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Author Topic: Bickering about bicycles, now with occasional tips about motorised vehicles  (Read 242377 times)

bicostp

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The problem is, they don't take to the streets. They take over the streets. They clog both lanes of traffic and seize intersections by lying in front of conflicting traffic like they're Arthur Dent regardless of lights and right-of-ways. If they want motorists to 'share the road' they should be held to the same standards as mopeds and scooters: yield to faster traffic, follow the rules of the road, use hand signals. Critical Mass does not help improve the driving public's opinion of cyclists in the least, they just reinforce the negative stereotype that all cyclists think they should have all the rights of both a car and a pedestrian.

That doesn't mean they should be run down though. That's just wrong.

pwhodges

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Forward the revolution! (but not on bicycles)

Sometimes the law is inadequate, or insufficiently regarded, and to gain improvement it seems necessary to step outside it.  I'm not sure that Critical Mass can claim this justification - but I have no experience of some of the conditions for cyclists that have come up in this thread.
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To be frank, given the current state of the environment I think if it was just a protest against the over-use and domination of cars it would be entirely justified. Getting people to drive less and cycle more is an extremely legitimate goal.
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pwhodges

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I agree with that goal, certainly, but giving people who don't cycle an example of what they perceive as bad behaviour by cyclists may not be an effective way to convert them to the cause!
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"Being human, having your health; that's what's important."  (from: Magical Shopping Arcade Abenobashi )
"As long as we're all living, and as long as we're all having fun, that should do it, right?"  (from: The Eccentric Family )

bicostp

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Precisely.

"Let's prove video games don't cause violence by going on a paintball rampage in replica Halo helmets!"

e:

If I lived in a city where I had to worry about critical mass I would drive the most awesome tank I could find

I think you meant to write this. I highly recommend a 1977 Trailduster with a 440.
VVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV
« Last Edit: 28 Feb 2011, 17:06 by bicostp »
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Something Witty

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If I lived in a city where I had to worry about critical mass I would drive the biggest, oldest, diesel-est piece of rusty, black smoke blowing, winter ending, sky darkening tank I could find and run over every goddamn one of them that stopped in front of me.

Your solution to getting me to ride a bicycle is to make me late to work?

Yes, yes, I know, they have the right to peaceably assemble. I also have the right to tell them to fuck off out of my way. And when they decide to surround me and bang on my giant death-tank I will simply put it in 4LO and start rolling very slowly. They can move out of the way, or, more preferably, not.

In which case I can't wait to hear the sound of their carbon-nano-tube frame with titanium wheels and carbon fiber brakes and tires and stupid clippy shoes crunch under the enormous weight of whatever I find to drive.



All that said: As long as the dudes on bicycles obey the rules of the road, at least to the same degree I do, we'll get along fine, like I do with the bike riders here, because they aren't a bunch of smug twats who need to keep their goddamn yaps shut and mind their own goddamn business.
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Something Witty

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For the record I didn't know that some dude ran a bunch of bikers over when I posted that.

For the record, had I known, I doubt it would have changed much more than the wording of the above post and hardly, if at all, affected the message therein, fuck people(in this case cyclists) who go out of their way to make life worse for those around them.
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The Seldom Killer

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If I lived in a city where I had to worry about critical mass I would drive the biggest, oldest, diesel-est piece of rusty, black smoke blowing, winter ending, sky darkening tank I could find and run over every goddamn one of them that stopped in front of me.

Your solution to getting me to ride a bicycle is to make me late to work?

Seems perfectly reasonable to me. In response, the next time I get held up by cars in a traffic jam, I'm shoot all of the drivers in the face and beat any survivors with my D-lock. If you're going to be arrogant, greedy asshats then you truly deserve to be murderised.

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David_Dovey

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Never mind Switty dude, this is pretty much just what he does. I'm not sure he actually thinks that people should die, he just likes to act misanthropic on the Internet. It's pretty cute.
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The Seldom Killer

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Hah, I was just riffing off him. Face-shooting and D-lock justice are reserve only for people who drive Audi's and Chelsea Tractors.

However I was looking over a few things on the internet last night and all the drivers complaining that cyclists don't obey the law are being a bit hypocritical. According to sources like the AAA and the Department for Transport, 80% of drivers admit to intentionally breaking the speed limit, 70% admit to intentionally runing red lights and at least 10% admit to drink driving among other offenses. You cheeky weasels (in a broad sense).

Also looked at some figures from the London Met. Back of a fag packet calculations strongly suggest that fines and penalties applied to cyclists is disproportionate to the level of damage, injury, death and distress caused in comparison to motorists.
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Something Witty

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There is a far cry of difference between shooting everyone in the face and driving over people who are intentionally making life worse for everyone around them.

Do I really believe that they should die for it? Not really. If I were in a big truck surrounded by angry cyclists who were attacking my car? Fuck yes I would drive over them.

By the same token, the asshat in the pick up on the way to work this morning that was blocking two lanes of highway because he had failed to tie his load down should also be drawn and quartered by a team of very slow moving oxen.

Also, all that aside, I speed, run yellow(and red, on motorcycles. None of the lights in this entire fucking city will switch for a bike) lights, that said, I don't do either of these things when it would put other people on the road in danger. I don't speed in traffic and I don't run lights into the side of cross-traffic. I also have not, do not, and will not drive drunk, because all I risk by doing so is fucking it up for everyone else on the road(and myself, coincidentally), which would sort of go against this whole tirade.


All that aside, when was the last time someone on a bicycle stopped for a traffic jam? fuck you and your riding between stopped cars and on the sidewalk.

What I am saying is you should probably listen to dovey because really only about 5% of the things that ever come out of my mouth(or fingers) should ever be taken seriously, and almost none of that comes out over the internet, let alone in a post about driving a killdozer over bicyclists.
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The Seldom Killer

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I did yesterday morning, and the morning before that. Chatted briefly to another guy on a bike (we moaned about the bloody cars causing a traffic jam. If half those people were on bikes, it wouldn't have happened). I never ride on the pavement and it wasn't safe to go round the outside in a legal overtaking manouver. Yes, I'll ride between stopped cars, but only when it's safe to do so and it's still perfectly legal, otherwise I wouldn't do it.

As for shooting people in the face? Most of those people don't actually need to be driving along in cars so for the purposes of this argument, I reckon they're intentionally making my life worse so I reckong it is exactly and precisely the same (plus I get to shoot idiots in the face (lucky for them I don't own a gun(not really, I'm not the kind of asshat to use violence against fools (I'm a different kind of asshat))))
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bainidhe_dub

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Ok really, they're intentionally making your life worse? I highly doubt that anyone has ever said, "Hey you know that guy, The Seldom Killer? I'm gonna find out what route he takes to work, and what time, and I'm going to get in my car and drive slowly in front of him." No.
Sure, probably a lot of people could ride instead of driving, but none of them are not doing it because of you. And what about people who physically couldn't ride the distance to their work, have jobs that require a dress code not conducive to comfortable cycling, would have an even longer commute if they were on a bike, need their car for their job, need their car to transport their family after work, or a hundred other reasons to "need" to drive besides being a lazyass who wants to ruin the environment and your (you personally, The Seldom Killer's) day?
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The Seldom Killer

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My apologies, I forgot to add  :-D :-D :-D :-D :-D :-D :-D and j/k to my post.
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Something Witty

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Again, I fail to clarify. I'm not talking about cyclists, I'm talking about critical mass. I thought I made this point in basically every post I've made on the subject?

I'm not talking about Johnny Ridetowork, I'm talking about the bunch of twats who get out of bed on whatever day of the month and go swarm an intersection or whatever with cyclists for the sole purpose of being cocks about riding a bike. No offense, normal cyclist guy, but those guys can fuck right off.
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The Seldom Killer

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the bunch of twats who get out of bed on whatever day of the month and go swarm an intersection or whatever with cyclists for the sole purpose of being cocks about riding a bike.

I like how you've neatly distilled and explained exactly what Critical Mass is all about. Very insightful.
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Jace

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Go to critical mass one day a year
>douchebagbiker.jpg
Drive to work all other days.

Critical mass, hit guys car, he shouts at you
>douchebagbiker.jpg
"Fuckin asshole drivers"
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edwinalink

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I'm seriously considering selling my car and buying a bicycle to ride to school/work (same place). This both terrifies and excites me.

I'm doing the same.

its stressing me out right now. as my inseam is 28 inches, and that means I should ride a 49cm(small) frame, but I'm 5'10 which means I should ride a 56cm(large)

so I'm being told Neither one fits.

it was so much easier to pick Mountain Bikes.
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The Seldom Killer

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Any decent bike shop should allow you to test ride stuff to get an idea of the feel of it.

Bike sizes generally allow for a reasonable degree of seat post extension and an average reach to the handlebars designed to sit just behind the front hub. If you have below average leg length to height ratio then I'd advise a frame size in the middle with less extension through the seat post and put in a longer headset to balance out the reach. This would mean that you shouldn't get too much compromise on frame handling and reach handling for a person of your size.

The good thing about bikes is that, unlike cars, they are much easier to customise to fit you as a rider. If the model off the peg turns out not to suit you, it's pretty easy to exchange components and a good local bike shop will be able to help you with this pretty well. Some shops will even have a measuring jig to assess your riding position and lets them advise on which frames will match your physiognomy.
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greenMonkey

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Results from the collegiate road season opener:

Time Trial: 5th
Crit: 3rd
Points Race: 3rd

Not bad for my first weekend outside this year.  My teammates did really well too, one of them won the time trial in my category, then got 2nd in the points race.  Our captain got 2nd in his time trial (category above mine), crashed out of his crit, and then came back the next day to dominate his points race with an insane solo break which he maintained for a good 2/3rds of the race.

PICTURE (I'm the large one in the purple cow print kit):
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valley_parade

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Not a bad start, dude!
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The Seldom Killer

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How about a compromise between bicycle and car?



I desperately want one of these.
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pwhodges

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That's not a compromise with a car, it's a compromise with a Sinclair C5.
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The Seldom Killer

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Give over, it's much faster and cooler than that.

It's also not designed by a short-tempered deluded megolamaniac.
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Akima

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How about a compromise between bicycle and car?
The velomobile. Combining the disadvantages of a car and a bicycle in one vehicle for over a century.
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The Seldom Killer

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Well, not all of the disadvantages of a car. For instance, the price and depletion of fuel doesn't continue to escalate at a rate beyond economic sustainability and it doesn't cost money to sit in traffic going nowhere. Also, like a bicycle, they don't feed exhaust fumes from other vehicles directly into the face of the driver (and passengers in cars) (University of Bristol study demonstrated that car drivers in traffic are subject to more exhaust fumes than cyclists in traffic and pedestrians at the kerbside, therefore at a higher toxicological risk of cancer, heart disease, dementia, developmental delay in children... the list is apparently quite long). Other motor vehicle related disadvantages are also avoided.
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bicostp

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Thing is, you're subject to the exhaust fumes of other cars if you're stopped in traffic with those. You can't obnoxiously weave between lanes of traffic or ride on the sidewalk in a pedal car the size of a Fiesta.

My daily commute is 30 miles each way. No way in hell I'm doing that on a bicycle, and moving closer would cost more than the monthly gas use does. (One month's rent up there would cost about as much as the gas and car payment on a brand new Mustang GT.) My 12-year-old sedan gets 36 MPG on the cheap stuff and it's been paid off for years. I have every intention of driving it until the wheels fall off, then a few thousand miles further. (Then either an engine swap with a Cobalt SS or get another inexpensive commuter econobox.)
« Last Edit: 12 Mar 2011, 10:08 by bicostp »
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Akima

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Well, not all of the disadvantages of a car.
I never said all, but the environmental advantages of a velomobile over a car are also offerred by a bicycle, at lower cost financially (usually, though admittedly there are stupidly expensive bikes on the market), in natural resources, in "real estate" on the roads, and space required for parking/storage.

But hey, different pedal-strokes for different folks, right?  :laugh:
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Blue Kitty

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So long after reading this thread I have noticed that a lot of people like to pass on the right instead of the left on the highway
« Last Edit: 26 Jun 2011, 16:15 by Blue Kitty »
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Akima

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So long after reading this thread I have noticed that a lot of people like to pass on the right instead of the left.
Roughly a third of the world:-D

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calenlass

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I think he means in right-driving regions, wherein this is rude and often illegal.
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pwhodges

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In the countries where I drive (UK, Europe) it is generally not permitted to pass on the inside (to keep it generic), except in specific situations where traffic is stuck in lanes (in a jam where different lanes are inching forward at different times; in the turn lane at a junction).  In the UK, even bicycles are not strictly permitted to do this, say, to run up the inside of waiting vehicles at lights (unless a bicycle lane is marked out); but it is rare to find anyone who respects that fully.  Overtaking on the inside on a freely moving UK motorway will  get you stopped by the police if they see you.
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calenlass

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Yeah, it's not legal in several states here, but I doubt most people know that, given how many of them remember to use their turn signals ever. There are always exceptions (the one I encounter most often and the one I dislike the most being when some chump is just cruising in the passing lane going no faster than exactly the speed limit, especially right next to someone in the center lane who is also going precisely the speed limit), but they are exceptions.
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Akima

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In the countries where I drive (UK, Europe) it is generally not permitted to pass on the inside (to keep it generic), except in specific situations where traffic is stuck in lanes (in a jam where different lanes are inching forward at different times; in the turn lane at a junction).  In the UK, even bicycles are not strictly permitted to do this, say, to run up the inside of waiting vehicles at lights (unless a bicycle lane is marked out); but it is rare to find anyone who respects that fully.
In New South Wales (traffic laws are a matter for the states in Australia) passing on the inside (the left for us) is permitted on "multi-lane roads" subject to certain restrictions.

Bicycles (not motorcycles) are specifically permitted to overtake on the inside in NSW even where there is no bike lane, but that is something that wise cyclists do with discretion, since it is a rule that motorists forget as soon as they've passed the obligatory exam required to get a license, and many pay little attention to their nearside. Special caution is required when overtaking on the inside between traffic and a row of parked cars, to avoid opening doors. Cyclists should also remember that the law does not require motorists to position their vehicles to provide clearance on the inside for our bicycles, nor excuse clipping or scraping any part of another vehicle, even it it is equipped with a ridiculously large door mirrors that the driver plainly does not use. Don't ride like a dickhead.
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Inlander

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Special caution is required when overtaking on the inside between traffic and a row of parked cars, to avoid opening doors.

Wouldn't that be overtaking on the outside, ie, the side nearest the curb (and the parked cars)?
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pwhodges

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No; the lane nearest the curb is the inside or nearside lane, and the fast/overtaking one is the outside.  The outside lanes of the two carriageways are together, and the inside lanes are apart.  Sorry, but that's just how it is!

Anyway, how do you not know that and survive?
« Last Edit: 28 Jun 2011, 22:49 by pwhodges »
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Inlander

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I survive by spending approximately 100% of my time on a bike observing the environment around me, and approximately 0% puzzling over nonsensical terminology.

If somebody pulled me over, put a gun to my head, and asked me "Which is the inside lane on a road?", clearly my survival would be in jeopardy.
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LTK

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Considering how a road looks it seems to make more sense that the inside is to the middle, and the outside is to the edge. However, the reason why the curb side is designated inside is because cars are supposed to hug the curb side when driving. So the inside of the road becomes the side you'd be driving in, in a normal situation, while the outside is for situations out of the ordinary, like overtaking.

If we wanted to avoid confusion we could call it my side/your side or good side/bad side, but obviously everyone who partakes in traffic is aware of this rule (to some extent) so it doesn't matter as long as you know which side is for overtaking and which isn't.
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I figured it was to do with cars passing during corners while in a race. The inside line is the one that cuts inside the curve of the car being passed, which is the part of the road furthest from the median.
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The Seldom Killer

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If we wanted to avoid confusion we could call it my side/your side or good side/bad side, but obviously everyone who partakes in traffic is aware of this rule (to some extent) so it doesn't matter as long as you know which side is for overtaking and which isn't.

I calls them port and starboard.


Agghrrrrrrr
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Van donk III

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Just built this up. I shall call her beatrix.

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She is pretty. Beatrix the Bumblebee? :-P

I've taken a bike apart, but never put one together. I think I'd be too scared to ride on something of my own handiwork.

At present I get pretty much everywhere by mountain bike, which is obviously not built for roads, but it's all I've got and it gets me there quicker than walking and cheaper than a bus. I only really started using it a lot at the start of the year, but I can feel the benefit of the exercise already.
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Akima

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Just built this up. I shall call her beatrix.
It is pretty. No room for mudguards though... :lol:
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The Seldom Killer

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Looks like there is a new game in town.

http://www.bikecommutenews.com/2011/07/los-angeles-cyclists-to-race-jet-blue.html?spref=tw

Wish I lived in LA, I would definitely like to race a plane. Am now going to see if I can find out what the shorted commercial flight in the UK is and see whether I can race that.
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The Seldom Killer

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Seems it's up in the Orkneys, takes about 97 seconds but covers a body of water. After that comes Douglas to Liverpool, also covers a body of water. Dammit I want to race a plane.
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Lummer

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Seriously, FUCK BIKE THIEVES!!!!!!!  :x :x :x
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Seriously. I had my bike jacked like three times in my freshman year of high school. Cut the cable with bolt-cutters in their backpacks, it was fucked. I really, REALLY hope your post isn't relevant to your current situation, man.
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My long-dead band Troubador! licks your gentlemen's legumes on the cheap

valley_parade

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A local antique dealer has this old Peugot listed on their site, and I'm kinda in love. Hoping it's the right size for my tall-ass body.

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Wait so you're letting something that happened 10 years ago ruin your quality of life? What are you, America? :psyduck:

pwhodges

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That is so like the Peugeot I had in the early 80s (apart from the blue tyres)!  Looks like a 21" frame to me.
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"Being human, having your health; that's what's important."  (from: Magical Shopping Arcade Abenobashi )
"As long as we're all living, and as long as we're all having fun, that should do it, right?"  (from: The Eccentric Family )

valley_parade

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That is so like the Peugeot I had in the early 80s (apart from the blue tyres)!  Looks like a 21" frame to me.

Braaaaargh! The chart I looked at said I'd need at least a 22". They had some other bikes listed on their site (and a little cheaper), I guess I'll just go check them out and get what feels/fits best for me.
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Wait so you're letting something that happened 10 years ago ruin your quality of life? What are you, America? :psyduck:
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