Topic: What is the social/ethical/legal status of AnthroPCs? (Read 62024 times)

Is it cold in here? · « **Reply #150 on:** 19 Apr 2013, 22:42 »

In fact, we've seen figures for the cost of a high-end humanoid chassis. The Mitsubishi was $30,000.

Notice that nothing in the comic contradicts the idea of Yelling Bird having adopted Pintsize before Marten did? There was absolutely nothing saying that Marten was Pintsize's first companion, and apparently Pintsize had been around long enough to acquire a bit of a reputation.

ZoeB · « **Reply #151 on:** 20 Apr 2013, 01:25 »

Quote from: Storel on 19 Apr 2013, 21:50

Because a "fully functional" anthroPC would basically be a RealDoll++ -- it would have to have hardware to do a whole lot of things that RealDolls can't, like walking and talking and moving their arms and manipulating things with their hands and having facial expressions, plus as much hardware and software as it needs to achieve sentience. In other words, it would be quite a bit more expensive than RealDolls, which run around $6,000-7,000 these days. (And some comparable Japanese sex dolls are up to $10,000.)

So RealDolls are still around in the QCverse because they're cheaper, thus appealing to a different market niche.

Having had some fascinating talks with the head of the Sydney sex worker's collective, I can imagine some people (OK, they're AI people - I make no such fine distinctions) volunteering for that kind of job too. As she said to me though, people shouldn't be forced into it any more than they should be forced into slavery on a production line.

With the right hardware, considerably more sanitary too, a great way of reducing STDs.

You might think Pint Size might be an ideal candidate - but he's not mature enough. Consenting Adults only.

DSL · « **Reply #152 on:** 20 Apr 2013, 02:14 »

RE: "Fully functional" AnthroPCs vs. RealDolls, ZoeB hit on the essential distinction above, also touched on in the strip where the CoD girls and not-yet-fully-Hannelore were speculating about RealDolls with the ability to file restraining orders.
So (and again I'm more or less restating ZoeB here) one is a sentient being, for whom all the rules/laws about consent and willing participation apply, and the other is a deluxe dildo.
And yeah, ZoeB, you're right ... I wouldn't trust Pintsize in that job. Either one.

Is it cold in here? · « **Reply #153 on:** 20 Apr 2013, 02:44 »

I wonder if AnthroPCs in sex work are resented by others for contributing to prejudice?

What if Pintsize wasn't kidding?

~~Valdís~~ · « **Reply #154 on:** 20 Apr 2013, 04:26 »

Quote from: Is it cold in here? on 20 Apr 2013, 02:44

What if Pintsize wasn't kidding?

Well, he does have a history.

RedWolf4 · « **Reply #155 on:** 20 Apr 2013, 05:54 »

That makes some disturbing sense.

ZoeB · « **Reply #156 on:** 20 Apr 2013, 08:01 »

Quote from: RedWolf4 on 20 Apr 2013, 05:54

That makes some disturbing sense.

What has been seen cannot be unseen.

http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/what-has-been-seen-cannot-be-unseen

Is it cold in here? · « **Reply #157 on:** 20 Apr 2013, 12:33 »

Pintsize does have a vibration mode.

Carl-E · « **Reply #158 on:** 22 Apr 2013, 08:20 »

I recall there was theorizing that Clinton's hand did, also.

But is it sentient? It has an autonomous mode, but it needs to do as it's told, so I think there's some reduced level of intelligence there.

Masterpiece · « **Reply #159 on:** 22 Apr 2013, 08:32 »

If hands have a vibration mode, I'd speculate a lot more people would consider having them.
I know I would.

Sidhekin · « **Reply #160 on:** 22 Apr 2013, 09:27 »

Quote from: Masterpiece on 22 Apr 2013, 08:32

If hands have a vibration mode, I'd speculate a lot more people would consider having them.

A lot more ... than 7 billion?

(Who wouldn't considering having hands?)

Mr_Rose · « **Reply #161 on:** 22 Apr 2013, 09:53 »

You guys do know that it is possible to learn voluntary control of the shiver response, right?

Masterpiece · « **Reply #162 on:** 22 Apr 2013, 15:01 »

but... effort

Mr_Rose · « **Reply #163 on:** 22 Apr 2013, 15:59 »

A whole twenty minutes of paying attention to what nerves fire when you get cold, vs. general anaesthetic, weeks of recovery, months of physio, and probably a bunch of psychiatrist appointments because "it'd be so cool" is not considered a normal reason to want to chop your hand off…?

Method of Madness · « **Reply #164 on:** 22 Apr 2013, 16:01 »

I'm so confused right now.

Storel · « **Reply #165 on:** 22 Apr 2013, 17:50 »

Quote from: Mr_Rose on 22 Apr 2013, 15:59

A whole twenty minutes of paying attention to what nerves fire when you get cold, vs. general anaesthetic, weeks of recovery, months of physio, and probably a bunch of psychiatrist appointments because "it'd be so cool" is not considered a normal reason to want to chop your hand off…?

Just slam a car door very hard on your hand two or three times, and nobody who looks at the hand will have any question about why you want it replaced.

But don't let anybody see you do it, or you'll have to go to those psychiatric appointments anyway...

mtmerrick · « **Reply #166 on:** 22 Apr 2013, 19:20 »

Quote from: Mr_Rose on 22 Apr 2013, 15:59

A whole twenty minutes of paying attention to what nerves fire when you get cold, vs. general anaesthetic, weeks of recovery, months of physio, and probably a bunch of psychiatrist appointments because "it'd be so cool" is not considered a normal reason to want to chop your hand off…?

soon as they get touch and better individual digit control working on prosthetics, i'd seriously consider voluntary amputation. i have very little faith in my meatware. gimme some decent and upgradable hardware and i'll be very happy.

(also, the simple fact of being a cyborg is awesome.)

Is it cold in here? · « **Reply #167 on:** 22 Apr 2013, 23:21 »

Maybe after the artificial ones have had as many years of R&D as the natural ones.

pwhodges · « **Reply #168 on:** 22 Apr 2013, 23:55 »

And the infrastructure to support them is as widely accessible.

Neko_Ali · « **Reply #169 on:** 23 Apr 2013, 05:38 »

I would sincerely love to have my damaged lower back or weak eyes replaced.. But to be honest, what I really want is a full body replacement. Especially if I get to design the shell... Matoko Kusanagi anyone?

Masterpiece · « **Reply #170 on:** 23 Apr 2013, 05:46 »

This is why I was always pro-augmentation in Deus Es Human Revolution

Method of Madness · « **Reply #171 on:** 23 Apr 2013, 07:04 »

I wouldn't mind super vision...or an enhancement that would help my brain with calculations without altering my personality.

Is it cold in here? · « **Reply #172 on:** 23 Apr 2013, 10:24 »

This question must have arisen in the QC world. We don't know what conclusion has been reached -- we've seen only a handful of people rich enough to afford it.

Loki · « **Reply #173 on:** 23 Apr 2013, 10:43 »

Which raises an interesting question: How could Clinton afford the hand? Was it covered by insurance? Or was it a "pay for it with prize money from IT competitions because you are some kind of child prodigy" sort of thing?

Masterpiece · « **Reply #174 on:** 23 Apr 2013, 10:49 »

I don't think the price of human augmentation has ever been established in the qcverse.

pwhodges · « **Reply #175 on:** 23 Apr 2013, 11:03 »

Quote from: Loki on 23 Apr 2013, 10:43

Which raises an interesting question: How could Clinton afford the hand? Was it covered by insurance? Or was it a "pay for it with prize money from IT competitions because you are some kind of child prodigy" sort of thing?

Or just get it free for being prepared to be experimented on, perhaps?

Loki · « **Reply #176 on:** 23 Apr 2013, 11:05 »

There was a figure somewhere claiming that Momo's chassis cost 30k, give or take. That is without personality included.

The hand is arguably way cheaper, as it's only a hand, but it has some tech built in that allows it to interact with biological nerves. It is also detachable and STILL remains either voice- or thought-controlled. The incident that caused him to lose his old hand was when he was thirteen (so he says), but that would imply that he is got it later or it auto-adjusted to his growing body or that he bought a new (bigger) one at some point. The last two options would add a bit to the cost. So how much ever it cost, it certainly wasn't cheap.

*hits submit*

Warning - while you were typing a better plausible idea has been posted.

...or yeah, that.

Is it cold in here? · « **Reply #177 on:** 23 Apr 2013, 11:05 »

My guess had been insurance. Health insurance seems to work better in the QC universe.

Neko_Ali · « **Reply #178 on:** 23 Apr 2013, 11:22 »

This does bring up a new question... We have seen that AntroPC companions are not created to order, but rather there is a match making service that sets up compatible humans and AIs to be companions. The human partner takes on the financial responsibility for maintaining and upgrading the AnthroPC's hardware... But who is creating and paying for their bodies in the first place, before they are assigned? We know that Momo and others chose to be companions for whatever reason they had, but nobody as far as I know has talked much about their existence before hand. Were they AIs who wanted a corporeal existence? Did they have other jobs and other bodies before becoming companions? They can hold jobs presumably legally (Momo works in the library, unless it's under the table). So what other jobs can or do AnthroPCs hold? And who is making the new AIs anyway?

Pilchard123 · « **Reply #179 on:** 23 Apr 2013, 11:39 »

Perhaps the AnthroPCs themselves? Just spitballing here though.

Loki · « **Reply #180 on:** 23 Apr 2013, 11:42 »

Quote from: Neko_Ali on 23 Apr 2013, 11:22

And who is making the new AIs anyway?

AIs. All the way down.

Seriously, maybe AIs are like software in the real world. There are some variants that are open-source, but there are custom-build solutions that cost (like, say, a certain AI for nuclear warfare). The creators of most AI make no money from the AIs themselves, but from the matchmaking service they provide, and from the costs of hardware that has to go with an AI. And which also has to be upgraded from time to time, and sometimes fixed if the owner cannot do it themselves.

Is it cold in here? · « **Reply #181 on:** 23 Apr 2013, 13:38 »

Companion AIs presumably get their first body from their human companion, and matchmaking interviews could be done from their natal server. Apple, Mitsubishi, and Sony at least make AnthroPC bodies. The references to "Sony AnthroPC" and "Apple AnthroPC" may refer to bundling arrangements where the hardware manufacturer provides a turnkey body/adoption solution.

Masterpiece · « **Reply #182 on:** 23 Apr 2013, 13:56 »

If AIs can procreate themselves, what happens to population control? Won't there be too many robots at some point?

bhtooefr · « **Reply #183 on:** 23 Apr 2013, 14:19 »

Quote from: Neko_Ali on 23 Apr 2013, 11:22

We know that Momo and others chose to be companions for whatever reason they had, but nobody as far as I know has talked much about their existence before hand. Were they AIs who wanted a corporeal existence? Did they have other jobs and other bodies before becoming companions? They can hold jobs presumably legally (Momo works in the library, unless it's under the table). So what other jobs can or do AnthroPCs hold? And who is making the new AIs anyway?

Forklifts, potentially ICBM-carrying submarines, banks.

Plenty of things where the chassis wouldn't be humanoid at all.

DSL · « **Reply #184 on:** 23 Apr 2013, 15:40 »

Quote from: Masterpiece on 23 Apr 2013, 13:56

If AIs can procreate themselves, what happens to population control? Won't there be too many robots at some point?

Assuming an AI hive mind (no real evidence I can remember presented in comic, but it's almost an assumption in forum discussion) one could reasonably extrapolate there is some logical framework for deciding when there is a need for new physical AI receptacles to be manufactured, and it's not just a case of robots off somewhere interfacing like crazed WeaselPCs.

Neko_Ali · « **Reply #185 on:** 23 Apr 2013, 16:12 »

Actually, it seems Jeph already answered most of my questions in the comments of this comic: http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=1996

Is it cold in here? · « **Reply #186 on:** 23 Apr 2013, 17:31 »

The QC world seems to have a market economy, so eventually anyone who makes robot bodies when nobody's buying them will go out of business.

Ah, but what controls the number of intelligences that get created?

~~Valdís~~ · « **Reply #187 on:** 23 Apr 2013, 17:34 »

Quote from: Is it cold in here? on 23 Apr 2013, 17:31

The QC world seems to have a market economy, so eventually anyone who makes robot bodies when nobody's buying them will go out of business.

So.. never? I mean, we know AI people can work for their own salaries, so it's not like they wouldn't stay strong customers of things like that.

Is it cold in here? · « **Reply #188 on:** 23 Apr 2013, 18:47 »

They wouldn't have an infinite amount of money to spend on new bodies, though.

It would be tough to represent in a comic, but wouldn't a sufficiently rich AnthroPC want to have as many bodies as humans have changes of clothes?

DSL · « **Reply #189 on:** 24 Apr 2013, 08:12 »

Quote from: Is it cold in here? on 23 Apr 2013, 18:47

They wouldn't have an infinite amount of money to spend on new bodies, though.

It would be tough to represent in a comic, but wouldn't a sufficiently rich AnthroPC want to have as many bodies as humans have changes of clothes?

Well, have you ever seen Winslow and DeathBot 9000 in the same room at the same time? Me neither.

pwhodges · « **Reply #190 on:** 24 Apr 2013, 08:31 »

If Deathbot was Winslow, I doubt he would have let PintSize off so easily!

Is it cold in here? · « **Reply #191 on:** 24 Apr 2013, 12:28 »

Marten's not a secret robot, ditto Marigold, but do we know that about any of the rest of the cast? Wil, I suppose, because he got x-rayed for his broken arm. The Pugnacious Peach, from the concussion incident. Hannelore, when the robots tested her.

Maybe we don't see Raven because she keeps uploading into her other bodies, such as the background redhead. I wonder if she was the raccoon or the pigeon? She seem to like air ducts.

Method of Madness · « **Reply #192 on:** 24 Apr 2013, 12:30 »

Wait, you're saying Sweet Tits is just a vessel for Raven? Their personalities are nothing alike!

Zebediah · « **Reply #193 on:** 24 Apr 2013, 13:52 »

Raven is actually Pizza Girl! Just uploaded into a different body!

No, wait, too simple. I've got it! Dale is actually Pizza Girl!

mtmerrick · « **Reply #194 on:** 24 Apr 2013, 14:13 »

Quote from: Is it cold in here? on 23 Apr 2013, 13:38

Companion AIs presumably get their first body from their human companion, and matchmaking interviews could be done from their natal server. Apple, Mitsubishi, and Sony at least make AnthroPC bodies. The references to "Sony AnthroPC" and "Apple AnthroPC" may refer to bundling arrangements where the hardware manufacturer provides a turnkey body/adoption solution.

IDK about this. Didn't momo introduce herself as "I AM a Sony___ anthropc" ? And the same goes for Winslow, but saying apple. They seem to have a more solid identify of brand than just their starter chassis gifted to them from their human.

Akima · « **Reply #195 on:** 24 Apr 2013, 15:36 »

Quote from: Is it cold in here? on 23 Apr 2013, 13:38

Companion AIs presumably get their first body from their human companion, and matchmaking interviews could be done from their natal server. Apple, Mitsubishi, and Sony at least make AnthroPC bodies. The references to "Sony AnthroPC" and "Apple AnthroPC" may refer to bundling arrangements where the hardware manufacturer provides a turnkey body/adoption solution.

We know AnthroPC bodies can be bought from Best Buy, when their original hardware becomes unusable, so the linkage between hardware and software can't be tight. Who made PT410x's body, I wonder? He looks somehow... Russian? I know... It's the beard... And the angst. Ленинградская робота завода, товарищ!

mtmerrick · « **Reply #196 on:** 24 Apr 2013, 15:42 »

He looks like a neckbeard'd Linux guy to me

in fact, the dont-call-it-a-neckbeard heat sink has been mentioned in-story before.

Masterpiece · « **Reply #197 on:** 24 Apr 2013, 16:40 »

how dare you put shame on the neckbeards.

mtmerrick · « **Reply #198 on:** 24 Apr 2013, 16:56 »

Dude at one point in my life I HAD a neckbeard. Got nuttin but respect for em.

Masterpiece · « **Reply #199 on:** 24 Apr 2013, 17:01 »

I still od. It's the amin reason I wax myself.

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How are AnthroPCs regarded in the QC universe?

Author Topic: What is the social/ethical/legal status of AnthroPCs? (Read 62024 times)