow out (for instance, the whole 'your still have feeligns for Faye!?') thing, and in the second to last panel here she looks like she's giving things a second thought, or at least thinking 'that could have gone better.'  Now Marten might actually be pretty ticked off-have we ever seen him this mad?  Perhaps at Ellen that one time.  So it's possible that it's Dora that's going to have to try and reconcile her and Marten.

[Dosmas]

Just found this comic two weeks ago, read through all the archives in two nights and have been kicking myself for it. This is what methadone to crack addicts must feel like. But as for the current situation, A) I kinda feel sorry for Jelph, writing this intense drama stuff is kinda reverse-cathartic, you feel all agitated after your done for the day instead of relieved, and B) this is a hell of a story arc, I'm envisioning at least two more weeks of repercussions to everyone in the 'gang' and a couple more Friday cliffhangers to boot. Only reason I think I've ever disliked weekends.

MC - been the hypocrite before myself. Not a good thing when you're reminiscing about the past.

Uber - I agree with skaps, in that second to last panel I think Dora just got caught up with the fight and forgot about Pen-pen sitting there watching. They really ought to get a popcorn machine in CoD.

[Dosmas]

And on a side note, I always found The Silmarillion to put me directly asleep even without the head trauma. Love me some Tolkien, but whew.

[Irewild]

It's so true! The Silmarillion is so dry I had to chew cardboard to prepare to read it. The prose is beautiful just...tiring.

Aw, <3 Tolkien.

[bunnyThor]

The movies were better than the books.

[Boom]

god help us all if they make a movie based on the silmarillion, man and i thought sitting through the last 20 minutes of The Return of the King was bad...

btw books > movie

[col]

This last strip reminds me of a fight me and boyfriend once had.  Me being the "insane" one.  So I guess I can relate with Dora, but right after the fight I was like "wtf was I saying?" which kinda looks like her face after the fight.

I think marten and her will be fine

[Amadeus]

This last strip reminds me of a fight me and boyfriend once had.  Me being the "insane" one.  So I guess I can relate with Dora, but right after the fight I was like "wtf was I saying?" which kinda looks like her face after the fight.

I think marten and her will be fine

Yeah, I have been there before, too.

At least this is more reasonable than the haircut fiasco.

[shadowdemon_lord]

First off to the entire thread up till now, I think this OoTS thread works very well to express my opinionhttp://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0401.html. Secondly, Dora is acting inane yes, but did anyone expect her not to freak out? She freaks out all the time when Marten is involved even tangetially. The real shocker to me was Marten walking out on her, I mean, woah. Standing up for himself like that and not putting up with shit is as anathema to him as signing karaoke in front of a large group is to Hannelore. I mean, Marten has never once walked out on someone in this comic before, and he's been put through the ringer.

[angelagee]

Dora, like many of you have said, is acting like a girl. She's gonna end up feeling so stupid about this.
Although, I have a feeling she might take a while before realizing she's definately blowing this out of proportion.
Like, I can see her making things awkward at work. Just for a day or something.
And Marten, well, we haven't seen if he's ACTUALLY okay with this or he's just saying that to be...A man or something.

P.S. Faye and Sven need to be together.
P.P.S. I can just see Sven sticking up for Faye when Dora goes and yells at him.
P.P.P.S. Woo!

[Umlaut]

I believe Dora must be feels very insecure about Marten - Does he really love her? Is it only lip service him saying that still likes Faye, but there is nothing beyound?
From Marten's point of view he never gave ambiguous signals to Dora, so I can understand very well that he reacts like he did. Who wants to be under a steady general suspicion.
I do hope they stay together, but in my opinion it is up to Dora to make the first step.

[MC]

The real shocker to me was Marten walking out on her, I mean, woah. Standing up for himself like that and not putting up with shit is as anathema to him as signing karaoke in front of a large group is to Hannelore. I mean, Marten has never once walked out on someone in this comic before, and he's been put through the ringer.

there was one other time he walked out on someone.... I can't quite remember the comic but it has happened before.

EDIT: I DO remember now. He walked out on Steve when him and Ellen were having their first argument and Steve was acting like an asshole. Though now that I think about it.... he DID go back and apologize after-all.

[DonInKansas]

If there were no fights in relationships, there would be no make-up sex.

And make-up sex rawks.

[AngelofShadows]

Dora's being overly paranoid I think. I can understand the logic. Faye admits to having feeling for Martin, Martin admits to still having feelings for Faye, the two things standing in the way of them was Fayes inability to be in a relationship, and her.

Faye just had sex, which, despite the fact that she's freaking the fuck out about it, (thought it seems to be less about having the sex and more about who it was with) throws that first hurdle out the fucking window, or at the very least, nudges it closer to said open window.

Dora probably feels like she isn't a good enough reason to keep Faye and Martin from finally hooking up. Her being as insecure as she is, she's going to take it personally, even though, really, This has nothing to do with her at the moment, and she'll probably realize that after thinking about it, or having Penelope talk to her (btw, Pen eating Popcorn while Faye is getting screamed at is priceless, and if were real, I would hug her)

Though I do hope Faye and Martin hook up. Even though I understand where Dora is coming from, I'm still finding the whole reaction annoying, and her blowing up at Martin over little shit is starting to grind mah gears.

[AlexT]

EDIT: I DO remember now. He walked out on Steve when him and Ellen were having their first argument and Steve was acting like an asshole. Though now that I think about it.... he DID go back and apologize after-all.

That was straight after he left. XD

Dora is just being a little bit melodramatic. She's being paranoid and I'm sure she'll see sense after a while like she did with the whole 'haircut' issue.

[Uber Ritter]

Man, everyone that thinks that Dora's too crazy/insecure for Martin but that Faye's somehow a match made in heaven baffles me.  Given that even after this she still doesn't really feel 'ready' for a relationship.

But anyway, I don't think that Dora's acting like girl, inasmuch as I do the whole 'blow up embarassingly and then cool off almost immediately' thing all the time myself, and I am decdidedly a dude, if a somewhat girly one by some standards.

[Amadeus]

god help us all if they make a movie based on the silmarillion, man and i thought sitting through the last 20 minutes of The Return of the King was bad...

btw books > movie

True, though the council in Rivendell in the book goes on for ages. The super long poem there is the only part I skipped. I'm sorry, it's no Sam singing about boners. No comparison.

[supercubedude]

Dora is overreacting, but I'm willing to bet she's smart enough to realize this and resolve the situation before it gets out of hand (well, more out of hand.)

[bunnyThor]

Dora may indeed be overreacting, but I'd like to know what she is overreacting about.

Is it just the bit from high school that when Sven fucked her friends they stopped being her friends, or is there something more significant than that?

If it was just high school, then, Dora, it was 8 years ago. MOVE ON.

[Doug S. Machina]

Maybe it was just the most obvious of many incidents and arguements. I think she'll get over it, sooner or later.

[Escape Velocity]

Given that she's completely alienated both her boyfriend and her best friend during the course of this argument, she's running out of people to talk to about it.  I suspect what's going to happen is that she's going to go confront Sven about it, go in completely swinging, and then he's going to stand up to her long enough to finally knock her down, and actually give her some perspective on the whole thing.  I think once she calms down, she's eventually going to see the same thing that everybody here seems to agree on, which is that she's not really angry per se, but rather is insecure about her relationship with Marten, and scared about what this means for it.  Probably the only person who can get her to really confront that at this point is Sven, and he's definitely tough enough to do it.  Plus, he's her brother, so he's had a lifetime of experience putting up with her shit, and vice versa.  I think we'll see her going into his apartment mad as hell, and a few strips later leaving it scared and ashamed. 

Luckily, both Marten and Faye will probably be understanding enough that there won't be any burned bridges in the long-term.  Bravo to Marten for actually standing up for himself, though.  I think after this is all said and done, it will actually have strengthened their relationship.

[Surgoshan]

Given that she's completely alienated both her boyfriend and her best friend during the course of this argument, she's running out of people to talk to about it.  I suspect what's going to happen is that she's going to go confront Sven about it, go in completely swinging, and then he's going to stand up to her long enough to finally knock her down, and actually give her some perspective on the whole thing.

Actually, I kind of suspect he'll sit calmly and be kind of snarky at her.

[Helios05]

Man, everyone that thinks that Dora's too crazy/insecure for Martin but that Faye's somehow a match made in heaven baffles me.  Given that even after this she still doesn't really feel 'ready' for a relationship.

But anyway, I don't think that Dora's acting like girl, inasmuch as I do the whole 'blow up embarassingly and then cool off almost immediately' thing all the time myself, and I am decdidedly a dude, if a somewhat girly one by some standards.

We don't think Faye is a "match made in heaven" but she has progressively worked to make her problems lessen and hopefully go away(as much as they can), while Dora honestly just seems to get worse and worse, not better. Sure she doesn't "feel" ready, but does that really mean she shouldn't or will not try? If what we've seen and come to understand is true, then hardly, she will give a relationship a chance, but maybe it should be with someone who will likely understand better (hence, Marten). Sven is a good start, and growing to be a better person as well, but he doesn't have a full understanding of Faye, and thus is not exactly the person Faye should have her first relationship in a long time with. While the idea of a "starter" relationship sounds cold, even too me, it is honestly what she needs to work herself up to having a real, long term relationship with the person she wants to be with. I've used the idea of someone who has lost the muscle in a limb, you have to work slowly but steadily up to strength with the limb if you even want it to get to the state it once was, thats the best analogy I can think of.

[sadakogirl]

I'm not sure it's quite right to say she's just acting like a girl. I mean, it irritated me when Steve said that, oh, you never call a girl irrational and so forth. In Dora's case, she really needed someone to call her on all her BS. I mean, she's been uber insecure in the past and I'm glad that Marten didn't let her walk all over him. She may be feeling confused and so on, but the way she's handling it really isn't cool. And yelling at Faye when Faye really was apologetic...just seemed mean.

To say something in her defense--she did look very good in that fight strip.

[MC]

well this isn't the first time she's done this..... I could name at least 3 other times she flipped out and than blamed it on her insecurities. Honestly this is probably the thing that annoys me the most about Dora. I mean everyone's got insecurities at some level..... get over it.