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Mom's New Apartment.

May's Employment Attempts.

Relationship Issues (take your pick as to whom)

Hanners and her HAAAAAAATTT!!!!

The Band!

Harriet officially joins the cast (with her pet bird YB)

Insert Meme Here (space ham, space tea, waffles, etc.)

Something completely different.

[mikmaxs]

Off the subject of who is and isn't a person, there's a much better reason that someone wouldn't want to hire AIs in this universe:
Have you freakin' seen them? A giant percentage of the robots, AIs, and anthro-PCs we've seen would make terrible employees.
Just off the top of my head, here's all the AI beings I can think of, some of whom I can't recall the names of:
Pintsize
Momo
Winslow (It's been a while since we've seen Winslow, huh?)
May
That Neck-beard, hipster guy
Pintsize's Posse of PCs. (We've seen about a dozen re-skinned versions of him, all in all.)
Sattelite AI (From Hannelore's Dad's ship)
That terrifying spider thing from when Marten bought Pintsize
The Vespa Combat robot with lasers who worked with the Vespavenger
Deathbot 9000, whom Pintsize taunted on message boards
The two robots who worked at the chassis store


Now let's examine their character traits as far as redeeming and negative personality traits go:
Pintsize: Good: Friendly, supportive of Martin. Bad: Misogynistic, creepy, arsonist, sexual offender, vandal, pervert, insensitive, drug addict (Or at least, ROM addict), generally gross, repeatedly damages his own hard drive and chassis by trying to eat food.
Momo: Good: Really nice, helpful, socially adept and gives good advice. Bad: Not much here.
Winslow: Good: Friendly? I haven't read a comic with him in a while, but he always seemed a little bland to me... He definitely did nothing to stop Pintsize most of the time, even on some of his really bad ideas.
May: Good: Assertive, has at least some knowledge of social cues, tries to help. Bad: Convicted felon who tried to steal a fighter jet, aggressive, verbally abusive, vulgar
Neck-Beard Hipster Guy: Good: Um... Bad: Rude, inconsiderate, almost got Pintsize killed as part of a joke...
Pintsize's Friends: (These guys are a little less intense, but all seemed pretty similar to Pintsize. Misogynistic, rude, addicts, vandals.)
Satellite AI: Good: Friendly, very supportive, a really nice guy. Bad: Despite the fact that he should be one of the most competent AIs in the world, he accidentally burned out a ton of his circuits while trying to calculate an impossible math equation. After getting drunk.
Terrifying Spider Thing: (We didn't see much of him, but he didn't seem to pick up on any social cues, or realize that he was freaking the heck out of Martin.)
Vespa Robot and the Deathbot 9000: Yes, they were both designed for battle, but they had practically no value of human life and were almost definitely both murderers. (Or at least attempted murderers.)
The Chassis Store Robots: Once again, friendly, but we didn't see much of them so I can't give much of an opinion.
Toaster Bot: Makes toast FUN!


From this cross section, assuming that it stays consistent throughout most AIs, it seems like a giant chunk of the Anthro-PCs in the world are incompetent, inconsiderate, or generally creepy. I won't take off too many points for Pintsize's friends being creeps because his friends would presumably be similar to him, but even if they aren't taken into account a big chunk of the AI beings in this world would make terrible employees. They might make good friends, (At least some of them,) but they'd make terrible workers.



This is completely unrelated, but has anyone else noticed that Momo seems to be acting like a lot less of a Chibi-Anime girl since she got her new chassis? Her personality should be the same, but she hasn't really done anything remotely anime-ish since she got an upgrade.

[Thrillho]

That's a well thought-out and written post.

But there are also large amounts of humans who are giant douchenozzle fucktwats as well. That's what a job interview is for.

[Aahz]

Do non-terrestrial sapient beings deserve to be afforded the same rights as our much talked about breed of hairless monkey that thinks rather highly of itself?

Do they deserve to be afforded the same rights as a hairless monkey in a society that belongs to the hairless monkeys and is created for the benefit of the hairless monkeys?  Not necessarily.

Please explain the terms "human" and "posthuman".

Intersexed individuals are a fairly soft posthuman concept, I will admit, but they do fit some of the criteria.  As a transhumanist, I find the phenomenon to be endlessly intriguing.

Mr Green, I think you should lurk more here and do some reading regarding of views in transhumanist thought. The positions you've been stating seem very anathema to me; and I've been studying the concept for many years.

[Rghfrgl]

Racist boss. Robots yelling at you. Should have never given up that CoD job Sara.

[Aziraphale]

That's a well thought-out and written post.

But there are also large amounts of humans who are giant douchenozzle fucktwats as well. That's what a job interview is for.

Not that it necessarily matters. I worked entirely too long in retail and customer service, part of that in management. I've seen plenty of people who impressed everyone in the interview and went on to be awful employees; I've also had a few who, off the clock or in the break room, were total assholes but who were professional where and when it counted.

May strikes me as someone who'd need some very clear and strong boundaries set, but who doesn't seem to have any of her own.

[cesium133]

Racist boss. Robots yelling at you. Should have never given up that CoD job Sara.

She works at the Gap on the corner of Allosaurus' Stomach Ave. and Allosaurus' Esophagus Street.

[Barmymoo]

Haha that's such a good point, that could easily be Sarah!

[mikmaxs]

That's a well thought-out and written post.

But there are also large amounts of humans who are giant douchenozzle fucktwats as well. That's what a job interview is for.

Fair enough, but if you do a cross-section of the humans in QC, you have nowhere near the percentage of violent, criminal, perverted incompetents. Faye is probably the only 'Mean' person on the main cast, and not only is she nowhere near the terrible person that Pintsize is, but she saw her father kill himself. Kind of a totally valid reason to be screwed up. Unless there was a storyline I missed, none of the AnthroPCs have any reason in their history for being so creepy and awful.

The human characters have problems and issues, but unlike the AnthroPCs they all generally seem competent, non-violent, and they don't tend to sexually harass each other on a daily basis or steal fighter jets.

[Method of Madness]

Sarah!

Sara

(I'm engaged to a Sarah, the h or lack thereof matters )

[Pilchard123]

She does also have blue eyes. Could be. Probably isn't. Kinda hope it is.

[Method of Madness]

Hey, we don't know for sure either way

[Is it cold in here?]

It is an easy habit of thought to generalize based on ethnicity, but it's a habit that leads to errors and injustices. After interviewing and rejecting Pintsize, it would be a fallacy not to hire Momo, or to hire Faye in her place because you think "humans are politer".

No generalization should influence the hiring process.

[CaptainFish]

In terms of the exchange, I'm honestly happy with how both parties dealt with this situation. The clerk didn't lie and give May a false hope of getting a job after establishing some rapport with an employee and May showed the clerk that her employer's behaviour is both illegal and hurtful. I would hope that the clerk ditches her defense of her employer's partial discrimination, because it bleeds of onto her to the degree that it would be possible to think she's bigoted as well.

As for unneeded employee abuse maybe it wasn't deserved, but if I had presented the same questions and heard the response "we tend not to hire blacks" I'd have a pretty intense reaction for the person of the "we" I'm addressing as well. That's not an okay sentence to say. If she's not complicit with the discriminatory hiring practices she needs to use precise language to distance herself from it (just say "My boss tends..."). It's pretty obvious she doesn't think it's a big deal if she'd use the word we for a sentence like that anyway. Also the idea that you can discriminate but it's okay because it doesn't stem from hate is just perplexing.

[Kugai]

[Method of Madness]

I really, really should watch TNG. Holy crap, that was amazing. (I know it can't all be that good, but wow)

[Is it cold in here?]

If AIs, immigrants or any other external category are introduced into a situation in which employment and thereby, resources are in finite supply, and demand generally exceeds that supply, then those newcomers will be impacting adversely on SOME group within the original population. That's basic arithmetic.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lump_of_labour_fallacy

[Method of Madness]

If AIs, immigrants or any other external category are introduced into a situation in which employment and thereby, resources are in finite supply, and demand generally exceeds that supply, then those newcomers will be impacting adversely on SOME group within the original population. That's basic arithmetic.

Even if that wasn't a fallacy as Cold pointed out...so? Who is to say that the people who were there first deserve that job any more than the people who come later?

[cesariojpn]

That lady ended up looking more like Raven than I intended. Whoops!

Actually, I thought Tai recolored her hair and got contacts and May was trying to see if she could get a job at the SMIF Library when it was loading up.

[Is it cold in here?]

<snip>
The idea of treating every single person equally is, frankly, unnatural, and as little as 50 years ago voicing that opinion would have you labelled a radical.
<snip>
I'll now take my leave.

Global Moderator Comment

Equal rights is a core value here. Northern Light said that would be their last post. It is.

[SuctionCup Caper Two]

I really, really should watch TNG. Holy crap, that was amazing. (I know it can't all be that good, but wow)

No but gems like this redeem some of the less-good moments.    It's worth sitting down and watching a few episodes here and there.
 
Star Trek was not meant to be a sci-fi ACTION shoot-em-up series.  It was intended to tell stories and provide commentary on social issues.    However... Well...  That's another thread entirely.   

[Aziraphale]

She does also have blue eyes. Could be. Probably isn't. Kinda hope it is.

I thought it was pretty much canon that Sara was eaten by an allosaurus? It could, on the other hand, be Pizza Girl. Like Dale, she may work multiple jobs.

[Method of Madness]

It was never said within the comic, so nope, not canon. We also don't know who Pizza Girl is. We also don't know if Penelope was telling the truth, so the jury's still out on it being her.

[jwhouk]

Wow. So much Story. So wow. What next?

Mom's New Apartment.    5 (12.2%)
May's Employment Attempts.    20 (48.8%)
Relationship Issues (take your pick as to whom)    1 (2.4%)
Hanners and her HAAAAAAATTT!!!!    5 (12.2%)
The Band!    1 (2.4%)  <== P.S.: Jeph's put out the stretch goal comic book!
Harriet officially joins the cast (with her pet bird YB)    3 (7.3%)
Insert Meme Here (space ham, space tea, waffles, etc.)    3 (7.3%)
Something completely different.    3 (7.3%)

Total Members Voted: 41

[mustang6172]

Damn it!  How did someone post those Star Trek videos before me?

Someone should really get around to starting a Star Trek thread.

[Perfectly Reasonable]

I'm sorry that Blondie was interrupted. Her boss might have valid reasons for not wanting to hire robots. There is a reason they keep Charlotte back by the toasters.

Obviously some entities will be more deserving of civil rights than others. But soon you start hearing things like "useless mouths" and "life unworthy of life". So it's best that having those rights is the default condition. Lest someone decide YOU are among the undeserving.

On a more cheerful note, I'm happy to see more about the place of AIs in the QC universe. Gary bless!

[Neko_Ali]

Obviously some entities will be more deserving of civil rights than others.

Highlighting and pointing this out to say NO. This is not in any way a good statement. You did go on to condemn, at least in part, what you said. But this is nothing worthy in that statement. It is the basis and core of all discrimination and bigotry. The feeling or thought that some people are better, more deserving than others of basic rights. That simple thought is the basis of so much hate, so much pain, even so much death in this world that it needs to be expunged. Everyone lives. Everyone feels. Everyone deserves the same civil rights as anyone else.

[Spitfire]

This comic is starting to remind me of O Human Star in the sense of social acceptance of robots/androids being comparable to transgender people. I'm not sure if the comparison is intentional here, but I like it.

[mustang6172]

Transgender people were not created in a laboratory.

[Neko_Ali]

A transgender robot was though. In part at least... In body. The mind belonged to someone else.

[jwhouk]

I'm thinking PR was making an oblique Animal Farm reference.

[hedgie]

Equal rights is a core value here. Northern Light said that would be their last post. It is.

Good.

[Is it cold in here?]

Her boss might have valid reasons for not wanting to hire robots.

Her boss might have had bad experiences with robots.

That's not a valid reason to refuse to take applications from them. Otherwise nobody would ever hire humans, since damn near everyone has had bad experiences with them.

[GarandMarine]

The Measure of a Man is one of the top TNG episodes. Once you let Patrick Stewart get his monologue going on you get the fuck out of the way.

"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied – chains us all, irrevocably."
                                     - Captain Jean Luc Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie, "The Drumhead" TNG S4E21

[Mad Cat]

I've come to a conclusion about May.

It has nothing to do with her poor impulse control. It has nothing to do with her criminal tendencies. It has nothing to do with her desire to become a jet fighter.

May's an asshole.

May's a bitch. May's a curmudgeon; a grump; a sour puss. May's the supreme pessimist. When bad things happen to her, she gets bitter. When good things happen to her, she gets bitter. The later, I think is because she expected bad things to happen, and when they didn't, it violated her sense of expectation. There's literally nothing in the entire universe that can make May happy. Even if everyone in society conveyed unto May the title of Bitch Queen of the Known Universe and catered to her every… impulse… she would still find things in her new power base to complain about and be dissatisfied with.

May's the type of people I assiduously avoid in the real world, so I do not think I will ever find it within myself to like her in QC, much like I will always hate Ruth Lessik in David Willis's Dumbing of Age. She's miserable, and actually enjoys wallowing in her own misery and actively seeks out more things with which to make herself miserable.

[Aziraphale]

The Measure of a Man is one of the top TNG episodes. Once you let Patrick Stewart get his monologue going on you get the fuck out of the way.

"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured...the first thought forbidden...the first freedom denied – chains us all, irrevocably."
                                     - Captain Jean Luc Picard, quoting Judge Aaron Satie, "The Drumhead" TNG S4E21

He doesn't even need a monologue.

"There... are... FOUR... lights!"

[hedgie]

The Measure of a Man is one of the top TNG episodes. Once you let Patrick Stewart get his monologue going on you get the fuck out of the way.

His episodes are really the best.  The rest of the (regular) actors on that show couldn't hold a candle to him.

[foolsguinea]

Who else noticed that the counter girl in Tuesday's strip looked like Raven, before Jeph mentioned it?

It's Raven's sister! OK, not reallly.

[ankhtahr]

Yes, the Picard episodes are the best, there is no episode greater or more tragic than "The Inner Light" in my opinion, but I still love the heck out of the whole series. I had watched many episodes before I sat down to watch them in order (both my parents are trekkies, my mother more than my father) and when I started watching a few concurrent episodes I at first thought it was a selection of best episodes. No, the series is just that good. Once you get past the first season though. Before it felt too much like they were trying to keep the spirit of TOS, afterwards they found their own style.


To return back to this topic here, I think most things were already said. What I still feel the need to mention is that, no matter how much we value free speech and the freedom of opinion, I don't think one should have to tolerate speech or opinions which discriminate others, and thus are going directly against their freedoms. I don't see why one should have to tolerate this, and not create a safe space. A safe space for people who are discriminated against elsewhere. I don't see why a place shouldn't be better than others.

I see this forum as such a safe space. I'd like it to stay one.

[Aahz]

Obviously some entities will be more deserving of civil rights than others.

Highlighting and pointing this out to say NO. This is not in any way a good statement. You did go on to condemn, at least in part, what you said. But this is nothing worthy in that statement. It is the basis and core of all discrimination and bigotry. The feeling or thought that some people are better, more deserving than others of basic rights. That simple thought is the basis of so much hate, so much pain, even so much death in this world that it needs to be expunged. Everyone lives. Everyone feels. Everyone deserves the same civil rights as anyone else.

I agree. If your statment semantically boils down to "But your suffering brings my life *meaning*" then you can rest assured it's pretty darn evil.

[hedgie]

To return back to this topic here, I think most things were already said. What I still feel the need to mention is that, no matter how much we value free speech and the freedom of opinion, I don't think one should have to tolerate speech or opinions which discriminate others, and thus are going directly against their freedoms. I don't see why one should have to tolerate this, and not create a safe space. A safe space for people who are discriminated against elsewhere. I don't see why a place shouldn't be better than others.

I see this forum as such a safe space. I'd like it to stay one.

More than that, it is OT for the comic sub-forum.  Maybe Discuss would be the place for whether or not AIs or ETs (as brought-up by GM) should be treated as people.  This is a different place, and focused on QC canon.  In canon, AIs are legal persons, and have all the rights and responsibilities associated with that (which is probably why Pintsize hasn't done anything horribly illegal for some time).  Just jumping into the discussion and saying that "AIs have no rights" here is *extremely* OT…  Well, that, and those posts look like something that Nick Griffin would have posted.

[Is it cold in here?]

It's interesting though to notice how hard QC society, and even the AnthroPCs themselves, had to work to accept the idea of equal rights. http://questionablecontent.wikia.com/wiki/AnthroPC#Civil_Rights_of_AnthroPCs .

It is still a work in progress.

[sitnspin]

May might be an asshole but she is also a member of a marginalized social class, something I can identify with across multiple spectra. Her anger and hostility in this circumstance is entirely understandable and to dismiss the frustration of marginalized people as simply being miserable for the sake of being miserable is taking part in that marginalization. She and other marginalized people have legitimate cause for misery and frustration.

[Rghfrgl]

So if Monday's Sara and Tuesday is Raven, maybe Wednesday's clerk will be Gabby.

[KOK]

For the record. "Just following orders" is not a flimsy defense. Per all precedents in military and civilian law it is NOT a valid defense of any kind.

If the clerk was following orders, her boss is an idiot. From the boss' point of view, the right thing for the clerk to do is to accept the application, which the boss will then reject. By informing May what is really going on, the clerk has given her the opportunity to do something about it. She has already refused to buy anything, and will most likely urge her friends to avoid this place.

I do not see that the clerk has done anything wrong. She has done May a favor.

[ZoeB]

The "not a natural person" bit is true though. Even Intersex people aren't regarded as such in some jurisdictions.

That is accurate, as they are not natural people, in the strictest sense.  They are posthuman.

You may not be aware that your statement that intersex people are not natural pertains directly to someone with whom you are discussing...

I hope you don't mind me bursting out laughing... I know this is a serious conversation, but sometimes situations are so inherently hilarious....

[ZoeB]

Honestly, I am finding it fairly intimidating trying to explain my thoughts.

Sorry, I'll try not to intimidate you.

I am not a particularly intelligent individual, so I doubt I could properly voice the reasoning behind my opinions.

Horse puckey. Even a superficial analysis of your vocabulary and grammatical structure shows you have to be above average in both intellect and communication.

Give it a go.

It's why I'm interested in your views, and how you came to those conclusions. I'm trying to understand.

[Tova]

When bad things happen to her, she gets bitter. When good things happen to her, she gets bitter.

I think you're jumping to conclusions, there.

http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2515

It has nothing to do with her poor impulse control. It has nothing to do with her criminal tendencies. It has nothing to do with her desire to become a jet fighter.

May's an asshole.

"Poor impulse control" and "criminal tendencies" may or may not be accurate, but at least they are attempts at character descriptions/analysis, whereas "asshole" is nothing more than a value judgement.

The phrase that pops into my mind is "anger management issues."

[ZoeB]

Further thought, while I find the concept of transhumanism interesting, intersex people have been around for a long time. Like since recorded history long.

I actually didn't know that!  When and who was the first recorded case of a true intersex individual?  I'm really interested in reading about it!

This deserves its own thread in the DISCUSS section if it's to go much further... but the basics are simple. Intersex is a possibility in any sexed species. You find it in all mammals, for example. Birds too. Reptiles. Fish.

While chapter 6 focuses on the crimes and punishments of parricides, tyrants, renegade slaves, and corrupt emperors, Celia Schultz, “On the burial of unchaste Vestal Virgins,” pp.122-135, investigates the methods of handling ritual impurity within the priesthood of Vesta for the Vestal Virgins themselves. While ritual murder, broadly defined, was not unfamiliar to the Romans (it occurred twenty times between 230 and 80 B.C.E., p. 135) with many similarities between the methods for hermaphrodites, convicted Vestals, and for pairs of Gauls and Greeks, the three types of ritual murder did not serve a single purpose. In the case of hermaphroditic children and Vestals, their removal needed to be bloodless and permanent, so as not to taint the Roman state as a whole.

Review of Mark Bradley (ed.), Rome, Pollution, and Propriety: Dirt, Disease, and Hygiene in the Eternal City from Antiquity to Modernity. British School at Rome studies.   Cambridge; New York:  Cambridge University Press, 2012.  Pp. xx, 320.  ISBN 9781107014435.

[ZoeB]

May is Momo's Evil Twin. Well, not so much Evil as Assertive and Impulsive. Not as obnoxious as she was.. one can hope that continues.
Momo could learn a little from her. May could learn a thousand times more from Momo.

Heaven help anyone who really got Momo riled. She has the same feelings, but is a nicer person. She keeps those feelings safely bottled up, for transmutation into kindness over time. May just lets them go before they're ripe.

[Mad Cat]

I think you're jumping to conclusions, there.

http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2515

DoA's Ruthless can have episodes intended to show her softer, emotionally vulnerable side as well. Doesn't endear her to me in any way. Her core personality traits remain unchanged. In the immediately past two strips, we have May reacting in the exact same profane and angry way to diametricly opposite news. Her core personality traits remain unchanged.

"Poor impulse control" and "criminal tendencies" may or may not be accurate, but at least they are attempts at character descriptions/analysis, whereas "asshole" is nothing more than a value judgement.

The phrase that pops into my mind is "anger management issues."

They're not my character descriptors/analysis. They're the author's objectively true facts. http://www.questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2502 The asshole part was just my personal executive summary of her character to date.