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Author Topic: FFTA2  (Read 40514 times)

Jackie Blue

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FFTA2
« on: 24 Jun 2008, 17:21 »

What the fuck, man.  All but one of my characters died in the first battle.  I swear I'm good at these games!

At least the intro isn't excruciatingly long like the first one's was.
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Melodic

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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #1 on: 24 Jun 2008, 17:57 »

I'm unclear on whether that's a spoiler or not. Whatever, screw you for having it before me!
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Scandanavian War Machine

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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #2 on: 24 Jun 2008, 17:59 »

man i was really looking forward to playing this today...i even brought my DS to work so i could play at the end of the day when i have nothing to do (i.e. right now).
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Jackie Blue

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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #3 on: 24 Jun 2008, 18:06 »

It's not a spoiler.  I'm pretty sure you're not supposed to suck total ass in the first fight.  I just screwed up, when I replayed it things were fine.
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Storm Rider

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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #4 on: 24 Jun 2008, 18:47 »

I am about 2 hours in now and it's fun! It's basically the same as the first game, except the Judge system is less obnoxious. I don't have enough weapons yet to really play around with the jobs yet. The cool thing is that even characters that you don't send on missions earn AP, so you can just equip characters with the weapon you want them to learn something from and leave them back at the pub or whatever.

Also, if you have the original FFTA make sure you have it in the GBA slot when you start a new file. You unlock a special Clan Ability that isn't available until much later otherwise.
« Last Edit: 24 Jun 2008, 18:49 by Storm Rider »
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Melodic

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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #5 on: 24 Jun 2008, 20:17 »

I am looking forward to buying this next paycheck. I'm piss-poor now.
AND I sold the original months ago to fuel Mass Effect. Bloody hell!
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Jackie Blue

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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #6 on: 24 Jun 2008, 20:20 »

I'm slightly annoyed that the beginning of the game is almost exactly the same as the beginning of the first one.  I mean, you have access to the exact same jobs, races, equipment and abilities.  It's kind of boring for someone who's played through the first one a couple times.  Even the monsters are the same.

I'm sure it will get a lot better, but I'm disappointed that they did this for the opening.  Would have been cooler to have a few new jobs or abilities thrown at you from the start.

Also, I am seriously annoyed with the fact that every game that ever comes out now has Mandatory Tutorial.  It renders the instruction booklet useless and anyone who buys a game used without the instructions or whatever can go to gamefaqs.
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Scandanavian War Machine

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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #7 on: 24 Jun 2008, 20:46 »

yay i found a game store i didn't know about and they had it!

now, having never played the first one but being a huge fan of the first tactics, i must say i am enjoying the hell out of this so far. i'm only 2 quests deep right now but so far it's great and i can imagine it only getting better. i mean, the story is good, the characters are likeable, the combat is fun and it looks great. not to mention that having only played the original tactics, it's so wonderful to have legit translations for the dialogue.

i'm very glad i found a copy of this because i have a broken/cracked rib, a bum wrist, and all next week off work. yeah.
i don't know what i would have done with my time since being active is pretty much out and playing my 360 is out because of my wrist.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #8 on: 24 Jun 2008, 21:05 »

Oh god yes, I guess this means the English version is out.

Will grab it and waffle in here asap.
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Jackie Blue

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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #9 on: 24 Jun 2008, 21:10 »

i'm very glad i found a copy of this because i have a broken/cracked rib, a bum wrist, and all next week off work. yeah.
i don't know what i would have done with my time since being active is pretty much out and playing my 360 is out because of my wrist.

Wait, playing a 360 is harder on your wrist than a DS?   :?
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Melodic

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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #10 on: 24 Jun 2008, 22:26 »

So, did they fix the crap story and easiness? Those were my only two complaints with the first one.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #11 on: 24 Jun 2008, 22:51 »

I got it today but have not yet gotten a chance to play it. Looking forward to it.
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Jackie Blue

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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #12 on: 24 Jun 2008, 22:51 »

I slightly retract my previous complain, because as of 2 hours in, I do actually have access to a new Job.  Still, 2 hours.

Storyline?  Eh... so far it doesn't seem like it will be significantly better or more deep than the first.  I seem to recall reading somewhere that they had decided to retain FFTA's simplistic, childlike fable-story for the sequel, and as of the beginning of the game there is actually even less going on in any grand scheme of things.

Difficulty, who knows.  I personally think every grid-based 3/4 view TRPG I've played has been the same difficulty, it's just a matter of knowing how to exploit the system.  FFT, Vandal Hearts, Tactis Ogre, Disgaea, Front Mission, etc etc.  I don't expect these games to have anywhere near the difficulty of your basic Fire Emblem or Advance Wars; they're more about customisation and having a vast amount of shit to do than being a hardcore tactician.
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Storm Rider

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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #13 on: 25 Jun 2008, 00:29 »

It's not particularly difficult, but it's not very easy either. Also, I've unlocked several jobs already and I'm just starting to get enough abilities in the lower tier jobs to get some of the better ones available. Luso's still a Soldier for right now, but I'm going to switch him to Paladin as soon as I master Rend Magic. I switched the Nu Mou to Beastmaster, not because I want one, because they really kind of suck, but because he's already mastered both the Black Mage and White Mage spells available right now and if I left him in one of those jobs he'd just be sitting and not getting any AP at all. I switched the Viera to Green Mage, and as soon as she's done learning Shell I'll switch her to Fencer for a bit to unlock Red Mage, then move on to that in order to get Summoner. The Archer has been trading off between that and Thief skills, since Ranged Weapons are one of the more frequently forbidden things. The Moogle is just about done mastering the Thief weapons I have right now, so I'm going to switch him to Moogle Knight since I don't have any Tinker weapons yet.

Something really neat about this game is that you basically have to build weapons from your loot before you can buy them, similarly to how it worked in FF12. It's a simple yet clever way to keep the item progression consistent.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #14 on: 25 Jun 2008, 00:37 »

Crap, this isn't out in Englandland until friday.

And "put my FFTA cartridge in the GBA slot"? It's been in there ever since I got the DS. Favouritest game, ever.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #15 on: 25 Jun 2008, 06:37 »

So the story's subpar? I was never a big fan of the slow pace of the original Tactics' battle system and its only saving grace for me was the excellent story. Would I be correct in assuming I should probably skip this game?
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Jackie Blue

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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #16 on: 25 Jun 2008, 08:49 »

I find the concept of someone playing through FFT for the story, without liking the battle system at all, to be masochistic.  The story was good and all but if you didn't like the gameplay at all, damn.  Why not just read a dozen books in the time it took you?
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0bsessions

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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #17 on: 25 Jun 2008, 08:54 »

I was interested in the story.

That doesn't answer my question in the slightest, though...

Edit: Note, I didn't say I completely disliked it. It just didn't do much of anything for me. I liked the job system (Though I preferred it in FF V), but the battles were abysmally slow sometimes. It wasn't so painful that I couldn't muscle it out for the enjoyable story, though.
« Last Edit: 25 Jun 2008, 08:55 by 0bsessions »
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Jackie Blue

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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #18 on: 25 Jun 2008, 09:08 »

I thought it had already been made clear, but no, FFTA and (so far and by all accounts) FFTA2 don't have a deep story and are actually actively childlike and simple in plot.
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0bsessions

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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #19 on: 25 Jun 2008, 09:25 »

I'm obviously seeing that as explicitly stated. What I'm wondering is if the battles are exactly the same as the original PSX Tactics. I was able to stomache the slow pace due to the great story, but if it's the same battle system to a T, minus the fun story, I'd have to pass.
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Jackie Blue

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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #20 on: 25 Jun 2008, 09:36 »

Well you initially asked "So the story's subpar" so I was addressing that.

The battle/quest/item system in FFTA and FFTA2 is exponentially more fun and less time-intensive than the original FFT.  These are GameBoy games, after all, so drawn-out hour-long yawn-fests are Right Out.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #21 on: 25 Jun 2008, 10:51 »

Okay, that answers that a bit more satisfactorily. So does it lean more towards the battle system in Revanent Wings? If so, I can get behind that. It made for a nifty compromise between the more swift and satisfying rate of a RTS and the tedious chore that FFT's battle system often wander into.
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Storm Rider

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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #22 on: 25 Jun 2008, 13:25 »

Personally, even though this makes me a pariah in some circles, I found the original FFTA to be much more enjoyable than FFT. In fact, I think as much as I love Yazumi Matsuno's work, FFT is extremely overrated. The plot is convoluted in the same way FF7's is, and characters are killed off so quickly after being introduced that I never found myself giving a shit about any of them. The gameplay was so goddamn slow and the difficulty of individual missions shifted between insultingly easy and ball-bustingly hard randomly and without warning. The plot may have been pretty thin in FFTA, but the gameplay design was so much more streamlined that I found it so much easier to get into.

With my experiences with FFTA2 so far (about 8 hours in, for the record), the plot is lighthearted, which I think is actually quite different from the first one which was 'oh my god I want to go home my life sucks so bad', and more importantly it doesn't get in the way.

In short, if you're playing only for the plot, don't bother. But holy crap are the portable Tactics games much better than the original in terms of gameplay. And I'm sticking to that, no matter how many people threaten to burn down my house.
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0bsessions

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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #23 on: 25 Jun 2008, 13:38 »

Sold.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #24 on: 25 Jun 2008, 14:15 »

Personally, even though this makes me a pariah in some circles, I found the original FFTA to be much more enjoyable than FFT. In fact, I think as much as I love Yazumi Matsuno's work, FFT is extremely overrated. The plot is convoluted in the same way FF7's is, and characters are killed off so quickly after being introduced that I never found myself giving a shit about any of them. The gameplay was so goddamn slow and the difficulty of individual missions shifted between insultingly easy and ball-bustingly hard randomly and without warning. The plot may have been pretty thin in FFTA, but the gameplay design was so much more streamlined that I found it so much easier to get into.

I agree with this entirely. I have tried so many goddamn times to get into FFT, both the original PS1 version and the apparently superior PSP version and I just found that I couldn't bring myself to give a flying fuck about the tedious wanky overcomplicated plot. And even though I loved all the stupid amounts of levelling and character customisation in Disgaea, I just found it badly explained and confusing in FFT. The simpler approach of FFTA was loads better for me - okay, the judge/laws mechanic was stupid and could easily be broken by just travelling between pairs of cities until you got a set of laws that suited you, but generally speaking I thought it was a much better game.

That said, I love Disgaea even more, and will be buying that for a fourth time when it comes out on the DS later this year (1x PS2, 2x PSP - once in English, once in Japanese, 1x DS), and I will lose days of my life in Item World yet again.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #25 on: 25 Jun 2008, 15:54 »

I'm with you guys that enjoyed FFTA better than the original FFT.  Or rather, better than than the FFT remake on the PSP.  I played through the first FFTA when it came out and loved it quite a bit.  Several years later, as I'm staring at my PSP and wondering what to do with it, I thought it would be a good chance to go pick up the remake.  I made it through about 5 hours of the game, but just haven't been able to go back to it, I think it's probably the lengthy battles combined with unskippable cutscenes if you have to retry missions that did me in.  Of course, maybe I just don't have the stamina for these types of games anymore... only made it to disc 2 of Lost Odyssey, and stopped played the FFIII DS remake right in the middle of the final dungeon. 

Still, I'm interested in FFTA2, but since I've only just now got to ordering The World Ends With You from amazon, it might be a while...

God, and I still need to finish Ninja Gaiden 2, GTA 4, and the Neverwinter Nights expansion I stole from my friend.  Sooo much gaming ADD.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #26 on: 25 Jun 2008, 16:11 »

Ok so I am about 1 hour into the game so far, but haven't really seen much of the game.  I wish there was a way to skip all these fucking tutorials or at least speed the stupid little fuckers up when they are walking around the screen during the "cutscene" bits.  I am pretty happy with the graphical improvements over FFTA.  Other than that it's playing pretty much the same.  So far this is a good thing.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #27 on: 25 Jun 2008, 16:54 »

Darn you all and your praise for inspiring me to go drop dollars I don't really have, but I do look forward to participating in the fun! Thanks for the good comparative opinions my friends.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #28 on: 25 Jun 2008, 17:13 »

This is one of 5 fucking games I want to buy in the next 2 months and I don't have the time or money for any of them. I hate responsibilities.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #29 on: 25 Jun 2008, 23:44 »

I just unlocked the ability to use the auction house, and it's a neat little feature. Since I'm assuming I'm the furthest among all of us, since I'm unemployed and on summer vacation so I have nothing better to do, you basically bid on regions of the world map and if you win, quest fees and shop prices go down for that area, and you get random loot events on the map for that region. Through a combination of managing to grab several of the bonus tokens by being in a given place at the end of a round of bidding, and blind luck, I managed to win all 4 of the areas in the central part of the continent. So what I found out accidentally is if you win all of the areas in a given auction region at the same time, you become permanent owner of of the region and you can't lose it in the next auction period no matter what happens. So basically, I now own 8 of the 10 areas in the first continent of the game. Every other clan is my bitch.
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Jackie Blue

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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #30 on: 26 Jun 2008, 00:07 »

I wanted to love Disgaea SO HARD but honestly I ended up wanting to press Start to skip the battles and get to the next cutscene.

Totally agree that the FFTA/2 gameplay is vastly superior to the original FFT.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #31 on: 26 Jun 2008, 00:21 »

I wanted to love Disgaea SO HARD but honestly I ended up wanting to press Start to skip the battles and get to the next cutscene.

You are like the anti-me. I spent so much time levelling my characters that I never actually finished the PS2 version - it was only when I got the PSP version that I figured I should maybe actually play the game to completion rather than tooling around in item world forever.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #32 on: 27 Jun 2008, 03:56 »

I liked FFTA better than FFT gameplay-wise, I liked the story better in FFT (but I didn't like the sucker punch to the balls that the end of the game was), but the gameplay was better in TA, they streamlined it a bit and added some convenience.

I had completed maybe 290 of the missions in TA, then started a new game because I was bored of waiting around getting someone to do the dispatch missions, and I saved over the wrong slot... Need to find the cartridge if it gets me bonus stuff, though. I know it is somewhere in my room, but I haven't played my GBA in months, if not a year. It was my birthday yesterday, and while I didn't get any presents yet, I did mention wanting it to my mother a couple days ago, hopefully I get it.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #33 on: 27 Jun 2008, 10:20 »

there's so many new jobs! my mind, she is boggled.

of course, i never played FFTA so any jobs that were new then are new to me now. but still.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #34 on: 27 Jun 2008, 12:38 »

I have been playing the original like a fiend. Its the perfect game to watch tv while playing.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #35 on: 30 Jun 2008, 19:55 »

6 hours in and I just now finally got Beastmaster unlocked (and Dragoon).  It was annoying as Hell having my Nou Mu unable to learn any new skills after the four basic White/Black Mage skills, but it's cool that some of the jobs so far have been unlocked by doing missions.

One problem I had with the first that is much more pronounced with this one is: Viera.  I love them.  They are amazing.  A party of Viera in FFTA could break the game in two in seconds with Elementalist/Sniper/Assassin based parties.

But now that it's much harder to recruit new members - I haven't gotten even one new member yet - it's even harder to choose what my sole Viera should be.  Green/Red mage?  Fencer/Elementalist?  Sniper/Assassin?  Assassin/White Mage?  The choices, they are too many for one race!

Also, humans still kind of suck.  My main character is slowly getting enough skills to be a Fighter or Paladin and my other human is a rather boring Archer/Black Mage.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #36 on: 30 Jun 2008, 21:43 »

Humans are the only race that can learn Dual Wield, so they're basically the best Melee race by default. Get Luso Dual Wield ASAP and make him a Paladin with Fighter subclass and he will absolutely wreck shit. He'll do ridiculous amounts of damage and take almost none in return. On the magic side, humans are the only ones that can become Blue Mages or Seers, but you don't unlock Seers until really late. I just did the quest that unlocked the class a few minutes ago and I'm over 40 hours in. Blue Mages also aren't terribly useful until you have a Beastmaster that can control all of the enemy monsters and get them to use their most useful abilities on the person with Learn, so that you can get them reliably to use yourself. Really, the later human jobs are much better than the early ones. 

Bangaa and Viera are definitely the most varied races, and Nu Mou are good at what they do (magic) and pretty much nothing else. To be honest, the Nu Mou have kind of disappointed me because their good abilities are spread out between all of their classes so it's difficult to get a build that I feel maxes out their potential. I have mine as a Time Mage with a Black Mage subclass right now, because Haste and Stop are damn useful, but that way I'm limited to fire/ice/lightning attack spells. I only have one Gria so far and I haven't even unlocked all of their classes yet, so I can't really assess how good they are at this point.

The two races I don't think are very good at all are Moogles and Seeqs. Gunners aren't nearly as useful anymore, because maps are bigger now, they do less damage, and the status effects seem to trigger less often. The flintlock class I think kind of sucks, because they need to take a turn to prime before they can even use any of their abilities, their curative ability isn't nearly as useful as a dedicated healer, and their abilities cannot be used as a subclass because they require the handcannon weapon equipped to use. Everything else is just inferior to other races. Seeqs only have four classes, three of which are done better by other races, and the fourth (Ranger) is a gimmick because using traps against your enemy is based almost entirely on luck.

Basically, my opinions on optimal races for archetypes:

Melee: Human (aforementioned Paladin/Fighter with Dual Wield), Bangaa (Templar/Dragoon or Master Monk/something else), and maybe Gria (don't know for sure until I unlock Raptor)
Long-range Attacker: Viera (Assassin/Sniper), Bangaa (Cannoneer/Trickster), and maybe Gria (Hunter/Geomancer, but I haven't unlocked the latter so I don't know how useful those abilities are)
Healer: Viera (White Mage is the most obvious, of course, but Elementalists and Summoners have healing abilities as well, and you can choose almost anything as the second class)
Attack Mage: Nu Mou (any two except Arcanist and Illusionist, those kind of suck imo), Viera (Elementalist/Summoner, not as good for damage but great damage/status effect spells for very little MP), maybe Humans depending on how good the Seer class is
Support Magic: Nu Mou (Time Mage/something), Viera (Green Mage/something)

When you want to get into hybrid classes, you can obviously experiment a lot more. In terms of useful classes to crappy classes, I agree that Viera are the best, although Bangaa are a close second. However, Humans are really the best melee race, because nobody else can dual wield, and Paladins have great stat growths for dealing and taking damage. I'm sort of iffy on Nu Mou, and I can't really gauge Gria yet, but I will definitely suggest staying away from Moogles and Seeqs, because they aren't worth the trouble.
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jeph

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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #37 on: 30 Jun 2008, 23:07 »

oh god i need this so bad

The original FFT was ridiculously hard until you got that one super-badass swordsman dude (whose name I forget). Then it became a cakewalk.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #38 on: 30 Jun 2008, 23:43 »

Viera aren't the best melee class, for sure, but who needs high damage when you have insta-kill attacks?
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #39 on: 01 Jul 2008, 00:34 »

I don't know. I just can't convince myself the game is worth the money because I find that no matter how much more awesome I think an SRPG will be than all the others I've ever played, they all turn out just about the same in the end. And it's not like the story is a huge selling point (at least, not huge enough to justify $40). Every time I try I eventually decide I'd rather wait and spend that money on the FFIV remake.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #40 on: 01 Jul 2008, 01:20 »

Viera aren't the best melee class, for sure, but who needs high damage when you have insta-kill attacks?


Because late game accessories null that. There's no magical ribbon that can protect you from a sword to the face.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #41 on: 01 Jul 2008, 10:16 »

So about how far into the game does it take to get a Gria?  They're cute.  I want one.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #42 on: 01 Jul 2008, 11:56 »

You have to take the airship to the second continent, and then they show up for recruitment at the same time as seeqs, only around the hub city there. Where that is in terms of game time, it depends on how quickly you proceed with the story missions as opposed to just fucking around with sidequests, because I did just about every sidequest available before proceeding with the next story mission so I didn't get one for quite a long time.

One cool thing about Gria is that they have the innate ignore elevation trait, so you don't have to slap Faerie Shoes on them for that. That frees up an inventory slot that they can put a useful accessory in like a Ribbon or Crimson Tear or something.
« Last Edit: 01 Jul 2008, 12:01 by Storm Rider »
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #43 on: 01 Jul 2008, 12:06 »

Damn.  I too am obsessed with doing every available sidequest before continuing the main story.

I am currently amused by the fact that Green Mages use giant honking hammers.  A cute little Viera whomping on things is pretty rad.  I would watch an anime based on that concept (kind of like The Beating-to-Death Angel Daruchan).
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #44 on: 01 Jul 2008, 17:09 »

You just succinctly explained my problem with every single relatively open-ended game ever.  I mean, I love them to death, I just have side-quest completion OCD or someshit.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #45 on: 01 Jul 2008, 20:28 »

I broke down and bought this last weekend... along with The World Ends With You and Persona 3: FES.  I think I have a problem.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #46 on: 01 Jul 2008, 20:37 »

Just bought it this afternoon. The tutorial is goddamn endless, but after that it's smooth sailing. The main character looks like the girl from Big Comfy Couch with better hair, though.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #47 on: 01 Jul 2008, 20:52 »

Jeph: TG Cid?

Now, assuming that Viera are similar to TA, I liked the insta-death abilities of the assassin, but they were too unreliable, a good high-end dual-wielding human was more efficient, fighters and ninjas both could usually take out an opponent in a round. The assassin was fun, but not as reliable as a couple 120 damage hits. Gunners were also pretty reliable for when you need something dead right now, assuming you got them ultima charge.

I still need to get the new game, I played about 13 hours of the old one last weekend.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #48 on: 01 Jul 2008, 22:46 »

Viera had other insta-kill things that weren't literally insta-kill.  They had/have insta-stoning, paralysis (which is as good as insta-kill in most cases), Blindness, Can't Move, Can't Use Actions, etc.  Most of those hit reliably from the back or side IIRC.
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Re: FFTA2
« Reply #49 on: 02 Jul 2008, 00:28 »

Yeh, but it's not as effective as, say, a human with dual-wield. My original FFTA main character was a Paladin loaded with two blades and some nasty fighter specs. He could kill anything in one move, then heal the entire team. Outclassed all of my Viera.
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