Topic: The Quadrennial Global Round-Ball Extravaganza (Read 44841 times)

a pack of wolves · « **Reply #50 on:** 12 Jun 2010, 11:14 »

Quote from: KharBevNor on 12 Jun 2010, 10:05

Seriously though, can we? You really don't think it is dreadful to be crassly enjoying a corporate-sponsored bread and circuses event that has caused suffering to thousands of people? By supporting the World Cup uncritically and 'just talking about sport', you are basically saying to the SA authorties, and everyone else, that this behaviour is absolutely normal and fine. You're shitting on real fucking living people who are having their lives destroyed for the sake of a glorified playground game. I'm sorry you don't want to think about that, but I don't think you can somehow claim that I'm being some sort of deliberately obtuse fly in the ointment just because I care about other members of the human race!

Crassly enjoying is stretching it. One of the grand tragedies of football is that the very people who find it most important are the same ones who get shat on by it. One article I read about a community of people who'd been promised improvements to their village that never materialised and had their entire community covered in dust due to nobody feeling it worthwhile to even tarmac the road still bought tickets to matches when they could scrape the money together. Football's a weird split between largely working class fans and (in some countries) large companies who profit from what are basically (or at least should be) community institutions. So sometimes you get those beautiful acts of resistance to the whole affair like FC United Of Manchester or AFC Wimbledon, and on the other hand there's the World Cup resulting in people getting bumped off for knowing about corruption in stadium building, Arsenal fleecing its fans or the haggard face of the Portsmouth fan I saw giving a talk about the destruction of his club by owners who couldn't care less.

It doesn't mean we shouldn't talk about the really horrible shit that's been going down of course, but talking about all of that and still enjoying the football is sort of the point for me. I don't think it's an insult to watch the games because of what's been done to people in South Africa since that's exactly what a good number of those people who got done over will be doing.

StaedlerMars · « **Reply #51 on:** 12 Jun 2010, 12:12 »

ouch. that must have been painful.

KvP · « **Reply #52 on:** 12 Jun 2010, 12:21 »

My it is such a good day for US DOMINATION

BP GO HOME

JD · « **Reply #53 on:** 12 Jun 2010, 14:58 »

These things were really annoying.

BlahBlah · « **Reply #54 on:** 12 Jun 2010, 15:01 »

I have Argentina in the office sweep, so hopefully I'll be winning at least a tenner.

Darke · « **Reply #55 on:** 12 Jun 2010, 15:40 »

It just gets funnier each time.

onewheelwizzard · « **Reply #56 on:** 12 Jun 2010, 15:56 »

Which Brit made the bigger mistake?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/jun/12/itv-england-world-cup-goal-gaffe

LeeC · « **Reply #57 on:** 12 Jun 2010, 17:33 »

Quote from: Darke on 12 Jun 2010, 15:40

It just gets funnier each time.

its like playing with a cat but keeping the toy just out of reach as its chasing it.

KharBevNor · « **Reply #58 on:** 12 Jun 2010, 17:34 »

I wrote a blog post about the football!

http://panzerdivisionjohncandy.blogspot.com/2010/06/fussball-fussball-uber-alles.html

It's prety scathing.

I guess I hate the working class or something pack of wolves?

I mean, I dunno, I guess a lot of working class people feel very strongly about Roman Catholicism but would you really try and support that particular institution?

est · « **Reply #59 on:** 12 Jun 2010, 17:55 »

Oh for fuck's sake. Yeah, because the SA govt is rounding up millions of people and trying to kill them. They put a few thousand homeless people into temporary accommodation during the World Cup. Oh no, that's fucking horrible.

StaedlerMars · « **Reply #60 on:** 12 Jun 2010, 18:00 »

That goal is just so painful. It's so incredibly painful to watch.

You just know that that guy's career is pretty much ruined.

KharBevNor · « **Reply #61 on:** 12 Jun 2010, 18:04 »

Quote from: est on 12 Jun 2010, 17:55

Oh for fuck's sake. Yeah, because the SA govt is rounding up millions of people and trying to kill them. They put a few thousand homeless people into temporary accommodation during the World Cup. Oh no, that's fucking horrible.

That's not really what they did at all!

Yeah I know you got to break a few poor, disenfranchised, ultimately expendable (you seem to believe) eggs to make an omelette, but that's life right?

This is bad because I was pretty sure you were actually a nice person?

amok · « **Reply #62 on:** 12 Jun 2010, 18:16 »

The blog post started well and the news article therein is an important read but the fascism bit is kind of a stretch, at best.

Quote from: StaedlerMars on 12 Jun 2010, 18:00

That goal is just so painful. It's so incredibly painful to watch.

You just know that that guy's career is pretty much ruined.

It's even worse than the Neville/Robinson OG from the Euro 2008 qualifiers 'cos at least that match was 2-0, so England would have lost anyway. This time it lost 'em 2 points.

Having said that, a draw tomorrow and both teams will fancy their chances at qualifying from the group. You'd still have to assume that SLO/ALG are the weaker 2 sides of the 4 I reckon.

est · « **Reply #63 on:** 12 Jun 2010, 18:22 »

Khar, I read the article you linked to and that is what I got from it. They moved a bunch of homeless people/squatters into a shanty town. South Africa and other countries like it do this pretty much any fucking time without anything to provoke it, so yeah of course they're gonna do it come an event like this.

est · « **Reply #64 on:** 12 Jun 2010, 18:37 »

Oh, and when I saw that goal I kinda hoped the US had won as a result. Football doesn't get as much attention as it should in the US, but as with everything people get interested in success, so success at this year's cup will help with that.

(Also because I had put $5 on the US winning due to it being 7:1 on odds)

a pack of wolves · « **Reply #65 on:** 12 Jun 2010, 19:11 »

Quote from: est on 12 Jun 2010, 18:22

Khar, I read the article you linked to and that is what I got from it. They moved a bunch of homeless people/squatters into a shanty town. South Africa and other countries like it do this pretty much any fucking time without anything to provoke it, so yeah of course they're gonna do it come an event like this.

So? None of that means that the occurrence isn't worth noting and getting angry about. You could say something pretty much the same about damn near every bad thing that ever happens.

Quote from: KharBevNor on 12 Jun 2010, 17:34

I wrote a blog post about the football!

http://panzerdivisionjohncandy.blogspot.com/2010/06/fussball-fussball-uber-alles.html

It's prety scathing.

I guess I hate the working class or something pack of wolves?

I mean, I dunno, I guess a lot of working class people feel very strongly about Roman Catholicism but would you really try and support that particular institution?

Oh come on, you know I never implied you hate the working class. And although football is pretty different to Catholicism there is a useful similarity in that how a religion like that functions on an individual level is very different to what those that run it want you to think. For one thing, I've never personally known a straight Catholic. Their reasons for sticking with a religion that officially condemned them for what they saw as their natural and not at all sinful desires were complex. Just like enjoying football. God knows I've no reason to stick up for FIFA, but enjoying football isn't as clear-cut as you're making it out to be.

And I know you weren't talking about club football, but with your fascist comparison in that blog post you do kind of skirt around the fact that by far the easiest way to identify an anti-fascist in the UK is if they're sporting the name of a professional football club:

KharBevNor · « **Reply #66 on:** 12 Jun 2010, 19:18 »

Quote from: amok on 12 Jun 2010, 18:16

The blog post started well and the news article therein is an important read but the fascism bit is kind of a stretch, at best.

You deny the fascist aesthetics associated with large international sporting events? Here is a quote from yesterdays Sun newspaper

Quote

WAYNE Rooney urged the whole nation to get behind England tonight - roaring: "Your support will drive us on to glory."
The Three Lions talisman was last night raring to take on the USA in the first of our World Cup group games.

And he begged fans to play their part - as he said of England's chances of going all the way in South Africa: "We're not scared of anyone."

Only the nation united, without dissent, can spurn our mystic elites on to the righteous victory the deserve. DO NOT THINK. ACT. ENGLAND ENGLAND ENGLAND.

Yeah I was specifically talking about not just international football but a certain class of international sports events with national teams. I'm not really making statements about enjoying football, although I'd still say the premiership type of football is more corporate sponsored bread and circuses than anything else. The difference between Manchester United and St. Pauli is the same as the difference between Coldplay and Stiff Little Fingers.

I would say the fact that I find football incomprehensible allows me to be more objective about it, or at least as objective about it in the opposite way as you are, if that makes sense.

Also I think you mean 'gay catholic'.

JD · « **Reply #67 on:** 12 Jun 2010, 22:00 »

sports to fascism is quite a leap

that's like working in a office, then deciding to take lion taming as a career.

look out! Ninjas! · « **Reply #68 on:** 12 Jun 2010, 22:24 »

It's less fascism and more nationalism.

Patrick · « **Reply #69 on:** 12 Jun 2010, 23:03 »

Troll effort: 0/5
Troll effect: 4/5

Halfway there, Khar, halfway there.

KharBevNor · « **Reply #70 on:** 13 Jun 2010, 01:22 »

I'm not trying to troll?

scarred · « **Reply #71 on:** 13 Jun 2010, 01:53 »

I build everything ever myself to avoid that kind of problem.

Dazed · « **Reply #72 on:** 13 Jun 2010, 01:53 »

You would listen to an iPod wouldn't you? FASCIST!

est · « **Reply #73 on:** 13 Jun 2010, 02:00 »

In about 8 or 9? hours I'm heading over to a mate's place to watch Australia v Germany and do an exceedingly early breakfast BBQ and probably drink espresso-themed alcoholic drinks or something. We know we're gonna lose, but we'll watch anyway.

Dliessmgg · « **Reply #74 on:** 13 Jun 2010, 02:38 »

Quote from: Zombiedude on 12 Jun 2010, 22:00

sports to fascism is quite a leap

They're not trying to harm anybody but it attracts Those People.

scarred · « **Reply #75 on:** 13 Jun 2010, 02:55 »

Quote from: tender on 13 Jun 2010, 02:03

And your very flesh shall be a great poem.

ugh i hate whitman

amok · « **Reply #76 on:** 13 Jun 2010, 02:58 »

Quote from: look out! Ninjas! on 12 Jun 2010, 22:24

It's less fascism and more nationalism.

Yeah exactly. The merits of which are debatable at best, but even though football is one of the more gaudy and obnoxious displays of nationalism on the calendar, it's merely an expression of it and not a root cause.

Besides, quoting the Sun is too easy because the tabloids are over-simplistic and nationalistic about anything.

Anyway, more importantly, today's predictions:

ALG 2 - 2 SLO
GER 3 - 1 AUS
SER 1 - 0 GHA

If either team wins the other match from England's group, you'd have to fancy them with an outside chance to progress if Eng or Team USA USA USA slip up in their remaining fixtures.

Patrick · « **Reply #77 on:** 13 Jun 2010, 03:03 »

I hope someplace with a hella shitty reputation just completely fucking rips Serbia apart, I think it'd be funny after all the nationalism and ethnic cleansing over the last billion years

Inlander · « **Reply #78 on:** 13 Jun 2010, 06:08 »

Algeria's goalkeeper just completely fluffed an attempted save and let Slovenia take a late 1-0 lead in their game. He probably did it to make Rob Green feel better. What a nice man!

amok · « **Reply #79 on:** 13 Jun 2010, 06:32 »

Yeah that was really odd, from his position he looked like he had it completely covered then it just slipped round him.

Still think Green's was worse but good to see some international GK solidarity.

Strange red card too.

Spluff · « **Reply #80 on:** 13 Jun 2010, 06:34 »

Khar, whilst the situation in South Africa is obviously not desBZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ

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BZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ

KharBevNor · « **Reply #81 on:** 13 Jun 2010, 07:45 »

Yeah I will admit it was pretty cool how the match sounded like a Lustmord album.

Also I saw a car sticker in a shop today, which had an outline of Africa with an England flag inside it and the strapline 'Football's Coming Home', which would seem even to the footy lover, I hope, slightly unfortunate given the history of the British Empire.

Alex C · « **Reply #82 on:** 13 Jun 2010, 08:26 »

Quote from: look out! Ninjas! on 12 Jun 2010, 22:24

It's less fascism and more nationalism.

Fascism is basically nationalism taken to the most mindless extreme. There are sports fans out there for whom the comparison is pretty apt, unfortunately. All the alcohol flying around doesn't help either, but ultimately you shouldn't care enough about the outcome of a game that you need to be pepper sprayed to stop fighting with other fans whether you're drunk or not.

amok · « **Reply #83 on:** 13 Jun 2010, 09:08 »

While this is true, it's (hopefully, anyway) going to be less relevant at the World Cup. The worst hooliganism generally involves gangs, essentially, who use football as an excuse to kick off rather than doing so purely as a result of their team losing. Far more common in league football between ultras etc. from different regions of the same country.

Not that I'm suggesting for a minute that there has never been any trouble as a result of a football team losing a match, which is pathetic, but terms like 'fascism' tend to get somewhat devalued by being tossed around in situations where it's either an exaggeration or doesn't tell the whole story.

BlahBlah · « **Reply #84 on:** 13 Jun 2010, 13:37 »

GERMANY!
GERMANY!
GERMANY!

amok · « **Reply #85 on:** 13 Jun 2010, 14:07 »

Games got better as the day went on;

Slovenia will be optimistic about being able to scrape through the group in second if they can hold the US.

Ghana are much better without Essien than I expected. Far more so, Germany without Ballack. England will have to win their group if they want to get past the round of 16, because Germany will be winning theirs and going a fair way further, on that form.

Fairly odd to have a red card in every game today too; especially as the first two were down to utterly incomprehensible behaviour from the players involved, and Australia's was probably undeserved.

KharBevNor · « **Reply #86 on:** 13 Jun 2010, 15:16 »

I think you're kinda missing the point of fascist aesthetics but ok w/e.

Patrick · « **Reply #87 on:** 13 Jun 2010, 21:01 »

Quote from: Patrick on 13 Jun 2010, 03:03

I hope someplace with a hella shitty reputation just completely fucking rips Serbia apart, I think it'd be funny after all the nationalism and ethnic cleansing over the last billion years

Hey guys guess what sorta barely happened

negative creep · « **Reply #88 on:** 14 Jun 2010, 05:59 »

Quote from: amok on 13 Jun 2010, 14:07

Germany without Ballack.

Fuck him. Nobody needs him.

David_Dovey · « **Reply #89 on:** 14 Jun 2010, 06:48 »

Oh my God, apparently the Australian loss to Germany is a DISASTER now. I don't even know where to start

McTaggart · « **Reply #90 on:** 14 Jun 2010, 07:27 »

I think disaster is pretty accurate. There was a lot of hope for the Socceroos and it was a huge blow to Our* pride. It's killed a lot of hype for the World Cup and generally everyone I've seen today has been glum or grumpy. Sure it's not a tsunami but there are degrees of disaster.

*I feel I'll need to explain this but exactly what I mean is kinda hard to pin down and I should really be studying.

Jimmy the Squid · « **Reply #91 on:** 14 Jun 2010, 07:32 »

Who the fuck thought we would beat Germany? Seriously people, how deluded do you have to be?

Inlander · « **Reply #92 on:** 14 Jun 2010, 07:32 »

Quote from: McTaggart on 14 Jun 2010, 07:27

Sure it's not a tsunami but there are degrees of disaster.

GOAL-NAMI

David_Dovey · « **Reply #93 on:** 14 Jun 2010, 07:33 »

I dunno man it's partly that horrible watering down of the word disaster but I'm used to news programs doing that shit by now. Really it is more that I am surprised everyone is so surprised, or something?

Like, I do not know much about soccer at all but Germany are really good, right? As in, may actually win. I think maybe I was always quite prepared to write 2006 off as an anomaly and that Australia should consider every World Cup we actually make it to as a blessing, let alone making it past the group stage.

Inlander · « **Reply #94 on:** 14 Jun 2010, 07:44 »

And while we're at it, does anyone else feel that it's kind of anticlimactic now that we're qualifying through Asia? Instead of playing a whole bunch of ridiculously easy games against island nations and then having to travel half-way around the world to play a South American team which was several leagues in class above us and all the teams we'd been recently playing against? Being in the World Cup this time doesn't really feel special.

McTaggart · « **Reply #95 on:** 14 Jun 2010, 07:52 »

I don't think anyone thought that we'd win it cleanly. 2 - 1 would've been cool. 2 - 0 would've been ok, but 4 - 0 and a red card against a headline player and the German coach's shrugging us off completely is more of a blow than anyone prepared for. We have a villain now though, so even if we don't make the finals (and then be up against what, England probably?) we have up to four other teams to barrack for.

Harry I think that's part of why people had such strong hopes: We qualified against much better teams and it's easier to feel like we're on par, instead of punching far above our weight.

amok · « **Reply #96 on:** 14 Jun 2010, 09:12 »

Quote from: negative creep on 14 Jun 2010, 05:59

Quote from: amok on 13 Jun 2010, 14:07
Germany without Ballack.

Fuck him. Nobody needs him.

Couldn't agree more mate.

Khedira looks great in that role and they've got more than enough fresh young talent up front to worry anyone. I know it's a lil' early to judge but they look like a class team.

scarred · « **Reply #97 on:** 14 Jun 2010, 11:56 »

ahahahaha

Slick · « **Reply #98 on:** 14 Jun 2010, 12:14 »

Are those shopped? I do not know.

a pack of wolves · « **Reply #99 on:** 14 Jun 2010, 12:34 »

Quote from: David_Dovey on 14 Jun 2010, 07:33

Like, I do not know much about soccer at all but Germany are really good, right? As in, may actually win. I think maybe I was always quite prepared to write 2006 off as an anomaly and that Australia should consider every World Cup we actually make it to as a blessing, let alone making it past the group stage.

There were a lot of doubts about Germany. Klose had a poor season in the Bundesliga and I think Podolski hadn't had a great one either. Talk seemed to be about Germany being in a transitional period and not at previous heights, so Australia weren't being delusional by thinking they had a shot or at least would give them a tough game. To be fair I don't think Australia played badly, Germany were playing like they could rip anyone apart.

Paraguay are currently leading Italy 1-0 as the second half starts, and they're playing tough defensive football so I'm hoping they can hold this lead until the end. I love a good upset, and this will be much more fun than a couple of the big teams being held to draws.

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Author Topic: The Quadrennial Global Round-Ball Extravaganza (Read 44841 times)