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Author Topic: University/College  (Read 435923 times)

calenlass

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Re: University/College
« Reply #300 on: 21 Oct 2009, 23:05 »

Social Bacon I think that perhaps all the people who are just there for their jobs are there because they have been told that, essentially, they have to be. I can honestly tell you that if I was not under the impression that I would be making enough money (thanks to that piece of paper) to make up for all the bullshit, I would skip out on all of it and go hang out somewhere I could learn cool stuff on my own time and of my own volition. I would make up my own majors and graduate in them all, AND I would take 20 years to do it if that's what I felt like doing. Most of it would be free, and all of it would be engaging and entertaining. I am passionate about learning, but the university system, at least in the States, is more of a suffocation of education than the promotion of it

Those of us that are in university programs "for our degrees" cannot afford to pay for university just for the hell of doing it. Some of us wouldn't want the chokehold that is more about essays and book reports and grammar exercises and busywork just for fun, even if we could afford it. But we are here because we must be, because our society has dictated that this sort of education makes for a well-rounded individual who is more interactive and financially successful. In industrialised nations, those are the keys to our survival. So, in this light, I ask you who is ultimately worse off: the one who struggles against The System but cannot change it, or the ones who fight to learn to survive in it?
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MrDorman

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Re: University/College
« Reply #301 on: 21 Oct 2009, 23:21 »

I go to community college and live with my parents.

eheu  :cry:
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Nodaisho

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Re: University/College
« Reply #302 on: 21 Oct 2009, 23:41 »

Me too. It's a lot cheaper than a university, even an in-state one, and I don't have to pay for rent or food. The more money I don't spend on that stuff, the more I can save and invest. Especially nice when I can't find a job, because apparently nobody wants to hire a part-time student with no prior professional experience.
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Alex C

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Re: University/College
« Reply #303 on: 21 Oct 2009, 23:54 »

Sorry, my post wasn't really meant to be a personal attack on Andy. I know it kind of came off that way, I just get a little frustrated when I start talking about uni and tend to rant. I really agree with you on all counts, but the point I'm trying to get at is that it's impossible to knock the leechers out of the system. It's their prerogative to leech if they so choose. As such, for those of us who are passionate about our studies, we have to work with what we have. I'm saying that we can cut ourselves apart from the losers with no real interest in learning and get the full value from our profs and the time we spend there. I don't think focusing on the problems and inept individuals is really useful when there's so much to be pleased with. (Again, this is not meant to be an attack on you, but this thread has spent forever talking about these issues.)

This troubles me somewhat. Not everyone with issues with the system are necessarily leeches. That the system is tailored in such a way that you do not chafe from its fit is a blessing for you, but for others some of the structure and general education requirements involved are an expensive and frustrating stepping stone on the way to pursuing their interests. As Jhocking said, universities generally dismiss this as a problem because they do not really consider job training as part of their mission statement; personally, I'd like to see that change a tiny bit, and I'm not really convinced that learning for learning's sake would necessarily just die out or something just because we finally got around to acknowledging a lot of the pragmatism involved.

Really, I find it funny that Calenlass and I seemed to be disagreeing earlier, since her last post makes me think that we have essentially the same attitude on this subject just with perhaps different points of emphasis when actually discussing it. I'm not really struggling against any system, I just have an opinion of it that isn't entirely complimentary. It'd be a real stretch to say that I have an ax to grind.

The way universities and colleges are set up in the US, I would never want to be a career student, even if it were free. I do not want to go for a grade and a piece of paper, either, but that is what they want. Those grades and pieces of paper are apparently necessary to get a job (even unrelated to my degree, but that is a different can of worms), so I am doing that to get a job so I can pursue studies in my own fields of interest without all the administrative and bureaucratic bullshit getting in the way.

Also, this gem. That's basically me. I got enough formal education to get my paramedic cert and then I got the fuck out (too bad the money sucks though). This does not mean I am uninterested in learning or would even being opposed to taking classes on a more ala carte basis. I actually enjoyed some of the classes I took on other subjects while I was in there. But it was also a more costly and at times frustrating experience than I would like to go through again.
« Last Edit: 22 Oct 2009, 00:35 by Alex C »
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jhocking

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Re: University/College
« Reply #304 on: 22 Oct 2009, 06:00 »

the ones who fight to learn to survive in it

lol what

the ones who fight to learn to consider to believe to suggest to interpret to imply to mutter to agree to disagree to sermonize to settle to blather to prioritize to categorize to filibuster to debate to desire to clarify to exclaim to decide to survive in it

hee hee that amused me
« Last Edit: 22 Oct 2009, 06:09 by jhocking »
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schimmy

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Re: University/College
« Reply #305 on: 22 Oct 2009, 07:23 »

22 October 2009: jhocking discovers marijuana.
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Re: University/College
« Reply #306 on: 22 Oct 2009, 07:34 »

I am passionate about learning, but the university system, at least in the States, is more of a suffocation of education than the promotion of it

I always found that learning was most stressed in both of my degree departments.  In both of them, what you actually learn does matter.  In physics, you either teach physics in high school, or go on to graduate school (which is the opposite of the financial burden where you don't learn anything).  In music, you either teach music, go on to graduate school or play music.  For all of those options, you actually have to understand what's being taught.  And in both of those degrees, you have to want to do them, because they're too hard for people to just coast through by going through the motions.  So, I guess it's really what department you find yourself in combined with what university you find yourself in.
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SonofZ3

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Re: University/College
« Reply #307 on: 22 Oct 2009, 11:17 »

Ok, I haven't been in this thread for a little while but I'd like to respond, in general, to the last two dozen or so posts. In my original post I wasn't trying to say that a monetary payoff should be the ONLY reason for being in school. Personal growth and learning for the sake of learning are wonderful, but I don't fault people for putting money right up there. This is why my minors were literature and philosophy, and not a major. This is why I used up all my electives on Russian culture and film courses, because I have a passion for them, but I fully understood that I NEEDED my degree to pay off when I graduated. I went to a State School, worked through college, and I'm still going to be in debt for the next 8-10 years paying off my education. Now that I've graduated, and shell out 1300 a month in bills before food or gas (I'm saving on rent by living at home), I'm glad I didn't major in philosophy or literature. In fact, I wish I would've went to school for nursing, or an associates in criminal justice instead. Long debates with my philosophy professors, or nights at the bar with my Russian Lit prof talking about War and Peace are some excellent memories, but are they worth my debt? No.
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Christophe

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Re: University/College
« Reply #308 on: 22 Oct 2009, 12:20 »

Jesus fucking shitting dicks I am about to have a conniption fit about the shitting group leader for my fucking entrepreneurship fuck-damn project. All being all "no this is the way to do it" while everyone else in the group is all "hey how about you let us have your say as to why you might be wrong" and him being all "no but I'm the one who came up with the project" and everyone else being all "but it's a group project now and you have to let us have our say" and fucking hell if you didn't want people to come up with other things for your fucking pet project then you shouldn't have shared it with the group you fuck. I did not cross the shitting 48 contiguous states and the bitch dicks Atlantic Ocean to get into a wang-biting argument about fuck all. All for a piss-dip five minute presentation that frankly could have been dusted off in a Goddamn hour.

TL;DR: AHHHH C'MON, FUCK A GROUP PROJECT
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Re: University/College
« Reply #309 on: 22 Oct 2009, 12:31 »

Holy shit you guys, experimental design for the life sciences is such a pain in the ass. Pseudoreplication, confounding factors, background variation, correlational vs. manipulative studies, proper randomization, within-subject vs. between-subject designs, observer drift, and ethics that mess your shit up... This science will make you its bitch. So damn many things to take into account, and if that wasn't bad enough, the test questions are really mean too. Urghh.
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Re: University/College
« Reply #310 on: 22 Oct 2009, 12:40 »

Wait...you actually have to take a class on that? I've had to go to ethics seminars, but for everything else we just learn it in the lab as we go.
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Alex C

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Re: University/College
« Reply #311 on: 22 Oct 2009, 12:41 »

TL;DR: AHHHH C'MON, FUCK A GROUP PROJECT

It's even better when they insist on doing it their way despite not really understanding exactly how they should go about doing it their way. If you're going to willfully commandeer the group leadership role and not take "no" for an answer you better know exactly what the fuck you're doing. I've done it on presentations before, but only in cases where I felt like I could reasonably acquire a full page of talking points and a half page of citations in under 40 minutes. It also helped that I was working with mouth breathers.
« Last Edit: 22 Oct 2009, 12:43 by Alex C »
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jhocking

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Re: University/College
« Reply #312 on: 22 Oct 2009, 13:21 »

When my fiancee had an ugly group project situation back in business school, she ranted to me about how pissed off it was making her. At first I nodded along because, well, I hate it too when shit like that happens. But then at the end she finally took a deep breath and asked me what I thought she should do about it, and I kinda blinked in confusion for a moment and said, "Well, you should do the work."

My point then (and my advice to you now) was that there's no way to change the shitty situation halfway through the project, so she should just make the best of it. Definitely bear this in mind for the future (eg. don't be in another group project with that asshole) but as for the current project her main focus should be on doing what will help her, rather than wasting time thinking about how to get even or whatever.

In her case she should do all the work to get the project done (the problem she was having was lazy teammates who weren't pulling their weight,) while in your case I would advise don't waste any more time arguing with your stubborn "leader" and focus on making the presentation of his idea look good so you come off as a great presenter. Unless this is some special contest where you're presenting business plans to actual investors, nobody really cares about the ideas being presented, they only care about how good you are at presenting the idea.
« Last Edit: 22 Oct 2009, 13:24 by jhocking »
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Christophe

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Re: University/College
« Reply #313 on: 22 Oct 2009, 13:37 »

Yeah after the huge argument I think everyone had a sit-down and got relatively calmed down. Thankfully everyone in the group actually submits their own business plans (has to do with the way the course is graded and stuff) but seriously it was like being in the worst episode of The Apprentice. Yeah I'm gonna buckle down and make sure the presentation goes well and stuff but after today I am not feeling good about it at all (whereas beforehand I was quite ambivalent about it and just happy to do the work and research). We meet again on Tuesday and the presentation is in a week so either we get it done or we're at loggerheads indefinitely.

And since I go back to my home university in the Winter (and I shouldn't have to take any more management courses after that) I'll definitely not be in another group with the dude.
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LTK

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Re: University/College
« Reply #314 on: 22 Oct 2009, 15:04 »

Wait...you actually have to take a class on that? I've had to go to ethics seminars, but for everything else we just learn it in the lab as we go.
Yeah, but my knowledge of scientific research is zit. After high school we needed to do research on a subject in our profile, and mine was FUBAR so it's really quite helpful. The author's of the book themselves say that it would have saved them a lot of time, money and trouble if they had a book like this back when they were starting college. It's not a large book, and it primarily deals with setting up a good experiment rather than statistically analysing your data, and there's only a page or two on ethics. I've got a test for it tomorrow, but the thing is, this is a book that was not written to make you do a test on it. It was written to give you a guideline to use on your scientific research to keep you from screwing up, a manual of sorts, not a studybook. It's actually pretty easy to understand, only there's a lot of jargon to deal with, as well as demanding a high amount of insight into experimental design. But then they start asking questions like "If you go to a supermarket and ask every third person who comes out to fill out a questionnaire, what kind of sampling are you using?" and it comes down to a test of your vocabulary. I hope I don't get screwed over too bad on those questions.
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Quote from: snalin
I just got the image of a midwife and a woman giving birth swinging towards each other on a trapeze - when they meet, the midwife pulls the baby out. The knife juggler is standing on the floor and cuts the umbilical cord with a a knifethrow.

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Re: University/College
« Reply #315 on: 23 Oct 2009, 16:29 »

And in fact I didn't! Test went really well, when I was done I was sure I made no mistakes, but after discussing it with people I saw I made a few, and after checking the answers I saw that I had eight (out of 30) and two of them have to be corrected, so that's 80% scored. Nice!
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I just got the image of a midwife and a woman giving birth swinging towards each other on a trapeze - when they meet, the midwife pulls the baby out. The knife juggler is standing on the floor and cuts the umbilical cord with a a knifethrow.

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Re: University/College
« Reply #316 on: 23 Oct 2009, 17:09 »

I've just had ice hockey initiation and it was awesome  :-D Not just the initiation thing although it was hilarious, but also the fact that there was no fuss at all about me not drinking, everyone was cool with it and just accepted it and I still had a great time and did all the games and stuff. I've never seen so much alcohol disappear so fast... the guy opposite me at dinner drank fourteen glasses of wine, ten of which he chugged. It was completely insane and totally hilarious.
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Re: University/College
« Reply #317 on: 27 Oct 2009, 09:35 »

Holy shit I passed the course with a 6.333333333333333333333333 average. Kickass.
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I just got the image of a midwife and a woman giving birth swinging towards each other on a trapeze - when they meet, the midwife pulls the baby out. The knife juggler is standing on the floor and cuts the umbilical cord with a a knifethrow.

Joseph

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Re: University/College
« Reply #318 on: 27 Oct 2009, 10:43 »

90% on my first midterm of the year (Neuroscience of Language)!

Two more today though.  Oh Shiiiiii
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Re: University/College
« Reply #319 on: 27 Oct 2009, 16:41 »

Yay!  I'm not doing nearly as badly in my second course from this professor as the first!  I got my waveguides test back and I got a 23/30 (that's actually pretty good for how hard his tests are).  I might actually pass the course.
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StaedlerMars

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Re: University/College
« Reply #320 on: 08 Nov 2009, 18:40 »

Smells like the first all-nighter of the year!

I am writing a web crawler, and it's parsing 261 pages of html to find where the actual relevant content of the site is. And it has taken 45 minutes to do just the first 50 pages. This sucks, cause I can't really work while this is running. And if I do it's staggered, so I lose track of the changes I've made since the beginning of the first run. It's a hazard. 

I'm on my second cup of coffee.

Tomorrow I have to do a bunch of stuff for the student radio station. I might have to member other committee members and see whether they can do anything, cause at the moment it doesn't look like I'm going to be getting any sleep.

I should not have watched that marathon of 30-rock last night. I should have been working instead. Oh well. Living life on the edge!

Wooo!

(man, I am wired)
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Yayniall

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Re: University/College
« Reply #321 on: 09 Nov 2009, 11:10 »

My first piece of coursework was easy like a wolf.
Computing but for bitches.
Fuck yes Matlab.
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Bastardous Bassist

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Re: University/College
« Reply #322 on: 09 Nov 2009, 11:21 »

Matlab is the worst best program ever.  It can do everything, but my God if it isn't super sensitive to what you're actually telling it to do (the built-in commands rarely do what one would expect them to do).
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Yayniall

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Re: University/College
« Reply #323 on: 09 Nov 2009, 11:22 »

It's programming for people who really can't be arsed.
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Drill King

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Re: University/College
« Reply #324 on: 09 Dec 2009, 17:38 »

Oh hey I got my first final mark back and I got an over Aish A+ish depending on where you are


eeeee
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Avec

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Re: University/College
« Reply #325 on: 09 Dec 2009, 18:42 »

This may be slightly off topic but I was curious if anyone here has applied for a summer college session as a high school student. Any advice is really appreciated; I'm interested in writing, chemistry, and philosophy if that helps any.

Thank you.  :-)
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Bastardous Bassist

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Re: University/College
« Reply #326 on: 09 Dec 2009, 19:07 »

I did, but it was during my senior year.  The class started before my senior year ended, but continued after it ended.  It was a rather normal thing.  They're really fine with stuff like that as long as you meet the prerequisites (I think).  At least in the USA.
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Re: University/College
« Reply #327 on: 09 Dec 2009, 19:28 »

I'm pretty certain I'm going to start an access course to hopefully get onto an Anthropology degree. My other option is to take a Higher National Certificate in Electronics and Computer Engineering but I think I'd rather go for an academic degree and then move into that area because I want to work in that field but I definitely want to study anthropology.
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Re: University/College
« Reply #328 on: 09 Dec 2009, 19:38 »

Was it expensive? and I guess in your case it really wouldn't change your transcript but I was considering a six week course of philosophy at U-Penn for roughly $2,000 as the sticker price.
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Re: University/College
« Reply #329 on: 10 Dec 2009, 13:27 »

Agreed, I wish I had done that, writing classes are really annoying when you've got a full courseload and are working 30+ hours a week.  Two of them in one semester is even worse. 

Unloading my textbooks and using the money for beer, alright.
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Re: University/College
« Reply #330 on: 10 Dec 2009, 15:00 »

Just got a 95% on the first portion of the final exam for my worst class. I'm feeling pretty damn smug about that.
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Re: University/College
« Reply #331 on: 10 Dec 2009, 15:14 »

Since my final projects for my classes were videos, I get to share.  :-)

Single Camera class. Feature piece on local musician.

Video Editing class. Movie trailer for "Once Upon a Time in the West".
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Bastardous Bassist

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Re: University/College
« Reply #332 on: 10 Dec 2009, 19:25 »

just do some community college over the summer dogg, you can get required credits out of the way, they're shorter, and most likely easier! that's what i'm doing to get writing comp etc. out of the way. they should also be less than 2k

I was going to say just this.  Just make sure that the class can be transferred.  Nothing sucks more than having to do work over again just because whatever college doesn't agree with the course as you took it.  That almost happened with my calc 3 class, but I just had to do a little bit extra because the guy responsible for that stuff was extremely awesome.
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Barmymoo

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Re: University/College
« Reply #333 on: 17 Dec 2009, 04:40 »

For my part, my motivations to be here are as follows:

  • Study the law (I am interested in it, but do not want to be a lawyer)
  • Learn to be independent whilst still having the safety net of my college to help out if I trip up
  • Get the chance to try new things (ice hockey, ballet, stage management) that simply wouldn't be available elsewhere


Ahahaha. I just re-read this and realised how quickly things have changed. My motives now run something like this:

  • Play ice hockey
  • Sleep in til lunch on Saturdays
  • Read some stuff sometimes

University has been really bad for my academic ambitions.
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Re: University/College
« Reply #334 on: 17 Dec 2009, 08:01 »

Man May that happens to so many folk is crazy!
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Jimmy the Squid

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Re: University/College
« Reply #335 on: 17 Dec 2009, 18:06 »

Hey so I told my dad that my back up plan if I don't get into uni is to do a small business course at TAFE (kind of a technical college?) and open up a comic book shop. His reaction was way more positive than I expected! "... Yes, well let's just hope you get into uni then." When I told my mum she pretended not to hear me. Woo supportive parents!
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Re: University/College
« Reply #336 on: 19 Dec 2009, 16:15 »

I was just reading an interesting article about choosing a college:
http://www.sloperama.com/advice/lesson25.htm

The funniest part is how in the made-up decision spreadsheet it includes the category "Pretty Coeds?" and one school is rated "As seen in Playboy." And then the hypothetical student's mother has a fit when she sees that category on the grid. lol

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Re: University/College
« Reply #337 on: 20 Dec 2009, 01:21 »

Decision matrixes are really useful in general, actually.  I've used them to make all kinds of major life decisions, from "should I skip high school?" to "which boy of the two who've asked me out should I accept?"  Making one helps me feel confident that I've actually weighed all the options I wanted to weigh--and then, if I disagree with the answer that comes out, I realize that I actually do have a strong feeling in one direction (which makes it easy to make the decision for that reason).

So if you're picking between some colleges, I second Joe's recommendation.
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Jimmy the Squid

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Re: University/College
« Reply #338 on: 20 Dec 2009, 01:37 »

I usually flip a coin for that kind of thing. If I'm not happy with the result I know what it is I really want. This has never failed me. I assume this will fail me when I am presented with more than two options.
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tania

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Re: University/College
« Reply #339 on: 20 Dec 2009, 05:53 »

"which boy of the two who've asked me out should I accept?"

show-off
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jhocking

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Re: University/College
« Reply #340 on: 20 Dec 2009, 07:02 »

I assume this will fail me when I am presented with more than two options.

First you need a three-headed coin...

Dliessmgg

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Re: University/College
« Reply #341 on: 20 Dec 2009, 11:42 »

The third option is when the coin falls on its edge.
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Allybee

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Re: University/College
« Reply #342 on: 20 Dec 2009, 12:35 »

college on a saturday night: paint a mural in the lounge, drink spiked hot chocolate and home brewed beer, acoustic guitar sing along. go drunken sledding on trays and trash can lids on the hill at midnight. fall asleep on two beds pushed together with four other people, watching wet hot american summer and swigging whiskey every time someone in the movie makes out.

college on a sunday morning: oh my god study for chem final, drop people off at hartford airport, need to finish greek history paper, need to pack clothes up, need to clean my room and dishes, need to call physical plant, need to dig out car (ahhhrgh snow) fuck fuck fuck
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radical dame

Jimor

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Re: University/College
« Reply #343 on: 28 Dec 2009, 13:07 »

Just checked my grades online. Straight A's in all 3 classes.  :-D

Plus I passed the Apple Certification exam for Final Cut Pro 7, which will make nice resume fodder.

Have the rest of the classes I need next semester to complete the TV Production technical certificate. 2 classes in the TV studio, and a class on advanced DVD authoring.
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Sythe

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Re: University/College
« Reply #344 on: 29 Dec 2009, 04:24 »

My sweet ass shotglass final project dealio is still locked in the glass shed at my school. I fucking neeeeeeed it.
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LeeC

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Re: University/College
« Reply #345 on: 08 Jan 2010, 06:36 »

anyone here attempting to go into medicine?
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schimmy

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Re: University/College
« Reply #346 on: 08 Jan 2010, 07:53 »

I am just starting to realise how absurd some of the stuff I have to learn for my degree is. I'm doing Philosophy, so that's kind of par for course I guess, but when I get exam questions like "How fast does time pass?" and "Present and assess one argument to the effect that nothing changes" I can't help but feel that my lecturer is taking the piss.
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pilsner

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Re: University/College
« Reply #347 on: 08 Jan 2010, 23:03 »

Q: "What is courage?  Please answer in 500 words."

A: "This."
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Jimor

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Re: University/College
« Reply #348 on: 09 Jan 2010, 00:20 »

Took me a moment to get that.

My favorite answer came from a classmate in chemistry. The question was about the method of reducing bauxite ore to aluminum metal. His answer: "Zap the bejeesus out of it." Full credit.
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pilsner

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Re: University/College
« Reply #349 on: 09 Jan 2010, 05:07 »

Awww, TAs should have a sense of humor, Jens.  It qualifies as a survival skill, at the very least.
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