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Poll

What music should Dora put on for the inevitable bloody reckoning that is to come?

Something up beat and poppy! You can't spell "slaughter" without "laughter" after all!
- 12 (18.5%)
Slayer. Why is this even a question?
- 28 (43.1%)
New Age Spathe Ham Electronica
- 4 (6.2%)
Dubstep, Drop the bass and dropkick someone's soul.
- 8 (12.3%)
I would tell you what band I'd go on a rampage to, but you'd have never heard of them. Pleb.
- 8 (12.3%)
Dora should just calm down and visualize whirled peas till she feels better.
- 5 (7.7%)

Total Members Voted: 62

Voting closed: 30 Aug 2014, 02:49


Pages: 1 ... 5 6 [7] 8 9   Go Down

Author Topic: WCDT: 2776-2780 (25-29 August 2014) Weekly Comic Discussion Thread  (Read 75766 times)

dsvella

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**Blows dust off account**

*cough*

testing psyduck  :psyduck:

OK!
Been lurking for a while but after this weeks WCDT i have decided i need to make my voice heard.

A few points:
1. I am loving the art lately, the lack of borders and some of the drawing is real nice.
2. I don't think i have ever seen so much arguing so early into a week (seriously 6 pages).
3. For what its worth i can understand Dora's position. She has had enough with Sven's shit and faces a decision; either put up with it because he is unlikly to change or don't deal with him. Honestly though i look foreward to the upcoming 'talk' with the parents about this as i suspect that they will see this as a serious issue that they neeed to intervene in.

I may have to comment more often.
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pwhodges

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I get the feeling that not talking to Tai is going to come back and bite someone in the ass.
At the library, Tai says to Marten that Dora's been a bit odd over the past couple of days, and Marten says something that gives the game away.  Tai then gets caught up in the drama.
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NilsO

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Quote from: Dora
I'm cutting him out of my life as entirely as I possibly can!
Let us look at the meaning and the implications.
  • "As I possibly can": They are siblings. Their parents are alive, and both have contact with them. It is a similar situation as divorced couples with children in common. No matter how unpleasant, there must be some form of interaction, planning, and agreement; particularly when their parents get older. On Thanksgiving, they will both probably be sitting at their parents' dinner table.
  • Dora will have to tell Sven about her decision, and her reasons for that. I guess she could just avoid answering his phone calls, and otherwise be as bitchy as possible whenever they meet; but then Sven will not know why, and just assume Dora is crazy.
  • Dora will also have to tell her parents, and ask them never to invite her and Sven at the same time. Still, Dora and Sven are bound to bump into each other sometimes if they come on unannounced visits.
  • Dora and Sven both live in a small town, and are bound to bump into each other now and then, even if Dora bans Sven from Coffee of Doom. Should they just try to ignore each other, or say hello, or even exchange a few meaningless pleasantries? "Hi, how are you?", "Fine", "Me too", "Bye"

CaptainFish

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"No, I'm avoiding mentioning this to anyone who might tell me what an awful idea it is.  I mean, sure, I'm telling you, but that's because you have a noodle for a spine and all you'll do is whinge ineffectually at me for a while."


... except he did tell her what an awful idea it is.

Marten managed to get out 1.5 sentences before being shut down, and only said it was a bit extreme, which isn't really a condemnation as much as it is a description of how intense an action it is to take. I doubt Tai or Faye would say as little if told.
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Thrillho

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I just want to add that Mieville is clearly a toxic scumbag who should be cut out of all of our lives.
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FayeDouble

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I just want to add that Mieville is clearly a toxic scumbag who should be cut out of all of our lives.

Eh, it's part of having a cat. I mean what Mieville did WAS pretty far above on the ewwww factor, but cats do catch stuff. My kitty brought me a dead mole this morning to show off. Look what I did mommy! Since we partially got her to be a hunter and keep the mice away, I praised her and told her she was a good girl and let her play with it a while before I tossed it out so she wouldn't eat it. She eats bugs she catches fast but the moles she plays with first, lol. Silly kitty.
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Thrillho

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I was joking.

Because of the hilariously over the top arguments about Sven that were occurring.

MIEVILLE IS A NASTY BASTARD AND HIS DADDY SAID SO
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FayeDouble

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I was joking.

Because of the hilariously over the top arguments about Sven that were occurring.

MIEVILLE IS A NASTY BASTARD AND HIS DADDY SAID SO

Oh, I know. It was just the perfect opportunity to talk about my kitty.
WHICH I LOVE TO DO.

But yeah, I stayed out of the crazy arguments. I prefer to just scroll and read when those occur.
Besides, Sven is one of my fave characters.
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Somnus Eternus

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I just want to add that Mieville is clearly a toxic scumbag who should be cut out of all of our lives.

It's why I'm a dog person.

Because of Mieville.
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TheEvilDog

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I just want to add that Mieville is clearly a toxic scumbag who should be cut out of all of our lives.
At last! Someone finally gets to the truth and revealed that little fecker for what he truly is!
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sitnspin

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But Mieville is always so supportive of murder plots. How can that be a bad thing?
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TheEvilDog

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Because Mieville is always the one suggesting murder. And he's always stoned on catnip, always wanting to watch the sync-up between Dark Side of the Moon and the Wizard of Oz.
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sitnspin

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Oh sure, use his substance abuse against him. Addiction is a disease.
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TheEvilDog

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Oh please, the cat is a psychopath plain and simple, he's only using the addiction as an excuse to act like an asshole.
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LeeC

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Perhaps I havn't read as much but how is Sven really in her life that she can cut out.  They go about their own lives and he rarely sees his sister as far as I can tell and they don't talk on the phone all the time.  If anything her reactions are internalized feelings that she has to deal with.  Cutting him out of her life will not change anything as far as I can tell.  Perhaps just thinking she is will help ease her mind of all the stress she puts on herself about him?  She should see her or a therapist on dealing with her brother in a healthy way because this is all in her head and has been.

as for the Mieville situation...I would not want to anger the cat overlords.
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sitnspin

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He is a faithful and loving companion. Sure he may suggest murder as a solution to see interpersonal conflicts, but he's a cat. It's a cultural difference. His heart is in the right place.
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TheEvilDog

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See, that's your mistake right there. Cats don't have hearts, just pure, solidified hatred pumping vitriolic ichor through their veins.
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Rubick

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As for not telling Faye - well, obviously I can't guess Jeph's thinking, but I read it as Dora thinking "Faye has a lot of shit going on in her own life, without potentially feeling guilty over causing a familial divide."

ALL HAIL THE PSYCHIC LORD
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cesium133

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As for not telling Faye - well, obviously I can't guess Jeph's thinking, but I read it as Dora thinking "Faye has a lot of shit going on in her own life, without potentially feeling guilty over causing a familial divide."

ALL HAIL THE PSYCHIC LORD
Wait, are you Froglord?
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sitnspin

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Cats are manifestations of the divine. They are the universe condensed into a tiny furry form.
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TheEvilDog

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The only thing Divine about cats inolves Dante's Comedy. Spawn of the devil they are. Pure evil condensed into a tiny furry form of evilness.
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hedgie

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That which is done by a cat always takes place beyond good and evil (apologies to Nietzsche).  Plus, their cuteness excuses them of pretty much everything.
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Cats are the universe, in that they do what they're going to do and it's up to us to figure out how to interact productively with them or stay out of the way. Dogs have to be considered individually.
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Rubick

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As for not telling Faye - well, obviously I can't guess Jeph's thinking, but I read it as Dora thinking "Faye has a lot of shit going on in her own life, without potentially feeling guilty over causing a familial divide."

ALL HAIL THE PSYCHIC LORD
Wait, are you Froglord?

I'm whatever you want me to be.

Provided it's a lord.

That's mandatory.
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sitnspin

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Cats are the universe, in that they do what they're going to do and it's up to us to figure out how to interact productively with them or stay out of the way.
Precisely. Therein lies their majesty and their appeal.
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TheEvilDog

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Bah! Cat cultists everywhere. You've all been brainwashed by those flagitious felines!
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sitnspin

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Nah, I just have respect for beings that have their own identity and sense of self independent of others. That and they are adorable.
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St.Clair

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"No, I'm avoiding mentioning this to anyone who might tell me what an awful idea it is.  I mean, sure, I'm telling you, but that's because you have a noodle for a spine and all you'll do is whinge ineffectually at me for a while."

... except he did tell her what an awful idea it is.

Marten managed to get out 1.5 sentences before being shut down, and only said it was a bit extreme, which isn't really a condemnation as much as it is a description of how intense an action it is to take. I doubt Tai or Faye would say as little if told.

yeah.  perhaps I should have said "would actually (be able to) talk me out of it."  Marten's no more capable of that than a bowl of custard.
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Method of Madness

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As for not telling Faye - well, obviously I can't guess Jeph's thinking, but I read it as Dora thinking "Faye has a lot of shit going on in her own life, without potentially feeling guilty over causing a familial divide."

ALL HAIL THE PSYCHIC LORD
Wait, are you Froglord?
Froglord is the ancient ancestor of Hypnotoad.
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Kugai

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Boradis

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Why the fuck should Faye care what goes on between an ex-fuck buddy she now actively avoids and his sister even though she's her boss?

Why the fuck should Marten give a fuck if Faye finds out?

Jeph, you're really reaching for your drama these days. If you're going to use the hackneyed trope of keeping secrets from each other, you have to at least make it secrets that matter.
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jwhouk

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Geez, what's up with all the haters on webcomics all of a sudden?
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TheEvilDog

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Why the fuck should Faye care what goes on between an ex-fuck buddy she now actively avoids and his sister even though she's her boss?
Because Faye might not appreciate being handled with kid-gloves, especially in a situation that involves her. Because her ex "fuck-buddy" has now been cut out of his sister's life because Sven told Faye he loved her. Let's not forget that pre-Talk Faye was rather prone to let her fists do the talking, far more than afterwards at least. Old habits are quite easy to slip back into.

Why the fuck should Marten give a fuck if Faye finds out?
Probably because he lives with Faye. Probably because Faye is his best friend and Dora is his ex, but still a close friend. Probably because if Faye did find out that Dora, and by extension, Marten were having this conversation, Marten mind end up on a receiving end of a Savannah Slammah.

Jeph, you're really reaching for your drama these days. If you're going to use the hackneyed trope of keeping secrets from each other, you have to at least make it secrets that matter.
This isn't reaching for drama, this is typical Dora acting out and making something about her, insinuating herself into the problem of others.* And this isn't the drama, this is quite possibly the spark to the trail of gunpowder leading to the giant bundle of dynamite and other high power explosives.


*I would like to leave this little caveat that I do like Dora because her issues are somewhat relatable as someone who is a younger sibling to a more successful older sibling.
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Aziraphale

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Why the fuck should Faye care what goes on between an ex-fuck buddy she now actively avoids and his sister even though she's her boss?

Why the fuck should Marten give a fuck if Faye finds out?

Jeph, you're really reaching for your drama these days. If you're going to use the hackneyed trope of keeping secrets from each other, you have to at least make it secrets that matter.

Keeps it true to life, IMHO. Honestly, now: when's the last time you overheard someone's drama* and said, "Well, that's a perfectly rational thing to get irrationally worked up over!" Don't know about you, but if I see someone getting their blood pressure up over something that really isn't worth it, I try to talk them down a bit. That's likely where this arc is going (or should, if you ask me**); Dora has an argument with Sven, or Faye, or both, and either realizes or is told in no uncertain terms that it's not quite her business one way or the other.

*As opposed to things where freaking out is legitimate and warranted, which tend to be fewer and farther between.

**I know, you didn't. Play along, dammit.
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Jazzmaster

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Geez, what's up with all the haters on webcomics all of a sudden?

What "haters"?
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TheEvilDog

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WAIT, waitwaitwait! You mean Marten doesn't smell like flowers anymore?!
OH GOD! WHAT WILL WE DO?!
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TheEvilDog

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WAIT, waitwaitwait! You mean Marten doesn't smell like flowers anymore?!
OH GOD! WHAT WILL WE DO?!
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cesium133

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Marten has switched to the new fragrance from Marty McFly Calvin Klein, Eau du Manure.
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Boradis

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Why the fuck should Faye care what goes on between an ex-fuck buddy she now actively avoids and his sister even though she's her boss?
Because Faye might not appreciate being handled with kid-gloves, especially in a situation that involves her. Because her ex "fuck-buddy" has now been cut out of his sister's life because Sven told Faye he loved her. Let's not forget that pre-Talk Faye was rather prone to let her fists do the talking, far more than afterwards at least. Old habits are quite easy to slip back into.


My point is, this doesn't involve anyone who's not in their family. At all. In the slightest. If I decided to cut off all relations with my sister it wouldn't affect my relationships with my friends, or her relationships with her friends at all. In fact it would be none of their business.

I mean sure I might want to talk it over with them for advice, get some emotional support. But it wouldn't impact their lives directly. At all. It would be a private family matter. And her exes? They would give even less of a shit.

Now I know Dora is a drama queen who thinks the world revolves around her issues, and Marten is a spineless milksop who treats anything said by a person with boobs with deadly earnestness. But in actuality if Dora stopped talking to her brother it wouldn't impact anyone but their immediate family. None of the core cast even deals with Sven on a regular basis or has him as an integral part of their life.

Hell, when was the last time before this new Faye thing that Dora and Sven even shared a strip together? Months? Years? Have they seemed upset by this? Has anyone noticed at all?
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sitnspin

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Marten treats everyone's problems seriously, not just women's. He's a good guy who actually cares about other people. That doesn't make him spineless.
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billydaking

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My point is, this doesn't involve anyone who's not in their family. At all. In the slightest. If I decided to cut off all relations with my sister it wouldn't affect my relationships with my friends, or her relationships with her friends at all. In fact it would be none of their business.

So? Does that mean Dora can't tell the people who are actually closest to her in her life about a major life decision?

Some friends are the family we choose, and we tell them everything going on in our lives, including family matters. Especially when those family matters affect our mutual circle of friends (in this case, Sven's dealings with their mutual close friend Faye).

Quote
I mean sure I might want to talk it over with them for advice, get some emotional support. But it wouldn't impact their lives directly. At all. It would be a private family matter. And her exes? They would give even less of a shit.

So Marten is just an ex? Marten and Dora were friends before their relationship, and that friendship was strong enough to survive a bad breakup. Who else is Dora going to get emotional support from (which is exactly what Dora is doing here)? Tai? Their relationship is still new and tentative, and its Dora's first commitment after her breakup with Marten. Faye? She's cutting off ties with her brother partially because of how he's treated Faye in the past year (yes, a year; remember that time in the comic moves extremely slow compared to real time). Hanners? They've hung out, but they've never been all that close. Penny? Collette? They're just employees. Jim? Same situation as Tai, except even less so.

Marten's a close friend, and has remained so even after their romantic relationship fell apart. He's exactly the kind of friend you share this information with. He's also proven to be a good listener with people he cares about, no matter how remotely.

Quote
Now I know Dora is a drama queen who thinks the world revolves around her issues, and Marten is a spineless milksop who treats anything said by a person with boobs with deadly earnestness. But in actuality if Dora stopped talking to her brother it wouldn't impact anyone but their immediate family. None of the core cast even deals with Sven on a regular basis or has him as an integral part of their life.

Until Sven decides to become one, like he's done with Faye. Dora's and Marten's closest friend.

Quote
Hell, when was the last time before this new Faye thing that Dora and Sven even shared a strip together? Months? Years? Have they seemed upset by this? Has anyone noticed at all?

People noticed, kinda like how they notice with other minor characters who have an affect on the characters' lives, like Marten's mother (hey, another family member!)

Shortly after Angus and Faye got together, Sven took Hanners out on a pretend date back in 1755 to 1770. Dora wasn't thrilled (and neither was Faye), and told him point black. During that story, Sven realized he wasn't over Faye yet, but couldn't understand why.

Even if they haven't shared a strip together that much since the Sven-Faye storyline, many of Dora's issues come out of her rocky lifelong relationship with her brother, which she admitted to her therapist in 2170. She went to talk to him about it in 2192, when she found out that Sven hadn't had sex for months and was starting to reevaluate himself. (The interns were introduced just a few strips later, to put it in story context.)

Since then, Sven laid low by his own choice, moping around. That's why he hasn't been around. In the meantime, Dora, Faye, Marten, and the others moved on with their lives. Now, after his own imposed hermititude, Sven's decided that he loves Faye, and in his self-centered way, bulldozes his way into Faye's life. And thus everybody else's again.

Yes, it's been a long time since we've seen Sven in an active storyline. But that's the kind of character he is.  Just because they're not actively in the strip doesn't mean that they still don't have an affect on the other characters, especially when the backstory was actually told in the strip, and it also doesn't mean they can't simply slip back into the story when driven by their own decisions. People only completely disappear when they move (like Steve's first girlfriend) or get eaten by allosaurus. That's what happens when you have an ensemble strip that's been running for more than a decade. Sven will always be part of Dora's life, no matter how much she tries to cut him out, and he's got two strong connections to two of the three major original characters.
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Tova

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"No, I'm avoiding mentioning this to anyone who might tell me what an awful idea it is.  I mean, sure, I'm telling you, but that's because you have a noodle for a spine and all you'll do is whinge ineffectually at me for a while."


... except he did tell her what an awful idea it is.

Marten managed to get out 1.5 sentences before being shut down, and only said it was a bit extreme, which isn't really a condemnation as much as it is a description of how intense an action it is to take. I doubt Tai or Faye would say as little if told.

I must be spineless too, because I found Marten's response to be perfectly proportionate.

It's only in comparison to the over the top reactions in here that he seems subdued.
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Beware Cats bearing gifts?

Beware cats bearing GIFs :claireface:

Well done! Well done indeed!  :laugh:
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dsvella

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To the various people arguing about the supposed divine / infernal nature of cats...

You guys are awesome.

That is all.
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hedgie

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Keeps it true to life, IMHO. Honestly, now: when's the last time you overheard someone's drama* and said, "Well, that's a perfectly rational thing to get irrationally worked up over!"
Sadly, my total refusal to deal with such shite has had a negative effect on my employment status lately.  By not getting into drama, I basically have ignored most former cow-orkers, and only listened to bosses when they were giving orders.  It doesn't do one well when it comes to "networking" (apparently, there's some sort that doesn't require Cat-5 or wireless).
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"The highest treason in the USA is to say Americans are not loved, no matter where they are, no matter what they are doing there." -- Vonnegut

Tova

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To the various people arguing about the supposed divine / infernal nature of cats...

Wait. Supposed?
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Yet the lies of Melkor, the mighty and the accursed, Morgoth Bauglir, the Power of Terror and of Hate, sowed in the hearts of Elves and Men are a seed that does not die and cannot be destroyed; and ever and anon it sprouts anew, and will bear dark fruit even unto the latest days. (Silmarillion 255)

Loki

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Bah! Cat cultists everywhere. You've all been brainwashed by those flagitious felines!

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toxoplasma_gondii

Sleep well.

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The future is a weird place and you never know where it will take you.
the careful illusion of shit-togetherness

ASB84

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I think Dora's latest take on the matter is more measured and realistic. I can certainly relate: over the past couple of years, I've had to distance myself, and eventually cut myself off from, someone who used to be a close friend, but in recent times has become a very nasty and petty person who has treated me rather poorly (and in retrospect, was doing that for years before their nastiness really become apparent). So yeah, I can sympathise with Dora...though I would hope that she's spoken to Sven or intends to tell him that she's done with him, and to keep his distance. That's what I did, though it took for a while for the message to sink in. Hopefully - for the sake of a fictional character! - Sven will have more respect for his sister than my former friend did for me.

Having said that though, the arc still bugs me a little. Not because what Sven did with Faye wasn't a bad idea (it was), not because his attitude after being told where to go was out of line (it was), and not because Dora doesn't have the right to distance herself from her brother because she's sick of his crap (she does). It's not even the notion that Dora might be overreacting to second/third hand news (she arguably is, but she's not completely off-base, either).

Again, it's more that it seems like Sven's more redeemable traits have been overlooked/ret-conned out of existence in order to facilitate the current arc. That's why I'm hoping this arc does get a decent run and is explored a bit from both sides rather than being pushed aside, say, for a week of Marigold grossing out Hanners or wacky May hi-jinks.

I guess I want to know whether Sven's previous acts that have shown him to not be a completely terrible person were genuine, and that this is just him handling a situation badly because of his own baggage, or whether it's a case of nope, that was an all act, he truly is an irredeemable jerk. I'm kind of hoping it's the former, as I think the latter is sort of an easy way out, and definitely strips some complexity from the character, for the sake of having an antagonist in the current arc.

Still, if I'm thinking about it that much, connecting to the characters and feeling intrigued...well, I do like that. Good fiction should be able to elicit a response like that. I'm just hoping the twists and turns, and ultimately the conclusion of the story, will offer a satisfying payoff.
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Carl-E

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I guess I want to know whether Sven's previous acts that have shown him to not be a completely terrible person were genuine, and that this is just him handling a situation badly because of his own baggage, or whether it's a case of nope, that was an all act, he truly is an irredeemable jerk. I'm kind of hoping it's the former, as I think the latter is sort of an easy way out, and definitely strips some complexity from the character, for the sake of having an antagonist in the current arc.

I have to agree with you on this one - that is, I'm thinking it's the first option. 

He has a long way to grow, though. 
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When people try to speak a gut reaction, they end up talking out their ass.
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