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Poll

Rumble at the Fight Arena!

Momo leads a sit-in!
BUBBLES leads a sit-in!
Momo is arrested after cooking the bouncer-bot's power cell with her taser when Corpse Witch tries to have her ejected!
Momo gets arrested after tasering the Chief of Police when he admits he's an avid fan of the fights!
Faye and Bubbles are arrested for gross public indecency (don't ask)!
The Arm-bot is arrested for pinching Faye's behind!
May is arrested for trying to persuade her favourite fighter to autograph her chest panel!
Corpse Witch goes berserk and tries to kill all her idiot employees (i.e. all of them)!
Something vaguely realistic

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Author Topic: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)  (Read 23296 times)

BenRG

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WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« on: 15 Nov 2015, 09:16 »

I think that something light-hearted is called for in the poll after the weekend that the world has had!

Seriously, though, I'm expecting mostly either Faye-Bubbles or Faye-Bubbles-Momo conversation this week. Maybe Bubbles will tell her story or, and this might be interesting, Corpse Witch tells her story and how she got into this game!

MOMO: "What's this?"

BUBBLES: "It's my Congressional Medal of Honour. I'm the first Synthetic to earn this award."

MOMO: "Wait... then... you're...!" BUBBLES covers MOMO's mouth so that only muffled fangirl squees come out.

BUBBLES: "I was that person... but she vanished a long time ago."

FAYE: "Maybe you need to rediscover her? She sounds like she was a great gal."
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #1 on: 15 Nov 2015, 09:51 »

May would want pics for option 5 that's for sure. As in how Momo would react to Bubbles, we have seen that. Any amount of exposition about Bubbles' past would probably only increase the "anime factor" (for lack of a better word).
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #2 on: 15 Nov 2015, 09:59 »

I voted for the Jeremy option. And by "arrested" I assume it really means "demolished by Faye."
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #3 on: 15 Nov 2015, 11:24 »

"Momo is arrested after cooking the bouncer-bot's power cell with her taser when Corpse Witch tries to have her ejected!"

Immediately followed by the storyline where Momo gets recruited by the owners and becomes the uncontested champion of the fight arena, culminating in a knock-down drag-out brawl with Bubbles, who loses, and is repaired by Faye, creating a bonding moment between the two and thereby advancing Faye's arc.

You know, I started this comment to make fun of that ridiculous possibility, but now I really want to change my vote to that.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #4 on: 15 Nov 2015, 12:59 »

Remember the risk May would be taking if she visited the skate park. Associating with known criminals is a violation of parole terms.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #5 on: 15 Nov 2015, 13:51 »

Hmmmm

I wonder if that body of hers is fitted with a GPS Tracker.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #6 on: 15 Nov 2015, 14:29 »

They're cheap even in our world so it would make perfect sense. Which was the strip that listed the features of her chassis?
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #8 on: 15 Nov 2015, 16:22 »

Considering that she's relegated herself to watching poor-quality LiveLeak videos of the fights, I'd say that GPS is extremely likely. Human paroles often have tethers, after all.

Hell, she wouldn't even verbally say anything about -going- to the fights, so it stands to reason that they might even monitor her conversations.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #9 on: 15 Nov 2015, 16:41 »

Her movements are quite likely being tracked.  "Them" listening to every word is probably just May's paranoia.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #10 on: 15 Nov 2015, 17:33 »

Also plausible. It's why I said 'might' instead of speaking in definites  :-P
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #11 on: 15 Nov 2015, 18:49 »

so it stands to reason that they might even monitor her conversations.
I hope not, if only because that'd mean monitoring everyone she is around.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #12 on: 15 Nov 2015, 20:52 »

"The Arm-bot is arrested for pinching Faye's behind!"

Faye would disassemble Jeremy in ways Johnny 5 can only imagine!
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #13 on: 15 Nov 2015, 21:27 »

Momo uses pupbot eyes. It's super effective!
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #14 on: 15 Nov 2015, 21:36 »

Why would "I don't want to talk about it" feel so different from "I have no obligation to explain or justify myself"?
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #15 on: 15 Nov 2015, 21:42 »

Dang, Bubbles has some junk in the trunk.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #16 on: 15 Nov 2015, 21:59 »

Bubbles is also pretty much the tallest character in the strip (except for maybe Deathbot 2000).
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #17 on: 15 Nov 2015, 22:11 »

Why would "I don't want to talk about it" feel so different from "I have no obligation to explain or justify myself"?

"I don't want to talk about it" is straight-up deflection. It's something you could say to a friend honestly, and doesn't have implications other than what it says openly.

"I have no obligation to explain or justify myself" is prickly and makes no sense unless Bubbles assumes that Momo is there to emotionally or morally beat up on her.  Bubbles is saying pretty forcefully here that if Momo tries any moral-superiority bullshit or offers "help" that is contingent on agreeing that Bubbles' past choices were morally wrong, Bubbles will refuse to accept her as any kind of moral authority entitled to do so and is likely to be angry at her.   If Bubbles didn't keep such a tight lid on herself, it could even be interpreted as a direct warning that Bubbles would feel justified in a violent response to any such misbehavior.

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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #18 on: 15 Nov 2015, 22:27 »

Bubbles is also pretty much the tallest character in the strip (except for maybe Deathbot 2000).
She doesn't look like Gwendoline Christie, but Bubbles can still be Mecha Brienne of Tarth.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #19 on: 15 Nov 2015, 23:38 »

I've noticed that QC-verse AIs never use one word when they can use several with many more syllables. For example, Bubbles' line in the last panel could be written: "No! Not the puppy-dog eyes!!!" :laugh:

That said, I'm getting a Vietnam Vet vibe from what Bubbles is saying. When she was demobilised, did she face ostracism? Did she have AIs messaging her with abusive texts, calling her a 'savage', 'betrayer' and even 'baby-killer'? It might explain her reluctance to confront her demons if all previous offers of help were contingent on repentance, public renunciation and (given she's an AI) maybe a personality rewrite.

Momo is nice but, in that, she may be a minority. Someone like Bubbles may have attracted a far more militant form of activism.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #20 on: 15 Nov 2015, 23:58 »

Going by what Momo and Bubbles have said about it, it sounds like Momo's attitude of "How can you be a soldier? You're setting back human-AI relations!" is something that Bubbles has dealt with a lot from other AIs. To the point where she's sick of it and just assumes anyone who brings up the subject just wants to berate her for the decision to enlist. It certainly does seem that's the case now, rather than a pre-AI Rights Bubbles being assigned to a combat unit.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #21 on: 16 Nov 2015, 00:34 »

Momo's views seem to be evolving. She's being much more open-minded than she would have been in the days when she was chomping at the bit to throw May under the bus and kick the wreckage to the curb. I think she honestly is seeking to understand Bubbles.

Knowing May has been good for her.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #22 on: 16 Nov 2015, 02:26 »

Momo's views seem to be evolving. She's being much more open-minded than she would have been in the days when she was chomping at the bit to throw May under the bus and kick the wreckage to the curb. I think she honestly is seeking to understand Bubbles.

It probably helps that Bubbles is a very different personality. She's quiet, dignified and reserved and bears her pain with a certain pride and maturity that Momo could easily define as 'noble'. On the other hand, May is brash, loud and tends to cover her own traumas and sense of bitterness with outrageous behaviour. It's easier to be unsympathetic to someone who cultivates the appearance of an antisocial hooligan.

Although, one wonders if, at some level, Bubbles' reserve and May's abusive behaviour both have the same basic goal: to stop themselves from getting hurt by allowing anyone inside their emotional defences.
« Last Edit: 16 Nov 2015, 07:28 by BenRG »
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #23 on: 16 Nov 2015, 05:41 »

Really, Momo? Bothering somebody at their place of work? What the hell.
And you want a cookie for saying you're not there to judge?

I mean, yes, that kind of behaviour was there before, but for somebody working for AI rights she treats AI a lot worse than humans. She wouldn't threaten a human with death, and she wouldn't bother a human at work with very personal (and judgemental) questions.
(And yes, asking why somebody went to the military is a personal, private, if-that-person-wants-to-share conversation. Not a public, I-deserve-answers-so-I'm-gonna-bother-you-at-your-job conversation)
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #24 on: 16 Nov 2015, 07:14 »

Momo's views seem to be evolving. She's being much more open-minded than she would have been in the days when she was chomping at the bit to throw May under the bus and kick the wreckage to the curb. I think she honestly is seeking to understand Bubbles.

Knowing May has been good for her.

All that, plus she seems to have great confidence in the effectiveness of Force Cuteness ("Oh Noes, she's using The Face!")

Re: Showing up at Bubbles workplace - I agree that's a big "The good reasons to pull something like that are virtually always a lot less good than you're likely to believe they are. No, a lot less still ...".
However, mitigating circumstance might apply when the neccesity to reach the people in question seems to be great enough and if the people in question don't havea place besides their workplace (cf. 3070 - it actually looks to me like she's staying at the Skating park). AND (humongous 'AND') if you take great care not to let it turn into a "You owe me answers, because [REASONS]" - type of 'intervention' (And what could possibly go wrong with that one?)

And recall that it was May who set her up to it (Friday's comic) - maybe expecting that Momo might get an upgrade to her cheerfull, good-hearted meddlesomeness? Are we in for an arc on AI-intersectionality? #SolidarityIsNotForCombatAis?
« Last Edit: 16 Nov 2015, 07:47 by Case »
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #25 on: 16 Nov 2015, 07:45 »

I don't think Momo is quite as aggressive as some people are implying.
She is used to being very assertive with Marigold, but that's because she was confident with her social protocol database while Marigold hadn't a clue about such thing and really needed to be told what (or what not) to do. With May and Bubbles, Momo is ready to back off when challenged and wants to learn.

And she's only ever used her defence hardware when she was really being attacked or creeped out by Clinton.

for somebody working for AI rights she treats AI a lot worse than humans. She wouldn't threaten a human with death, and she wouldn't bother a human at work with very personal (and judgemental) questions.
When did she ever threaten anyone (AI or otherwise) with death?
And Bubbles is on the defensive, but all Momo has said to Bubbles is that she "wants to understand".
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #26 on: 16 Nov 2015, 07:53 »

I distinctly remember Momo saying something about knowing the presence of May and making sure her drive would be relocated to an incinerator if she tried anything funky, back when May was a projection on Dale's Glasses.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #27 on: 16 Nov 2015, 08:22 »

Yes, Momo did threaten May with destruction. Whether she had the means to carry out that threat is open to question.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #28 on: 16 Nov 2015, 08:29 »

Is that really that important a distinction. If the first time you ever meet someone they threaten to put a bullet in your head if you step out of line, do you first check and see if they own a gun before reacting? And does it make it any better if it was just an idle threat without the means to back it up?
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #29 on: 16 Nov 2015, 10:15 »

It's also worth remembering that before ever encountering May's brashness Momo was openly contemptuous.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #30 on: 16 Nov 2015, 11:20 »

I sense a Flashback coming up

And Momo is kinda hard to resist in 'Puppydog Mode'
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #31 on: 16 Nov 2015, 13:25 »

Is showing up at someone's workplace considered rude in the U.S.? Serious question.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #32 on: 16 Nov 2015, 13:34 »

Someone you only just met the night before, and you show up unexpectedly to ask them probing questions about the past you are trying not to think of? Yes, very rude.

Even in general purposes, work is a place of business. Someone bothering you at work for something that's not related to your work is looked down on, yes. And possibly could get you in trouble with your employer.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #33 on: 16 Nov 2015, 13:57 »

I get your general point, but I think that "probing" is about as inaccurate a description of the way she's asking the questions as you can possibly get.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #34 on: 16 Nov 2015, 14:33 »

Is showing up at someone's workplace considered rude in the U.S.? Serious question.
I'm not from the US, but I would feel it very out of line for somebody that I just met to show up at my place of work just to ask me personal questions. It would be OK if it's something important happened (for example, a mutual friend got hurt and they didn't know how to contact me) but if it's just to ask me a controversial question... My workplace is business, and I keep my personal life out of it as far as possible. It's not only rude to intrude, it's also one of the places  where I can't just leave if the person is bothering me and where I look very unprofessional if I chat with non-colleagues.

Would it be not rude where you live?
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #35 on: 16 Nov 2015, 14:35 »

She still showed up at a near-stranger's work place to ask questions about her past. After they exchanged what, less than six words the night before? If someone I met at a party briefly showed up and wanted to know about my past, especially one that I've been grilled about by strangers on a regular basis I would be less than inclined to be charitable. And less kind in my response than Bubbles, puppy-bot eyes be damned.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #36 on: 16 Nov 2015, 14:52 »

Would it be not rude where you live?

I wouldn't consider it rude personally, but maybe I am a bit odd? (:
I would suggest to them that we meet somewhere else for lunch to discuss whatever they wanted to ask about, though.

In Momo's case, it's not like she had the choice of meeting Bubbles anywhere else. Having said that, I agree there's a case that it was impolite to broach the topic at all. Though in Momo's defense, I'm not sure she realises just how sensitive a topic this is for Bubbles.

In any case, I admire Bubbles for her forbearance.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #37 on: 16 Nov 2015, 15:31 »

She still showed up at a near-stranger's work place to ask questions about her past. After they exchanged what, less than six words the night before? If someone I met at a party briefly showed up and wanted to know about my past, especially one that I've been grilled about by strangers on a regular basis I would be less than inclined to be charitable. And less kind in my response than Bubbles, puppy-bot eyes be damned.

Thus raising the question of why her social protocol database didn't stop Momo from doing it.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #38 on: 16 Nov 2015, 16:08 »

Probably the same reason people ask probing and personal questions to LGBT people. Curiosity overwhelms common sense and decency that tells us 'Hey, maybe I shouldn't ask this near-stranger questions about their private life.'
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #39 on: 16 Nov 2015, 16:39 »

Good point.  AIs are not automata, and may be emotionally be impelled to break their better judgement, whether that be logically thinking of a problem, or performing an SQL query.  (edit, removing content for a comic that hasn't gone live yet).  I concur with those who know the power of that sad puppy look.  Maybe the "more powerful AIs" who have confronted Bubbles in the past did not have the adorable power.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #40 on: 16 Nov 2015, 16:53 »

Is showing up at someone's workplace considered rude in the U.S.? Serious question.

It's possibly cool (depending on the friend and the workplace) to pop in and say hi to a friend if you're in the neighborhood.

But to show up at the workplace of somebody you met briefly the night before to interrogate them is definitely not.

In general using a workplace to force a meeting with somebody is super rude. See, for example the Brothers McElroy segment on "Lady Zoos".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_sYzLJ2jcL8
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #41 on: 16 Nov 2015, 17:08 »

Thanks for all the considered answers, everyone.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #42 on: 16 Nov 2015, 17:18 »

Why are we comparing Momo's reaction to May to Momo's reaction to Bubbles?

When Momo met May, she treated the known criminal with hostility and contempt.
When Momo found out Bubbles was in the military, she was upset about the generalities of AI in the military.

VERY different scenarios there!  She doesn't approve of being in the military OR being a criminal, but it's not like she's treating Bubbles with contempt for having a different opinion about that.  And aside from asking "why did you do that", she's never made it about "Bubbles is a bad AI for joining the military".  I think it's not entirely unfair to say that "May is a bad AI for committing crimes bad enough to have her in robot jail".  Now that she knows May better and is seeing the effort May is making to turn herself around, she's behaving better.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #43 on: 16 Nov 2015, 17:27 »

Why are we comparing Momo's reaction to May to Momo's reaction to Bubbles?

My impression was that was not so much a comparison, more of an enumeration of Momo's faults. A judgement, one might say.
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Yet the lies of Melkor, the mighty and the accursed, Morgoth Bauglir, the Power of Terror and of Hate, sowed in the hearts of Elves and Men are a seed that does not die and cannot be destroyed; and ever and anon it sprouts anew, and will bear dark fruit even unto the latest days. (Silmarillion 255)

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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #44 on: 16 Nov 2015, 17:43 »

You know, I get the feeling that it's going to be Momo coming out of this the worse for wear emotionally.
For what we've seen of Bubbles, she's got very much a (I believe) Spock like manner of speaking, there's no emotion, no contractions, very formal way of speaking. She's shut down emotionally and locking down. Just talking to Momo now won't break her, but I bet it's going to hurt Momo in the end.
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #45 on: 16 Nov 2015, 17:52 »

Yeah, I think you're right. A double whammy of an emotional story and a challenge to her beliefs.
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Yet the lies of Melkor, the mighty and the accursed, Morgoth Bauglir, the Power of Terror and of Hate, sowed in the hearts of Elves and Men are a seed that does not die and cannot be destroyed; and ever and anon it sprouts anew, and will bear dark fruit even unto the latest days. (Silmarillion 255)

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WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #46 on: 16 Nov 2015, 18:34 »

Yeah, it's PTSS.
« Last Edit: 17 Nov 2015, 11:32 by jwhouk »
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #47 on: 16 Nov 2015, 19:50 »

Why are we comparing Momo's reaction to May to Momo's reaction to Bubbles?

Because it's such an informative case of "compare and contrast", and because Momo seems to be coming from the same place in both cases. She was afraid that May would reinforce or create a hateful stereotype and would thus undermine human support for AI civil rights. She was, maybe still is, afraid that Bubbles going to war reinforced a stereotype of dangerous robots and would thus undermine human support for AI civil rights.

She's listening with an open mind, I believe.

-----------------

Bubbles's eyes in panel 3. How on earth does Jeph make things so expressive.

----------------

Bubbles is making it sound like she had that chassis before enlisting. Seems unlikely, but if so, where did it come from?
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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #48 on: 16 Nov 2015, 19:58 »

Bubbles is making it sound like she had that chassis before enlisting. Seems unlikely, but if so, where did it come from?

When she says, "With this body, I am superhuman," she may have meant "with this body that I received upon enlisting," in contrast to the artificial intelligence she already had.

"A state of the art weapon that can think, reason, and empathize." Echos of Ender's Game right there...
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Yet the lies of Melkor, the mighty and the accursed, Morgoth Bauglir, the Power of Terror and of Hate, sowed in the hearts of Elves and Men are a seed that does not die and cannot be destroyed; and ever and anon it sprouts anew, and will bear dark fruit even unto the latest days. (Silmarillion 255)

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Re: WCDT Strips 3091 to 3095 (16-20 November 2015)
« Reply #49 on: 16 Nov 2015, 20:18 »

I suspect that something is likely to happen where Momo experiences an impulse to give Bubbles a hug.

If fate is kind to them both she will be conscious enough to ask permission first.

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