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[Statik]

Preface - sorry for starting (another) new thread, but it didn't really seem appropriate to necro the previous thread on the creature creator.

Aussies broke the street date on spore, and about 48 hrs later, it was cracked and on many many torrent sites.

First thoughts: Ill be buying it.  The potential for custom player content is too tempting, and too awesome to ignore.

Second thoughts:  My brother and I both started playing, I made a carnivore, and he made a herbivore.  The initial stages go pretty quick, not many parts to play with, you unlock things by finding them/killing for them.  I had the ability to attack things with my jaws, whereas my brother found it advantageous to have multiple mouths (mouthes?).  Both of us had spikes and such for defense.  The first stage (at least as a carnivore) plays a lot like flOw.  Filling up your XP *ahem* DNA bar, you finally evolve enough to grow legs, and move on to land.

Neither me or my brother found it as immediately intuitive as SimCity/Sims, but it didn't take long to figure out how to move my little dude around, dance, sing, mate, etc.   


Other stuff:
One thing I found nice was that you can just go into creator mode from the main menu, where you have everything unlocked, and just create stuff.  Comparatively, in single player, you have to find or harvest parts in order to be able to use them on your creature.

Final thoughts:  If you have doubts on liking it or not, its around on the internets, check it out.  Also, if you like it, please buy the game.  Originality should be supported.

[Surgoshan]

First thoughts: I'd like to buy it, but my computer can't handle it.

Second thoughts:  I'd like to buy it, but fuck EA.  I won't willingly put that DRM Shit on my PC.

Third thoughts:  Now I want to steal it because of that DRM shit.

[Boro_Bandito]

Honestly, I have no problem waiting a couple of days for the game to come out to play it, I'm going to buy it either way. Also, what's up with the DRM thing? I mean, does it really cause harm to your computer?

[Melodic]

SecuROM shows up as a rootkit, I think it is. It's a shitty piece of software, to be sure.

[Surgoshan]

It's like buying a virus.

[Dimmukane]

In this instance, they're using something similar to what they did with Mass Effect, I think.

I originally had money on this, but I'm running out of money (Statik, you know why), so I'm gonna cancel the pre-order.  I think it'll be a fun game, for sure, but I get the feeling I'm not gonna have as much time to play games this semester, so I'm only buying the games at the top of the list.  I'll come back to the ones I missed over winter break.

I'm somewhat tempted to just download the game and mail them a check instead, though.  They deserve the money, but the anti-piracy measures that some companies are taking is getting ridiculous.

[numb3rb0y]

The DRM is pretty crushing. You get three installs, and uninstalling doesn't top up that total. If you swap out any internal hardware it counts as an extra install, and you have to call EA tech support to get them to reset your total, assuming they're willing to.

Suffice it to say I won't spend my money on something so damned authoritarian. It pisses me off to no end since I've been looking forward to this game for years, I'm not about to reward EA for crippling legitimate users when the pirates have already broken the DRM.

[Dimmukane]

In all honesty, I think that's what I'm going to do.  I'm going to pirate the game and mail them a check for 50$.  Not going to get it for a few months, at any rate, I've got a lot on my plate.  I've been playing Too Human more than is probably healthy, and it'd probably get more attention from me than Spore would, so I'm going to wait.

[Statik]

Well, I already have the DRM stripped version on my computer, and I might just reinstall from the crack with my legit serial once I purchase it.

Also, my brother has advanced in the game farther than me (Damn my need to shoot people in their faces!), and has gotten to the world uniting/conquering stages of the game, when you have to make multiple types of vehicles / buildings / etc. 

Still seems to hold together well, I think the game will be even more interesting a couple months down the road when hundreds or thousands of people have made different creatures / buildings / vehicles / etc.

I honestly hope the whole less-than-48hrs-cracked-and-on-the-net will be a giant wake up call to EA and other big publishers that programs like SecuROM quite simply DO NOT WORK.  How often does a shitty copy protection scheme need to be utterly destroyed in order to prove its worthlessness? 

Back on topic, I spent about 2 hours last night just making tanks and boats and such, the creator is almost as much fun as the game itself, I can't wait to see what people do with it.

[KvP]

Word of mouth around the sites I frequent has been overwhelmingly negative. The word of the day is "shallow". I haven't played it yet, but the incredibly narrow range of actions you could make your creature undertake in the creator worried me. Looks like I may have been right.

[Roivas]

When IGN tells me a game lacks depth I tend to take this as a sign of the end times. Plus I don't much care for buying a game that treats my computer the way EA thinks they can. If they strip the DRM and switch to a digital watermark I'll reconsider but for now?

FUCK EA.

I don't want them to stop shelling out money for big budget experimental games but they've failed to prove Spore is anything more than a creature editor with some random minigames tossed in to give the creatures something to do.

[Statik]

If spore is shallow, then apparently HALO is little more than a melted snowflake on an acre of blacktop.

There is definitely less person to person (creature to creature) interaction options than something like Sims2, but its not supposed to be the Sims.  Its Black&White meets the Sims, meets SimCity, meets Impossible Creatures, and so on and so forth.  I think the game is a lot deeper than people give it credit when they are forced to do a super quick playthrough.  Also, a problem exists for reviewers:  No custom content exists yet, as it needs to be created by the community.  Of which, I assume there will be an insane amount of stuff made in the next month or so.

I'd still highly recommend trying it out.

Also, when did we start listening to IGN?

[KvP]

I didn't read the IGN review. I'm just wary (and I'm right to be) when a game boasts vastly more depth in its content creation than it does in its content application. Sure, you can create fuckin' gothic cathedrals and persian palaces in Second Life, with pretty impressive detail. But Second Life is also boring as shit.

[Storm Rider]

Didn't EA take SecuROM out of Spore and Mass Effect? I could have sworn they said they were going to a few weeks ago.

[Surgoshan]

Securom ain't the only DRM out there.  Three installs is all you get.  Ever.

[Melodic]

I am so fucking sick of this "fuck EA" stuff.

SecuROM was scaled back tremendously in its strictness months ago. Severely scaled back, as anyone who played Mass Effect for the PC knows.

Changing out "any internal hardware" is totally inaccurate, as well. Replacing most of the guts of a PC won't set you back an install, and the only parts that will trigger it are ones in which you'd have to reinstall the game anyways.

Three installs is not all you get, ever. Although I admit that the system is long-winded, calling EA will almost guarantee another install, excluding the possibilities that you distributed your key/software to others. Blaming hardware changes, hardware failures, or a new PC will net you more installs.


Also, since when did everyone start using the f-bomb over a game that they haven't even played yet? Most of the negative posts here have been by people who haven't had their hands on the final copy. Half of this thread is "fuck EA, fuck DRM" nonsense that I'd expect on other forums, not here. None of the reviews mention user-created content, procedural programming, which is typical of sites that focus on getting the first review posted as quickly as possible, that are also immune to the cool features that Wright discussed originally in Germany.

Pardon me for defending a gaming giant, but dayumn.

[Surgoshan]

Why should I have to call EA for permission to use the game?  By going out and purchasing the game, I've purchased permission to use the game.  EA isn't my mommy.  I'm not 12.  I don't need permission to play my game. 

Fuck DRM.  Whether it's EA or Sony or your next door neighbor, fuck DRM.

[Ozymandias]

I have to side with Melodic.

When did the gaming community become such petulant assholes they they have to throw a tantrum and steal when the industry is trying to find ways to have people not steal their games? Why is it fair to punish the developers and programmers and artists who have worked ridiculously hard to make this game for, what, the past 4-5 years because they disagree with a business decision from the publisher?

It's like when the HD-DVD key was cracked and posted on Digg, the owner of Digg was threatened with lawsuits and removed it, and the entire community repelled and started posting it over and over again. Way to fucking go, assholes, you threaten a man's livelihood while not putting yourself into any possible danger at all and putting forth no effort. Just a rebellious nerdrage because your actions will never come back to haunt you, it'll just punish innocent people.

[Dimmukane]

DE-FENCE

If it were a number like at least 5 installs, I would not have a problem with the DRM.  I just think 3 is a bit limiting, and as I said, I'm waiting until I have the time and money first anyways.  In all seriousness, though, who would I make the check out to?  EA?  Right now I'm completely split on what I should do when I do come across the money.  I could buy the legit version, get the DRM, but EA loses some profit to EB.  I could get the cracked version, no DRM, limited functionality (apparently the cracked copy only supports 1024x768 and no AA), EA gets the full $53.00 (sales tax in my state).   Can somebody offer a second opinion?

I do intend to pay that much whenever I get it, which may not be for another 4 months.

Melodic, if you could work your magic and maybe get them to increase the amount of installs a bit, I would buy the legit version of the game.



To clarify, in light of John's post, I am going to pay for this game before it is installed on my computer, one way or another.  I am as disgusted that it was cracked 3 days early as anyone on the team.  I just can't decide how to pay them.

[Melodic]

Sorry mate, my "magic" only extends to DICE at the moment.

I don't approve of DRM. I think studios like Bethesda have proven than even without DRM, a product can be so astoundingly well-done that pirating isn't a factor. That being said, however, you have to seriously consider what position producers and, to some extent, developers are put in when releasing a game. We don't revolt at the thought of Walmart putting theft detection thingies at the door, and while I understand the DRM we're talking about is much more restrictive than that, you can't just say "fuck DRM".

Perhaps more accurately, if you're looking for a bike, you can't get mad at somebody for having the bike chained up when you go to look at it. It's not a personal insult that it's locked, just a statement that the world is full of assholes. Saying "fuck the lock!", breaking it with wirecutters and making off with the bike isn't a mature or even reasonable course of action, no matter how easy it is to do. You can't take it as a bloody insult that he's locked up the bike, and NOT buying the bike because the owner is cautious is silly. Stubborn, even.

Despite my feelings on the subject, it is not so much the discussion about DRM here that makes me rant but the fact that half of the posts have been plain rude. Fuck EA, fuck Maxis, fuck DRM, fuck SecuROM, fuck the game. This forum is definitely above that.

[ackblom12]

I agree people have been getting a bit too bitchy in here, but i think a better example would be the bike shop owner putting a anti-theft device inside the bike that has to be reactivated every once in a while, otherwise the bike stops working.

Either way, I'm enjoying the hell out of Spore right now and I'm quite loking forward to buying it in a couple of days.

[parm]

I had a bit of a play around last night. Yes, it's shallow, in the early stages at least, in that the gameplay is fairly lightweight - but then, this isn't about the gameplay in the traditional sense of the word; it's more about exploration and creativity and that, and that part of the game is really well done. The whole thing looks wonderful; it's really charming and all the creatures you create and meet are adorably characterful. There's clearly some really bloody clever tech in this thing, too.

I do worry slightly about the long-term appeal of the game - I've not got to the galactic domination part of the game yet, and I understand the scope explodes somewhat when you get there, but given that this is pushing really hard to be a Sims-style success I can't help wondering if there needs to be more of a sandboxy type affair somewhere. Anyway, it's fun so far, so long as you're not expecting each of the five stages to be as deep as the genre of game they're based on.

[Statik]

Couple of side notes, as I really don't want this thread to devolve into some sort of OMG FUCK EA BLAH BLAH BLOO BLAH DRM SUX BLAH BLAH 3 INSTALLS.

First up:  3 installs.  Honestly, most people PROBABLY won't hit that much, do you really change your hardware enough to make this an issue?  By the time I significantly upgrade my hardware, I highly doubt that I'll still be playing spore.  Granted, things like computer meltdowns and such happen, but really?  Is this a concern?

Additionally, 3 installs, while it is a "hard" limit, EA has already gone on record and said that they would unlock more installs on a case by case basis.  Stop acting like EA is made of all that is Al Pacino in Devil's Advocate.  They aren't evil for the sake of being evil, despite what many of you would like to believe.  They are a business, and they are attempting to protect their products.


Secondly: DRM.  I have no problem with companies attempting to secure their products.  Gamers flat out demand cutting edge graphics and entertainment.  This isn't cheap.  I don't fault companies for attempting to protect this property from the GENERAL POPULATION.  No copy protection exists that cannot be broken, but with the ease of use of programs nowadays, they want to restrict the general copying for friends.  I understand and appreciate the concerns about rootkit DRMs, and I think its the wrong way to go for copy protection, but the companies need something.

If you want to discuss the problems with DRM and copy protection, or just trash on EA some more, please take it to a different thread.


Back on topic, I finally decided to stop messing around in the creator and actually play the game, and I got enough XP/DNA to move on to the tribal area (meanwhile my brother is already terraforming planets for colonization).  Something I can recommend to you, if you play it.  After you get to the point when you can evolve to the Tribal stage, take some time running around collecting parts from kills / friends / skeletons.  It will allow you more customization as far as skills and abilities (and looks as well).  I spent about 30 minutes or so just killing and befriending things for parts.  Advancing to the tribal stage is the point in which the "look" of your creature matters, as you won't be changing it from that point on.

Also, a tip from what I learned about befriending other species:  If you want to befriend things, it helps A LOT to have other groups in your "pack" or whatever its called.  Trying to befriend something when you are by yourself and you probably will not succeed.  Also, make sure you have all four social skills (Sing, Dance, Charm, Pose) as that will help you as well, even if they are all level one.

Early on, don't worry so much about looks, if you have 3/4 attack skills (I don't think "spit" is particularly useful, at least not for a carnivore), and all four social skills, you should do fairly well.  Also, sprint is very very useful, especially if you need to get away from one of the epic monsters.

Finally:  Doubling up on skill granting items does not benefit your abilities, if you have two items that grant the skill "charge" then only the higher level one will "count."  (ie: horns that grant charge level 1, and feet that grant charge level 2, only the level 2 ones count, and removing the horns will not affect your charge ability at all)

[Alphalpha]

I am severely looking forward to this game, although at the moment my video card would probably explode if I tried anything more detailed than Zoo Tycoon on it, and it doesn't play that very well as it is. Unfortunately I use a laptop so I can't swap it. I guess I'll just have to get a new computer! What a shame.

I don't get why people are saying the game is shallow. As you progress it unfolds exponentially! The space-roaming stage is galaxies wide, just think of all the possibilities.

[Dimmukane]

I guess 3 installs is pretty reasonable.  It'll still have to wait a few months, though, I just don't can't do it right now.

[ackblom12]

I think the point is not whether or not the number of installs is reasonable, but whether or not you should have to have someone reset the password on the digital lock on the game you legally purchased in the first place.

Requiring you to have a serial to download patches and use expansions with the game? Definitely a good idea. Telling your customers that they aren't allowed to use their product, within the bounds of the law, as they see fit? Not a big fan.

Edit: DURRRR, other thread.

[Roivas]

Okay deleted post now.

So that EA company makes video games now?

[JD]

http://antispore.com/

Will Wright is clearly evil and will mislead you in your god-loving ways.

[ackblom12]

Oh bloggers, thinking they matter and such. It's almost cute.

[sean]

Man, I am having trouble believe that site is not some joke. I really am. It almost comes across as dead pan humor.

[Melodic]

I want to be able to say "TOTALLY a joke, lololol", but my faith in humanity is about 0 right now.

[KvP]

So does anybody have any thoughts on the actual game? AFAIC, Cell stage is simple, creature stage is fun, tribal stage is godawful, civ stage is alright but overlong, and space stage is where the meat of the game is, but most of the fun is in terraforming.

[benji]

HAVE YOU TAKEN YOUR JESUS PILL TODAY?

MAKE SURE YOU GET ENOUGH JESUS IN YOU

All I could think of was Jesus giving bad pickup lines: Hey babe, got any Jesus in you? Want some?

That blog has so much bad theology, science, and general information in it, it's ludicrous. My inner minister is crying right now.

As for the game itself, I haven't played yet. I'm still going to get it, maybe this weekend, but it sounds like there's some good and some bad in it. I don't mind that design is one of the biggest elements of game, I like games that are more creative then challenging sometimes.

[Scandanavian War Machine]

you might be a little disapointed with the tribal and civilization stages but everything becomes worth it when you get to the space stage.

i just got into space last night and it's pretty amazing.

[KvP]

I don't mind that design is one of the biggest elements of game

Well that's just it - all the design is in the Space stage of the game. Everything else plays like a browser app. It wouldn't be a problem if the Space stage didn't get all of its variable bonuses from the previous stages.

[Jesus Christ]

Considering the fact that I am my father, who is omnipresent, technically, everyone has got enough Jesus in them.

Especially the ladies.

[The extra letter]

I got the game yesterday and after losing a good 4 or 5 hours, I can say that I really like the game. I'm up to the tribal stage which seems a bit... shaky, but the cell and creature stages were a whole bucketload of fun.

There are a few things I'm a bit disappointed with (aquatic stage, how I wish you were here), but so far I'm really impressed.

[KvP]

I don't mind that design is one of the biggest elements of game

Well that's just it - all the design is in the Space stage of the game. Everything else plays like a browser app. It wouldn't be a problem if the Space stage didn't get all of its variable bonuses from the previous stages.

(I don't think I said that)

You say whatever I say you say, says I.

[Scandanavian War Machine]

I got the game yesterday and after losing a good 4 or 5 hours, I can say that I really like the game. I'm up to the tribal stage which seems a bit... shaky, but the cell and creature stages were a whole bucketload of fun.

There are a few things I'm a bit disappointed with (aquatic stage, how I wish you were here), but so far I'm really impressed.

i completely agree, but the weak tribal and civilization stages are more than made up for by the fucking awesome space stage. just keep on truckin and it'll all become clear.

and yeah, where the fuck is the aquatic stage? that'd be fucking sweet, albeit terrifying. Spore 2 maybe? or a future expansion?

[Scandanavian War Machine]

i am so fucking frustrated with Space right now. everything was going fine for a while: all the species i encountered were friendly and eager to establish trade routes and i even ended up buying a couple star systems because i was rolling so deep in dough.

but now, all i seem to meet are hostile species who instantly declare war on me for no reason and i can't do shit because every time i leave my home system, it gets attacked by someone and all the planets i've terraformed and colonized have been stolen from me.

it wouldn't be so bad if my spaceship actually stood a chance in a fight, but it's completely useless and i don't have any decent upgrades available to me. even if i did, i wouldn't be able to afford them because i now have one colony on one planet and everyone hates me.

what am i suppoed to do?!

[Boro_Bandito]

Oh man, I'm in love with this game so much. My spaceship is powerful, I have four allies, I've utterly obliterated three enemies, my ship rocks and has max health,energy, and most weapons, I just finished establishing three colonies in a star system that has green,blue and pink spice which has already given me like 8 million sporebucks, add that to my other colonies and the three ones that I've bought from allies and I'm up to like 20.

I ended up buying the legal copy after a few days of playing the pirate just because I wanted downloadable content from my buddies from CC. I decided that I really don't give a shit about the DRM, not enough to not buy it, and I'm not disappointed, hell I bought the Galactic edition.

I don't really mind the tribal stage all that much, though it does seem to be as shallow as the cell stage but it isn't terrible, it just takes about 20 minutes to get through and then onto global and galactic domination. it actually took me a while to figure out in Civ stage that your city is going to be the primary source of income (the quick tutorial at the beginning focuses on the spice so much) that i didn't even really know what the factories were for and so I died a couple times and got frustrated until I finally realized what I was doing wrong and hit myself on the head for it, then all of a sudden the Civ stage was a lot more fun.

Also, fucking Grox. I get a mission to make contact with them and I spend 20 minutes to get to the center to find out they own ALL of it. Like, there's gotta be 500 stars if there's one if where I started running into their territory had any meaning to it.

[Scandanavian War Machine]

http://antispore.com/

you guys were right. It really was a joke, after all!

link

[sean]

oh man I am so proud of myself.

[Spluff]

I think the funniest part is how all the outraged people in the comments section still don't get it. It shows how most people won't even listen to your arguments before dismissing them.

[The extra letter]

I can see what people mean about the space stage, now.

I played through the tribal stage again from scratch, still hated it.

The civilization stage blew my pants off. I think I spent an hour designing my tank, then a fair while designing everything else, too. The ability to customize everything is pants-soilingly awesome. It's like LEGO, but not.

Got to the space stage and lost a good 6 hours just toolin' around. The ship-to-ship combat is a bit iffy, but it's still early days for me in the game yet.

It's almost making up for the lack of the aquatic stage.

[JD]

Haw haw spore has a 1 star rating on amazon.
 http://www.amazon.com/Spore-Mac/dp/B000FKBCX4/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=videogames&qid=1221249769&sr=8-1

[Melodic]

The number of geeks it took to average out the 1 star rating will depress me, once learned.

[Dimmukane]

I thought it was reset, though.

[Melodic]

Was. Apparently it was a mistake by Amazon when they deleted the reviews, and now they're back up in full whining glory.

[JD]

Interesting tidbit from a game developer

http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2008/sep/11/games.piracy1