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Author Topic: Lil' Columbine?  (Read 3811 times)

Jposh

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Lil' Columbine?
« on: 02 Apr 2008, 11:43 »

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Apparently being told off for standing on a chair is an offense punishable by death.
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ThePQ4

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Re: Lil' Columbine?
« Reply #1 on: 02 Apr 2008, 11:50 »

Quote
Currie said he decided to seek juvenile charges against two girls, ages 9 and 10, who brought the knife and paperweight and an 8-year-old boy who brought tape

"Yeah, I went to juvie for bringing tape to school..." What the heck? Poor kid...
Although, it's a little scary that kids that young could even begin to imagine that kind of act... I will never trust children ever again --not that I did in the first place.
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bryanthelion

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Re: Lil' Columbine?
« Reply #2 on: 02 Apr 2008, 12:00 »

Maybe the kids should be stabbed.

I mean you're supposed to sit on chairs.
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TheFuriousWombat

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Re: Lil' Columbine?
« Reply #3 on: 02 Apr 2008, 13:30 »

This freaked me the fuck out. What 8 year old decides to bash their teacher over the head with a paperweight, tie her up and stab her with old knives? These're some malicious lil buggers.
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muteKi

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Re: Lil' Columbine?
« Reply #4 on: 02 Apr 2008, 14:08 »

See? People like to make fun of kids with learning disabilities until those people realize just how good at dealing with things they're interested in they actually are.
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Verergoca

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Re: Lil' Columbine?
« Reply #5 on: 02 Apr 2008, 14:17 »

Uhm, what the fuck?

We are dealing with kids here!

a). I do not consider them to have thought this over in a reasonable fashion. I mean hell, one 8 year old kid with "clean up duty". HOW THE HELL IS HE GOING TO MANAGE THAT! With the average strength of an 8 year old, they'd need at least four to drag the body to the grave-in-the-sandbox. Also, extra long lunchbreak to prepare the grave...

That aside.

b). have you ever seen how vicious kids get when they tease/harass other kids for <minor things that set them slightly apart from the group>. VICIOUS! They dont think about the consequences, just the here and the now matters.

also.

c). ADD/other weirdness does help to break down some of the rationalisations that "normal" people have (i think, i dont have scientific evidence to set next to this statement, someone who is more interested into youths-with-learning-disabilities, help me out here)

d). How is getting kids of that age into jail going to help them? That is just asking for some pedo's to go for them. Which would make the State an accessory to the crime (what without scentencing that the kid wouldnt be there), which could lead to uhm, interesting lawsuits...

e). i need some sleeps
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a pack of wolves

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Re: Lil' Columbine?
« Reply #6 on: 02 Apr 2008, 14:38 »

Stab their goddamn parents, I say. If your kid plots to kill his teacher with a broken steak knife you've done something terribly, terribly wrong raising your kids.

Actually, giving them the snip might work too. I guess you could stab-snip them or something.

Er, these kids all had some kind of mental problem or other so condemning their parents to death and sterilisation because their children had some disturbing thoughts seems like a huge overreaction to me. And they didn't go through with anything, the weapons they brought could just as easily be seen as props in a (admittedly very morbid and worrying) group fantasy rather than something any of the kids who fully understood it would have gone through with. I'm not saying that nothing should be done about it, but I can't see what will be helped by them getting arrested. They need counselling not being locked up.
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NarwhalSunshine

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Re: Lil' Columbine?
« Reply #7 on: 02 Apr 2008, 14:44 »

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080401/ap_on_re_us/children_s_plot
Quote
A prosecutor said they are too young to be charged with a crime under Georgia law.
Quote
Children in Georgia can't be charged with a crime unless they are at least 13, District Attorney Rick Currie said.
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Cartilage Head

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Re: Lil' Columbine?
« Reply #8 on: 02 Apr 2008, 14:45 »

These kids are malicious, but not psychotic. Everyone knows that children of this age do not have morals, and their disabilities only worsen the matter.The kids sought a remedy to their problem and possibly some excitement. I hate to say it, but their plot seems to come straight from a violent movie. The parents of some of these kids were obviously exposing them, or allowing them to be exposed, to something they should not have been exposed to.
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Jposh

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Re: Lil' Columbine?
« Reply #9 on: 02 Apr 2008, 14:53 »

Uhm, what the fuck?

We are dealing with kids here!

a). I do not consider them to have thought this over in a reasonable fashion. I mean hell, one 8 year old kid with "clean up duty". HOW THE HELL IS HE GOING TO MANAGE THAT! With the average strength of an 8 year old, they'd need at least four to drag the body to the grave-in-the-sandbox. Also, extra long lunchbreak to prepare the grave...

That aside.

b). have you ever seen how vicious kids get when they tease/harass other kids for <minor things that set them slightly apart from the group>. VICIOUS! They dont think about the consequences, just the here and the now matters.

also.

c). ADD/other weirdness does help to break down some of the rationalisations that "normal" people have (i think, i dont have scientific evidence to set next to this statement, someone who is more interested into youths-with-learning-disabilities, help me out here)

d). How is getting kids of that age into jail going to help them? That is just asking for some pedo's to go for them. Which would make the State an accessory to the crime (what without scentencing that the kid wouldnt be there), which could lead to uhm, interesting lawsuits...

e). i need some sleeps

I think that they definitely put some thought into it. The article said that some of the kids were ADD kids. For the most part, ADD kids also have higher IQs. I figure the ADD kids were the leaders.

And for the clean up, they could probably cut the teacher up. It doesn't take much to saw with a serrated knife, and a 90 lb. 3rd grader could easily break bones after a but of cutting. I had read a few Poe stories by the time I was in the 3rd grade, so I could have  easily thought of just cutting the victim to pieces.

On a side note, I assume the teacher was probably a bit worse then just telling someone to step down off a chair.

Edit: Cartilage, your probably right, kids are exposed to an awful lot of violence, be it on Tv, Video Games, or Movies.
« Last Edit: 02 Apr 2008, 14:56 by Jposh »
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Re: Lil' Columbine?
« Reply #10 on: 02 Apr 2008, 15:20 »

That's an awful lot of assumption. Anyway, there's a world of difference between having some disturbing thoughts and even making some plans to carry them out and actually doing anything. The thought of cutting the teacher to pieces might have occurred, but actually going through with something like that is incredibly unlikely. Even if these kids had actually attempted this plan the most likely outcome is that they would have bottled it as soon as they got yelled at.
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thepugs

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Re: Lil' Columbine?
« Reply #11 on: 02 Apr 2008, 15:26 »

While certainly the exposure and desensitization to violence is a factor in this incident, care should be taken not to place blame on content alone.  A third grader making detailed plans of violence and attempting to carry them out raises huge red flags in my mind - whoever the particular mastermind of this was needs some serious psychological help, and definitely a social worker to ensure no abuse is present in the home.
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blanktom

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Re: Lil' Columbine?
« Reply #12 on: 02 Apr 2008, 16:16 »

the real problem is they got caught.
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Re: Lil' Columbine?
« Reply #13 on: 02 Apr 2008, 16:20 »

I was being completely serious!

Oops. Sorry, I've been on too many forums where people say those kind of things perfectly seriously.
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Re: Lil' Columbine?
« Reply #14 on: 02 Apr 2008, 16:56 »

No, that would just have been weird. Although I am now confused, but that happens a lot.
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Narr

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Re: Lil' Columbine?
« Reply #15 on: 02 Apr 2008, 17:29 »

I guarantee that even if the kids did attack the teacher, they would have scared THEMSELVES into a state of shock after violence started.  8, 9 year old kids, man.  When I was that age, seeing someone with a bloody nose was enough to make me feel ill, and I can't imagine I'm alone in those regards.

Now, I do believe they need to be held accountable to an extent (My religion believes children reach the age of responsibility at age 8), but these kids really had no idea what they were doing.
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Chrasstor

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Re: Lil' Columbine?
« Reply #16 on: 02 Apr 2008, 18:01 »

I'm still not convinced that 9 year olds could cut up a body. Average nine year old is 4'6" 70lbs. I'd have trouble cutting human bone with a steak knife. Christ sake, are you forgetting how weak you are before puberty? They obviously didn't think it all the way through, again, they're not even top notch 9 year olds ; how intricate do you suppose their plan was? I'd say, not very.

These kids are just stupid as hell, guys. I'd say I was even more diligent as a young boy than I am as a young man. Not because I knew more about punishment back then, but because, whether from my parents or otherwise, I had a conscious knowledge of wrong and right. I knew that it would be a major fuck up, and that I would be punished. Although I may not have known as much as I do today as far as academics go, I definitely fucking knew that it's a BIG mistake to kill someone. On top of that, why would I want to hurt anyone? Sure, I watched Dragon Ball, Mortal Kombat and Spawn... But I still never got into any real fights, nor did I want to hurt anyone.

It would be perplexing to figure out why average 9 year olds from decent middle-class families would do something like this. It's not as shocking to understand that a bunch of LD 9 year olds would think up a plan like this. Chances are they didn't have great parenting, either. Also, kids who have ADD severe enough to be in a separate class aren't much brighter than those with ADD.

Idiocy+Innocence+Mob Mentality=Let's kill someone, I suppose.
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SeanBateman

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Re: Lil' Columbine?
« Reply #17 on: 02 Apr 2008, 18:56 »

I mean if you are going to murder someone Waycross, Georgia is as good a place to do it as any, since I hear there is a cave that you can hide bodies in where they will never be found.


I think it is in like... Tiger Mountain?
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Ozymandias

Re: Lil' Columbine?
« Reply #18 on: 02 Apr 2008, 18:57 »

It would be perplexing to figure out why average 9 year olds from decent middle-class families would do something like this.

average 9 year olds from decent middle-class families

decent middle-class families
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a pack of wolves

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Re: Lil' Columbine?
« Reply #19 on: 02 Apr 2008, 19:05 »

I'm just curious if you guys think the parents are responsible for any of this. My first reply was a joke, but me raising the parental issue was kind of serious. I mean, parents should start imprinting into their kids that killing will send you straight to showers where dropping the soap is a major fuckup as early as possible, definitely not wait until third grade or later - or is this just a case of the kids not giving a shit about what their parents say?

I think trying to determine that is impossible. I still reckon this could just have been a very morbid little game, peculiar but harmless in the end. When I was about four my sister and I used to have elaborate executions for our teddy bears, running through whole mock trials before mercilessly dispatching them. I can imagine we might have done something similar with another kid as the victim. We would never have hurt them, but we damn well would have assembled all of the equipment to stage a good killing. I often think adults have an expectation that kids only want or should have pleasant and untroubled imaginations but that's not what I remember, death, destruction and general unpleasantness were standard things to be preoccupied with. Ghost stories and folk tales are usually very dark and that's fine, and anyone who's read a Roald Dahl novel will know children like things gruesome so I don't think them being exposed to stories that deal with murder and violence is a problem either.
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Darkbluerabbit

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Re: Lil' Columbine?
« Reply #20 on: 03 Apr 2008, 00:22 »

I was never very interested in humanized dolls, but I did play with plastic horses.  At one point, when I was about 9 years old, I created a story where one of the ponies betrayed the other ponies and was so repentant that she committed suicide by hanging herself from my bedpost.

My twisted plots had nothing to do with Jesus and Judas, as my family was not religious.   I also used to stage death scenes by smashing my grandmother's blackberries onto my chest.  My mother was not happy when it came time to do laundry.

Kids are fuckin' crazy, but they're not evil.  I came up with shit like that at a young age, and I am definitely now a pacifist. 
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IronOxide

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Re: Lil' Columbine?
« Reply #21 on: 03 Apr 2008, 03:52 »

Most kids carry out actions that are criminally prosecutable at this age. Have you never heard of a story of kids getting into a fight and breaking an arm/leg? If I'm not mistaken, that's aggravated battery, as is one kid spitting on another in many jurisdictions. Kids don't really mean to hurt people when they come up with these plots, they are just thinking of their own wants.

I am however, not going to deride the prosecutor for his actions, I strongly doubt he wants to lock these kids up in juvie, he wants to teach them a lesson, scare them a bit by bringing them down to the police station. If I'm right about his intentions, he's a pretty smart dude IMO, it can be a rather effective idea, but if I'm wrong and he actually wants to prosecute eight year olds, then he's batshit insane.
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Re: Lil' Columbine?
« Reply #22 on: 05 Apr 2008, 15:53 »

c). ADD/other weirdness does help to break down some of the rationalisations that "normal" people have (i think, i dont have scientific evidence to set next to this statement, someone who is more interested into youths-with-learning-disabilities, help me out here)


i haven't read through all the posts. so hopefully I'm not being redundant, but up until about two weeks ago I watched three kids, agred 12 11 and 7, all adopted from Russia.  The 12 year old had some severe add and just social problems, to put it generally.  But he went from seeing me as an authority figure and mentor (going so far as to call me the dad he never had) to trying literally to hit me with a hammer punching me, kicking me, spitting in my face, stabbing me with a skipole, among other things.  He oftentimes tied himself up with tape, rope, and handcuffs, and went through all sorts of "hostage" situations.  He had what I feel was a bit of a hero complex, though that Bush was a hero, that all arabs were the bad guys, watched Cops and cheeered them on etc.  He just had a completley skewed sense of reality.  Anyway what I'm getting at is the fact that he was in a normal school, but had ultra violent tendencies.  It's far from impossible for he or any kid (such as the ones in the article) to scheme a plot and get some friends to agree to help (whether or not they wouldve executed the plan is another story.)

Hope that was some okay input!
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SeanBateman

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Re: Lil' Columbine?
« Reply #23 on: 06 Apr 2008, 08:23 »

Look I made a really good Gram Parsons/Hank Snow joke in this thread and if I don't get any props for it there will be fucking murders.
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