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Author Topic: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)  (Read 25970 times)

mustang6172

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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #100 on: 15 Feb 2014, 19:11 »

Rumor has it that if the NHL didn't allow players to go to the Olympics this year, the Russian players would have staged a three-week walkout.  Some rumors indicate Putin was the brains behind this idea.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #101 on: 16 Feb 2014, 05:54 »

The question will be what will happen in 2018 if the NHL decides not to shut down for the Pyeongyang Olympics.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #102 on: 16 Feb 2014, 06:14 »

Uh, was that a typo or intentional? I'm bad at figuring that out in written text :psyduck:
The 2018 Olympic games are in Pyeongchang in South Korea, not Pyeongyang, the capital of North Korea. I do hope that the IOC would not be so stupid as to ever give the games to North Korea... (Until after a drastic change of their political system, I mean.)
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #103 on: 16 Feb 2014, 06:47 »

I'm guessing that was a typo.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #104 on: 16 Feb 2014, 11:40 »

Canada over Finland in OT. Canucks were strong as expected and probably deserved the win. Small margins keep it exciting, and some what-ifs linger in our minds.

No complaints about the refs (I should really try and bury that hatchet, but...).
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #105 on: 16 Feb 2014, 17:43 »

Uh, was that a typo or intentional? I'm bad at figuring that out in written text :psyduck:
The 2018 Olympic games are in Pyeongchang in South Korea, not Pyeongyang, the capital of North Korea. I do hope that the IOC would not be so stupid as to ever give the games to North Korea... (Until after a drastic change of their political system, I mean.)

Yeah, it was a mistake on my part, my bad. Pyeongchang is the site of the 2018 Winter Olympics - an it's unlikely that the NHL is going to stop its season again for it.

So. It's setting up for a Canada-USA showdown in the semifinals, not for the Gold.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #106 on: 16 Feb 2014, 18:26 »

North Korean Olympics would be fun.

If you ignore the starving children that is.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #107 on: 16 Feb 2014, 19:31 »

The NHL shut down entirely?
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #108 on: 16 Feb 2014, 19:47 »

I forget the reason off the top of my head, but yes, they did it recently and it worried a lot of fans. I think it was recently, like just before this season or during last season...
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #109 on: 16 Feb 2014, 19:53 »

No, I mean it's shut down now for the Olympics?
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #110 on: 16 Feb 2014, 19:54 »

Like it isn't shut down normally during their regular season.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #111 on: 16 Feb 2014, 19:55 »

I dunno, I don't usually pay attention.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #112 on: 16 Feb 2014, 22:38 »

The NHL shut down entirely?

Yes.  No NHL games until the players come back from the Olympics.

If MLB had swallowed their pride and done the same thing for the summer games, baseball would still be an Olympic sport.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #113 on: 16 Feb 2014, 23:05 »

The question will be what will happen in 2018 if the NHL decides not to shut down for the Pyeongyang Olympics.
The North American hockey fans are the only people that can really put any kind of pressure on the NHL. Because you're kinda paying for the show. Tell them that you want to see the stars in the Olympics.... Please.

So. It's setting up for a Canada-USA showdown in the semifinals, not for the Gold.

I guess the teams are placed into the play-off bracket according to a scheme that depends on the number of points earned in the preliminary round. Sweden became the #1 seed for winning all their first round games in regulation. US and Canada needed OT against Russia and Finland respectively, so they are second and third seeds (according to some tie-break rule, goals for/against difference?). Finland got the #4 spot for having earned the most points among the 2nd place teams in the three groups.

I'm not sure I like the format, where seeding at this point may depend on how badly you run up the score in one of those somewhat unappetizing mismatches. I guess an alternative would be to invite 16 teams, but then there would be even more mismatches. Narrowing down the field down to eight would make for an interesting tourney, but would make the pre-tourney qualifying rounds matter more, for behind the six usual suspects (USA, CAN, RUS, SWE, CZE, FIN) it would be a toss up. In WCs the Swiss and the Slovaks do well occasionally. To secure a few more sponsors you need to allow Germany a shot to be in, and give nations like Belarus, Latvia, Kazakhstan, Norway a shot at an upset. I doubt that the NHL would accept players going to play for their respective countries in the qualifying round games on top of the actual tournament. Consequently we get this format, where the real games begin when the top eight knock heads. They are pressed for time, so it's a `best of oneŽ play off (+ a bronze medal match).
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #114 on: 18 Feb 2014, 07:05 »

Wow, Slovakia only scored 2 goals?  That's pretty shocking given the offensive talent that country has produced over the years.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #115 on: 18 Feb 2014, 08:25 »

Also, hugely disappointed that olympic curling doesn't use the Page playoff system.  Most domestic competitions here do.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #116 on: 18 Feb 2014, 09:01 »

Also, hugely disappointed that olympic curling doesn't use the Page playoff system.  Most domestic competitions here do.

Learned something new!  :-)
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #117 on: 18 Feb 2014, 09:04 »

I just have an old axe to grind here. When my hometown co-hosted the WCs some time in the 90s, there were complaints about the Europeans refs by the North American teams. We were quite puzzled by some of the complaints, as the local ref was voted by the players of our league to be the best year after year (by a fair margin I may add). It turned out that the complaint was not so much about his calls, but the fact that he couldn't communicate in English. So are all the players entitled to talk with the ref in their own language?

While you didn't ask, you probably won't be surprised to learn that over here, the WCs are considered about as important as the Izvestia tournament.  That is to say, not very.

Oh, and not all North American players have Englishas "their language", but I get your point.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #118 on: 18 Feb 2014, 10:00 »

Also, hugely disappointed that olympic curling doesn't use the Page playoff system.  Most domestic competitions here do.

I'm disappointed curling is still an Olympic sport, but then so is ping pong.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #119 on: 18 Feb 2014, 10:12 »

Everyone has a complaint, it seems, about what should or should not be in the Olympics.  I get that.

What I've never understood is the derision shown for table tennis.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #120 on: 18 Feb 2014, 10:23 »

I'm basically against any "sport" that is commonly plaid on cruise ships being considered an epitome of human physical endeavour. (Let's be honest, Curling is shuffle board on ice with younger players, they even have the same wacky pants now)

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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #121 on: 18 Feb 2014, 10:26 »

There is no way I could ever be anything close to a ping pong player. It's sooo difficult.

Also,I want poetry and city design and poodle grooming back in the olympic games.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #122 on: 18 Feb 2014, 10:37 »

Pretty sure people go for runs on cruise ship decks.  So definitely no more Usain Bolt or Haile Gebreselassie in the Olympics!
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #123 on: 18 Feb 2014, 10:48 »

There is no way I could ever be anything close to a ping pong player. It's sooo difficult.

Also,I want poetry and city design and poodle grooming back in the olympic games.

As someone who was always on the smaller end of the scale growing up, I like that there are sports that are about more than raw strength and speed.  Ideally, there should be sports out there for all body and mind types, and I have no problem with all of them being feted at the Olympics.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #124 on: 18 Feb 2014, 13:45 »

Why not chess, bridge, go ... Indeed.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #125 on: 18 Feb 2014, 13:50 »

Wait, how are strength and speed not huge parts of ping pong? And for that matter, they're hardly the ONLY thing that matter in any sport.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #126 on: 18 Feb 2014, 14:16 »

Yeah, professional table tennis is insanely fast - it is totally about speed, concentration and technique. I fail to see how it is somehow not worthy of being in the Olympics. Or less worthy than other sports anyway.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #127 on: 18 Feb 2014, 14:34 »

I'm basically against any "sport" that is commonly plaid on cruise ships being considered an epitome of human physical endeavour. (Let's be honest, Curling is shuffle board on ice with younger players, they even have the same wacky pants now)

You ever pick up one of those curling rocks, soldier?

On other things: Latvia vs. Canada in hockey is like a Pop Warner football team vs. the Seattle Seahawks in (American) football.

Or, for our friends outside the CONUSA, it's like your kid's local U-18 footy team taking on Manchester United.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #128 on: 18 Feb 2014, 14:45 »

Yes actually. I have curled. It was mind numbing.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #129 on: 18 Feb 2014, 14:48 »

Why not chess, bridge, go ... Indeed.

I've always been a little leery of the equestrian sports
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #130 on: 18 Feb 2014, 14:58 »

I wouldn't support Chess for the Olympics, I would however support Chess Boxing
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #131 on: 18 Feb 2014, 17:03 »

On other things: Latvia vs. Canada in hockey is like a Pop Warner football team the Denver Broncos vs. the Seattle Seahawks in (American) football.
The only way I'll get over it is to laugh about it, I suppose :roll:
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #132 on: 18 Feb 2014, 18:57 »

I believe Chess will be a sport in the 2016 Olympics in Rio. Along with Rugby Sevens.

But no wrestling.  :? :? :?
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #133 on: 18 Feb 2014, 19:06 »

...chess? Why chess? And for that matter, why is it a summer sport? Isn't it usually played indoors? Also...is it a sport?
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #134 on: 18 Feb 2014, 19:27 »

Chess would be a summer sport because it isn't played on snow or ice.

Basketball is traditionally an indoor winter sport, but its part of the Summer Olympics because it's not played on a frozen surface.  The NBA has no problem sending athletes to the Olympics because it's their off season.

Fun fact:  basketball was invented so people would have something to play indoors, when the weather was too crappy to go outside.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #135 on: 18 Feb 2014, 21:37 »

Why not chess, bridge, go ... Indeed.

Bridge was an exhibition event at Salt Lake City games. IIRC some players expressed disgust on IOC restrictions to smoking on the playing venue. I guess we won't see a repeat any time soon. Mind you, nowadays they organize mind game olympics, but that is still in beta. China hosted a well rounded such event after Beijing games (weiqi/go, bridge,..). After London games Lille (France) hosted something that was supposed to be similar, but only bridge players showed up :psyduck:

The events I would throw out are the ones where artistic impression and style judges play too large a role. Sure, figure skating, slopestyle, halfpipe, synchronized swimming and the like are physically demanding - no question about that. But evaluation of style always seems to leave too much room for differences of opinion as to who actually was the best. May be that is part of the fun actually?

As someone who was always on the smaller end of the scale growing up, I like that there are sports that are about more than raw strength and speed.  Ideally, there should be sports out there for all body and mind types, and I have no problem with all of them being feted at the Olympics.

This. Also I'm happy that the large variance in, for example, weight divisions in events like wrestling and weight lifting allow people of different sizes to compete. Gymnastics still is mostly for people in the smaller end (or should I say advantageous muscle strength/body weight ratio), but there are many more events, where size is an advantage.
« Last Edit: 18 Feb 2014, 21:44 by Skewbrow »
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #136 on: 18 Feb 2014, 21:50 »

While you didn't ask, you probably won't be surprised to learn that over here, the WCs are considered about as important as the Izvestia tournament.  That is to say, not very.

Ok, ok. This has been explained to me many times. I just have a hard time swallowing. You see, I have this wonderful conspiracy theory of how the NHL ... it explains everything! Real clearly!
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #137 on: 19 Feb 2014, 01:34 »

The Olympics is a sports event. Stuff that isn't sport shouldn't be in there. If you're not very well co-ordinated, or, let's face it, genetically predisposed to be a near superhuman, then tough titties, you don't get to be in the Olympics. But that is, sadly, the way a million things work. Art, music, writing, sport, maths, so many things are down to just being born with the knack to some extent.

Also, I still think in dressage the horse should get the medal, not the rider.

Also, I still think it's the dumbest looking 'sport' I've ever seen in my life, and over here there are people who throw themselves down a hill to catch wheels of cheese.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #138 on: 19 Feb 2014, 02:02 »

You only say that because you have no Ankie van Grunsven.

Or however that name is spelled.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #139 on: 19 Feb 2014, 04:03 »

Also, I still think in dressage the horse should get the medal, not the rider.


The horse's medal is a life time of comfort, ease and not being turned into glue. Not to mention the massive amount of money people will pay for an Olympian horse's issue.

Knowing what I know about dressage, the stupid amount of effort horse, rider and trainer need to put in to compete at any level, the Equestrian events, if retained as Olympic events, should be considered team sports, and the trio responsible for the winning performance (rider, primary trainer and the horse) should all receive medals.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #140 on: 19 Feb 2014, 05:04 »

Ahh. Thank God for the sprint relays (Xcountry skiing). Today was Finland's: silver at women's (not a surprise), gold at men's (a moderate to big surprise). A huge monkey off our collective backs.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #141 on: 19 Feb 2014, 05:23 »

While you didn't ask, you probably won't be surprised to learn that over here, the WCs are considered about as important as the Izvestia tournament.  That is to say, not very.

Ok, ok. This has been explained to me many times. I just have a hard time swallowing. You see, I have this wonderful conspiracy theory of how the NHL ... it explains everything! Real clearly!

Really the conspiracy runs that way?  Hold the world championships every year during the Stanley Cup Playoffs, so most of the best Canadian players are busy and can't come, but the NHL has a conspiracy?

btw, sounds like you're a bridge player, too.  Canada won in SLC iirc...

I do find it interesting that you throw figure skating and synchronized swimming under the bus, but gymnastics is just as judged, and just as...questionable.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #142 on: 19 Feb 2014, 05:46 »

Actually, with all this discussion about judged events, I think we're overlooking something that has to disappear from the Olympics even sooner than judged events - relays.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #143 on: 19 Feb 2014, 05:55 »

End y's dat?
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ev4n

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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #144 on: 19 Feb 2014, 05:59 »

Relays are fundamentally a way to pad medal count.  They're not different, really, than the individual events (hence, people barely ever train specifically for a relay), and they tend to pad medal counts in certain events, such as swimming and track.

(As an aside, as a swimmer, I think there are VASTLY too many swimming medals given).

It would be like if there were medals in tennis for:
- one set tennis
- 3 sets tennis
- 5 set tennis
- tennis relay

This is one skill, NOT 4.
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Thrillho

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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #145 on: 19 Feb 2014, 06:03 »

Hmm. You have a point there.
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Skewbrow

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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #146 on: 19 Feb 2014, 06:39 »

While you didn't ask, you probably won't be surprised to learn that over here, the WCs are considered about as important as the Izvestia tournament.  That is to say, not very.

Ok, ok. This has been explained to me many times. I just have a hard time swallowing. You see, I have this wonderful conspiracy theory of how the NHL ... it explains everything! Real clearly!

Really the conspiracy runs that way?  Hold the world championships every year during the Stanley Cup Playoffs, so most of the best Canadian players are busy and can't come, but the NHL has a conspiracy?

Well, in the old times the WCs were held in the winter/early spring, and all the other leagues, save the NHL, were suspended for the duration of the WCs. And it is hardly the Europeans fault, if the NHL wants to run winter sport play offs in May/June :-). I have not heard of the NHL suggesting a different date for the WCs, but I may be wrong. FWIW I would welcome such a suggestion!

Quote from: ev4n
btw, sounds like you're a bridge player, too.  Canada won in SLC iirc...

Congrats! Had to dig for the results. Needless to add that Finland didn't qualify :-D

Quote from: ev4n
I do find it interesting that you throw figure skating and synchronized swimming under the bus, but gymnastics is just as judged, and just as...questionable.

You have a point there. The things going for gymnastics are that 1) it's been around from the beginning, 2) it is one of the rare events, where size is a disadvantage, so it has a place. Not a solid argument by any stretch. It being a judged sport is a bit questionable. IMHO the most alarming thing that ever happend in gymnastics was the domination by 4ft8in, 65lb, 12-14 year old girls in the 80s and 90s. That body type is such a good fit for the sport, so they had to introduce an (admittedly artificial) lower age limit. I don't know, if that was a good thing. People whose physique fits that description are entitled compete in some event (and there's no question about the physical talent/training it requires). Nevertheless, the judging element makes gymnastics also a bit iffy.

Relays on the other hand? On the track the switchovers are a separate skill. That is were the Americans have often ruined their chances, in spite of overall dominating the event very clearly (historically speaking, Jamaican success is a recent thing) . In Xcountry skiing and swimming it is admittedly a bit more iffy. I guess the point is that it prevents one astounding athlete from dominating the sport, and gives a balanced set of quality also-runs a chance. In Xcountry the tactical aspects make relays very interesting. Normally the races are timed in a way that the contestants leave at 30 second intervals, so that they don't congest the trail. In relays (also the mass start events that are a new arrival, too) a weaker skier can just try and hang in there - effectively using the stronger skier as a pacemaker. I guess opinions differ, whether any of these points is a good thing or not :-) You are probably correct in that it is done somewhat to pad the medal count. And I agree that swimming is possibly where bloating the number of events started.

Finland - Russia 3-1.  Hell, yeah!
« Last Edit: 19 Feb 2014, 07:24 by Skewbrow »
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GarandMarine

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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #147 on: 19 Feb 2014, 06:46 »

A good argument against gymnastics is that it's incredibly phyiscally damaging.
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Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #148 on: 19 Feb 2014, 07:08 »

Quite a few olympic sports are damaging.

Is mens gymnastics as damaging as women's?
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BeoPuppy

Re: Сочи 2014 (Winter Olympics Thread)
« Reply #149 on: 19 Feb 2014, 07:11 »

Any top level sport is. NFL has the concussion issue, the NHL is making dentists rich beyond believe (plus other injuries), tennis is hell on the knees and anything that makes you vomit after crossing a finish line cannot be good for you.
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