Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

Now departing the USS MartenClaire *bell rings*

122 (56.7%)

Jephizba trolls us all, hallowed be the trollmaster's name.

32 (14.9%)

Spatheham and Clairemom Pancakes

7 (3.3%)

A solid week of Steve eating cereal

9 (4.2%)

Martenmom and Clairemom team up and fight crime/meddle in their children's personal lives

45 (20.9%)

Total Members Voted: 195

Voting closed: 09 Oct 2014, 22:04

[davedig]

Been meaning to mention: for some reason I think Deliah will come back into the picture sooner than Padme. No reason why to be honest.

[kerky]

Been meaning to mention: for some reason I think Deliah will come back into the picture sooner than Padme. No reason why to be honest.

I agree, sounds plausible since she is a friend of Tai and probably still around nearby. OTOH, a lot more of character develpment had gone into Padme, and she also seems to have vanished from the story. Did she ever answer Marten's email from the space station?

[Nepiophage]

Yes she did. http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2195. And her name is Padma btw.

[Rghfrgl]

Problem with Delilah showing up is there wouldn't be much point. She wasn't interested in anything more with Marten and Marten's figured out what he wants anyway.

I..guess she could be there to make Claire uncomfortable?

[jwhouk]

Sorry, naughty librarian role is two webcomics over.

[cesium133]

Sorry, naughty librarian role is two webcomics over.

She does have a similar-sounding name, though. Perhaps with the right (or wrong, depending on perspective) influences...

[BenRG]

Been meaning to mention: for some reason I think Deliah will come back into the picture sooner than Padme. No reason why to be honest.

Agreed; maybe she's the sort who gets possessive if someone she dumped moves on?

[ReindeerFlotilla]

Agreed; maybe she's the sort who gets possessive if someone she dumped moves on?

That sub plot is already running with Sven. That doesn't mean Jeph wouldn't double down, but it does make it a little less likely.

[cesariojpn]

And now I have this image in my mind of Claire as a naughty librarian... oh, I think I just found the subject for Jimbo's next book!

I think I saw this in a.......nevermind.

[McFace]

Been meaning to mention: for some reason I think Deliah will come back into the picture sooner than Padme. No reason why to be honest.

I would agree with that if only because she has some connection with Tai. As opposed to Padma who shows no sign of returning after her move.

[Aziraphale]

Been meaning to mention: for some reason I think Deliah will come back into the picture sooner than Padme. No reason why to be honest.

I would agree with that if only because she has some connection with Tai. As opposed to Padma who shows no sign of returning after her move.

The thing is, Marten's relief over that whole mess being over was palpable. Assuming Delilah does show up again, I'm not sure she'd be so much as a blip on his radar (assuming she even remembers his name, or he remembers her name).

[BenRG]

She  doesn't have to remember his name; all she needs is sufficient crazy in her head that makes her jealous that he's moved on so quickly.

"It's the principle of it! I don't like being taken for granted!"

[Aziraphale]

She  doesn't have to remember his name; all she needs is sufficient crazy in her head that makes her jealous that he's moved on so quickly.

"It's the principle of it! I don't like being taken for granted!"

Except she's not crazy. She's apathetic toward him, at best. I'd bet that if anything, she'd be relieved that from her perspective, he's not her problem anymore.

[MooskiNet]

Yeah, I'm pretty sure Delilah's feelings for Marten are nil, and her thought process that night was basically a decision between banging him and going to sleep alone. 

[Aimless]

I really hope she doesn't pop up again and that Jeph's feelings for her are nil

[BenRG]

Except she's not crazy.

Well, maybe, maybe not. She has been looking for a boyfriend for a long while, after all. Ever put something back on the shelf, regretted it and come back only to find it has sold out?

[Somnus Eternus]

Been meaning to mention: for some reason I think Deliah will come back into the picture sooner than Padme. No reason why to be honest.

Agreed; maybe she's the sort who gets possessive if someone she dumped moves on?

Is it dumping, though, if it was only ever a one-night stand?

[Method of Madness]

It was always a one-night stand for Delilah, but was it a one-night stand for Marten before she told him it was?

[BenRG]

It was always a one-night stand for Delilah, but was it a one-night stand for Marten before she told him it was?

I think it was a one-night stand for Marten at first. However, he's not a ONS-type of guy; he's nice enough that the whole thought of "Wham, bam, thank you Ma'am!" is somewhat repugnant to him. He wanted to give Delilah at least the option of attempting a relationship if she so wanted.

[Aziraphale]

Except she's not crazy.

Well, maybe, maybe not. She has been looking for a boyfriend for a long while, after all. Ever put something back on the shelf, regretted it and come back only to find it has sold out?

Sure. Happens all the time (in the more literal sense of your analogy, though it's happened in the more figurative sense you're using, too). But in both cases I recognize that my indecision was my own damn fault and move on.

It was always a one-night stand for Delilah, but was it a one-night stand for Marten before she told him it was?

I think so: http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2613. I think it wasn't 'til later that he realized a ONS wasn't what he was really looking for. But as Ben alludes to, the regrets after the fact don't change the motivation beforehand. There's probably a TV Trope for the ONS that backfires (I've seen it a couple of times besides here, though I don't remember which shows/comics).

[eschaton]

Hah! There it is. The ultimate explanation. In panel 2 in http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=273

Marten has finally gotten over a traumatic experience!

SCNR.

I thought you were maybe linking to this this at first.  Just found it in the archives this weekend. 

[Method of Madness]

Just because he wanted to go hook up with someone doesn't mean he never wanted to see them again, though.

[Platypodes]

True, but I think if he really had feelings for her, he would've remembered her name.

He did ask for her number, but I took that as being because, to Marten, that's what you do after you make out with someone, not because he was smitten with her personally.

[Method of Madness]

Well yeah, he probably forgot her name once he realized she forgot his. And yeah, maybe he didn't like her because of who she was, but because he wanted to make out with her more and get to know her better. (shrugs)

[tragic_pizza]

One of the things that's awesome about this forum is that all the things I wanted to say about Claire/Marten have pretty much been said.

I do have a bit of an issue with the idea that Tai or anyone else could "figure out" that Claire is trans. Honestly, there's no trans-dar, it ain't gonna happen. Besides, Jeph isn't the type to make any character say something as insipid as, "I knew it all along." Not Tai, not even Pintsize.

My prediction is that maybe, maybe a few hundred strips down the line, Claire might share with one of the other characters. I suspect that the response will be similar to Marten's and Emily's responses. Or... maybe not. Because - spoiler - none of them have the right to that information.

[kerky]

Problem with Delilah showing up is there wouldn't be much point. She wasn't interested in anything more with Marten and Marten's figured out what he wants anyway.

I..guess she could be there to make Claire uncomfortable?

Ah, how could a girl who is anti-mainstream enough not to shave her armpits possibly want to make anyone uncomfortable? I also remember her being quite cool about Marten´s proposal for makeouts, so my bet is NO.

[kerky]

Hah! There it is. The ultimate explanation. In panel 2 in http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=273

Marten has finally gotten over a traumatic experience!

SCNR.

I thought you were maybe linking to this this at first.  Just found it in the archives this weekend.

Hmmmm, I have not gotten this far with my binge-re-re-re-re-re-read yet.  Though, Claire is not actually a dude. Just to avoid any misunderstandings and hurting anyone.

[AprilArcus]

Honestly, there's no trans-dar, it ain't gonna happen.

Do you really believe this to be true? Or are you making a case for how things are in the QCverse, or how you think they should be in real life?

Passing culture and passing privilege may be contemptible manifestations of an amoral, judgemental, cisnormative, objectifying patriarchal cultural apparatus, but that doesn't make it any less relevant to my life when a stranger on the bus is staring at me with death in his eyes telling me "you're a man, right?"

[eschaton]

I thought you were maybe linking to this this at first.  Just found it in the archives this weekend.

Hmmmm, I have not gotten this far with my binge-re-re-re-re-re-read yet.  Though, Claire is not actually a dude. Just to avoid any misunderstandings and hurting anyone.

I wasn't comparing Claire to drag performers.  But I realized re-reading that that the comic had explicitly shown that Martin had some baggage about nontraditional gender displays in his early years he needed to get over.  He was scared of burlesque drag queens.  Hell, he might have associated *that* with being a transwoman until he met Claire.  Or maybe not.  Still, his experience was not altogether positive. 

[ZoeB]

Ah, how could a girl who is anti-mainstream enough not to shave her armpits possibly want to make anyone uncomfortable?

That's one of the things I found odd in the US. It's not normal practice here in Australia, yet not to do it is apparently seen as weird in the USA.

[tragic_pizza]

Passing culture and passing privilege may be contemptible manifestations of an amoral, judgemental, cisnormative, objectifying patriarchal cultural apparatus, but that doesn't make it any less relevant to my life when a stranger on the bus is staring at me with death in his eyes telling me "you're a man, right?"

I am not in any way discounting your personal experience. I know it happens, and it's terrifying.

But is it not true that people can, and do, pass?

I'm way out of my pay grade. Maybe you're right, maybe I'm just thinking that's the way it should be in QC-verse. Please forgive me if I have insulted you in any way.

(Edited to remove an unnecessary word)

[ZoeB]

But is it not true that people can, and do, pass?

And some standard factory model women don't. But when they get the glares, they have the self-confidence to do the "withering stare" back. Most of them, anyway. It's not as dangerous for them, though there have been unfortunate situations that mean it's not entirely safe for them either. You don't have to be trans to suffer the threat of transphobia, though it helps.

For all women, being too attractive, too traditionally feminine, is dangerous. For trans women, being too traditionally unattractive is even more so. Less so, but still not without risk, for cis women. The number of crones burnt as witches attests to that.

Now we're getting off-topic. This kind of thing really belongs in one of the Trans threads, if I want to discuss it further. Or even a Feminist thread.

[tragic_pizza]

Agreed, and thank you for engaging me, and helping correct my thinking.

[AprilArcus]

But is it not true that people can, and do, pass?

I'm 5'8" and wear my hair short and pass 99% of the time. Claire is 5'3" and has overtly feminine hair and probably passes 99.9% of the time. But you sure don't forget that 1% or that 0.1% when it happens.

My point is that a statement like "there's no trans-dar" is utterly false. People point their trans-dar at me all the time, because figuring out "what I am" is a fun game to them. People do this to everyone, all the time, because categorical perception is baked into our genes, and gender policing is baked in to our culture. You can wish the world were better, but saying won't make it so.

Back on topic:

I do have a bit of an issue with the idea that Tai or anyone else could "figure out" that Claire is trans.

Except that this already happened. Marten's reaction of utter un-surprise in Number 2323: Willingly Ignorant (heck, the title of the strip!) strongly indicates that he already suspected, but knew enough to wait for Claire to bring it up.

[Neko_Ali]

hehe.. I had always taken the name of that strip in reference to the last panel, that they would rather not know what Faye and Angus are like when making out. But this explanation makes sense too. It's entirely possible that Marten did figure things out before Claire told him, and had enough sense to be chill and quiet about it. He had a pretty diverse exposure to LGBT people growing up with a gay dad and mom in the porn business. He's talked about knowing drag performers as a kid, it's no stretch at all that he knew some trans people growing up too. (not that the two are the same, but there is some overlap.) He and Tai talked about it as well and he seemed fairly savy then.

[AprilArcus]

I would totally read a comic about Henry and Veronica's beard marriage. I imagine they were sort of best friends and artistic collaborators living out of the top floor of Henry's Castro nightclub in the 80s, who had Marten by accident amid the tumult of a drunken cast party for a wildly successful opening. Baby Marten chasing the cats around with age-inappropriate props as comic relief. I would read that all goddamn year long.

[Kugai]

It'd make a great Sticom/Drama, but what would you call it?

And who'd pick it up?

[jwhouk]

It'd make a great Sticom/Drama, but what would you call it?

And who'd pick it up?

Showtime would pick it up, but the name would be the sticking point.

Questionable Conquest?

[Thrudd]

It'd make a great Sticom/Drama, but what would you call it?
And who'd pick it up?

Showtime would pick it up, but the name would be the sticking point.
Questionable Conquest?

Family Ties, Bonds
On The Ropes
Surprise! We're a family.
Any which way
Rule 34
Purple Marten
 
or just name it after the club
Castro's Beard ?

[jwhouk]

Rule 34.  4chan would sue the pants off those ######.

[valkygrrl]

Rule 34.  4chan would sue the pants off those ######.

Charles Stross wrote a book titled rule 34. I was bad don't read it. I'm not even kidding, it was written in the second person, who does that?

[Aziraphale]

Rule 34.  4chan would sue the pants off those ######.

Charles Stross wrote a book titled rule 34. I was bad don't read it. I'm not even kidding, it was written in the second person, who does that?

Italo Calvino did. The book's called "If On A Winter's Night A Traveler." It takes a chapter or so to get past the quirk of reading something in the second person, but it was a good book.

[Dalillama]

Rule 34.  4chan would sue the pants off those ######.

Charles Stross wrote a book titled rule 34. I was bad don't read it. I'm not even kidding, it was written in the second person, who does that?

Don't judge Stross by that book; his other stuff's a lot better.

[davedig]

Well Delilah could come back looking for Marten to announce she's 'adult pregnant'!

Now wouldn't that be a swerve.

[kerky]

I'm 5'8" and wear my hair short and pass 99% of the time. Claire is 5'3" and has overtly feminine hair and probably passes 99.9% of the time. But you sure don't forget that 1% or that 0.1% when it happens.

My point is that a statement like "there's no trans-dar" is utterly false. People point their trans-dar at me all the time, because figuring out "what I am" is a fun game to them. People do this to everyone, all the time, because categorical perception is baked into our genes, and gender policing is baked in to our culture. You can wish the world were better, but saying won't make it so.

Well I used to live in a big city here in Spain. One nice thing about this city: People don´t give a rat's a** about meeting celebrities from sports and media on the streets, in the cafe where they're having breakfast or in the queue at the supermarket. The city has a bustling GLBT scene, the second liveliest CSD in Spain and a popular gay holiday spot is nearby, so expect to meet more queer (gender- or otherwise) people than in Smalltown, Elsewhere. And you know what I always thought really nice? They give as much as they do about celebrities. I have, of course, spotted transwomen, be at the beginning of the transition, or for whatever other reason not passing too well on the underground, the bus, on the train or all around the city. And guess what? I have hardly seen a giggle, staring or strange reactions. Of course, it does happen, and once is possibly once too many, but I do think 99% of the people know how to behave and do act in a natural, unoffensive way. Now, that makes it "only" 1% left to worry about (and sooner or later they will be extinct or learn and know better). Of course in smaller, less cosmopolitan cities, the situation will be different.

I personally think Claire has little to fear from the regular QC cast. They all have shown an attitude of coolness, tolerance and non-discrimination against all possible sexual orientations and stereotypes that they will not put Claire and/or Marten in an uncomfortable situation about her transexuality, should it become known beyond Emily, Marten, Clinton, Claire's and Clintos's mom and (possibly) Tai so I expect the best intentions and behaviour from all of our regulars, really, I am very optimistic about this.

[valkygrrl]

Rule 34.  4chan would sue the pants off those ######.

Charles Stross wrote a book titled rule 34. I was bad don't read it. I'm not even kidding, it was written in the second person, who does that?

Don't judge Stross by that book; his other stuff's a lot better.

Was thinking of checking out Neptune's Children but after reading about a computer virus causing a 3d printer to spit out a bunch of dildos...

[ReindeerFlotilla]

Rule 34.  4chan would sue the pants off those ######.

Charles Stross wrote a book titled rule 34. I was bad don't read it. I'm not even kidding, it was written in the second person, who does that?

I rather enjoyed both Halting State and Rule 34. There's something to being told that YOU are a Scottish, lesbian police officer. Forces you out of your own head. Unless you are a Scottish lesbian police officer. Then it's probably quite normal to take that point of view.

Admittedly, the real difficulty was switching pov. Jumping from being a lesbian cop to being a delusional sociopath can be a bit jarring. And I'll admit, the end of Rule 34 was less satisfying than the end of Halting State.

[Dalillama]

Was thinking of checking out Neptune's Children but after reading about a computer virus causing a 3d printer to spit out a bunch of dildos...

Gotta say I don't recall that scene from when I read it.  I'm mostly a fan of his series.  The Merchant Princes series is about a New York journalist who discovers that she's related to a clan of people who have the ability to jump from our dimension to another one, and have used it to gain power and wealth.  The Laundry Files follows computer geek, applied necromancer and secret agent Bob Howard in his adventures through the horrors of departmental bureaucracy and cthonian monstrosities from beyond time and space.

[Method of Madness]

Re: second person, when I was younger I was really into Goosebumps (before Goosebumps 2000, fuck that noise), and thus had a bunch of the "choose-your-adventure" books. What's funny is one of them had the protagonist (me, I guess?) de-aged to seven years old...but I was seven when I read that so...yeah.

[valkygrrl]

Was thinking of checking out Neptune's Children but after reading about a computer virus causing a 3d printer to spit out a bunch of dildos...

Gotta say I don't recall that scene from when I read it.  I'm mostly a fan of his series.  The Merchant Princes series is about a New York journalist who discovers that she's related to a clan of people who have the ability to jump from our dimension to another one, and have used it to gain power and wealth.  The Laundry Files follows computer geek, applied necromancer and secret agent Bob Howard in his adventures through the horrors of departmental bureaucracy and cthonian monstrosities from beyond time and space.

it was a scene in rule 34