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Author Topic: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)  (Read 499273 times)

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1100 on: 27 Aug 2015, 22:03 »

MOVING AWAY FROM THAT BECAUSE TODAY'S COMIC IS UP AND MY OPINION IS VOICED

New comic is up,
And just like that, DMW has transported me back to my own thoughts the night of my first kiss. (Except for the 'three days' thing)
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1101 on: 27 Aug 2015, 22:07 »

I am still counting on the belief that tomorrow morning, Becky will emerge dressed in the frills and horns of another one of Dina's (presumably numerous) dinosaur hoodies. Because oh my god, the adorable. I'm in absolute favor of a lesbian dinosaur couple being an existing thing in the modern media landscape
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1102 on: 27 Aug 2015, 22:19 »

dinobians... lesasaurs... I like the ring to it. Maybe I just like mash-ups too much, but lesasaur sounds awesome.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1103 on: 27 Aug 2015, 22:33 »

Dina + Becky is Binky, yes?

I wanna see a Binkysaur.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1104 on: 27 Aug 2015, 22:35 »

Pair of wild Binkysaurs wandering campus... Yass, pls
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1105 on: 27 Aug 2015, 22:56 »

I am still counting on the belief that tomorrow morning, Becky will emerge dressed in the frills and horns of another one of Dina's (presumably numerous) dinosaur hoodies. Because oh my god, the adorable. I'm in absolute favor of a lesbian dinosaur couple being an existing thing in the modern media landscape

I WANT TO SEE THAT
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1106 on: 27 Aug 2015, 23:32 »

Okay, technical people - I think Becky needs to know this. How do you reboot a human brain? Is there a recessed button somewhere that you have to push with a pin or something?

This is odd - Several people have mentioned this on the actual strip's comment thread. Why does Dina suddenly not know how this 'kiss' thing is done when she initiated with Becky during the party? The only explanation that I can come up with is that she was so angry with Sarah and Joyce that she acted without thinking (itself probably quite a new experience for her). Now she's acting deliberately she's feeling a bit less certain of herself.

I am still counting on the belief that tomorrow morning, Becky will emerge dressed in the frills and horns of another one of Dina's (presumably numerous) dinosaur hoodies.

FWIW, the only reason that I think that's unlikely is because... well, spoilers. I'll leave it at that.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1107 on: 28 Aug 2015, 07:34 »

Dina is freaking out over 'how' to do kiss because that's what she does. She doesn't understand things on an instinctual level, she tries to analyze everything logically. Kissing Becky the night before was spontaneous and very out of character. She did without thinking in a spur of frustration and attraction. And besides that I think everyone's first kiss is a bit of confusion of the how and why and whens.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1108 on: 28 Aug 2015, 14:07 »

FWIW, the only reason that I think that's unlikely is because... well, spoilers. I'll leave it at that.
Consarn it Benergy, I'm not even sure what you spoiled, but I'm pretty sure you just spoiled something.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1109 on: 28 Aug 2015, 14:51 »

Of all the things to worry about ...........
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1110 on: 28 Aug 2015, 15:25 »

FWIW, the only reason that I think that's unlikely is because... well, spoilers. I'll leave it at that.

I'm not sure what you thought to gain out of saying that other than ruining the suspense and enjoyment for other readers.

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1111 on: 28 Aug 2015, 16:56 »

I don't really feel comfortable with everyone assuming Dina's a lesbian because of this. :/ She can still be asexual and have romantic feelings for people. I'm not saying she IS asexual, but it sure seems that way, based on her own comments (including something about "disinterest" or a similar word).
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1112 on: 28 Aug 2015, 21:13 »

Comic.

Sorry Lolibutt, but I can't help my first response being that they're gay. I understand that homoromanticism is a thing that can exist within asexuality, but with asexuality being a fraction of the population and same-sex romanticism also being a fraction, I feel like we're talking about a fraction within a fraction. I know people like that exist, but I don't know if I think Dina's necessarily one of them.  I feel they're going to be CALLED a lesbian couple in the near future, but it remains to be seen if Dina connects to that. That's when I'll be certain. I'll call her what ever she calls herself, and in the meantime, I'm just applying Occam's razor.

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1113 on: 28 Aug 2015, 21:18 »

Most of Dina's thoughts that point to asexuality, at least the ones I remember, always felt like they could be situational. I say that because I've thought them myself, and I'm most definitely not asexual, just very specifically not attracted to the majority of personality-types. But, like I said, we don't have the word of god on this, or anything definitive in-comic, so we can only blabber on with our personal takes. Sorry if I made you uncomfortable, Lollibutt, I didn't think too much about it.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1114 on: 28 Aug 2015, 23:42 »

Thank you--I appreciate that. I definitely get where you're coming from. :) I'm on the asexual spectrum, and well... we see a lot of asexual erasure. Dina hasn't stated what she is, so assuming that she's a lesbian after her first homoromantic kiss just seems like a leap in logic. It's not an unreasonable leap, of course, but it's a leap enough that I noticed it, you know? And a LOT of people on the comment sections of the actual comic are jumping to the same conclusion, so I guess it's been becoming a bit of a sore spot for me. :/

I think she could possibly be bi as well. I haven't seen anything of her that implies she'd never be attracted to men. But that's just me!

I think she dated some dudes in the older continuities, but I know very little about them outside of Shortpacked!'s version. I'm not spoilering this because she's almost not in Shortpacked!, and I have no idea if my memory of some random strips I've seen of the other comics is correct. If someone wants to point them out, then they can spoiler them at their own discretion. :)

I agree that they'll probably be referred to as a lesbian couple, because it's a typical shorthand for two women in a relationship.

With all the bi and ace erasure, I wish it weren't that way.

I don't know. I'm tired. But today's strip is FREAKING CUTE. That is all.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1115 on: 29 Aug 2015, 01:13 »

Too adorkable.

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1116 on: 29 Aug 2015, 07:22 »

Well, Dina's said she is 'unsure if gender expression matters' to her. She's very much just figuring things out. I don't think she's felt any kind of attraction to anyone but Becky before. In fact she's expressed nothing but confusion and vague clinical interest until now. So best just to let Dina decide what labels, if any, feel right to her.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1117 on: 29 Aug 2015, 08:57 »

I think it is a mistake to read too much into what the various characters did in the Walkyverse timeline. Their backgrounds tend to be different and they have also had radically different experiences (often quite traumatic ones) over a number of years. That necessarily will lead to radically different life-choices and needs.

DoA Dina is what she is in a universe where the aliens and the extra-universal humans had not started intervening in history when the main characters' parents were all still mostly teenagers.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1118 on: 29 Aug 2015, 09:25 »

While her experiences and actions in other universes do not directly impact this iteration of her, Willis has stated that all characters retain their orientation across the multiverse.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1119 on: 29 Aug 2015, 10:40 »

That said...

(click to show/hide)
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1120 on: 29 Aug 2015, 12:07 »

While her experiences and actions in other universes do not directly impact this iteration of her, Willis has stated that all characters retain their orientation across the multiverse.
I'll believe it when I see it. As far as I'm concerned, anything is possible if it hasn't been contradicted by in-DoA stuff.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1121 on: 29 Aug 2015, 12:29 »

One is still of their particular orientation regardless of whether or not they have engaged in behavior that reflects it.
« Last Edit: 29 Aug 2015, 12:47 by sitnspin »
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1122 on: 29 Aug 2015, 12:31 »

Well, maybe. But I don't want to get into the whole Death of the Author/Word of God bullshit again.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1123 on: 29 Aug 2015, 12:34 »

One is still of their particular orientation regardless if whether or not they have engaged in behavior that reflects it.

Amen to that.

A bi person in a heterosexual relationship, or has only been IN heterosexual relationships is no less bi. This is what Lollibutt was talking about with bi and ace erasure.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1124 on: 29 Aug 2015, 16:20 »

Triceracute
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1125 on: 30 Aug 2015, 16:07 »

Hmmmmmm

I wonder how this will play out.  Becky shoulda stayed.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1126 on: 30 Aug 2015, 16:27 »

No, I think it was ok that she left. Dina doesn't seem to mind :)
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1127 on: 30 Aug 2015, 19:54 »

No, I think it was ok that she left. Dina doesn't seem to mind :)

Dina is sleep. I think it's cool, though. Might be what keeps Dina from presenting her with her very own frilly-dino-hoodie, though
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1128 on: 31 Aug 2015, 01:16 »

This is something that I have noticed about the character of Joyce: She's actually self-destructively optimistic. I'll explain what I mean. She'll repeatedly do things that have previously gone badly for her because she honestly thinks that good intentions and a pure heart somehow make up for ignoring other people's clearly-expressed wishes or previous bad reactions.

It's sort of funny that Becky and Joyce are alike in so many ways: They're both bubbly, friendly and (as pointed out above) over-optimistic to a nearly-dangerous level. I also think that Sal has them to thank for being on time for classes this morning.

Still, it probably says a lot about how much a living hell was that boarding school Sal went to that her first instinct, upon awaking and finding someone leaning over her, is to attack.

So, anyone else who thinks that this chapter, "To Those Who'd Ground Me" is going at least in part going to be Sal focus?
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1129 on: 31 Aug 2015, 05:13 »


Still, it probably says a lot about how much a living hell was that boarding school Sal went to that her first instinct, upon awaking and finding someone leaning over her, is to attack.


Or it just says she values her sleep snd she wants the people who disturb her to pay the price. That's my theory, because I'd do about the same thing
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1130 on: 31 Aug 2015, 05:17 »

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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1131 on: 31 Aug 2015, 07:53 »

I'm really thinking about the chapter title here: "To Those Who'd Ground Me".

There are basically two definitions for 'Ground' that I think are potentially relevant:
  • To punish by limiting movements and/or associations
  • To stabilise and reassure
One strip in, naturally, we'd all be guessing. But I'm thinking that there are basically two directions in which this chapter could go. The first possibility is that we're going to see Sal showing how she's fought back from her parents' attempt to mould her, for good and for ill. It's going to be showing her basically standing proud and shouting: "Look at me! Despite you, this is who I am and I'm proud of it!"

Secondly, it could be Sal being left at a bit of a loose end as a result of Marcie and Malaya dating. As a consequence, she takes more interest in her brother's life and the activities of her neighbours. This is convenient for Joyce as she really, really needs the advice of a more worldly-wise person to help her confront the challenges coming in her life. Thus, the chapter is about Sal's growing awareness of the importance of her friends in helping a very lonely and very badly hurt young woman find a balance point in her life.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1132 on: 31 Aug 2015, 23:22 »

Today's strip (9/1) is a hilarious insight into Joyce and Becky's nature. They're so cheerful, so optimistic, so friendly and so utterly nice that it is like being around Pinkie Pie all the time! They're like two sunshine and sugar generators permanently set on 'maximum'! No wonder poor Sal hasn't even tried to open her eyes in the morning; dealing with that must be hard!

A question for fellow readers: Do you think that Sal is wearing a shirt to bed because she feels less at ease with Becky than she did with Billie (she has known Billie since childhood, after all) or is this a continuity error?
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1133 on: 01 Sep 2015, 00:07 »

Isn't there a third interpretation of "To Those Who'd Ground Me"?

Ground is also a form of "grind". So could it be "To Those Who Had Ground Me"?
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1134 on: 01 Sep 2015, 08:11 »

That's true.

But as someone who has seen Wicked three times, here's the literal interpretation of the phrase:
"To those who'd ground me" is one of the last lines in "Defying Gravity," the song where Elphaba (the Wicked Witch of the West) accepts that she's different and is okay with being seen as evil. She raises up off the stage close to the end of the song and sings:

"So if you care to find me
Look to the western sky!
As someone told me lately:
'Everyone deserves the chance to fly!'
And if I'm flying solo
At least I'm flying free
To those who'd ground me
Take a message back from me
Tell them how I am
Defying gravity
I'm flying high
Defying gravity
And soon I'll match them in renown!
And nobody in all of Oz
No Wizard that there is or was
Is ever gonna bring me down!
"

Read more: Wicked - Defying Gravity Lyrics | MetroLyrics
http://www.metrolyrics.com/defying-gravity-lyrics-wicked.html

Obviously, the DoA crowd can't literally fly, but if I were to go with a strict interpretation of the lyrics in context of the story, I would say it's about Becky trying to spread her wings and not letting Toe Dad bring her down. That's just me, though!
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1135 on: 01 Sep 2015, 09:09 »

Well, we can't be certain that they can't fly :parrot:
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1136 on: 01 Sep 2015, 09:11 »

Amazi-Squirrel can.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1137 on: 01 Sep 2015, 12:07 »

Well, we can't be certain that they can't fly :parrot:

I think Sal is tempted to try that experiment right now. They live on the 3rd or 4th floor I think?
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1138 on: 01 Sep 2015, 20:18 »

You have awakened the Dragon
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1139 on: 01 Sep 2015, 21:06 »

Didn't take Becky long to grok Walky's essence, now did it
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1140 on: 01 Sep 2015, 23:15 »

I wonder if Sal knows that Joyce has imprinted on her as the template for female beauty?

[edit]
Maybe this is just me. Am I the only one who thinks that Joyce brushing out Sal's hair with an air of devoted focus would be a memory for Becky's "fevered fantasy" file?
« Last Edit: 02 Sep 2015, 04:30 by BenRG »
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1141 on: 02 Sep 2015, 05:17 »

Walky and I have this in common.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1142 on: 02 Sep 2015, 15:47 »

So, Joyce is about to become Sal's slave eh?
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1143 on: 02 Sep 2015, 21:28 »

Come on Becky it has JUST been established that Sal can't do anything while she is in class with Joyce.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1144 on: 02 Sep 2015, 22:57 »

For some reason, I've got a mental image of thirteen-year-old Joyce and Becky sitting on Joyce's bed after lessons and making up not-rude rude names for Ross and giggling like the teenagers they are. What I'm saying is that the current breach between Becky and Ross has had its roots a long way back. I don't think that he ever tried to give his daughter reason to love him and the consequence is that, despite their fundamentalist upbringing, Joyce and Becky never really respected him.

Joyce, seriously? Find Dorothy and make peace; it isn't that hard. Besides, given the strength of Billie's hooch, the likelihood is that she won't even remember the party.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1145 on: 03 Sep 2015, 21:09 »

I welcome the return of Dina Classic, though I'm surprised Becky knows it to be classic, seeing as she's only been in town a handful of days.

I also support smooches.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1146 on: 03 Sep 2015, 21:44 »

Joyce ultimately wants her friend to be happy :)
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1147 on: 03 Sep 2015, 22:10 »

This is true. I'm surprised she is so chill about it.. she wasn't so much the idea yesterday. Now it's happening right next to her, even if she isn't looking at the smooches.
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1148 on: 03 Sep 2015, 22:56 »

This is true. I'm surprised she is so chill about it.. she wasn't so much the idea yesterday. Now it's happening right next to her, even if she isn't looking at the smooches.

Well, the simple fact is that Becky and Dina kissing in the last panel doesn't exactly fit into anyone's definition of 'sapphic erotica'. They're more like a couple of cute high-schoolers. So, yeah, I think it's fairly easy for Joyce to pigeon-hole it as 'cute and affectionate' and not confront the sexual element of it (such as there is).
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Re: Damn you, Willis! (Dumbing of Age)
« Reply #1149 on: 04 Sep 2015, 14:12 »

It shall be interesting to see if this leads to anything further or whether this will be the sum total of Dina and Becky's relationship for the next few comics
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