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[Jimmy the Squid]

Non-Skippable Videos:  Ever hate having that in a game, where you sit through a 5-10 minute video before a boss, fight the boss, die, and then have to watch the same video again because the makers of the game didn't think of allowing you the option of skipping videos?  There were a fair number of PS2 games I had where I would get owned by a bass 4-6 times and be forced to watch the video again...and again....and again.

I can see where you're coming from but I basically love cutscenes. Basically if a game has good cutscenes it could make or break the entire game for me. That said, I get pissed off when you can't skip cutscenes that you have seen before! I happily it through the 10 minutes of exposition for the first time around because I'm interested but if I want to play that level again at a later date I already know the story! Just let me kill bad guys!

[KvP]

MGS3 had it right. You could go through the game skipping the cutscenes, but at a certain point it bit you on the ass (skipping a cutscene prevents you from gaining a very useful radio frequency)

[Narr]

Someone earlier made me think of another thing older RPGs tended to do that still bothers me.

Unintuitive stat systems.

Face it.  If you didn't read up on stats in AD&D, you were probably going to make a crap character.  The first time I played Baldur's Gate, I didn't realize how it worked as all I knew at the time was 3rd edition.  I made a character that would have whopped ass in 3rd, but didn't have a single bonus to anything inside AD&D rules.  I couldn't kill anything.  It was pretty bad.

The worst offender of this one is BY FAR the Fallout games.  To this day, I am incapable of making a good character.  I just do what my friends tell me to do who know the innards of the game like the back of their hands.

[Ikrik]

Non-Skippable Videos:  Ever hate having that in a game, where you sit through a 5-10 minute video before a boss, fight the boss, die, and then have to watch the same video again because the makers of the game didn't think of allowing you the option of skipping videos?  There were a fair number of PS2 games I had where I would get owned by a bass 4-6 times and be forced to watch the video again...and again....and again.

I can see where you're coming from but I basically love cutscenes. Basically if a game has good cutscenes it could make or break the entire game for me. That said, I get pissed off when you can't skip cutscenes that you have seen before! I happily it through the 10 minutes of exposition for the first time around because I'm interested but if I want to play that level again at a later date I already know the story! Just let me kill bad guys!

That's essentially what I'm talking about.

[KvP]

The worst offender of this one is BY FAR the Fallout games.  To this day, I am incapable of making a good character.  I just do what my friends tell me to do who know the innards of the game like the back of their hands.

Seriously?

I mean if you want an easy and powerful character, you follow three rules -
1. Gifted. Take it.
2. Tag small guns. This will pull you through the first 80% of the game.
3. Tag energy weapons. This will pull you through the last 20% of the game.

It just makes the most sense. You even get a bit of variety in choosing your third skill, the only detriment is that you can't have a full-on "rogue" character because you aren't awarded enough tag skills. You could probably drop energy weapons, but it'll make the endgame a bit harder (although taking the Tag! perk later on can fix that) #2 is the biggest thing. Going without Small Guns tagged is for seasoned players only.

That's really all you need. The SPECIAL system is pretty great in comparison to something like the TES system, conceptually and practically. As far as the worst CCS, that would probably go to Arcanum. At a certain point in the game 80% of all character builds became gimped, because of a lack of thorough design.

[Narr]

haha, well, then let me rephrase.

Unintuitive game builds because there's only one or two viable options despite the fact it's toted as something where you can toy around with different builds.

At least you can play as whatever you want in Neverwinter Nights 2 and not feel like you went down the wrong path.  The game will take care of your character creation if you're new to the whole 3rd ed thing, and for people who like to metagame, there's plenty of options that are all viable.  (My personal favorite: Enchanter Red Mage.  I lost out on most defensive spells in the game but my DC vs. enchantment spells was absurd.  I just charmed most everything I fought or put it to sleep for a coup de grace.)

[Spluff]

Only a couple of viable builds? Dude, you can go through the ENTIRE game of Fallout without even fighting a single enemy, if you want to. There are at least 3 methods to get through the game, whereas pretty much every D&D game's method is : kill the enemies.

[clockworkjames]

By LAG I am including "Connection errors/interrupts" and stuff, ping reg interpolation etc. are most likely what you were told about. LAG is an unstoppable force of evil when packets are dropped or connections are lost, you can replicate *some* of the stuff by messing with how you send packets, this is known as rates hacking.

The LAN Commandments

1- Honor thy admins and thy organisers
2- Honor the tournaments and keep them holy
3- Thou shall not eat fish pies or any sort of higgehfidel foods, lest the angel of the lord admin smite thee with his divine  backhand
4- Thou shall not be a drama llama, for it is the way of noobs and satan.
5- Thou shall not leech forth from others during designated game time
6- Thou shall not play Single player games, during the sabbath hours.
7- Thou shall not covet thy neighbours CD-Keys
8- Thou shall not host a network game with a password unless it's an arranged mix or tournament
9- Thou shall not use 1337 in vain
10- Thou shall not commit adultery, by raping the bandwith of a shared net connection

We don't really count hacking because nobody does it. at our LANs.

[Narr]

Only a couple of viable builds? Dude, you can go through the ENTIRE game of Fallout without even fighting a single enemy, if you want to. There are at least 3 methods to get through the game, whereas pretty much every D&D game's method is : kill the enemies.

Yet again,

UNINTUITIVE.

If you loaded the game for the first time, even with the manual, would you have known that?  Or would you have just guessed as to what you should do for a character (like I did) and end up making a really sorry guy?

[KvP]

well, as long as you knew the distinction between small and big guns (I originally thought Assault Rifles and such were big guns) it's just one of those things. Melee characters are advanced builds in all games where automatic ranged weapons are prevalent. It's sort of like going through Baldur's Gate expecting to kick ass as a dagger specialist.

[Narr]

It's easy to beat Baldur's Gate with a dagger.  You're losing a potential 4 damage off every attack as compared to most other one handed weapons.  Big-whoopty-doo.

i tried Fallout and discovered it was impossible to actually succeed in hitting anything unless you maxed out your agility and perception scores, meaning he sucked at everything else, which made me rather angry at how completely unintuitive the character creation is.

it's a problem with most older computer RPGs, really.

[ackblom12]

Narr, it's ok if you suck at a game. We all have our shitty games.

[Siert]

I suck as said earlier at beat-em-ups. I also suck at platformers, althouhg im doing pretty good in mario galaxy.

Back on point. LATEST encounter, this one made my ears bleed Halo 3 online, me and a few friends were aplying online, then our party got split with others (Not enough for 4v4 so 3v3, guess who joined the other team? Yours truley.

Right it goes well, i get in the Warthod (3 man vehicle with a massive cannon on the back) A guy get in and becomes gunner, he gets me a few medals for being a good driver, then we blow up... I get out kill two people and hear this over my headpiece.

"OMFG I PWN THESE FAGGOTS LAWL! OMG I KIK ASS!"

Score at moment, my team : my friends

5 : 3 (Remember I died in the warthog, killing three people, and i killed another two So technically thanks to me i got those 5 kills)

I decide to go into my hiding place, so I sneak back hide behind some concrete and make art.

Score at end of match? 5 : 50 ... My friends obliterated them. And I made soem fancy equipment art, I made a box!...with boxes! (I refuse to do what other  and giver free kills, so I simply hid and waited, cowardly? no, I just  don't appreciate my friends being insulted by skillless pricks.

[Dimmukane]

Yeah, in those situations I tend to do everything in my power to make it suck for the not-my-friends.  I'll throw Flares and Radar Jammers down like nobody's business, and try to destroy all the vehicles and deplete the ammo of the good weapons.

[Spluff]

i tried Fallout and discovered it was impossible to actually succeed in hitting anything unless you maxed out your agility and perception scores, meaning he sucked at everything else, which made me rather angry at how completely unintuitive the character creation is.

it's a problem with most older computer RPGs, really.

I didn't find that at all.

I did however, get completely mauled in Arcanum my first two times in a row. I still have no idea how to build a character for that game.

[KvP]

The main problem with Arcanum was probably that the experience system was really fucked. It was a level system but it used a gain-by-use system similar to TES. As a result, a guy running around with a dagger capable of 8-10 hits in a round could be counted on to gain levels much faster than a guy with a sword or a magic-user. Tech users would be completely fucked even if the experience system was coherent, which begs the question why they set the game in a steampunk setting in the first place.

That wasn't the worst part, though. The worst part was that party members didn't have their own experience, they leveled up with you. This would have been fine were it not for the fact that you didn't get experience when your party members scored a hit. So if you built a character based off of speech and charisma who would assemble a team of loyal followers to do your bidding, you gained exponentially less experience the more people you had in your party, and thus your party became exponentially less effective against the progressively tougher enemies in the game. It was a complete mess. The best character build was a half-ogre with maxed out strength and no charisma / intelligence.

[Siert]

Yeah, in those situations I tend to do everything in my power to make it suck for the not-my-friends.  I'll throw Flares and Radar Jammers down like nobody's business, and try to destroy all the vehicles and deplete the ammo of the good weapons.

ACtually thats a good idea but i don't want to give free kills or ruin my awesome K/D spread with them shooting at me. So hiding was the best call there Also the fact its a new map so.... I know where none of the awesome gadgets are :*(


ALSO. I hate.HATE HAATE!

leeches, the people who join a match and do NOTHING expecting you to pick up the slack, not being newbie, newbie i udnerstand, jsut the peopel who join but put their controller down.... I ahte the mso much.

[McTaggart]

I did however, get completely mauled in Arcanum my first two times in a row. I still have no idea how to build a character for that game.

You just need the skill to make molotov cocktails. Then wonder around the cities farming the materials. I think this is the easiest way to get yourself through bits where you're thoroughly outgunned and out-hped.

[öde]

Any game that judges you on your score, in like a platformer or beat-em-up that has the score reset if you die.

Basically, in order to get the top rank for performance (not high-score list, just if the game says "Great job" or "You suck" to you on how you played) you cannot die.

Yeah I hate that, especially when I'm quite a tactical player a lot of the time. I don't go rambo all the time, probably not even most of the time, but I play to help my team/side win and a lot of the time I get ranked badly because of it. I guess that's why when I do play games, it's usually Enemy Territory, because of the good support aspect.

[teh pwn queen]

ACtually thats a good idea but i don't want to give free kills or ruin my awesome K/D spread with them shooting at me. So hiding was the best call there Also the fact its a new map so.... I know where none of the awesome gadgets are :*(


ALSO. I hate.HATE HAATE!

leeches, the people who join a match and do NOTHING expecting you to pick up the slack, not being newbie, newbie i udnerstand, jsut the peopel who join but put their controller down.... I ahte the mso much.

WoW has a similar problem, people will enter a bg just to get the marks for winning (or not winning).  Though Bliz has made some progress with deterring people from doing that, you can now target a member as AFK and if they don't attack the opposing team they'll be marked as AFK and will be soon kicked out.  What makes it even better is if you leave a bg as AFK, you you become a 'deserter' and can't enter again for 15 min, which is long in game standards.
Although once I got marked because I was guarding a node along with the other ones who were too and we threw a fit, luckily we broke the tag and were able to stay in the game, we were all really pissed.

[Narr]

Oh god, Alterac Valley AFKers made me hate life.

There's a good reason Horde lost on every battlegroup known to man.  It's because 90% of those who joined just sat in the tunnels.

[clockworkjames]

If you afk you leave BG now though which is awesome.

You can also report people for being afk.

[Siert]

I used to do that in the old days, for reputation, I would hide behidn the tank in Dun Baldur (I think... or Alguz.. its Dun something!) and just sit for hours earning reputation, thats how I got my exalted with those dwarves. was an easy way around it but I mean I was a "Healadin" Raid specced, so the most i could do was scrap a bit of armour, noone liked a healer either.

"OMG STOP HEALING NUB I R IMBA!" Seriously, i got so many insults for healing.... I mean ...what?

Then after they cntinually nerfed it and I heard of the burning crusade me and a friend made a warlock. Took us about 2 months we got to elvel 60 each, we roleplayed, we PvPed (I was usually number one due to my obsession with spell damage > survival) and hurrah, then the portal opened and me and my friend went forth. Took us .. I think it was 7 days and we were both level 70 and we had achieved numerous goals by ourselves (He actually turned into his warrior, he couldn't be bothered levelling the warlock, which benefitted us nicely, I also had my summoned pet to help out.

We killed The giant spider, Sand worm, big frost wyrm, the Grull in the ... green bit, the one that circles the rock Osh...Osh something. We achieved a lot, there was very few monsters we couldn't figure out how to kill with just the three of us (Demonolgy Warlock, Arm Warrior and Felguard.) It worked well , I just made lots of healthstones and soulstoned regularly, and well, it worked wonders.

I did well up until I became obselete in a single PVP patch where my gear could be replaced in 2 days... seriously my gear ... well is insane i've not updated it since i quit.  *shrugs*

New encounter today!

Playing halo 3 onlin with me best bud, doing some Ranked Team doubles. We start it up all merry and cheerful. it comes up "construct" were like "Fantastic we know the tactics on this map inside out!"

So it starts, we rush we start shooting and jump in some teleporters, we gear up and wait for them to chase....nothing... noone, not even a smidge of motion on our scanners, we start gearing up, looting some of the powerful weapons (A super sword (MEIN!) and a sniper rifle (MAtes speciality, although you wouldn't think it from the next match...). So we get ready thinking "right they must be planning to rush us".

Timer ticks on, "Five minutes remaining!" ..on a ten minute match that was slow... we figured out where they were, we had scouted the entire upper floor of the map, and we caught motion sometimes, they were beneath us!

So my mate knows a sneaky path and just jumps (yes jumps) down off the ledge and plants a perfect headshot, absoloutely gorgous on the guy who is crouched in a corner looking up at where we were.

So then all hell breaks loose in this last minute, and the two enemies rush me!! So I pull out my sword and hack and slash, it ends with us on 5 points them on -1 (One jumped off the ledge....)

Point?... Camping sunsa bitches! We kept running around, being careful trying not to give it away throwing frags round corners.... So we won it but it was quite upsetting .

[Narr]

Hm, that makes me think of another sin:

Poor level design in multiplayer matches.

Honestly, I think Valve is guilty of this.  It hurts to say it, but they do not know how to make a fun CTF map.  Honestly, I don't know a single person that enjoys a round of 2fort.  There's a few people who CLAIM to like it, but if you ask them to explain what specifically they like about it, they cannot come up with an answer more in-depth than "It's fun?"

As much as I love Call of Duty 4, spawn camping is entirely too easy.  Spawn camping should be next to impossible to properly pull off, if levels are designed properly.  Firstly, spawn nodes should NEVER be in the complete open.  That's just redonkulous.  Secondly, make multiple exit strategies for any one side of a map so that if you ARE getting pinned down, you can try to escape another way.  I can think of oh-so many FPS games that can't seem to get this part right.  Battlefield 2142 had a lot of infantry maps where it was too easily pigeon-holed toward one route, Call of Duty 4's random spawn policy doesn't seem to ever randomly keep you out of the line of fire, and TF2 has too many maps where you can't even leave the starting location without dying unless you're a spy, and even then it's a crapshoot.

It's most obvious in FPS games as they are the most commonly played competitive online game, but it's not just beholden to them.  Seeing as lots of people have mentioned World of Warcraft lately, let's talk Alterac Valley.  You cannot ever start on the opposing side as you are locked into your faction.  Because the map was, for no good reason, NOT mirrored for both sides, this puts one ahead of the other due to sheer logistics, always.  The Alliance have it easier.  It's just fact.  Their towers are harder to raid (as ALL archers shoot you at any given time, because of how open it is.  Their final base is harder to raid because there's a long bridge you MUST pass in order to proceed, making it an effective bottleneck and a staging ground for a stonewall.  The Horde city isn't defended by their towers, anyway, meaning it can be wiped out without any alliance player breaking a sweat.  There's more paths through their little town, too, so it's impossible for Horde defensive players to bottleneck Alliance raiders.

[est]

Fake obstacles is one that I really, really hate.  It happens in a lot of games.  Halflife has already been mentioned, but pretty but every FPS is guilty of it to one degree or another.  I've had scenarios where I couldn't progress due to a large glass window.  I had guns, rockets, grenades, etc.  The window was marked as indestructable.  It shits me.  That plus this other thing is one of the reasons I have a love/hate relationship with Guild Wars.  The other thing is spawning/re-spawning out of nowhere bad guys.  Fuck that noise.  I don't mind the odd ambush, but getting stopped every 10m by some motherfucker popping up out of the ground like magic is really fucking annoying, especially if I just walked by this way a few seconds ago and cleared it out.

While I am bitching about MMORPGs I'll mention requirement creep, the multitude of little time-slowing phenomena that occur (mostly in MMORPGS) whereby everything starts to take longer and longer as you level up.  For example, a low-level PC can utterly destroy a similar level beastie, but once you start passing a certain level an "even con" encounter will start getting harder, forcing you into a group.  Let's set this straight, game creators - I like grouping up with other players on occasion, but I don't want to be forced to group.  Most people online are morons.  I do not want to be forced into interaction with them just to play the game.  I want to be able to pop online, kill some bad guys for an hour or so and see some kind of progress, then pop off for tea.  I don't want to get online at 7pm and look for a group for the next half-hour only to wind up with a pack of half-witted cretins who don't know one end of a sword from the other.

Another example of this is that things tend to become more and more spread out the higher the level.  At lower levels you're told "go hit that thing over there and come back" or "go kill cute little seals and bring me back their delicious eyes" and you do, and it's great.  Once you start to hit the middling levels it's all "go three areas across, pick a flower, take it to another continent and show it to Grand Inquisitor Fuckface, and then he'll give you the real quest."  (eg: kill larger, not-so cute woolly mammoths, bring back their delicious spleens). "Oh, and on your way back be a good lad and pop over to the inn and grab me an ale, I figure I'll be thirsty from all this rigorous sitting I seem to enjoy doing".

It's not really even the travelling I mind, it's that it's all a contrivance.  I don't need to be slowed down in a game I am enjoying.  I will stay with the game longer if I enjoy it and can sense some kind of progress without devoting my life to it.  When I have a limited amount of time to play with I want to be able to get on, have fun, then leave.  I don't want to jump through hoops to be able to do things I used to do just fine at a lower level and I don't want to have to run/gallop/hitch a ride/take a boat for half a fucking hour to get to where I need to be to do it.  Slow down the rate at which I gain experience if need be, but just let me play the game and have fun as opposed to slowly turning it into a second job.

[Narr]

I totally agree.

If I made an MMO, group dynamics would never require more than 3 people, ever.  I'd also try to make a system where "guilds" couldn't have more than, say, 15 people.  Basically, I'd aim for casual from the get-go, and institute "hardcore" things later on in successive patches if there was enough demand for it.

Sadly, MMOs are a terrible genre simply because World of Warcraft has such a majority of the market share.  Every other MMO out there right now is PURELY a substitute for WoW players looking for something new, I swear to god.

[Spluff]

I don't get MMORPGs. They have no plot, story, memorable characters, or anything like that - instead, they have a long grind to get to the next level. If I wanted to go out and mindlessly kill people, I'd play a FPS or an action game.

[Melodic]

Games in which we don't mindlessly kill people:

-Tetris
-Katamari Damacy
-???

[camelpimp]

Both of which are games which could be improved by the addition of killing.

[Spluff]

I was going to post a retort outlining the meaning of the word 'mindless', but the idea of violent Tetris is just too awesome to ignore.

Camelpimp, you are going to be rich and famous.

[muteKi]

Well, we need something to balance out that pornographic pac-man game.

[est]

Violent Tetris: There is a bad guy on the right in the bar thing & every time you complete a line it shoots him in the head & drags another bad guy onto the screen.

[Siert]

Well, we need something to balance out that pornographic pac-man game.

please don't tell me this is true.. that pacman promotes pornography?

Personally I thought it promoted going "Wakka" whenever you ate from a pez dispenser...

[muteKi]

It exists -- though it's not with Pac-Man. You're basically a clit and the ghosts are now (animated) penises. The pills are the same but are now called "contraceptives".


Man, some people come up with CRAZY shit.

[Siert]

Are you SERIOUS!?.... dear me you msut be.... i'm disturbed now...

[Surgoshan]

I know Ms. Pac-Man is special. She's fun. She's cute. She swallows.

[Narr]

Reminds me of Pussycity Pimps, which was a remake of Rivercity Ransom.  Everyone walked around with boners and the women were topless.

[Thaes]

I remember Pussycity Pimps. If I remember correctly, the "plot" had something to do with the protagonists "ho" having been kidnapped or something like that.

[Scruffy]

Tetris Blast for the original Gameboy
Perhaps the best Gameboy game ever.
There is a mode where you kill mosters by strategically blowing up tetris lines.
Also, perhaps the best Tetris game.

[AngelofShadows]

Things I hate.

The fucking rubber band effect in fighters. I could be a punch away from winning, with a near full health bar, and all of a sudden, the CPU decides it's a virtual god and destroys me. Yeah, I'm looking at you Street fighter, and most of you capcom family members, and those that cloned you.

Uneven characters.....Fuck you M. Bison. being uber fast and uber strong doesn't make you challenging, it makes you cheap. Cheap like a prostitute's self respect.

Bad music. This is thing for me. I've played to many RPG's where something sad happens, and the score is great, but when the party agrees that it needs to forge on, the score gets peppy, and upbeat, and poppy....like they just decided to go to the mall, instead of a journey to avenge whoever/whatever/some stupid ass town. It's not hard to make short little epic bursts of music. Fucking do it.

Cliffhangers....I hate them in movies, games that cost fifty bucks makes me want to punch a kitten in the face. MGS, after the credits. Everyone I've played. Hate them.

12 year olds playing Halo 3 at two in the morning....so many things wrong with this that I'm just gonna move on

This next one is one I've noticed in the WWE games. The story modes, why can't I do more? Like, run ins, or stop a promo mid sentence and start a brawl. This seems pretty odd.

Horrible unlockables. If I just spent 12 hours playing a game to get something that ends up being worthless (concept art, something that doesn't enhance gameplay) then I don't want it.

RPG's where the main character is a liar, and cross-dresses, and ends up being emo towards the end, and the villian ends up being nothing more than a over-hyped moma's boy with issues and a big ass sword, who kills off a main party member a third of the way into the game.....that was oddly specific.

All RPG's should have a punch in the face option for any spoken dialoge. If I have an annoying party member, I should be able to punch them in the face.

Shooters that have locked doors made of wood or glass that I can't simply shoot, or blow up.

[muteKi]

What are people opinions on random battles in RPGs?

[Thaes]

I think they are okay. They help keep the game interesting when you play it again after completing it.

[Scruffy]

Random battles can be okay.  It's just when they are every other step that it gets annoying.  I remember this one game, every time you get to a door, every time you open a chest, every time you walked along a wall or whatever,  it was you're being attacked.   
To be honest, in FF12, I wish they had random battles.  Without any surprise and being able to walk around badguys, it just wasn't as interesting.

[TheFuriousWombat]

Spawn camping

This!

[Narr]

Truly random encounters (as in the map just spontaneously enters battle, like in every FF game up to 9) are a thing of the past and unwanted.  I suppose there is something to be said about not knowing when you're going to enter battle, but considering most games that employ that style of random encounter are boring in terms of combat, then I'd rather be able to pick and choose my battles.

Games like the latest few Namco Tales games and Earthbound did it right.  Have random monters, but the battles can be avoided because the monsters have to touch you to initiate combat.

[Surgoshan]

A good article on the flaming dickwad that is gamer.

[Narr]

There's no random encounters in BG2.  O_o

Unless you consider the fights that can potentially occur while sleeping in wilderness areas?

[KvP]

There were random encounters, you just seldom, uh, encountered them. There were the pre-scripted ones (the Harper Hold quest initiation, the slavers with the red shortsword, etc.) but there were also slaver packs with something like 12-15 orogs, which is what Anyways is referring to. They were pushovers.

[Dimmukane]

I agree with the bad music part, and Anyways might also be talking about all the wilderness encounters that involved weak monsters like kobolds...

[Narr]

Those encounters aren't technically random.  They're very scripted.  Very scripted.

And again, none of them are terribly difficult because they were beatable right out the gate with a level 8/9/10 party.