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This week on QC...

Now departing the USS MartenClaire *bell rings*
- 122 (56.7%)
Jephizba trolls us all, hallowed be the trollmaster's name.
- 32 (14.9%)
Spatheham and Clairemom Pancakes
- 7 (3.3%)
A solid week of Steve eating cereal
- 9 (4.2%)
Martenmom and Clairemom team up and fight crime/meddle in their children's personal lives
- 45 (20.9%)

Total Members Voted: 203

Voting closed: 09 Oct 2014, 22:04


Pages: 1 ... 14 15 [16] 17 18 ... 32   Go Down

Author Topic: WCDT: 2806-2810 (6th - 10th October 2014) Weekly Comic Discussion Thread  (Read 143893 times)

T

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Okay, it's kind of killing me. Is Claire biologically a man? It would paint Marten in a new way because there was no pretext of him swinging that way or is it that Marten has gotten past all of that and is only looking at the person underneath?? Or is it that he thinks he can do that but will  find out that it just doesn't work on that level for him? Or is she biologically a girl.... but doesn't act on her gender....

I'll say this much: Her hips move like she's anatomically female. Men can walk like that but it takes conscious effort. Claire was half-asleep, so it is just how her body works. I'd say she's >80℅ through transition.
Although anatomically speaking female gait part of normal women movement I guess a man can actively train that until it takes no more conscious effort.

Taking hormone in adulthood wouldn't change that because it is part of the basic bone structure I think.
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Nightfall44

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OK... I've signed up to comment on this for a number of reasons.

Firstly, Claire looks EXACTLY like a girl I know who is/was in the same situation as Claire who I crushed on for ages. Not the "one that got away", but close. DAMN if I haven't been rooting for Marten and Claire.

Secondly, the "Nose Grows Some" reference had me worried. Why? Pinocchio. To me, it was a suggestion that this was a falsehood. But somehow I'm doubting that.

Thirdly, I want to put my own thoughts in on this. This is a potential relationship where Marten hasn't been pushed into it. It's all his OWN initiative, unlike most of the others... Padma, Dora, D (not that that was a relationship, but it follows the pattern) all pretty much took the lead and he followed. For once, it's his own choice to pursue something. Yes, this has been mentioned before, but there is another aspect to this.

In this (potential) relationship, there are no expectations. They HAVE to feel it out. He doesn't have to take a role other than a decent, upright guy. It can be taken at its own speed, and both of them can put on the brakes at any point. He can, in his own way, take the lead by NOT taking the lead.

Does that make sense to anyone else?

But I am squeeing like a 14-year-old girl at these developments. I really, REALLY hope that Jeph isn't trolling us again...
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T

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Maybe he will
(click to show/hide)

That ship sunk so long ago it's sitting in the middle of a desert.
And that's why it could happen! Because nobody is expecting it anymor... Oh... Now it won't happen... Wait!  :psyduck:
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Okay, it's kind of killing me. Is Claire biologically a man? It would paint Marten in a new way because there was no pretext of him swinging that way or is it that Marten has gotten past all of that and is only looking at the person underneath?? Or is it that he thinks he can do that but will  find out that it just doesn't work on that level for him? Or is she biologically a girl.... but doesn't act on her gender....

Hello, and welcome, and please give yourself an emergency crash course in transgender issues.

Claire's brain is set to female, and brains are biological, so "biologically a man" is imprecise language that will lead your thinking astray. The delivery room doctor probably checked "male" if that's what you're asking. Marten is flexible enough to realize that the person underneath is a woman despite accidents of birth.

Prepare for some serious brain-stretching as you study this!
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T

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Secondly, the "Nose Grows Some" reference had me worried. Why? Pinocchio. To me, it was a suggestion that this was a falsehood. But somehow I'm doubting that.
It is a reference to a song. It was posted in the thread earlier.
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TomOBedlam

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I've got to say that even the view points that I don't agree with here are fascinating - it isn't just that there is more than one way to start or be in a relationship, there is a human race full of ways :-)
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Nightfall44

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Secondly, the "Nose Grows Some" reference had me worried. Why? Pinocchio. To me, it was a suggestion that this was a falsehood. But somehow I'm doubting that.
It is a reference to a song. It was posted in the thread earlier.

I got that. I didn't know that at the time, but it still gave me some misgivings after that was pointed out. And it could still be a reference to that as well... but, as I said, I doubt that. Just my two pence on that one.
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Half Empty Coffee Cup

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I've got to say that even the view points that I don't agree with here are fascinating - it isn't just that there is more than one way to start or be in a relationship, there is a human race full of ways :-)
As many ways as people.  :-)
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Secondly, the "Nose Grows Some" reference had me worried. Why? Pinocchio. To me, it was a suggestion that this was a falsehood. But somehow I'm doubting that.
It is a reference to a song. It was posted in the thread earlier.
Y'know, I don't understand those lyrics and definitely don't understand what it has to do with the comic.  If anyone wants to draw any kind of connection.... ?
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Welcome, new people, and here's a repost of something topical you may not have gotten to yet in the Rules section.

Quote from: forum rules
Speaking of civility, there are a lot of things to know about transgender and other trans* people. This set of rules is incomplete.

The principle to keep in mind is that the trans* people are male, female, or other as they report themselves to be. They have spent their lives grappling with their identity and are the world's leading authorities on it. Next is that they have always been that sex even when their bodies didn't match. Remember those points and you'll see a lot of the etiquette for yourself.

Don't argue "biology" unless you have a specialist post-secondary education.

Private parts and pronouns: use pronouns people tell you to use for them. And don't put them in quotes. Don't ask about medical status. Natural general curiosity you should satisfy with online resources such as http://glaad.org/transgender but don't pry into someone's life. You wouldn't ask any other woman "Do you have a vagina"?, so don't do it to a trans woman.

That includes Claire. It took a while to persuade the moderators but it turns out that speculating about Claire's downstairs hurts real people. Further,
Quote from Jeph Jacques
    Dear everyone who ever asks about Claire’s junk: it’s none of your business what’s in somebody else’s pants. Stop it.


That word you saw online is a toxic slur. "Shemale", "tranny", and anything you've seen on a porn site will be treated like ethnic slurs by the moderators.

Want to know more?. There's a lot to learn. Start with the links ZoeB posted at the beginning of the trans* discussion thread. Be cautious asking in the forum: make sure you don't sound like you're entitled to answers. We have some generous educators but don't overuse them.
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feelsalmostbad

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Okay, it's kind of killing me. Is Claire biologically a man? It would paint Marten in a new way because there was no pretext of him swinging that way or is it that Marten has gotten past all of that and is only looking at the person underneath?? Or is it that he thinks he can do that but will  find out that it just doesn't work on that level for him? Or is she biologically a girl.... but doesn't act on her gender....

Welcome, new person!

If you research the matter further, you'll find the term "biologically a man/a woman" fails to properly describe the situation in any case. After all, what are we but biology, no matter our bodies?

So Claire is a woman, because she identifies as a woman.


If you intended it as a question about her genitalia: please don't discuss that. In the manner such discussions tend to go, they very quickly become disrespectful to real people, of which we have a-plenty on this board. Imho not discussing people's genitalia without their consent is basic human decency.

I can't get a fictitious person's consent. My only reason for asking the question is because I want to get into Marten's headspace. Genitalia exist, it's part of being human. Some humans like one set, some the other, and some both. To my knowledge Marten has never expressed any interest in people with male genitalia. It seems out of character to suddenly jump into relationship with a transgender person because we have no previous examples of him expressing interest in the male sex. My inquiry stems from the thought if this is something Marten has considered fully. I can't judge if Marten thinks he is being bold and assertive and fooling himself that he can do this or if he is genuinely attracted to Claire both physically and emotionally. I guess that is yet to be decided but not knowing left me scratching my head. I'm not looking to discuss this any further as I am already ranting a bit but I don't believe in ignoring one aspect of a person because it leaves me lacking understanding of them as a whole especially when it is something they might be uncomfortable with because then I can understand  at least from an external view point what difficulties they may face.
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feelsalmostbad

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Okay, it's kind of killing me. Is Claire biologically a man? It would paint Marten in a new way because there was no pretext of him swinging that way or is it that Marten has gotten past all of that and is only looking at the person underneath?? Or is it that he thinks he can do that but will  find out that it just doesn't work on that level for him? Or is she biologically a girl.... but doesn't act on her gender....

Hello, and welcome, and please give yourself an emergency crash course in transgender issues.

Claire's brain is set to female, and brains are biological, so "biologically a man" is imprecise language that will lead your thinking astray. The delivery room doctor probably checked "male" if that's what you're asking. Marten is flexible enough to realize that the person underneath is a woman despite accidents of birth.

Prepare for some serious brain-stretching as you study this!
My language is sloppy but my understanding is clear. I doubt Marten's credibility because I've seen people make decisions like this in real life only to realize later that they chose something that they actually didn't want, often harming others in the process.
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Platypodes

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I've seen people make decisions like this in real life only to realize later that they chose something that they actually didn't want, often harming others in the process.
The decision to date the person you find attractive and see whether it works out often does lead to such realizations and hurt feelings, yes.  But there's only one way to find out...
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valkygrrl

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Hello, and welcome, and please give yourself an emergency crash course in transgender issues.

Claire's brain is set to female, and brains are biological, so "biologically a man" is imprecise language that will lead your thinking astray. The delivery room doctor probably checked "male" if that's what you're asking. Marten is flexible enough to realize that the person underneath is a woman despite accidents of birth.

Prepare for some serious brain-stretching as you study this!

I'm so going to be banned for this but remember who brought this male/female brain stuff into the discussion...

Claire is a lovely person who for some reason or reasons was sufficiently uncomfortable with the physical and social conditions imposed by the circumstances of her birth. So uncomfortable that she sought out to change those things and has succeeded to such an extent that the people around her though either ignorance or acceptance see Claire as what she chooses to present to the world. Good for her and good for Marten not having hangups that get in the way or perusing someone he likes, who likes him and would make a good match.

But this stuff about male and female brains is so much offensive crap!

A brain is a brain. To even suggest anything else is to buy into all that crap of boys are better than girl at... and girls are better than boys at... It reenforces misogynistic bullshit like women are too emotional or girls are bad at math. It says men are right every time they make an excuse up about how woman are supposed to behave because now their brains are like that not becuse form an early age they were trained by the pink asile at the toy store with little dolls and easy bake ovens while the Lego and blocks were in the blue aisle.

Boy brain or girl brain is bullshit. And the science agrees.

Kindly read this before pressing the ban button. http://www.popsci.com/article/science/stop-looking-%E2%80%9Chardwired%E2%80%9D-differences-male-and-female-brains
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pwhodges

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I'm not looking to discuss this any further as I am already ranting a bit but I don't believe in ignoring one aspect of a person because it leaves me lacking understanding of them as a whole especially when it is something they might be uncomfortable with because then I can understand  at least from an external view point what difficulties they may face.

We don't ignore the issue; we restrict the discussion of it in a number of ways, and for a number of reasons. 

The owner of this forum, the artist himself, has made it clear that talking about people's and character's genitalia is off-limits; his place, his rules. 

The mods, trying to follow his guidance, together with that of those most affected by society's marginalisation of them (and worse - much worse) have channelled the discussion of trans*-related matters into threads in the Discuss! forum - those threads contain many thousands of posts around this subject which are useful to read, and which will give some insight into the decisions that are made here.

To even suggest anything else is to buy into all that crap of boys are better than girl at... and girls are better than boys at...

No one here is saying that different means better or worse; that is bullshit.  Read the thousands of posts I just mentioned (and the links they contain) for more background.
« Last Edit: 08 Oct 2014, 00:48 by pwhodges »
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hakko504

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Okay, it's kind of killing me. Is Claire biologically a man?
Well, if you check her DNA, yes.
While this is probable, there is no way for us to know whether it's true or not.
She also had an operation to transform her penis into a vagina
You do not know that. It has never been stated and we've been (repeatedly) asked not to speculate.
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NilsO

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I'm just not buyin' it. It truly pains me to say it, 'cause I've been reading this comic for YEARS, and I've loved Jeph's work, and I've bought QC stuff from him to support him,  but I think this might be a tipping point.  It feels like getting Marten into another relationship just for the sake of getting him into another relationship, and nothing more.  I love Jeph's work, but I'm having real trouble following this move.  Where's the heart behind it, where's the impetus?  I just...

I don't see it.

Me neither. Probably has to do with the fact that I don't really like Claire and it's, to be honest, hard for me to gather why everybody loves her so much.  Can't see where Marten has got his feelings from, just can't. But we're very alone, so I think we just missed something and/or have a very different perception, so I'm just going to see myself out until this arc pauses ;)
Agreed. She is judgmental, and the puns are irritating (although Emily's are often worse). And she really needs a haircut.

USS Martenclaire

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It's actually really easy to understand. Think about someone you're attracted to. It doesn't have to be your One True Love or anything like that. What goes through your mind? Their laugh? Their smile? Perhaps they have a personality quirk you find endearing. A couple of times you fall asleep in each others arms; you feel warm, content and happy.

The universe then smiles on you and the two of you start dating. Life couldn't be better. One night the two of you decide to make love for the first time - but there's a problem. Your genitals are too big/too small for your partner and making love is not as straightforward as it normally is. Your partner is upset and afraid. Are you suddenly going to say to them "Your stuff isn't what I usually want in a partner - it's over between us." Are you suddenly and magically going to turn those feelings of warmth and attraction off? Or do you find a way to make things work?

Once you have the answer, then you'll know why Claire's downstairs configuration is a secondary concern to Marten, instead of his overriding goal.


If you want a more concise version: you date a *person*, you don't date their disembodied genitals.
« Last Edit: 08 Oct 2014, 01:07 by USS Martenclaire »
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feelsalmostbad

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I'm not looking to discuss this any further as I am already ranting a bit but I don't believe in ignoring one aspect of a person because it leaves me lacking understanding of them as a whole especially when it is something they might be uncomfortable with because then I can understand  at least from an external view point what difficulties they may face.

We don't ignore the issue; we restrict the discussion of it in a number of ways, and for a number of reasons. 

The owner of this forum, the artist himself, has made it clear that talking about people's and character's genitalia is off-limits; his place, his rules. 

The mods, trying to follow his guidance, together with that of those most affected by society's marginalisation of them (and worse - much worse) have channelled the discussion of trans*-related matters into threads in the Discuss! forum - those threads contain many thousands of posts around this subject which are useful to read, and which will give some insight into the decisions that are made here.

To even suggest anything else is to buy into all that crap of boys are better than girl at... and girls are better than boys at...

No one here is saying that different means better or worse; that is bullshit.  Read the thousands of posts I just mentioned (and the links they contain) for more background.

On a general level I feel that restrictions on discussing any topic is often counterproductive. It often ends by one party telling the other party blatantly that they are wrong and ending the discussion. The offending party is then offended themselves and usually cements their beliefs and possible misconceptions. Instead an open (yet objectively moderated) discussion where people can ask and should ask questions to one another in order to achieve a better understanding of a topic or where one side is coming from will lead to better understanding all around. However I will respect Jeph's rules as it is his site and I have no say in the matter.
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T

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Boy brain or girl brain is bullshit. And the science agrees.
Actually science disagrees with you. Popsci is not a valid scientific source.

There are male and female patterns meaning that there are patterns found more often in a gender than the other. The development of body parts is influenced by chemical signals like hormones since inside uterus and the brain is a body part.

There are studies based on girls who have been exposed to androgens before birth (due to some hormonal disfunction) and they are more likely to have male-typical interests.

http://psych.colorado.edu/~carey/pdffiles/cah_berenbaum01.pdf

Don't forget that humans are animals and that the brain is a body part like any other.
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Platypodes

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Can we go back to discussing pancakes?
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USS Martenclaire

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Can we go back to discussing pancakes?

"The syrup is for the *pancakes*!"
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Tub

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I thought the entire comic was to inflict pain on Marten ::)
Someone should tell Jeph, he seems to have forgotten for the last couple of weeks ;)

That obsessive, butterflies in the stomach feeling you get about someone though?  That never led me to any good places, not even once.
I hear you. When enumerating body parts that are qualified to make lifechanging decisions, "genitalia", "hormonal glands" and "heart" are not among them. Always double check with your brain.

That being said, emotions are a powerful thing and cannot be entirely discounted. After all, the whole point of your brain is to make you happy, which is an emotion.


I don't think Clinton is a big Marten fan.
I don't think Clinton is a big fan of anyone. He's overprotective of Claire to the point that he'd probably want to see her locked in a cage, three miles underground, where nothing could hurt her.
She has put him into place before, she may need to do it again. I expect him to stay suspicious, but I also expect him to respect his sister's wishes of not interfering.

To my knowledge Marten has never expressed any interest in people with male genitalia.
He has never expressed any interest in men. While there's a huge overlap between men and people with male genitalia, you don't check someone's pants to figure out whether they're attractive.

Claire is at a point in her transition where she looks female, behaves female and smells female. Marten does not seem to have any trouble seeing her as a female being, and his attraction to her can be real. It's possible that he wouldn't even know about her trans status if she hadn't told him.

At that point, in a perfect world, genitalia should be a minor issue they can work through. I understand that it's not a minor issue for everyone. Let me quote someone who said it better than I could:
It's actually really easy to understand. Think about someone you're attracted to. It doesn't have to be your One True Love or anything like that. What goes through your mind? Their laugh? Their smile? Perhaps they have a personality quirk you find endearing. A couple of times you fall asleep in each others arms; you feel warm, content and happy.

The universe then smiles on you and the two of you start dating. Life couldn't be better. One night the two of you decide to make love for the first time - but there's a problem. Your genitals are too big/too small for your partner and making love is not as straightforward as it normally is. Your partner is upset and afraid. Are you suddenly going to say to them "Your stuff isn't what I usually want in a partner - it's over between us." Are you suddenly and magically going to turn those feelings of warmth and attraction off? Or do you find a way to make things work?
These are questions everyone should ask themselves at one point or another. Knowing your priorities in a relationship helps making better relationship decisions. My personal conclusion has been that sex is awesome, but it's not the part of a relationship I need to be happy. Your results may vary.


Whatever claire has down there, it will unfortunately be different to what marten is used to from cis women. They agreed to work through that when they're getting there. It's possible that it'll end up more complicated and/or less satisfying than the sex he had with his previous cis girlfriends, but that doesn't need to be dealbreaker.
Frankly, I don't think the issue of her pants is the biggest hurdle they will have to face.
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T

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Can we go back to discussing pancakes?
Sure! But I still would rather have waffles most of the times.
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Platypodes

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"The syrup is for the *pancakes*!"
Oh god, how did it take us this long for anyone to make that connection?
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Thrillho

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It's actually really easy to understand. Think about someone you're attracted to. It doesn't have to be your One True Love or anything like that. What goes through your mind? Their laugh? Their smile? Perhaps they have a personality quirk you find endearing. A couple of times you fall asleep in each others arms; you feel warm, content and happy.

The universe then smiles on you and the two of you start dating. Life couldn't be better. One night the two of you decide to make love for the first time - but there's a problem. Your genitals are too big/too small for your partner and making love is not as straightforward as it normally is. Your partner is upset and afraid. Are you suddenly going to say to them "Your stuff isn't what I usually want in a partner - it's over between us." Are you suddenly and magically going to turn those feelings of warmth and attraction off? Or do you find a way to make things work?

Once you have the answer, then you'll know why Claire's downstairs configuration is a secondary concern to Marten, instead of his overriding goal.


If you want a more concise version: you date a *person*, you don't date their disembodied genitals.

I. Love. This. Post.

We are getting an alarming number of newbies who just don't get it.
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T

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I thought the entire comic was to inflict pain on Marten ::)
Someone should tell Jeph, he seems to have forgotten for the last couple of weeks ;)
Just to make things even more devastating when they don't work out?

Things seemed to be going alright between him and Dora in the begin.
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valkygrrl

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Boy brain or girl brain is bullshit. And the science agrees.
Actually science disagrees with you. Popsci is not a valid scientific source.

There are male and female patterns meaning that there are patterns found more often in a gender than the other. The development of body parts is influenced by chemical signals like hormones since inside uterus and the brain is a body part.

There are studies based on girls who have been exposed to androgens before birth (due to some hormonal disfunction) and they are more likely to have male-typical interests.

http://psych.colorado.edu/~carey/pdffiles/cah_berenbaum01.pdf

Don't forget that humans are animals and that the brain is a body part like any other.

Your reply suggests belief in such a thing as male-centric interests rather than the patriarchy suggesting which interests are acceptable based on biology.  What that study so condescendingly calls male-typical play is actively suppressed in the female half of the population. Boys will be boys vs don't you want to be a good girl? You're ignoring how early and strongly cultural training starts and how deeply its ingrained not to mention how changeable it has been over the years. Victorian women were expected to be reserved, Elizabethan women were expected to be bawdy, read Shakespeare some time. Are you suggesting sudden evolution changed lady brains? Does Marigold have a partial male brain because she liked video games?

Also I see your study and raise you another article http://womensenews.org/story/women-in-science/131212/calling-all-female-brains-stop-the-neurosexism#.VDTzbGcxUg4
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T

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It's actually really easy to understand. Think about someone you're attracted to. It doesn't have to be your One True Love or anything like that. What goes through your mind? Their laugh? Their smile? Perhaps they have a personality quirk you find endearing. A couple of times you fall asleep in each others arms; you feel warm, content and happy.

The universe then smiles on you and the two of you start dating. Life couldn't be better. One night the two of you decide to make love for the first time - but there's a problem. Your genitals are too big/too small for your partner and making love is not as straightforward as it normally is. Your partner is upset and afraid. Are you suddenly going to say to them "Your stuff isn't what I usually want in a partner - it's over between us." Are you suddenly and magically going to turn those feelings of warmth and attraction off? Or do you find a way to make things work?

Once you have the answer, then you'll know why Claire's downstairs configuration is a secondary concern to Marten, instead of his overriding goal.


If you want a more concise version: you date a *person*, you don't date their disembodied genitals.

I. Love. This. Post.

We are getting an alarming number of newbies who just don't get it.

I wonder how many people got the mental image of a person taking a genital for a fancy dinner  :roll:

Now you got it!
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feelsalmostbad

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It's actually really easy to understand. Think about someone you're attracted to. It doesn't have to be your One True Love or anything like that. What goes through your mind? Their laugh? Their smile? Perhaps they have a personality quirk you find endearing. A couple of times you fall asleep in each others arms; you feel warm, content and happy.

The universe then smiles on you and the two of you start dating. Life couldn't be better. One night the two of you decide to make love for the first time - but there's a problem. Your genitals are too big/too small for your partner and making love is not as straightforward as it normally is. Your partner is upset and afraid. Are you suddenly going to say to them "Your stuff isn't what I usually want in a partner - it's over between us." Are you suddenly and magically going to turn those feelings of warmth and attraction off? Or do you find a way to make things work?

Once you have the answer, then you'll know why Claire's downstairs configuration is a secondary concern to Marten, instead of his overriding goal.

I would love to believe that is always the case however I feel it is an ideal situation. People are different, they have different thought processes, modus operandi etc.... I know not everyone thinks nor acts that way whether it be the fault of our society or otherwise. Physical attraction is a deal breaker for many people. I understand how many people have successful relationships regardless of genitalia but to say that all people can do that would be a very broad statement. That's why I feel it is important to shed some light on what Marten is really thinking and feeling. He's reached a critical point in his life and he's freaking out about a lot of things. He may not be behaving rationally. It's entirely possible he's looking for something he can control because right now he feels like he is so out of control.  So when I am presented with their romance it's important in my mind that I have all the facts straight. In real life people's personal life isn't my business  especially when it comes to genitalia but when I am being told a story I feel it's my right to ask questions as it provides context and insight into what is happening and how I feel about characters.
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anahata

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If you want a more concise version: you date a *person*, you don't date their disembodied genitals.

Yes. I tried to say something like this a long way back.

On a general level I feel that restrictions on discussing any topic is often counterproductive.
In this case, the discussions that happened before that rule was made were far more counterproductive.
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T

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Boy brain or girl brain is bullshit. And the science agrees.
Actually science disagrees with you. Popsci is not a valid scientific source.

There are male and female patterns meaning that there are patterns found more often in a gender than the other. The development of body parts is influenced by chemical signals like hormones since inside uterus and the brain is a body part.

There are studies based on girls who have been exposed to androgens before birth (due to some hormonal disfunction) and they are more likely to have male-typical interests.

http://psych.colorado.edu/~carey/pdffiles/cah_berenbaum01.pdf

Don't forget that humans are animals and that the brain is a body part like any other.

Your reply suggests belief in such a thing as male-centric interests rather than the patriarchy suggesting which interests are acceptable based on biology.  What that study so condescendingly calls male-typical play is actively suppressed in the female half of the population. Boys will be boys vs don't you want to be a good girl? You're ignoring how early and strongly cultural training starts and how deeply its ingrained not to mention how changeable it has been over the years. Victorian women were expected to be reserved, Elizabethan women were expected to be bawdy, read Shakespeare some time. Are you suggesting sudden evolution changed lady brains? Does Marigold have a partial male brain because she liked video games?

Also I see your study and raise you another article http://womensenews.org/story/women-in-science/131212/calling-all-female-brains-stop-the-neurosexism#.VDTzbGcxUg4

Do you have any scientific source? Like published papers instead of stuff from random websites?
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BenRG

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Taking hormone in adulthood wouldn't change that because it is part of the basic bone structure I think.

Agreed; that's why I speculated about either surgical reconstruction (horrendously expensive, hazardous and unlikely) or nanorobotic bone molecular restructuring (thanks Dr E-C) up-thread.

If it's the latter... I wonder if it's an experimental therapy that Claire agreed to try out? I wonder how Hannelore would react to it? Would she regard Claire as effectively being a kind of step-sister, someone else touched by her father's genius?
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Platypodes

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I thought the entire comic was to inflict pain on Marten ::)
Someone should tell Jeph, he seems to have forgotten for the last couple of weeks ;)
Maybe longer than that, now that I think of it.

In the early days, there was much more of a running gag of Marty being the poor sucker who always gets barfed upon or clonked in the junk, but Jeph mostly left that behind as the comic got more sophisticated and the characters more complex.
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feelsalmostbad

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I. Love. This. Post.

We are getting an alarming number of newbies who just don't get it.

How am I not supposed to take that as combative? Presented with an opportunity to educate you instead choose to ridicule.
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rschill

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Can we go back to discussing pancakes?

Yes!  I've had enough of this waffling. 
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Platypodes

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Can we go back to discussing pancakes?

Yes!  I've had enough of this waffling.
Indeed--it's starting to give me the crepes.
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valkygrrl

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Do you have any scientific source? Like published papers instead of stuff from random websites?

the articles cite their sources. Is there a reason you insist on seeing males and females as different rather than as people who are treated differently based on physical differences? Why do you wish to justify the stupid social expectations that put dolls in the hands of girls and blocks into the hands of boys instead of giving both to both?
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plusorminus

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I would love to believe that is always the case however I feel it is an ideal situation. People are different, they have different thought processes, modus operandi etc.... I know not everyone thinks nor acts that way whether it be the fault of our society or otherwise. Physical attraction is a deal breaker for many people. I understand how many people have successful relationships regardless of genitalia but to say that all people can do that would be a very broad statement. That's why I feel it is important to shed some light on what Marten is really thinking and feeling. He's reached a critical point in his life and he's freaking out about a lot of things. He may not be behaving rationally. It's entirely possible he's looking for something he can control because right now he feels like he is so out of control.  So when I am presented with their romance it's important in my mind that I have all the facts straight. In real life people's personal life isn't my business  especially when it comes to genitalia but when I am being told a story I feel it's my right to ask questions as it provides context and insight into what is happening and how I feel about characters.

But I wonder if you would think this if Marten were with Emily? Or someone else not-Claire. If he were with Emily, let's say, he'd still be freaking out about a lot of things, so what really is the big deal? Claire is a woman. Reducing her to her "parts" isn't fair, and I think that's why that sort of discussion is verboten here.

I think that we will see Marten's state of mind as things progress between him and Claire. He is, at this point, not drunk, thinking rationally, and talking rationally. Claire has asked him directly if he was okay with her being trans. He actually didn't give her a yes or no answer, but he was honest. He doesn't know. This is uncharted territory for him. Things felt natural, but he is hinting that they must take things as they come and talk things out because there might come a time where things don't feel natural. But aside from that, he wanted to give them a chance.

In many ways, this is similar to the talk Tai had with Dora. At that point, Tai had never had a "real" relationship and she could not promise Dora that they'd live happily ever after, but she was into her and wanted to give it a shot.
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Psuedoname

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(does anyone besides Claire even own a car in this comic?)
Started to think about it, and had to find out, only can be sure of a couple

Angus http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2292
possibly Steve and/or Cosette http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2298
Raven -aargh, couldnt find it, think it's a yellow Beetle
Tai - see same comic for Steve, also when she ran a few red lights thinking about Dora
Penelope http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=1000

Also, no new comic today :(

Warning - while you were typing 16 QC characters drove past in their cars. You may wish to review your post.
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Platypodes

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Dora has a car; she talks about driving to Marten & Faye's place the night she walks Tai home.
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BenRG

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In the early days, there was much more of a running gag of Marty being the poor sucker who always gets barfed upon or clonked in the junk, but Jeph mostly left that behind as the comic got more sophisticated and the characters more complex.

One of the running themes of the comic could be said to be Marten's climb out of the status of being "Fate's butt-monkey". The sci-fi fanatic in me considers the logical final step to be for him to step in Steve's shoes and have an action/adventure arc. Maybe saving Hannelore from her mother's evil plots (I'd love to see Beatrice doing a Dr Evil-style pinkie evil laugh).
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feelsalmostbad

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I would love to believe that is always the case however I feel it is an ideal situation. People are different, they have different thought processes, modus operandi etc.... I know not everyone thinks nor acts that way whether it be the fault of our society or otherwise. Physical attraction is a deal breaker for many people. I understand how many people have successful relationships regardless of genitalia but to say that all people can do that would be a very broad statement. That's why I feel it is important to shed some light on what Marten is really thinking and feeling. He's reached a critical point in his life and he's freaking out about a lot of things. He may not be behaving rationally. It's entirely possible he's looking for something he can control because right now he feels like he is so out of control.  So when I am presented with their romance it's important in my mind that I have all the facts straight. In real life people's personal life isn't my business  especially when it comes to genitalia but when I am being told a story I feel it's my right to ask questions as it provides context and insight into what is happening and how I feel about characters.

But I wonder if you would think this if Marten were with Emily? Or someone else not-Claire. If he were with Emily, let's say, he'd still be freaking out about a lot of things, so what really is the big deal? Claire is a woman. Reducing her to her "parts" isn't fair, and I think that's why that sort of discussion is verboten here.

Questioning people about hypotheticals  and building a straw man is hardly fair. My position never reduced Clair to  her "parts" and if Marten hooked up with someone else I would be asking the same questions. However because Marten is hooking up with Claire the consequences are much more severe. Claire could become entirely broken if things don't pan out.
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valkygrrl

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In the early days, there was much more of a running gag of Marty being the poor sucker who always gets barfed upon or clonked in the junk, but Jeph mostly left that behind as the comic got more sophisticated and the characters more complex.

One of the running themes of the comic could be said to be Marten's climb out of the status of being "Fate's butt-monkey". The sci-fi fanatic in me considers the logical final step to be for him to step in Steve's shoes and have an action/adventure arc. Maybe saving Hannelore from her mother's evil plots (I'd love to see Beatrice doing a Dr Evil-style pinkie evil laugh).

That is awesome, you are awesome. I'd like to subscribe to your newsletter.
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T

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Do you have any scientific source? Like published papers instead of stuff from random websites?

the articles cite their sources. Is there a reason you insist on seeing males and females as different rather than as people who are treated differently based on physical differences? Why do you wish to justify the stupid social expectations that put dolls in the hands of girls and blocks into the hands of boys instead of giving both to both?
There is no scientific source, only a book and people can write anything they want on their books.

Also I oppose to this because people are what they are and try to change this is no good. Sometimes a girl is born with a more masculine brain and a boy is born with a more feminine brain and many parents try their best to change it.

I know a brother and sister that was like this. Since they were very small the girl played and interested in more masculine activities and toys while the boy was the other way around to the dismay of their parents. They tried their best to make the girl girly and the boy macho but no matter how much nurture was offered she continued ignoring dolls and instead playing with cars and swords while the boy continued being delicate and social.

I don't know about sexual preference, they still haven't demonstrated nothing on these lines and brain type doesn't necessarily match with sexual preferences.

Some things are part of what you are and no amount of nurturing can change that. You don't make a gay guy start liking women by educating him to like women, or a lesbian become straight.
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plusorminus

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Questioning people about hypotheticals  and building a straw man is hardly fair. My position never reduced Clair to  her "parts" and if Marten hooked up with someone else I would be asking the same questions. However because Marten is hooking up with Claire the consequences are much more severe. Claire could become entirely broken if things don't pan out.

As this was not clear from your previous posts, this was all you had to say. I was answering your question in good faith and not constructing any sort of "straw man." You bought genitalia into this discussion, not me.  Attacking me was unnecessary. You have a good one.
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Platypodes

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One of the running themes of the comic could be said to be Marten's climb out of the status of being "Fate's butt-monkey". The sci-fi fanatic in me considers the logical final step to be for him to step in Steve's shoes and have an action/adventure arc. Maybe saving Hannelore from her mother's evil plots (I'd love to see Beatrice doing a Dr Evil-style pinkie evil laugh).
:-D :-D :-D

Would that be after he becomes Marten the Fireman?
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bhtooefr

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In real life people's personal life isn't my business  especially when it comes to genitalia but when I am being told a story I feel it's my right to ask questions as it provides context and insight into what is happening and how I feel about characters.

From last week's thread:

Discussions about the implications of Claire's gender status on her potential relationship with Marten are now off-limits. Marten and Claire are fictional characters. Jeph will reveal whatever he wants to tell us about their relationship through the comic. Speculation hurts real people who are members of this community and it is quite clear from the last few days that it's not possible for this sort of discussion to take place without that hurt occurring.

The problem is that every time Claire's status and its relation to a sexual relationship with Marten gets discussed, the end result is that the trans members of the community get hurt badly, and the forum descends into flamewars, and the mods have to break out the banhammer.

One problem is that it inevitably involves a discussion of Claire's genitalia (let's be honest, it does, because that's the entire reason there would be a hypothetical problem), and that is considered completely off limits, and based on statements Jeph has made on Tumblr and Twitter, I'd be shocked if we were ever told those details outright in the comic. Either things will work sexually between them, or they won't, and that's for Jeph to decide. We don't have enough information to decide, and speculating would hurt too many people for it to be worth it.

Marten and Claire need to have these discussions (and Claire, in fact, started them), but it's become clear that if we're not dating Claire, us having those discussions about her is incredibly rude. Yes, even though she's fictional.

Also, this is a privately run forum, not a forum run by the US government, and therefore you have no rights. See http://xkcd.com/1357/.
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Vincent Adultman

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How am I not supposed to take that as combative? Presented with an opportunity to educate you instead choose to ridicule.

And this is why I just plain don't go near this particular Sacred Cow with a ten foot pole. It seems next to impossible to educate yourself on the issue without being demonized for not being already educated on the issue. I get that it's a touchy subject, but man am I ever tired of the combative, "more enemies prove my cause is righteous" attitude. Nobody ever taught me about this shit in my sheltered little life, and I'm supportive of whatever increases general happiness in the world. But try to ask a couple unintentionally awkward questions to gain a better understanding and you get labeled all sorts of nasty adjectives and nouns.
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bhtooefr

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Also, it's worth reading this thread. Yes, the whole thread: http://forums.questionablecontent.net/index.php/topic,28457.0.html
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