THESE FORUMS NOW CLOSED (read only)

  • 14 Jun 2024, 03:23
  • Welcome, Guest
Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Poll

The Moment of the Week in QC:

Chill And Understanding
- 0 (0%)
Faye Cliff Notes (and loading docks)
- 3 (5.9%)
The Angst Solstice
- 5 (9.8%)
"Are you gonna break up with me?"
- 2 (3.9%)
Something we gotta fix.
- 0 (0%)
Full Disclosure, Crazy Bitch and Sense of Timing
- 2 (3.9%)
"The first genuinely Nice Guy" she's been with
- 0 (0%)
"I love you." "I love you too."
- 10 (19.6%)
"LESS TALKING MORE HOT MAKE-UP SEX"
- 16 (31.4%)
Whole Social Circle imploding over no PANTS!
- 13 (25.5%)

Total Members Voted: 41


Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 ... 8   Go Down

Author Topic: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010 (1746-1750)  (Read 113284 times)

Is it cold in here?

  • Administrator
  • Awakened
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 25,163
  • He/him/his pronouns
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #150 on: 08 Sep 2010, 01:07 »

...(I'll also remind you anyone who has to utterly win an argument with his or her SO better really enjoy winning, because that will, sooner or later, be all they have).... And if you need to know how to win an argument with the person you love, this is it. You don't crow, you don't require utter submission, and you make sure it's understood where you want things to go from here without being a tool about it. I don't know if it's well known, but a person in a position of strength shows it by being magnanimous. It's the precarious weakling who requires the genuflect.

How can anyone that wise not like dogs?
Logged
Thank you, Dr. Karikó.

akronnick

  • Only pretending to work
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2,188
  • I'm freakin' out, man!!!!
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #151 on: 08 Sep 2010, 01:13 »

...drive-by water-balloonings of Dora's ex-boyfriends...


Can QC just be that from now on?
Logged
Akronnick, I can think of no more appropriate steed for a Knight Of The Dickbroom than a foul-mouthed, perpetually shouting, lust-crazed bird with a scrotum hanging from its chin and a distinctive cry of "Gobble gobble gobble".   --Tergon

themacnut

  • Vagina Manifesto
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 690
    • The Vanguard-Superhero Space Opera Action
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #152 on: 08 Sep 2010, 01:15 »

That could be fun for the next few pages. Not to mention therapeutic for Dora.
Logged
The Vanguard - superhero space opera

raoullefere

  • Duck attack survivor
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1,610
  • Rock 'n Roll is cool, Daddy, and you know it!
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #153 on: 08 Sep 2010, 01:16 »

I disagree that Marten "won" - because there wasn't a competition.  Using the term "win" at all is a major problem in this discussion.
Hence all my little quote marks. But you're wrong; there is a competition, a struggle between Dora and her insecurity for her future. Marten (with the aid of an opening sortie by Faye's Furies) just won a battle for the former; now Dora has to take the field, because the war's just starting. I really doubt insecurity's going down easy, either.

All this clamouring for Marten to say something like: "I need you to know that you hurt me and made me angry" sounds like something off Dr. Phil.
Well said. Of course, Dr. Phil definitely makes me foam at the mouth. Oprah's got much to answer for…someday. If certain portions of her anatomy don't get her first.

Meanwhile, may I say possibly Jeph's best damn 'drama' strip ever? Both the scripting and the art? Managing both to do a little tearjerking (from Akima and Tergon, of course—never me) and still deliver a punchline? Whoops, too late, I did.

Now I'm off to take my grumping pills. I've clearly become much too cheerful…
Logged
GOM (Grumpy Old Men): Complaining about attire, trespassing, loud music, and general cheerfulness since before you were born, Missy.

Tergon

  • The German Chancellory building
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 487
  • Grandmaster of the Order of the Dickbroom
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #154 on: 08 Sep 2010, 01:28 »

Meanwhile, may I say possibly Jeph's best damn 'drama' strip ever? Both the scripting and the art? Managing both to do a little tearjerking (from Akima and Tergon, of course—never me) and still deliver a punchline? Whoops, too late, I did.

No, I just had... something in my eye.

It's nothing.

Don't look at me.
Logged
Proud guardian of the original Useless Broom Made Entirely Out Of Dicks

Holding the line against the Rabid Fanboy Horde

Fenriswolf

  • Pneumatic ratchet pants
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 319
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #155 on: 08 Sep 2010, 01:37 »

Now I'm off to take my grumping pills. I've clearly become much too cheerful…
Heeee. Love it. I seem to have a never-ending supply of those...

Yeah, as someone who is insecure in a very different way to Dora (no going off over stupid things, just waking my partner up in the middle of the night to make him re-iterate that he does want to be with me, even though I'm mental), I can tell you someone looking like Dora does in the first panel is in quite a lot of pain, and there is no need to be a wanker on top of it.

Sure, I would have liked him to actually say "you have got to get a handle on yourself, walk away until you think clearly, something" but his reaction was still fine and a damn sight better than staying angry - the kind of angry that would probably be the cold eyes + leaving her on the couch to go to bed without talking, is what I imagine of Marten. Could be wrong.
Logged

Switchblade

  • 1-800-SCABIES
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 846
  • WTF was I thinking when I picked this name?
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #156 on: 08 Sep 2010, 02:46 »

It's funny, if you listened to the right people on these forums, you could learn everything you need to about how to have a healthy relationship. There's some solid Gold advice and observations being shared here.
Logged
ROCK MORE, ROLL MORE, LURK MOAR

Ferahgo the Assassin

  • Plantmonster
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 31
    • http://ferahgo-the-assassin.deviantart.com/
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #157 on: 08 Sep 2010, 02:56 »

It's funny, if you listened to the right people on these forums, you could learn everything you need to about how to have a healthy relationship. There's some solid Gold advice and observations being shared here.

Unfortunately, it's often lost amongst the sea of people who obviously have no experience.
Logged

no one special

  • Curry sauce
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 293
  • I been rockin' this brainslug since I was like, 5.
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #158 on: 08 Sep 2010, 02:58 »

Grammar vs  idiom - no winners there, either!

Language is what is used; grammar is a post hoc  attempt to rationalise it

I disagree, but respect your opinion  :)

I feel that "me" vs. "I" is a question of grammar, and not an idiom.  If you said "scared to death" and I corrected it to "frightened to an unsettling degree," then we could argue that it was idiom vs. semantics.

While I admit that I was in kind of a douche-y mood when I posted that wholly unnecessary correction... I still think it's correct  ;-)
Logged
Quote from: Kai
if I was making music I would want to be able to eat. If you download it, at least like, make me a fucking sandwich or send me some pop tarts or something.

akronnick

  • Only pretending to work
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2,188
  • I'm freakin' out, man!!!!
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #159 on: 08 Sep 2010, 03:02 »

Unfortunately, it's often lost amongst the sea of people who obviously have no experience.


Just listen to us folks clinging desperately to our Useless Brooms Made Entirely Of Dicks.

We know what we're talking about.





Or we're completely full of shit, I forget...
Logged
Akronnick, I can think of no more appropriate steed for a Knight Of The Dickbroom than a foul-mouthed, perpetually shouting, lust-crazed bird with a scrotum hanging from its chin and a distinctive cry of "Gobble gobble gobble".   --Tergon

Switchblade

  • 1-800-SCABIES
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 846
  • WTF was I thinking when I picked this name?
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #160 on: 08 Sep 2010, 03:16 »

It's funny, if you listened to the right people on these forums, you could learn everything you need to about how to have a healthy relationship. There's some solid Gold advice and observations being shared here.

Unfortunately, it's often lost amongst the sea of people who obviously have no experience.

yeah, that's the part I was leaving out.
Logged
ROCK MORE, ROLL MORE, LURK MOAR

Random832

  • Bizarre cantaloupe phobia
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 234
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #161 on: 08 Sep 2010, 04:35 »

I believe Martens timing is only fair. Dora wants full disclosure and probably would have been more irked had he waited or she find out later.

I can't even think of any possible way his timing could be better, unless Dora is judging by very different criteria [annoyed at the _inability_ to turn it into more drama, either before or by finding out later]
Logged

Dr. ROFLPWN

  • Beyond Thunderdome
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 575
  • Farmin' all these goddamn mushrooms.
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #162 on: 08 Sep 2010, 04:40 »

Unfortunately, it's often lost amongst the sea of people who obviously have no experience.


Just listen to us folks clinging desperately to our Useless Brooms Made Entirely Of Dicks.

We know what we're talking about.





Or we're completely full of shit, I forget...

I would say that the noble members of the Order of the Dickbroom are the ones dispensing the most sage wisdom, to mine eyes.

There are dudes I know who tried the "I'm not a pansy" response and called their SOs out and made them grovel. Also girls. Inevitably, those relationships ended pretty quick after that.
Logged
Fuckin' pain in the ass.

jwhouk

  • Awakened
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11,022
  • The Valley of the Sun
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #163 on: 08 Sep 2010, 06:03 »

He did say, "It's something we've gotta fix", though. That implies that they're going to work on the issue in the future, but for this very instant he just wants to reassure her that he's not about to walk away from the relationship.

I find it pretty puzzling that Marten *isn't* mad, but hey, that's how he functions - he was mad, he thought about it, now he's calmly made a decision about it. It might help the situation if Dora had actually been allowed to see firsthand that Marten was mad, but she seems to be finally understanding, thanks to Faye's smackdown, that anger is reasonable in this situation and she was in the wrong, so I think that's what'll make the real difference here.

Y'all ever been in love? Ever been REALLY mad at the woman/man/thing you love deeply, for whatever reason? So mad that you storm off in the middle of the night? Then, when you come back, you're halfway ready to ream her/him/it out? And there she/he/it sits, looking sad and forlorn because they've made you so mad, and you suddenly remember all the reasons why you love her/him/it in the first place, and you can't possibly STAY mad at her/him/it.

THAT is what his happening here.


But when is the future? Is it later that day? Next week? The next time she spazzes out because OMG HE HUGGED HANNELORE (hypothetical scenario, do not analyze)? That future strip may be satisfying, but this one is very much not.

"The journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step."

EDIT: Oh, and Raoullefere: (CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP) Good job.
« Last Edit: 08 Sep 2010, 06:15 by jwhouk »
Logged
"Character is what you are in the Dark." - D.L. Moody
There is no joke that can be made online without someone being offended by it.
Life's too short to be ashamed of how you were born.
Just another Joe like 46

Carl-E

  • Awakened
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 10,346
  • The distilled essence of Mr. James Beam himself.
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #164 on: 08 Sep 2010, 06:55 »

I gotta stop posting before I get enough sleep. 

OK, I actually had a point in the first of those two points in my last post.  I agree with Raoullefere, Akima, Tergon et al that it doesn't really matter that Faye helped Dora get to the point where Marten found her, the important thing was that she was at that point.  I agree. 

My point was simply that Faye got Dora to that point, being one of the best friends there could be, one who isn't afraid to call a friend on their bullshit.  Without her, Dora may have reached that point on her own, lying awake after Marten had left, realizing what she'd done, and would still have been there waiting pitifully for him to get back and dump her / dump on her. 

Then again, maybe not.  She could easily have drifted off upset.  Had Marten woken her upon his arrival, she may well have still been in "rawr" mode.  With a good night's sleep, she may have realized what she'd done and become contrite, but that's pretty doubtful - she probably wouldn't have had a good night's sleep if she went to bed upset, and would've been in a foul mood upon waking.  Things would not have gone nearly as well...

Marten owes Faye a lot for bringing Dora quickly and efficiently to this point, and he doesn't even know it.  Not yet, at least.  But hey, what are friends for? 

There's one other thing that's been bothering me since yesterday's comic.  In the second panel, Marten says "OK, I think I know how to handle this Dora thing now."  It's taken a day (nearly two), but I pinpointed it.  It's the word "handle" that's bothering me.  It just doesn't sound like Marten - it sounds manipulative, like "OK, I'll go and pour on the patended Marten Reed "Aw shucks" charm, and all will be well". 

OK, I think I understand where she's coming from. 

OK, I think we can work through this. 

OK, so she's not really psychotic. 

OK, I won't have to dump her ass.  Sorry, that's another thread...

But "handlie this Dora thing" just bothers me for some reason.  You handle stress, or grief, or other emotions, they're internal.  When it involves another person, it's not handling. 

It's helping. 


[/wall o' text]
Logged
When people try to speak a gut reaction, they end up talking out their ass.

Tergon

  • The German Chancellory building
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 487
  • Grandmaster of the Order of the Dickbroom
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #165 on: 08 Sep 2010, 07:32 »

I almost agree... but I think the key issue here is that Marten really does have to "Handle" Dora right now.  In much the same way you would, if you'll excuse the metaphor, handle a small injured animal.  You need to help it, you need to take care of it, but to achieve this you first need to make sure it won't panic and lash out, hurting you or itself.  As much as I do feel sympathy for Dora, particularly now that the predicted crash has arrived is here, the simple fact is that this is how she's behaving.  Not rationally, not logically, but running off pain and emotion, and that's how Marten has to treat her if he wants to help.

I suppose in a very broad sense of the term, he is manipulating her.  He's guiding her and helping her to move toward a resolution it seems unlikely she'd manage on her own.  And in doing so he's treating her with kid gloves... not because he may want to, but because if he doesn't, it could so easily blow up in his face.  I saw it as a particularly good turn of phrase for this reason - Marten has recognized the problem, and has chosen the manner in which he plans to face the problem.  Now, the problem is Dora's trust issues, yes, but as long as she's running on emotion, she's letting herself be ruled by those issues.  And if she's being ruled by the issues, then she's personifying the issues.  In a very direct way, Dora is the problem, at least until Marten manages to get through to her.  And, as such, he has to handle her carefully until he's dealing not with the bundle of pain and emotions, but with the lady he loves.

That's how I took "handle this Dora thing" to mean.  Not that he's going to control and manipulate her, but that he's going to take this slowly and gently.  More of a Handle With Care, if you will.  And the fact that Marten not only recognizes that he should deal with this problem carefully, but actually does plan to deal with it, is something I see as a tremendous leap forward for them.
Logged
Proud guardian of the original Useless Broom Made Entirely Out Of Dicks

Holding the line against the Rabid Fanboy Horde

Graphite

  • Pneumatic ratchet pants
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 337
  • the final frontier?!
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #166 on: 08 Sep 2010, 07:35 »

He did say, "It's something we've gotta fix", though. That implies that they're going to work on the issue in the future, but for this very instant he just wants to reassure her that he's not about to walk away from the relationship.

I find it pretty puzzling that Marten *isn't* mad, but hey, that's how he functions - he was mad, he thought about it, now he's calmly made a decision about it. It might help the situation if Dora had actually been allowed to see firsthand that Marten was mad, but she seems to be finally understanding, thanks to Faye's smackdown, that anger is reasonable in this situation and she was in the wrong, so I think that's what'll make the real difference here.

Y'all ever been in love? Ever been REALLY mad at the woman/man/thing you love deeply, for whatever reason? So mad that you storm off in the middle of the night? Then, when you come back, you're halfway ready to ream her/him/it out? And there she/he/it sits, looking sad and forlorn because they've made you so mad, and you suddenly remember all the reasons why you love her/him/it in the first place, and you can't possibly STAY mad at her/him/it.

THAT is what his happening here.
Yeah, you're right - upon further reflection, that is exactly the most plausible emotional response in the situation from a well-balanced character like Marten.
Logged

someone1074

  • Balloon animal serial killer
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 95
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #167 on: 08 Sep 2010, 08:50 »

I'm on the side that feels that this wasn't handled well but I recognize that it could be because Jeph just might not want to write a lengthy and wordy comic for this resolution.

The only reason I disagree with how it was handled (and a few of the posters here) was solely out of personal experience. Every woman I've ever been with who did awful things or had insecurity issues went right back to behaving that way when treated with the kid gloves. It wasn't until the issue was completely explored, sometimes right at the height of an episode, that they began bettering themselves.

But again, that was personal experience. I recognize that there are unique people out there and, more than anything else, I recognize that this is a comic. If Jeph wants to write that Dora becomes a better person after just this, that's fine. Perhaps Faye got to her. That alone could plausibly suffice as a wake up call since I don't think anyone spoke to her like that before.
Logged

Carl-E

  • Awakened
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 10,346
  • The distilled essence of Mr. James Beam himself.
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #168 on: 08 Sep 2010, 08:59 »

I almost agree... but I think the key issue here is that Marten really does have to "Handle" Dora right now. 

<regretful *snip*, 'cause it's so good>


Thank you Tergon.  That helps a lot.  He does have to "handle" her until she's stable, and able to deal with what's happening to her.  Whether she was contrite or psychotic (or asleep) when he got back, he'd have to adjust his approach until he could reach the real Dora, and not the bundle of pain and hurt. 

Now please, stop pointing that broom at me.  You never know if it's loaded...
Logged
When people try to speak a gut reaction, they end up talking out their ass.

raoullefere

  • Duck attack survivor
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1,610
  • Rock 'n Roll is cool, Daddy, and you know it!
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #169 on: 08 Sep 2010, 09:30 »

May I add that 'to handle' is often an idiom synonymous with 'to deal with' or 'to approach'? As in "I can handle that" or even "I've got a handle on it." (Swats casually at the idiom-folk with his duplicate UBMEOD to quiet them for a moment). I read that line as Marten saying "Okay, I think I know how I'm going to deal with these meltdowns Dora's been having," said meltdowns being the 'Dora thing,' which is why that's not a good word to bandy about too often.

I'll agree with Tergon that Marten does need to 'handle' Dora in the other sense; as he said, to help her. But I don't really think that's what he meant when Marten said that to Sven. Of course, he may be attempting to become more laconic, and thus make every word that can do double-duty.

(On that note, assuming Marten knows, as do I, that thing was originally used to mean 'meeting,' 'Dora thing' takes on an entirely new nuance, and Marten's laconic abilities quickly shoot up to EPIC.)

Edit:
Y'all ever been in love? Ever been REALLY mad at the woman/man/thing you love deeply, for whatever reason? So mad that you storm off in the middle of the night? Then, when you come back, you're halfway ready to ream her/him/it out? And there she/he/it sits, looking sad and forlorn because they've made you so mad, and you suddenly remember all the reasons why you love her/him/it in the first place, and you can't possibly STAY mad at her/him/it.

THAT is what his happening here.
Yes. That's what I meant about this being some of Jeph's best dramatic work, and why Tergon's crying, and I would be, if I weren't such a hard-ass. Been there, done that, from both positions.
« Last Edit: 08 Sep 2010, 09:47 by raoullefere »
Logged
GOM (Grumpy Old Men): Complaining about attire, trespassing, loud music, and general cheerfulness since before you were born, Missy.

Buggman

  • Not quite a lurker
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 16
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #170 on: 08 Sep 2010, 10:03 »


Yeah, as someone who is insecure in a very different way to Dora (no going off over stupid things, just waking my partner up in the middle of the night to make him re-iterate that he does want to be with me, even though I'm mental), I can tell you someone looking like Dora does in the first panel is in quite a lot of pain, and there is no need to be a wanker on top of it.

Gotta agree with you there.  My wife has similar insecurity issues.  Every time we have a fight, she becomes terrified that I'm going to become fed up and leave her.  The cool-down of every fight, therefore, must include me reassuring her that I love her and being calm and gentle with her, or else she'll spend the whole night awake and freaked out.  It's actually been good for my growth as a person, as I'm normally very aggressive and brusque and my wife's insecurities mean I'm having to learn to be more sensitive.

But yeah, coming in still mad at someone with insecurity issues after you've cooled down from the initial fight?  Not a great idea.  Not if you want the relationship to last or the person to heal.

Shalom.
Logged
"Your failure to be informed does not make me a kook."

Moxie

  • Furry furrier
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 154
  • Shinier than thou
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #171 on: 08 Sep 2010, 10:37 »

The comic I read:

Marten knows Dora is remorseful because he can see her sitting on the couch, curled up into almost a fetal position and looking doleful when he walks in....Also, he might have a clue by her asking "Are you gonna break up with me?" That's an admission of guilt and more—it puts Marten in the driver's seat, because he gets to decide what happens. That's submission, folks....Then Dora apologizes, and Marten accepts—more submission....Marten accepts—that's what 'it's okay' means—and immediately attaches a condition for continuing the relationship. Then Dora further acknowledges she was wrong by asking if Marten is 'mad' at her. This is an admission that Dora thinks Marten has a right to be angry, and perhaps that why he's not mad is nowhere near as important as the fact that he's not. That's enough for now.....At the same time, he's showing Dora how unlike those other assholes he truly is. An Alpha-Goth Grade-A asshole, I'm guessing, would need a grovel...


Raoullefere, you posted a theory in last week's thread that I really agreed with - namely, Dora is a master of the self-fulfilling prophesy. Relationship-wise, she sets herself up to fail, deals with a crappy relationship (while further lowering her self-esteem), and then watches as the relationship fails (presumably this involves being dumped by the guy). You pointed out that she started this relationship with Marten with the same idea in mind (because Marten was obviously attracted to Faye)...but then Marten was different. And now she doesn't know what to do, so she chooses to lash out in a preemptive "hurt them before they hurt me" fashion.

I really like that theory. I also think it really fits in neatly with what Sven told us about Dora's dating history. And if that ends up being right, that's why I'm bothered by her in today's comic.

The whole thing reeked of her expectations. I have no doubt that Faye's comment sparked something in Dora (like the realization that now the relationship might be ending, and Dora really doesn't want it to end) and so she's sitting there, waiting for Marten to come home so that the other shoe can drop and he'll break up with her and she just move on with her life, just like she was expecting.

I read her dialog completely different. It wasn't submission to me, it was resignation. She started off the conversation by flat-out asking if Marten was gonna break up with her - she expected it. When he told her no, she immediately apologized. To me, this was her trying to salvage the relationship, but she still can't believe Marten's not gonna get mad at her, or do something to her, or whatever - she has to verify again that he's not mad at her. His behavior is not what she expected.

Unfortunately, I also don't think Dora was really hearing what he was saying ("we need to fix this"/"you should have listened"). I don't think she really heard that because she was too wrapped up in her own unhappiness/expectations/whatever. Marten's honesty is something she finally heard - and I really hope she appreciates that in him, timing or no - but I think she focused in a bit more there because she was expecting to hear something...more there, maybe.

I think she keeps looking for signs that Marten is like those other guys, and she keeps not getting them, and so she has to imagine them because she can't fathom that there are guys out there who would treat her much better than past boyfriends. I think that the way tonight's conversation went, it was about Dora's expecting that sort of behavior from Marten and not getting it, and not really listening to what he was saying - at first.
I can see Marten thinking there's some resolution from this conversation, but I'm not convinced there is on Dora's side. Yet.
Logged

Border Reiver

  • Born in a Nalgene bottle
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3,189
  • Yes, I painted this.
    • The Pet Patch
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #172 on: 08 Sep 2010, 11:15 »

There is a time in the disagreement with the SO where you simply have to say the words so that things are on the table.  Then you get the opportunity to reflect on what you've said and done.

After that you've got to reaffirm that the words are there, what it means and then look at how you're actually gonna do it.

That isn't going to happen when you're mad, nor is it reasonable to expect a very abrupt personality shift.  Working through problems is most definitely not a case of going "Dammit, that was the problem, now I've got it solved and it will never happen again!"  Magical thinking isn't helpful, and the work needed to work through a signifigant psychological issue is certainly not going to happen in the space of the couple of hours that the last few strips have covered, or by one person's unilateral action.
Logged
"It's a futile gesture that my sense of right and wrong tells me I should make." Is It Cold Here, 19 Mar 2013, 02:12

IanClark

  • Furry furrier
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 156
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #173 on: 08 Sep 2010, 11:48 »

I read her dialog completely different. It wasn't submission to me, it was resignation. She started off the conversation by flat-out asking if Marten was gonna break up with her - she expected it. When he told her no, she immediately apologized. To me, this was her trying to salvage the relationship, but she still can't believe Marten's not gonna get mad at her, or do something to her, or whatever - she has to verify again that he's not mad at her. His behavior is not what she expected.

That's one way to look at it, but on the other hand, examine all of the people on this forum saying he should break up with her. Even though I think that sentiment is somewhat unrealistic and only a little bit cruel, it is a sentiment that is held by rational people. Dora thinking that Marten's going to break up with her isn't necessarily because of her past boyfriends, it could just as easily (I'd argue more easily) be because she realizes that she actually did do something horrible and that if Marten was himself in a particularly irrational mood (as he might've been had he not run into Sven) he might actually break up with her over this. Plus, Faye did directly imply that Dora might have already fucked up the relationship. I think Dora's expectations in this case are self-reflective. I used to date a girl who in situations like this would usually say something along the lines of "I'd break up with me." I think that's what Dora's doing.

Quote
Unfortunately, I also don't think Dora was really hearing what he was saying ("we need to fix this"/"you should have listened"). I don't think she really heard that because she was too wrapped up in her own unhappiness/expectations/whatever. Marten's honesty is something she finally heard - and I really hope she appreciates that in him, timing or no - but I think she focused in a bit more there because she was expecting to hear something...more there, maybe.

Her last line included the phrase "If I'm going to work on being a crazy bitch". I think that after Faye yelling at her, she's probably already become completely aware that she's going to have to work on her jealousy issues, and that's why she's not reacting to that part in particular. The only parts of the entire conversation that she hasn't had in her own head a million times already are the part where Marten's not mad and the part where he's wearing Faye's pants. Admittedly, it would probably be wise of her to say something along the lines of "I know I have to work on my issues and I'm going to before it tears us apart", but I think that she was so surprised at Marten's lack of anger that it dominated her immediate mind at the moment. It's not that she's not thinking it, it's just that it's not the first thing that comes out of her mouth.

Quote
I think she keeps looking for signs that Marten is like those other guys, and she keeps not getting them, and so she has to imagine them because she can't fathom that there are guys out there who would treat her much better than past boyfriends. I think that the way tonight's conversation went, it was about Dora's expecting that sort of behavior from Marten and not getting it, and not really listening to what he was saying - at first.

I think the only time she does that is reflexively, like when she saw Marten and Faye in their underwear. Her mind immediately went to "I've seen this before." She has a habit of jumping to conclusions but in order for the relationship to have lasted this long, the logical part of her brain must actually believe that Marten is different. She's speaking from that part of her brain now, and a guy breaking up with her over something she did which was horrible but probably not horrible enough to break up with her over is kind of way down the list of bad things guys have done with her when you compare it to being cheated on or being treated like shit. Consider that if her exes were as bad as Sven says, more than a few of them probably would have hit her in a situation like this. She's not flinching, she's not wincing. She's not expecting Marten to break up with her because she thinks he's like the others, she's expecting him to break up with her because she thinks it would be justified.
Logged

Moxie

  • Furry furrier
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 154
  • Shinier than thou
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #174 on: 08 Sep 2010, 12:05 »

I think Dora's expectations in this case are self-reflective. I used to date a girl who in situations like this would usually say something along the lines of "I'd break up with me." I think that's what Dora's doing....
...She's not expecting Marten to break up with her because she thinks he's like the others, she's expecting him to break up with her because she thinks it would be justified.

Snipping a bit to just focus on these two parts. I very strongly feel that Dora's still within the scope of her self-fulfilling prophesy.

If in the past she's had manipulative guys cheat on her and then convince her it's her fault they just had to do it, I'm quite certain that would stick with a person. So, if Dora's been half-expecting Marten to break up with her (probably because of Faye), then it stands to follow that she'd see him reacting the way her exes have reacted in the past - she's half trying to guide him down that path because, as far as she knows, it's the only path there is.
That's not to say that Marten won't be a help to her, because I think he will be, it's just that Dora isn't entirely able to hear what he's saying to her because she herself isn't there yet. She is still expecting the worst of the situation because that's all she's been conditioned for.
Logged

Heliphyneau

  • Pneumatic ratchet pants
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 315
  • Mommy, why is a naked clown crying on our lawn?
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #175 on: 08 Sep 2010, 14:19 »

I refuse to say the "name" of that creature on page 2 of this thread, but I will say that he has split the difference between hat and hair by wearing a hat apparently made of his own pubes.

Ya know, some of us actually try to sleep at night...

Thanks for that lovely image.  I need to retch now. 

Hee.  Sorry?  I am occasionally descriptive to an unpleasant degree.  Let's just say I'm fun to have at the dinner table.

i'd just like to say that it amuses me that dora's panties match her hair. can we all at least agree on that?

I do agree with that!   :-D

As an aside, I think that Marten went "full disclosure" on Dora at that point while she was contrite and calm to 1. get it out of the way and 2. avoid her blowing up again.  He may need to work on his timing, but his apparent ill-timing here works in his favor.

I read that line as Marten saying "Okay, I think I know how I'm going to deal with these meltdowns Dora's been having," said meltdowns being the 'Dora thing,' which is why that's not a good word to bandy about too often.

That's how I read it as well -- that Marten is going to try and handle the problem Dora's having, not Dora herself (although, taken literally, I'm sure she'd be happy to be handled once she's in a better mood).

Looking forward to hearing (or hearing about) the rest of . . . the conversation.

Page two . . .
Logged
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
Actually, I would posit that purple elephants do not contribute to the ruination of everything forever in any way.

jwhouk

  • Awakened
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11,022
  • The Valley of the Sun
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #176 on: 08 Sep 2010, 14:47 »

<wall o'text removed>
Ahhhhh. I think I got it now. You're thinking the next move for Dora is that she's going to find some way (unconsciously, subconsciously or whatever) to sabotage the relationship. In essence, "ramp it up".

Which means DoraTai might still be in the cards... <eeeewwwwwwww>
Logged
"Character is what you are in the Dark." - D.L. Moody
There is no joke that can be made online without someone being offended by it.
Life's too short to be ashamed of how you were born.
Just another Joe like 46

jwhouk

  • Awakened
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11,022
  • The Valley of the Sun
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #177 on: 08 Sep 2010, 14:52 »

Who will Marten run into next?

Angus.    - 1 (1.9%)
Hannelore.    - 7 (13%)
Steve.    - 4 (7.4%)
Faye.    - 2 (3.7%)
Dora.    - 9 (16.7%) <--- Winner Winner Chicken Dinner
JEPH! (Talk about META)    - 15 (27.8%)
Pintsize    - 5 (9.3%)
Someone wielding the UBMEOD.    - 11 (20.4%)

Total Voters: 54
Logged
"Character is what you are in the Dark." - D.L. Moody
There is no joke that can be made online without someone being offended by it.
Life's too short to be ashamed of how you were born.
Just another Joe like 46

pwhodges

  • Admin emeritus
  • Awakened
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 17,241
  • I'll only say this once...
    • My home page
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #178 on: 08 Sep 2010, 14:54 »

his apparent ill-timing here works in his favor.

It wasn't ill timing at all.  Disclosure was sensible, even if trivial; and it gave Dora the opportunity to criticise Marten a little, which meant that their talk wasn't so one-sided, and so started to rebuild Dora's confidence.
Logged
"Being human, having your health; that's what's important."  (from: Magical Shopping Arcade Abenobashi )
"As long as we're all living, and as long as we're all having fun, that should do it, right?"  (from: The Eccentric Family )

IanClark

  • Furry furrier
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 156
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #179 on: 08 Sep 2010, 16:59 »

I think Dora's expectations in this case are self-reflective. I used to date a girl who in situations like this would usually say something along the lines of "I'd break up with me." I think that's what Dora's doing....
...She's not expecting Marten to break up with her because she thinks he's like the others, she's expecting him to break up with her because she thinks it would be justified.

Snipping a bit to just focus on these two parts. I very strongly feel that Dora's still within the scope of her self-fulfilling prophesy.

If in the past she's had manipulative guys cheat on her and then convince her it's her fault they just had to do it, I'm quite certain that would stick with a person. So, if Dora's been half-expecting Marten to break up with her (probably because of Faye), then it stands to follow that she'd see him reacting the way her exes have reacted in the past - she's half trying to guide him down that path because, as far as she knows, it's the only path there is.
That's not to say that Marten won't be a help to her, because I think he will be, it's just that Dora isn't entirely able to hear what he's saying to her because she herself isn't there yet. She is still expecting the worst of the situation because that's all she's been conditioned for.

I think I see where you're coming from, and I think it's a possibility, but I don't think it's a likely one.

Sven's said that all of Dora's previous boyfriends were douchebags, but he actually specified the particular type of douchebag. He said that they were all alpha-goth types. To me, this means one of two things: Either they were trying to be the alpha-goth (in other words, the most goth they could be), or they were alpha types who were also goth. The first one is kind of cartoonish and silly and so I'm going to assume it's the second one. I'd have to imagine most of Dora's exes have been misanthropes, possibly sadists, who thrive on domination and demand to be viewed as the superior one in any relationship. In other words, when they cheat on a girl and tell her it's her fault, they don't say it's because she's a crazy bitch who drove him into the arms of another woman, they cheated on her because she's inadequate. She's not good enough in bed, she doesn't suck his dick enough, the other girl doesn't cry when he sticks it up her ass, he's still going to fuck her because he can juggle both and dammit she should be glad he still gives her the time of day for a quick fuck whenever he says so. (Sorry if that was offensive to anyone Sorry that was so horribly offensive period, that's not how I actually feel, I'm just writing the mindset). When they get caught, they don't try to hide it, and if she can't "deal with it" then the relationship is over. On their terms.

From there, it has to be apparent to Dora that she's dealing with a different situation. Marten doesn't demean her in public or in private, he makes jokes at his own expense and he's okay when she's the one suggesting sex (or suggesting not having sex, as the case was when they first started seeing each other).

I think that her paranoia is a lot more generalized than a self-fulfilling prophecy. Since it's apparent that Marten's not the same as the other guys she's dated, she probably doesn't think that the relationship is going to happen exactly the same way. She's just been left with extreme levels of paranoia from her previous relationships that are causing her to write a new self-fulfilling prophecy with details that are actually pertinent to the current situation. She believes that Marten's going to leave her for Faye, and the jealousy she's exhibits is causing friction which could, at high enough levels, succeed in driving Marten away, and presumably into the arms of Faye if she was willing.

Lastly, I still feel that today's strip features Dora while not in the throes of her issues. The reason she feels that Marten is going to leave her is because a lot of guys would. They might regret it later, but that soon after someone does something that horrible to you (and to your best friend), there's a tendency to overreact, or to panic. He went out for a walk to calm down and try to put it all in perspective, but in the end it was only an outside perspective that actually helped him figure anything out. In an alternate universe, say one where he ran into Tai and she was baked enough to try to talk Marten into leaving Dora (more Dora for her), he might've actually ended up breaking up with her. Her issues caused her to snap, but the reason she thinks Marten's going to leave her is because it's actually a possibility.

If Dora was acting the way she would've in previous relationships (or worse actually trying to guide the relationship down the same path) she probably would've reacted with deflated sadness to the scene of Marten and Faye in their underwear rather than anger, and when Marten walked back in, she probably would've been bracing herself for a lot worse.
Logged

Heliphyneau

  • Pneumatic ratchet pants
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 315
  • Mommy, why is a naked clown crying on our lawn?
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #180 on: 08 Sep 2010, 17:48 »

his apparent ill-timing here works in his favor.

It wasn't ill timing at all.  Disclosure was sensible, even if trivial; and it gave Dora the opportunity to criticise Marten a little, which meant that their talk wasn't so one-sided, and so started to rebuild Dora's confidence.

Indeed, hence my use of the word "apparent."
Logged
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
Actually, I would posit that purple elephants do not contribute to the ruination of everything forever in any way.

Kugai

  • CIA Handler of Miss Melody Powers
  • Awakened
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11,493
  • Crazy Kiwi Shoujo-Ai Fan
    • My Homepage
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #181 on: 08 Sep 2010, 17:58 »

Who will Marten run into next?

Angus.    - 1 (1.9%)
Hannelore.    - 7 (13%)
Steve.    - 4 (7.4%)
Faye.    - 2 (3.7%)
Dora.    - 9 (16.7%) <--- Winner Winner Chicken Dinner[/u]
JEPH! (Talk about META)    - 15 (27.8%)
Pintsize    - 5 (9.3%)
Someone wielding the UBMEOD.    - 11 (20.4%)

Total Voters: 54

You want Fries with that?

 :-D
Logged
James The Kugai 

You can never have too much Coffee.

westrim

  • Guest
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #182 on: 08 Sep 2010, 19:24 »


You want Fries with that?

 :-D

And a coke.

Tai could help her out; I'm sure she'd be happy to give Dora a good tongue-lashing.   :angel:
Logged

Is it cold in here?

  • Administrator
  • Awakened
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 25,163
  • He/him/his pronouns
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #183 on: 08 Sep 2010, 22:36 »

Pintsize was creepy, of course, but not damagingly so.
Logged
Thank you, Dr. Karikó.

Dr. ROFLPWN

  • Beyond Thunderdome
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 575
  • Farmin' all these goddamn mushrooms.
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #184 on: 08 Sep 2010, 22:39 »

<wall o'text removed>
Ahhhhh. I think I got it now. You're thinking the next move for Dora is that she's going to find some way (unconsciously, subconsciously or whatever) to sabotage the relationship. In essence, "ramp it up".

Which means DoraTai might still be in the cards... <eeeewwwwwwww>

If Tai lets her do that, she will be the Biggest Douchebag in the history of QC. She will out-douche even Sven's early days. Nothing will compare.

I mean, talk about people that Marten honestly does need to have a word with. Tai needs to get Fucking Told.
Logged
Fuckin' pain in the ass.

TheHappyBerry

  • Plantmonster
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 42
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #185 on: 08 Sep 2010, 22:45 »

I may have expressed some dislike for how this situation is being handled.  But, then I got to panel 5 (the I love you panel)  and all dislike went out the door.  It's well drawn and adorable and I want a big, giant copy of it.
Logged

Akima

  • WoW gold miner on break
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6,523
  • ** 妇女能顶半边天 **
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #186 on: 08 Sep 2010, 22:54 »

Now Pintsize... Pintsize deserves the angry-face. Note that Marten is not afraid to initiate the "I love you. I love you too." exchange. I also can't resist saying that Dora looks adorable in the last two panels. Brrrr... The sugar-rush comes... Great drawing too.
« Last Edit: 08 Sep 2010, 22:56 by Akima »
Logged
"I would rather have questions that can't be answered, than answers that can't be questioned." Richard Feynman

zagraf

  • Obscure cultural reference
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 129
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #187 on: 08 Sep 2010, 22:56 »

There. This is what I was waiting to see before commenting on the last few strips: Marten and Dora finally talking over the trust issue, and what seems to have caused it, like mature adults.
Logged

squishything

  • Plantmonster
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 42
  • Buh
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #188 on: 08 Sep 2010, 23:05 »

SAVE ME FROM THE WEE PILLOWS!
Logged

Watched Pot

  • Balloon animal serial killer
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 91
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #189 on: 08 Sep 2010, 23:14 »

SAVE ME FROM THE WEE PILLOWS!
Now is not the time to bring up Dora's modest endowment.
Logged
Don't you do cocaine at ME, you son of a bitch!

Econoclast

  • Plantmonster
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 25
  • Liberate tutemet.
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #190 on: 08 Sep 2010, 23:18 »

Weak. Way to be a total wuss, Marten.

Jeph threw away the perfect opportunity to break those two up -- something that's been overdue for years.
Logged

zagraf

  • Obscure cultural reference
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 129
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #191 on: 08 Sep 2010, 23:30 »

*Reads Econoclast's post*

Let's see...flame-resistant clothing? Check. Helmet? Check. Extra-large popcorn? Check.

This...is gonna be good.
Logged

Econoclast

  • Plantmonster
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 25
  • Liberate tutemet.
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #192 on: 08 Sep 2010, 23:50 »

Oh, I'm not trying to start a flame war. I just think that it's stuff like this that makes people stop caring about Marten/Dora and want to focus on ancillary characters instead. Personally, I haven't seen Marten as an interesting character since he and Dora got together -- and I've always found Dora to be a poor substitute for Faye anyway. Despite all of her character development, in the end she's just a bland goth chick with stupid girlish insecurities. All of her problems seem pithy and shallow in comparison to legitimate issues like Faye's PTSD, or Hannelore's OCD, or Marigold's social anxiety. Her androgynous looks don't hold a candle to the other female characters, and all of her wit invariably falls back on sexual innuendo or extremely tedious lesbian undertones. Humor-wise, she brings about as much to the table as Pintsize -- just a series of running gags that have lost most of their luster over the years. If there had to be a culling of QC characters, I'd vote her as the first to go (well, second -- Pintsize would be the first).

In short, she sucks.

... 'kay, that last bit was flame-bait. Sorry.
« Last Edit: 08 Sep 2010, 23:53 by Econoclast »
Logged

Sorflakne

  • Duck attack survivor
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1,721
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #193 on: 09 Sep 2010, 00:30 »

Hm, going by the last panel, Dora's apparently back to her old self.


And if Econoclast's post is any indication, seems he only wants bland, predictable characters.  Also seems he wanted Marten and Faye to get together.
Logged
If you want to see what God and Satan look like, look in the mirror.

themacnut

  • Vagina Manifesto
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 690
    • The Vanguard-Superhero Space Opera Action
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #194 on: 09 Sep 2010, 00:41 »

Actually it seems to me like he considers Dora to be bland and predictable. I think you're right about him shipping Faye and Marten though.

Too bad Marten's wrong for Faye-he can't keep up the witty banter like Angus can. And Marten would NEVER in a MILLION years have been this bold. It's not in his nature.
Logged
The Vanguard - superhero space opera

Carl-E

  • Awakened
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 10,346
  • The distilled essence of Mr. James Beam himself.
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #195 on: 09 Sep 2010, 00:45 »

All of her problems seem pithy and shallow in comparison to legitimate issues like Faye's PTSD, or Hannelore's OCD, or Marigold's social anxiety.

Yes.  They certainly seem less... intense.  They are also no less crippling.  And, rather than preventing a relationship, they snuck up and sabatoged an otherwise good relationship.  

This is what makes it a slice-of-life comic.  It's actually normal to have baggage.  

Quote
Her androgynous looks don't hold a candle to the other female characters

To each his own.  
Logged
When people try to speak a gut reaction, they end up talking out their ass.

Dr. ROFLPWN

  • Beyond Thunderdome
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 575
  • Farmin' all these goddamn mushrooms.
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #196 on: 09 Sep 2010, 00:51 »

Hm, going by the last panel, Dora's apparently back to her old self.


And if Econoclast's post is any indication, seems he only wants bland, predictable characters.  Also seems he wanted Marten and Faye to get together.

Actually, reading his post it seems his issue with Dora is that she's too normal and acts well-adjusted most of the time. Apparently a string of psuedo-abusive relationships is not an actual problem, it's just superficial. Uh-huh. Yep.

As for his apparent latent Faye/Marten shipping, that just makes me laugh and tell him to cry some more, because that possibility is having nails driven into its coffin every day, and I thank God for it. QC is one of the really good dramatic comics because, unlike many dramas, it doesn't rely on unresolved sexual tension. When tension comes up in this universe, people have to do what they do in real life: work it out and move past it.

And hey, guess what? If you let it sit around the way Marty and Faye did before the Talk? You will not get to be with that person! And they will move the fuck on! Like Faye is finally doing and Marty did a while ago!
Logged
Fuckin' pain in the ass.

nicoley

  • Not quite a lurker
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 18
    • myspace
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #197 on: 09 Sep 2010, 01:04 »

I agree with Econoclast to some degree... not a big Dora fan like most people are. But I mean, not everyone has to have big intense problems, like Faye with her dad killing himself in front of her or Hanners bad OCD. While Dora's issues are considerably less severe than Faye's, they are still legitimate I suppose. I don't like the way Marten handled Dora when he got home. Someone said it's a natural reaction for him to get home, see her in an almost fetal position looking sad, and want to comfort her. But if I did something like what Dora did, it doesn't matter how puppy eyed I made myself look. My boyfriend would be giving me the silent treatment for a looong time. Marten hasn't done anything to make Dora distrustful like her old boyfriends did. I don't think it's fair to bring old baggage into new relationships, especially since before they even started dating, Dora knew Marten pretty well and knew that he wasn't the cheating type.

Also, I don't really think Econoclast is trying to ship Faye and Marten... it's not like Marten has to either be with Faye or Dora ONLY. Personally I don't think either of them are right for him. I was kind of hoping this would break those 2 up too, but it's not my choice!
Logged

Tergon

  • The German Chancellory building
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 487
  • Grandmaster of the Order of the Dickbroom
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #198 on: 09 Sep 2010, 01:18 »

*shrugs*

We all have our favourite characters, so it follows we all have our own least favourite.  Some people are just slightly more... vehement... in their dislike.  As far as making Dora an interesting character, I actually think that making her more "normal" than the others is what makes her more interesting.  Certainly she's got her share of issues, and her family is anything but ordinary, but she handles things like a normal person would.  But like everyone, she has her little problems, and we're finding out more what they are.  If in the past you found Dora to be boring, maybe as we explore her history you'll find her more interesting.  As for me, I genuinely like her as a character, so I have no trouble with exploring her a bit more.
As far as comparing Dora's issues with those of Faye, Hannelore or Marigold goes, my initial response is to comment that QC is not a competition for Which Is the Craziest Chick Of All? though at times it may seem like it.  Yeah, okay, they might have better reasons to act a little crazy sometimes, but that definitely doesn't mean that Dora has no good reason.  If anything, the fact that she's seemed so normal up to now, when we find out she's been sitting atop a mountain of crazy, is something alarming all on its own.

I'm reminded of an old novel I once read:  The Fog, by James Herbert (none of the shitty movies you're thinking of were based on it).  Basically a chemical weapon gets loose, blows into London as a cloud of fog, and if you inhale it, it destroys parts of your brain and makes you go completely insane.  In one scene of the story, the (immune) protagonist is exploring London, seeing people doing all kinds of crazy shit, killing themselves and each other, gibbering madly, crashing cars and lighting fires... and the most chilling part is seeing people who are dressed in suits and ties, lining up at bus stops, chatting to one another, going to work, and ignoring all the chaos around them.  Which is what makes them insane, because despite the horrific scenes around them, they simply act normal as if it's not going on.

My point is, look at Dora's life.  Her parents are obscenely-rich European pot-smokers.  Her brother is a womanizing pseudo-celebrity who writes Country music that he despises.  One of her friends suffers from severe depression and what looks like post-traumatic stress disorder from a paternal suicide, another has severe OCD and is from space, and the world is populated by tiny, highly destructive robots that people choose to buy for some reason.  She's had a string of potentially-abusive relationships with arseholes before hooking up with a guy who was in love with her friend who she not only employs but lives with.
In the midst of this, she has a healthy relationship and is a successful small business owner.

...exactly what part of this is boring?
Logged
Proud guardian of the original Useless Broom Made Entirely Out Of Dicks

Holding the line against the Rabid Fanboy Horde

Kugai

  • CIA Handler of Miss Melody Powers
  • Awakened
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 11,493
  • Crazy Kiwi Shoujo-Ai Fan
    • My Homepage
Re: WCDT - 6-10 September 2010
« Reply #199 on: 09 Sep 2010, 01:27 »

A nice, honest, real  relationship in QC - who woulda thought!

At least Dora recognises she has issues and needs to sort them.  I love the angle on this too.

Those pillows definitely  look too small.  More like cushions than pillows.



Aaaannnnnnd


Pintsize to bring it back to basics.
Logged
James The Kugai 

You can never have too much Coffee.
Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 ... 8   Go Up