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Author Topic: Have You Forgotten?  (Read 27044 times)

KvP

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Have You Forgotten?
« on: 12 Sep 2009, 13:13 »

I have a question and I know y'all have it too.

Do you remember 9/12/2001? Think for a moment of how it was back then. The day after 9/11, we stopped thinking about Red States and Blue States. We stopped thinking about Republicans and Democrats. Do you remember when America came together? Do you remember that day? Do you remember when you were struck with a fear of brown people, an even more profound fear than you, as a right-minded American, already naturally possessed? Remember when you dropped a dime on your neighbors from India because they spent large stretches of the day indoors and never told you what they were doing? Remember that guy's name? Ali? What kind of a name is that? That didn't sound very American to you. You knew with a name like that he couldn't be grateful to you and your forebears who came to this land and made it into a Great Nation for them. Why didn't he love your country? Why did he wear that ridiculous hat? People who love Jesus don't wear silly hats. Remember Melissa, who had that accent? She said she was from Australia but now that America was under attack you weren't so sure if Australia was really our friend. Remember when we baked cakes? And went to church?

Why can't we have that again?

Join us, and together we can make it a reality again.

« Last Edit: 12 Sep 2009, 13:25 by KvP »
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WriterofAllWrongs

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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #1 on: 12 Sep 2009, 13:15 »

OBAMA WANTS TO LEGALIZE A DEATH PANEL TO KILL MY GRANDPA.
« Last Edit: 12 Sep 2009, 13:23 by WriterofAllWrongs »
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #2 on: 12 Sep 2009, 13:26 »

dude I don't think that Eagle looks sad enough.
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jhocking

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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #3 on: 12 Sep 2009, 13:30 »

stupid crying eagle picture

Whenever I see a picture with the tear coming out of the wrong side of the eye (and it is often, people who paint crying eagles are not smart folk) it annoys me so much.  Damn thing looks like an anime characters who's nervous.

WriterofAllWrongs

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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #4 on: 12 Sep 2009, 13:34 »

dude I don't think that Eagle looks sad enough.

He's practically smirking.  It's like he's hitting on some lady eagle, right?  And then BAM, someone's cutting onions.  Eagle's so damn cool he don't even blink.  He just keeps on trying to fuck a lady eagle.

That's what America means to me.
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Johnny C

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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #5 on: 12 Sep 2009, 13:58 »

oh dear.
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #6 on: 12 Sep 2009, 14:03 »

Get outta here, you maple syrup chugging canuck. This ain't FOR you, okay?

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Tom

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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #7 on: 12 Sep 2009, 14:07 »

Puss-say
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michaelicious

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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #8 on: 12 Sep 2009, 14:23 »

September 12th, 2001 was my second day of high school. In religion class my friend Jenn bet me two dollars I couldn't guess what book she had the Bible open to. I guessed Amos and was correct. She never gave me the two dollars.
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Slick

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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #9 on: 12 Sep 2009, 15:04 »

Glenn Beck is a foul useless human being.
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #10 on: 12 Sep 2009, 15:13 »

Quote
James Beam says:
September 12, 2009 at 7:34 PM
Great principles, but obfuscated in the wording. Let’s rephrase :

1. I vote for a balanced budget only while the Democrats are in office. While the Republicans are in office, I didn’t object to squandering the Clintion surplus on tax cuts for the wealthiest, and a needless and damaging war with Iraq.

2. I oppose all tax increases… especially tax increases that might help us balance the budget as in #1.

3. I believe we should allow oil & gas corporations should have a free for all on mineral extraction in this country, despite environmental concerns, and despite the reality that the oil reserves left in this country are too negligible to have an effect on gas prices or our dependence on foreign oil.

4. I will not get my car washed by illegal immigrants. I will not hire illegal immigrants to clean my house. I will not buy fruit picked by illegal immigrants. I will not eat in restaurants with illegal immigrant busboys. I will not support a temporary guest worker plan to give some of these immigrants a legal way to work here. I will not allow illegal immigrants to buy health insurance under the Obama plan, because we’d rather just treat them for free in the E.R. like we do now.

4b The UN has no power over us. America can do no wrong and is above the law, and does not need to abide by the standards we expect of other nations.

5. America really is the greatest country on earth, and even with my head buried so far up my backside I can see that!
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JD

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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #11 on: 12 Sep 2009, 15:42 »

America can do no wrong and is above the law hurr durr derp

Oh hey while I'm at it
« Last Edit: 12 Sep 2009, 15:51 by Zombiedude »
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #12 on: 12 Sep 2009, 15:57 »

You're welcome
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #13 on: 12 Sep 2009, 17:31 »

I am such a loser because all I can do is.

Come on guys :c
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #14 on: 12 Sep 2009, 23:24 »

I actually had forgotten how bad Muse are until you just reminded me.

The new track sounds like Queen would sound to a baby having an abortion.
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #15 on: 12 Sep 2009, 23:47 »

I heard Glenn Beck say a Star Wars analogy to something about government or something else he hates for about 15 minutes straight on the radio the other day.  It was one of the dammed nerdiest things I've ever heard from a right wing political pundit, and I was mesmerized.  Then I realized I was still listening to Glenn Beck...

ALSO, I HAVE STRONG FEELINGS ABOUT NINE 'LEVEN.
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #16 on: 13 Sep 2009, 00:13 »

a baby having an abortion.


Can we all just focus on this for a minute?

A baby having an abortion.
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #17 on: 13 Sep 2009, 06:56 »

Man, freedom of choice means freedom of choice for everyone. Who are you to say that one person is allowed to have an abortion and another isn't just because of their age, or race, or religion, or wealth?

Only the OBAMA DEATH SQUADS can do that.
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #18 on: 13 Sep 2009, 09:38 »

Glenn Beck reveals his love for art analysis: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xWL-pfCao-U
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #19 on: 13 Sep 2009, 10:48 »

Can we all just focus on this for a minute?

A baby having an abortion.

I was well aware of what I was typing when I was typing it.
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KvP

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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #20 on: 13 Sep 2009, 11:22 »

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WriterofAllWrongs

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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #21 on: 13 Sep 2009, 12:29 »

Glenn Beck reveals his love for art analysis: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xWL-pfCao-U

For fuck's sake, when did the Red Scare get a revivalist movement?


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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #23 on: 13 Sep 2009, 16:06 »

I think Van Jones stepped down because he had publicly signed a Truther petition. Chances are the petition was altered after signatures were collected (classic Truther move) but I think it was that more than anything.
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #24 on: 13 Sep 2009, 16:21 »

Real America - a photo gallery
Little Capitalist Kid

I read that as "The Cure for Obama Communism is an Era of McCartneyism". I was a bit confused.
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #25 on: 13 Sep 2009, 19:04 »

I think Van Jones stepped down because he had publicly signed a Truther petition. Chances are the petition was altered after signatures were collected (classic Truther move) but I think it was that more than anything.

I had this weird moment at work the other night where I was shaking pretty badly cause I hadn't eaten anything and I was hungover and this guy says "hey you're a shaker aren't you"

I step back and ask him what the hell he's talking about

"you know, a shaker, you shake pretty badly"

anyway I proceeded to talk to this dude for a little while and apparently it's got a lot to do with vitamin B12 deficiency or something but my point is it was really weird to hear a problem I've had my entire life given a catchy name like that.

What I am saying is I wonder if 'truthers' ever get same weird existential moment when people call them that
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WriterofAllWrongs

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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #26 on: 13 Sep 2009, 20:17 »

Glenn Beck reveals his love for art analysis: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xWL-pfCao-U
For fuck's sake, when did the Red Scare get a revivalist movement?

And it's thanks to smear like that that Van Jones stepped down. Your country insists on fucking itself and everyone else over.

Erm, just a second.  There are a lot of folks within the system of our country that are trying to clear up the messes that people like Glenn Beck and Ann Coulter make.  They aren't really representative of the whole.  I'm not trying to get all confrontational about MY AMURIKA HURR, that's just a bit of a rude thing to say.
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Bastardous Bassist

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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #27 on: 13 Sep 2009, 20:18 »

A rude and ignorant thing to say.
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JD

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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #28 on: 13 Sep 2009, 20:19 »

Every country fucks them self over at some point. Take Canada and Jean Chrétien for instance.
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #29 on: 13 Sep 2009, 20:21 »

Hey! I liked Jean Chrétien!
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #30 on: 13 Sep 2009, 21:26 »

9/11 just pissed me off because they aired the news instead of my cartoons.
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #31 on: 13 Sep 2009, 21:29 »

so... flying sure has sucked since 9/11 huh guys?
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #32 on: 14 Sep 2009, 02:53 »

Oh, you kidder. Damn it Tom

Anyway, apparently there's some stirrings over there that the "you liar" comment from Congressman whomever during Obama Satan's congress address must've been racially motivated and not because he's just a guy who didn't think out his conduct in Congress very well at all when an issue that he evidently strongly disagreed with was raised.
« Last Edit: 14 Sep 2009, 05:30 by look out! Ninjas! »
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #33 on: 14 Sep 2009, 02:58 »



holy shit I literally want this woman to die
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Beren

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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #34 on: 14 Sep 2009, 03:04 »

I think Van Jones stepped down because he had publicly signed a Truther petition. Chances are the petition was altered after signatures were collected (classic Truther move) but I think it was that more than anything.

I had this weird moment at work the other night where I was shaking pretty badly cause I hadn't eaten anything and I was hungover and this guy says "hey you're a shaker aren't you"

I step back and ask him what the hell he's talking about

"you know, a shaker, you shake pretty badly"

anyway I proceeded to talk to this dude for a little while and apparently it's got a lot to do with vitamin B12 deficiency or something but my point is it was really weird to hear a problem I've had my entire life given a catchy name like that.

There is a sign down the road saying there's a Shaker Community Meeting on Tuesdays. I guess you should go. Maybe it's like AA.
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #35 on: 14 Sep 2009, 03:06 »

so... flying sure has sucked since 9/11 huh guys?

Fuck yes. Goddammit!
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #36 on: 14 Sep 2009, 03:10 »

So let me tell you something about 9/11. On 9/11, at around a time, I was sitting in Math class. And the news was on and blah blah blah and suddenly one of the teachers runs in from another room and says "Is the news on? Are they watching it? This is the biggest thing that will ever happen in their lifetime."

I was, let me see, 15? Something like that. Here was a man, saying that in the next 70 or so years nothing more important than 9/11 will ever happen. I could chalk it up to the heat of the moment, except that whenever the last 9/11 was, 2 or 3 days ago, someone said the exact same thing, "9/11 is the most important thing that will happen in the lifetime of our children."

I still cannot fathom this statement. We could cure death in the next 80 years. We could end all disease, hunger, misery, poverty, foxnews, processed cheese, and crust on sandwiches, and 9/11 would still be more important.

9/11 is that important to these people. It all makes sense to me now.
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #37 on: 14 Sep 2009, 03:16 »

To be fair, it is a pretty big deal. It's like the fall of the Berlin Wall, or Vietnam, or World War II. Sure, we might cure death in the next 70 years but at the moment I have no problem whatsoever declaring 9/11 to be the biggest thing that's happened since I've been old enough to comprehend these kinds of things. For better or worse the events of that single day basically turned the entire world on it's head.
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #38 on: 14 Sep 2009, 03:45 »

The American reaction to 9/11 always perplexes me. Of course im making huge (huge) generalisations here but America accepted getting shat on after 9/11.

Whereas in Britain (not saying Britain is perfect or anything) the Blitz, and WW2 in general, made ordinary folks think 'to hell with all this fighting for my country if my country isnt going to look after me'. So we got healthcare and otehr aspects of the welfare state.

Milton Friedman said, “Only a crisis, actual or perceived, produces real change." It just seems that 9/11 brought about bad change for America, every disaster is also an opportunity, I cant help but think America missed out an opportunity to do something good. Instead it started two really unpopular wars.
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #39 on: 14 Sep 2009, 03:49 »

To be fair, it is a pretty big deal. It's like the fall of the Berlin Wall, or Vietnam, or World War II. Sure, we might cure death in the next 70 years but at the moment I have no problem whatsoever declaring 9/11 to be the biggest thing that's happened since I've been old enough to comprehend these kinds of things. For better or worse the events of that single day basically turned the entire world on it's head.

I think the point that saying 8 years later that it still will ultimately still be the most important thing to happen in this century or whatever shows an incredible lack of concern or foresight for the future.
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #40 on: 14 Sep 2009, 04:44 »

I think the point that saying 8 years later that it still will ultimately still be the most important thing to happen in this century or whatever shows an incredible lack of concern or foresight for the future.
But you know how sensationalism plays.
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #41 on: 14 Sep 2009, 04:53 »

The American reaction to 9/11 always perplexes me. Of course im making huge (huge) generalisations here but America accepted getting shat on after 9/11.

Whereas in Britain (not saying Britain is perfect or anything) the Blitz, and WW2 in general, made ordinary folks think 'to hell with all this fighting for my country if my country isnt going to look after me'. So we got healthcare and otehr aspects of the welfare state.

Milton Friedman said, “Only a crisis, actual or perceived, produces real change." It just seems that 9/11 brought about bad change for America, every disaster is also an opportunity, I cant help but think America missed out an opportunity to do something good. Instead it started two really unpopular wars.

Whereas we got new anti-terror legislation that vastly inflated police powers, a proposed ID card scheme and two really unpopular wars... er, what was the difference again? Also, Milton Friedman is basically a psychopath and one of the twentieth century's nastiest bastards.

For better or worse the events of that single day basically turned the entire world on it's head.

In what way?
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #42 on: 14 Sep 2009, 04:54 »

uh maybe by turning america into a bunch of terrified lunatics

I mean, moreso.
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #43 on: 14 Sep 2009, 05:06 »

I think the point that saying 8 years later that it still will ultimately still be the most important thing to happen in this century or whatever shows an incredible lack of concern or foresight for the future.

OK so in hindsight it seems kind of silly but you could probably credit a dude a bit of exaggeration when out of nowhere with no warning whatsoever 3000 people were killed by method of flying jets into some of the most well-known buildings in the world.

In what way?

Well you could probably start with all of the things you just mentioned and multiply it by the number of other countries who adopted similar measures (to varying extents).

On top of that, before September 11th 2001, how often do you think the average person had devoted any amount of time to considering terrorism? It was barely a blip on the radar. Hell, most people were barely even cognizant of what Islam was before 9/11.

And yes, as Brett (kind of) said, the events of that day went on to exert an incredibly strong influence the foreign policy of the only superpower on Earth, which- like it or not- in turn touches the lives of pretty much everyone.
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #44 on: 14 Sep 2009, 05:42 »

how often do you think the average person had devoted any amount of time to considering terrorism? It was barely a blip on the radar. Hell, most people were barely even cognizant of what Islam was before 9/11.

In Britain, major terrorist acts in Manchester and London were more than just a blip on the radar (I heard  the Bishopsgate bomb while sitting in my garden), and nothing to do with Islam either.
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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #45 on: 14 Sep 2009, 05:44 »

Bombings weren't new to the US either, Oklahoma City for one and I can remember Bin Laden being mentioned in connection with the WTC attack very quickly because of a previous attempt (vans in the parking garage I think?).

It was undoubtedly a very significant event, and it did alter global politics. I just don't see any of it as turning the world on its head. War on terror? First came from a speech by Reagan in the '80s if I remember right. War in Iraq? It never really stopped since Operation Desert Storm, and the British had been sending troops over there for what, close to a hundred years by that point? War in Afghanistan? Again, not a new arena for Western intervention but I think it was the first time the US had ground troops over there. They certainly weren't newcomers to intervention by other means though. Strict domestic security? Sure it got ramped up globally but it's not like domestic surveillance wasn't something any of the countries that did it hadn't been investing in heavily beforehand. Islam as a threat? Undoubtedly a massive increase in that perception in the US (the UK and other countries were already familiar with racism against Muslim minorities and discussion of Islam as a cultural threat by this point) but it was just that, an increase in a perception rather than an inversion of one. 9/11 just seemed to make increases in a bunch of stuff that had been going on for a really long time.
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Barmymoo

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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #46 on: 14 Sep 2009, 06:15 »

I get the impression that what September 11th has mostly done for the American on the street is create a situation where the word "terrorism" can be used politically to achieve results. I'm not in any way saying that the death of all those people wasn't horrific, shocking and devastating for their families and friends, but the reaction does seem to be a little disproportionate, and I can only assume that it is because of the media response to the event and the political exploitation of that.

It's not entirely fair to compare Britain's experience of terrorism to that of the USA because we have very different histories. There have been repeated terrorist attacks over here; the IRA in particular were causing major panic and fear for a good while before 2001. So people in the UK were perhaps more used to the idea that people would want to attack us. In fact, the startpoint for most people's grasp of British history is the 1066 invasion.

America has not, to my knowledge and correct me if I'm wrong, ever been invaded and has a history of being a superpower. So the shock of a country that had spent nearly a hundred years being considered the dominant superpower, and several hundred years before that (I'm thinking since the War of Independence) being pretty damn strong, being attacked must have hit fairly hard. In comparison to that, the UK has had a bit of a seige mentality since the demise of the Empire and as an island has always been alert to the risk of attack.

So that's why I don't think "we didn't panic so much when we got attacked" is a very good argument. Having said that, however, I still don't feel that the American response to September 11th, on a national scale, is very logical to an outside viewer. Terrorism shouldn't be accepted as a good excuse for removing civil liberties or waging pointless wars. This goes just as much for the UK as for the USA.
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allison

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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #47 on: 14 Sep 2009, 06:40 »

Terrorism was not new to the US.

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WriterofAllWrongs

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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #48 on: 14 Sep 2009, 08:33 »

It's interesting how much a young Alan Rickman looks like Zachary Quinto. 


(mad ups for that, by the way)
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Barmymoo

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Re: Have You Forgotten?
« Reply #49 on: 14 Sep 2009, 09:44 »

I have no idea what that picture was in reference to, but I know I was wrong about terrorism being new to the US. I suppose I meant it was the first time that America had perceived itself as under continuous threat.
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There's this really handy "other thing" I'm going to write as a footnote to my abstract that I can probably explore these issues in. I think I'll call it my "dissertation."
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